Dell To Enter PDA Market

soundsop writes "CNET News.com reports that Dell is poised to enter the PDA market. Michael Dell states that announcements for US PDA products are coming "really soon". Will I have 50 configuration options on my Dell PDA?"

Comments

dell-less

[Anonymous Coward]

dell does computers real well. they need to leave the printers/pda's/etc alone & stick to what they know. dude, i'm not getting a dell pda.

Accounts

[e8johan]

In the good old days, everyone had an account on the central company server. (I had 250kB on an old winchester drive!) Nowdays we all have an account (or several) accesable over the internet. Over the years the internet has become mobile and I want to reach my files etc. even when I travel. This is probably one reason to why the PDA market has exploded in such a way as it has. Another important factor is the price and size of electronics; one can actually make a palm sized useful computer today to a price that some of us can afford.
This move by DELL shows that the PDA market has grown, and become more mature. That is, PDAs are not only geek toys, but today they can be quite useful (even though I still use mine for vrally!).
In the future I imagine almost everyone carrying PDAs that can be wirelessly conneced to a screen (or a projector) to show stuff, or terminals with proper kbds and mice to do real work. The PDA will be the phone, computer, wallet and calendar of today, and hopefully not running Palladium!

Options?

[sunilhari]

In all fairness, this could be Dell's chance to create something truly novel. Their PCs are pretty much the same as other manufacturers, and so creativity has been minimal.

On the other hand, this could be simply another way to push WindowsCE through some backdoor agreement with Bill and Co. But we can only wait and see.

I just hope that Dell's PDA doesn't turn into another Palm clone (Handspring, et. al)

Re:Options?

[Anonymous Coward]

Dell? CREATIVE?

This is Dell we are talking about. If you think they'll create a "new" PDA you are fooling only yourself--it will be a by-the-book stock Wince device. This is DELL, they lick Microsoft's boots at every step. Has Mike Dell ever taken a single step outside Bill Gates' shadow?

The market for Wince devices is already bloated...seems like every single electronics manufacturer has their own WinCE device. And the only one that was a runaway success was the iPaq (no thanks to Wince, and every bit of thanks to the years if 'Itsy' research that went into the iPaq).

Re:Options?

[Ponty]

You've hit the nail on the head.

The WinCE market, rather like the Windows market, isn't a very exciting place. I'm no expert, but besides architecture differences, I don't see much variation in the world of WinCE devices. They're all basically the same with different form factors. (Heck, look at desktop PCs. The only ones that are vaguely different are Sony Vaios and they aren't all that revolutionary.)

So I don't expect this to be anything other than a PDA with a little higher dude-factor, and maybe a deal if bought with a new laptop.

Re:Options?

[Cheffo Jeffo]

Dell is not about technical creativity -- they build inexpensive machines that most people can use and get them out the door quickly.

End Of Story.

People end up paying for their machines before Dell has to pay for the components -- a nice way to finance things.

They're going to put out a solid (?) WinPDA and price folks out of the market as only they can.

Don't go looking for a revolution -- you'll just be disappointed.

Cheers,

JAKD

Re:Options?

[jamesl]

According to news reports, the Dell PDA will be Pocket PC, in stock, order today, ship today. Priced at $199 and $299. compared to HP's $500+ offering that's pretty revolutionary.

Re:Why bother

[Hung Chow]

We haven't seen any specs yet, but they did give some guidance that is could be PocketPC based. I'll reserve judgement until we see some hard facts. Still loving my Sharp Zaurus!

Make PDAs Open Source

[Lieutenant_Dan]

We must permit the Open Source community of developers access to the global strategy in PDAs. We are sorely lacking in standards, which only the Open Source community can provide. With their vast experience and technical knowledge, they can assist any large corporation such as Dell, Psion, or Miratech to provide the public a PDA that fulfills all their needs.

Only when we allow the Open Source community to assist us in PDA development will we able to topple HP's reign in programmable calculators.

Hmmmm...

[mirko]

I guess they are trying to work around the poorer and poorer PC sales.
Now, they'll have a hard-time against Sony, HP(aq), Palm and also Sharp whose Zaurus is really the kind of programmable gadget one may look for.

Hoo-freakin'-rah.

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh yay, Dell getting into the PDA business? Why? Does the already bloated PDA market NEED yet another Windows CE device (and you KNOW that Dell wouldn't even consider doing anything else)?

Re:Hoo-freakin'-rah.

[Mr_Silver]

Oh yay, Dell getting into the PDA business? Why? Does the already bloated PDA market NEED yet another Windows CE device (and you KNOW that Dell wouldn't even consider doing anything else)?

At the risk of sounding stupid, of course it does.

The larger the number of people in the market, the greater the competition. Given that the software specifications are pretty much the same (helped by Microsofts specifications) you've got only a few things that companies can compete on such as hardware specs (including dimensions and weight), battery life, upgradability and best of all price.

So if more players in the market causes others to start making strides to produce a better product, then it can only be seen as a good thing.

Will they make them themselves?

[Louis-Nap]

Does anyone know what exactly will Dell be selling? Will it be PDAs that they made themselves (ala Martha Stewart), or will they just be rebranding some other companies PDAs (like they are apparently going to with Lexmark printers)

Personally I hope they make them themselves. While I don't want to get into an argument of white-box versus brand name computers (damn, I mentioned it, here come the flames :0), the one thing Dell can always be relied on is to care about quality. They don't just stick any old crap on the shelves and sell to my mother, so hopefully they'll manufacture them themselves.

Plus like the story says, being able to customize my PDA a million billion ways (if only my iPaq could have 512MB RAM) is just plain cool

Re:Will they make them themselves?

[vasqzr]

Well, they already sell Palm PDA's. They actually gave us some M105's (bottom barrel, but my manager likes his for keeping contacts and golf scores) when we bought some laptops a while back.

At their website they've got Palm, Sony, Handspring...

Isn't Dell climbing into the printer business as well, and the router business?

I thought Cisco wasn't allowing them to resell anymore because Dell has the PowerConnect line out...

Re:Will they make them themselves?

[madshot]

Good question.. what exactly will they sell.. We use dell here in our office and we have had a good experiance. I'm not sure I would buy all of my parts from dell (i.e. printer and pda), but if dell started selling PDAs, for us big customers we can maybe get the sales person to give us a free PDA after we make large orders.. I love sales people that send me free stuff!

Re:Will they make them themselves?

[Octagon Most]

Isn't Dell climbing into the printer business as well, and the router business?

I thought Cisco wasn't allowing them to resell anymore because Dell has the PowerConnect line out...

No, Dell is getting into the switch business. And, yes, Cisco has cut them off from reselling Cisco switches as a result. Dell offers a full line of managed switches competing with Cisco's Catalyst 2950 and 3500 series as well as an inexpensive unmanaged line.

Dell does currently resell other manufacturers' PDAs, but now they are announcing their intention to sell their own branded line based on the MS PocketPC (WinCE) OS.

The thing about Dell is that they do not enter a new market lightly. They have waited until the PDA market matured enough that they could take commonly used technology and win market share by selling it for less. I think other PDA manufacturers should be very concerned. And PDA consumers should be excited about the competition.

Re:Will they make them themselves?

[inteller]

If you don't already know by now, most Pocket PCs are made by an OEM in Taiwan these days. They are basically all the same and they just change the button layouts and the front plate. Asus is coming out with one and I think it'll have a greater impact than Dell's PDA, IF they price it right. Asus is better known in the do DYI community and Asus has a good shot at capturing all the mom and pop business.

Re:Will they make them themselves?

[Ponty]

Martha Stewart makes PDAs? Can I get a lemon zester attachment?

No Specialization

[Anonymous Coward]

Networking products, printers, wireless, handhelds? Seems like Dell is about to spread themselves too thin. God knows they need a new marketing department after that "Dude, yer gettin a Dell" bomb. Will this lead to a degradation of quality in their desktops and servers?

Re:No Specialization

[NDPTAL85]

Actually that marketing campaign was a hit. Dell is just being smart by deciding not to overdo it and save Steven for later. I know you all hate him, but he was an overwhelming success for the company.

What's the motivation for Dell?

[Latent IT]

I wonder why Dell considers this a good move. It has potential - like Apple, they can offer you a handheld gizmo (ipod) with your computer... but is Dell really going to put out their own line of handhelds? Or just offer handsprings (or something) in a bundle?

If they're just going to offer handsprings, their revenue stream will be severely limited, since their main business model is to sell hardware fairly cheaply. If they put enough of a markup on the handheld hardware, people won't want to buy them (I hope) because they'll be able to purchase them elsewhere for less.

If they put out their own piece of hardware, it's a major departure from what Dell already does. It has massive potential, if it's a good piece of kit, but it will be coming into a saturated market no matter what. Right now, Dell is a value added reseller. I'm not sure they would want to try to be something else.

The only other option that I could imagine them thinking is that they will be able to 'guarantee' that whatever handheld they sell will work with whatever desktop they sell, due to software they pre-load on both.

Er... wait. Actually that's a great idea. Dell, do that. They won't get the hardware geek market, but then, they never have. They'll get the home family market, and rake in money for software that pretty much already exists. It's good sense on their part.

Re:What's the motivation for Dell?

[Sabalon]

Right now you either see people with palms, or if it's like the conference I just came back from "Compaq iPaq" everywhere.

My guess is that hurts them, that people don't get the Dell name when they look at other people's handhelds.

Probably also part of that "me too" mentality.

Re:What's the motivation for Dell?

[jgalun]

I think Dell's reasoning is simple - Dell wants to become as close to a monopoly in the computer market as it can. Of course, it can probably never become a monopoly - there are too many places that can make white boxes for that to happen - but it's certainly going to try to gain market share to the point where it can raise profit margins.

Look at it this way: in the PC market in the US, there are just a few big manufacturers. But IBM loses money on its PC line, so that's only going to continue as long as IBM feels that loss creates a greater profit for its consulting business down the line. HP and Compaq just merged, so those two competitors just become one, and Dell has been stealing market share from them anyway. Gateway is slowly dying. Apple is not a real threat. Sony is only one doing decently.

Dell's long term strategy is to outprice as many of their competitors as they can for a long time, until they take a huge market share and push those competitors out of the market. And at that point, many businesses and consumers would look to Dell as their one place to get all their computer needs. If that happens - with competition significantly limited - Dell can raise their prices, not just on PCs, but on other products too - like PDAs and printers, the two new markets they are entering in 2003.

So, to sum, Dell's strategy is two-pronged:

Gain market share/push competitors out of the PC market so that eventually they can raise prices (profit margins).

Attack every aspect of the PC business, with the idea that once you become the major player in the PC business, people will prefer to buy all products from you, not just their PCs from you and their PDA from vendor 2 and their printers from vendor 3.

It's a smart strategy. Dell's been run very, very well so far, I wouldn't bet against them.

Re:What's the motivation for Dell?

[Latent IT]

I wouldn't dream of underestimating them, but I just hope that they don't overestimate themselves. Even if they did achieve a market share that allowed them near-monopolistic powers, I'd be worried they'd lose it the moment they tried to leverage them.

I just don't see a huge ammount of brand loyalty in the beige box business. I see loyalty for servers, I see people get worked up into a slather over operating systems, but very rarely do you see Dell and Gateway fans having it out. I think it's a bit like Intel - they thought they had near monopoly powers, and they certainly had near monopoly size... but the moment they let their guard down, AMD jumped in down their throats. Intel had raised prices, and AMD slashed them. Things are only just now getting back to what used to be 'normal'. It'll be interesting to see what happens when each company rolls out it's line of 64 bit processors.

What does this have to do with Dell? I just think a Dell isn't like a Ford, or McDonalds. People compare the (meaningless) numbers, and come up with some not entirely usefull $/MHz comparison, and then buy whatever seems best to them. Apple has brand loyalty because they have some kind of soul lurking in each machine. Dell has... a kid who's very excited about getting one on TV.

I like Dell, I do. They revolutionized quite a few things by building to order, rather than keeping stock. But I think things like bundled printers have been giving other bundled devices bad names. (You know these printers. They come with no ink, cost more than the printer to refill, and then break conveniently.)

By the way, what makes you say Gateway is slowly dying? I think things like their Profile line offer them more than bundling a PDA. They seem fairly unique. (To the non-apple world.)

Re:What's the motivation for Dell?

[jgalun]

What makes me think Gateway is dying? Simply put, the fact that the only reason to buy Gateway vs. buying another brand of PC is their direct model and their marketing. And Dell has been beating them on both counts. Gateway has been bleeding money, while Dell has twice as much revenue and is profitable. Dell is opening new direct sale mini-stores while Gateway has been closing many Gateway stores. As for whose marketing is more successful, well, CNN covered it as one of its top stories when it leaked that Dell was thinking of retiring Steven. The only things I've ever heard about Gateway's advertising is people making fun of the talking cow for being stupid.

As for whether marketing is important in computers, I think you underestimate its importance. If marketing were unimportant in computers in general, then we'd all be using Amigas today, or perhaps Macintoshes, or BeOS. And if marketing were unimportant in the PC world, then more users would buy white box PCs, since as you put it, "People compare the (meaningless) numbers, and come up with some not entirely usefull $/MHz comparison, and then buy whatever seems best to them." On $/MHz, white box retailers don't have marketing costs and thus normally win that comparison.

But users are swayed to a great degree by marketing. And for many people, when they think of buying a PC today, they think of Dell first. And if Dell's more efficient business model can push a couple more competitors out of business, it could come to the point where when people think of buying a PC, when the average user thinks of buying a PC, he'll think of Dell, IBM, or HP (when the rich user thinks of buying a computer, he'll think of Apple or Sony, the upscale computer brands). And in that circumstance, you can easily see how it makes sense for Dell to sell peripherals too.

Re:What's the motivation for Dell?

[Anonymous Coward]

Wrong! Dell's strategy does not require raising prices somewhere down the line. Dell's strategy is simply to produce its merchandise for less than the competition can and sell it direct to the consumer and to do this without sacrificing quality. If they can produce the product for less than the competition and cut out the middleman in the sales channel, they can sell to the consumer for less money and still make a profit. Expect the strategy for PDA's to be the same.

Re:What's the motivation for Dell?

[rtechie]

I just don't see a huge ammount of brand loyalty in the beige box business. I see loyalty for servers, I see people get worked up into a slather over operating systems, but very rarely do you see Dell and Gateway fans having it out.

Brand loyalty matters in the corporate IT world, where the real money in desktops is. Most shops, even small shops, tend to standardize on one brand of PC. Increasingly, that brand is Dell. Personally, I prefer IBM, the laptops are the best on the market and the desktops are outstanding, though slightly overpriced.

By the way, what makes you say Gateway is slowly dying? I think things like their Profile [gateway.com] line offer them more than bundling a PDA. They seem fairly unique. (To the non-apple world.)

Gateway has bee hemmoraging cash, they're closing a buch of the "Gateway Country" stores, and they've always tried to compete in the comsumer space where the real mone ISN'T. Gateway has a lousy rep among corporate IT departments. And the Profile is hardly unique, IBM, Compaq, and Dell have all offered similar products (I think IBM still is), but sales have been lackluster due to low demand. Most consumers aren't willing to spen more on a "stylish" PC, particularly those all-important corporate IT departments.

I wonder...

[A non moose cow]

... If Dell is doing this without the expectation of making lots of money. I think they see PDAs becoming more mainstream every year, and they are getting their feet wet now just so they don't have to play catch-up in a couple of years.

any thoughts?

Re:I wonder...

[Ponty]

If you buy a Dellpaq with your box, Dell makes $30 bucks (or whatever the profit margin is). That's why they're doing it. They know people buying computers might want to buy PDAs. If they can buy them both at the same time, they might be more likely to buy them from Dell.

Re:I wonder...

[drinkypoo]

Sure, just like Microsoft "helping" out with the Dreamcast.

PDAs are getting to the point where just about everyone has one because they're so damn cheap, you can get an effective PDA for $99 now and almost anyone can afford that. I mean, it's half the price (or less) of a console game system, right?

Re:I wonder...

[Saint Fnordius]

I think it's Mike Dell's deep-burning desire to imitate Steve Jobs' every move. The Dell PDA was first supposed to be an MP3 player/geek toy, but it was cheaper to just relabel a PDA instead. I'll bet that His Jobsness even leaked rumors of a Newton revival just to make Dell jump the gun.

And think about it: isn't that the REAL reason Dell's version of Ellen Feiss is called Steve? (Yes, I know the Dell Dude predates Ellen, but's a joke. Relax.)

speaking as an owner of dell desktops ...

[dlasley]

... and a purchaser of serveral large PO's for business in my area, i have always found Dell to be top quality, pretty Linux (at least SuSE) friendly, and offering great support options. i see no reason why their PDA offering would be any different, and i'm honestly curious to see just how Dell's track record with servers, desktops, and appliances translates to a rather specific market full of *very* picky users.

that said, i'm a skeptic, and with Palm and Clie and Zaurus out there, Dell is going to have to be damn near perfect in their first offering, otherwise it's just a foray into a fashion trend like the Web PC.

Re:speaking as an owner of dell desktops ...

[lovebyte]

pretty Linux (at least SuSE) friendly
You mean like asking Dell support for some information regarding my Dell laptop which does not run Linux properly and being told: Sorry we do not support Linux?

Re:speaking as an owner of dell desktops ...

[kakos]

Dell and quality is never two words I would ever put together. My Dell laptop crashed and burned hard. There were five major failures in my computer (about one a month). I eventually had the thing returned. I've pretty much sworn off Dells. However, I will admit that their customer service is top notch. It's very interesting though. I've met a lot of people who swear by Dells and will never buy anything other than a Dell. I've also met several people who have had Dell lemons. Dell seems capable of producing high quality products, but they don't seem to be too consistent about it.

Re:speaking as an owner of dell desktops ...

[Anonymous Coward]

I work for Dell tech support and I will say that things do happen. I am not saying that we make a perfect machine, but I do believe they are worth the money. Hardware crashes, it's a fact of life. Dell's crash no more than Compaq. Compaq crash just as much as IBM's. All I can say is that you try returning a hard drive to IBM that failed and have a new one back to you in 2 days. I just mailed off my old IBM hard drive and it has been almost a month. I had to pay for shipping too..... Dell gives you a box and overnights it. That is why Dell is as popular as they are.

Well...

[Lobo]

There will be more than one configuration (two or three), but most important of all is the price.

Pictures included in the link.

Re:Well...

[Lobo]

Even better pics and specs can be found HERE.

Re:Well...

[z_gringo]

Thanks for the pics.

It looks oddly similar to the Compaq PDA, no? I wonder who builds the Compaq ones, and if Dell will simply outsource to the same place?

Corporate

[gadgetboy1]

Somehow I think Dell is gearing toward the corporate market rather than the personal one, making all those "I'm not getting one" comments moot. As a personal gadget addict, I agree with them - I wouldn't get one. But I build my own computers too.

Dell may be going for the bulk computer/PDA sales. Imagine companies and government agencies buying PDAs like they buy (and probably at the same time they buy) computers from Dell. Maybe they believe IT departments disburse these like they disburse computers. Imagine if Dell included better support for their PDAs in their desktop support contracts that they would for standard Palms/PocketPCs.

build to order??

[romit_icarus]

Now don't tell me they're going to use their fancy build-to-order supply chain system on this!

Re:build to order??

[Anonymous Coward]

Why not? They build to order laptop computers right now in different configurations. When you place an order on their website to be delivered to the US, the notebook is built in Malaysia and sent to the US for distribution. All that, and their delivery time is not unreasonable at all. There is no reason they need to keep inventory of PDAs.

Dell stretching themselves?

[romit_icarus]

Frankly this looks a pretty desperate attempt and extending their sales. I hope the chaps at Dell realise that PDAa is a different fish: PC is a computer - PDA is a consumer electronics. Big Difference, dude!

ipaq on top?

[romit_icarus]

This may be a coincidence - but am I the only one being served a Compaq iPaq web banner on this page??

Re:ipaq on top?

[Anonymous Coward]

It is called targetted advertisement. A story about PDAs is served, so the people reading this story are interested in PDAs. Thus you serve ads that are best suited to people interested in PDAs.

Not a conincidinc.

Jeremy

where are the efficiencies for Dell in a PDA

[elliotj]

You can build a PDA like a PC or a pizza. Dell has enjoyed tremendous success by having super-efficient supply chain management. They're able to build PCs using off-the-shelf parts cheaper than anyone else. It's all because they keep inventories low and have tried to make every step as efficient as possible.

For this to work in a PDA, they only thing they can realistically do is co-brand someone else's device. If that happens they won't be much more than a sales force for the other person's technology.

If they decide to actually design and build one themselves, I think it would be a major shift in corporate strategy.

Re:where are the efficiencies for Dell in a PDA

[bsharitt]

It won't be long until Microtel has a PDA built out of the cheapest parts avalible running a no name Linux for $79.99

This is where they'll bring back ...

[mtec]

brain damaged 'Steven'

I can see it now, "Dude, you're getting a P Dell A"

Dell to only OEM device

[Anonymous Coward]

It says here that
Dell is seeking an ODM [google cahce] like Compal or HTC to make a device for their entry to the handheld market.

The good: The Dell handhelds will be similar to iPaq and the T-Mobile PocketPC Smartphone.

The bad: Nothing really new or different but a sticker on the devicel

The ugly: Steve..."Dude, is that a Dell in your pocket, or are you just happy to get one?"

Re:Dell to only OEM device

[RedX]

Looks like they went with Wistron to manufacture the devices. Another article I had read back in June mentioned that 3 of the 4 ODM's that Dell was courting for their PDA line pulled out of the running because they didn't think there'd be much of a profit in manufacturing a device with Ipaq specifications but selling for $299. It doesn't sound like Dell is aiming for the mid-level Audiovox Maestro-type devices, they're aiming squarely at market leader HP and their high-end Ipaq devices. That $299 price is also mentioned in the article I linked to above and has been the price that has been tossed around with just about all recent Dell PDA rumors.

If you're a fan of the PocketPC devices, Dell's entry is nothing but a good thing as they'll drive down prices across the board. If you're a Palm fan however, this is yet another blow since at this price-point, a mid-tier Palm OS device will have trouble competing with a flashy, full-featured Pocket PC device in the mainstream markets.

Re:Dell to only OEM device

[adfrost]

>The ugly: Steve..."Dude, is that a Dell in your pocket, or are you just happy to get one?"

I think "or are you just hoping to get some?" would be more appropriate for that dude.

--

What microsoft wants

[Martigan80]

A top selling PC maker that makes their own PS's, printers and PDA's. Hmmm, we all know DELL felt the fear of M$ by_trying_to be bold and offer Linux (well just to sell it). Sure they sell servers running Linux, and MS is o.k. with that for now. But you have a top selling PC maker with a top selling OS, just think of the monopoly here folks.

--This isn't FUD, just a wake up call.

Corporate Consumption

[jlrowe]

I work for a large corporation which has standardized on Dell PC's for some time, and of course, Micorosoft software.

I can imagine that they would be rather interested in the Dell product simply because it is Dell.

And the big thing there is that it would displace everything else (Palm, Linux based PDA) with Win CE, virtually assuring MS dominance in the PDA field as other large companies also standardize on Dell.

They're already in the switch business

[Gothmolly]

Now they make 10/100/1000 "PowerConnect" switches. So why not enter the PDA market?

Dell Rep just told me

[jfinke]

I had a conference about storage with our Dell rep last week. He noticed that I had just bought a Toshiba e740. He told me to save my reciept because they are going to be price cutting everyone. The price he quoted me was $250... Now, he may just be blowing smoke up my ass, because he is a salesman after all. FYI...

Link to Available Specs

[gimgol]

Slides from the Dell PPC Presentation are available here

Shape looks familar.

MS Strongarming This, Too?

[E-Rock-23]

Everyone knows that MS is stronarming companies like Dell and Gateway about their products. In this case, are they going to try and force Dell to use CE or whatever other PDA software they may have? Or can Dell opt for embedded Linux, PalmOS, or others?

PDAs suffer from OEM Syndrome, since it's rather difficult to go out and nab up parts to build your own, unlike PCs. We PC users can go get what hardware we want, what OS we want, and go to town. PDAs aren't that easy. They're pretty much factory only, unless you're an UberGeek with connections beyond that of mortal geeks.

Dell does Hollywood

[werdnab]

Dell makes some really nice computers. Good hardware and excellent service. But what Dell does better than most others is marketing. You all know the "Dude" commercial.
PDAs need marketing. The only ones I've seen in use are by my teammates and other nerdy types. They need to be more mainstream, like telephones. Marketing will help increase the installed base, lower production/consumer costs, and increase application.
Dell may piggyback the PDA marketing with thier highly sucessful computer ads. I'd love to see a PDA for under $100. Marketing can do this.

Re:Dell does Hollywood

[PsyQ]

Excellent service? I don't think so, and let me tell you why:

- Ordered 3 notebooks from Dell Switzerland's online store
- Received two, got confirmation for third but PC never arrives
- Called my "customer representative" after two weeks, got a "I'm sick, please call XYZ at extension N"
- Called XYZ, she tells me (in not-really-German) that she doesn't know, and Mr. Representative is out of office for the week. Okay.
- Called the next week, no one picks up the phone. Getting rerouted to the main number after a couple dozen rings. Giving up for now.

Then the third notebook suddenly arrived! Well, great, so I get to configure it for its future owner. Part of that is setting up wireless networking (we ordered a Dell card with the notebook).

- Win XP finds wireless network card, initializes, finds valid access point -- but doesn't get an IP address?
- Linux does the same, but gets an IP address?
- Calling Dell tech support after updating the network card's Win XP drivers, checking the DHCP server for DHCPDISCOVERs from the card's MAC and the other obvious stuff.
- Get put on hold for 15 minutes after explaining problem.
- Guy comes back, asks whether I have Win XP Home Edition or Pro. I say Home. He says "Well, networking is not included with Win XP Home Edition, you need Pro for that". I tell him that's not true.
- Guy asks what access points we use. I say Cisco Aironet 1200. He says "Oooh, in that case I can't help you, we only support our own access points, you need to call Cisco". I say "but it works on Linux". He says "I'm sorry to tell you that if you install Linux on a Dell notebook, you void your warranty."

So he flat out lied at least twice? Yeah, great support, that. And we're not just a mom & dad store, we're registered as 1500 - 3000 employee shop with Dell so I guess this is "premium" support.

The next batch of notebooks we'll get will be from Toshiba :)

Palm or Win?

[BTWR]

Sorry if this is redundant,
But will these Dell PDAs be Palm OS-based or Windows CE-based?

Dude,

[The Spelling Nazi]

You're getting a Dell.

BUT DOES IT RUN LINUX?

[Anonymous Coward]

if not dude is not getting one

TechSupport

[MadocGwyn]

I've actually noticed a trend in tech support (Ive worked at 4 dif companys in the last 3 years in various positions, before decideing to stay where I am now). There was no dress code at the first 3, other then, don't be naked, nothing thats going to offend anyone and no holes etc, you know, common decency. The 4th place, where I am now, is an american company with an office in canada, and about once a month one part of that dress code gets removed, first to go was hats in the call centre, apperntly american companys really have a hard on about that. MY thoughts on recent trends in IT dress code is Customer faceing is becomeing more and more formal non customer faceing, they could care less. Techsupport: Some of you may not consider it IT. Those of you who did it and got out feel sorry for me. Those of you in the trenches now cheer. But its IT as far as im concered

News.com is a bit late with this story...

[fdiaz5583]

E-Week PRINTED magazine had this story about a week or two ago that Dell would be going into the PDA market. How is a PRINTED magazine ahead of the game by that much???

-5 Uninformed Karma Whore

[Anonymous Coward]

What a karma whore. 5 paragraphs (the underpinnings of any good karma whore) and absolutely no information at all. Firstly, Dell has offered PDAs many times in the past: They try to bundle Palms in with computer purchases, adding it as an available option. Clearly they're not talking about getting in the PDA reselling business because they already are in it. Secondly, if you've paid any attention to other recent Dell developments, namely that they're going to start building their own printers, you'd know that Dell has hit the growth ceiling of being a VAR, and they want more of the pie now: If they can just cut out the manufacturers, that's more profit for them --- right? By getting into printers, and PDAs, and probably eventually making Dell CPUs, Dell is trying to increase their profit margins.

Of course ventures like this usually fail miserably. Organizations like this want to make the shareholders happy by proposing unlimited growth via enterprise expansion, but 99% of the time the execution is flawed and go out in a blaze of infamy.

Wish list

[WillWare]

Here's what I want in a PDA.

• Forget about HWR. Graffiti is the best I've seen, and it's still a PITA. Give me a chicklet keyboard like the Zaurus. Or give me speech recognition, if it can be made to work well.
• Long battery life. A bright colorful display is worth much less to me than being able to go for weeks on one set of batteries. If I _do_ need to charge it N times per week, don't make me take the batteries out to recharge them.
• My biggest problem with PDAs is that I pay big bucks for a small breakable object, and invariably I drop it on a hard surface. Give it a chain, like a pocket watch. Put a snaphook on the end of the chain - some people will prefer to allow their PDAs to hit the floor.

Re:Wish list

[Sloppy]

My biggest problem with PDAs is that I pay big bucks for a small breakable object, and invariably I drop it on a hard surface.

Translation (what Dell just heard you say): "The greatest thing about PDAs, is that people drop them and have to buy another."

Dells niche

[The Mutant]

Heres what I see happening.

I don't think Dell is gonna offer 100 flavours of handheld, simply because of manufacturing constraints; it would cost too much for any vendor to offer a widely diverse range of PDAs like most do for desktop machines.

So I see Dell making PDAs standard, across their PC / Notebook computer product line. You purchase any PC from Dell, and it comes with a PDA.

The PC is preconfigured to talk to the PDA as it comes out of the box. No sw to install on either device (my iPaq came with a big sticker on the screen cover that told me to install ActiveSynch before I did what comes naturally - hook it up to my PC and play!).

And the PDA can talk to the PC out of the box. Just plug 'em in and go!

In one, maybe two quarters Dell is the number one vendor of handhelds, simply because they bundle PDAs with the PCs.

Corporate customers will love it since they are by far and large the biggest purchasers of PocketPC handheld devices. This strategy will play in a major way in most vertical markets that already distribute handhelds to employees (Insurance companies, etc), and consumers will love it as well since with one purchase they get two devices.

Specs

[Anonymous Coward]

This was mentioned earlier, but here's the proposed specs for the handheld: http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules.php?name=Foru ms&file=viewtopic&t=220 Win CE, 2 models: 300 or 400Mhz, $199 and $299 respectively

Why Dell wants to do this + more info on this PDA!

[mguentz]

I've been watching the story closely for some time now, and there are a wide variety of opinions on why Dell is doing this and how successful will it be. I've been a PDA user for about 3 years now (4 if you include the low-end Zaurus I had). I now use a Compaq Ipaq I bought for about $500. First off, it will be Pocket PC (nee Windows CE) format, although Dell may offer alternatives (like Linux). For the users in Dell's core consumer market, Pocket PC OS will work with the applications already on their PCs (i.e. M$ Word, M$ Excel, etc...). When I used a Handspring (Palm OS), I didn't like the fact that I had to have some middleware to "translate" my Word documents into Palm's Word format. It's one of the reasons I switched. This is not to say the Pocket PC is the *best* OS for these devices (Linux is probably much better), but it's the one that the core market is going to want. Another reason Dell wants to get in this market is because the PC business is maturing (and not growing nearly as fast), and the focus is turning towards the competition. There are too many computer makers out there and someone has to go! Dell wants to make sure it's not them. By selling these PDAs at $299, it undercuts one of the last remaining areas Compaq/HP is profitable (the new Ipaqs are $649 MSRP - now that's a margin!). There are rumors that Dell's going to be using a Taiwan tech plant to make these (although I can't find the article where I read that). There aren't many specs on the Dell PDA at this point, but if it contains built-in WI-FI, they'll get my business. Here are some articles that explain more: Comdex story about it: http://news.com.com/2100-1040-961283.html?tag=fd_t op_10 Leaked Specs story: http://news.com.com/2100-1040-961229.html?tag=fd_t op_1 Dell's business strategy: http://www.eweek.com/article2/1,3959,640829,00.asp Undercutting HP/Compaq http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,3959,640855,00.asp -mguentz

Interesting insight into Michael Dell

[CathedralRulz]

Not very long ago he was down on PDA's using very decisize language. From Fortune Magazine's January 21, 2002:

While switches and storage make sense to the CEO, other hardware markets don't fit the plan. PDAs, for instance, are a nonstarter. (Interestingly, Dell and Steve Jobs see eye to eye on this one.) According to one Dell employee, Michael goes around dissing PDAs with a simple query: "Question: What is the biggest button on a PDA? Answer: The button that syncs it to your PC." Simply put, they aren't big enough or profitable enough for Dell. To wit: Palm just reported second-quarter revenues of $ 290 million, down from $ 522 million the previous year. As for the bottom line: It lost $ 36 million.

To me, this says that when Mike D is too eager to make strong, forceful statements that may not stick.

Palm OS or Windows CE?

[KeelSpawn]

There are basically 3 things to consider:

1. Palm OS or Winodws CE. Definitely a hard one. With tons of devices operating on Palm OS (not to even mention all the palmware and free source code), it's hard to avoid it. But with the speed-demanding high-end device like the iPAQs, DELL will need the new strongARM (or the X-scale?)processors to fit in the Windows CE's RAM/ROM eating calculations.

2. Expansion: SD/MMC? CompactFlash? Or another one they're going to make up? Here's an interesting article on VisorCentral, they were debating which one is better: http://www.visorcentral.com/content/Stories/1279-1 .htm

3. Is DELL aiming at the general public? Is it something that most people can afford? (I won't expect it to be something like the Palm Zire) Lot's of handhelds has left the mainstream neighborhood to the high-end heaven. Making devices up to $600-7000 (one of the HP Jornadas).

I hope there isn't gonna be any "E-value" code the devices this time...(like they won't make it until we order it...lol)

Last Post!

[alpg]

Worthless.
-- Sir George Bidell Airy, KCB, MA, LLD, DCL, FRS, FRAS
(Astronomer Royal of Great Britain), estimating for the
Chancellor of the Exchequer the potential value of the
"analytical engine" invented by Charles Babbage, September
15, 1842.

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