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Paris, The City Of Wi-Fi?
TheMatt writes "An article at the IHT describes an effort to make Paris one big Wi-Fi hotspot. The project, with partners like RATP and Cisco, if approved, will place two or three antennae outside each of the 372 Metro stations in Paris and link them through an existing fiber network that runs through the subway tunnels.
The current pilot project is centered along the route of Bus No. 38. You can sign up for access to the pilot which is free until June 30."
I thought there was some legal issue w.r.t. WiFi in France -- that the 2.4ghz spectrum area was reserved by the French military?
I'd like to see them attempt to cover Paris with WiFi alone. That would be a feat! No fiber backbones, just wireless nodes.
You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
except, of course, on the days when the network goes on strike. (Just like the RATP.)
sulli
RTFJ.
One plus... they already have a great tower to cover all of Paris.
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It's right <a href="http://www.tour-eiffel.fr/teiffel/uk/
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Let's all just hope the thought that Wi-Fi causes cancer is bullshit LOL
X00M
I just signed up using my location as Detroit...
*That* should give the Cisco engineers something to work for...
Life is the leading cause of death in America.
I don't know how succesfull this can be... There are 2 potential markets (leaving kids with portables as a marginal marketshare)
- people of paris : why would they subsribe to such service ? They likely have a home in paris, with internet access a lot cheaper, more reliable and more secure.
- visiting bussinessmen : why would they subsrcibe either ? Most hotels have access for a reasonable fee, and are not subscription based.
Additionally, I seriously wouldn't want to sit with my portable open on a bench near a subway entrance in autumn/winter when it gets dark after 19:00. Subway stations are not exactly known for their safety, and walking around with a 2000Euro piece of electronics is asking for trouble.
Additionally, i consider it silly to first sit in the subway for 15 minutes wit haportable and no connection, and then finally getting out in the open where you have to sit again to connect. Wouldn't it be much better to put the base stations INSIDE the trains ?
Call me stupid, but my guess is that they'd better focus on appartment buildings : place a wifi hotspot on top of it, and you've got you whole building connected for low fee and without having to rewire the damd thing.
When will I end this grieving ? When will my future begin ?
I think they meant the city of WHIFF... The last time I was there, the smell of the Parisian subway about knocked me out. And I used to think that whole smelly French thing was a tasteless joke!
-A.M.
Pimpin' all the Karma Hoes!
Paris WiFi? I think this network is going to stink...er I mean suck. But seriously...is WiFi affected by massivley bad BO? ;)
/* sig */
Does 802.11(b or g) enough bandwidth to handle that many people? Not that everyone has a WiFi connection, but when you provide ubiquitious access, the applications will be created that utilize it.
I don't think that 802.11 can handle more than a handful of users before it is swamped. I imagine that the city will be subdivided somehow so that broadcast traffic from one machine isn't repeated to every node in the city.
can we call it Freedom Net? :)
Doesn't France have some really low limit on encryption? Like 48bit encryption?
Does that apply to wireless as well?
Anyone have more on this?
Obviously I agree with you. Hopefully you do not get mod-whacked by some humourless person as I did :(
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL
Umm, hate to break it to you but there was no email in the 1940s.. In fact, i dont even think they had the internet back then.
Geez, some people are so dumb
Isn't being connected to the Internet all the time sort of ... creepy?
I mean, don't even corporate execs need to get away from the World Wide Web a few minutes in the day, and just zone out while on the subway, or riding the bus?
Just because we can do it, doesn't mean it is a good idea. If Paris suffers a spike in crazy CEOs, then I say we call the trial a failure.
Saskboy's blog is good. 9 out of 10 dentists agree.
that was a long time ago - see this press release for example talking about wifi activity.
http://www.3g.co.uk/PR/Feb2003/4849.htm
Why would there be a need to "sign up", if you want to roll out public wifi, put it up and let people know its it up. This may be just for the pilot. but there should be no need for sign ups or authentication systems when they do roll this out. Public wifi has many security risks, running ethereal on a public ap is very scary. Instead of trying to lock it up, just inform people what they need to do to keep their info safe.
Look at the RATP's metro map. Unless they're planning to include all of the RER stations in that, Paris will not be totally covered by Wi-Fi. Even given a 300-metre radius, which is probably being hopelessly optimistic, you won't have full coverage the way you do with GSM wireless coverage - the stations are usually more than 300m apart, not to mention the 'shadows' created by buildings, etc. in the path of the signal.
Now, if they mounted transmitters on each wireless tower or minitower or microtower, you'd have 100% coverage of the city.
Nevertheless, it is a good idea.
Zaphod B
When duplication is outlawed, only outlaws will have
Nuff Said
I went to battle MC Escher but drew a blank
I think I'll stay with my freedom wi-fi, thank you!
-- Repeat with me: "There is no right to profits".
better hurry up and register it before they do! then sell it back for millions!!! muhahaha
Just thinking about my work I've done in Paris.. there are many times the stations are simply swamped with people. Laptop wifi is just out of the question. Far too many people and no real area to sit down. Besides, you only have minutes in a subway stop before your train comes. Even with Hibernate, my W2K box takes a while to be ready for use.
That really only leaves handheld devices, like a trusty ole iPaq. But.. with anyone with an iPaq (or laptop for that matter) probably also carries a mobile telephone - probably with bluetooth.
So in the 5 minutes you've got in the subway station, why not just go to street-level, turn on your PDA, and connect via GPRS. The iPaq with bluetooth is fantastic for downloading and running a quick scan on your email.
Plus if you really want to sit down and check your mail or surf, then zip off to a Brasserie for a coffee too.
Gare du nord now has WiFi.. I spend many hours sitting there waiting for my trains. Hey that's a great idea - wire up the trains themselves with WiFi. A Thalys or TGV with WiFi access would rock.
I can see it now: Pringles cans mounted all over the Eiffel Tower...
The hard part is finding enough French people to eat the chips.
Hey, that icon slashdot uses for WiFi stories certainly looks familiar...
Here in State College, PA I usually eat at a locally owned coffee and bagel shop called Irvings or a large regional grocery chain called Wegmans. Both places offer free wifi, the local Starbucks doesn't even offer wifi and if it did you would need to pay ~$6/hr.. If two places are of equal quality, but one offers free access, where would you go?
uhm, I've done this in Bryant Park, New York, and it was a great way to stay connected to people at home in Europe, without wires, without cost. I think that experiment is still running
http://www.nycwireless.net/
This is exactly what I was looking for as I'm going to Paris next week. There are lots of people wandering around the middle of town with laptops, sitting in the park with laptops. Of course you wouldn't be sitting outside with one in winter - however I don't really think that's the period they'd envisage most users. Using a laptop on the metro is not really a practical proposition.
Possible users?
Business travellers using one of the major stations with an hour to kill in the cafe.
Tourists emailing home.
Day trippers from somewhere else in Europe who want to email home/check the internet for something (Gare du Nord is a terminals for Eurostar).
All depends how much it costs of course. I'll definitely use it when it's free.
Is that like a TRAP but encoded in 64bit industrial-strength WEP ?
You mean USA is good for something other than breeding rednecks, hillbillies and anti-french sentiments?
Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
Gendarme! Gendarme! I'l n'ces pa a la Orinoco Gold carte de la searchimande!
2.4gHz?? Moi? Non, regardes CowboyNeal!Disclaimer - I have no idea what any of that means.
You were 80% angel, 10% demon. The rest was hard to explain. - Over The Rhine
"Math in a song is good."-Linford
THe local starbucks charges 30$ per month. HEllOOOOOO! I tend to study at starbucks, so i could easly rack up 3-6 hours a week, but im not willing to shell out 30 bucks for that, especially if im not there for a few weeks. THink aobut it, anyone who has a wireless laptop, probably already is paying for a connection at home. THis would dprobably almost double the cost of most peoples connections. I woul dlove to see figures of how the service is working, as far as subscribers.
MAybe if they went with 1$ a day, i would have used it. OR maybe a discount plan, for every 1$ of coffee you buy, you get a percentage off the 30$
All Troll + "offtopic" mods are meta moderated as "Unfair", because you abused the system.
re/read the article. There is no service on the metro. I know, i've read about this elsewhere, and that's definitely true on the test, and will probably be true for the final version due to problems with ground penetration (the wifi hotspots are above ground, stations are just a convenient location).
Faites l'amusement de nous si vous souhaitez. Mais au moins nous obtenons la connexion de WiFi pour hors des ordinateurs. Vous parole biseautZe qui au sujet de New York
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
Where they really need Wi-Fi is inside the metro tunnels. Surely they could install some leaky coax or seomthing that will make it work for the people actually travelling in the Trains.
I live in Paris (I'm not french, my work sent me here), and I have to travel the full length of Line 1 each day. The trip from Chateau de Vincennes to La Defense each day is 45 minutes to an hour, and if I could make my laptop work for that time, that would cut my workday by nearly the same amount as my travel time. I've been waiting for them to do the same thing with the mobile phones. Right now, the phones work in some tunnels, and not in others.
It's true that all the cables and fiber run through the metro tunnels, that makes it easy to hook up any building with fiber, because nothing is very far from a a Metro station. Both Cable Internet and DSL here in Paris is available everywhere.
-- -- Warning. Do not stare directly at the sun.
In addition to the networks listed in other posts, this one has been running for about a year and a half now.
If appearance and essence were the same thing, there would be no need for science -- Dr. Michio Kaku
You forgot surrender monkeys.
From the bus38 link "Hello! Be the very welcome aboard Bus 38!"
Who did their translation, Babelfish?
Trolling is a art,
a good joke about wardriving and France's military surrender history, but nothing springs to mind.
/. geeks go wardriving and are asked about it, the French would surrender to them anyway ;)
I'm willing to bet if enough
So rise up, all ye lost ones, as one, we'll claw the clouds.
I have been in contact with a friend in Tallinn, Estonia and he tells me that Tallin is full of publically accessible Wi-Fi hot spots. You can see more on this page, referenced at Wifi Free hot spots.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
Duh, I think it was a joke Fuckstick.
You forgot to mention that they play the accordion. Or is that covered by 'terrorism'?
I for one welcome our new SCOviet Russian overlords to whom all our base are belong.
What a bunck of pricks! Not you, the moderators.
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL
Of course, when network traffic gets heavy, the network just surrenders.
I wouldn't have been quite so vulgar, but the fact of the matter is that one DOES need to study the morality of a situation -- AS A WHOLE -- before diving into it. One the one hand, free WiFi sounds like a great thing to use "geek" types. On the other hand, France is not exactly in the world's best standing right now, as you note. Why do you think it's okay to discuss the former but not the latter? You might say that France's support of dictators and rejection of the principles of Christ is "off-topic" to this discussion, but I don't think so.
It's easy to be tempted by material wealth and earthly comforts, such as this WiFi network. On the other hand, that might be EXACTLY what they're shooting for -- lure in the "geeks" with this and hope they'll forget about past transgressions. I don't think this will happen. I guarantee you that the history books will have much to say about France and its actions in 2003, and I can also guarantee you that it will say nothing -- NOTHING -- about WiFi. This is a clear case of "too little too late" on the part of Mr. Chiraq.
it would make much more sense for Cisco to back a city that makes it difficult to run services. One in particular that comes to mind is Venice, instead of fighting with the waterways why not just broadcast across the city so that everyone can easily tap into the wireless access. I realize from what I've seen/read that it is more of a old world city so maybe technology isn't a high priority there but just think of what it could do to help revitalize it.
Like the software you're using?
Come on now, as a geek you should know better.
I suppose the fact that your slobbering, ape-like jingoism is off-topic never occurred to you, did it? Now that you've been corrected, please go and watch the "monster truck rally" or whatever the hell it is that you people do.
It does not surprise me in the least to discover an American who believes that Finland is part of America. :-) Okay, so I realize that Americans consider it "hateful" to point out things that were not invented or discovered in their country, but that does not change the truth.
wow, funny, big words hahaha
Hey, I see nothing wrong with sipping cappuchinos at the café, ogling at well-endowed waitresses and reading the latest slashdot article on my tablet..AND gettting paid for doing remote desktop support :)
On Fridays substitute coffee with cheap red wine.
And you really think i think ANYONE thinks that there was email in 1940? or that there might have been the internet? look whos talking fuckstick
is not done by the French. Usually, it is done by another country (recently, the Germans).
The French are good at warsurrendering, though.
I might be able to use that. Hmmm. THanks.
All Troll + "offtopic" mods are meta moderated as "Unfair", because you abused the system.
yeah, i said it.
Sorry, still doing my happy dance. Will get back to you later.
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL
This is great! They will now be able to surrender from anywhere in Paris with just a laptop!
While much smaller in scope, Atlanta, GA is receiving something similar. The folks over at www.freebeeatlanta.com are setting up hotspots in a major area of Atlanta for free use. I am somewhat skeptical of their business model, though I have high hopes for it.
Their old site mentioned possibly rolling out in other cities, as well; unfortunately, the new site is less than informative.
Software I'm using? Let's see... Linux was born in Finland, KDE is mainly an European effort. Qt-toolkit is from Norway. I'm running Galeon right now. I would guess it has some american roots in it, but usually I use Konqueror, which has it's roots in Europe. I'm also currently running VNC (born in the UK). A while ago I also used IRC (invented in Finland).
It seems that overwhelming majority of my most-used software is from outside the USA.
Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
It's gettin hot in here ...
I'm living in the Netherlands and in my hometown (Leiden) there has been wifi for quit a time now. Although a lot of progress has been made, there's still a lot of work to do in terms of building the netwerk. They still cannot compete with the speed provided by DSL connections. But one can join the project for only Eur. 100,- and since a couple of months an ISP called Demon is providing free internet access. More can be read here http://www.wirelessleiden.nl/indexuk.html
Freedom net, Liberty net? Nah, state run stuff that's free as in beer but censorded is not very free. They have different notions of freedom than we do. Come to think of it, these days we have different notions of freedom than we do. Happy Cinco de Mayo, when you can't celebrate liberty you can always drink a beer to someone else's defeat.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
The naked ones are sane?
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
The WiFi pilot at the Gare du Nord uses prepaid cards. The cheapest card costs 5 euros and provides 20 minutes of access (about US$5.65).
Who cares what france does.. What pisses me off is the lack of respect they showed the US after 150,000 of our guys died liberating that dumbass country.
That was supposed to read:
Paris, The City of Why Fight
Just another day in Paradise
all my spam will come from gay paris.
Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
if this spreads will they call it a the freedom network?
hahaha.... ha... ha... (freedom fries)
Okay Stupid (hey, you asked),
Imagine chilling out on the banks of the Seine in the long summer evenings and being connected. This is a very cool idea. Yes, I already have a fast DSL connection at home and an even faster connection at work. So what?
On another note, Paris is actually quite safe as a city. Compared to the average American city, it's amazingly safe. I have *never* felt in the least uncomfortable about whipping out my top-of-the-line G4 TiBook just about anywhere in the city at all times of the day/year.
On yet another note, NO, it would SUCK EGGS to put the base stations inside the trains. Have you ever ridden the Paris Metro? The trains are noisy, confined, and jolt you about like mad. I can't think of a worse place.
Sheesh people, if you don't know squat about the subject, don't open your yap and post nonsense. Oh wait, this is slashdot.
I'm guessing a lot of other people will pass, too. Starbucks needs to offer a one-day (or even hourly) rate before things will take off. They could use it for promotions... fill up your Starbucks card, get an hour online. That $30/mo is going to wave a lot of people off.
Mail? Put "slashdot" in the subject to pass the spam filters.
What makes you think I was talking about that software? Don't routers use software? Isn't that coded in the USA? You're also betting that not one piece of code you have has one line written by an American?
;-)
Dammit, you're not thinking geeky enough!
What makes you think I was talking about that software? Don't routers use software? Isn't that coded in the USA? You're also betting that not one piece of code you have has one line written by an American?
;-)
Dammit, you're not thinking geeky enough!
Besides, I was actually good at geography.
You could also set up a webcam pointed at the Mona Lisa so people wouldn't have to wait in line to see it.
So, as long as one piece of code - just that one - is written by an American, you now claim right to it somehow? Very impressive logic, sir. No software (or anything else, I can only assume) matters unless America was somehow involved...God bless, indeed.
shut your fucking cock-sucking hole, filthy americunt
I've claimed no right to any software. The original question was asked if America could produce anything but rednecks and such. I said we (generic we) could produce a piece of software (s)he was using. If a single line of code is American, does it not prove that America can produce software and not just rednecks? Come one now, you can't assume that I think only things that are made in the USA count. My car is a VW, made in Mexico. Most of my consumer electronics are made in China, Taiwan or Japan. I was just pointing out statement that I found logically flawed. If I made too many assumptions or miscommunicated, then I apologize. Have a nice night (as judged from New England).
For some reason I think someone going by gmontag@guymontag.com is going to recklessly search for child porn and spam people with all sorts of shit.
Have a good time, fuckface.
the best thing about computers? oh and the demos, ai, number crunching, the Internet, games, additional memory...and abstractions it puts on life aren't important somehow?
you are being unreasonable, sir...sure computers wouldn't be very geat if you have photographic memory, the ability to multiply 3000 digit numbers in base2-1024 in your head by command, and a video camera that just happens to be pointing at something interesting at all time, and the ability to be in 6 or 7 places in the world at one time so that you could get more done... sure if that describes you then mabye computers are worth getting away from. for the rest of us, there's masterca...i mean...computers.
i do think that this is likely going to be a waste of money, but this could easily be the future - you will know that you are in a human-inhabited regioin not by the smell of rotten urine and feces, [like the dark ages] but by the patterns of what would otherwise be passive electro-magnetic radiation being used and awaiting someone to conjour it up so that it could display
Debian GNU/Linux 3.0.1 wireless Zarathustra wfx 3967023 Login: _
GENERATION 26: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
I think everyone assumes they want to transmit wifi inside the subway. That is silly. :-)
They just plan to use the RATP's fiber network as a backbone for their wifis access points. Since the subway covers all the city, so does their fiber network, so does their wifi service.
This means you could get connected from any place in town, during lunch or shopping.
Paris is just a wondeful place. Now expect to see geeks playing UT2003 in the gourmet restaurants of Paris