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Screenshot History of Windows

jobugeek writes "Neowin has an article that shows the progression of Microsoft Windows from pre-windows 1.0 through the 2003 server. For those of you who have used all of them, I'm sorry."

115 of 683 comments (clear)

  1. Progression by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There's been no real revolution since win95... just evolution. Will revolution happen anytime soon?

    1. Re:Progression by packeteer · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Win95 was hardly more of a revolution more than some of the new stuff today. I think the changes between XP and ME (which is replaces) are huge.

      --
      unzip; strip; touch; finger; mount; fsck; more; yes; unmount; sleep
    2. Re:Progression by kfg · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Hammers haven't changed much since the days of Thor, although they've evolved a bit.

      They still bust heads better than just about anything. Lack of revolution just might be a *good* thing.

      The great thing about computers though, especially one running Linux, is that it's fairly easy ( in the comparitive sense) for anybody who has a better idea to impliment it.

      Have you thought up the new, revolutionary interface that will sweep everything else away before it?

      Neither have I, so that's ok. Neither has anybody else.

      There a few competing graphical interfaces, and a few command line interfaces, that pretty much seem to cover the bases of people's preferences, and they all approach optimum to one degree or another and direct mind control is still science fiction.

      Get used to it. It's going to be like this for a while.

      KFG

    3. Re:Progression by Xrikcus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      on the other hand the changes between XP and 2k (which it evolved from) are tiny

    4. Re:Progression by mccalli · · Score: 5, Funny
      Hammers haven't changed much since the days of Thor, although they've evolved a bit.

      Nonsense. Hammers aren't a bit like they were in Thor's day. Thor's hammer was able to fly and respond to commands, whereas all today's junk can do is hit things.

      Pah. They don't make 'em like they used to...

      Cheers,
      Ian

    5. Re:Progression by yaba · · Score: 3, Funny

      There's been no real revolution since win95... just evolution.

      Yes, and as we all know Evolution is a Linux application ;-)

    6. Re:Progression by miffo.swe · · Score: 4, Funny

      Heh!

      You have obviuosly never ever used a pneumatic hammer with 100 nail magazine!

      I used one when i built my house and it saved me both thumbs and half the time.

      Maybe windows is the (sigh, spelling sucks) equivalent (did i get that right?) of an old hammer and the rest of us is waiting and working towards the pneumatic hammer?

      (then again i have rarely seen a hammer fail as often as windows. Come to think of it, Microsoft is to windows what a hammer is to glass!

      --
      HTTP/1.1 400
    7. Re:Progression by 42forty-two42 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Uh, it might not be a good idea to contradict someone holding that big of a hammer...

    8. Re:Progression by usotsuki · · Score: 2

      IMHO, Win95 was a rip-off of OS/2 2.1. So was New Trash. And dreXP, don't get me started. :( Give me GS/OS!!

      -uso.

      --
      Dreams, dreams, don't doubt dreams, dreaming children's dreaming dreams. Sailor Moon SS
    9. Re:Progression by AngryPuppy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hmmm... I should not reply to trolls, but...

      I use Red Hat 8.0 at home. The following is true. I am NOT embellishing this and I'm not a Linux expert nor am I Windows impaired.

      My hardware is better supported under Linux. That's right. It works BETTER under Linux than Windows98. In particular, my sound card. It is a Sound Blaster Live 5.1. Admittedly, the following is a hole in Creative Labs' support, rather than a true Windows issue, but without the original driver disk, I cannot install the driver that I downloaded from their site under Win98. Maybe I would have better luck with XP, but I don't want to buy it when Linux works so well for me.

      Red Hat recognized the card during installation and got it running for me without trouble. ALL of my hardware was detected and works like a champ under Linux including my HP Deskjet 722C which is a known Windows based printer. I bought that printer back when I only used Windows.

      As far as having a life... I am married and have a 2 year old son, plus I have all the standard work that comes with home ownership, and I am the only person on call for a system I support, so I'm very busy. But my Linux box just works. I DO admit that I struggled when using Mandrake getting everything working, but Red Hat is a champ. My wife runs Linux on a laptop, and I will admit that I've been impressed with its stability compared with older Windows versions I used.

      But Red Hat just works, and I can get things done without supporting a company that I think is terrible for consumers.

    10. Re:Progression by default+luser · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually, you're forgetting some of the most important aspects that Windows 95 brought to the world.

      Plug 'n Play - Nod to OS/2 for having the same feature, but Win95 is responsible for bringing it to the masses. There were, as expected, a few bugs, but in most cases the hardware was properly detected and configured without the user lifting a finger. Think of Win95 as the working, but basic PnP, whereas Windows 2k / XP with ACPI are the best it ever needs to be.

      Built-in easy networking (IPX/TCP/Etc.) -
      Come on folks. Linux was a pain in the ass for years to configure to talk to anything, unless you already knew how. In Windows, it was as simple as opening an applet, and selecting the protocol / service. Better still, most Dialup / Network adapters AUTOMATICALLY installed the protocols and services you needed, so no user interaction necessary.

      No, it wasn't perfect. But time doesn't stand still, and in terms of features Win95 was an excellent starting point for things to come. Both features mentioned above ( simple networking, PnP ) have been nearly perfected in 2k/XP.

      --

      Man is the animal that laughs.
      And occasionally whores for Karma.

    11. Re:Progression by mccalli · · Score: 2, Funny
      Doesn't AMD's Hammer respond to commands?

      Yeah, but it's a non-flyer so far...

      Cheers,
      Ian

    12. Re:Progression by ChiefPilot · · Score: 3, Interesting
      You've got to be kidding!

      MacOS had plug'n'play in 1986, with the introduction of the MacII. Not to mention dual monitors, which Windows finally added in what, 1999?

      Built in easy networking: AppleTalk in 1984, Ethernet in 87 or thereabouts. Or whenever cards started coming out for it.

      And BTW, Windows STILL hasn't got Shortcuts right; they still break when you move the original doc. MacOS has had that since about 1994, I think.

      I realize Windows dominates things but TRY to give credit in the PC world where credit is due!

  2. windoze schmidoze by incrustwetrust · · Score: 2, Insightful

    did anyone ever hyndai or whatever computers? they were only released as an experiment to see how well they worked.. they were cheap as heck and they planned on giving them to school. they could only handle this bad wordprocessing program, "wordstar"

    windows user interface has ALWAYS been prettier than that. even if it always has been pretty damned ugly.

    1. Re:windoze schmidoze by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Funny, from these pictures, I can't tell the difference between 1.0 to 2003.

  3. Yechh... by DoctorFrog · · Score: 2, Funny

    You don't appreciate how ugly the standard Windows colors are without this kind of perspective.

  4. A crowd Pleaser by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    What they need is a history of windows blue screens....and photos of frustrated 4th year students who lose 3 hours worth of work, 2 hours before there final papers are due.

    You know who you are!

    1. Re:A crowd Pleaser by NewbieProgrammerMan · · Score: 5, Funny

      Wow, people manage to get to their 4th year (of anything that requires even incidental use of Windows) without developing an I - must - press - Ctrl-S - every - 15 - seconds reflex?

      --
      [b.belong('us') for b in bases if b.owner() == 'you']
    2. Re:A crowd Pleaser by BWJones · · Score: 4, Funny

      What they need is a history of windows blue screens....and photos of frustrated 4th year students who lose 3 hours worth of work, 2 hours before there final papers are due.

      Yeah, it went beep beep bee...... Oh, Never mind. I've switched already.

      --
      Visit Jonesblog and say hello.
    3. Re:A crowd Pleaser by BWJones · · Score: 5, Funny

      What they need is a history of windows blue screens....and photos of frustrated 4th year students who lose 3 hours worth of work, 2 hours before there final papers are due.

      Seriously though, I remember working on our Token-Ring (or whatever it was) equipped early Wintel based systems at the library on papers (before I bought my first Macintosh), and someone would yell, "MY Computer crashed!". And then everyone would frantically be saving their files to disk before the crash propegated itself through the network systematically crashing everyone's computer. The entire network would then have to be rebooted and God help the poor soul who had submitted his paper to the print que without saving it.

      --
      Visit Jonesblog and say hello.
    4. Re:A crowd Pleaser by el_flynn · · Score: 2, Funny

      Well, if it's history you want, then this screen has got to be the granddaddy of them all. Now we all know where the BSOD get its start from... dang, it's been around since the 2.0 days!!!

      --
      The Wknd Sessions - Malaysian and South East Asia independent music
    5. Re:A crowd Pleaser by ayjay29 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Enjoy your joke while you can.

      Your going to to mention "Blue Screen" one day and no one will know what you are talking about. I have not seen one for over a year now, as the releases progress, Windows is getting more stable. You have to find a different way to poke fun at the man-in-the-glasses.

      Ayjay...

      --
      Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated up.
    6. Re:A crowd Pleaser by SoupIsGoodFood_42 · · Score: 4, Insightful
      You have to find a different way to poke fun at the man-in-the-glasses.

      I'm sure I'll be laughing from my Mac when a virus is released that exploits a hole in MSs' DRM system and makes it so you can't back up you own files. he he he.

    7. Re:A crowd Pleaser by PunchMonkey · · Score: 5, Funny

      I'd never trust my computers on a Tolkien Ring... too many systems turning evil, talking about the precious.... blech.

      --
      I'll have something intelligent to add one of these days...
    8. Re:A crowd Pleaser by sfe_software · · Score: 3, Informative

      True that, if win2k goes down on me it just reboots.

      Actually you're getting a blue screen, but Win2k defaults to "Reboot Automatically" in the event of a blue screen error. This is bad, in my opinion; I lost a system (had to reinstall) over a problem I never did figure out.

      Microsoft's solution? Install another copy of Win2k to a different partition or folder, hack the old Win2k registry to disable the auto-reboot feature. I just reinstalled...

      Ever since, that's the first thing I do: disable auto-reboot (System Properties -> Advanced -> Startup and Recovery).

      I did recently have a blue screen. I plugged into my laptop, of all things, a monitor. An analog monitor. Got a blue screen. I had to boot safe mode, uninstall the video driver, and it just fixed itself (how the hell do you run a headless Windows server if it won't even boot without a video driver?)

      --
      NGWave - Fast Sound Editor for Windows
    9. Re:A crowd Pleaser by Jucius+Maximus · · Score: 2, Informative
      " I was always a fan of having one or more local copies and redundant network backups on my roommate's computer. If his computer happened to be off at the time, I settled for a floppy. It did end up saving my ass at least once."

      Good idea. I periodically copy my 'work' directory to CD-Rw for short term backup purposes. (I also us CD-R for long term backups.) This has saved me at least once as well.

    10. Re:A crowd Pleaser by sfe_software · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Your going to to mention "Blue Screen" one day and no one will know what you are talking about. I have not seen one for over a year now...

      I would have said the same thing the other day, but I recently received a blue screen in Win2k by plugging an analog monitor into my laptop. After that the machine wouldn't boot, even with the monitor disconnected. Had to remove the video driver (in safe mode) and reboot. Suddenly everything worked, with both monitors connected...

      Note that the blue screen showed on both monitors (laptop built-in and external LCD, nicely anti-aliased, too).

      Win2k defaults to "Automatically Reboot" in the event of a blue screen, which costed me a reinstall once over a problem that to this day I don't know what caused. I really, really wish it would wait 5 seconds and *then* reboot, so you can at least read the error. Safe mode wouldn't boot, and I just saw a flash of blue before it rebooted (when I discovered the problem, I awoke to my machine in a constant reboot cycle).

      All in all, I will agree, Windows has come a long way in stability. I'm still using 2000, and have no plans (no need) to "upgrade", at least until I retire my current machines. But you *must* disable "Automatically Reboot", else you get stuck with no log, no error message, and an ever-rebooting Windows box...

      --
      NGWave - Fast Sound Editor for Windows
    11. Re:A crowd Pleaser by TopShelf · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I never understood why they default to auto-reboot. It smacks of arrogance that says, "this couldn't possibly happen again, we'll have your OS back up and running in no time."

      --
      Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
    12. Re:A crowd Pleaser by x0n · · Score: 5, Informative

      [flamebait]Since noone here really knows anything about Windows[/flamebait], I'd better answer this one -- on the contrary my friend, you _do_ have several logs of the event (details for default install of win2000):

      - An event notification in the NT Event Log

      - A carbon copy of the bluescreen data at C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\DrWatson\

      - System crash dump (choice of small/kernel/complete) at %systemroot%\memory.dmp

      - user process space dump at C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\DrWatson\user.dmp

      Run drwtsn32.exe to see some of these options, additionally, right-click my computer, advanced tab, startup and recovery options.

      Additionally, Windows does not have "automatically reboot" enabled by default. Either you or your administrator chose to enable that behaviour.

      Enough of the "bah, windows 2000 doesn't do this, nor that" banter. RTFM (yes, I know there is no manual, F1 it mate) or, ATFM "ask the f*ing adminstrator". :)

      - Oisin

      --

      PGP KeyId: 0x08D63965
    13. Re:A crowd Pleaser by sfe_software · · Score: 3, Interesting

      ...on the contrary my friend, you _do_ have several logs of the event...

      Yes, except that when the system will not boot at all (command line, safe mode, etc all result in the auto-reboot) I can't view any of that stuff. Microsoft's solution involved a parallel install of Win2k to be able to fix the existing install. Because of course you need the GUI tools to fix it.

      Perhaps it may have been possible to use the "Recovery Console" to obtain some of the crash data -- but why the hell couldn't the blue screen just pause for a second before rebooting?

      Additionally, Windows does not have "automatically reboot" enabled by default.

      Sorry, but Windows 2000 Professional "Upgrade", purchased 2/17/2000 (day it was released I believe), does in fact enable this by default. Trust me, it's enabled by default.

      Enough of the "bah, windows 2000 doesn't do this, nor that" banter.

      I didn't say I didn't like Windows 2000 -- the reason I'm using it is because I do like it. Win2k offered a lot of stability and reliability that Windows did not have previously. But there are still things that are just plain stupid about it. Windows will not boot without a video card *and* valid driver for it. If the driver won't initialize -- BSOD. Card not present? Not sure what it would do, but I am sure it won't be useful.

      In my opinion, much as I do like Windows (2000 and up), it's a desktop OS, and nothing more. But that's beside the point...

      --
      NGWave - Fast Sound Editor for Windows
    14. Re:A crowd Pleaser by XO · · Score: 2, Informative

      funny, we have a few XP machines at work (most are '95) .. the XP machines crash at least 3 times a day, and all they do is run Flash presentations all day long. The '95 boxes that are used as our cash registers have uptimes of months...

      --
      "Champagne for my real friends - and real pain for my sham friends!" http://ericblade.postalboard.com/
  5. Wordstar? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Wordstar was bad?
    That was a great program that started many of the flag based text editing programs to date. All of the commands were at the bottom of the screen and it was relatively easy to use. I really thought that was a good program.

    1. Re:Wordstar? by stoborrobots · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And both WordStar and WordPerfect shone out against the similarly dated versions of WinWord...

    2. Re:Wordstar? by chthon · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The great thing about WordStar was that I could help people easily retrieve their documents from a bad floppy, without cashing out money to buy specialised software, like you need for Word.

  6. NonBloated by questamor · · Score: 5, Funny

    Hey, at least the bloat hadn't yet set in. I have a few versions of Windows archived away here just because they don't take up too much room.

    Win 1.0 is a 244k zip file.

    Win 2.0 really went overkill and that's where the bloat set in I'm afraid. 667kb. What do people need all that for anyway?

    1. Re:NonBloated by Unreal+One · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Flamebait: At least a full distro of Windows still fits on a single cd-rom unlike some other operating systems.

    2. Re:NonBloated by QuMa · · Score: 2, Informative

      I doubt you have the full thing then, win 1.0 came on 3 360k floppies, and I doubt it'd compress to 22%.

    3. Re:NonBloated by jkrise · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I know you said Flamebait, but what the heck. The full distro of Windows that you talk of, does NOT include the apps, which are part of these other distro. Many otherr full-distros come in a single floppy! And some of these can read Windows files as well..

      --
      If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
    4. Re:NonBloated by Unreal+One · · Score: 3, Insightful

      hehe I love Linux, but getting 2 web servers, 3 rdbms, 6 text editors, 2 GUI's, 3 mail readers, etc. is a bit unnecessary. Standardize for God's sake... Each distro should have a vote on their site for the best of each app to distribute with their package, and write it, nice and tight into their distro. All the other crap can still be downloaded, so it's still okay. Whatever. Just a thought.

    5. Re:NonBloated by the_cowgod · · Score: 5, Informative

      Here's the contents of the disks I've got:

      Windows 1.01 (files dated November 1985) - 5 360K floppies - 1,598K
      Windows 2.03 (November 1987) - 9 360K floppies - 3,540K
      Windows 3.0 (October 1990) - 7 720K floppies - 5,423K
      Windows for Workgroups v3.11 (November 1993) - 8 1.44MB floppies - 12,215K
      Windows 95 v4.00.950 (July 1995) - 34,621K
      Windows 95 v4.00.950B (May 1997) - 45,169K

    6. Re:NonBloated by SpaceJunkie · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Nicely said brookharty - in fact I would consider the other CD's with many optional apps a bonus!
      You do not even have to install a GUI if you dont use it... Linux can be as minimal as you need it.. Browser? If you really want you can have 7 or so- or none at all..
      However most of windows is not optional. you must have a GUI, a browser etc- otherwise you have to go right back to dos - in which case using a recent linux kernel would give you more functionaly and safety.
      As for bonuses microsoft gives you the doctor evil feeding-you-to-sharks-with-lasers brand, keeping you in the lock in, charging you big time, having a premium for office apps that may include nasty DRM tech, and so on.
      To me the very basics is a console with a TCP/IP stack, text editor and pine..

      --
      OrionRobots.co.uk - Robots From sol
    7. Re:NonBloated by DanCo · · Score: 2, Informative

      IIRC the difference is that B has Internet Explorer, the quicklaunch bar and support for user toolbars on the desktop. Not sure about any changes in the back-end of it though.

      --
      It's not my fault - greatness was thrust upon me.
    8. Re:NonBloated by ReverendRyan · · Score: 2, Informative

      "B" (aka OSR2) has USB support, as well as major bugfixes.

    9. Re:NonBloated by the_cowgod · · Score: 2, Informative

      The "B" release added USB and FAT32 file system support. I think IE3 was added as well. There was also an "A" version which is what you got when a service pack was applied to the original release, so those changes would have been in "B" too.

  7. They missed one by traskjd · · Score: 3, Funny

    Ignoring the fact I made this (mod it down if that's a problem - I don't mind) I think they missed one of the screen shots of early windows -

    A never released version of windows*

    *of maybe it was - you decide :D

  8. win95..... by vvikram · · Score: 5, Interesting


    looking at all of them one thing really
    strikes you, win95 was quite a leap.
    till then it really was not close to
    a usable desktop. win95 was the racehorse...

    1. Re:win95..... by dabootsie · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That would be because W95 borrowed heavily from OS/2 after Microsoft pulled out of their partnership with IBM.

    2. Re:win95..... by cbreaker · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Windows95 has a start button. Woo.

      And .lnk files.

      I wouldn't exactly say it's any kind of leap in UI development.

      Lots and lots of people used Windows 3.1 for a long time. If it was unusable, people wouldn't have used it. Back then, it wasn't quite a monopoly yet, although that's about the time when they started using shadey business practices to force manufacturers to put Windows on PC's that ship, and nothing else.

      --
      - It's not the Macs I hate. It's Digg users. -
    3. Re:win95..... by MegaFur · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You're right it wasn't a great leap for UIs, but it was a huge leap for Windows. The fact that many people think a huge leap for Windows represents a huge leap for UIs in general shows that most people are still unaware that Microsoft is not the center of the computing Universe, nor is it, in any sense an innovator.

      It is possible for a program to be "usable" and yet still horrible to use. This is what Windows was prior to Win9x.

      --
      Furry cows moo and decompress.
  9. Well aint it just typical... by guran · · Score: 2, Funny
    I got to Win 3.1 and then the server refused to serve me anymore.

    You may call it slashdotting, but I say BLAME WINDOWS!


    (Or perhaps it was just emulating the slow release process of Win -95)

    --

    All opinions are my own - until criticized

  10. Sorry?!!? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    "For those of you who have used all of them, I'm sorry." Has it ever dawned to you that some people actually like using Windows??? Not everyone is a Microsoft bashing Linux freak like you Michael.

    1. Re:Sorry?!!? by pebs · · Score: 2, Funny

      "For those of you who have used all of them, I'm sorry." Has it ever dawned to you that some people actually like using Windows??? Not everyone is a Microsoft bashing Linux freak like you Michael.

      Ummm... dude.. You haven't used any Windows before Windows 2000 have you?

      Windows 3.xx is what turned me into a Microsoft-bashing UNIX/Linux freak.

      --
      #!/
  11. heh. slashdotted already by devlogic · · Score: 5, Funny

    22 comments on the story, and the site is already experiencing the full force of the /. effect. I wonder what OS that server's running? Oh. Well, that blows my theory out of the water.

    You know, this was a lot funnier BEFORE I went to netcraft.

  12. OS/2 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    I was using OS/2 during that whole sordid Windows thing. Sure I've seen Windows, but I never inhaled. I never saw the point in Windows; still don't. I'll admit to exchanging blow jobs with some of my buddies when I was 14, but I'll never admit to using any MS product except NT4 at work ( unplesent duty, that).

  13. from the article by smylie · · Score: 5, Funny

    In regards to windows 1.0:
    It took 55 programmers one year to develop this program.

    And 500 slashdotters 20 minutes to overload neowin's server looking at screenshots of an OS we all supposedly loath . . .

  14. Screenshots are originally from... by eMartin · · Score: 5, Informative

    First, many of the screens from the article appear to have been taken from The GUI Gallery, which is kinda lame since it's basically just a copy of that site anyway. The author even says that he "picked them up" from the internet. :P

    And second, wasn't this posted here like a week ago?

    1. Re:Screenshots are originally from... by linebackn · · Score: 5, Informative

      Yes, many these were taken from my site http://toastytech.com/guis/ Some of them look like they were taken from elsewhere. You can even see my name in the NT 3.51 user manager screen shot. I can't get to all of their site right now since it is mostly slashdotted. I normally don't mind if people use my images or graphics, but I generally ask that they provide reference or a link back to my site.

  15. Re:Man... what a garbage it was (like 1, 2, and 3) by Frobnicator · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Man... what a garbage it was. I'm making some product right now and I'm in charge. Also It's much better (looking) than Win1, 2, and 3. I must be able to tons of money over next 10 years.
    For the time it was high-end. Nobody had 256 color displays, you were getting 'high end' EGA cards with 32 colors, and 256 colors was available for several thousand bucks. Your high-end machines were 32-bit and aproaching 33 Mhz, with 32-mb of disk space and, if you were rich, had 16 MB of RAM. A more common scenario was a 16-bit machine with a 20-mb hard disk, 12 or 16 Mhz, and up 2 MB of ram.

    If you make make your app run nicely on that configuration, then have 15 years of development for improvement, then you might have something.

    --
    //TODO: Think of witty sig statement
  16. Re:heh. slashdotted already by tulare · · Score: 2, Informative

    From the Netcraft link:

    mod_bwlimited/1.0 PHP/4.3.1

    Looks like it's working perfectly. They probably have to pay through the nose to their hosting company if throughput exceeds some arbitrary limit.

    --
    political_news.c: warning: comparison is always true due to limited range of data type
  17. The lies prepetuated by Safety+Cap · · Score: 5, Interesting
    From the site:
    It [Windows 95] is no longer a graphic user interface on MS-DOS, but a complete operating system. Although users can see a regular MS-DOS window in the boot process, the system takes over MS-DOS 7.0 after it's loaded completely.
    Nope, sorry. Windows 9x is still DOS with a quick switch over to the graphical shell.

    If you have your old copy of Windows 95 System Programming Secrets (1995, Matt Pietrek) handy, he has some examples of how those pesky Int 21 calls (DOS services) are still thunked down to that crappy old DOS layer, instead of being completely handled in the kernal, as in WinNT. If there was truely no DOS, there would be no thunking, no crappy DOS layer, and no MSDOS.SYS/IO.SYS/COMMAND.COM garbage.

    Microsoft's marketing machine tried (and mostly managed) to convince the world that 'DOS is dead' with this version of Windows. Rumor has it that BillG got totally hacked off by an Apple commerical that compared booting a Mac with booting a WIntel box, and told his minions that the next version (95) better boot right to Windows.

    --
    Yeah, right.
    1. Re:The lies prepetuated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Nope, sorry. Windows 9x is still DOS with a quick switch over to the graphical shell.

      It's a 32-bit patch to a 16-bit extension to an 8-bit operating system originally written for a 4-bit microprocessor by a 2-bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition.

    2. Re:The lies prepetuated by steveha · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Windows 9x is still DOS with a quick switch over to the graphical shell.

      That's true, but for the time it was the right thing.

      You could run Win95, and do useful work with it, on a PC with 4 MB of RAM. More was better; I ran it with 8 MB. (In 1995, RAM was expensive!)

      Part of the reason it was small was because of the stupid thunking into DOS. DOS is small, partly because it started out small and partly because lots of people hacked on it over the years trying to keep it small. (DOS 4 was an exception, but the MS DOS guys were quick to point out that IBM made DOS 4. DOS 5, done by MS, was actually smaller than DOS 4, despite having many improvements.)

      Also, Win95 had lots of 16-bit code inherited from Win 3.1, and it thunked into that a lot. Again, this contributed to the small size.

      I'm glad that machines are so powerful these days, where 128 MB of RAM is considered a small amount. But part of Win95's success was that it actually ran on the machines of the day.

      steveha

      --
      lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
    3. Re:The lies prepetuated by g4dget · · Score: 2, Informative
      Windows 9x is still DOS with a quick switch over to the graphical shell.

      That's true, but for the time it was the right thing.

      Neither DOS nor Windows 9x were ever "the right thing". We are talking mid-90's here. UNIX was more than 20 years old, people were using 3D user interfaces on SGIs, you could get Sun workstations for $2000, Smalltalk was nearly two decades old. You could even get better open source 16bit operating systems at the time.

      Windows 9x was purely a way of squeezing lots of money out of a pathetic architecture that was obsolete before it even shipped.

      Also, Win95 had lots of 16-bit code inherited from Win 3.1, and it thunked into that a lot. Again, this contributed to the small size.

      I think calling Windows 95 "small" represents a seriously distorted world view. You could run UNIX and X11 in less memory and with less CPU power than Windows 95. Except relative to other Windows versions, Windows 95 was a dog, and a seriously ill one at that.

    4. Re:The lies prepetuated by g4dget · · Score: 2, Informative
      Frankly, technological excellence aside, if it wasn't for DOS and those IBM PCs that IBM didn't care about, we wouldn't be using these computers we sit at today

      Yes, indeed. There is a good chance that without Microsoft or Intel, the computers we sit at today would have better processors, better programming environments, better usability, and better end-user software. Microsoft and Windows have held back the industry and technology by at least a decade.

      the wintel alliance has brought us a revolution in computing power, that those 20 years of unix failed to deliver even slightly.

      That is clearly completely false. Even without anywhere near the sales volume of Wintel machines, in the early 1990's, Sun was selling $2000 SPARC workstations, including high resolution monitors, without any Wintel components at all. That included a full 32bit operating system, a decent window system, and full networking. The only thing that was missing was desktop application software. Imagine how much more the non-Microsoft vendors would have been able to do if they could have gotten their volumes up.

      Microsoft clearly has their act together on the business side, but in terms of technology, they have been an unmitigated disaster for the technology industry.

  18. I feel old. by Powercntrl · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The first time I was introduced to Windows, I was using a Tandy 1000RLX. For those of you who didn't follow the history of Tandy's 1000 series, it basically started with the original 1000 and went something like this... RGEG@#3t232tG@#g@#G23#%#@^!@^grsg

    Yea, that's about as much sense as it made - the 1000 moniker was absolutely useless for determining what kind of system it was. So anyway, as it turns out, the 1000RLX was an XT-286. Yep, while other 286s had a 16-bit bus and 16-bit ISA slots... My crappy Tandy didn't. What it did have was a 10MHz AMD 286 chip on an 8-bit bus with 256k VGA graphics, 1MB of RAM, a 1.44MB floppy drive and an XT-IDE 40MB hard drive. It also had one 8-bit ISA slot that I decided to cram a 2400bps modem into.

    So anyway, I certainly didn't have the hardware for Windows 3.0 and while I don't remember the exact date, I do remember Windows 3.1 was just about to come out in a few months... So it was back in the day. I got ahold of a copy of Windows 3.0 and installed it on that Tandy and guess what - my mouse didn't work.

    I called tech support (you could actually reach a live person back in the day!) for the Tandy computer... They kinda wondered where I got a copy of Windows from (since the computer didn't come with it, it came with Tandy's Deskmate) but instead of telling me "No, we don't support operating systems that didn't come bundled... blah blah blah" like you'd expect to hear today - they were actually helpful and explained that this XT-286 had the PS/2 mouse port on a non standard IRQ and I'd need to get a serial mouse.

    To make a long story longer, I waited awhile for 3.1 to be released and ended up pawning off the computer on my father and convinced him to buy me a Tandy 2500SX/25 instead... So not only could I run the new Windows 3.1 with a mouse, I also could run it in 386 protected mode with a whopping 2MB of ram and an 80MB hard drive. From what I remember of Windows 3.1, it was always very slow and it seemed to crash a lot and every few weeks or so it managed to crash badly enough to corrupt itself. Blue screens nowadays make me feel all nolstalgic.

    --

    ---
    DRM is like antifreeze, to the MPAA/RIAA it's sweet, to the consumers it's poison.
  19. Most popular app by mabu · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think it's quite telling that for several years the biggest-selling and most popular application for Windows was what?

    A screen saver! (After Dark)

  20. Looks ripped. by eMartin · · Score: 3, Informative

    Didn't see your comment, so I posted below.

    The screens are from The GUI Gallery, and the author even says he "picked them up" from the net.

  21. Official Microsoft Story by rf0 · · Score: 5, Informative

    You can read the official M$ story of the windows history at microsoft.com
    including horrible coloured screenshots :)

    Rus

  22. When I worked at M$ by WhaDaYaKnow · · Score: 2, Interesting

    right when I started there was a whole pile of software boxen in the hallway. My manager told me that I could take whatever I wanted. So I looked around and found really early versions of Windows and DOS. I thought it was cool and so I took em home. Then one day after perhaps one too many evenings of Linux hacking I was cleaning up my room... you guessed it, out they went. I have to admit, I regret that a bit...

  23. Re:Damn by tulare · · Score: 3, Funny

    Sure. Take a square. Make it just a tad darker than sky blue. Now put a grey bar at the bottom, with a crappy logo on the left and the word Start. (remember, you have to Start before you can Shut Down)

    You will also notice a funny-looking lower-case 'e' somewhere. This is special software for your computer. Very special. Time-warp forward about three months. The blue square is now an annoying set of green tiles with gold trim, or a wierdly-distorted picture of someone's wife and kids. But it doesn't really matter because just about all you can see are random icons scattered haphazardly all over the place. Most of them came as a result of the funny 'e' software, and they are named things like "pics.scr" and "Brittney_SPears.mp3.exe. None of them do anything when you click on them, so you naturally download another to see if you can make that one work, too. But I digress...

    Pretty much, that's the look of the thing after 3.1, at least until XP. To get a picture of XP in your head, you first have to be familiar with the gumdrop look of Mac OS X, which came before XP. Then, while holding the OS X desktop in your mind, send in some Tellytubbies, and have them run around, say gibberish, point to their belly buttons, and while they're at it, customize the desktop and control buttons very slightly to suit their own, um, needs. That's Windows XP, in a nutshell.

    The preceeding comments were brought to you by the letter G and the Number 3.

    --
    political_news.c: warning: comparison is always true due to limited range of data type
  24. Burned-in pattern by SgtChaireBourne · · Score: 5, Funny
    Wow, people manage to get to their 4th year (of anything that requires even incidental use of Windows) without developing an I - must - press - Ctrl-S - every - 15 - seconds reflex?

    I haven't used MS-Windows/MS-Office in years and I still have the reflex to hit Ctrl-S at the end of each sentence or any time I pause for a moment while typing.

    Usually, I catch it in time to abstract it to "Save" and use the correct short cut. But being a reflex it unfortunately still kicks in sometimes as Ctrl-S ... even in Bash or vi.

    --
    Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
    1. Re:Burned-in pattern by parliboy · · Score: 2, Funny

      I've been going in the other direction. I've gotted so used to Ctrl-W in Pico for searching, that when I'm in IE, I do it instead of Ctrl-F, and end up closing my window.

      --
      "You're never ready, just less unprepared."
    2. Re:Burned-in pattern by cdrudge · · Score: 2, Informative

      Your problem about keyboard mapping was just answered this month in Sys Admin Magazine. Check out the first Q&A here.

      You might also check out the Customizing Mozilla page at Mozilla.org.

  25. Can someone post the keygen for Windows 1.0? PLZ by teamhasnoi · · Score: 4, Funny
    Oh wait, that *is* Windows 1.0.

    Ah, the days before bloat.

  26. mirror of first 10 pages by lizzybarham · · Score: 5, Informative

    here

    the "skip to page number" at bottom of pages don't work - you'll need to hit back on your browser

  27. Used them? I have to program for some of them! by ojQj · · Score: 3, Interesting
    > For those of you who have used all of them, I'm sorry.

    What about us poor schmucks who have to keep our programs compatible to the 95/98/Me family, while still integrating a "modern XP look" (blech) for marketing? Don't we get some sympathy?

    Microsoft Layer for Unicode, here I come...

  28. Re:Man... what a garbage it was (like 1, 2, and 3) by wass · · Score: 2, Interesting
    With a Tandy 1000/TL, I was able to routinely use 320x200 at 16 colors, and occasionaly 640x200 at 16 colors when software specifically accessed Tandy-specific memory space. Made my friends jealous when they only had CGA graphics at 320x200 at 4 colors. It made playing Leisure Suit Larry so much better!!!

    That said, did anyone else have a Tandy 1000, or specifically the 1000/TL? It was actually pretty sharp back in the day, and may have been the last custom computer Radio Scrap offered. It had the operating system (older version of MS-DOS, I forget which one) in ROM on the D drive, so it booted insanely fast. It also came with some windows/office kind of software called Deskmate, which sort of resembled Windows 1.0. It was a desktop environment with a word processor and some other stuff, which was graphic-based, but the text was the same size/font as the standard IBM-PC text at 80x25 character resolution. Anybody else besides me ever use that? I don't remember anything else about it, though.

    --

    make world, not war

  29. Timelines... by antdude · · Score: 4, Informative

    Here's a Windows Timeline list of each MS OS and its date. Also, includes the current future OS'.

    --
    Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
    1. Re:Timelines... by KewlPC · · Score: 2, Informative

      And MS didn't have anything to do with DOS until version 6.2 or whatever.

      Not even close. When MS heard that IBM was designing the PC, and looking for an OS for it, they bought a dinky little OS that nobody had ever heard of called QDOS (Quick and Dirty Operating System), which was itself an x86 hack/clone of the popular CP/M operating system, and made some changes to it so that it would run on a PC.

      IBM had been hoping to use actual CP/M, but the company that made it, Intergalactic Digital Research (the Intergalactic part was eventually dropped), was too slow off the mark in doing the x86 port (CP/M was originally for the Z80 microprocessor), so they picked Microsoft with their "new" "Disk Operating System". IBM called it PC-DOS, and shipped it themselves for a while, but all development beyond QDOS was done by Microsoft. MS, of course, also licensed DOS to companies making PC clones, such as Compaq, and eventually (at something like DOS 3.0) started selling it to the public themselves.

      Intergalactic Digital Research eventually finished the x86 PC port of CP/M (in something like 1982), but by then it was too late. They tried to pull a reverse-Microsoft on Microsoft by marketing their own version of DOS called DR-DOS (they had dropped the Intergalactic part of their name), but Microsoft had released Windows by then, and were able to out-Microsoft Digital Research by making Windows 3.1 only work on MS-DOS and spreading FUD that DR-DOS wasn't as good as MS-DOS (quite the opposite in reality, though; DR-DOS was vastly more stable than MS-DOS, and the only reason that Microsoft even thought about developing MS-DOS beyond version 3.0 was to compete with Digital Research; their marketing department announced MS-DOS 4.0 before any of the design people had even considered it, and later did the same with MS-DOS 5.0).

  30. So easy to bash the past... by rufusdufus · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why back in the middle ages get this..they used swords! Those fools! Why didn't they just use guns!

    Programmers today have no clue what programming was like back in the early days of the PC. The system had to boot in 64k, which is equivilant to a few icons in todays world. The graphics technology was so primitive most programmers today would refuse to write code for it; the pixels weren't square and there was no screen read!

    Yet the functionality was substantially similar to what we have today; networking, graphics, spreadsheets, word processors with fonts.

    Put down the early days of windows all you want, twenty years from now you will be defending the "boneheaded code" you wrote in your youth and you may just get a taste of it; though not the full course meal since starting a billion dollar enterprise is much much more difficult than coat-tailing on one.

    1. Re:So easy to bash the past... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Sure. A much fairer method would be to compare Windows to the alternatives which were available at the time. Like the Macintosh. Or the Amiga. Or GEM. Or OS/2.

      Oh. Well then it looks like Windows really was crap then, doesn't it? So was the PC/AT, come to think of it. Crappy hardware and a crappy operating system, and now its the defacto standard. Yay.

  31. this is like one of those TV flashbacks by tankdilla · · Score: 5, Funny
    Seeing the old Windows 3.10 startup screen brought me back to when I got my first computer, and the Windows 3.1 splash screen booted up. It was Christmas morning and I was a young lad. This was a really big thrill, being the first kid on the block with a computer. After the splash screen, there was some setup screen for some program that was preinstalled. After filling in the information, I clicked the Next button and waited for more magic to happen. I waited...and waited....and waited....then my father pushed ctrl+alt+del, and up pops my very first blue screen of death! It rudely told me it was busy and commenced to spit floppy disks out of the disk drive at me. I went to bed crying and terrified of the computer, and never touched another computer again after that.

    the end.

    just kidding, actually my father reinstalled the system, and eventually we got it working.

    --

    -Look lively. LOOK LIVELY!!! --Mr. Shmallow

  32. Re:2003 server by PhrostyMcByte · · Score: 2, Informative

    Actually, if you go to start->run->services.msc and enable the Themes service then reboot, it lets you select the luna themes again.

    Just when you thought m$ cut down on the bloat, you find out it's still there ;)

  33. Inaccuracies by KewlPC · · Score: 2, Informative

    This article seems to have some inaccuracies.

    Namely that versions of Windows before Win95 didn't fully support the 386 (dunno 'bout NT, never used it), despite what the article claims, still had worthless (and error-prone) cooperative multi-tasking, nor did they have anything resembling a 32-bit filesystem. FAT32, Microsoft's 32-bit file system, didn't come along until Windows 95; prior to that they had FAT16.

    Additionally, starting with the 286 you could have more than 640k of RAM. The 286, IIRC, had a 24-bit address space and could therefor address up to 16 megabytes when running in 16-bit protected mode, but even in its protected mode still suffered from the horrid segmentation model that so annoyed programmers writing software for Intel's earlier x86 CPUs. Intel's poor segmentation system didn't become a thing of the past (or at least something you could ignore) until the 386 and its 32-bit protected mode.

    1. Re:Inaccuracies by julesh · · Score: 5, Informative

      Who modded this as informative?

      Namely that versions of Windows before Win95 didn't fully support the 386

      Win 3 supported every feature of the 386 processor. It could run 32 bit code (although most of the code was 16 bit for compatibility). It could run DOS programs in V86 mode. It supported 4Gb of RAM. That's pretty much every 386 feature accounted for.

      despite what the article claims, still had worthless (and error-prone) cooperative multi-tasking

      The article claims that DOS tasks where pre-emptively multitasked. This is correct. I thought it was true for 2.0/386 as well, though, but I'm not certain, having never actually used that (I only ever used 2.0 on a 186).

      nor did they have anything resembling a 32-bit filesystem.

      Win3.1 came with a 32 bit filesystem driver. That is, the driver executed as 32 bit code without thunking to DOS. The articles text is ambiguous, and may cause you to think of FAT32, but it does clearly state later that FAT32 was introduced with Win95 OSR2.

    2. Re:Inaccuracies by KewlPC · · Score: 2, Informative

      Win 3 supported every feature of the 386 processor. It could run 32 bit code (although most of the code was 16 bit for compatibility). It could run DOS programs in V86 mode. It supported 4Gb of RAM. That's pretty much every 386 feature accounted for.

      You could only run 32-bit programs with the Win32S (yes, there's an S on there) addon. Most programs didn't use it.

      4GB of RAM? Really, that's quite astonishing, considering that not even Windows 95 supported that much.

      DOS programs in V86 mode? I'll give you that one. Keep in mind that I said Windows 3.1 supported some of the 386's features.

      The article claims that DOS tasks where pre-emptively multitasked. This is correct. I thought it was true for 2.0/386 as well, though, but I'm not certain, having never actually used that (I only ever used 2.0 on a 186).

      I never stated otherwise. But for all the non-DOS programs, the versions of Windows prior to Windows 95 (and excepting Windows NT) used cooperative multitasking.

  34. Re:Man... what a garbage it was (like 1, 2, and 3) by Goth+Biker+Babe · · Score: 2, Informative

    "For the time it was high-end. Nobody had 256 color displays, you were getting 'high end' EGA cards with 32 colors, and 256 colors was available for several thousand bucks. Your high-end machines were 32-bit and aproaching 33 Mhz, with 32-mb of disk space and, if you were rich, had 16 MB of RAM. A more common scenario was a 16-bit machine with a 20-mb hard disk, 12 or 16 Mhz, and up 2 MB of ram"

    Some of us were using AmigaDOS or RISC OS and had 32bit machines, thousands or millions of colours and decent sound support all for a reasonable price. 80's PCs were crap!

  35. Jesus by tedrlord · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This is the first time I actually noticed the dates on all this software.

    Back in the late-eighties/early-nineties I only knew Macs. I had family that worked at Apple so I had access to a lot of stuff. I finally moved over to a PC in 1998, when I got tired of connecting to shell accounts and wanted to get my own unix machine.

    Anyway, I can't believe the dates here. I always assumed that Windows 3.1 came out in 87/88, what with the horrible interface and lack of features. I remember playing with a Mac 128k in 1985 that worked better than 3.1, minus the color.

    It really makes me wonder what they were thinking at Apple back then, making the machines so expensive rather than trying to take over the market when they had such a lead. It boggles the mind.

    --
    [insert witty quote here]
  36. Windows 95 by jsse · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The 32-bit operating system also offered enhanced multimedia capabilities, more powerful features for mobile computing, and integrated networking

    I think the author pulled this straight out of Microsoft's propaganda. I don't know what qualify Windows 95 as a 32-bit OS.

    Windows 95 cannot perform preemptive multitasking when 16-bit applications are running. Therefore if you plan to use mostly older 16-bit applications, you should not expect to see productivity improvements. There are also times when Windows 95 cannot multitask 32-bit applications. Windows 95 uses older 16-bit code for two very important modules( Window management and Graphics Device Interface). When an application needs to use these modules, they have to wait in line until the previous application gives up control, the operating system cannot preempt it. If a 32-bit application needs to use one of these two modules, it may have to wait for it. That application is not able to multitask while it waits. In addition, 16-bit applications can inhibit the multitasking related performance of the 32-bit applications. When you run a mix of 16-bit and 32-bit applications, Windows 95 resorts to a less sophisticated form of multitasking called cooperative multitasking.

    You see, 'pure 32-bit OS mode' will never happen.

    1. Re:Windows 95 by spongman · · Score: 3, Informative
      yeah win95 did not have a multithreaded 'kernel', it's ring-0 code was not reentrant. but this does not mean that 32-bit applications and the set of win16 apps could not be preempted if they were in user code. it wasn't until the preempt kernel patch that linux operated in precisely that same manner - threads in the kernel would spin before continuing. when you run 16-bit apps win95 doesn't 'resort' to a less sophisticated form of multitasking the 32-bit apps, they're multitasked in exactly the same way they always are, it's just the 16-bit apps that are preempted as a single app. To do otherwise would be impossible: 16-bit apps expect to cooperatively multitask with each other; they share a single address space, message queue, global heap, the whole lot. If you wanted them to preempt each other you'd have to rewrite all the existing 16-bit apps. Not much of a compatibility feature.

      Your statements are not based on fact.

  37. Choice... by bazmonkey · · Score: 3, Interesting

    with over 90% of PC users choosing to adopt this software

    Heh, well, if having it violently shoved onto your future computer by its manufacturer...

    Or if having to pirate a copy because you can't afford it and for some God-awful reason you need to hone your l337 haxor sk177Z on it because UNIX is just too easy...

    Of if you actually bought it because a winmodem is your only ticket online. If that all in some convoluted way constitutes choice, then yes, we "adopted" Windows.

  38. Misguided sarcasm? by G3ckoG33k · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Jobugeek wrote: "For those of you who have used all of them, I'm sorry." Why? I have produced a lot of stuff using Windows? I don't think Windows is _that_ bad even if I mostly use Linux today.

    Also, there has been a lot of sarcasms in the previous posts regarding the slashdotted site. But checking with www.netcraft.com one sees their server's setup:

    "The site www.neowin.net is running Apache/1.3.27 (Unix) mod_log_bytes/1.0 mod_bwlimited/1.0 PHP/4.3.1 FrontPage/5.0.2.2510 mod_ssl/2.8.12 OpenSSL/0.9.7 on Linux."

  39. Re:in response to your automatic windows hatred... by nagora · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I can assemble a completely random machine, have an install as easy as Windows, and NOT have to recompile a kernal each time I change something, Windows is going to stay maintstream.

    The fact that manufacturers spend the time to make drivers for Windows is not a reflection of the quality of Windows itself.

    Plus, you could just compile all the kernel modules at once instead of having to recompile when you change your setup. That's effectively what Windows does.

    TWW

    --
    "Encyclopedia" is to "Wikipedia" what "Library" is to "Some people at a bus stop"
  40. Re:in response to your automatic windows hatred... by unbiasedbystander · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Correct, and because of this feature (about all kernals being compiled) being used by DEFAULT, which is easier? (to Joe Public)

  41. in response to your automatic windows zeal by dpete4552 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There are zealots everywhere. On Neowin you'll find your fair share of Microsoft zealots, on Slashdot you'll find your fair share of Anti-Microsoft zealots, on an Apple website you'd find your fair share of Apple zealots, etc...

    People have their views. Sometimes people's views are based upon a line of logic that that person happens to agree with, and a lot of times people's views are based on other things. The people in the latter category are ignorant. You will find these groups of people everywhere. There is really nothing you can do about it. So I would suggest that you simply get used to it or you are going to have a very hard time in life.

    Even you yourself appear to be quite ignorant. This is not necessarily an insult, as I am not attempting to challenge your intelligence. But based upon a lot of comments you made in your post you are very uninformed. Although your last comment pushes you into the arrogant (ignorance mixed with ego) category imho. My purpose in saying this is not to flame bit, but to show you that even you express zealousness. So you might want to be a bit more tolerant when you see others expressing that same quality, or you might come across as a hypocrite to some.

    --
    http://www.archive.org/details/ThePowerOfNightmares
    1. Re:in response to your automatic windows zeal by derubergeek · · Score: 2, Informative

      I installed Win2k on an AMD K6-2/300. Fairly straightforward outside of a bazillion reboots. Then I installed RedHat 7.2 on it. Fairly straightforward without all of the reboots. I didn't have to muck with the kernel, etc., although the Win2k box didn't want to work with my Voodoo card - I had to hunt down updated drivers and then go through this screwy driver update system that slapped me back & forth between 640x400 VGA/16 color & the 3dFX driver.

      Anyway, I recently upgraded the motherboard to an Intel board with a P4 2+GHz. Win2k completely barfed. I thought I had a config problem somewhere so I booted to Linux. No problems.

      I did a bunch of digging around on google groups (using my Mac - which is by far easier than Linux or Windows) and found that I needed to:

      1) Boot from the Win2k install CD.
      2) When it asks me if I wanted to install or repair, choose REPAIR (what kind've brain damage is that?)
      3) When it trys to install, it will detect an existing system and then ask me if I want to repair. NOW choose repair.
      4) Four reboots & 45 minutes later (after spending 3 hours dicking with it), I'm up & running again.

      Now I don't call that a superior system. That just plain sucked.

      I would suggeset giving a recent RedHat install (or ask around for something better) a try. You might be surprised...

      --
      Trust me. This is an inactive account. Regardless of what the /. bean counters might report.
  42. Amiga OS history by FrostedWheat · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Hiya!

    Didn't get a chance to see the pictures, server is slashdotted. So I did a quick googling around and found a nice site that shows the history of the AmigaOS. http://www.gregdonner.org/workbench/index.html

    I had forgot just how nasty Workbench 1.x's colours where. Makes XP look friendly *g*

  43. Novell by linzeal · · Score: 2, Funny

    Novell was an evil mistress back than, it was like the mature lady down the street propogating herpes to every yound lad willing and able.

  44. Re:2003 server by robbieduncan · · Score: 2, Funny

    Also note on the Windows Server 2003 page they talk about the release like it already happened. They say it was release on 24 April 2003. Do they have a time machine? It's still March here. They also say that Server 2003 was the best MS OS ever. How can they know?

  45. /. anti-Windows bigotry? by Malc · · Score: 4, Funny

    "For those of you who have used all of them, I'm sorry."

    Errr, why? Not half as sorry as I feel for those who've used X11 since the beginning. Ever got stuck with TWM or FVMW (feeble virtual window manager) or OpenLook? They give me the shudders just thinking of them! FVWM even had a Win95 look on my Slackware distro back in the mid-90's. The difference between them is that you're increasingly unlikely to see older Windows UIs, yet the crap old X11 ones are still active today. My XFree86 under Windows/Cygwin comes with TWM, and I had to suffer TWM on my Linux box the other day when I was compiling a newer version of KDE. Ugh!

  46. Re:silly remark by _Spirit · · Score: 3, Insightful

    So XP professional (NT 5.1 as it identifies itself) wasn't meant to replace 2000 Professional (NT 5)? And I suppose 2003 won't replace the 2000 server versions.....

    Silly remark indeed.

    --

    beauty is only a light switch away

  47. Windowing systems by pork_spies · · Score: 2, Interesting

    When I was at University, in the mid 80s, windowing systems were the real high end, final year undergraduate student stuff. Much as I hate the beast, I think it does deserve some credit for Windows 3.0 and 3.1 which really did take this stuff out to the masses.

    I really had to fight my then employers to go for Windows in the mid-90s (we were still using DOS and Wordperfect) and the benefits of the switch were real and immediate. Back then Linux was for geeks (:->) and nothing else was really a serious, low cost option for mass roll out on cheap hardware.

    That's all changed now, of course.

  48. Fun Game - aftermarket metaphores by ch-chuck · · Score: 2, Funny

    Here's a fun game to play - think of all the aftermarket 'fixes' for Winblow$ and the marketing metaphore. For example:

    1) First Aid - Windows is a sick person hemorraging blood and needs 'first aid' while waiting for the 'doctor' or ambulance. It is also succeptible to 'viruses' and diseases. Adherents to this metaphone often say, "My computer is sick!"

    2) Oil Change - Windows is an automobile that need regular perodic 'maintenance', as if there were metal parts in there rubbing together and need lubricant. They also often need a cheap muffler, tire rotation, etc. See Also "Tune Up". Adherents to this metaphone say their computer is "In the shop" being repaired, or "Hey Jim! Put 'er up on the rack again - the transmission's still acting up!".

    3) Power Tools - Windows is a decrepit old house that just needs a little 'fixing up' and 'sweat equity' to fix the drafty windows, broken stair steps, etc. This metaphore suggests a 'do it yourself' person more willing to tinker with their system than the Sick Human or Broken Automobile metaphore, who must call a Dr. or mechanic. But sometimes users of 'power tools' just make things worse and have to call in a 'contractor' to reinstall a whole new house.

    --
    try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
  49. Re:Preemtive DOS Multitasking by KewlPC · · Score: 2, Informative

    It used preemptive multitasking for MS-DOS apps, because there would be no other way. For everything else, though, it did cooperative multitasking.

  50. Re:eh, wot? by benzapp · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Warp 4 was released in 1996 - any copying (window close buttons, start menu, taskbar, etc) was by OS/2 off Win95 (for which MS copied of many other products as well, but Win95 was before Warp4)

    Warp3 was more Win3.x-ish.


    You must be kidding right. I only wish I had a version installed so I could show a screenshot.

    Warp 4 certainly had many design elements of Windows 95, but they were ONLY a start bar type fthing and the X buttons. Those features were available years before in circa 1993 as freeware add-ons. Checkout Filebar and NPS WPS enhancer, from which MS primarily ripped their design concepts.

    Many of the core ways that OS/2 worked were ripped from OS/2. A consistently gray GUI provided a much better look and was easier on the eyes. Buttons and bars had the "chiseled" look. MS even ripped the dark green background of OS/2 Warp 3.0. IBM did a whole study and determined that color calms humans better than any other. Lets not forget the absolutely revolutionary tabbed properties dialogue boxes.

    OS/2 always had a desktop since 1992, three years before Windows 95. There was no true desktop in Windows prior to 1995.

    In reality, the Macintosh had many of these features first. It was always striking how Windows 95 looked so incredibly similar to OS/2 Warp 3. They could easily have incorporated many of the design elements but still have created a unique look.

    --
    I don't read or respond to AC posts
  51. Windows 1.0 on a floppy by DMDx86 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    http://toastytech.com/guis/win101disk.zip

    Runs nicely in VMWARE.

  52. Remember this *IS* history folks... by erinacht · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It must not be taken out of context

    I had Gem on my 8088 (512K, 30Mb HDD) and had a funky graphics card that would do CGA hi-res in 16 colours. So Gem was nice and colourful (though fixed windows, unlike atari Gem).

    With first Word Plus and Timeworks DTP, the machine was excellent for doing schoolwork and stuff.

    Now this PC I got also came with 2 operating systems, MS-DOS 3.2 and DOS Plus - Due to software compatibility, I tended to use MS-DOS, dos plus was slightly more memory hungry. I made the choice to use MS-DOS because it *was* a better operating system.

    I remember windows 2 coming out and being quite excited - I remember starting it up - waiting ages - running in monochrome (it didn't support my weird graphics card) and played othello for about 30 minutes and then uninstalled it. My opinion: windows is a flop. (DOS is still good though!)

    I used Windows 3.0 on some machine or other (not mine) and thought that it was a big improvement on 2.0.

    I then got my 486 (33MHz w/ 8mb ram) with windows 3.1 installed! Oh-My-God it was *so* good, people talk about the shortcomings, but they either didn't use win3.1 or didn't have powerful enough machines to appreciate it properly.

    There were 1 million hacks available for win3.1 to do whatever you wanted (icons on the desktop etc.) and it was skinnable too.

    The underlying technology didn't really matter to me, I still played my DOS games in DOS and ran windows when I wanted to do something like use Word - remember word 2 folks? It's almost the same as the current word that we use today - all the elements were in place and it took first place on my machine.

    I played with a couple of linux distros around that time or just after (Slackware and a thing called mini-linux that I've never found any references to again). But they just couldn't compete for a desktop experience for me and they didn't run doom!

    Nowadays I run mandrake linux on my pc and debian (knoppix) on my laptop because I feel it's time has come.

    Look on those old windows shots with the pleasant nostalgia they are intended to invoke. Suppress the anti-M$ urge on this one!

  53. Hammers... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Truly KFG, you chose the right analogy, but to the wrong conclusion. You presumed that hammers have not transformed suddenly, and this presumption lead you to conclude by similarity that current MMI will not undergo another shocking tranformation. The question depends upon whether you believe the MMI is in a state of stasis or flux - you vote for stasis? Consider your analogy to the hammer:

    Think! Hammers haven't changed much since the days of Thor? Simply untrue!

    Basic engineering has given you a far better hammer than your pre-historic and Roman-era ancestors. Materials science has given you a longer lasting hammer and a shock-resistant grip. Ergonomics have saved callusses on your palm. Hammers are no longer powered only by the muscle of your arms, but via chemical reactions, pneumatics, hydraulics, magnetics or springs. The "interface" is no longer only a bar of wood, but a simple release trigger, or sculpted plastic, and padded rubber. Moreover, hammers no longer pound target nails only through wood, but through metal and concrete as well.

    Think. All of those advances in the art and science of hammering have occured during the last 100 years! From the perspective of the 6000 year recorded history of the hammer; the evolution of the hammer into the modern form was rather sudden - in archeological terms: a catastrophic revolution. Thor's prototypical hammer is now a shameful implement - long since been relegated to the bargain bin of history.

    Will the WIMP metaphor eventually slide into disrepute? All that is required for advance is that we apply the new technologies that we develop or discover to the MMI. We needn't jump to science fiction and direct mind control or any such imaginings: speech interfaces will occur much sooner, as will true adaptive handwriting recognition, not to mention visual and socially cued interfaces. When one of these both reaches fruition and finally clicks with the public, we will have yet another revolution, which will be as profound as the one that brought us WIMP.

    Will it occur in my lifetime, which is already over 3/4 done? No, but mark these words: those changes will come to fruition in the lifetime of a teener geek reading this. The revolution of a tool only ends when no-one asks "Will revolution happen anytime soon?", which is the necessary precursor to the demand, "I must change this." People are still asking, and thus change will continue.

    Revolution isn't done with MMI yet.

  54. tip: look for your old BYTE back-issues by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    One good source of information is to go back in your back issues of BYTE mag. circa 1981-83 (until the Apple Lisa came out). You do see that Bill's vision was to have a Multiplan-like UI, that nothing was really graphical.

    Unless I'm mistaken (do realize it's been close to 20 years), things changed completely when Apple showed him their work for the Lisa and then the Macintosh. Only then did the microserfs go graphical.

    It was not only M$ that did not grok the "graphical" thing: IBM's TopView was also essentially character-based.

    But back to my main point: for more info on this, go to those used book stores, your uncle's/father's/older brother's collection of BYTE, Creative Computing and similar magazines of the early '80s and read through them. You'll be amazed what you'll find.

  55. ^x is cut in Windows by DrSkwid · · Score: 3, Funny

    which could be very harmful

    cut - save - crash

    omg where's my work, it was there when I saved it

    --
    There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
  56. Re:silly remark by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    So XP professional (NT 5.1 as it identifies itself) wasn't meant to replace 2000 Professional (NT 5)? And I suppose 2003 won't replace the 2000 server versions.....

    Silly remark indeed.


    Not a silly remark at all. Microsoft is not aggresively selling Windows XP as a replacement to Windows 2000. Rather they are selling it as the upgrade path to the consumer line (which is the 9x series, Windows ME) and as an upgrade to Windows NT 4.0. If you wanted to upgrade Windows 2000 to Windows XP Microsoft won't stop you but it's not the market that they are aggressively seeking.

    Likewise Windows 2003 Server is not being touted as a serious upgrade to Windows 2000 Server. A good deal of the enhancements to Windows 2003 Server specifically address concerns when upgrading from Windows NT 4.0. Microsoft is not pushing this server heavily as a replacement to Windows 2000 Server.

  57. kind of true by DrSkwid · · Score: 4, Informative

    AT&T licensed Unix to OEMs and Microsoft decided to be one of them.

    Bill was a Xenix evangelist, even putting it on the desks of the secretaries if the stories are true.

    See here

    and here

    A Snippet of his 1996 speech at Unix Expo

    One of the exciting things we're announcing today is that our commitment to the Internet and to building a state-of-the-art browser extends not only to Windows 95 and Windows NT, but also to 16-bit Windows and the Macintosh and to Unix. And so, working with some partners, we've created Internet Explorer 3.0, and that's our latest, with all the active control capabilities on several Unix platforms.

    --
    There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
  58. Well... by JKConsult · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I have no idea whether Win2k Home defaults to auto-reboot or not (I'm still running 98, thank you very much), but there's obviously a reason for Server to default to it. Bosses don't really like to hear that the server was down for an hour because it hung and then waited for input to reboot, all while you were driving to work. They'd rather hear that it crashed and came back up on its own, even if that means that finding the initial problem is harder. That's what bosses do.

    Remember the old phrase "It's easier to ask for forgiveness than permission"? Well, it seems Win2k just coded it. :P

  59. Re:Yeah, but solitaire hasnt changed a Bit! by Le+Marteau · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm convinced the Solitare game is rigged... it's WAY too easy to win as compared to 'real life' Solitaire. I believe Microsoft 'stacks the deck' and makes Solitaire easy to win because lots of people learn mousing skills and have their first experiences with Windows through the Solitaire game. More frequent wins than real life means pleasant newbie experiences with Windows, giving the newbie the warm and fuzzies and good Windows feelings.

    --
    Mod down people who tell people how to mod in their sigs