RIAA Not Done With Jesse Jordan

digime writes "In a recent Slashdot article it was reported that 19-year-old college student Jesse Jordan gave up his life savings to the RIAA for running a campus search engine. He has recovered over 83% of his savings lost to the RIAA, and his search engine is back up. "The RIAA started yelling and tried to rescind my order of dismissal after they signed it because of comments that I made on CNN.", Jordan says on his site. "A very well-known top lawyer at the RIAA, while making threats of further legal actions, referred to himself as a 'dentist' that I would not want to 'have another visit with'"

Comments

Yeah!

[AntiOrganic]

Stick it to the man!

...so you can lose all your money again.

Re:Yeah!

[TedCheshireAcad]

Maybe the RIAA would back off a bit if most of their legal attack squad and mayhaps their fearless leader all had glorious meetings with a large bullets.

...which is exactly why organized crime families should run p2p networks.

No new CDs

[nafmo]

Well, I've given up buying new CDs because of the bully tactics from the recording industries.

Re:No new CDs

[AntiOrganic]

Hey now, the RIAA is just the Recording Industry Association of America. There are plenty of foreign labels like Century Media, Spinefarm, and Nuclear Blast that have plenty of artists to offer.

Re:No new CDs

[nafmo]

I know, but in the age of the USian megacoprs owning almost every recording company on the planet, it's hard to figure out which ones are the good guys.

If there are any. I'm not sure, it seems like most recording companies are getting buyer-hostile these days.

Re:No new CDs

[Arker]

The European companies are just as bad. Indies might be ok, but most of them are pretty deep in bed with the biggies just to survive too. I only buy from bands directly. There are actually some really good musicians out there selling CDs pressed on their own computer. Go to gigs. If you like em, buy their CD.

Re:No new CDs

[Sycraft-fu]

Just a note, a CD produced on a personal computer is a burned disc, not a pressed one. Mass produced discs are called pressed because that accurately describes their process of creation. The pits are literally stamped into the reflective layer, then the plastic coating is added. With CD-Rs you have a disc with the plastic and reflective layer already setup. However there is an additonal element, a dye added. A laser is then used to burn the dye to the reflective layer, causing it it become less reflective in the burned spots, giving the same effect to the reader laser as a pit on a pressed disc.

So, if you are speaking of mass producd silver discs, they are pressed. Individually produced discs off a burner are burned. The distinction can be an important one when you are talking about selling CDs since pressed CDs are much cheaper per unit, but have a higher minimum production run.

Re:No new CDs

[Anonymous Coward]

The pits are molded into the substrate (the polycarbonate) and not into the reflective layer. Likewise, the pits that are "burned" into a CD-R are melted into the polycarbonate; not the reflective layer.

In most cases, the reflective layer is aluminum. Some early CD-R's used gold because it was more reflective (necessary because the process of applying a precision coating of dye was relatively new and difficult).

CD-RW's use a completely different technology. The disc is "sputtered" (vapor deposited) with a sandwich of different materials that, when hit with energy of a certain wavelength, undergo a phase change making it reflective to energy at a certain wavelength. Pumping more of the "write" energy into it forces it's phase to revert to the original "transparent" state. This is what makes it re-recordable.

</pedantic>

Re:No new CDs

[Simonetta]

- I would encourage anyone interested in being exposed to new music and not wishing to give money to organizations that will use that money to destroy your life and take your property (you pay enough taxes to the federal government already) to explore the music section at their local library.
Most libraries in major cities in North America have large collections of CDs available for checkout. Be sure to check the on-line catalogs for the best stuff and place a hold or reserve on items that you are even remotely interested in.
With a resource such as this, a new approach towards musical tastes might be cultivated: make an effort to grab CDs that you have never heard of instead of those that you have been previously encouraged to consume by media exposure. In a commercial setting, your music choices are limited by your available funds so you buy and listen to recordings that you know or are similar to those you have consumed in the past, while a library has no monetary limits on your consumption. It is your attention span and the check-out-and-return procedure for the physical library materials that is the limiting factor.
Grab as many CDs as you can physically carry from the shelves and focus on titles that you have no clue as to what they sound like. Try each one in your CD player/PC for a few minutes or bring a portable CD player to the library and take a listen to the CDs there. If they are even remotely interesting, then rip, mix, and burn. Blank CD-Rs are about 20 cents (in the USA anyway) and can store about a hundred songs in MP3 or OGG format. Scan the album covers and insert books and store them in a directory along with the audio MP3s. By the way, a DVD-ROM player will rip an audio 'red-book' CD much faster and more accurately than a CD-ROM.
The CD-R is beginning to show signs of age as medium for trading new music because it is so limited in its storage capacity. Many of us have old hard drives available as we upgrade from 10-15 gig sizes to 100-200 gig drives on our primary machines. Put your favorite newly-discovered music on an older hard disk and trade these drives with fellow music lovers instead of CDs. Be sure to keep the hard disk in an anti-static bag and wrapped in bubblewrap or foam blocks to protect it against shock or bumps as they are quite delicate.
Summing up, the best way to fight the RIAA goon squads and the predatory corporations behind them is to circulate as much new and different music as freely and as cheaply as possible. This is not piracy, this is your birthright. The RIAA corporations are making a massive and bold attempt to seize and control all of the world's culture and heritage. This is like paying off the politicans for patent on air and then demanding that everybody owes them money for consuming their product!

Thank you,
Simonetta
www.nga.gov/exhibitions/2001/virt uebeauty/fantasy. htm

Re:No new CDs

[T40 Dude]

The last CD I bought was the first CD that wouldn't work with my PC's drive. That was a couple of years ago. You bought the Celine Dion CD ???

Re:No new CDs

[geekopus]

It has to do with the refractive index of the Polycarbonate. It's index is 1.4 (IIRC), so it tends to act as a little bit of a focusing mechanism. The energy density of the beam isn't focused enough to actually cause a deformation until it's traveled approximately 1.2mm (which just happens to be how thick the substrate is), and even then the material that's being heated is the dye (not the substrate; as you said, it's mostly transparent to the laser). Being pedantic (isn't that what started all this? ;-), yes, you're correct that the laser isn't directly deforming the plastic. Rather it's the dye heating that causes this. But, yes, the plastic is most definately deformed.

Here's one reference. There are probably others you can find. I can tell you from personal experience of examining "burned" CD-R's with an AFM that there are deformations in the plastic.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "pits are burned into plastic" and "the difficulty of precision coating the dye". If you don't have a nice even layer (down to a few nanometers of consistency) you can't possibly control what's gonna happen when you hit the dye with power. People have been coating things with layers that accurate for years, but being able to do every second of every day on a consistent basis is a real manufacturing challenge.

I suggest you look at a burned disk via AFM to prove this to yourself.

Re:No new CDs

[devilspgd]

Or they'll just blame pirating on continuing loss of sales, and use it as an excuse to hijack our rights even further.

Re:No new CDs

[canajin56]

Hehe
"These cars can't cost more than a few hundred dollars to make, yet you're asking for $20,000! That's an outrage! Tell you what, here is $500, I'll just take the red one now....what? Listen to me, if you want my money, GIVE ME THE CAR! On MY terms or I'll just take one for nothing! It's not grand theft auto, it's my birthright! Look, I'm not a bad person...I just don't think your prices are fair. I'm MORE than willing to pay for the car...but only $500. The ball is in YOUR c....Ummmm....hello officer....I was just.....*FEET ON PAVEMENT*"
-Trying the "I only do it because YOU charge too much" philosopy at your local Ford dealership.

Dentist... how appropriate

[Anonymous Coward]

I think it is time for someone to pull the RIAA's teeth

Re:Dentist... how appropriate

[deranged unix nut]

Where can we get a list of RIAA mailing addresses, phone numbers, and email addresses?

Re:Dentist... how appropriate

[deranged unix nut]

From www.riaa.com
RIAA Leadership:

Hilary B. Rosen, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer
Cary Sherman, President

Board of Directors
â Roger Ames, Warner Music Group
â Michele Anthony, Sony Music Entertainment Inc.
â Val Azzoli, The Atlantic Group
â Jose Behar, Univision Music Group
â Bob Cavallo, Buena Vista Music Group
â Ronnie Dashev, Maverick Recording Company
â Clive Davis, RCA Music Group
â Tracey Edmonds, Edmonds Record Group
â Dick Griffey, Solar Records/J.Hines Co.
â Zach Horowitz, Universal Music Group
â Don Ienner, Sony Music U.S.
â David Johnson, Warner Music Group
â Lawrence Kenswil, Universal Music Group
â Mel Lewinter, Universal Music Group
â Alain Levy, EMI Recorded Music
â Roy Lott, Virgin Records
â David Munns, EMI Recorded Music Worldwide
â Antonio Reid, Arista Records Inc.
â Sylvia Rhone, Elektra Entertainment Group
â Rolf Schmidt-Holtz, BMG Entertainment
â Tom Silverman, Tommy Boy Music
â Andy Slater, Capitol Records
â Thomas Stein, BMG Entertainment
â Tom Tyrrell, Sony Music Entertainment, Inc.

It is time for a major BOYCOTT

[Anonymous Coward]

And a clearly-spoken public campaign to discredit these scum at the RIAA. The "dentist" can go fuck himself. The threat by this "top" RIAA attorney is assault and he needs to be criminally prosecuted.

Re:It is time for a major BOYCOTT

[jeffasselin]

Yes, a boycott. That way, RIAA sales will go even further down, and they'll continue to blame piracy

"See it's rampant, and increasing, our sales are even lower than they were! We must have the right to destroy those evil pirates' computers"

Which will not help at all until EVERYONE gets in, and that won't happen very soon. And we still need to enjoy music, and some mainstream music is good, it's just that most of it is so identical to the last one out.

The real problem is the power of corporate america, how they can bully through legal system, how they can bully politicians and buy laws in their favor, how it takes a superhuman effort from the populace to defeat such lawsuits or stop such laws from being passed. Congressmen do not really bother listening to their own constituents (as they understand their re-election is more dependent on the cash they get from corporations than on the votes of the people they're supposed to represent), and it takes a LOT of noise to make them do so.

So you either need changes in the legal and electoral system, or you need changes in the rights of corporations. Take your pick. I'd go for some of all three. One, it's forbidden for one party to spend more on defense than the other party can afford, unless you agree to pay for both defenses upfront and cannot get it back later. THAT would deter frivolous lawsuits. Two, No more soft money and contributions are limited in proportion to the number of people living in the area, and donations from a single person is also severely limited. A corporation cannot give more than a single individual could. Three, corporations cannot bring lawsuits against individuals with whom they do not have a business relationship without prior approval from a judge.

...Teach him!

[tomstdenis]

That'll teach him that democracy and freedom runs rampant in the good ol' US of A.

What I have to question, do *AA laywers live for bad-press by the nerds of the world? Sure, people are still buying their tripe but the non-nerd part of the world will figure it out eventually. Weird....

Tom

Re:...Teach him!

[The Only Druid]

Um, this has nothing to due with flaws in the American system. If his comments to CNN violate the terms of the settlement, then the RIAA is fully in its rights to rescind all benefits from that dismissal.

Now, I am not sure - glancing at the interviews and the dismissal agreement - whether or not he's violated it or not. Frankly, thats for someone with a more precise legal background to handle than me. But thats the key issue: we simply cannot rant against the RIAA unless we first confirm that they're doing anything wrong.

thr0d ps1t

[Anonymous Coward]

One of the big problems with our legal system is that it is easy to bully someone with a frivolous lawsuit when they can't afford the time or money to defend themselves. As the defendant pointed out, a lawsuit against AltaVista would have just as much justification behind it (little to none) but they didn't go after them because AltaVista can afford to defend themselves.

Re:thr0d ps1t

[deranged unix nut]

(I am Not a lawyer, so I don't know if this is even possible, however...)

What if every (or a large number of) upset music listeners each filed an individual small claims court lawsuit against RIAA? Would 10,000 simultanious small claims court cases slow them down?

Hey, I have only purchased 50 or so CDs, so I'd be happy with $140 dollars back out of the $700 or so I have spent. :)

Re:thr0d ps1t

[AftanGustur]

One of the big problems with our legal system is that it is easy to bully someone with a frivolous lawsuit when they can't afford the time or money to defend themselves.

Exactly, some countries have 'justice system', USA has 'legal system' ...

The search engine is NOT back up

[moonbender]

The article says: "He has recovered over 83% of his savings lost to the RIAA, and his search engine is back up."

Apparently, that is not correct, as it says the following on the search engine's website (also linked in the article):

The ChewPlastic Campus Search Engine is currently available to the public as a demonstration of the site as it was. NOTE: The files listed through the results on this site are fictitious - they DO NOT EXIST. This means that you cannot download them because they are fake computers on a fake network. While there is a small assortment of files listed in the search engine, they are not meant to represent the actual assortment of files available during the Search Engine's operation.

He does, however, say "I am legally allowed to run my search engine - it is not forbidden by my dismissal. I have a first amendment right to free speech.", so maybe he intends to bring the search engine back up for real ...

Re:The search engine is NOT back up

[RickHunter]

The search engine that's up right now looks to be him thumbing his nose at the RIAA. Try doing a search for "Metallica" or "Linkin" (or other popular band names) and take a look at the results. Searching for "linux" also produces amusing output.

I approve. Very nice way to show that he's not intimidated by their legal protection racket.

Re:The search engine is NOT back up

[PetWolverine]

I liked this part:

Max allowed load:
11

Current load:
124.

Yeah, that's /. at work.

Mirror

[GigsVT]

Dismissal

I don't think Jessee will mind a mirror of the settlement PDF.

Re:Mirror

[GigsVT]

The site is getting slashdotted, here's the post from his blog too:

I have posted my Order of Dismissal (settlement) to the lawsuit filed against me by the RIAA. As stated in the settlement, I settled solely to avoid the costs of litigation. There is a very long story behind my settlement.

I am truly appalled by the RIAA's unprofessional conduct in dealing with my case. A very well-known top lawyer at the RIAA, while making threats of further legal actions, referred to himself as a "dentist" that I would not want to "have another visit with". I will not be intimidated by the RIAA - they're just going to have to put up with me.

The RIAA started yelling and tried to rescind my order of dismissal after they signed it because of comments that I made on CNN. Despite the $12,000 figure in my settlement, the other terms of the settlement were carefully negotiated over the course of several weeks.

"My fundamental view is that people should not be able to walk away from a deal they've made.", says RIAA CEO Hilary Rosen in response to California issues over artist contracts. It would seem to follow that the RIAA should understand the concept of a legally binding agreement. If an artist signs a contract and then later decides that they don't like the terms of that contract, the labels should understand now because that is exactly what they did with my dismissal (my dismissal is a legally binding agreement).

It is time to call the RIAA to task on their clear hypocrisy on many issues. I am legally allowed to run my search engine - it is not forbidden by my dismissal. I have a first amendment right to free speech. On the surface, the RIAA claims to support the right to free speech - but only when it benefits their bottom line. When their victim speaks out against them, they step up the intimidation.

They were so desperate to undo my dismissal that they were resorting to blatant lies. I have even been accused of tricking the RIAA into signing my dismissal.

Unfortunately for the RIAA, their basis for undoing the dismissal was so ridiculous that the judge didn't even take up my offer to mediate with the RIAA over their issues with the dismissal - he decided to enter the agreement.

A number of documents surrounding this issue will soon be published. For now, read my order of dismissal.

Re:Mirror

[PetWolverine]

It appears he got a slight discount. The settlement is to be paid in four installments, the first one $5000, the other three $2333.33 each.

Now, for only $11999.99, paid in four easy installments, you can run a search engine defying the RIAA!!

Re:Mirror

[Idarubicin]

The site is getting slashdotted...

Right. The RIAA doesn't intend to sue him again, or really attempt to rescind the settlement. They're just going to keep doing things that result in /. stories, and kill the kid with bandwidth costs.

How does it feel to be a puppet of the regime, everyone? ;)

I love America

[TripleA]

Keep in mind that it is companies like this, aggressive, immoral capitalists, that run the USA through their lobbying organisations. No wonder daddy's boy has also started his way to bullying the world into WW3.

Re:I love America

[jstroebele]

I think you're a bit confused, first off the RIAA isn't a single company.

Second, I think what you say about the RIAA running the US through it's lobbying organisations, is a bit over blown, but let's go with it anyway, if they can buy lobbiest so can other groups such as the EFF, at least that would level the playing feild somewhat. I would like to hear of a more successful system anywhere in the world.

I don't think "daddy's boy" is bullying the world into WW3, lets not forget who was in office when the only other major nuclar power in the world, the Russians, hastly sent tanks and troops in to Kosovo, one wrong mover there and it would of been WW3.

Re:I love America

[Anonymous Coward]

if they can buy lobbiest so can other groups such as the EFF

The problem with this is that the RIAA has money from all its member companies whereas pretty much all of the EFF's funds contributions come from donations. Furthermore a good portion of the EFF's donated resources are not MONEY but TIME, i.e. Lawyers working for significantly less money than they would in a private practice or for no money at all, interns working for free etc.

The EFF is a CHARITY whereas the RIAA is an INDUSTRY ORGANIZATION. They have very different abilities as such. Furthermore, the power of these two organizations is not proportional to the interests of people in this country. The RIAA fundamentally is a representative of the interests of the record industry, whereas the EFF is really more about representing the rights of the consumer.

Re:I love America

[kcbrown]

I think you're a bit confused, first off the RIAA isn't a single company.

No, but they may as well be. They're a cartel. The companies (particularly the large ones) that are RIAA members all act in unison, in lockstep.

Such a thing is explicitly illegal, but they have enough money that they can make the entire U.S. government forget about that inconvenient fact.

Jesse's Business Model

[telstar]

1) Get sued for $12k
2) People donate money
3) Get sued again for $90b
4) People donate hella money
.
.
5) Profit?

Oooh scary.

[paroneayea]

A very well-known top lawyer at the RIAA, while making threats of further legal actions, referred to himself as a 'dentist' that I would not want to 'have another visit with'
So wait a minute... dentists are supposed to be the ones working for you. So, it seems to me that he's saying he's not the kind of guy you'd want to hire twice. Nevertheless, his comment sounds a lot like this:
Booga booga booga!

Re:Oooh scary.

[Associate]

Better yet. Why doesn't the ADA sue the lawyer for implying there is something wrong with being a dentist?

Search engine might be "back online," but...

[AntiOrganic]

"06/19/03: The ChewPlastic Campus Search Engine is currently available to the public as a demonstration of the site as it was. NOTE: The files listed through the results on this site are fictitious - they DO NOT EXIST. This means that you cannot download them because they are fake computers on a fake network. While there is a small assortment of files listed in the search engine, they are not meant to represent the actual assortment of files available during the Search Engine's operation."

Oh, how useful.

Re:Search engine might be "back online," but...

[TinoMNYY24]

Before you get all sarcastic about the search engine being back up, consider the original article. The search engine was set up to search a large college network. What month is it? That's right, it's June. There's no school in June. The search engine wil lbe back up in August, and will be fully operational before the beginning of September. If the search engine worked right now, you'd be able to search for files in Jesse's house, and you wouldn't be able to download those files unless you were actually in his house.

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790), Letter to Josiah Quincy, Sept. 11, 1773.

Re:Search engine might be "back online," but...

[Alsee]

Oh, how useful.

Have you read the terms of use?

Terms of Use: As of January 15, by using Phynd, you agree to have your shared (non-password protected) data indexed. Do not worry, if you do not wish to have your files indexed in Phynd, just add a password to your shares. Alternatively, if you would like to be removed from the database, please use the Feedback form and I will remove you within 24 hours.

Bringing Phynd back up in "dummy mode" is a means of collecting permission to index people's files. His original case was severely prejudiced by the fact that he himself was sharing files. His case was weak because he did not get authorization to index people's files. And he did not provide a removal mechanism.

I am going to seriously oversimplify the settment here and say that it pretty much says that he can't do anything illegal and that he can't knowingly facillitate illegal downloads. If the service goes live again I assume his will honor copyright holder requests for the removal of specific links to infringing files.

This kid's got a huge set of balls flaunting his system in the RIAA's face. It all boils down to whether he got good legal advice or not. There is good reason to think the premise of the Phynd system is perfectly legal. With these minor changes he may be perfectly entitled to bring his system back up. If the RIAA tries anything he may in fact win a suit against the RIAA. Worst case the RIAA wins a hundred billion dollar suit against him and he files for bankruptcy. Not only does he have virtually nothing to lose, it would wipe out the three year $7000 debt he still owes to the RIAA. By suing and winning the RIAA could conceivably wind up getting LESS money from him than if they do nothing.

-

A Dentist?

[agentZ]

A dentist? Like in Cryptonomicon? Uh oh...

The RIAA are legal terrorists

[Tuxinatorium]

These are the folks who ashcroft should be worrying about.

Re:The RIAA are legal terrorists

[dbrutus]

They have a plan to take care of that. It's called damage caps and loser pays tort reform. Essentially, it takes away the incentive to make frivolous lawsuits. The guy wouldn't need a defense fund, and wouldn't need to settle because he'd simply go through the process and get his lawyer fees back when he wins.

Re:The RIAA are legal terrorists

[Crashmarik]

Do you have something similar from a respectable paper ?

Where's teh EFF ?

[Anonymous Coward]

This seems right up their alley... this kid was running a general purpose search engine. It indexes everything it finds. It returns results. He made no money off of it. He was intimidated into settling, pure and simple.

Can I run a search engine now? Exactly HOW are google and alta vista immune from similar suits? Simple -- they can pay lawyers who could kick the crap out of the RIAA.

It's a travesty of justice. I wish one of the multi-letter organizations would help this guy.

Re:Where's teh EFF ?

[yack0]

>Can I run a search engine now? Exactly HOW are
>google and alta vista immune from similar suits?
>Simple -- they can pay lawyers who could kick the
>crap out of the RIAA.

How? They can afford lawyers. College students can't. It's really quite as simple as that. Set the precedent in the court with someone unable to defend themselves and then you can start getting the bigger fish. The same thing happened with Divine, Inc. . Thing is, Divine went Chap 11. So whoever buys their property will do it all again. Lucky us.

Re:Where's teh EFF ?

[GigsVT]

Since it was settled, it sets no precedent.

If you want to set a precedent, you have to sue someone who can afford to appeal it up to a pretty high level, since precedent is mostly set with appellate court opinions.

Re:Where's teh EFF ?

[dipipanone]

Yeah, but the law is not blind.

No, it can definitely see the size of your wallet. The problem it has is seeing what counts as justice.

Just because it's only a search engine doesn't exempt it from the fact its primary use was to find and distribute copyrighted materials. The reason google and alta vista are immune is they're searches are not primarily used for illegal purposes.

Bullshit. The law doesn't distinguish what something is 'primarily' used for. If something has a legitimate use, then it's perfectly legal. The primary use of cigarette papers is probably to roll joints these days, but because they can be used to make hand-rolled cigarettes, they aren't illegal. Similarly, look at the recent Californian decision over Kazaa. Kazaa is unquestionably primarily used to download warez, mpegs and mp3's, but because it can have other legitimate uses, their defence against the RIAA prevailed.

As I recall, most states require a permit to own a lockpick.

If so, it's because they've passed a law requiring such. Point us to an equivalent law outlawing the use of search engines...

hmmm....

[The Tyro]

If I read your dismissal action correctly, you are prohibited from trading/transmitting/etc/etc/ad nauseum any sort of copyrighted works via your phynd service.

It also states that the "defendant shall not engage in or sell" software that encourages copying, trading, blah, blah, blah.

How are you keeping your Phynd service up again(or are you just offering it for download)? Is it your contention that your software is intended to do nothing of the sort (ie. just a tool to be used for good OR evil)? That's the only loophole I can see in that document... anyone better with legalese than myself find something different?

I'm a little confused here.

Re:hmmm....

[Wavicle]

I think your pdf viewer automatically detects and removes the word "Plaintiff's". Because what you said is true if you insert "Plaintiff's".

He is prohibited from trading/transmitting Plaintiff's copyrighted works.

The defendant shall not engage in or sell software that encourages copying of Plaintiff's copyrighted works.

He is obligated to implement measures which attempt to prevent the illegal copying of RIAA's (well their member company's) copyrighted materials. And if RIAA ever implements a system to prevent finding of this copyrighted material, he must implement it in his phynd service.

Double Jeopardy

[nuggz]

Not if you do it twice.

From Slashdot?

[Wind_Walker]

Yeah, right. Just like we're boycotting Blizzard because of their bnet.d hassles... oh wait, we ran a story on the release and expansion of Warcraft III.

Well, the MPAA is horrible and is taking away rights! But hell, here comes X-2, The Hulk, Lord of the Rings, etc.

The Slashdot crowd is all about boycotts, except when it makes life inconvenient for them. Then they'll pony up to the bar faster than... something that ponies up to the bar really quick.

Re:From Slashdot?

[jwilcox154]

Except, this has nothing to do with the MPAA, this is the RIAA we're talking about. Oh, about Boycotts, I have not bought any cds in the past 2 Years "Except, perhaps, blank CDs", I get my music in Analog form now "I.E. 8-Track, Vinyl Albums, Cassette", and not a single penny goes to the RIAA.

The problems are 1. The Teens and Pree-Teens cant "or at leat think they can't" do without the cookie cutter boy and girl bands

2. Even if everyone were to stop pirating their music, the RIAA would still blame the loss of sale on pirating. "And, I imagine the RIAA would consider my activities of copying music from an analog format to a digital format for my own personal use a form of piracy."

Re:From Slashdot?

[John Hasler]

> The Slashdot crowd is all about boycotts, except
> when it makes life inconvenient for them.

Speak for yourself. No MPAA or RIAA member has gotten any of my money in twenty years, nor have I made unauthorized copies of anything of theirs.

Re:From Slashdot?

[garcia]

and would it matter to them if we did end up boycotting them? I highly doubt it. They are not interested in the small, insignificant groups that complain about them.

99% of the population has NO idea what the RIAA/MPAA is until they get busted for downloading Spiderman Divx.

Re:From Slashdot?

[1000StonedMonkeys]

Slashdot is not a single entity.

There are a lot of people that will boycott anything that appears on yro, and there are a lot of people who don't give a flying fsck. Personally I belong to the latter. I don't think what Blizzard did was great, but WC3 was a good game and they got my $30.

Re:From Slashdot?

[minion]

Speak for yourself. No MPAA or RIAA member has gotten any of my money in twenty years, nor have I made unauthorized copies of anything of theirs

Sooo, you have large collection of disco records, and that made your life complete? =)

Re:From Slashdot?

[WNight]

I'm not boycotting Blizzard because of bnet.d, though that's not a bad reason.

I'm simply never buying another thing from a company who puts the burden of supporting their cd-check on the customer. I bought Diablo 2 from them and the cd-check always failed. Turned out it didn't like my burner (my only cd drive). I emailed Blizzard and their response was "Buy a new CD drive". Fuckers. Of course the store I bought the game at wouldn't take it back.

Later I found all this was for naught, D2 sucked ass anyways. Well, it's an expensive lesson, but I'll never buy anything they do again, and I'll tell people my story so they know what sort of treatment they'll get if they have a problem.

Re:From Slashdot?

[Qzukk]

I'll tell you what, I haven't seen X2. Or the second Lord of the Rings movie, or the new Matrix movie, or anything else in a while. Not even the second harry potter movie. Thats "haven't seen it at all" not "downloaded some camcorder rip from the net".

Sure, I think I'm missing out on something, but thats ok with me.

Related reading "The Ones who Walk Away From Omelas", Ursula LeGuin short story. Think about that when you talk about boycotting something. Some people feel that the benefits are worth any atrocity, and will just not care about the boycott.

Re:From Slashdot?

[Skiboo]

No MPAA or RIAA member has gotten any of my money in twenty years

Ever bought a CD-R?

Re:From Slashdot?

[Anonymous Coward]

Ever bought a CD-R?

As long as you buy data CD-Rs you're fine unless you're unlucky enough to be Canadian. Only audio CD-Rs get taxed usually. At least, in my state they do.

RIAA behaving like criminals

[bani]

...well, the RIAA was caught price fixing, and settled rather than face conviction, so I guess it's only expected that they should behave like criminals :)

What an idiot

[anthony_dipierro]

It is time to call the RIAA to task on their clear hypocrisy on many issues. I am legally allowed to run my search engine - it is not forbidden by my dismissal.

Ha! Looks like you fools who donated could have saved yourself the trouble and made your donations straight to the RIAA.

the law sucks..

[SystematicPsycho]

What sucks about the legal system is that anyone can make something up and file a law suit against you, and if you don't have the funds to deal with and defend the allegation then you're screwed in court.

The RIAA was probably looking to make an example out of this person(making examples out of people is what they love) and probably got unlucky with this guy. The best weapon that these guys _think they have against activity they don't like is a detterant (making examples out of people for fun and profit). They'll do it again at a time of their choosing, they've got the dough and the legal beagles to screw with you.

Lawyers are like legal hitmen, give them enough money and they'll do anything you want - desperados, got to feed the family.

move the site

[rf0]

Would not moving the site and the contents outside the US help avoid this or would the person still be responsbile?

Rus

RIAA wants search engine down?

[jakub_sad]

The RIAA has nothing to worry about, Slashdot has taken care of it FREE OF CHARGE!

Just wait..

[Lysol]

until Mary Bono - wife to the late Sonny Bono, who was the father of the blessed Copyright Extension Act - get's into office. Out with Hillary and in with Mary who called the RIAA her 'ideal job'.

Jesus, what a family legacy..

RIAA makes example of him...

[Anonymous Coward]

... he makes example of RIAA, RIAA makes another example of him, blah blah blah. Why don't they just get it over with and have one of their labels sign him to a 3 album deal - that way they can fuck him whenever they want!

Pro Bono?

[wbren]

Isn't there any top lawyer who would take this case on for free? It seems like he could fight them if someone would step up and help him with legal needs. It also seems like a great publicity opportunity...

Community insurance ?!

[teorem]

So, he recovered 83% of his lost savings through donation.
Good for him, nice of the donators !
But I don't think we ("the community") will be able to support a lot of people in its situation.
Does it mean that we (all of us) should find in our usual insurance contracts if they cover our responsibility wrt to our programming activities ?

RTFA and the previous one, and the....

[botzi]

Hello???
The guy was not violating any copyrights....
He's running a search engin, remember?He is NOT, repeat, NOT, hosting the files. Talking about search engins, there's one you should know about.... it's here.... Oh wait.... If you search for ANYKNOWNARTIST.mp3... there's a 25% chance that the robot has indexed a page with a link to the file... Well, damn those criminals, lets sue them....
As stated in a post above, the RIAA have exactly the same legal right to go after Altavista, Google or whatever.

Re:RTFA and the previous one, and the....

[teorem]

about google: looking for "revenge english band new order mp3" (revenge is a english band produced by the english band "new order", but you all know that :-).
Anyway, google is proposing on the right of the result page:
Free MP3 Music Downloads
No monthly fees. Fast downloads.
All your favorite artists available
(link to kaz..)

I find this funny.

Looks like Orrin Hatch blew up his box.

[Mordant]

'Fatal error: Call to undefined function: message_die() in /opt/chewplastic/htdocs/db/db.php on line 88'

Page Generation: 95.88 Seconds

[Anonymous Coward]

Legal Issues: Order of Dismissal
Saturday, June 21 @ 01:46:07 EDT by chew (96 reads)
I have posted my Order of Dismissal (settlement) to the lawsuit filed against me by the RIAA. As stated in the settlement, I settled solely to avoid the costs of litigation. There is a very long story behind my settlement.

I am truly appalled by the RIAA's unprofessional conduct in dealing with my case. A very well-known top lawyer at the RIAA, while making threats of further legal actions, referred to himself as a "dentist" that I would not want to "have another visit with". I will not be intimidated by the RIAA - they're just going to have to put up with me.

The RIAA started yelling and tried to rescind my order of dismissal after they signed it because of comments that I made on CNN. Despite the $12,000 figure in my settlement, the other terms of the settlement were carefully negotiated over the course of several weeks.

"My fundamental view is that people should not be able to walk away from a deal they've made.", says RIAA CEO Hilary Rosen in response to California issues over artist contracts. It would seem to follow that the RIAA should understand the concept of a legally binding agreement. If an artist signs a contract and then later decides that they don't like the terms of that contract, the labels should understand now because that is exactly what they did with my dismissal (my dismissal is a legally binding agreement).

It is time to call the RIAA to task on their clear hypocrisy on many issues. I am legally allowed to run my search engine - it is not forbidden by my dismissal. I have a first amendment right to free speech. On the surface, the RIAA claims to support the right to free speech - but only when it benefits their bottom line. When their victim speaks out against them, they step up the intimidation.

They were so desperate to undo my dismissal that they were resorting to blatant lies. I have even been accused of tricking the RIAA into signing my dismissal.

Unfortunately for the RIAA, their basis for undoing the dismissal was so ridiculous that the judge didn't even take up my offer to mediate with the RIAA over their issues with the dismissal - he decided to enter the agreement.

A number of documents surrounding this issue will soon be published. For now, read my order of dismissal.

http://jessej.chewplastic.com/dismissal.pdf

Mafia

[Esion Modnar]

More and more, I associate the *AA with the Mafia. Their real source of power is intimidation, usually through carefully chosen lawsuits against financially unprepared defendants. (First Amendment? Not if it goes against *AA interests! *AA uber alles!! Sieg heil!)

Oh, and strategically placed "campaign contributions".

If that bit about "visiting the dentist" is accurate, I hope he gets his teeth knocked out in some unfortunate freak accident with a ballpeen hammer.

Re:Mafia

[Tibor the Hun]

you mean MAFIAA

Re:Mafia

[kien]

you mean MAFIAA

Finally, an acronym to replace all the various **IA, (MP|RI)AA, etc. etc. Nice one, Tibor!

I just hope the real Family doesn't take offense. Historically, they've had much more business sense than the entertainment cartels.

--K.

Re:Mafia

[redhog]

That would be "Movie, Art and Fiction - Intimidation Associations of America"

Re:Mafia

[Zarquon]

There's an italian comedian Pat Cooper. One of his routines goes (by memory):

"Daddy, what does the N-double A-C-P stand for?"
"It's the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People."
"We're italian, what do we got?"
"We got the EMA-AIA-EFFA-IIA-AIA. The Mothers and Fathers Italian Association."
"Oh."

But no music

[Anonymous Coward]

Notice that the search engine makes you choose a file type, where mp3 is not one of them.

Looks like he is obeying the settlement.

Jordan hasn't decided fate of search engine

[mrtaco01]

I am a reporter for the Washington Times and I interviewed Jesse Jordan on Friday night and he said, "I dont think they want me to run the site anymore, but we shall see about that.It's still a question I haven't really answered, I do plan to follow the agreement."

He also explained the reason the Phynd search engine is "up" right now is so people can see how it worked and let people decided for themselves if he broke the law and so media members, like myself, can see how it worked and have a better idea of how to describe it in articles.

Re:Jordan hasn't decided fate of search engine

[ProfMoriarty]

You're right ... Jordan hasn't decided ...

We have ...

Fatal error: Call to undefined function: message_die() in /opt/chewplastic/htdocs/db/db.php on line 88

Re:double offences

[kfg]

As the other poster notes double jeopardy does not apply to multiple counts.

More to the point, double jeopardy does not apply to civil cases between litigants. It only applies to criminal cases.

Money can be argued over forever.

KFG

So, at what point...

[stinky wizzleteats]

Do our protests against the RIAA involve torches and pitchforks?

I suppose I should be somewhat pleased that they've given up all pretense of rational public discourse. No one would consider their points valid in the context of a dentist comparison.

Dentist? More like Proctologist!

[JonTurner]

Because nobody knows as many assholes as an attorney for the RIAA.

??AA Needs nose thumped

[buss_error]

"The RIAA started yelling and tried to rescind my order of dismissal after they signed it because of comments that I made on CNN.", Jordan says on his site. "A very well-known top lawyer at the RIAA, while making threats of further legal actions, referred to himself as a 'dentist' that I would not want to 'have another visit with'" It's obvious that RIAA is upset because now the object lesson of their terror campaign isn't projected the properly meek and submissive attitude to the world.

Sounds like another SLAPP suit on the way.

To those that are still buying RIAA music or MPAA movies, how does it feel to be part of the problem, jerk?
To those that are not buying RIAA music or MPAA movies, feels good being a small part of the solution, doesn't it?

Donations

[rmohr02]

It seems Jesse has recovered much of his life savings through donations. He has a paypal link on his site (unfortunately I can't give the link to you--it uses post). If you want to donate, go here, sign in/register, and send money to jordaj@rpi.edu

One of the other college students sued by the RIAA, Daniel Peng, also has a paypal donation page.

Blizzard Boycott not a total loss

[varebel]

For what it's worth, back when WC3 was released, me and about a half dozen of my gaming buddies were discussing what next game to all invest in. We had narrowed it down to Warcraft 3 or Neverwinter Nights. After explaining to everyone what was going on and how Blizzard were being pricks over the whole bnetd project, we settled on NWN.

Six sales Blizzard lost. Certainly not even a scratch in their sales. But, the point is, some people do take boycotts seriously.

Hey, I would love to play WC3. But, I am strong enough to resist temptation, even if the hypocrits that you point out aren't.

There's a whole lot of media I just do without..

[dentar]

I don't even bother anymore. There's nothing on CD that I even WANT. I'm an old fart now, and don't much care for their content anymore.

I also don't much care for CNN / MSNBC / Faux News, so I don't watch them anymore either. I've also quit watching clear channel stations.

The news, and musical artists, are both manufactured now, nothing's real anymore.

"The artists"

[Lemmy Caution]

What the have in common, also, is something that really pisses me off - they always invoke "the artist" and the artists rights when they pull this crap. The Sonny Bono act was touted as a victory for, exampled, Harold Lloyd, the silent film star whose films were going to go into public domain. He's been dead for years, but it was being treated as his victory because his grand-daughter would be able to restrict distribution of his old films, and make a profit on them.

The idea that "the artist" - which is really a misnomer, since the term should be "whoever happens to own the rights to a work" - has some God-given right to perpetual profit from and control of their work - is untenenble. I certainly don't: I do my work for hire, and if I want more money, I have to do more work. But the Bonos and the RIAA and MPAA seem to think that an "artist's" granddaughter not having to work for a living is more important than an open society and a free discourse about the cultural works in it.

Great job guys

[dankinit]

Cost of tuition for one semester: $2,000
Fees and settlement from lawsuit: $15,000
Having to deal with a /. attack on top of everything else: Priceless

Fair is fair

[AndroidCat]

...which is exactly why organized crime families should run p2p networks.

Great, organized crime on both sides of the fight, that would be interesting.

RIAA.org

[dema]

What's up with theRIAA website? I went to the main site and it downloaded that has some jibberish and says "HTTP/1.0 302 Moved Temporarily ". Same sort of thing happened with other pages within. Strange.

Re:RIAA.org

[Loosewire]

NewsCo *The RIAA tuesday cleaned up at the Loosewire Awards ceremony. A glitzy event held on skid row, they walked away with the Most hacked website award, the Most Hated Organisation award and hilary Rosen the ugliest woman award, in an interview after the show she said "I dont know what these awards are for but thanks anyway" to much laughter and applause.... *
- thats how it would be if i had a news channel :-)

Legal Ethics violation

[bear_phillips]

"A very well-known top lawyer at the RIAA, while making threats of further legal actions, referred to himself as a 'dentist' that I would not want to 'have another visit with'"

Could this be an ethics violation? Each state bar association has its own ethics rules. It could be possible that making threats like this, threating to rescind a lawsuit etc.., could be an ethics violation. Especially if it was done without any legal basis and only as a threat. It might be good to file an ethics complaint with that states bar. It might not get him punished, but it would probably be a thorn in his side.

A law professor of mine was a US attorney. He said that when they had a case against a mafia figure, the mob attornyes would ALWAYS file an ethics complaint against the prosecutors. The complaints always proved false, but they would show that the mob was willing to fight hard and would sometimes shake up the government attorney. Having an ongoing ethics investigation could prevent an attorney from getting a new job, promotion etc.

IANAL

Re:Prepaid legal service is a must nowadays

[jerdenn]

Yup, and you'll get the absolute minimum service required. Do you really believe that you'll get a zealous advocate under this plan? Just like with Doctors and HMOs, there will be financial incentives for your attorney to minimize time spent on your case. Its likely that you'll be encouraged very strongly to settle. I'd also research your policy for possible exclusions, etc.

Frankly, my opinion of pre-paid legal is that it is a scam. (And I use legal services fairly often, too...)

-jerdenn

Re:There's a whole lot of media I just do without.

[Tumbleweed]

> I don't even bother anymore. There's nothing on CD that I even WANT. I'm an old fart now, and don't much care for their content anymore.

Exactly.

"Everybody knows Rock attained perfection in 1974. It's a scientific fact!"
- Homer Jay Simpson

Don't get yourself so worked up, grandpa. :)

What he said on CNN...

[PetoskeyGuy]

Click here for the Transcript

This is proof of how sleazy the RIAA is..

[Newer Guy]

"My fundamental view is that people should not be able to walk away from a deal they've made.", says RIAA CEO Hilary Rosen in response to California issues over artist contracts. It would seem to follow that the RIAA should understand the concept of a legally binding agreement. If an artist signs a contract and then later decides that they don't like the terms of that contract, the labels should understand now because that is exactly what they did with my dismissal (my dismissal is a legally binding agreement)".

This quote from his webpage says it all... The RIAA obeys the laws when it benefits them...and flouts them when it benefits THEM!. It's only too bad that they have such deep pockets with which to bribe Congress. Their arrogance will prove to be their undoing in the long run though. Only freaks like Orrin Hatch will be left once that happens..and frankly I think Hatch is so far out on the lunatic fringe that he's more a liability then an asset for them these days

New ways to screw with the RIAA?

[GuNgA-DiN]

I just noticed the RIAA put up a new site. One feature they added is the "How to Report Piracy" page here:

http://www.riaa.com/issues/piracy/report.asp

" For those who want to contribute an ounce of prevention, RIAA is making it easy, and potentially lucrative. In August of 1999, RIAA launched its CD-Reward program that provides monetary awards of up to $10,000 to an individual who provides the association with information regarding CD manufacturers illegally producing RIAA member company sound recordings.

Consumers, retailers and replicators can report any suspected music piracy to the RIAA by dialing a toll-free hotline, 1.888.BAD.BEAT, by faxing this Badbeat Form, by sending email to cdreward@riaa.com, or visiting the website at www.CDReward.com."

So, let's get to it! I see a 1-800 number, an email address, and a fax number(1-202-223-8322). What could we possibly do to tie up resources and cost them money? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.........

Re:At least some in the Mafia

[AndroidCat]

In the Mafia, if you break the code of silence, the worst they can do is kill you.

The RIAA can play That Achy-Breaky Heart over and over and over...

If you want to help w/ article, email me!

[mrtaco01]

Any and all /.ers who wish to put their two-cents in, e-mail me at mrtaco@nmo.net ASAP. I will need phone numbers where I could contact you tomorrow morning/afternoon. I never planned on making this another "human interest" piece. I just wanted to explain what the RIAA says he did wrong, what he thinks, what the technology behind it, etc. Basically, take the technology behind this and put it into real world language so the everyday reader can understand it. I'm open for comments/suggestions/etc. But let's not tie up /. messageboards with this, so PLEASE e-mail me at mrtaco@nmo.net with all comments related to my article.