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OpenOSX Provides Virtual PC Alternative
lucas.clemente writes "OpenOSX has just announced a cheap alternative to Microsoft's Virtual PC for Mac OS X, OpenOSX WinTel. What's more, the OpenOSX version will be compatible with Apple's new G5 architecture, whereas Virtual PC users will have to wait until the next major upgrade for G5 compatibility." It's a frontend to bochs, which we've discussed before as a possible Virtual PC replacement, and the biggest obstacle seemed to be getting it up and running. Perhaps this product will fill that hole. Prices start at $25 for download, but it is covered under the GPL.
Cool. BTW before anyone asks. Yes you can charge for GPL software.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Bochs needs a front end for Linux too!
BTW... Is anyone out there using Bochs?
Karma: The shiznight, mostly because I am the Drizzle.
Bochs is so much slower than Virtual PC that I don't consider it an alternative at all.
Getting Windows 95 to run acceptably on my last comouter was impossible in Bochs, and oh so easy in VPC.
Just wait for a VPC update. I'm sure you won't have to wait for 7.0.
Also, I refuse to use software from OpenOSX. All they do is recompile popular software, then put it on CD for you for silly amounts of money.
I.E. - Want GIMP?
Step 1) Download and install fink - http://fink.sourceforge.net
Step 2) % sudo apt-get install gimp
OR
Pay OpenOS X a whole bunch of money.
"The software on this CD is distributed under the GNU General Public License and the OpenOSX WinTel License."
The only link on the page I can see to anything about a license is a link to the GPL
I have no idea what the actual software is released under. They currently do not seem to have the OpenOSX WinTel license available yet to look at.
This looks interesting, though. Almost enough for me to install it.
- (c) 2018 Hank Zimmerman
Before you post something about them not abiding by the GPL by charging for their software, I suggest you read the GPL FAQ.
Ok, so this new alternative may not be as fast as Virtual PC. But you know what really impresses me? Look at how quickly an alternative to this Virtual PC problem was produced. Five years ago, it would have been "eh, it's just Mac. Screw 'em." But the G5 just came out and there's already an alternative to a problem. Perhaps it'll keep Microsoft on their toes. Perhaps other developers will go "damn, we best be writin' some stuff for them too." It's refreshing to see developers rushing to fill the void so quickly.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts...for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang
1 As said before, bochs is extremely slow. Their own page does not even recommend that you install Win2k or XP.
2 This project is not new. It has been around for I don't know how long, at least a few months. The only new thing is support for the G5.
3 It is suspected that this organization is ripping off compiled binaries from Fink without giving credit. Read about it in the Fink FAQ.
It would be much more useful for someone to create an OS X port of qemu [http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/] and wine [winehq.com] and post it somewhere. Both of these programs have very good things said about them, as far as performance and stability, but I don't know how well they work on OS X.
Can I make my Mac run the LoveSan virus?
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They Are Vermin Feeding On Each Other's Feces.
I Hate \.
Robert Atlee was one of the founders of this company, and provided a substantial part of the initial equipment and funding. He is listed on the contact page rather unprofessionally as "terminated." I spoke with him on the phone about three months after he footed the bill for the double-wide booth that Jeshua Lacock ran at MacWorld. He was rather upset at the time that Jeshua had basically skipped town with a bunch of his computer equipment and had locked him out of the web server etc. I'm sure that every story has two sides, but at this point in time, not only Mr. Atlee, and Christoph Pfisterer, but also myself have received poor treatment at the hands of Jeshua Lacock, the sole proprietor of OpenOSX.
Slashdot doesn't probably have the budget that professional news sources do, so we can't expect all of the stories to be double or triple cross-checked. My guess is that if you start asking around (tax records? employees? better business bureau?), you'll find that few others have genuinely benefitted at the hands of this opportunist. The MacGIMP project helped to fund GIMPCon 2003. Has OpenOSX EVER given back to the community that built the software it sells?
One of the first rules of polite public behaviour is to give credit where it is due. Jeshua has attacked my reputation and left a rude web page up with my name on it (after numerous requests to have it taken down) and upset a very good open source developer (Chris Pfisterer) and has managed to con his business partner out of the equipment it took to get everything he had started. Make up your own mind, but I refuse to do business with someone who has managed to offend this many reasonable people without having made any visible efforts whatsoever to set things right.
FYI this product has been out for well over a year(I bought a copy last December I believe).
Before I bought it I downloaded Bochs. I am no ubergeek, so I didn't even get past compiling it.
It works. First I ran Linux on it, then got DOS running, then Win95. It works. It works. It's slow. It works. Compared to spending hundreds of dollars to buy Microsoft's Virtual PC, this is magical. (plus, they have nice bundles where you can get open-source Office, GIMP, and other such programs together for very nice prices... yes, I am a newbie and I don't want to use Fink anymore)
tilTrue.info contechtext.info prettypowerful.info twitter.com/frets fb.com/prosody
I've been using Windows emulators on Macs since the "beginning" and have 4 licenses for VPC currently, but we use them on laptops, where it would be inconvenient to bring along a PC laptop AND a Mac laptop just to have access to more than one platform. For desktop use, one can add a PC for not much more than the price of VPC + OS and, if space is a problem, as it is for me, build an inexpensive Athlon PC with a Shuttle case and put in a KVM switch to keep to a single keyboard and monitor.
We have 3 shuttles with 2400+ processors, 256MB ram, 80GB drives, running Windows 2000 Pro. We already had flat panel monitors which the iBook users mirror when sitting at a desk, so it was simple to place a KVM between their external keyboard/mouse and monitor. The cost of the box was less than $400 each and that included an OEM Radeon 9000 Pro in each of them, which is not really necessary for standard 2D work as they come with decent graphics built in for modest 2D work.
I just don't see the gains for running VPC on a desktop Mac considering the low price of PC hardware; but for a laptop, it's really handy and since there's not much chance of a G5 laptop anytime soon, we can hope there will be a workable solution when and if the G5 architecture comes to Powerbooks.
I'd rather run Bochs for free (or at worse, very cheaply) that pay significantly more to Microsoft for crippled future releases of VPC to ensure that performance sucks (even after the architectural differences are taken into account).
Look, I loathe and distrust Microsoft as much as the next guy, but--what incentive do they have to cripple Virtual PC?
Microsoft profits from the sale of Windows for Virtual PC in the same way it profits from the sale of Wndows for actual x86 hardware.
Microsoft may very well sell other software products that run under Virtual PC at the same rates they sell those products for actual x86 hardware.
Apple is only the enemy of Microsoft because Apple hardware a) doesn't run Windows and b) exemplifies an alternative to Windows hegemony. But,
It seems to me that if some application is capable of running Windows and Windows applications aptly on the Macintosh platform, this turn of events is only in Microsoft's interest.
I mean, they have no real hope of "crushing" the Macintosh platform -- there are too many addicts, Apple is far too liquid, and people just plain hate Microsoft. Virtual PC provides them a way to continue to profit from Apple.
You'll have to scroll down a lot to get to the actual interview.
Fink Relations with OpenOSX
Note: This page represents the view of Fink project leader Christoph Pfisterer. Other people, including other Fink project members, may have different views.
Here's the story of the relations between the Fink project and OpenOSX. It is unpleasant, but I feel that is has to be made public.
OpenOSX is a business that sells a range of CDs of Open Source applications. The GIMP CD they sell is based to a large part of Fink 0.2.1. Until very recently, the OpenOSX web site made no mention at all of Fink, and as far as I can tell, the CDs themselves still contain no hints. My impression (and that of many others) was that OpenOSX did all the porting - which has now turned out to be wrong.
I was never contacted by OpenOSX about their usage of Fink. Instead, I was notified of the situation by a third party. What followed was a rather unpleasant e-mail conversation with OpenOSX owner Jeshua Lacock. The net result? We almost broke into a flame war and OpenOSX has slightly modified their web site to cover their tracks. They still don't have the courage to openly say which parts are their work and which parts aren't. It also appears they don't want to cooperate with the rest of the Mac OS X Open Source community, and Jeshua doesn't feel like responding to my mails as promised.
I encourage everyone to read the e-mail exchange that led to this and judge for themselves. (Be warned that it's quite lengthy, though.)
-Christoph Pfisterer
Copyright(C)2001-03 TheFinkProject
Last changed by chrisp on Thu, Aug 23 2001, 05:44 GMT
How hard can it be to get something to add a link to fink's web-site?
Like pulling teeth when Jeshua Lacock is involved.
PS: Did I miss something about using Links in /.?
Now if only I had a PPC emulator for i86 Windows, then I could run mac OSX on top of my WINE running on Linux Running on Boch running on OSX. I could then have it running mac Classic and emulate my 68000 processor that emulated my Atari 6502.
Finally I'll fire up a web browser, kick back and re-read Nick Bostroms "you are almost certainly living in a simulation" web page.
The only problem would be not knowing which window to close when I was done.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
Here's a solution:
Get a beefy Apple machine that meets your needs (new dualie G5?). Get it with more than one hard drive. put LINUX (I prefer Gentoo to get the optimizations I like) on it, install MOL (Mac On Linux) and make up raw disk images for any Mac OS systems you want to try out. MOL works really well, and it can handle multiple concurrent instances, IIRC. And while you won't have graphics _acceleration_ the overall speed is comparable to classic (about 95% of normal speed) because it's NOT an emulator, it's basically VMWare for the PowerPC.
I use MOL to play A-10 Attack on OS9 when I get overbored.
"Sometimes, I think Trent just needs a cup of hot chocolate and a blankie." -Tori Amos on Nine Inch Nails
This is a much better solution than VPC, IMHO, considering that you can buy a really cheap Windows box and every application runs natively this way.