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Novell Nterprise Linux Services Announced
eer writes "At BrainShare (Novell's customer/developer conference), Novell customers reacted positively to the news that they would have the choice of running Novellâ(TM)s network services on Linux or NetWare or both. Today the company provided more details by introducing Novell Nterprise Linux Services, which will give customers file, print, messaging, directory and management services in an integrated package that runs on the Red Hat Enterprise Linux and SuSE Linux Enterprise Server distributions--along with providing those customers with comprehensive Novell technical support, training and consulting services for Linux. Partner companies, including IBM, HP, Dell, Red Hat and others, also voiced their support for Novell's Linux."
Excellent move by Novell. Basically they are showing two fingers to SCO and their silly legal moves. Ours is one of the many asking novell for providing linux support for a while. And we are glad to see it arrive finally.
Buy a vowel.
"And this is my boy, Sherman. Speak, Sherman." "Hello." "Good boy."
I thought that they named it Novell NTerprise, and were setting themselves up for litigation.
You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
At BrainShare (Novell's customer/developer conference)...
How many brains do they have to share between them?
http://twitter.com/onion2k
And, if i'm reading this right, we can have files under linux too!
In your face SCO!
Unlike SCO who just cries fowl when they realize that they are not going to make it. Novell knows that for Servers Linux is where the money is and they are now (A little late) putting some effort into it. The last time I looked at a Novell System was 4 years ago. But it ran a modified version of MS DOS. Although it was a pretty stable system. I always thought if they just port their tools to Linux they can have a good competing system now and actually get new customers and not just hang on to their current base.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
More great stuff from them.
... can anyone challenge GroupWise?
I have seen many people put Novell down recently with all the SCO crap going on. But the truth is, they really do make great stuff that nobody can compete with (right now). Linux/Sendmail/mySQL is great (I use it a lot) but everything from Novell is just easier to deploy (flame bait).
I mean
Now this is an important step for Linux! To have integrated file, print, messaging, directory and management services on Linux is something sorely needed. Way to go Novell!
I'm not sure about that. Can you imagine if Novell had announced this 2 years ago? Linux lovers would have praised them, but no one else would have taken them seriously because so few people took Linux seriously. It would have been another questionable product/marketing move from Novell.
Now, however, Linux has tons of mind share, and we also know why Novell got involved with the SCO train wreck.
--madgeorge
What we really have is a repacement for NIS+
If Nterprise uses an alternate file ownership scheme with network ACL's, I'm all for it!
You think that I'm crazy, you should see this guy!
I've always been a fan on Novell. I cut my teeth on Netware 3.12, and was always impressed with it's stability (plus, it's lack of virii, ever hear of a Novell virus).
Once you got to Novell 4 and 5, you were able to manipulate very large scale networks, with thousands of users, something MS barely does (one PDC?) and Linux not at all. It makes me laugh when Linux Zealots talk about replacing corporate networks with Linux servers, and the largest network they've administered is 3 Pentiums and a Pentium II for playing Doom.
Yeap, one big step for more Linux in real, corporate networks.
A. Rightmann
Boy have you been left out in the cold. I think IPX has been left out since 6.0 and an option since 5.0.
"that runs on the Red Hat Enterprise Linux and SuSE Linux Enterprise Server distributions"
Kids! Never trust any product with Enterprise in the title unless it comes with batteries and has a light up deflector array and real torpedo and phaser sounds.
On a similar note, if a website ever uses the acronym "SME" even semi-seriously then you should avoid that assiduously too.
graspee
http://forge.novell.com/modules/news/ a SourceForge repository of Open Source stuff for Novell. RSYNC, Apache, bash, gcc etc.....
Consensus is good, but informed dictatorship is better
I mean, just a couple of weeks ago, Novell was trying to put SCO off of Linux by claiming ownership of key UNIX Copyrights. With this announcement just made - I would think they were trying to keep SCO at bay so that they could come out with this new product announcement and not have a certain amount of uncertainty about it from the Industry. After all, they have been developing this software for years ... yes years! There's a lot of money tied up in this.
It all makes a little more sense now. I'm glad they finally embraced their services on Linux though. I always like the Novell File Services!
The truth is usually just an excuse for lack of imagination.
The United States' second largest bank, universities, hospitals, county and state governments.
Yeah, people still use it.
integrated package that runs on the Red Hat Enterprise Linux and SuSE Linux Enterprise Server distributions
...
I can't wait to see a version of Novell's package for OpenLinux, or even UnixWare+LKP
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
Will this run on a 'consumer level' version of RedHat? If not, why not?
The problem is, this ain't gonna be cheap, especially if you buy one of the enterprise Linux's mentioned. Novell's got to make it extremely convenient for their existing sysadmins and Linux/UNIX sysadmin's too. Unless Novell does something miraculous, both groups will need to be retrained for this product. Novell admins will have to learn Linux and Linux admins will have to learn Novell. The Linux admins are going to scream why should I learn Novell when i can use NFS/NIS/LPD or Samba and Novell admins are going to scream why should I learn Linux when i can just use Netware. Sounds great, but they're gonna need to overcome one of their traditional weeknesses - MARKETING!
Slashdot, the site where everything's made up and the points don't matter
I can't see this as being anything as a "good thing".
Used to be, the reason why you bought Netware was to do thse these things:
1. File Server.
2. Print Server.
3. Administration of 1 and 2.
For a long time, Novell had the best of 1 and 2 - and with their directory services, they weren't matched. I loved using Novell's admin tools. They were usually easy enough to get in and do what you want, and powerful enough to do all sorts of other things. You could set up rights, trickle them down or stop trickling, take care of email stuff - right there in one nice interface. Sure, it wasn't perfect - but compared to the compeition....
The problem came with Linux, and people realized "Hm - do I need to spend this much for a file/print server?" They web server offerings in my humble opinion stank, and I never really liked Groupwise that much. It could do a lot of cool things, but other simple things that I would have expected were beyond it's grasp.
So I see this as a Very Good Thing for Novell. In a way, they can be like Apple, only for the Server world on Linux. Apple's OS X's strength is that you can do all the cool Unix stuff you want - without having to do anything Unix-y to get it to work. You can crawl under the hood if you like or just sit at the dashboard.
I'm browsing through the Novell offering, and here's what I'm hoping for:
1. A kick-ass admin tool like thier old NWAdmin.exe tool. Start making plugins for things like Sendmail, Postfix, Apache - whatever. Go ahead and charge for the plugins so we can just sit back and go "click, click, click" and get stuff done rather that going "Hey - what was the setting in Apache for turning on directory indexing!" (Yes, I know what it is, thank you, move on.) Sure - there's stuff like Webmin that can do this, but Novell's Admin tool was still (IMHO) cooler. And with drag and drop, the directory style layout, and being able to click on a user and get all info right there would be most excellent.
Make it Java based so I don't have to run it off of Windows. (What the hell was up with that, anyway? I could never figure out why Novell couldn't make an Admin tool for their servers that didn't run on Windows - granted, the last Novell I really used was Netware 5, so don't sue me if things have changed.)
2. You can have multiple Linux servers out there, and instead of trying to figure out your LDAP settings and that, just install the software, start the admin, and say "These Directory users have these rights on this box on this directory" - click, click, click - you're done, have a nice day. This was something promised with eDirectory, but I'd like to see it really hardcore delivered.
With this, merge the strength of Linux's "no license fee" with Novell's admin/directory tools. I want to have a server I can throw 5, 500, 50000 users on and not worry about licensing - and I just pay Novell for the user interface and tools. I can even see paying Novell like their mass server license - I pay for how many concurrent users I have on the system, unlimited servers. (So, for example, I can have 500 servers out there, and if I only need a 5 user license, I just pay Novell once for 5 users to administrate the boxes.)
I think if Novell plays their cards right and goes for the "administrate, authenticate, and authorize" bit for Linux services, they can work with Linux to make a lot of money, and make Linux so Admin Friendly as to keep pushing that other desktop/server OS out of the market.
Of course, I could be wrong. But... isn't it nice to dream....
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
Novell customers reacted positively to the news that they would have the choice of running Novellâ(TM)s network services on Linux or NetWare or both
In other news, IBM announced they'll give their customers the chance to run OS/2 on AS/600.
-- No sig today
This is cool news, and definitely a step in the right direction. Their ZENworks package already relies on Linux to support workstation imaging. You can create boot disks/CDs to install the support partition on the client PC for imaging operations. Parts of ZENworks are written in Java (actually runs under a virtual machine on the Netware box), so moving them to Linux would probably be fairly trivial as well. Looks like they made a couple good choices back then that will pay off in the future.
Except Bordermanager, which blows donkeys IMO.
Maybe it does blow donkeys, but I've got it as an http proxy for 1,000 simultaneous users right now - I think that's pretty darn good. And it used to crash a whole lot, but it was a hardware problem - 45 days up, and climbing fast. So sad that so many of those users are looking at pictures of...
People... blowing... donkeys?
Christ, these internet logs scare me. Over 130 MB/day, too.
When you think about it for a moment, companies more than likely don't support Linux because it's technically superior to what's out there or costs less. Beleive it or not, it's true.
Why does IBM support Linux? So they can sell more consulting, hardware and software, their bread and butter. How about Dell? More hardware, more choices of consumer OS. How about HP? Same as IBM. What about Oracle, Veritas, WebLogic and Novell? To sell more of their software.
I'm not saying Linux is the best solution for every need, but I'm not saying it's the worst either. Just keep in mind when you see companies cheering on Linux it may not be because it's Linux, but because it can provide more revenue for the company's products that produce the majority (or all) of their revenue.
The only good reason to use Novell is it's BULLET PROOF file system with proper file access control and the excellent file undelete utility SALVAGE though other companies have caught up since the last time I used Novell as a Sys Admin in '98, I've yet to see any other x86 network OS with a standard utility like SALVAGE which can undelete files regardless of the application which deleted them.
It's worth the thousands it cost for the licenses when the research dept deletes a days worth of work which hasn't been backed up yet while tidying up their server files.
Try undeleting a file on an NT server which was deleted by a DOS client or a Windows application file browser... ouch painfull.
Those files in the NT recycle bin are only there because the app e.g. Explorer put them there not by the OS.
Is there any reason for anyone to consider using it...
Here are a few reasons:
With ZenWorks, you can lock down a users' W2K or XP workstation, deploy/install applications and printers without leaving your desk and remote control their PC if they are having a problem (technical support).
With groupwise, you have all the functionality of any other Enterprise level Email system. With the security of GroupWise, you have less worries with some of the Virus' that can plague many of the MS Email systems.
The Directory Services of Novell is far superiour of any other company's, mostly because it is more mature (going on what... 9, 10 years now?). Novell's eDirectory can handle about a billion objects in the Tree. Maybe more now, I am not sure
Of course, Novell NetWare runs pure IP or a mixed IPX/IP environment if you want. Since 5.0, NetWare has had IP natively.
It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.
Who cares! Linux doesn't need Novell, or Microsoft for that matter.
I earned my Novell CNE (Certified NetWare Engineer) back in 1996, and since then watched Microsoft's Windows NT steadily eat away their market share. Novell succeeded back in the 80's and early 90's because they filled a need. It didn't matter that their support was bad or their marketing non-existent, because at one time NetWare was the only game in town. But they lost their market share to Microsoft because they did not improve their support or their marketing.
But times have changed. Microsoft may be the leader now, and although they do a good job of marketing, their support is awful, mostly because their products are bloated piles of spagetti code. I ditched working with NetWare because I can do everything and more with NT, and then I ditched NT because I can do everything and more with Linux and can support it or make changes without things blowing up. Linux will never have the marketing that Microsoft has, but it doesn't need it because word of mouth and an ever improving product is the best form of advertising.
Sorry Novell. Sorry Microsoft. You treated guys like me who paid thousands of dollars for your certifications like crap for years, so we left and decided to write our own. Linux doesn't need Novell or Microsoft to succeed in the long run. Anyone who says different hasn't worked in the industry long enough.
Ruby on Rails Screencast
Obviously you've never been aware that Novell has been equipped with Phasers for years.
When Apple becomes Unix and Novell becomes Unix should we really be referring to them as "competing OSes" anymore?
If all I'm doing is providing body panels and upholstery I'm not going to be calling myself an auto manufacturer.
TW
It seems that Novell is really and truly dedicated to the OSS community. I didn't know until I looked at their page, but Novell is offering a Linux certification, the CLE (Certified Linux Engineer) apparently somewhat equivalent to the LPI cert (at least that's what they recommend for studying), but also including Novell Nterprise services for Linux.
This has got to be the smartest marketing Novelll has ever done. (Any of you familiar with Novell know how absolutely BAD they are at marketing). I actually have a renewed interest in Novell products, and I may just dust off my CNE cert and hang it on my wall proudly, rather than hiding it at the bottom of my underwear drawer where no man but me dares tread. A CNE and a CLE might look nice together on a resume.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. It's just that yours is stupid.
Hey, Novell had the most fine-grained access control and nicest directory services implementation. Don't know if that's still the case with Active Directory around, but I'd really use Novell on Linux to do file and print services for Windoze boxes rather than Windows 2000 or 2003. I've also heard it scales very well. It came a bit late but it's still a great thing. With SCO spreading FUD around, the timing of this release proves that Novell trusts the Linux platform, so their release may add a plus of credibility as well.
I would be shocked if Microsoft didn't have a large groups of people studying Linux; they may very well have their own internal distro. Considering that M$ needs all the security help it can get, NSA would be a good base for such a thing.
The real goal of M$ Linux would be to take concepts that work and port them back to Windows, so as to reinforce the monopoly in the places where it is crumbling. They might try to use marketing magic to bring some of the NSA credibility to Windows, although they are a long way from having a product that would remain secure long enough to make the effort worthwhile.
Microsoft is a mature IT company. They have to hold onto Windows because any other technology will cannibalize their revenue stream faster than new customers can replenish it. They face a dilemma in that competitors are free to bring their Linux submarines to periscope depth and launch torpedoes at the M$ battleship.
There may be a point in the future when some other technology undercuts or outperforms Linux and the Red Hats of the world have grown to a size where they can't adopt the new stuff without killing their existing base.
There is a poll on the page with "what Linux distribution do you use". Debian got a lot of votes (more than SuSE). As RedHat and SuSE Enterprise Server software doesn't come cheap, I suggest that people who like Debian should go vote. Maybe Novell will support Debian as well. Think about it -- the platform OS will come at zero cost.
Does anyone wonder how personal biases get introduced into business decisions? Maybe when people decide to completely disregard all products from a company for no reason other than their ignorance of those products.
Just to prove it, go look at the capabilities of the DirXML product from Novell. Then I can explain how our HR department processes a new hire and DirXML automatically creates the network account, portal account, email account and gives access to all appropriate backend systems seamlessly. And then it keeps everything in sync.
Actually, this is the second time Novell has ported the Netware core services to Linux. The first time, it was when Caldera had just started and Ray Noorda (ex Novell CEO) was heavily involved. They released "NDS for Linux" for the then-current Red Hat Linux 6.0, with great fanfare. It worked well; your Linux box was basically indistinguishable from a native Novell box on your network. Which, at the time, was a valuable and worthwhile feature.
I spent some time selling and installing these boxes to small businesses because they could seriously undercut the price of native Netware. They ran well on RHL 6.0, but got flakier on 6.1 and 6.2, and broke completely on 7.0. Novell/Caldera never upgraded or patched. Every time I called or talked to them at a trade show, they would tell me that a new updated version was right around the corner and should be out any day now. But it never happened.
That was FOUR YEARS AGO. Four years and not a peep or whistle or so much as a security patch.
Why should we trust them now?
-Graham
Does anyone wonder how personal biases get introduced into business decisions?
The most bigoted person I've ever met in my thirty year career was a Novell MCSE. He makes old VMS zealots look like OSS proponents. This guy is so slobberingly in worship of Novell I swear to $DEITY he's just a breath away from strapping on a vest full of C4 and walking into somebody's Microsoft server room.
You are British, yes?
North Americans are more efficient. We only need to use one finger.
If you don't want to repeat the past, stop living in it.
Ummm, last time I checked, Novell eDirectory 8.7 (NDS), eGuide (web LDAP lookup tool) and DirXML worked very nicely on Red Hat 8.0. And that was TWO DAYS AGO!
I'm sure that many of you regarded this news with a muffled yawn. But this is really good news for me. I've been supporting NetWare for a decade now. I actually install new NetWare networks. That's right, new. I've been using and installing Linux for a couple of years as well. With each new NetWare release, I've needed to evaluate if it's worth it to me to maintain my CNE and Gold status. But business keep coming to me for NetWare expertise.
Now I can have the best of both worlds. I actually prefer to work with Linux. NetWare can be frustrating, but it's bulletproof when it's setup correctly. Linux seems to be more forgiving in many ways. Plus the wide variety of software for Linux (there are, what, 6 different widely-used MTAs alone?) means I can accomplish more with the platform.
This news kept my largest NetWare client from moving to all-Windows servers. The client had been intrigued with Linux, but didn't feel comfortable using it in production. Now they won't have a problem with it. In their eyes, Linux is ligitimate now. I'm sure they aren't the only ones.
the no
I think the problem with a lot of linux tools for implementing "enterprise" solutions is that they tend to require that the admin know every little detail about each component technology in that solution. in an ideal sense, this is good because it encourages learning. in the realistic sense, it means that a potential convert ends up saying "Fuck this noise" and reaches for the fuzzy-feely-pointy-clicky thing that proprietary vendors will happily sell them. sometimes you don't want to have to memorize the ldap spec just get a centralized account/auth database up and running.
A teeny little bit of hand-holding (and a teensy bit less scorn and patronization) would go a long way to lubricating linux's deep, deep penetration into the enterprise, especially among mid-size businesses.
pr0n - keeping monitor glass spotless since 1981.
Well if we take the directory alone, then:
- Scales to millions and millions of objects
- Supports just about every method of accces, including LDAP, JDBC, ODBC, C, C++, Delphi, Visual Basic, Java, JNDI, SOAP, DSML, RADIUS, HTTP, SSL, XML, PHP, Perl, etc
- Is 100% standards, ie. TRUE LDAP v3 not like AD
- Has builtin, fault-tolerant automatic replication and synchronization
- Runs on Linux, Solaris, AiX, Windows, and possibly HP-UX in the near future
- Can be managed through a Java GUI Admin tool or a -very- cool Web-based portal called iManager
- Integrates with just about anything, including operating systems, databases, applications, HR systems, etc
- Has true inheritance
- Has granular access control
- Is secure
- Supports web services
- Is a mature product in its ninth+ generation
- Used by customers such as the French Tax Authority for 30 million users
- and the Star Alliance which includes Lufthansa and United Airlines for global identity management
- and CNN.com for personalized Ad banners on a huge scale
- is used more than any other directory in the market
- Can manage users, groups, applications, printers, desktops
- Is supported software
In other words, because nothing else comes close. Sure, you can probably think of some alternatives but anyone who does a technical evaluation will tell you this is THE directory to use.Now, do yourself and the company you work for a favor; get familiar with the products and then form an opinion. It's the professional thing to do. The geeky thing to do. The right thing to do.
-- .sig you would know what to do with it?
Like if I gave you a