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Farscape Frelling Cancelled

Mukaikubo writes "The Sci-Fi Channel has decided to cancel their second largest show, Farscape. Because networks respond better to phone calls and snail-mail letters than a mass e-mail campaign and there is contact info on a fan-run Message Board. Time is of the essence, as the Network wants to tear down props at the end of next week. Help save one of the best science fiction shows on TV today!" Other articles can be found here and the chat log is online too.

126 of 434 comments (clear)

  1. There will always be... by MiTEG · · Score: 2

    I'm sure they'll show reruns for years on SciFi, and failing that there is always alt.binaries.tv.farscape. But it would really be a shame if no new content was created.

    --
    The future isn't what it used to be.
    1. Re:There will always be... by bludstone · · Score: 5, Informative

      Or you could, i dont know... Buy the dvds? They are released by ADV Films, who are not a member of the MPAA or any other evil organization... And you would be supporting the show you liked.

      --

      no .sig
    2. Re:There will always be... by RickHunter · · Score: 3, Informative

      Not only that, but I believe ADV releases their DVDs without any kind of encryption or macrovision protection. In all, they seem to make good products and release good shows. (In addition to a whole load of anime, they also released the Reboot season three DVDs.)

    3. Re:There will always be... by The+Rizz · · Score: 2, Interesting
      They are released by ADV Films, who are not a member of the MPAA

      Perhaps not, but they do put out their series at prohibitively high prices. $25 for 2 episodes? The series may be good, but $275 per season is a bit much for me...
      Stargate SG-1, on the other hand, sells for only $70 per season. True, it's an MPAA company, but at least they're not going to bankrupt me if I want to buy their shows.

      --The Rizz

    4. Re:There will always be... by Overt+Coward · · Score: 2
      Skip cable, get a satellite dish -- new subscribers usually get free or heavily discounted equipment and installation. You also only pay $30-$40 a month for the non-premium channels (eveything but the sports packages, HBO, Showtime, etc.). It saves a lot of money over cable in the long run, and the picture quality is much better.


      TiVO subscription service for DirecTV customers (using the TiVO units with a built-in DirecTV tuner) was recently dropped to $5/month.

  2. FastFood and FastTV by Knacklappen · · Score: 5, Informative

    Well, it's a sad thing to write, but maybe they just make more profit with other series of lower quality? It's like when the Babylon 5 spin-offs where killed... Here's a good statement from JMS about this.

    The analogy I can find, is to Fast Food: Low-quality stuff for the masses (but it's practical and I'm enjoying it sometimes). Guaranteed profit. The stuff I consider high-quality, is a matter of taste. So the market is limited and profits not guaranteed. If you would run a restaurant for a living, what would you offer?

    Sad, though.

    --


    Excellence: Moderate (mostly affected by comments on your karma)
    1. Re:FastFood and FastTV by PD · · Score: 2

      I'm happy with the 5 years too. I just wish they'd finish Crusade. I don't care if it's on the screen or ink on a page - I just want to know how they beat the Drakh plague!

  3. Re:Second largest show? by rusty0101 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They are canceling it because it is too expensive to create. It is much cheaper to put together dreck like John Edwards, or show old B horor movies that will draw a far smaller audience, than it is to be creative.

    I am also with the people who have commented that season 4 wasn't worth the time I spent watching it.

    That's just my opinion, yours is yours.

    -Rusty

    --
    You never know...
  4. It comes as no surprise by dr_eaerth · · Score: 5, Insightful
    In April, Joe Straczynski, creator of B5, had this to say in reference to Sci-Fi passing on the Legend of the Rangers series:


    The SciFi Channel has indicated that it's moving away from space shows, with all the hardware/alien stuff that goes with it.


    Farscape is, of course, a space show, so I saw this coming. It was surprising that it stayed on the schedule this season, but not surprising that its stay of execution was only temporary.

    And now, for a small question from me... What is the point of a science fiction channel without science fiction?
    1. Re:It comes as no surprise by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 4, Interesting

      They aren't the science fiction channel, they are the SciFi channel which is a much broader, and shallower genre. Unfortunately it includes pablum like "The Dead Zone" which really belongs on the Women's Channel because the plots are so touchy-feely it is ridiculous, not to mention the bogosity of John Edwards and his feel-good show.

      If they aren't going to do space shows, does that mean SG1 is doomed? How about the rest of the Dune movies?

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    2. Re:It comes as no surprise by gmhowell · · Score: 2

      And now, for a small question from me... What is the point of a science fiction channel without science fiction?


      Maybe John Edwards knows?

      --
      Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
    3. Re:It comes as no surprise by RatFink100 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Saying science fiction is about space is like saying crime fiction is about guns.

    4. Re:It comes as no surprise by hackerzrus · · Score: 3, Funny

      Well, I guess I don't get the distinction between "sci-fi" and "science fiction" any more than I would see a diff between Hi-fi and "high fidelity", thought I suppose one could be a "stereo" and the other is "good sound". (So, the shorter one can be "nouned"? Don't think that applies here!)

      I certainly don't get Farscape. It's not Sci-Fi anymore than Friends is a soap or Charlie's Angels was "crime drama". They're all comedy.

      Just like Andromeda.

      SG-1 is pretty damn funny too.

      Colonel Jack O'Neil: Hey, Carter, thought you might like to watch a movie, so we got Star Wars. Teal'c here has seen it like, what, eight...

      Teal'c: Nine.

      O'Neil: ...nine times, so it must be good!

      Capt. Samantha Carter: [long pause] thinking [to O'Neil] You mean...you've never seen Star Wars?

      O'Neil: Well, you know me and Sci-Fi.

      Maybe it's all comedy...

      --
      -- Without the right to carry and use self-defence tools, we effectively have no right to life.
    5. Re:It comes as no surprise by Nik · · Score: 3, Funny
      Well, I guess I don't get the distinction between "sci-fi" and "science fiction" any more than I would see a diff between Hi-fi and "high fidelity", thought I suppose one could be a "stereo" and the other is "good sound". (So, the shorter one can be "nouned"? Don't think that applies here!)

      To those who are wondering why,
      What we call 'SF' ain't 'sci-fi',
      It's just, there's a fine line,
      Between Robert Heinlein,
      And 'Son of the two-headed fly'.

      N
    6. Re:It comes as no surprise by matrix29 · · Score: 2

      They aren't the science fiction channel, they are the SciFi channel which is a much broader, and shallower genre. Unfortunately it includes pablum like "The Dead Zone" which really belongs on the Women's Channel because the plots are so touchy-feely it is ridiculous, not to mention the bogosity of John Edwards and his feel-good show.

      Hello, I'm imitating John Edwards and I am happy to tell you that all of your loved ones are "Fine" they are always "Fine" yep... fine fine fine fine. (Coughs) Oh wait, I meant to say it as the French do - "Fin'e".

      Oh by the way, along with my utterly useless answers I will just ooze smarmy fake compassion then laugh all the way to the bank.

      --
      "Face it, a nation that maintains a 72% approval rating on George W. Bush is a nation with a very loose grip on reality.
    7. Re:It comes as no surprise by Golias · · Score: 2, Interesting
      The distinction is this: Pretentious assholes who like science fiction don't want thier favorite stories (which they consider to be literature equal to the best works of Dickens and Tolstoy) to be considered part of the same genre as crappy B movies about giant spiders invading Earth, even though it is.

      Therefore, they insist that "good" science fiction is a completely different genre from "bad" science fiction.

      I can debunk this silly notion with 2 words: Starship Troopers. Anybody who has both read the book and seen the movie based on it knows exactly what I mean.

      --

      Information wants to be anthropomorphized.

    8. Re:It comes as no surprise by RickHunter · · Score: 3

      It is an interesting question... Why is it that anything that portrays space as a useful place to be that is anything other than hideously uneconomical to get to gets axed almost immediately? As is, for that matter, anything that shows the least bit of imagination or originality...

      Are people just not interested in anything beyond the "lands we know" anymore?

    9. Re:It comes as no surprise by NeuroManson · · Score: 2

      Maybe we can do a class action lawsuit against Sci Fi, I mean, it's a false and misleading name for one thing...

      They even ran "Red Scorpion" on the channel, about a Soviet officer who's dumped in the desert to die after fighting his commanding officer in order to save a village... He's saved by a tribe and returns to BSU (blow shit up)... So HOW THE HELL does this relate to science fiction?

      Since I can pretty much download any show I want from Usenet these days via cable modem, I'm *almost* ready to cancel my cable teevee service, no point in letting AT&T double dip charge me anyway...

      --
      Just because you can mod me down, doesn't mean you're right. Shoes for industry!
    10. Re:It comes as no surprise by mpe · · Score: 2

      And now, for a small question from me... What is the point of a science fiction channel without science fiction?

      Assuming that "Sci-Fi" was intended to mean only addressing science fiction. The most obvious example being "Sightings", a "documentry" series about the paranormal.

    11. Re:It comes as no surprise by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2

      No, SciFi is not JUST a contracted version of the phrase Science Fiction. It is like the difference between saying "San Francisco" and saying "Frisco." People who call the city "Frisco" think they know what they are talking about, but really are saying more about themselves than they know.

      The term SciFi started out as simply a contraction of those words, but long ago it evolved to have a meaning of its own, distinct from its origin - that's what language does, it evolves. Nowadays, SciFi typically covers anything that is "light" and of a fantastical nature, covering many stories that might otherwise be called fantasy or historical fiction as well as light science fiction.

      As for the other guy saying that Starship Troopers is some kind of proof that SciFi and Science Fiction are one and the same - BFD. Of course there are borderline stories, just like there are borderline stories across the genres of mystery and historical fiction or fantasy and satire, etc, etc. The movie certainly was light in places, but it was also a savage commentary on fascism, even moreso than the book.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    12. Re:It comes as no surprise by mpe · · Score: 2

      If they aren't going to do space shows, does that mean SG1 is doomed? How about the rest of the Dune movies?

      Depends what "space show" covers, not much space travel in Dune and not that much, most of the time in SG1.

    13. Re:It comes as no surprise by blair1q · · Score: 2

      It's more like saying crime fiction is about motorcycle cops, but same diff.

    14. Re:It comes as no surprise by nhavar · · Score: 2

      I think you can see Sci-fi's switch though. If you look at what they are playing lately it's no "space" shows and nothing that's even really sci-fi. Mostly it's horror.

      Things like House, Species, Psycho, IKWYDLS, are really categorized as horror. I think Farscape is one of the few Science Fiction show's that has a mass appeal. The problem is that 1. it's expensive to produce 2. They could replace it for the cost with several shows that got mediocre ratings and get more people.

      Of course they don't count all the people they are losing from no longer being a Sci Fi channel. It's a clusterfuck. When people see Sci-Fi Channel they think space, they think Star Wars (science fantasy), they think Star Trek (space opera), they don't think Psycho (horror/suspense), House II (arguably comedy), or Howling III: Marsupalami (who knows what that was supposed to be), or Ghoulies (horror? comedy? occult?) or 8 hours worth of infomercials.

      Just my 2 cents.

      --
      "Do not be swept up in the momentum of mediocrity." - anon
    15. Re:It comes as no surprise by rodgerd · · Score: 2

      The US could certainly do with a good adaptation of Revolt in 2100, but making one and promoting it to the masses would probably get an American shot for treason in the current atmosphere...

    16. Re:It comes as no surprise by rodgerd · · Score: 2

      I suggest you consult a good proctologist. You appear to have a painful obstruction.

    17. Re:It comes as no surprise by Bartab · · Score: 2

      We've known this was going to be SG1's last season for two years ... They've been chanting "no more than six years" for several years. The only real question was if the fifth season would be the last instead.

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo.
    18. Re:It comes as no surprise by gmhowell · · Score: 2

      Damn! Are you serious? If so, it's no wonder you wound up on my friends list.

      Get this: I saw BOTH of those TWICE in the theatre.

      --
      Jesus was all right but his disciples were thick and ordinary. -John Lennon
    19. Re:It comes as no surprise by Bartab · · Score: 2

      Starship troopers ... based on the title of a book written by Robert Heinlein.

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo.
  5. Re:Second largest show? by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2, Funny

    I always thought John Edwards belonged on the comedy channel.

    --
    When information is power, privacy is freedom.
  6. Must be a study somewhere... by Nomad7674 · · Score: 2

    At times like this when it appears a trend is forming to cancel highly-rated shows like Farscape and Witchblade on cable, you have to wonder if there was a network study somewhere which claimed that Sci Fi was "out" or "on the want" and everyone is trying to get ahead of the curve. TV execs always seem to be trying to get ahead of the curve (rather than sticking with what works), which seems to leave us with fewer and fewer old, popular, and unique shows and more and more shows stamped from the same cloth.

  7. The Real intention of scifi by cioxx · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Look, I would hate to burst your bubble, but this looks to me like a lame publicity stunt by the networks. I hate to be the conspiracy theory guy, but hear me out, because this is a great strategy.


    1. SciFi/USA Networks Cancel Farscape claiming it costs too much to produce
    2. The story hits various portals such as internet message boards, tv news, slashdot and others.
    3. Creates a huge outcry from the fanbase, letters will be written, online petitions will be signed
    4. Suddenly SciFi has a change of heart and brings the series for a trial run for one more season
    5. As a result this turns out to be the best way to lure new viewers who are intrigued by all the hype
    6. ???
    7. The Network Profits by an unprecedented media stunt by increasing viewership.
    1. Re:The Real intention of scifi by banky · · Score: 2

      But what about the cast and crew? Isn't it bad to screw with the talent like that?

      I don't buy it. I think it's just SciFi doesn't want to spend so much on what is only now a moderate performer.

      --
      ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
    2. Re:The Real intention of scifi by Deanasc · · Score: 2

      No didn't happen for MST3K won't happen for Farscape. SciFi Network has no clue about keeping viewers.

      --
      I've hit Karma 50 and gotten a Score:5, Troll... I win!
    3. Re:The Real intention of scifi by Sarcasmooo! · · Score: 2

      If they wanted to do it for a publicity stunt they would've announced it on the main site, or on the scifi channel itself. The cast saying it in a chat log isn't exactly an effective way to build up a large amount of controversy. Only hardcore fans and internet geeks will hear about it.

    4. Re:The Real intention of scifi by ttyRazor · · Score: 3, Funny

      They could have had the same effect by just saying they might be planning on cancelling it and won't make a decision for a few months than saying it's cancelled now and they've got a week befoe they start tearing all the sets down to make room for a bigger John Ewards auditorium.

  8. Petitions, letters, and phone calls. by pajor · · Score: 2, Informative

    I don't think petitions, letters, nor phone calls will do any good.

    As Ben put it, "They're taking a chainsaw to Moya next week" meaning that the sets are scheduled to be destroyed within a matter of days.

    Yeah, maybe letters and phone calls will make them spend the money to rebuild the sets, but I probably wouldn't hold my breath. They would have folded the sets if there was a chance the show was going to be picked up again (as they did with "Crusade"'s sets [even though they never did pick up this series]). I think it's best we wish Brian Henson et al the best of luck on their new endeavors instead of spending our energy on such a longshot. The best we could hope for is for a final episode or movie, but I doubt this as well

    --
    Gnuyen
  9. Ok, i'm not a massive farscape fan by perlyking · · Score: 3

    But what is "frelling"?
    There is no good sci-fi on at the moment. I see Enterprise and its just more "wild west cowboys in space" crap.

    --
    no sig.
    1. Re:Ok, i'm not a massive farscape fan by banky · · Score: 3, Informative

      it's like "fucking".

      The idea is that certain words didn't get picked up right by the "translator microbes" so Crichton hears the "native" word, rather than the translation. Or something like that. It was just a way to give flavor.

      --
      ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
    2. Re:Ok, i'm not a massive farscape fan by crow · · Score: 2, Funny

      See "Feldercarb."

    3. Re:Ok, i'm not a massive farscape fan by banky · · Score: 2

      Good artists imitate, great artists steal.

      --
      ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
    4. Re:Ok, i'm not a massive farscape fan by b1t+r0t · · Score: 2
      But what is "frelling"?

      Someone throw him a frickin' bone here!

      (All I want is some frickin' sharks with frickin' laser beams on their heads!)

      --

      --
      "Open source is good." - Steve Jobs
      "Open source is evil." - Microsoft
  10. I smell HBO, cc them with your letters by vandelais · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I never got into the show, but understand why other people did. It's a decent show and probably should continue.

    There is always hope. HBO has a rather good record of picking up shows of meritable creative content that do not get network/cable support from the cronies that run them. Maybe you could redirect or cc your support mail there.

    --
    Game: Player 'Donald J Trump' now has AI skill level 'experimental'.
    1. Re:I smell HBO, cc them with your letters by Talaran · · Score: 2, Informative

      The problem with the idea of Farscape getting picked up by another network is that SciFi would have to give up the rights to the first 88 episodes for the new network to be able to air them, which they may not be willing to do. Any potential saviour would be much less likely to step up if they could only air the 5th season and without the previous 4.

    2. Re:I smell HBO, cc them with your letters by heptapod · · Score: 3, Funny

      Farscape on HBO means one thing:

      Blue boobies.

      'Nuff said.

  11. Shit! (from a UK viewer) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Urrghh... what a way to wake up on a Saturday. Farscape is one of the few shows that I make time to watch.

    I'm not usually surprised when a series is cancelled - either it obviously bites, or no-one is watching. Neither seems to be true of Farscape. In fact, I'm so mystified by this, I've spent my Saturday morning writing a letter to the Sci Fi channel in the U.S... I know, I know, I've been extremely polite (just expressing my sincere shock) and I realise that they will probably just bin it along with the thousands of other "fan" letters, but I had to do it.

    I've never done that for a TV show before. So maybe that will mean something to the less cynical slashdot readers.

  12. Fax them! by Ageless+Stranger · · Score: 5, Informative

    I urge everyone who is upset about this to send a fax to Sci-Fi Network. I found the this link to a free online fax service from the parent article.

    Free Online Fax

    Sci-Fi's fax number is +1-212-413-6531.

    1. Re:Fax them! by zerocool^ · · Score: 2

      Now, what you do here is take about 5 sheets of paper, write "DON'T CANCEL FARSCAPE, WE LOVE IT" about 3 times per sheet, then feed the first sheet through, and then tape the sheets together in a circular motion.

      Sit back, let fax for about 7 and a half hours.

      Of course, it's long distance, but... as brody once said, "small price to pay for the smiting of one's enemies".

      ~Will

      --
      sig?
    2. Re:Fax them! by zerocool^ · · Score: 2

      actually, hold on. Is a fax bomb a terrorist act?

      ~Will

      --
      sig?
  13. normally by Apreche · · Score: 2, Flamebait

    I would say yes save the show. However, I dont' like that show. It's too much like Star Trek, which I hate. I mean, I'm a geek just like the rest of you, but this is one area of geekdom I just don't get. When I watch Star Trek I just can't help but feel I'm watching an afternoon soap opera, except everyone is wearing an alien costume or a space ship uniform. Changing the setting doesn't make a show any better. I don't watch scifi channel anymore anyway. Wait... I don't watch TV anymore really. Go ahead and cancel all the shows you want.

    --
    The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
  14. Reminds me of The Pretender and NoWhere Man by nurb432 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In those cases, they killed off shows that you had to think ( gasp ) to enjoy.. and replaced with mindless garbage. Sign of the times i guess.

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  15. What is with this TV season's cancelling crap??? by slashdot_commentator · · Score: 5, Informative


    Look at what the networks have killed in the past 6 months (of note):

    Dark Angel (FOX: news to me, but axed in May, had ok ratings!)
    Futurama (FOX: weak ratings)

    A couple days ago:

    Witchblade (TNT: had strong ratings!)
    Farscape (Sci-Fi: good ratings?)

    (I'm sure I'm missing a biggie in all this. X-Files, Ally McBeal, Family Guy, etc. don't count...)

    I'd understand the cancellations if the ratings were weak, and new programming was so much more promising but:

    Derivative spinoffs: CSI:Miami, Law & Order:
    Cop shows, cop shows, cops shows
    doc shows, doc shows, doc shows

    Another boring lawyer show from David E. Kelley
    New soon-2-be-DOA show from the other lucky producer...

    And the rest being f**king lame-assed "reality" shows I don't watch. How the f**k do loser shows like Big Brother2, Amazing Race2, and The Mole2 manage to get timeslots??? Yeah, they're cheap to produce, but they get sh*tty ratings.

    I just don't get it. There a quite a few new shows coming out this fall, and most of them have LOSER stamped on them. Why kick out a promising show to stick in a sure loser?

    The only thing new that looks like it has promise is Firefly. But I would have killed something other than Dark Angel... (Birds Of Prey looks promising too.)

    Is it that our demographic (and thus, entertainment preferences) is too old and not desirable anymore? Do good shows cost too much? Do networks make more money on sh*t reality shows?
    Am I missing a possible trend? (Economic recession putting content companies out of business? 9/11 makes people want mindless, "wholesome", patriotic, hero themed shows?)

    Its a conspiracy, I tell you! And the handwriting is on the wall. Get ready to say goodbye to Buffy, Stargate SG1 (a Sci-Fi channel property), Angel, Smallville, Enterprise(?), South Park, Son of the Beach,

    I can't say its all bad. I watch way too much TV. I'd like to feel confident that there will be something watchable in a couple of years, but it doesn't look good (for me, for us?)...

    --
    There is no America. There is no democracy. There is only IBM and AT&T and DuPont, Dow, General Electric, and Exxon
  16. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by Kythorn · · Score: 2, Informative

    Since so many people seem to be asking, Farscape was scifi's highest, or second highest show depending on who you ask. Unrealized Reality (Season 4, Episode 12) pulled a 1.5, which is pretty unheard of for this network.

    Unfortunately, it's also their most expensive show to create, but what the hell else do they have? They killed b5:lotr (And no, not THAT lotr), they killed lexx, Stargate's coming to a conclusion after this season.... They're going to have dead zone and johnathon edwards when at the end of this year.

    JMS said scifi wants to get away from "those space shows", when they killed the b5 spinoff. I haven't figure out who's irrational bias this is, they're the scifi channel for christ sake, ut if I ever identify the person responsible, rest assured that I will provide contact info.

  17. Huh? by mstyne · · Score: 2

    Because networks respond better to phone calls and snail-mail letters than a mass e-mail campaign and there is contact info on a fan-run Message Board.

    Huh? I'm hoping this is due to a /. editor's scalpel.

    --
    mstyne: real name, no gimmicks
  18. Sh*tty Ratings vs Demographics by LittleGuy · · Score: 2

    Demographically, for an example, Mole 2 was holding its own against AI in the 18-34 demos for that time slot. If people that advertisers want to sell to are watching, that's good enough.

    Then again, NBC Executives have twice cancelled ratings-wise successes that followed Friends (Inside Schwartz was ranked in the top 15 at year's end, believe it, or not), because they pulled in only a 30 share rather than carry the 60 share of the Ross/Rachel crew.

    SFC's tactics seems to make it unprofitable for another network to hop in and save the show, or else toss in money to rebuilt the sets. Slash and burn, anyone?

    --
    Mod Karma -1: I sed bad wurds. If I cep my mouf shut, I wud be at riyses.
  19. For those that enjoy it... by fmaxwell · · Score: 2, Troll

    I'm sorry for those people that enjoy Farscape, but I could never get into it.

    I could never get into it. It just seemed like Days of Our Lives in spaceships. It had that same dark, dreary lighting and slow pace that is so typical of soap operas. Even the character summaries from the show's web page sound like a soap opera:

    Chiana's happiest when she has the opportunity to show off her scoundrel skills; she's a thief, a liar, a seductress and a drama queen.

    I'll take Enterprise any day. The story line is inspirational. The recurring characters are admirable. The production values are top-notch. The special effects are beyond reproach. And each episode stands on its own and does not require that you watch the show serially from the pilot up to the current episode to understand what is going on -- though, taken together, it tells a larger story.

    1. Re:For those that enjoy it... by Raul654 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Now I don't want to start a B5 vs Star Trek flamewar (quite frankly, I like them both a lot), but one thing B5 did better was the story arcs - you did have to watch many of the episodes to see what was going on, and it was very hard to break into the series otherwise. DS9 did this as well starting around the 4th season, but to a more limited extent. Enterprise seems to have moved back to the TOS/TNG model (mostly).

      --


      To make laws that man cannot, and will not obey, serves to bring all law into contempt.
      --E.C. Stanton
    2. Re:For those that enjoy it... by Sarcasmooo! · · Score: 2

      You just saw the wrong episodes. I would roll my eyes a bit when it was an Erin/John romance-fest. But check out episodes like "Crackers Don't Matter." And the drama can be seen in a different light. I consider John Crichton to be as classic as Dirty Harry or John McClain (Die Hard). Both dramatic, but neither would be compared to soap opera characters.

      As for special effects, I'd prefer a fly-by of Moya over Enterprise.

      Hopefully Farscape engrossed the right minds, so someone in high places will scoop it up.

      "Humans are suuuuppeerriioooooor!!!" - John Chricton

    3. Re:For those that enjoy it... by fmaxwell · · Score: 2

      but I think what you are trying to say, is that when you flip it to Farscape, there aren't always 30 ships zipping around each other,

      No, what I refer to are the poor production values, cheesy sets, melodramatic acting, dreary lighting, and a cast of characters that spend all of their time scheming and double-crossing one another -- much like a daytime soap opera.

      You probably saw the characters TALKING to each other, contemplating their sad state of affairs.

      If I want to contemplate a sad state of affairs, there are any number of real-life countries I could think about today. I want something that holds out hope that the future will be an improvement over the present.

      The acting on Farscape is top-notch.

      On that, we will have to disagree.

    4. Re:For those that enjoy it... by fmaxwell · · Score: 2

      talk about crap...

      Referring to your post, I assume.

    5. Re:For those that enjoy it... by _Sprocket_ · · Score: 3, Insightful
      To each their own...


      I'll take Enterprise any day.


      I could never get in to Enterprise.


      The story line is inspirational. The recurring characters are admirable.


      I found the storyline, while appealing to my like for "history" (even if it is fictional), doesn't really seem to go anywhere. And the characters fail to interest me.


      The production values are top-notch. The special effects are beyond reproach.


      Sure. Decent production. And they seem to do a somewhat admirable job of trying to balance between a "future" defined by our real-life past views of technology during the 60s and the current sense of ethetics that lead to the look of the "modern" Star Trek.


      And each episode stands on its own and does not require that you watch the show serially from the pilot up to the current episode to understand what is going on -- though, taken together, it tells a larger story.


      I don't find that a big selling point. Of course, I also enjoyed shows that really required a sequential following (like B5 or Twin Peaks). Having said that - I don't feel that Farscape suffers so much from this. And even if it does... that this is really a such bad thing. Unless, of course, you're a studio manager more concerned with filling in time slots than what your programming actually is.

      Farscape and Enterprise are entirely different shows and, honestly, I feel that its rather unfair to try and compare them. The only likeness between the two is that they both have a space sci-fi (sci-fantasy to the purist) background.

      And I must admit, it took me a bit to get interested in Farscape. But after watching a handfull of episodes (a couple of different times), I got hooked. Mainly because Farscape is very different. Its chaotic. Its full of very odd concepts and designs - from hardware, to aliens (and I've come to appreciate the occasional anamatronic alien puppet instead of another makeup-and-prostetic alien). And there is a certain degree of desperation that pops up occasionally that I find refreshing (as an example, running out of food and facing starvation pops up from time to time).

      Will Farscape be everyone's cup of tea? Hardly.
    6. Re:For those that enjoy it... by spectecjr · · Score: 2

      No, what I refer to are the poor production values, cheesy sets, melodramatic acting, dreary lighting, and a cast of characters that spend all of their time scheming and double-crossing one another -- much like a daytime soap opera.

      *POOR* Production values? They beat Star Trek hands down. Have you actually watched any episodes of Farscape or Enterprise and compared them side by side?

      Enterprise is stale, boring, and MORE LIKE A SOAP OPERA THAN FARSCAPE.

      Simon

      --
      Coming soon - pyrogyra
    7. Re:For those that enjoy it... by Anonvmous+Coward · · Score: 2

      "I could never get into it. It just seemed like Days of Our Lives in spaceships. It had that same dark, dreary lighting and slow pace that is so typical of soap operas."

      What I couldn't stand was the encounters they had with 'weird things'. I mean things that were weird for the sake of being weird. They lost me at the planet populated by lawyers.

      Gotta agree about Enterprise. What I like most about that show is the dialog. It's so much different than the other Trek shows. I think a lot of people don't pick up on that and that's why they hate it.

      I miss Quantum Leap over all of it. Scifi can be good, but you have to have good characters in it to make it work. QL decidedly proved that.

    8. Re:For those that enjoy it... by Cliff · · Score: 2
      but I think what you are trying to say, is that when you flip it to Farscape, there aren't always 30 ships zipping around each other.

      No, what I refer to are the poor production values, cheesy sets, melodramatic acting, dreary lighting, and a cast of characters that spend all of their time scheming and double-crossing one another -- much like a daytime soap opera.
      I've seen more innovative work come out of scenes from Farscape than I have scenes of Enterprise. Poor production values? I think not.

      To be fair, I think people need to realize thaet comparisons between these shows is unfair, they have different "attitudes" and this affects the way the show looks on screen, as well it should.

      Farscape, is a show that sets a better mood than I've ever seen Enterprise do. Ignore the flashy sets and glizy backgrounds of Enterprise; low-lighting and innovative camera tricks do more to set-up a scene than all the CGI and expensive sets in the world. I also have to say that as long as the story is strong and the production work good enough to add to rather than detract from the story, then I'm happy.

      Too many times, the scenes on Enterprise fail because I think Berman and crew did an absolute dismal job on setting the period of the show. This show is supposed to take place before kirk yet, at-a-glance I have problems placing it anywhere before any of the TOS Movies: this is a problem. If you are trying to set up a movie in the 1920s, having a 2001 Corvette show up in the frame is going to be a bit jarring. This happens to me whenever I see the NX01 on screen, which get in the way of me enjoying the show. There are other issues in the show where I have a problem with Berman and company being a bit revisionist as well...for one thing, most of the crew on board the Enterprise act like they have been in the Federation for years yet the UFP doesn't exist yet, another thing that gets in my way of enjoying the show, and I'm hoping this is something that gets addressed in future eps.

      So for me, I just find Farscape a better fit for it's setting. A hint, folks: life is a soap-opera. Sometimes it's nice to see your characters be true to themselves and not act in ways you expect of your typical protagonist. Farscape excels here, while Enterprise still feels like a fish out of water.

      Despite this, I hope it gets the standard 7 year run. If Voyager did, then Enterprise damned well should. With Farscape gone, the amount of even passably decent shows on TV is dwindling at a precarious rate.

    9. Re:For those that enjoy it... by Jethro · · Score: 2
      I'll take Enterprise any day. The story line is inspirational.
      I think you misspelled "superficial."
      --


      In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is kinky.
    10. Re:For those that enjoy it... by fmaxwell · · Score: 2

      First, let me thank you for your cogent and reasonable reply. While we may never agree on what makes "art", I think we can agree on one thing:

      Too many times, the scenes on Enterprise fail because I think Berman and crew did an absolute dismal job on setting the period of the show. This show is supposed to take place before kirk yet, at-a-glance I have problems placing it anywhere before any of the TOS Movies: this is a problem. If you are trying to set up a movie in the 1920s, having a 2001 Corvette show up in the frame is going to be a bit jarring. This happens to me whenever I see the NX01 on screen, which get in the way of me enjoying the show.

      I think that this is a very valid criticism. I do think that it's important to recognize the set quality as a tough issue. ST:TOS had really cheesy sets and special effects. We have progressed way too far technically to buy into that any more. Just the blinky lights that made up a "computer" (e.g. M5) are now laughable.

      That said, NX-01 seems far too "comfy" to be a first effort at a starship. The crew quarters are way too large and, in fact, larger than the ones on ST:TOS. The bridge is too spacious. The systems work too well. The sensors are far more capable than they should be. Weapons systems seem to have picked up pinpoint targeting that ST:TOS never showed. ST:TOS's sickbay had a bunch of gauges for vital functions. Enterprise has full patient visual body representations. The tricorders from ST:TOS were as big and bulky as an old portable cassette player. The ones on Enterprise are small, sleek, and capable. Communications seems to be perfected. There is never an issue establishing a video link between Enterprise and some never-before-seen alien species.

      I think some things that would have made it a lot better would be making everything from warp speed to weapons systems more complex to operate, less reliable, and less effective. The handheld communicators should have been at least four times as big as the ones from ST:TOS. They should have had range and quality problems. Sickbay should be a lot less capable. The list goes on and on.

      So, I wholeheartedly agree with your comments in this regard. Nonetheless, when evaluating the show in its own right, I find the characters, stories, and special effects to be compelling.

    11. Re:For those that enjoy it... by Cliff · · Score: 2
      I think some things that would have made it a lot better would be making everything from warp speed to weapons systems more complex to operate, less reliable, and less effective. The handheld communicators should have been at least four times as big as the ones from ST:TOS. They should have had range and quality problems. Sickbay should be a lot less capable. The list goes on and on. So, I wholeheartedly agree with your comments in this regard. Nonetheless, when evaluating the show in its own right, I find the characters, stories, and special effects to be compelling.
      This, is what I was hoping for. I was hoping to see the crew of the Enterprise struggling to eck out a place for themselves in this "brave new world" into which they had suddenly been thrust, but all too quickly it turned into "formulaic Trek" where the crew could solve things with magical devices and loads of technobabble.

      In other words, I was hoping they would take risks and be different...and this is the exact reason I like Farscape. Too many times I've seen Trek rehash an old plot, only to see Farscape do it, and do them one better. I don't know how well Enterprise's own continuity holds up but one thing that was common with most Trek is that you rarely got to see the consequences of character's actions over the course of the show. Farscape did this and did it well.

      On the other hand: Yes, I do agree with you that it's a good show, and it would be one that I could really get into once I get past the glaring anacronisms. Since DirecTV is being anal and not providing me with a UPN feed, I don't get to see it very often. Things could have drastically improved with the show since I last saw it, and I'll admit that this was a long time ago.

      Actually, it would be a damned good show if it was something original and not mired in the byzantine-continuity-hell that is today's Star Trek, but then again, I don't think they would have been able to get away with calling it Enterprise, now would they? =)

      I guess now I'll have to pour all of my hopes into Whedon's Firefly but Fox's track record with me is questionable at best. Would you trust the network that cancelled VR-5 for Who Wants to Marry a Millionaire and the genre that followed? =)

    12. Re:For those that enjoy it... by fmaxwell · · Score: 2

      My point is that every show that involves space, a ship, and men and women is bound to have relations hips somewhere in the story of the show.

      No argument there at all and I don't object to that in either show. What I *personally* don't like about Farscape is that it's like the worst office politics; lots of back-stabbing, plotting, scheming, and deviousness. Maybe it's just human(oid) nature, but it's not something that I like to watch on TV on a recurring basis.

      I'd much rather see a show that focused on mankind's good side: The quest for knowledge, admiration of science, the urge to explore, excitement and wonder at meeting the unknown head-on. Maybe I'm an idealist, but that's what Star Trek gives me (the exception being DS9, which I really never liked).

      P.S. Star Trek has *NEVER* resorted to cheap titillation. They rely on solid characters like Seven of Nine and T'Pol. ;-)

    13. Re:For those that enjoy it... by Anonvmous+Coward · · Score: 2

      Too bad ya didn't get a +1 funny for that, it was funny. :)

  20. Non-fan perspective by swb · · Score: 2

    I like science fiction, but I'd hardly call myself a "fan". Some of what passes for popular in the sci fi community doesn't register at all with me, and in fact I'd often write off as just not very good.

    Unfortunately I'd have to put Farscape in that column. I caught an episode or two and just didn't find it all that interesting. I'd guess that someone, somewhere decided that a show that lacks whatever elements make scifi popular to those people who don't count themselves as part of the sci fi fanbase.

    I think that like any genre the true fans always have a greater level of appreciation for things that will never register with most people. Some things (Star Wars, Alien, Close Encounters, Blade Runner, etc) have an attraction that makes them attractive outside the genre's base. I don't think that Farscape was one of them.

    And this is true of lots of genres of books, movies, music, or any other creative endeavor. It drives the fans batty, of course, because inevitably they are insulted when something they thought was a good representation of the genre gets cut because it just isn't popular with non fans.

    What surprises me is that as many scifi fans as there are that they haven't started doing their own low-budget scifi films direct to video. The Born Again types have been doing this for a while now, making movies based on Revelations. Its pretty big in the Christian community but doesn't even register on Hollywood's radar.

  21. TV shows with stories by RockyJSquirel · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Money only sorta.

    The problem is that Farscape had an involved story (unlike other TV shows). That's what made it good. But you needed to see all the episodes to make any sense of what was happening.

    Combine that with expensive, high quality production and the most incompetent marketing department in history and you have a huge money hole.

    They needed world wide distribution to make their money back, but their God damn incompetent marketing dept. couldn't understand that you have to treat a program like this differently than Bonanza.

    They wouldn't let outside networks get season 1 & season 2 episodes without which the series made no sense!

    100% incompetent marking.
    100%

  22. The reason they were canceled is obvious... by GuardianAli · · Score: 4, Interesting

    One, everyone is right in that the Show was less linear in the 4th season and had more single episode bubbles. I think the reason is cause SciFi wanted another Star Trek and not another Babylon 5. They needed a show that they can show in ANY order in the reruns and not have to worry about keeping the story arc going. One of the reason Star Trek is so popular is cause with its overall single episode ways, they can be rerun like mad and anyone, not even star trek fans can see an episode and get into it and not worry about why, who, when.. I LOVE babylon 5 but i have to admit, if i watch the reruns, its much harder if i wasnt already aware of the series plot.

    As for why it was canceled? Face it people. Scifi and USA Networks isnt Paramount with its huge cash reserves. It takes money. While Paramount can keep up with the costs, SCiFi cant. All those CGI effects, costumes, salaries, Puppets, etc..all cost money.
    I hate it. I wish they didnt cancel it. But SciFi can actually make MORE money rerunning POPULAR scifi shows and have fans watch then make a new series or new season.
    Think about it. They get money for the commercials and stuff for simply reruning a show that was already made or has already paid for it self.So instead of spending money on it, they can start making money. I think they simply figured 88 epsiodes are enough backlog to show reruns and have the fans keep coming back out of nastalgia.

    sad sad. Witchblade is canceled too!! Cause its TNT. Sad. Cause a cable TV isnt as big as Paramount or not enough money..original and great shows get cancled.

    Witchblade,
    First wave,
    etc..
    now..Frascape.

  23. Caitlin Kiernan has contact and action lists... by Bogatyr · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Caitlin Kiernan, the horror and fantasy writer, has a long comment on the cancellation of Farscape along with contact information and actions to take, including contacts for the advertisers on the show. She doesn't have links to individual days, so read the journal and look for the entry for Saturday, September 07, 2002.
    http://www.caitlin-r-kiernan.com/journal.ht mlÂÂ

  24. Re:Don't worry about stargate :) by AnalogBoy · · Score: 2

    Actually, I thought they were going to end it either the end of this season (No, the season has NOT ended yet, no matter what sci fi wants you to think - It's only HALF over - SciFi Wants to spread it out a little, since they may only get one season) or add one more season depending on viewer demand. Then they were going to do an SG-1 Movie which would set the stage for Atlantis. Infinity will have no impact on the stargate universe - it'll be a standalone, unbearable kiddie show. Not like the kinds we had when we were younger like G I Joe or Transformers or whatnot, but more like power rangers and the new transformers.. the cartoons that just reak of "Lesson of the week" type stuff.

  25. Mailbox Full by Hallow · · Score: 3, Informative

    The phone number given is for a woman named Bonnie Hammer. Unfortunately her voicemailbox is full. Does anyone have the number of anyone it would be appropriate to call?

    1. Re:Mailbox Full by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2

      If you wanted to be obnoxious you could just start dialing numbers in the near vicinity of the posted ones. Imagine if EVERYBODY at the network came to work on monday to find their voicemailboxes full of of complaints about farscape.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    2. Re:Mailbox Full by sallen · · Score: 2
      The phone number given is for a woman named Bonnie Hammer. Unfortunately her voicemailbox is full. Does anyone have the number of anyone it would be appropriate to call?


      She sure seems appropriate, since it seems they've taken the ax to the better programming after her arrival. Granted, Vivendi Universal has had it's financial problems with Messier having been at the helm (since dumped) but cost cutting of original programming, if that's what's going on, makes no sense. Why take one's higher rated programs off. Does it lower some costs? Sure. But it also makes Sci-Fi into just another run-of-the-mill cable channel with reruns. It certainly lowers the value... something I'd think they wouldn't want to do since I'm guessing a lot of the subsidiaries (possibly the whole USA net group and Universal group) may be back on the block. Maybe they could save costs by eliminating her position. I think USA would be better back in the hands of Diller and Universal back in the hands of the Bronfman's. I'm guessing they could both get them back at a lot less than they sold them to Vivendi for in the first place. (After all, they've taken a beating on Vivendi stock, that's for sure!)

  26. Time for the Slashdot Channel by option8 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    i think it's about time for a cable channel that's entirely programmed by the viewers, kinda like a slashdot channel.

    yeah, it wouldn't have much original programming, but i imagine it would be the best mix of reruns and syndicated shows available. and with this crowd, a lot of sci-fi and classic thinking-person's shows (ooh! a channel that would show "The Prisoner" would get my vote)

    maybe with enough karma-minded contributing viewers, it would have enough clout and advertisers to afford to get some original shows produced...

    *shrug*

    it's an idea. not my best...

    1. Re:Time for the Slashdot Channel by Anonvmous+Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      "...kinda like a slashdot channel."

      I dunno, I've seen that Goatse pic enough times already.

    2. Re:Time for the Slashdot Channel by Atrophy71 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Call it CBNN...CowboyNeal Network

  27. Re:The fourth season by foobar104 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I hate to say that I agree completely. Occasionally season 3 had a weird episode here and there ("Scratch & Sniff," "Revenging Angel") but also some really over-the-top good stuff. The "Daedalus Demands"/"Icarus Abides" saga that started way back in "Eat Me" was some really amazing television.

    But Season 4 has just blown, hitting what I think was its low point with "John Quixote."

    But I'm easy. If they would throw me a bone with something as good as "The Flax" or "Crackers Don't Matter," I'd be right back in front of my tee vee.

    (God, I'm a geek. Quoting all these episode titles, I sound like Comic Book guy. Time to go soak up some real life.)

  28. SciFi == timid management by Malic · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I have a family member that has had some high-level dealings with SciFi Network. He doesn't have the best things to say about them. He actually told me that really weren't interested in picking up another "space show" because they had many already.

    Frill. They are the SciFi channel! Space shows are they're bread and butter!

    The problem with television is that relatively new emerging networks (Fox is another example) is their history:
    1. Get launched and have a desperate need to make a name for themselves
    2. Having nothing to lose, take risks by trying non-"same old, same old" programming
    3. Acquire A LOT of very positive attention from an audience starved for original programming
    4. Become successful
    5. With success, they now have something to lose
    6. They lose their edge and stop taking risks and gravitate towards "safe/tried-and-true" programming.
    7. They become freaked out that they are losing marketshare and long for the good-ole-days.

    Hmmm... Lots of traditional businesses follow a similar path now that I think of it...

    Solution?
    1. Petition SciFi for more Farscape
    2. Failing that, watch a lot more Good Eats
    --
    I swear by MacOS X. Although I use to swear *at* MacOS 9...
  29. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by GigsVT · · Score: 5, Insightful

    John Edward -- All fiction and no science.

    Real science fiction fans deride the use of Sci-Fi as a moniker, I guess it is becoming obvious why. Soap operas in space are not science fiction, 900 number reject asshole "psychics" that scam old people are not science fiction.

    Science fiction is about expanding the way we thing about the present, by showing us probable or possible futures, based on the science and technology we currently have. It only barely encompasses the "supernatural", only insofar as the "supernatural" is just science we do not yet understand, which, by definition isn't really supernatural.

    --
    I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.
  30. Cost-cutting by The+Famous+Brett+Wat · · Score: 2, Funny

    In other cost-cutting measures, Stargate SG1 will be canceled, but replaced with a spin-off series called "Wormhole eXtreme". Also, the network is considering breathing new life into the old BBC series "Doctor Who". Rumour has it that the renewed "Doctor Who" series would hold fairly true to its earlier incarnation, and less like the movie-length "pilot" episode that was produced a number of years ago. An anonymous inside source tells us, "we think the die-hard Who fans will like it: sets will wobble."

    --
    proof, n. A demonstration that a conclusion is implied by certain premises and axioms.
  31. I Predicted This! by Geckoman · · Score: 3, Offtopic
    Well, not Farscape's cancellation in a specific, John Edwards kind of way [sic], but Sci-Fi's decline in a general, Hari Seldon kind of way.

    My theory for the past 10 years has been that there is an inevitable tendency for any given TV network or channel to become exactly like all the others. New, focused channels may pop up, or old ones may refocus, but those are momentary spikes, and the general direction will remain unchanged.

    Remember when MTV actually had music? Or when VH1 did? Now they both mostly have crappy reality shows and cheesy documentaries.

    Remember when TNN was The Nashville Network? Even if you weren't a country fan, you had to respect the attention they gave to their target demographic, with "Dukes of Hazzard" and "Dallas" marathons, NASCAR, outdoor shows, and the Grand Ol' Opry. The first bad sign was when they started showing Star Trek. Nashville? Huh? Now they're the "National Network," and last time I checked there were no fishing shows or overalls in sight.

    CNN used to be all news; now it's mostly talk shows that are vaguely news-related. Fox and WB used to be hip and edgy, and now they could give CBS a strong challenge for the snooze market most nights. Heck, even the Weather Channel has shows now!

    And soon we'll all pine for the days when Sci-Fi actually had science fiction. I'll go out on a limb and predict that they'll soon change their name to "SF," then shortly thereafter start pretending that it stands for something completely different, like -- I don't know -- "Serious Favorites: The Best Shows Everybody Likes!"

    When we were told we'd have 500 channels of programming, nobody ever bothered to mention that they'd all be showing reruns of Law & Order and Friends.

    1. Re:I Predicted This! by NeuroManson · · Score: 2

      Try TNN on Saturday and Sunday, when it's all overalls, deer huntin', monster trucks, adding blowers to your Shelby Cobra kit, wrasslin redneck fun! The Star Trek/Robot Wars/Baywatch/Conspiracy Zone stuff runs on weekdays...

      --
      Just because you can mod me down, doesn't mean you're right. Shoes for industry!
    2. Re:I Predicted This! by Geckoman · · Score: 2

      Ah! That explains why I haven't seen it. On weekends I'm usually out in the yard adding blowers to my 4x4 huntin' truck to get it ready for the mud races on Saturday night. ;-)

    3. Re:I Predicted This! by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I liked MTV better when they were the animation channel. LiquidTV, The Maxx, that weird alien-in-the-brain series, etc. Those were some awesome shows.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
  32. A Clue... by herderofcats · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I attended WorldCon, in which some of the executives of the SciFi channel were at a panel.

    They gave no clue that they were cancelling Farscape, but it was clear that the relationship with Farscape was different then many of their other shows. Basically a number of their shows are produced by either themselves or by a sister company under Vivendi Universal, but Farscape is not.

    Thus they have very few rights to Farscape, basically first broadcast rights. They may have decided that they needed more rights or control to the properties that they do broadcast then what Farscape was offering. Think about it, with the Dune miniseries, they own it completely. They get money from every DVD, every overseas sale, etc.

    This adds up, and may be what makes them believe they'll make more money producing their own or their sister companies shows then continuing to promote Farscape which owns all such subsidiary rights.

    BTW, re: the comments about starting in January being a bad sign, the executives also said in the panel that they don't try to do new stuff in the fall like the other networks. Instead, they counter-program, and thus introduce new mini-series and events in December when most networks are doing their first reruns, and introduce new shows in January and Summer when the momentum for network shows is down.

    -- Herder of Cats

  33. Does this NOT make sense to anyone else? by gerardrj · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The SCIFI web page for FarScape has no mention of a cancellation, and in fact they are touting new epsisodes in January. They are also touting the new FarScape video game.

    On top of that, SCIFI doesn't seem (from my brief research and the recollection of the credits) to have anything to do with production, they seem merely to purchase the show for "broadcast". What I understand is that Jim Henson Productions owns the show (characters, plots, elements, etc). So if JH owns the show, why would SCIFI cancelling the show cause JH and the production company to tear down sets when apparently the show runs on several other channels/stations in other countries (like BBC2 in England, FoxTel in Australia, etc).

    While SCIFI has a history of cancelling good shows, and I can't completely discount this as rumor/hoax the story just doesn't make a whole lot of sense, and there is no press release or the like that I can find on a credible site.

    If you do believe that the story is true and SCIFI is indeed cancelling FarScape, then I suggest that along with your letters/calls/emails/faxes to the SCIFI headquarters, that you also write/contact the programming managers at some other stations, just in case.
    HBO comes to mind, they are a major force in commercial-free original series, and they currently lack a SciFi based show. In order to compete with Odyssey 5 and Jeremiah on ShowTime (don't they also show SG-1?), HBO might very well be willing to pick up FarScape along with the installed viewer base. A letter writing campaign to them might better scure the future of FarScape in the event of cancellation by SciFi Network and cesssation of production by Henson, et al.

    --
    Article X: The powers not delegated... by the Constitution...are reserved...to the people
    1. Re:Does this NOT make sense to anyone else? by gerardrj · · Score: 2

      First off, since when can you trust anyone's identity on IRC or the Internet in general?

      --
      Article X: The powers not delegated... by the Constitution...are reserved...to the people
    2. Re:Does this NOT make sense to anyone else? by barberio · · Score: 2

      Henson own the show. However, SciFi channel own an option to the next 88 episodes produced. They are not excersing this option, but neither are they releasing Henson to work with another network. Escentialy, they have killed the show.

    3. Re:Does this NOT make sense to anyone else? by Exatron · · Score: 2, Informative

      I do not believe that SciFi cancelled Farscape. I know they did. SciFi may not own the series, but the network does provide most of its budget. I doubt Ben Browder, David Kemper, and Richard Manning were lying during the chat held last night at scifi.com. A letter from Anthony Simcoe confirmed the news.

      --
      "I think so, Brain, but 'instant karma' always gets so lumpy." - Pinky
      "Decepticons FOREVER!!!" - Ravage
    4. Re:Does this NOT make sense to anyone else? by jonnythan · · Score: 2

      And second, did YOU actually talk to them on IRC, or are you trusting someone else who TOLD you they did?

  34. Correction, cast and crew -nt- by Sarcasmooo! · · Score: 2

    no text

  35. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by Lars+T. · · Score: 2

    Well, people who are stupid enough to actually buy the stuff they see in the commercials are probably a better target group than those who don't and even use DVRs to skip them.

    --

    Lars T.

    To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck

  36. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by mpe · · Score: 2

    One could easily surmise that the true audiences for these more thoughtful shows has already largely abandoned TV for the internet and games. Therefore the delivery media is out of sync with the potential audience.

    One thing that the TV execs would rather fight than admit is that trying to chop the world up into geographical bits won't work any more. As soon as something is broadcast anywhere in the world it is likely to be available for download from some source or other.

  37. For those *WHO* enjoy it... by fmaxwell · · Score: 2

    I reread my original post and was embarassed to see the title with the word "that" where the word "who" should have been. Let the snickering begin...

  38. Just got back from the wrap party by edo-01 · · Score: 5, Informative
    A bit woozy, so bear with me... I worked on Farscape since the beginning of season 2 in the VFX department, I left at the beginning of season 4 but continued to freelance on the show.

    Tonight I was checking Fark.com literally as I was about to go out the door and saw that we'd been cancelled... my jaw just *dropped*. I couldn't believe it, the show was literally our lives for the last three years...

    The mood at the party was pretty good, a lot of sadness - I mean sci-fi broke the news the DAY before the wrap party, everyone was still reeling. We'd all known that season 5 was an on-paper "lock" but we knew there was a chance it might not happen. But overall people were in a cool state of mind, nothing like this had ever been done in Sydney before and it's been a hell of a ride. Everyone involved with the show is so happy to have been a part of it, for me it was my first job in the industry after quitting the IT world, and even when it got tough I'm so grateful to have gotten the opportunity, and I've made a lot of good friends to boot.

    Brain Henson explained that it had almost made it to at least 13 eps for season 5 but in the end he just couldn't sell it. Man, I'm numb (of course that could be the after effects of the party) It turned out to be a damn good party though, the gag reel had been hastily re-cut to include some nice moments in light of the news, but it went down well - Anthony Simcoe as D'Argo and Wayne Pygram as Scorpious bring the house down every year with their totally in-character bloopers, this year was no expection. I know the show was not to everyone's taste, hell sometimes I didn't go to the screenings myself, but it's a great offbeat show, and if you liked it enough; as Ben Browder, David Kemper and Richard Manning explained in the chat, send (polite!) letters to sci-fi, or call, and let them know.

    Ok drunken ramble mod /off going to go watch the sun come up :-)

    1. Re:Just got back from the wrap party by ErikZ · · Score: 2

      Bloopers?

      Is there any way for the fans to see these?

      --
      Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
    2. Re:Just got back from the wrap party by edo-01 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Man, I doubt it... These are generally pretty blue and they don't bleep them :-) Things like D'Argo threatening to f**k a peacekeeper squad to death and Scorpious resonded commanding them to line up and fellat the Luxan, that was last year. This year the funniest was again something D'Argo said that I'd maybe only repeat on alt.tasteless. In involved babies. They're also full of in-jokes, whenever a cellphone ruins a take the guilty party has to buy a slab of beer - one year there was great one of Pilot talking when it happened, he raised himself up and yelled in a very Aussie accent "aaaaaand *another* slab for Jacko!" (or whatever the guy's name was. Season one GMD, the old FX house did a great shot of the Digital Rygel singing Sinatra. We did our own CG Rygel and I always wanted do do something involving him and some Hynerian slave girls, or a "Star Wars" shot of a command carrier going by to reveal a bumper sticker like "I break for Fat Chicks" or "Hows my driving, call 1-800-eat-shit" etc... but I never got the time... never will now :-(

    3. Re:Just got back from the wrap party by anonymous+cupboard · · Score: 2

      Ok, just make sure someone sticks it up on a fileshare service. Uncut.

  39. Re:Where is the proof? by Flamerule · · Score: 2

    Don't be a moron; RTFA. All this news is courtesy of Ben Browder and 2 of the show's producers in an official chat. In fact, there were unsubstantiated rumors flying around several days prior to this -- but now they've been confirmed.

  40. Re:Reality Programming.... by slashdot_commentator · · Score: 2

    If I understand the idea behind television series correctly, The producers of the programming make a bit of money off of the original run (more if the ratings are really good and the show really brings in the advertising) which is all well and good. But don't they end up making more money *long term* if their shows end up in syndication after the series has been around for a few (3 or 4?) seasons.

    You are correct. That is why Network TV production companies are producing them, not independent production companies. Network TV does not care that there is no "resale" value to reality TV. And reality TV does not carry over debt into future seasons like a regularly produced program. The payoff is instant good ratings AND they are sort of counting on the FORMAT of the reality show to continue, even though the contestants don't. And when the ratings tank, chuck the format. Finally, "reality" TV takes maybe 1/10 of the cost of a regular drama/comedy. Thus those programs produce more money for the network. Who cares if they are getting less audience and lower advertiser dollars, if its more profitable than a drama/comedy?

    What concerns me is the network deliberately choosing shows that do not get great market share, but generate desirable net profit. That means more crappy shows, less people watching TV, but networks keeping them because they make more money than a drama/comedy.

    --
    There is no America. There is no democracy. There is only IBM and AT&T and DuPont, Dow, General Electric, and Exxon
  41. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by ErikZ · · Score: 2

    (blink)

    The want the sci-fi channel to get away from those space shows.

    Ah.

    I can see it from a managers point of view though. Make a sci-fi show that requires almost no special effects, and it will be a lot more profitable that one with a lot of expensive special effects.

    I bet "Crossing over" bring them a bundle of cash.

    --
    Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
  42. Nice theory, but this action is consistent .... by fm6 · · Score: 4, Interesting
    It might seem strange, but this sudden reversal seems consistent with the situation at SciFi. It's a pretty weird situation -- SciFi and USA Interactive's other cable networks were supposed to be spun off into a joint USA-Vivendi operation. But that seems to have fallen through. Instead, USA seems to be moving towards becoming a subsidiary of Vivendi. Except that Vivendi itself is in trouble. So they're both looking for ways to cut costs.

    Yeah it's dumb. You have to spend money to make money. But it's the way business works these days. Investors see everything in terms of the quarterly bottom line. This was true even when the economy was booming and is doubly true now. The company I work for has been profitable for 8 quarters straight, has a huge amount of cash, and no long-term debt. And yet we have to jump through hoops to justify even tiny expenditures -- even ones that would obviously save us money in the long term.

    The cash issue explains a lot of stuff at SciFi that had me puzzled. Their unwillingness to show Farscape episodes that supposedly had already been paid for. Their sudden disappearance of other shows because of "poor ratings". (Ratings that are poorer than the "Tales From the Crypt" reruns they used as filler?) I'm afraid the bottom line is this: SciFi's strategy of becomming a first-run entertainment provider is dead, and it's back to reruns of other networks' shows.

    1. Re:Nice theory, but this action is consistent .... by Chanc_Gorkon · · Score: 2

      Yeah. Well. I never much cared for it, but I do know Farscape was popular. Maybe now they will go back to showing reruns of other good series. With exception of TNN, ever notice that there aren't many networks who show what they started to show when they started. SciFi when they started showed things like Buck Rogers, Battlestar Galactica and things like that. Cartoon Network showed, well, old cartons like Bugs Bunny, Yogi Bear and Fred Flintstone. Now on there you get stuff like the Powerpuff Girls (eck) and Johnny Bravo. Maybe SciFi can do reruns of Dark Angel? Who knows!

      --

      Gorkman

  43. Re:Reality Programming.... by Chanc_Gorkon · · Score: 2

    Brings to mind another point....I remember everyone saying oh Kelly from survivor or Colleen who made that horrid The Animal movie with Rob Schnieder are going to be house hold words.....for MAYBE one month after the show. Now where are they? Only thing memorable for me was that a local radio station intern here actually banged Jenna from survior. It even made the radio(not the banging, but the story)! I don't remember much else. Don't even ask me about Survior 3 and 4. Fear Factor blows too. Fear Factor is a radio intern stunt blown up by 10.

    --

    Gorkman

  44. Re:I'm only mildly surprised by ErikZ · · Score: 2

    Heh. I went on the farscape IRC channel with questions, and was TAUNTED.

    I like farscape, I've found that the farscape fans generally suck.

    --
    Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
  45. Re:Was Filmed in Australia but too exe now. by anonymous+cupboard · · Score: 2

    Um, why do they want to 'straighten the cash breaks'. Queensalnd has been a gold mine for the production companies and, most importantly everyone one that brings back money into the economy. To lose Farscape is a misfortune, but to lose all the other shows seems more than a little careless.

  46. Here are the rumors by KILNA · · Score: 2

    Vivendi is the owner of Henson productions (producers of Farscape) and MP3.com in addition to other media properties. A quick googling indicates that they have been suffering financial difficulties, and are on the brink of bankruptcy. The rumor is, even with the 2-season deal that obligates Henson to the 5th season, they won't be able to produce it for the price of the original contract. Sci-Fi cannot afford the new price for the ratings the show drives, so as a result, they told Henson to stop the 5th season. So, even though I'm sending my letter to Sci-Fi channel, I doubt there will likely be a resolution unless Sci-Fi wants to buy Henson on the cheap in lieu of suing over the contract obligation. The actors in the show are more tenured and are probably driving costs to a certain extent. Furthermore, its unlikely to be picked up by another network who may be willing to pay more, due to the Henson obligation to Sci-Fi channel for the 5th season (Sci-Fi wants their eps at the original price if Vivendi picks up the pieces, or another company buys out Henson).

    --
    Error: PANTS NOT FOUND. Press <F1> to continue.
  47. Re:Speaking of Sci-fi...Enterprise is back on Sept by anonymous+cupboard · · Score: 2

    Actually, Enterprise is the methadone, it helps to eke things out till the real hard stuff becomes available again. I was pleasently suprised with Enterprise, if they weren't going to make a series out of Galaxy Quest, Enterprise was ok for trek. However, that only marked time until the next series of Farscape.

  48. Re:We were ready even before this by rodgerd · · Score: 2

    Buffy is at least getting Ripper as a substitute. And Buffy's been on a downhill slide through season 6, so a wrap-up in 7 might no be a bad idea.

  49. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by T-Kir · · Score: 2

    ...but what the hell else do they have?

    Well, at least they're doing a good job of the Dune series, although anything is better than Dino De Laurentis (sp?) and David Lynch's version (that got cut to hell to make it 'viable' for cinema).

    But I wonder how many more they'll do, there are plenty of books after Dune Messiah, plus the excellent Prelude to Dune series.

    --
    Are you local? There's nothing for you here!
  50. All is not lost by fm6 · · Score: 2
    Two weeks from now, Fox will premiere Firefly. The promos leave one with the impression that it's "Gunsmoke meets Buffy and buys a spaceship" but that's way off the mark. What's really happening is a serious attempt to do real "hard" SF. More serious, in fact, than any previous TV show -- and I don't exclude Star Trek. There are no conspiracies, latex aliens, ray guns, FTL drives, or any of the other silly baggage of previous TV SF. What it does have is people struggling to survive on terraformed planets in a remote solar system 500 years from now. Fancy technology exists, so most people have horses instead of shuttlecraft, and six-shooters instead of laser guns.

    There's a heavy western/civil war feel (supposedly it's all inspired by The Killer Angels and Stagecoach), but it's not just old adventure stories in SF drag (anyone notice the similarity between Balance of Terror and The Enemy Below?). It's something new and original, and I'm looking forward to it a lot more than I ever did a Farscape ep.

    This fan site has more info than does the official site, including a lot of good stills.

  51. Duh! by fm6 · · Score: 2

    Meant to write "Fancy technology exists, but is expensive, so..."

  52. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by slashdot_commentator · · Score: 2


    The point I wanted to make was that quite a few shows were being cancelled even though in most cases they were getting acceptably good ratings. I suspect there is a driving force for this trend. If this force is demographically driven, its likely most of the *kind* of shows we like will soon be gone and more important, these shows will not be debuted in the future.

    Smallville can very well be up on the chopping block. It has good rating, but hell, so did some of the shows I mentioned that have been canned. Smallville does not get MONSTER rating, but is popular to the 18-25 viewer category, which a lot of us do not belong to anymore. If you assume that category raised on videogames and computers are less loyalty driven to a particular show, ratings can drop precipitously, and in 3 months the trigger can be pulled. *Poof*, no more Smallville. It can happen as simple as that.

    I was hoping that someone out there may have a better insight to this trend, but I guess I'll have to wait a couple of years and see this trend play out.

    --
    There is no America. There is no democracy. There is only IBM and AT&T and DuPont, Dow, General Electric, and Exxon
  53. Re:Don't worry about stargate :) by AnalogBoy · · Score: 2

    Emerich wanted to do three Stargate movies. Indeed, as late as last year they were discussing a second stargate movie with the ORIGINAL CAST, completely disregarding SG-1. I think it's finally had the door shut on it.

    I really like stargate, and the boxed sets of the seasons are nifty (They need a few more features, like the star trek DVD's, IMHO, but otherwise they're great). The movie is coming out in a special edition (higher bitrate, DTS, more features, etc) in October.

  54. LCD TV by fm6 · · Score: 2
    Sorry to sound pessimistic, but networks have already long since shown that they don't want anything that doesn't appeal to the lowest common denominator.
    I don't disagree. The trick is to include just enough sex and violence to get the networks to carry your show. Then you slip in some actual thought-provoking content. Look at Law and Order (well, before they became a franchise, anyway). And ER.

    And in fact the creator of Firefly is Joss Whedon, who's past master of this trick. It helps that he's actually good at the violence part -- he used to make a living writing fight scenes for other people's movies.

  55. It's SciFi or nothing by fm6 · · Score: 2
    There is always hope. HBO has a rather good record of picking up shows of meritable creative content that do not get network/cable support from the cronies that run them.
    Not an option. Apparently USA Interactive, SciFi's parent, wants to have it both ways. They don't want to pay for more eps, but they want to retain exclusive US rights to the series. More IP hoarding!
  56. Re:Considering that they just put out a Farscape g by balthan · · Score: 2

    I doubt it's a scam. The rumor has been around for every season of every orginal series on Sci-Fi. My take on the situation:

    Sci-Fi is going at it ass-backwards. They're trying to appeal to the mainstream. Well, science fiction is a niche market, with few obvious exceptions like Star Trek. Sci-Fi should be trying to cater to all the sci-fi geeks. Stuff like Anime, imported shows (Dr. Who, Red Dwarf, Blake's 7), etc. Instead they follow the majors network's typical plan: Create show and if it isn't an instant hit, cancel and return to square 1. Also, instead of cowering from the major networks (the reason for the current 4 month hiatus of Farscape), they should market their shows as an alternative to the same old crap. But, that's just my opinion.

  57. Re:Was Filmed in Australia but too exe now. by anonymous+cupboard · · Score: 2
    Keep in mind, this is the state that introduced the revolutionary concept of Sunday trading only 5 weeks or so ago.

    I was kind of surpised about this when I as last in Oz. Howver, I currently live in Germany and apart from a few bakers and florists there is very little open here on a Sunday.

    Back to the film/tv series thing, I really don't understand why the write-offs are not permitted. You normally tax income rther than what was essentially a cost. Perhaps the state wasn't seeing enough of the post-production income before it was sent off-shore?

  58. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by ChaosDiscord · · Score: 2
    Real science fiction fans deride the use of Sci-Fi as a moniker, I guess it is becoming obvious why.

    Real science fiction fans just relax and don't worry about it. They spend their time reading, watching, and listening to things they enjoy, be it labelled science fiction, sci-fi, sf, speculative fiction, fantasy, or children's stories.

    The Sci-Fi Channel appears to please many people who identify with much of its programming and goals. What's the harm in it?

    (That said, John Edwards is tripe. Ah well.)

  59. Re:The time to act is now(why block subscription?) by Stephen+Samuel · · Score: 2

    It's probably mostly technical.. Far easier to block 1 or 4 sets of channels than to block 45 of 70 channels -- and probably get it wrong 5%of the time (which, in a city of 1 million subscribers, would be 50K upset customers demanding corrections)

    --
    Free Software: Like love, it grows best when given away.
  60. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by Sabalon · · Score: 2

    Why must they make all these shows? There is ton of stuff (some crap, some good) out there. Just buy the rights to broadcast it. TV Land and Nick at Night seem to be doing pretty good based on this method.

  61. Merging with SG-1 by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 2

    This is simple resource consolidation like any merger. I mean, c'mon, two shows back-to-back about wormholes?

    Here's what's going to happen: Sam's going to figure out how the Asgard stargate enhancer works, where dialing is extended to other galaxies. When they make a connection, the MALPS is going to pick up a NASA signal on the other side. When they go to investigate, they find it's the beacon from John Chriton's shuttle, and they signal to Moyia, whereby John travels down to the surface, and travels back to Earth with SG-1. Somehow, Dargo kills Jonas and O'Neil fills him with lead.

    Now, John is a member of SG-1, and with his knowledge of wormholes from the Ancients (the race who actually built the StarGates), the G'oo'ou'ould are defeated by a strike force from the Asgard, the Tokra, and the Taree.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  62. Re:What is with this TV season's cancelling crap?? by cheese_wallet · · Score: 2

    "Well, at least they're doing a good job of the Dune"

    Wow, it doesn't look like you are kidding. I really thought they did an absolutely terrible job on that. It was alright on its own I guess, if you pretended the books didn't exist and it was some new creation. But it wasn't even close to the book(s). Except in the names of characters. The behaviors didn't really match anywhere, and the fremen looked like janitors.