Peace Corps to Wire Senegal

An anonymous submitter wrote: "Peace Corps Online is reporting on the White House's Digital Freedom Initiative that will place volunteers from the Peace Corps, Hewlett-Packard and Cisco in a pilot program in Senegal where they will leverage nearly 200 cybercafes and 10,000 telecenters to provide opportunities for small businesses and entrepreneurs. The idea isn't new - David Rothman proposed an Electronic Peace Corps in 1984, the Geek Corps has been doing this kind of work in Ghana for years, and the Peace Corps already has about 1,500 volunteers working in information technology."

Comments

why?

[mschoolbus]

Why don't they just spend money on developing a wider range wireless technology that has a lower price and place those all along highways places where more people will be. I just don't understand why a cyber cafe would be more of an interest than wide scale internet.

Re:why?

[droid_rage]

Maybe it's because most entrepreneurs and small business owners in Senegal can't afford a computer, and would be better off renting small amounts of time as needed. According to the world bank Senegal's GNP per capita for 1996 was only $570. I doubt it's gotten much higher.

Re:why?

[jem]

Because it's realistic? if you electricity and telecoms already then it's going to be much easier to set everything else up. Plus an Internet Cafe is a good place for people to meet, get training, etc.

Re:why?

[vidarh]

I agree with you about internet cafe's as a good place to meet and provide access. It's important to focus in this, as the point is to provide access to people who are unlikely to afford a computer (or for that matter their own radio, telephone or TV).

However long range wireless solutions might be very suitable for many of these countries for bringing internet access to the cafes, because the poverty levels means that even phone lines get stolen quite often for the copper many places (some countries have even had cases of people cutting down power cables to sell the scrap metal).

Securing a number of wireless routers might be easier than securing miles and miles of cable. Additionally, putting up phone cables is expensive, and many African countries have extremely under developed landline networks, and it's not a given that setting up wireless connections won't be cheaper.

Re:why?

[collapser]

training for what, exactly? how are IT skills and improved communications going to help free impoverished countries from the grip of corrupt administrations and natural resource leeches such as Shell or deBeers?

what do these businesses sell, in any case? last i heard, putting your small business on teh internet was only useful if you are producing something someone in [affluent country here] wants - and sadly, outside of big business concerns such as oil or diamonds, that doesn't amount to much.

Re:why?

[Viol8]

Yeah , I can just see all those starving people begging for food at the side of the road
whipping out their Pocket PC once they hear that a wifi node has been set up on top of the local
rubbish heap.

Re:why?

[pe1rxq]

It is all very simple actually....

You can find practicly anything on the internet, no need for expensive books, all you need is a little curiousity.

As for fighting big business and governments all you need is to set up a 'poor-villages-against-whatever' mailinglist and you can organize.

That is the power of the internet: spreading information at practicly no cost.

Jeroen

Re:why?

[isorox]

Actually It's doubled,
GDP - per capita:
Definition Field Listing
purchasing power parity - $1,580 (2001)

but still has over half it's people below the poverty line, and nearly 50% unemployment.

Re:why?

[vocaro]

However long range wireless solutions might be very suitable for many of these countries for bringing internet access to the cafes

Are there any Internet cafes in the developed world that use long-range wireless technologies? We can't even make 3G cell phone networks a reality here in the US, so I don't see how we can expect that to happen in developing countries. And if you're referring to Wi-Fi, then that's also not feasible, since 802.11b only goes about 10 miles max, even with a line-of-sight high-gain directional antenna. You'd have to put repeaters all over the countryside.

When I served with the Peace Corps in Ghana, some of the "luxury" Internet cafes in the capital were using specially-licensed microwave links to a shared VSAT Internet link, but spreading that kind of access throughout the rest of the (mostly rural) land just isn't economically possible.

What I noticed in Ghana is that any town that had been wired for electricity, no matter how small, was also wired for phone service. Unfortunately, the government-owned phone company (Ghana Telecom) has a monopoly on the entire phone industry, and they aren't interested in competition because they don't want to lose their cash cow. The result is that dial-up Internet access from small towns is already availble but extremely expensive due to the per-minute long-distance charges.

The solution, I think, is not technical but rather economical. Instead of building some fancy wireless mesh network, developing countries should work to deregulate the phone industry and open it up to competition, thus lowering the cost of Internet access everywhere.

Re:why?

[perfessor multigeek]

Uh, let's see, weaving, carving, other handcrafts, or even services like human-enhanced OCR. If you can get a web site up then your customer base is the wired planet.

Also, a free press is a great tool to help develop a country. Get people used to exercising reason skills about the circumstances of their lives and they are a lot more likely to become entrepreneurial.

Don't get me wrong, I'ld rather see a balanced mix of solar ovens, microloans, and living machine-based water processing systems, But this is an excellent start.

Of course, since it's being sheparded by the Shrub White House we can assume that the whole project will be distorted by the sort of corporate malfeasance that made so much of the "Green Revolution" a multi-million death fiasco. But it is still worth it.

Rustin

Re:why?

[Anonymous Coward]

That figure is adjusted for purchasing power. Food in Senegal and the thirs world cost 1/20th what it does in the west as does housing because it is of lower quality and comparable housing is not available. When you adjust for purchasing power U.S per capita GDP jumps from 28k to 36k because we have many social services other countries lack Russian per capita GDP jumps the most from 2,500 to almost $9,000 because of communist social programms which still exist. You dont need money when things are free. Over 500 different variables go into the equation. That said the figure is only good for analyzing a nations potential total output, quality of life and industrial capacity not cash flow or real "purchasing power" of certain individual goods like computers. The Russian figure is most interesting because Russia spend only 15 billion dollars a year on it military but both in terms of quality and quantity its the equivalent of us spending 60 billion dollars mostly because the Russian army does not pay for fuel (most expensive military expense aside from R/D) it is thus subsidized. That does not mean that X amount of dollars exist when only y real do. It just means that money goes further in some places for some things, but not for all things! Computers cost the same in dollar term in most places because they are capital goods with a very short useable life span. Generally only nondurable non capital goods mostly consumables like food and fuel are effected by varying purchasing power.

Re:why?

[JPriest]

Why did you join the Peace Corps? I've heard some talk about it an might run to some free time at the end of the summer. I filled out most of the application form but now need to upload them copies of my HS and College transcripts. The requirements are the following.

You must submit an Essay.
Knowledge of French or Spanish is preferred.
U.S. citizenship
In most cases, a bachelor's degree
Interest in learning another language
Ability to commit to two years of service
A desire to help others and bridge cultural divides.

I could see 3 or 4 months, but 2 years of my life to be a volunteer? To me that seems like a long time to volunteer for something when you are that qualified.

Re:why?

[sbwoodside]

phone lines get stolen quite often for the copper many places ... or get washed away by monsoons in Bangladesh, or get cut during conflicts. Wireline infrastructure is not the answer. Cellphone penetration in developing nations is far exceeding wireline telephones in growth, for the same reasons wireless internet is also the best solution. The towers can be built on top of the cyber cafes, telecenters, schools, that use the bandwidth, thus ensuring they are well maintained by people with a vested interest in keeping them at peak operation.

simon

Re:why?

[vocaro]

Why did you join the Peace Corps?

The best answer is in an article I wrote, available here: More than one way to make a difference

You can also find more info about my Peace Corps experience here: Two Years, Two Months

The requirements you listed are spot-on. Note that if you don't have knowledge of Spanish or French, having a science or engineering degree can do just as much to help get you in to the Peace Corps. (Most applicants are liberal arts majors without any technical skills that the Peace Corps needs.)

I could see 3 or 4 months, but 2 years of my life to be a volunteer?

Two years is nothing -- a small fraction of your normal life span -- especially when you consider the impact those two years could have on your life. Think about it: What would you do with those two years in the U.S.? Work a nine-to-five job so you can buy that new computer and a big screen TV? I'd prefer to spend the time traveling the world, making friends, learning a new language, and discovering places I've only seen in National Geographic. But that's just me. If you can only commit three months, try the GeekCorps.

Re:why?

[vidarh]

Look at Nigeria as an example. The number of phone lines has stood still at about 400.000 for a country of 120 million people for a long time. The primary reason being that Nitel have large problems affording to build out the infrastructure further, in part because of extensive theft of phone cables as well as plain vandalism. MTN on the other hand aquired more than 400.000 cellphone subscribers in Nigeria in it's first 9 months of operation alone, growing by about 85.000 between March and April 2002 alone (I don't know how many subscribers they've added since then).

It's commonly estimated that Nigeria will have more than 18 million cellphone subscribers in 5 years time.

Why? Because building out a cellphone network is CHEAP compared to laying cable, particularly when you can expect the cables to be damaged or stolen on a regular basis.

Cellphone networks can easily be used for data transmissions - the GSM protocol allow channel bundling, so even high speed links are possible. So already today, wireless access to the internet would allow a far wider reach than landlines in Nigeria.

The reason internet cafes in the developed world use fixed line access is that the developed world is already wired. Enormous amounts of money have been sunk in laying copper wires everywhere, and the cost have already been written off, while technology keeps on increasing the amount of data we can shove down the wires. For countries with large distances and without an existing extensive landline infrastructure it is simply not cost effective.

So in this case it is landline based networks that are "fancy", and wireless networks using repeaters that is the cheap, cost effective alternative.

Re:why?

[sbwoodside]

And if you're referring to Wi-Fi, then that's also not feasible, since 802.11b only goes about 10 miles max, even with a line-of-sight high-gain directional antenna. You'd have to put repeaters all over the countryside.

Err.. no. Wi-Fi works perfectly well out to 25km and longer distances have been done. For references have a look here and look at the archives for the wireless-longhaul mailing list.

Also Senegal isn't that big a country ... with 25km hops you can go border to border (about 500km) with 20 hops. Each hop is a tower, a couple of antennas and a couple of APs ... costing maybe $1200 total.

The solution, I think, is not technical but rather economical. Instead of building some fancy wireless mesh network, developing countries should work to deregulate the phone industry and open it up to competition, thus lowering the cost of Internet access everywhere.

That would be "political" actually, I agree but you're missing a couple of other important policy needs. The country must normalize their spectrum with the international open spectrum bands to make sure WiFi is legal. The other policy need is to make sure that VoIP is fully legal and unrestricted, since it makes much more efficient use of existing resources, thus dropping call costs and allowing more people to make calls.

simon

Re:why?

[vocaro]

Wi-Fi works perfectly well out to 25km and longer distances have been done.

I went to the link you provided, clicked one of the articles at random (http://www.linuxjournal.com/print.php?sid=6299), and saw this quote:

If you have been making the move to wireless lately, most likely you are working with the microwave, high bandwidth frequencies of 802.11b. If so, you know that on a clear day you maybe can get a line-of-sight connection out 10 miles or so.

Italics are his, not mine, so he's certainly not in support of your argument. Can you be more specific on your sources?

Re:why?

[vocaro]

Also Senegal isn't that big a country ... with 25km hops you can go border to border (about 500km) with 20 hops. Each hop is a tower, a couple of antennas and a couple of APs ... costing maybe $1200 total.

I'm not following you. First, I don't think 20 hops in 500 km is possible, but let's say it is. You say each hop needs a tower, two antennae, and two APs. Antennae are about $100 each, and 802.11b APs are about $100, also. That's $400 per hop, times 20 hops is $8,000. I haven't included the 50-foot metal towers yet, which must surely cost several thousand dollars each, since you've also got to pay for the transportation of the metal beams and labor for the installation. Even if the towers were only $5,000 each, you'd still end up with a grand total of $108,000!

Even if you could do what you suggest for only $24,000, what have you actually accomplished? All you've done is connected two points together that are on opposite ends of the country. How are people supposed to get access to the link from within the country? They'd only be able to use your Internet connection if they were lucky enough to be right underneath one of the hops. (Remember, we're talking about directional, point-to-point nodes in this scenario.) And even if they were able to reach those hops, there are still those bandwidth limitations I mentioned.

Swell!

[LeoDV]

We've got no food, but now we've got BROADBAND! (First post?)

Re:Swell!

[collapser]

You're not far off the mark - Take a look at egypt's attempts to form a technocratic (as opposed to fundamentalist) society.

It's all very well and good to want to provide communications access to those that don't have it, but do they *need* it?
I would have thought that tackling the causes of Africa's poverty, rather than attempt to "boost it into the 21st century" (whatever that means) would be a more effective and longer-lasting solution.

but no. we'd rather show we care enough to give them the benefits of Fark, AYBABTU, and hotmail accounts (and who wants to bet some enterprizing fellow won't work out a way to capitalise on our own greed and idiocy - Nigerian 411, anyone?)

not belittling the hard work people put into this, but it seems to be yet another case of malformed priorities/treating symptoms not cause. but then, treating symptoms doesn't carry so much responsibility/difficulty, does it?

sadly, a pointless excercise.

Re:Swell!

[theophilosophilus]

> We've got no food, but now we've got BROADBAND!

Exactly, wouldn't this money be better spent? On the flip side it sounds like the move is generating private investment.

From the CIA world fact book (hey its what google gave me): [CIA World Fact Book]

"Senegal ... realized full Internet connectivity in 1996, creating a miniboom in information technology-based services. Private activity now accounts for 82% of GDP."

However, I worry about the mentality that the internet can solve all our problems. I think we all saw the fallacy of that misconception after the bubble. Further, the question should be asked, is this a society that is ready for this technology? Will this have adverse impacts on a culture that has not prepared itself for such drastic change (now I sound like my old Tech and Society prof)? Will the average Senegalese be receptive to such a cultural shift?

Re:Swell!

[kinnell]

I would have thought that tackling the causes of Africa's poverty, rather than attempt to "boost it into the 21st century" (whatever that means) would be a more effective and longer-lasting solution.

There's not much of an incentive, given that most of the causes of Africa's poverty are causes of the west's prosperity.

Re:Swell!

[collapser]

yeah. I wonder how much of the plastic and metal in these kindly donated components are from african soils in the first place.
<BR><BR>and they say ken saro-wiwa died in vain.

Re:Swell!

[Angry White Guy]

That's only half of the equation. Constant fighting between the political factions, stimulated by Colonial Europe's arbirtary division of the continent without regards for tribal boundaries (Forcing the Huutu and Tsutse tribes to live together), and corruption of their parliment have prevented African countries from prospering, as much as cash crop farming for the western world.

A large portion of Africa is farmland, but dedicated to export crops. There is little left over for staple farming. The money earned from these cash crops makes the landowners rich, which in turn makes the government rich. The profit is dumped into the military, buying jets and tanks, troops, training camps, etc to quell uprisings and 'protect' their country. Little is left over for urban development, health care, or infrastructure. Much of the foreign aid is absorbed by the government.

Tackling the root causes is difficult, as it is not only the western world which is profiting from Africa's poverty. It is their own leaders as well.

Re:Swell!

[LeoDV]

An other problem is infrastructure. The reason we have Internet is because we have phone lines, electricity, and on a larger scale all those infrastructures that come into play such as houses (as opposed to shantytowns), roads, etc.

Anyone who's played Sim City will know, Internet is one piece of a much larger puzzle. Or, to use a more potent metaphor, what would probably be more productive is to provide the *framework* for a modern society, and, with enough investment, they can fill the gaps and eventually become economically independent.

The problem is, we don't want that. Because that would make them rivals.

If you take a look at the financial exchange between the industrialized and emerging countries, you'll notice that there is more money coming from them towards us than from us towards them : we're not helping them, we're getting rich off of them.

Do I hear neo-colonialism?

Re:Swell!

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, the food thing is more important than the tech thing. However, I think it's worth baring in mind that these "missionaries" of today are attempting to westernise the developing world through technology rather than religion. This I think is worth noting.

My (anonymous) opinion. Do both. It's different aid from diffrent people.

Re:Swell!

[mousse-man]

And we can send 419er spams to Europeans!

Re:Swell!

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, well having colonial do-gooders undermine indiginous Internet Cafe's by supplying free ones is NOT what is needed by third world contries one little bit.

Radio Broadband is a good idea, though. it would mean anyone with relatives overseas who can send them a second hand computer can set up an Internet Cafe - now that IS good for the economy!

Andofor anyone wondering WHY african countries NEED internet

(1) Actually, most african countries are NOT short of food, but in many cases a high percentage of the population are outside the monitary economy - if you can pick food from the trees for nothing, then who needs dollars?

Internet means you can contact people outside the country - your relatives overseas, business contacts, etc. In most african countries the phone system doent work, or does, but is SO expensive (especially international calls), no one can afford it (which also applies to many european countries).

(3)An internet cafe (or business centre) is where illiterates have their letters typed/read for them, faxes sent, etc.

(4)As others have said, it is also a source of training, even if at the level of how to press the left mouse button.

(5)Its where students get to type their homework/research, etc.

Re:Swell!

[Scarblac]

It's all very well and good to want to provide communications access to those that don't have it, but do they *need* it? I would have thought that tackling the causes of Africa's poverty, rather than attempt to "boost it into the 21st century" (whatever that means) would be a more effective and longer-lasting solution.

There's no way they're going to get out of the poverty without education. They need to be able to compete with Western countries. For many people, books are too expensive, and also just unavailable. On the Internet however, there's a wealth of information about basically everything. For ambitious Africans who want to get away from poverty, the Internet is invaluable.

Re:Swell!

[theophilosophilus]

>The problem is, we don't want that. Because that would make them rivals.

"WE" is a gross overgeneralization. Apperantly I have a little more faith in humanity than you. I think most ordinary people don't want to see others suffer (WE just don't take as much action as we could/should).

About neo-colonialism, I strongly doubt there is any large number of people that are that sinister. This statement is simply paranoid conspiricy theory. However, you are VERY correct that corporations are happy to make a buck on developing nations and just as happy to exploit them. But the idea of "neo-colonialism" is far too structured. The same effect is being achieved by corporate greed, but I don't think it is in any way intentional. In other words the current economic situation of the third world is a byproduct of corporate greed.

Then again my opinion results from a sort of optomistic faith in humanity, "we suck but we don't want to".

Re:Swell!

[Anonymous Coward]

We've got no food, but now we've got BROADBAND! (First post?)

Yeah. But it won't do you much good. I'm sure the antispam vigilantes have already blacklisted Senegal's whole IP range.

Re:Swell!

[smallpaul]

It's all very well and good to want to provide communications access to those that don't have it, but do they *need* it? I would have thought that tackling the causes of Africa's poverty, rather than attempt to "boost it into the 21st century" (whatever that means) would be a more effective and longer-lasting solution.

Perhaps poor information infrastructure is one of the root causes of Africa's poverty. The canonical example is the rural farmer who doesn't know the price of grain at the market in the city and thus is robbed blind by the middlemen. The Internet can also be used to cheaply keep in contact with Senegalese abroad. The more they stay in contact, the more money they send back as remittances. etc. etc.

This is good but...

[Anonymous Coward]

The internet has a vast store of information, and I think creating this kind of infrastructure is a good thing, but we have to keep in mind that technology can't solve all problems. There is an excellent article at the linux journal site that illustrates some important points:

http://www.linuxjournal.com/article.php?sid=4657

Re:This is good but...

[Angry White Guy]

Third world countries are stuck in a vicious cycle. Internet access should be the last thing on their minds. Basic infrastructure such as roads, sewage, hydro are needed first and formost. This will atract industry, which in turn will build more infrastructure, create training facilities, and attract more skilled labour. And the only way to do this is with gobs and gobs of cash.

Re:This is good but...

[pe1rxq]

The western world wasn't such a fun place to live in until education became available to everyboddy.
You said yourself that you need skilled labour.
Skilled labour means good education.
For education to work you need to get people to look beyond their horizon into the world. What better medium than the internet to do this?

Jeroen

Re:This is good but...

[kinnell]

For education to work you need to get people to look beyond their horizon into the world. What better medium than the internet to do this?

Books?

Re:This is good but...

[pe1rxq]

Books are nice, but very subject specific. You also need some trees for them...
When you compare how many books you can fill with a google search I think that internet connection isn't so expensive afterall.

Jeroen

Re:This is good but...

[cfarivar]

I'm currently in Senegal (an American studying at Universite Gaston Berger), and am doing research on this exact topic.

The Internet is a fantastic tool, and yes, while there are many things that Senegal does need before it can advance in the world -- the Internet, while not the be-all-end-all solution, can do a lot of good.

Check out the draft of my paper here:

http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~cfarivar/senegal/draf t.html

Re:This is good but...

[Angry White Guy]

So what you're going to get is a bunch of technocratic elite, rather than the monetary elite. Skilled labour != educated people. Skilled Labour == Trained Labour. What is the sense of training somebody to do something, but not giving them the tools to use their training? Infrastructure first! The Internet can be percieved as part of the nation's infrastructure, but only part of the infrastructure. Information is not a magic bullet, you do not shoot it at problems and they mystically go away. The internet is a novelty used to look at porn and spam without the tools to use the information. Even something as basic as farming would be able to prosper using information off of the Inernet. New ideas on crop rotation, new crop families, techniques, all of this would help Africa. But if people are plowing fields with a donkey and a one furrow plow, it's not because they think that it's the best way to do it, or it's the only way they know how. It's because they cannot afford the new technology to use more modern techniques, or these techniques have been made unavailable to them.
Maybe crop rotation would help their farming, but when you only have one crop to grow (as is the case in most instances), what are you going to rotate it with, even if you DO know extensively about crop rotation.

Re:This is good but...

[aengblom]

Third world countries are stuck in a vicious cycle. Internet access should be the last thing on their minds. Basic infrastructure such as roads, sewage, hydro are needed first and formost.

What do you think the Internet is. It's basic infastructure. Computers and the Internet move information -- FAST and EFFICIENTLY.

Not only is that important for health, education and general quality of life, but employment can arise through it too.

The Internet is no longer a simple luxury. In fact, my specific job would be impossible without the Internet, but it has nothing to do with the Internet. It's just how we deliver our product.

Re:This is good but...

[kinnell]

People in Africa aren't ignorant, they're unskilled. Subject specific books are what they need. OK, you can get subject specific stuff on the internet, but for that you need electricity, a communications infrastructure, technical support. Also, it has huge running costs, relatively speaking. A book can be bought once and shared among a whole village, and with no running costs. And it'll last for several generations.

And Now the News...

[johndiii]

The "Senegalese Minister" scam overtakes the "Nigerian Minister" scam as the leading scam spam theme.

Re:And Now the News...

[Eideteker]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought that upon seeing the headline.

Re:And Now the News...

[nogginthenog]

So when do you think the "Senegalese Minister" scam will overtake the "USA sex/mortgage/insurance/whatever" scams? 90% of my junk mail originates from the US. Most of which is only applicable to US people but somehow they're not clever enough to decide that a .co.uk address doesn't lie in the USA.

Re:And Now the News...

[johndiii]

Well, to the extent that all spam is a scam of some sort, "Senegalese Minister" will likely never achive the prominence of viagra or penis enlargement.

I get about five or six of the "Nigerian Minister" a month, and it's the only one that I get that is really identifiable as a confidence trick. That was the sense in which I intended "scam".

Since spam is a numbers game (so many responses per million e-mails sent), I'd guess that they don't care whether your address is in the US or the UK. If you tried to buy one of their products from out of the country, they would probably seize the opportunity to charge you extra for shipping. And then they would just keep the money, and say that the package must have been lost in the international mail.

Always has to be hardware

[jj_johny]

It seems that everyone who does development work does not feel that they have made a difference unless they leave behind something to point at: A dam, a tall building, an internet... Please although internet access maybe easy to get your hands around, accessible technology that the educated can support and widely available, it really is way behind other issues that need to be fixed. Most countries need better laws, courts, banks not IT infrastructure.

Well at least Cisco and HP are branching into new market and away from the saturated ones.

Re:Always has to be hardware

[hoppy]

Development is not a serial process. You can not wait all population to be healthy before giving it education ect...

IT infrastructure permits to nurses to know better about new drugs, to exchange knowledge. it permits communication in a land where phone is very expensive.

Funny thing is Senegal is one of the most connected country in sub-saharian africa, 45Mb where Niger have only 2Mb. And it is the richest in west-africa (may be Nigeria is on par).

IMHO it is just another way to promote american engineering and products to a potentially good marketplace. Why not Mali, or Niger which are in a much more problematic state ?

Re:Always has to be hardware

[Thomas M Hughes]

IT Infrastructure is useful in developing other kinds of infrastructure, assuming it can be effectively used.

Most countries need better laws, courts, banks

Better laws can theoretically be attained in semi-democratic and democratic countries through providing information about current laws, and things that are going up for voting in the legislative body, as well as providing a conduit for citizens to contact their government members in order to influence policy.

Better courts can be attained, especially in countries that utilize a common law standard, by having the court system linked up, so all judicial reviews can be viewed quickly, easily and instantaneously. Thus, the court system can act more consistently as a whole across the entire nation-state, as opposed to the personal habits of each judge. Also, abuses in the system can be reported easier across great distances, if the other branches of the government are plugged in as well.

Banks are another institution that really need to be connected, and have a sharing of information between them. Computers are very useful in documenting a credit history on individuals, making it much easier to call up, so any bank can view it much faster for when determining whether or not to give an individual a loan. Transfers between institutions are better handled electronically as well.

The Internet also provides a cheap way for local nation-wide businesses to post job listings, theoretically allowing for out of work people to be put in touch easier with companies that need workers, improving the overall economy. Though, it is important to note that the US has had some serious flaws with this, but not to the point where its completely useless. I have found work off an Internet job posting before.

Along with increased mobility, you also have a better chance of affordable communication with relatives within the country. Thus, despite the physical distance potentially developing between citizens and their families, all touch won't be lost.

And of course, there is always the benefit of being able to access a wealth of information sources on the Internet that encourage people to view other places in the world and see how they function, so that they might demand change at home.

The point is, just because IT infrastructure seems like a luxury, improved and increased communication between all levels of society is an inherently good thing for democratic institutions, as well as developing market economies. It might not be as useful as building a power plant, or teaching them better farming techniques, however the companies helping here aren't farming or power companies. They're IT companies, so they're helping the way they know how to help.

Re:Always has to be hardware

[Oxygen99]

Well, maybe it's true that there are more pressing issues to be sorted than internet access, but any mechanism for the diffusion of information has to be good.

Ok, maybe it's not directly giving aid but given information on how to do something yourself, or how to contact someone else who has knowledge of a particular area has got to be a useful tool. Just because many of us have become blase about the potential of the internet, doesn't mean it is in actuality any less useful than it ever was.

It's pretty fashionable to bash the whole IT as aid effort as you've done, but I'd argue that a decent IT infrastructure is just as valid an undertaking for a developing nation as almost anything else you could do.

It comes with no strings attached, can't be appropriated, creates trade links and benefits everyone, both in the receipient country and in the donating country. There isn't a great deal else you can say all that about...

Re:Always has to be hardware

[dkf]

Most countries need better laws, courts, banks not IT infrastructure.

But I thought the USA already has the best laws and courts that money can buy...

Re:Always has to be hardware

[Surreal_Streaker]

It seems that everyone who does development work does not feel that they have made a difference unless they leave behind something to point at: A dam, a tall building, an internet... Please although internet access maybe easy to get your hands around, accessible technology that the educated can support and widely available, it really is way behind other issues that need to be fixed. Most countries need better laws, courts, banks not IT infrastructure.

Gee. Dosen't it strike you as a bit ironic that the forum in which you have chosen to advocating these changes ... is on the internet!

There is nothing more precious than information.

yay

[JeanBaptiste]

Now I will get twice as many BUSINESS PROPOSALS from DR ZUNAGA MBASAWA in SOME RANDOM COUNTRY trying to get me to help him wire $75000000USD from his recently deceased father's offshore account.

Re: yay

[Black Parrot]

> Now I will get twice as many BUSINESS PROPOSALS...

Think supply and demand! You can drive a harder bargin when there's competition.

huh?

[grub]

How would they do this? I thought Sececal was a laxative.. oh.. Senegal..

Open Source is crucial...

[tau_bada]

I certainly hope Peace Corps intends to use open source for these projects. One of the most import tenants of Peace Corps projects is sustainability from a host country's perspective - a perfect dovetail for open source code.

Re:Open Source is crucial...

[vocaro]

A friend of mine, Joel, was a Peace Corps volunteer in Ghana for four years, and he did exactly what you suggest. He set up an entire network of Linux-based computers to be used as a computer lab at the local high school in Wenchi, Ghana. See the home page.

oh nice..

[DZign]

first the 419 nigerian scam, soon similar scams from Senegal ??

Peace Corps not part of Homeland Security

[Mothra the III]

From the Peace Corps website: "Currently, 6,678 Peace Corps volunteers are serving in 70 countries, working to bring clean water to communities, teach children, help start new small businesses, and stop the spread of AIDS. Since 1961, more than 168,000 Americans have joined the Peace Corps, serving in 136 nations." These people most likely dont have the skills to combat cyber terrorism and are using the skills they do have to set up small networks and get people on the internet.

Re:Peace Corps not part of Homeland Security

[vocaro]

These people most likely dont have the skills to combat cyber terrorism

Yep, that's the point. The Peace Corps has very strict rules about separating volunteers from any sort of law enforcement activities, and that's a good thing: If foreign governments have any reason to suspect that the Peace Corps could be involved in spying or any kind of intelligence operations, they wouldn't be able to trust our intentions. Plus, the volunteers would be even more at risk to kidnapping and similar dangers than they already are. For this reason, all volunteers are put through a CIA background check as part of the application process, not to determine whether they're a security risk, but to find out if they've ever had any association with the CIA. If so, they're permanently ineligible for Peace Corps service, no matter what other qualifications they might have. (There's a similar rule for related intelligence agencies, but they might forgive you if it was more than 10 years ago.) Check out the eligibility form.

Sutil slogan changes...

[gmuslera]

Hippie: "Make love, not war"
Yuppie: "Make lan, not war"

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[Xerithane]

Sutil slogan changes...

In an effort to promote standardization in the English language, I must correct this.

Subtle.

Thank you.

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[andyf]

The Spanish word for subtle is sutil. Spanish and English seem to have a lot of words where a word in one language just looks like a misspelled word in the other.

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[Xerithane]

The Spanish word for subtle is sutil. Spanish and English seem to have a lot of words where a word in one language just looks like a misspelled word in the other.

Now, if he was speaking in Spanish it would be different and I wouldn't correct. Seeing as it was an English post, the spelling is 'subtle' not 'sutil'.

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[Anonymous Coward]

I was just offering an explanation for the misspelling, as your post seemed to imply (viz. "standardization") that "sutil" might be a part of the mutant Slashdot-English that includes words like "facilatate".

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[Anonymous Coward]

sign held by protestor:

"Make Love, Fuck Bush"

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[gmuslera]

To be honest, I had to search google to find how exactly the "hippie" phrase is spelled because I usually think in spanish. Names, phrases, a lot changes between languages and writing jokes in other languages is sometimes hard.

And even if in technical books I don't read "subtle" a lot to make it sound all the alarms, I just don't had to hurry writing the title and don't checking if it was ok. But I agree that is bad enough that all must talk one language here to add another language to understand to be capable to read slashdot properly.

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[Xerithane]

To be honest, I had to search google to find how exactly the "hippie" phrase is spelled because I usually think in spanish. Names, phrases, a lot changes between languages and writing jokes in other languages is sometimes hard.

I'll agree. This is why I explicitely put in "Standardizing English" in the quote. I was just secretly hoping you spoke Spanish natively, and weren't just an idiot American.

But I agree that is bad enough that all must talk one language here to add another language to understand to be capable to read slashdot properly.

I'm still pissed off that you can't put in Japanese characters in here. They are standard unicode, and if it's my journal, why can't I write in Japanese?

Re:Sutil slogan changes...

[evilpenguin]

facilatate: (adj.) Easy to milk.

Some of the worst /. errors would make great new words. Although, I suppose it realy should be "facilactate."

How long before...

[Pig Hogger]

...we see 419-style senegalese scams???

(What is the number of the senegalese penal code that prohibits such scams???)

Helping out online

[rf0]

In a similar vain people might be interested in NetAid which apart of the UN in helping out online less developed countries

Rus

Re:Helping out online

[Anonymous Coward]

I believe "vain" is exactly the word to describe this sort of non-African who proposes to "help" Africans.

What will it do?

[Txiasaeia]

My wife was in Senegal in a few years, and after seeing this article, she commented, "Well, that might help the people in cities, but what about most of the people who live in rural areas?"

Besides, the people in this country can't afford Coke as a general rule -- even when they can, they return the glass (yes, glass!) bottle right away to get the deposit back and put the Coke in a plastic bag to drink. There are already enough cybercafes in Dakar; perhaps this cash should be going towards helping the little Muslim boys that run around the streets, forced into virtual slavery (via begging) in order to make a few bucks for their master.

Re:What will it do?

[shanewarneiskweer]

I think that this is general criticism of Africa in general. The fact is that great swathes of the continent are progressing nicely and have decent-ish standards of living. The places where standards are bad tend to be warzones. I.T. improves lives, FACT. If this helps the Senegalese, then all power to them. I consider a few LANS small payback to the fact that the West rips off Africa blind in loan repayments.

Re:What will it do?

[ch-chuck]

perhaps this cash should be going towards helping the little Muslim boys that run around the streets,

Anything's better than the upbringing they currently get: hating jews and americans (altho it's worse in other more fundamentalist Islam countries). What kills me is how many people via pop media actually fall for the line that the problem actually is their objects of hate, instead of their enslaving masters, mullahs, ayatollahs and other desperate hate mongering cleric authorities and war lords.

Re:What will it do?

[Anonymous Coward]

Anything's better than the upbringing they currently get: hating jews and americans (altho it's worse in other more fundamentalist Islam countries). What kills me is how many people via pop media actually fall for the line that the problem actually is their objects of hate, instead of their enslaving masters, mullahs, ayatollahs and other desperate hate mongering cleric authorities and war lords.

Well that's funny, because you seem to be quite quite happy digesting the pop-media line that your enslaving masters are feeding you that all muslims are enslaved morons who hate americans and jews because their masters tell them. Its obviously never occured to you that most hatred of the US stems from the fact that the US has been buggerring the third world economically for over a century. But you probably don't believe this, because you've swallowed the line that america only invades other countries to bring peace and democracy unto the world, not to create comfortable environments for their companies to fleece the local economies rotten.

If you ever step out of your trailer park, you might one day realise that the vast majority of muslims are pleasant, tolerant people who take their faith seriously, but don't try and force it on others. As far as the extremists go, there's hardly a shortage of fundamentalist christians in the US - like the ones who are anxious to start a war in Iraq, and kill all those nasty evil muslims.

Re:What will it do?

[Anonymous Coward]

I hate Muslims

Re:What will it do?

[sbwoodside]

Right, that's why what's needed is voice over internet protocol (VoIP) access in the rural areas. It's all about the rural internet... something that can now finally be built using wireless technology (e.g. Wi-Fi) ... and bringing services that rural people can really use - like cheap voice communication as a replacement for expensive or non-existant telephone service.

Re:What will it do?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a sad fact that the general picture of Africa we see in the media is the absolute worst cases. There's so much more. Senegal in particular has had one of the most stable governments since its independence from the French. Not to mention decades of legalized prostitution which has held the rate of HIV infection to a very low level within Africa. And a solid middle class. Although predominantly Muslim, it is a pluralistic nation, with belief in freedom of opinion and press. (See yesterday's interview with Senegal's Foreign Minister Cheikh Tidiane Gadio to learn a bit about their view on the Iraq situation: http://allafrica.com/stories/200303050218.html) This makes it a good choice for the Peace Corps program. As for technology itself, people generally, when they can afford it, skip the wire phase altogether, and go directly to cell phones for example. This is because electricity service remains sporadic, so wireless seems like the more useful option. Also, it's a very community-based culture and so unless someone is full-time programmer, cybercafes would generally be preferred for their social qualities and economic efficiency, even if a family can afford the computer. Also Dakar is very dusty and hot and most homes have open window systems with no air conditioning, so a cybercafe is much better equipped to maintain the machines. Senegalese do a lot of business in New York and Paris for example and internet access helps this process. Internet access is helping the Senegalese economy to be independent of World Bank et. al., which will in turn helps alleviate the remaining material needs of the country, and reinforces the factors which allow for political stabilty. They benefit, we benefit.

Re:What will it do?

[Txiasaeia]

...bringing services that rural people can really use...

Rural internet, eh? 90% of the population aged 10-30 are illiterate in Senegal -- the whole country, not just the rural areas. I think that they've got other priorities than communicating with the village down the road, such as wondering if that person upstream from you is taking a piss or just washing their clothes...

Re:What will it do?

[cfarivar]

Firstly, not all Muslims "hate jews and Americans"

I'm an American currently studying in Senegal, and I can tell you that this is most certainly not the case here.

Re:What will it do?

[Anonymous Coward]

from CIA factbook page on Senegal
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factb ook/geos/ sg.html

Literacy: definition: age 15 and over can read and write / total population: 39.1% / male: 51.1% / female: 28.9% (2001 est.)

also take into account that historically this is an oral tradition culture. most people from an oral culture have detailed memory capacity that would blow the average "literate" out of the water. makes sending email a bit more of a challenge, granted.

Re:What will it do?

[error0x100]

"Well, that might help the people in cities, but what about most of the people who live in rural areas?"

Exactly. This will promote a small amount of growth in the developed areas that already have the wealthiest people. What these people primarily need, for long-term growth, is a better education, on a large scale. Better teachers, lots of books, etc. While you do need economic infrastructure development programs like this that build "from the top down", the only way to create real, meaningful widespread change is to also have programs that promote long-term growth from the bottom up, i.e. amongst the poorly educated majority of people.

80% of the population of Africa is under 25, young people who are more open to new and positive ideas and are faster learners; this implies that there is a lot of potental for positive change at the moment. Not to belittle the US efforts here, but programs like this are nicer for political image because they tend to show results relatively fast, i.e. after a few years. But for SERIOUS positive change, you need programs that are only going to show results 20 years down the line (e.g. better education country-wide for all children!), and nobody is willing to wait that long.

I hope they setup webcams

[Goody]

So we can see people receiving grain rations and immunizations at the "cybercafes".

Re:oh nice.. almost ...

[adzoox]

Sort of agreed .... a lot of scams that originate from the US are because we have wired the disadvantaged or barely traceable .... ie prisons, low income housing areas.

I can't believe that they actually want to waste time and wire the area, why not WiFi towers that double as cell phone towers so we won't have to ALSO go install those with volunteer labor?

I am completely for getting information and social/spiritual ideas to the masses though.

Business Opportunity

[ch-chuck]

they will leverage nearly 200 cybercafes and 10,000 telecenters to provide opportunities for small businesses and entrepreneurs.

Great. Now AOL will be intercepting 2 billion spams / month, from a new country tld.

Buzzspeak - English translation

[Viol8]

Word #234:
leverage (vb): means "use"
Alternative trendy buzzwords and phrases:
enabled
facilitate deployment
fixed resource empowerment
consolidate operational dynamics
foster tangible goals

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[Anonymous Coward]

leverage (vb): means "use" in an indirect manner, as with a "lever"

A good book about how to say things that you mean is "Choosing the Right Word". If you think leverage is a buzzword, you obviously don't "use" many words with definitive denotations and _connotations_.

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[Anonymous Coward]

Hey bud, try this one on for size: fuck you.

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[Viol8]

Its a buzzword that people overuse to try and sound intellectual. End of story. You're obviously one of them
though quite clearly you're failing on the ultimate goal there.

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[perfessor multigeek]

Bzzzzt! Wrong Answer!
"Leverage" is about using a small investment to achieve a large result. Those of us who actually study a subject before being snitty about it call this the Multiplier Effect.
In this context, the goal is to use a relatively small investment in telecommunications and electronics to provide a tool, a "lever", that will then cause larger, desired change.

Go away, little boy and leave criticism to those of us who actually *do* know the proper meanings of words.

Rustin

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[Anonymous Coward]

Suck my dick, faggot. Let my jizz on your face.

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[Anonymous Coward]

Nope. One fairly new usage of the word is the one you pointed out. The older more established meaning is based on -- surprise surprise -- noun lever, and means "to use lever". For exact physical explanation of how this fabulous ancient device works, refer to your old physics book. That should also explain where "multiplier effect" comes from.

So, mr. Big Boy, do not try to claim "fashionable" usage of "leverage" is anything but buzzwordy, PHB speak. I have heard too many management-oriented cow-orker to use "leverage" instead of using proper 'plain' english alternative, such as simple "use" (or "use to our advantage" if it's needed as page filler), to let your weasely explanation go by.

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[Doomdark]

That's unfortunately completely false argument. Leverage does NOT mean simple "use", nor "indirect use". Simply put, if word "use" is good fit, "leverage" is not.

This because leverage means (in more general sense than in its strict definition of using a lever to move an object) using smaller force (or amount etc) to achieve similar effect as using bigger force (etc). This is what a lever does -- it "converts distance to force" (same amount of work is done by either applying smaller amount of force over longer distance as bigger force over shorter distance).

And that's why many people (myself included) do think that majority of usage cases for "leverage" are in fact buzzspeak. People who think leverage is "just fancier way of saying 'use'" clearly do not understand meaning of the word.

Re:Buzzspeak - English translation

[perfessor multigeek]

First of all, as far as I could see, the usage cited was a legitimate example of suggesting a multiplier. Secondly, while undoubtedly some people misuse the term (don't get me started on "utilize") that doesn't cancel the usage I explained.
You want to dispute it? Cool. Give me an alternative to "leverage" that conveys the same sense that I explained.
Oh, btw, "weasely" conveys timid. As in "trying to weasel out". Which would also require that the original usage had been mine. What the ever-loving fuck have you ever seen in this post or any other post of mine here or anywhere else that could possibly be described as "timid"?

Rustin

Woo-hoo! Where to next?

[Uninvited Guest]

When does the Peace Corps come to my neighborhood, here in the US? This would be so...*ring* Hold on... call coming in...

What's that? Peace Corps? Yes. Overseas only? I see. Nothing inside the US? Aha.*click*

Never mind.

Re:Really?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't be so mad just because the girls said that you are ugly, fat and stink. Sex is not everything.

Straight outta "where are they now?"

[Anonymous Coward]

I always wondered what happened to him. He hasn't posted any stories in ages...

Wow, so he's getting wired by the Peace Corps?

I always knew his anti-microsoft rhetoric would get him into trouble :o)

Oops - that's Senegal, not Sengan.

My mistake.

Now I can receive Money Scams from Ghana Too

[Anonymous Coward]

Now we start receiving those nigerian scams from Ghana as well!

Great

[Anonymous Coward]

Now the Slashdot UIDs will swell past the 1 million mark and the trolls will be in French. . .

from CIA Factbook

[rjamestaylor]

check it

COMMUNICATIONS

• Telephones - main lines in use: 234,916 (2001)
• Telephones - mobile cellular: 373,965 (2001)
• Telephone system: general assessment: good system domestic: above-average urban system; microwave radio relay, coaxial cable and fiber-optic cable in trunk system international: 4 submarine cables; satellite earth station - 1 Intelsat (Atlantic Ocean)
• Radio broadcast stations: AM 10, FM 14, shortwave 0 (1998)
• Radios: 1.24 million (1997)
• Television broadcast stations: 1 (1997)
• Televisions: 361,000 (1997)
• Internet country code: .sn
• Internet Service Providers (ISPs): 15 (2002)
• Internet users: 40,000 (2001)

Lesser-developed countries flock to cell phones to get around there out-dated, out-moded, out-period telephone communications, I guess.

Sounds like the Peace Corps needs to Wi-Fi Senegal rather than wire it.

Please stop the "they only need food"

[Anonymous Coward]

It's all very well and good to want to provide communications access to those that don't have it, but do they *need* it?

Yes. It's exactly like if you argued they don't need a postal service at all in third world countries. Now matter how starved they are, postal service is useful. Likewise for communications. For the record, many of those countries have numerous emmigrants, and considering the price of international phone communications, you'll understand why email and cybercafes are such a success there. The emmigrant-whose-plane-ticket-was-paid-by-the-villa ge-and-who-sends-back-money is not uncommon. There are other uses too.

In addition, in almost all third world countries, have a very rich upper class, with the lastest technological toys, and which doesn't know what to do with its money (investing is boring - culturally speaking this isn't US/UK self-made-man dreams etc..., using money to get power isn't always necessary, as there is more social corruption). At the very least, those demand a good Internet access.

I'd love to go

[IWantMoreSpamPlease]

I mean where else could Uncle Sam foot your bill and still allow you unfettered access to fully automatic AK-47s, AKMs and RPGs?

Considering those are the three weapons I'd love to have...sign me up!

Educate women instead of developing cybercafes

[Anonymous Coward]

There have been several articles in the French press describing young African men flocking to cybercafes to watch online porn together and drink their night away. I let you imagine how they behave afterwards.

It would be better to bring Internet to schools. If there is hope in developing countries one should promote the education of women. The men will catch up accordingly.

Re:Educate women instead of developing cybercafes

[perdu]

Yep, I did 2 years in Zaire and I can see that. But the teachers I worked with were all men and they were very aware of what went on in the world - mainly via shortwave radio.

I think this is very worthwhile but would only work in cities where you have electricity - for part of the day at least...

Re:Educate women instead of developing cybercafes

[vocaro]

African women love computers, too.

Woah, 1500 IT workers?

[jonbrewer]

I think not. Sure 1559 volunteers may be "promoting" IT in their roles, but there certainly are not 1559 Peace Corps volunteers working in IT. The vast majority of these people are English teachers who have a secondary project of trying to improve their school's computer lab, often using "creative grant-writing" techniques to appropriate funds marked for women's health or community development.

Until "IT" is a Peace Corps job category like Education, Agriculture, Health, and Environment, Peace Corps will not be taking IT seriously.

I speak from experience.

-JB (Volunteer - Poland 15, 1999-2000)

Re:Woah, 1500 IT workers?

[vocaro]

Actually, the Peace Corps is taking IT very seriously. They now consider it a "focus area", which means that they devote about the same amount of resources to IT development as they do to AIDS education and prevention. (In other words, a lot.) They made it a focus area in late 2000, probably right after you left, and I attended one of the in-service trainings that Peace Corps funded as part of this change. It is true, though, that IT is not yet a full-fledged Peace Corps assignment, but I predict that it will become one sometime within the next ten years.

Hell, *I* just wired Senegal

[Anonymous Coward]

Here's what I said:

Senegal stop this is nineteen seventy seven stop I want my haircut back endendend

WTF!?

[Anonymous Coward]

WTF? Why are we wiring Senegal when I can't even get DSL to my neighborhood? %&*%$#!!!

sorry.. had to say it..

[Anonymous Coward]

Hello, My name is Doctor Oubli Oooubla. I have 25 millin dollars I need to move out of Senegal...

Senegal the next Nigeria?

[mlippert]

419 can boost their economy too!

Fallacy of Other People's Volunteering

[lucasw]

The Fallacy of Other People's Misappropriated Volunteer Efforts comes up on slashdot quite frequently, though predominately concerns itself with open-source software development: There's all sorts of complaining about branching and competitive overlapping software projects when all programmers should be working on project y, where y is the software the whiner (who probably doesn't contribute to anything) would most like to have an improved version of. Programmers aren't a fluid resource that can be thrown at anything for proportional result (remember Mythical Man Month), and a lot of mature software projects are intimidating or unappealling to the unexperienced or differently interested.

Here, there's the misappropriated tech support for the third world:

Most countries need better laws, courts, banks not IT infrastructure.

I would also prefer it if the U.S. had better courts and laws- they're currently better than most countries, but could also stand a lot of improvement. I'm not volunteering as a lobbyist, political activist, or even writing my representatives about those issues. Instead, I do some network administration and general tech support for a couple local non-profits. Are my efforts better spent elsewhere?

The short answer is no:

-I want to build on the knowledge I already have.
-I want to feel satisfied at the end of the day for having solved some small network problem, gotten a donated computer up and running, etc.
-I want an external and personal source of motivation: other volunteers and employees who immediately appreciate and recognize my efforts (and they couldn't have done it themselves) because it helps them do their job.
-I might want to get a paying job doing something similar with the references and skills I've built volunteering.

Large scale societal and infrastructural issues take lots of time, money, and effort beyond the abilities of volunteers to fix alone. It's good to be aware of efforts in those larger-scale issues and support them, but it's easier to get volunteers to do something they already know and want to do. (Contrast with "Hey guys, let's dig a latrine in Cambodia!" recruitment method)

If someone were to go to Senegal or other country with IT work in mind, they may come into intimate contact with the more fundamental problems and shift their efforts accordingly, where as reading a speculative slashdot post about the 'real' problems may put them off from volunteering altogether.

hmmm....

[oPless]

Anyone read this as:

Peace Corps Wire Segal ?

web access provides real-time access to prices

[rjnagle]

Well, certainly we need to keep in mind Maslow's hierarchy of needs here. But also, being wired provides real-time access to weather information and prices as well as communication for coordination.

I remember reading somewhere that the main use that rural Indians found from internet access was access to real-time pricing information in the big cities (so they know what price to put goods at). It also helps businesses to find more competitive rates for parts and supplies that they need to buy. These are significant business advantages.

From a consumer level, it makes sense. It gives the local consumer more power to shop for price and can often save unnecessary meetings or travelling. One uneducated woman I knew wanted internet access (in the USA) so she can have access to job applications and help wanted ads. Just from the standpoint of medicine, the internet contains oodles of information about treatment options, the pro's and con's of therapy and just disease information.

These are pretty obvious advantages, and in a third world, they count for a lot. I'm not saying that technology and net infrastructure is the most important thing (and certainly aid projects are subject to misuse, hoarding of resources and abuse), but they provide a lot of opportunity which westerns can't even begin to calculate.

rj

Re:web access provides real-time access to prices

[Angry White Guy]

I am not stating that there are no benefits to this, but I am hesitant to just jam these countries into the international market. Your points are valid, and very interesting.

That being said, I think that we should not measure an economy by whether it is net-enabled or not. Yes we should bring connectivity to these countries, but that should be in addition to, not instead of making a concerted effort to bringing the basics of a stable economy. I am merely proposing that we should not treat this as an experiment to see what the internet can do to a community plagued by economic problems. We should ensure that we give the tools to use the knowledge as well as the knowledge itself. In short, let's not forget about this country like we've forgot about countries in the past.

"Useless"?

[perfessor multigeek]

Okay, again, better communications are useful to ANYBODY. Even beyond what is in my post above, let's run down some obvious ones.

Farmers who are online can't be scammed anywhere near as much as to going prices of their crops. No more sleazy dealers buying from the farmers for three cents on the dollar.

DIY basic health care. Many people in places like this still don't even understand things like boiling water before using it to clean a wound. Access to simple online data like how to recognize Kaposi's Sarcoma will save many lives.

Information on farming and husbandry. My grandparents had a small farm in Kansas during the dustbowl years and I had it hammered into me many times that much of what kept my father and all of his siblings alive through it while others lost their land or worse was that my grandfather actually talked to the extension agent. Things like contour plowing or optimized crop rotation can mean the difference between life and death. As can, btw, the ability to recognize a plant blight *before* it hits the whole crop.

Far better opportunities for women, gay people, and other disempowered groups. People can't keep you down as well when you know that others are fighting elsewhere and how they're doing it.

Education, from schooling to information for parents on childcare.

Information on repair of things like pumps and stoves, and access to places to buy parts or replacements.

Access to music and entertainment. Here we just treat stuff like Kazaa as a cool way to route around Tower Records, but for somebody in rural Senegal access to music, movies, books, and so on, including the ability to upload their own is seriously important.

I could keep going but I hope that I've made my point. Of course, phone service provides *some* of this, but from the looks of it, many of these places don't have phones yet either.

Rustin

Why English teachers? surely French?

[fantomas]

Why loads of English teachers? French is the mother tongue for most people in Senegal (official language? can't remember). Is the intention to teach the kids a second language?

Re:Why English teachers? surely French?

[overunderunderdone]

French is the mother tongue for most people in Senegal

Umm... Mother tongue? Unless I'm really bad at geography I'd guess something less European - Imposed colonial tongue perhaps but not mother tongue. As for why English? Well first off the Peace Corp is American not French and secondly English has definitely surpassed French as the language of international discourse especially for business but increasingly for diplomacy as well (Which really has the French steamed) perhaps in Senegal the use of French as a common tongue among different tribes and their economic ties to their old imperial masters would be a good reason to prefer it to English but even then I think you are commiting your nation to a linguistic backwater.

Re:Why English teachers? surely French?

[Anonymous Coward]

A young male (20-30 y.o.)from the Ivory Coast I spoke to a few years back spoke French, English, and his native African language all perfectly well. He said this tri-lingualism was normal for French speaking areas of Africa. English is the world language.

Re:Why English teachers? surely French?

[vocaro]

I speak from experience, too, and I have no idea what the original poster was talking about. The vast majority of Peace Corps volunteers are most definitely not English teachers. The Corps does send English teachers to countries that request them (such as Poland), but the majority of volunteers train host-country nationals in things like health, water sanitation, small business development, and non-English education such as science or math.

--TH (Peace Corps volunteer, Ghana, 1999-2001)

Hey, you forgot a few links...

[Call Me Black Cloud]

You didn't put hyperlinks to the White House, Cisco, or HP! That's too bad...You were closing in on the record for hyperlinks in a single submission.

Charity Starts at Home

[Radical Rad]

There are lots of neighborhoods around me that can't get high speed internet access.

Re:Charity Starts at Home

[error0x100]

Do you think that not having broadband in ones home makes one a "charity case"? Or were you just joking and I missed it? Or are you really suggesting that charity (in general) should never be provided to other countries?

Re:Charity Starts at Home

[Radical Rad]

Excuse my flippant remark. I was mostly joking though not totally. I had read about similar volunteer efforts wiring third world countries with high speed access long before it came to my area. That did used to upset me since I was reading about them on my unreliable 22-34k modem connection, and my little joke was based on that frustration. But no, I think it is great to bring small, poor nations closer to the international community through volunteer efforts such as this. Faster communication and faster transportation always seems to make the world smaller and therefore more cohesive. The free flow of information always seems to empower people and encourage democracy. Greater contact and understanding will promote world peace.

Yeah, great

[Satan's Minion 666]

West African nations are renowned on all levels for political/economic corruption. I enjoy the fact that my tax dollars are helping me towards the day when my credit card number is stolen by some 14-year-old Senegalese. Senegal used to be a French colony, shouldn't this be, you know, FRANCE'S problem? Not that there's anything good to hack on Le Minitel these days, anyway.

Re:Yeah, great

[error0x100]

West African nations are renowned on all levels for political/economic corruption.

Not to be nitpicky, but this is different from the USA, how, exactly?

Re:Yeah, great

[Satan's Minion 666]

Well, easy. I said ALL levels. For example, cops here are dicks, but when's the last time you had to pay one off to stop him from mugging you? And you don't really see a bunch of Americans moving to Nigeria to bilk people out of their money. With Chevron being a possible exception.

Re:Yeah, great

[error0x100]

For example, cops here are dicks, but when's the last time you had to pay one off to stop him from mugging you?

Well its not like that sort of thing is even common in Senegal either. And its not as if US doesn't have corruption or racism problems (a la Rodney King) in their police force. And America is FULL of people trying to bilk people all over the world out of their money with scams - I know, I get their spam in my inbox almost every day. Corporate corruption is rife too; its not as if Enron was an exception. Enron was only exceptional for its size. The US has corruption on ALL LEVELS. This is how it works in every country in the world, no country is special or morally superior in any way. I will grant that certain types of corruption will have lower percentages in the US than in some other countries, but all of it is still everyday occurring stuff.

There is so much dirt on both sides here, it really isn't worth it to start a mud-fight, we could both be drudging up muck for a long time about the US and various other countries, which is a silly exercise, and certainly not constructive. I'm not attacking the US, I'm just saying that the US certainly can't be claimed to be a role model when it comes to these things.

Re:Yeah, great

[DanAnderson26]

France was going to fix it, but they wanted to give the UN more time. So, as usual, the US has to do it. :-)

Dan

No, what's needed is wireless broadband

[sbwoodside]

Senegal is a great place to mount an initiative like this because they have access to some serious bandwidth. The SAT-3/WASC/SAFE undersea fibre optic cable landed in Senegal last year, delivering multiple gigabits of internet bandwidth. This is in contast to the previous situation, where basically all of Africa had less bandwidth than the headquarters of my former employer.

But the idea of wiring Senegal is all wrong. What's needed is wireless. Wireless internet (e.g. 802.11b Wi-Fi) is a far more appropriate solution in a country like Senegal where traditional wireline infrastructure is going to be subject to harsh environmental conditions and being destroyed by political unrest. Wi-Fi long-distance links can span 30 km in a single hop, and the towers like cell towers can be powered with generators. Wi-Fi delivers true broadband, 802.11b is 10Mbps, and 802.11a and 802.11g can deliver more like 30Mbps.

Broadband is essential. With broadband you can deliver the killer app (yeah, I said killer app) of the rural internet which is Voice over IP. People in Senegal, well, the literacy rate isn't so high, and VoIP is what's really useful to people as it allows them to call members of their family who may be off making money in other parts of the world, to call into town to check crop prices, to call their relatives in the city. Of course this requires policy to make sure that VoIP is legal and that the national telco doesn't try to block it to protect their own profits.

If you're interested in wireless long-distance links, you might be interested in a mailing list on the subject, wireless-longhaul@openict.net. You can subscribe here, and the mailing list home page is here.

Re:No, what's needed is wireless broadband

[vocaro]

What's needed is wireless. Wireless internet (e.g. 802.11b Wi-Fi) is a far more appropriate solution in a country like Senegal

I'm not a Wi-Fi expert, but everything I know about Wi-Fi tells me that what you propose isn't possible. Here's why:

traditional wireline infrastructure is going to be subject to harsh environmental conditions and being destroyed by political unrest

Are you saying that Wi-Fi infrastructure would somehow be invincible to these issues? Let's say there's a coup, and the new leader wants to cut off Internet access. All he has to do is cut the SAT-3 link that you speak of. This would affect Internet links throughout the country, whether they were wireless or not.

As for environmental conditions, sub-Saharan West Africa may be harsh, but so is North America! We tend to think West Africa has a worse environment because of famine and diseases such as malaria, but that doesn't affect infrastructure, of course. And although it's true that West Africa can see some very high temperatures, they're not much worse than what you'll find in the southwestern states of the U.S. In fact, I'd say that the weather conditions here in America are actually harsher than West Africa's due to the wide ranges of temperature we experience. In my home state of Kansas, we go from 35 degrees Celsius in the summer down to -10 in the winter, and that can really play havoc on Wi-Fi electronics.

Naturally, with the wireless infrastructure you propose, you'd need links that are well protected from the rain and heat of Senegal, and that can add a lot to the cost of installation and maintenance. What would be interesting to see is a price comparison between 100 km of standard phone line and a Wi-Fi link of the same distance. My guess is that the phone line would be far cheaper and provide about the same bandwidth, since Wi-Fi bandwidth diminishes greatly over long distances.

Wi-Fi long-distance links can span 30 km in a single hop

From what I've read, 30 km is a best-case scenario for Wi-Fi under good weather conditions, and it only provides minimal bandwidth (on the order of one or two Mbps). More importantly, this can only be acheived with a high-gain directional antenna! Even if you could get this to work as an Internet link between towns, you still haven't solved the last-mile problem! How are you going to spread out that Wi-Fi access across the town? Even with good omni-directional antennae, you'd have to put repeaters in a grid every two kilometers or so, driving up the cost beyond the means of rural towns in a developing country like Senegal.

the towers like cell towers can be powered with generators

Do you have any idea how much that would cost? Over time, gas-powered generators would suck up money like a sponge, and solar panels with batteries are still too expensive to be put on every single Wi-Fi node. Plus, generators can easily break down and have to be serviced, adding even more to the cost.

Wi-Fi delivers true broadband, 802.11b is 10Mbps, and 802.11a and 802.11g can deliver more like 30Mbps.

This shows me that you really haven't thought this idea through. Let me get this straight: You're suggesting that we take the fiber optic backbone coming into Senegal and span it out across the country using Wi-Fi repeaters. Sorry, but Wi-Fi bandwidth is shared! If 30 users are on a "fast" 802.11g channel, then they'll each see less than 1 Mbps -- even worse than dial-up! So much for the broadband you speak of. And besides, most Wi-Fi routers can't handle more than 30 or so connections anyway. That means out of the 10 million people in Senegal, only 30 of them could be on the Internet at any given time. It sounds like not many people will be using this "killer app" of yours!

Next time, you ought to think about the limitations of Wi-Fi before you trumpet its advantages.

Re:No, what's needed is wireless broadband

[sbwoodside]

"traditional wireline infrastructure is going to be subject to harsh environmental conditions and being destroyed by political unrest"

Are you saying that Wi-Fi infrastructure would somehow be invincible to these issues? Let's say there's a coup, and the new leader wants to cut off Internet access. All he has to do is cut the SAT-3 link that you speak of. This would affect Internet links throughout the country, whether they were wireless or not.


Do you even know what SAT-3 is? It's an undersea cable, that is very difficult to cut. The SAT-3 connection in Senegal lands on the coast and then is connected in various network that are internal to the country.

As for environmental conditions, sub-Saharan West Africa may be harsh, but so is North America!

This is true; however the ability to recover from environmental damage is different ... in the US you will spend the necessary money to rebuild after a tornado or whatnot. In a developing nation that rebuilding may be delayed by years.

What would be interesting to see is a price comparison between 100 km of standard phone line and a Wi-Fi link of the same distance. My guess is that the phone line would be far cheaper and provide about the same bandwidth...

You're joking, right?

"Wi-Fi long-distance links can span 30 km in a single hop"

From what I've read, 30 km is a best-case scenario for Wi-Fi under good weather conditions,

Weather conditions make no difference to 802.11b Wi-Fi. There may be some effect on 802.11a because it operates at a higher frequency.

and it only provides minimal bandwidth (on the order of one or two Mbps). More importantly, this can only be acheived with a high-gain directional antenna!

It is possible to have higher bandwidth using directionals, and the antennas are cheap, in the range of $50-$100.

Even if you could get this to work as an Internet link between towns, you still haven't solved the last-mile problem!

I'm not concerned about the last-mile problem. In Senegal, people will walk a mile to use the telephone, if that's the only option. In the case where there's a more developed city, then it's a business opportunity for a wireless ISP (wISP) to purchase some of the bandwidth from the backhaul provider and the hub-and-spoke model is well documented and in use in many places now.

"the towers like cell towers can be powered with generators"

Do you have any idea how much that would cost? ...

No, but it's cheaper than building a power grid (since that, too, doesn't exist in much of the developing world). If a power grid is present, the generator is only for backup. In addition, Wi-Fi equipment has a minimal power use.

"Wi-Fi delivers true broadband, 802.11b is 10Mbps, and 802.11a and 802.11g can deliver more like 30Mbps."

This shows me that you really haven't thought this idea through. Let me get this straight: You're suggesting that we take the fiber optic backbone coming into Senegal and span it out across the country using Wi-Fi repeaters. Sorry, but Wi-Fi bandwidth is shared! If 30 users are on a "fast" 802.11g channel, then they'll each see less than 1 Mbps -- even worse than dial-up!

This shows me that you are missing a clue. Since when does dial-up give you 1Mbps? Perhaps you're thinking of DSL ... which isn't available in most developing areas and for that matter isn't available in much of the developed world as well, since it requires you to be within just a few km of an appropriately outfitted (expensive) telecom office.

1Mbps is most definitely broadband, and currently an essentially unavailable luxury in Senegal (since you'd have to pay tens of thousands a month to pull 1Mbps through VSAT, and even then the roundtrip latency sucks).

Thanks for your reply, because you've helped me show that my concept stands up to (admittedly lame) criticism. I'm not even going to bother addressing your last comment since you clearly have little grasp on the concepts of network design.

simon

Re:No, what's needed is wireless broadband

[vocaro]

Do you even know what SAT-3 is? It's an undersea cable, that is very difficult to cut.

I wasn't suggesting that you go underwater to cut the link. It has to come out onto land in Senegal somewhere, and that's where it can be cut.

What would be interesting to see is a price comparison between 100 km of standard phone line and a Wi-Fi link of the same distance. My guess is that the phone line would be far cheaper and provide about the same bandwidth...

You're joking, right?

No, I'd really like to see some figures on that. Wooden poles and copper wires are cheaper than steel towers and wireless routers. (Was that a rhyme?)

It is possible to have higher bandwidth using directionals, and the antennas are cheap, in the range of $50-$100.

Everything I've read about long-distance Wi-Fi says that even with a high-gain antenna, you still get only a fraction of the bandwidth at the distances you're talking about (30 km). Also, $100 is certainly not cheap. Remember, we're talking about a developing country here, and the $100 you're suggesting would be multiplied across every node.

Another point I was trying to make is that by using a directional antenna, you're making a site-to-site connection, rather than spreading the Wi-Fi access throughout an area. That defeats one of the big advantages of having a wireless connection in the first place.

No, but it's cheaper than building a power grid (since that, too, doesn't exist in much of the developing world). If a power grid is present, the generator is only for backup. In addition, Wi-Fi equipment has a minimal power use.

I'm really not following your logic here. You're suggesting that if a region doesn't have a power grid, then we can still go ahead and put in a Wi-Fi network anyway? You need a computer to use Wi-Fi, and you can't use a computer without electricity! In any case, providing electrical power is far more important than Wi-Fi, so it's not a simple dollar-for-dollar comparison. I mean, being able to turn on a light bulb is more important than hooking up to a Wi-Fi network, so a power grid should take priority over Wi-Fi even if it costs more.

This shows me that you are missing a clue. Since when does dial-up give you 1Mbps?

Oops. I was typing too fast and doing the calculations in my head, and I got to thinking in Kbps instead of Mbps. Sorry. Let me revise my figures then. Let's say 802.11g is giving you 30 Mbps, as you said. That means if there are 1000 users online at once (quite possible, since you're suggesting we share the Wi-Fi link with all 10 million people in Senegal), then each user would get less than 4 kilobytes per second. And besides, isn't Wi-Fi limited to 256 simultaneous connections, anyway? I think my points still stand, or did I have another brain-fart?

Thanks for your reply, because you've helped me show that my concept stands up to (admittedly lame) criticism. I'm not even going to bother addressing your last comment since you clearly have little grasp on the concepts of network design.

Perhaps I don't, so please explain what I said that was so "lame". Am I wrong in thinking that most Wi-Fi routers puke out when they get to around 30 or so simultaneous connections?

I realize you think I'm only trying to attack your ideas, but I'm not -- I had the same ideas myself when I was in the Peace Corps! But after reading up on Wi-Fi and thinking a lot about the possibilities, I realized that there are just too many problems with Wi-Fi, and I'm mentioning the caveats here. It would be great if it could work, but I don't believe it's possible for Wi-Fi to share an Internet connection throughout the rural areas of a developing country.

Re:No, what's needed is wireless broadband

[sbwoodside]

"You're joking, right?"

No, I'd really like to see some figures on that. Wooden poles and copper wires are cheaper than steel towers and wireless routers. (Was that a rhyme?)

I can't find a hard price. I found http://www.gildertech.com/public/telecosm_series/w irewave6.html to quote:

the stagnant price curves of wireline telephony in its cage of copper, dominated by the costs of rolling out trucks, digging trenches, laying wire and climbing poles.

Think about it ... 500 km with a pole every 25 m, that's 10000 poles, each one has to be put up, the cable strung, etc. etc.

I'm really not following your logic here. You're suggesting that if a region doesn't have a power grid, then we can still go ahead and put in a Wi-Fi network anyway? You need a computer to use Wi-Fi, and you can't use a computer without electricity! In any case, providing electrical power is far more important than Wi-Fi, so it's not a simple dollar-for-dollar comparison. I mean, being able to turn on a light bulb is more important than hooking up to a Wi-Fi network, so a power grid should take priority over Wi-Fi even if it costs more.

No, again you are wrong. Laptops run on solar power. So do PDAs. network equipment also requires little power typically. There are VoIP "phones" that are not full computers, that can connect directly into the IP network. Also, there are many locations that have power through generators, or wired power, but gaps between them that don't.

Oops. I was typing too fast and doing the calculations in my head, and I got to thinking in Kbps instead of Mbps. Sorry. Let me revise my figures then. Let's say 802.11g is giving you 30 Mbps, as you said. That means if there are 1000 users online at once (quite possible, since you're suggesting we share the Wi-Fi link with all 10 million people in Senegal), then each user would get less than 4 kilobytes per second. And besides, isn't Wi-Fi limited to 256 simultaneous connections, anyway? I think my points still stand, or did I have another brain-fart? ...

Perhaps I don't, so please explain what I said that was so "lame". Am I wrong in thinking that most Wi-Fi routers puke out when they get to around 30 or so simultaneous connections?

Yes, you're wrong about that. Although there are Wi-Fi APs that include routers, many don't. Those are just home/SOHO solutions. WiFi is really just a "wireless ethernet" at it's most basic, that is, a way to get data from one point to another. At each base station, the WiFi devices may be connected to any of the available routing and switching equipment that can be used with a normal TCP/IP network. So, each base station can tap into the data stream, and do whatever they like with it. Wi-Fi doesn't care how many "connections" there are, it's all TCP/IP packets.

Anything that's possible with regular wireline, can be done with WiFi. WiFi doesn't care about routing, switching etc. The intelligence is at the edge of the network, just like the internet.

I realize you think I'm only trying to attack your ideas, but I'm not -- I had the same ideas myself when I was in the Peace Corps! But after reading up on Wi-Fi and thinking a lot about the possibilities, I realized that there are just too many problems with Wi-Fi, and I'm mentioning the caveats here. It would be great if it could work, but I don't believe it's possible for Wi-Fi to share an Internet connection throughout the rural areas of a developing country.

OK.

simon

Re:No, what's needed is wireless broadband

[vocaro]

dominated by the costs of rolling out trucks, digging trenches, laying wire and climbing poles.

This is true in the industrial world but not in developing countries like Senegal, where you can hire laborers for dollars a day. The labor would actually be the cheapest part of the overall cost.

Think about it ... 500 km with a pole every 25 m, that's 10000 poles, each one has to be put up, the cable strung, etc. etc.

I was talking about 100 km, not 500 km, because the cost benefit of wired lines is greater at shorter distances. Also, I'm not sure where you got the value of 25 m. I'd say the poles could be much farther apart than that. Also, wooden poles are dirt-cheap in West Africa, because the forests are in-country (Ghana actually exports timber), so you wouldn't need to pay the costs of importing and international shipping (unlike the Wi-Fi electronics).

Of course, at a distance of 500 km, wires are normally put up using large metal towers at great distances apart. They'd cost more but would be more permanent. Regardless, I don't think either of us has enough data on this subject to do a proper comparison.

Laptops run on solar power.

No, they can be charged with solar power, but they cannot run on solar power. I know this because I actually tried it when I lived in Ghana. I brought a 60 cm by 30 cm portable solar panel with me to Ghana, thinking that I'd be able to power my laptop with it, but it was useless. Even in direct sunlight with no clouds in the sky, it took two days to charge the thing, and as you know, laptops can only run about 3 hours max on a full charge. That meant I could only use my laptop for 3 hours every two days! And of course, during the rainy season (a span of about four months), I couldn't use it at all because there was no sun. An even bigger issue is price. The small solar panel I brought with me cost $500. Are you suggesting we add $500 to the cost of each computer that these villagers buy? No, solar power just isn't feasible in the situation we're talking about. As for routers, even if they draw very little current, they'd still go dead at night if they were on solar power. I suppose you could add batteries (and thus several hundred dollars more to the cost), but I doubt they could store enough juice to last through a four-month rainy season.

Let's just say, for the sake of argument, that computers and APs don't need electricity, and the only issue is cost. Are you still suggesting that we hook up these rural villages to Wi-Fi before we give them electricity? Try going for a week without electricity sometime, and I think you'll find light bulbs will become much more important to you than Internet access. ;) (Seriously, I went without electrical power for long periods at a time while living in Ghana, and Internet access was not high on my list! A nice cool fan was much more valuable than a computer in those conditions.)

The bottom line is, you can do so much more with electricity than with Wi-Fi. Electricity gives you lights, fans, refrigerators, radios, TVs, and other appliances that have a much deeper impact on the quality of life than being able to surf the net. For instance, in the small rural town where I lived, the hospital used electricity to chill polio vaccines that would otherwise be ruined in the tropical heat. Meanwhile, in the center of town, women used an electric mill to grind cornmeal so they could prepare meals for their families. Are you honestly saying that Wi-Fi access and VoIP are more important than these things?

Although there are Wi-Fi APs that include routers, many don't.

Actually, I meant APs, not APs with routers. (I use the term "router" for both types.)

At each base station, the WiFi devices may be connected to any of the available routing and switching equipment that can be used with a normal TCP/IP network. So, each base station can tap into the data stream, and do whatever they like with it. Wi-Fi doesn't care how many "connections" there are, it's all TCP/IP packets.

You're saying that a Wi-Fi AP can support an arbitrary number of simultaneous connections, but this just isn't true. You cannot increase the number of connections to an AP without bound. Every time a computer connects to an AP and transmits packets, the AP has to allocate resources (RAM and CPU) to forward those packets. And because there is a finite amount of RAM and clock cycles in the AP, there is a finite number of simultaneous connections.

I did some more checking on this, and I have yet to find an off-the-shelf router that can handle more than 256 connections, and most can only handle 64. Try these links:
Envara
CheetahWireless
And this guy says his AP can't handle more than 7 (!) connections.

Re:No, what's needed is wireless broadband

[sbwoodside]

Are you honestly saying that Wi-Fi access and VoIP are more important than these things?

No I'm not, and your aggressive tone has made me unwilling to further pursue this, sorry.

simon

I get offers like this all the time

[msouth]

Usually I'm supposed to wire Nigeria, not Senegal. I can't believe the Peace Corps fell for it, though.

Development work and Internet

[griffjon]

As an IT Volunteer (not in senegal, tho), I can explain this a bit -- it's much easier to get loans and donations to buy computers and get net access than, say, a program to build pit latrines. Would the money be better spent on pit latrines? Probably, but the money doesn't come for that, and can't be repurposed. So you do what you can with what you're given, and maybe one of the kids you teach will earn enough money to build pit latrines for his elementary school later on in life.

that's a bit rosy-glasses, but the do-what-you-can-with-what-you-have part is very valid and useful.

Now, the impact on society is another thing, but, (sadly?) most countries ready for a digital revolution have been watching American cable TV for most of a generation, and the Internet may actually reduce that damage...

Feel free to ask me questions on this one, I'll try to check the spam ma^H^H^H^H^H^Hhotmail account.

http://www.lesoleil.sn

[Anonymous Coward]

we've got broadband....and an online daily to go with it.

Re:"Useless"? Yes it is !

[Tuna_Shooter]

First assuming they can read and write..ENGLSIH .and type and understand what a computer is and what the internet is !Hello ..!! lets take it further... great they don't know about sterilization and germs but they can use google to find all that!! Animal husbandry ... hmmm lets see the water buffalo needs new teeth ..lets go check out a site for the nearest buffalo orthidontist.. Contour plowing... hmmm the land is as flat as my wifes chest.. Lets see opportunites for gay people... dam i didnt know the guys down the road in the next hut are checking out Monster for new jobs.. Education... there is some potential there .. Information on repair music blah blah blha.... how many people in the world use English at all ????and last, let everybody there use the information provide by their new broadband connection to phone the world with all their newfound knowledge but wait no ..phones... dam lets wait for the cels to arrive next week...

Us only

[IAR80]

Peace corps only uses US "recruits", therefore I cannot bring my contribution through peacecorps! I wonder why!!

technology backend

[looie]

cisco is the company that designed and built the "special" routers for china, that enable the chinese gov't to track email to its source, so the gov't can arrest dissidents. they built these to spec for the chinese gov't. i wonder who in senegal is the beneficiary of this cisco "special" treatment.

mp

Ridiculous

[Anonymous Coward]

According to the CIA world factbook

population 10 million

54% of people in poverty, 50%-ish unemployment
1 in 18 infant mortality rate

Oh, but wire them up with web access! That will solve all their problems.

unintended consequences...

[Anonymous Coward]

Woohoo. More "My father, the late martyred president of Waloochia, left in my name a thousand million dollars, of which half is yours if you can help me" emails.

leapfrog

[sbwoodside]

Actually I think the idea is to leapfrog the "industrial age" and go straight to an information-based society. Developing nations can skip a whole bunch of unpleasant environmental nastiness and get the benefits of the Information Age now.

simon

Re:leapfrog

[Angry White Guy]

But the information age is a natural progression in the evolution as a society. Perhaps it's a better idea to hurry through the industrial age, rather than skip it altogether.

Re:leapfrog

[sbwoodside]

OK, practically speaking, you can't go straight to a FedEx society without the roads, the factories, the airports, etc. But do you really need FedEx? What do you really need for an information society?

- education
- wealth to allow time to educate
- communication tools
- electricity to power the tools

Sure, no one in Senegal is going to have the latest greatest hardware but you don't need that. You need solide reliable hardware with interchangeable parts. With that minimal infrastructure people in the developing country can join in the information economy by collaborating collectively in a global information space created by the internet. Sounds familiar? Sounds like open source ...

simon

Re:leapfrog

[Angry White Guy]

I wholehartedly agree. It seems that we are arguing over who can say the same point the best at this point.

Don't forget UNITeS

[jcravens42]

The United Nations Information Technology Service (UNITeS), an initiative managed by (UN Volunteers, has placed and supported more than 150 volunteers in developing countries doing just this kind of service, and more. Hope they can get together with the Peace Corps and leverage resources even more. And as someone mentioned. UNV manages the (NetAid Online Volunteering service, which allows online volunteers to provide service to organizations serving developing countries.