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Archos Recorder + Rockbox Plays Video

elinenbe writes "Rockbox, the open source firmware for the Archos Recorder, Player, FM, Recorder V2, and now the Neo can play grayscale videos at over 60FPS. A demo version of the DOOM3 intro along with a few other sample clips have been made so far. This is the Archos that was NOT designed for movies, but for MP3s -- go Rockbox!"

92 comments

  1. what can i say by da2 · · Score: 5, Funny

    COOL! this brings a whole new level of mobility for porn

    1. Re:what can i say by insmod_ex · · Score: 1

      Agreed. Anyone want to reencode my lesbian collection. Over 60GB of DivX. :D

    2. Re:what can i say by m1chael · · Score: 0

      yeah, because laptops are too bulky and take up too much lap space.

      --
      I know you are psychotic, but please make an effort.
    3. Re:what can i say by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Porn Magazines have been around for about 50 years

    4. Re:what can i say by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Anyone want a girlfriend? Two more just became available.

    5. Re:what can i say by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      new?

      i hate to break it to you..
      but opera for series60 and gprs..

      well you should get the idea, i just wish i would have had that army.

      nice work though!

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    6. Re:what can i say by Unregistered · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      If you whip it out on the subway, i'll cut it off.

    7. Re:what can i say by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Old news! I remember "back in the day" making the HP48 play porn sequences.

      I didn't exactly go to the extent that these guys have as you couldn't update the firmware on the 48. I just wrote a program to convert frames of an MPEG into the HP bitmap format and generate an associated RPM program to play the frames. I used the serial link cable to upload all the generated files from the computer to the HP.

      I think I tried playing the other typical geek fetish videos of that era too like looped raytraced animations. You know the ones: spinning chrome spheres on a checkerboard floor? That type of stuff. :)

    8. Re:what can i say by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Last year in high school I put some porn AVIs on a SD memory card and watched it in class one day. It didn't look that great, but it was much better than listenign to my all too liberal teacher rant, and my friends sure got a laugh.

    9. Re:what can i say by hyperventilate · · Score: 1

      The ZVUE is releasing their inexpensive DivX in mid January. For $99 plus the cost of a big SD card you get a solid state player with good battery life. They are also releasing a bunch of legal licensed video titles that are professionally encoded.

  2. All I can think of is by MC68040 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    .. "that's neat, but if that would have been a standard feature everyone would have said it sucked", on the other hand as it's not designed to play video, it's neat alright.

    Go non-corporate developers.

  3. LCD Response Time by zalas · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Is the LCD on that thing supposed to be able to keep up with 60fps? I mean, I don't think they were designing the LCD on the MP3 with Video playback in mind...

    1. Re:LCD Response Time by MrBlue+VT · · Score: 4, Informative

      Actually according to the site, they've been working on high performance blits for the LCD screen. Thus they have sped up the refresh rate significantly over the original Archos firmware.

    2. Re:LCD Response Time by zalas · · Score: 5, Informative

      But increasing the blit rate is still not going to do you any good if the LCDs can't physically "turn on" that fast. All you're going to get is a blurred mess.

    3. Re:LCD Response Time by Goldfinger7400 · · Score: 1

      They're probably just using one of the plethora of grayscale lcds on the market, rather than designing their own "slower" lcd because they don't need the extra response. I don't remember where but I saw a website where you can just buy screens used in the myriad of consumer electronics, they have a pretty good refresh rate so they can be used in more applications, like Gameboys and whatnot.

  4. Not so big by evilspyperson · · Score: 4, Funny

    Lots of things are used for purposes other than its original. DUCK TAPE ANYONE!

    1. Re:Not so big by maelstrom · · Score: 3, Interesting

      s/DUCK/DUCT/g

      --
      The more you know, the less you understand.
    2. Re:Not so big by tds67 · · Score: 0
      Lots of things are used for purposes other than its original. DUCK TAPE ANYONE!

      Q-Tips (cotton swabs) is another one. Fun to 'root' around in your ear for ear wax, but not officially recommended.

    3. Re:Not so big by ashot · · Score: 1

      thats not what they're for??

      --
      -ashot
    4. Re:Not so big by DanThe1Man · · Score: 2, Informative

      thats not what they're for??

      No, if you look at the package you will never see anywhere listed for putting it in your ear. They avoid law suits that way when you cause damage to your ear drum.

    5. Re:Not so big by Mwongozi · · Score: 1

      In the UK, and possibly other countries, duct tape is sold under the brand name "Duck".

    6. Re:Not so big by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you don't need the '/g' in there.

    7. Re:Not so big by ibmman85 · · Score: 1

      funny thing is alot of tests have been with duct tape and found that its really not very good for using on ducts...

    8. Re:Not so big by martin-boundary · · Score: 1

      s/DUCT/RABBIT/g

    9. Re:Not so big by eatdave13 · · Score: 1

      Somebody just learned regexes... I'm so proud :)

      --
      "Verbing weirds language." -- Calvin
  5. Nice one by TwistedSpring · · Score: 5, Informative

    I love people pushing the boundaries of hardware, but also I note that Archos have already made a sexy new device to accommodate your movie needs:

    http://www.archos.com/products/av300_series.html?s id=j22oyjykb2y3ckjbyjj24j#cinema_to_go

    80 hours? Yeah right. Does it do DivX? No doubt a firmware hack will allow that :)

    1. Re:Nice one by evilviper · · Score: 1
      Does it do DivX? No doubt a firmware hack will allow that :)

      I'm quite doubtful of that actually. I haven't yet seen firmware that will make a cheap DVD player play MPEG4 files, so it's not always as easy as a firmware update.

      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    2. Re:Nice one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yes, it does play DivX. I've got one, and they play both Divx 5 and Xvid 4. Quite nice, actually.

    3. Re:Nice one by tadheckaman · · Score: 2, Informative

      I have a Archos Multimedia jukebox... it can play divx files that have been resized to fit on the screen (comes with the program to do it, too), along with the audio being mp3... took me an hour to yank the AC3 audio out and encode it back into an mp3 format... ah, what I will do to keep my home video backups accessable... ;)

      I really do like it though, nice bright screen.

      --
      My potato gun was confiscated by the United Nations. They said I wasn't allowed to have weapons of mash destruction.
    4. Re:Nice one by Leto-II · · Score: 2, Funny

      took me an hour to yank the AC3 audio out and encode it back into an mp3 format... ah, what I will do to keep my home video backups accessable...

      Yah I just hate that too... Sometimes I think my home AC3 encoder is just too much of a hassle.

      --
      Do not anger the worm.
    5. Re:Nice one by tadheckaman · · Score: 1

      HAH, I had to bookmark that! :)

      --
      My potato gun was confiscated by the United Nations. They said I wasn't allowed to have weapons of mash destruction.
    6. Re:Nice one by borl · · Score: 1

      DivX/XviD? This one does. http://www.archos.com/products/prw_500521_specs.ht ml

    7. Re:Nice one by way2trivial · · Score: 1

      I have one- it REQUIRES divx

      --
      every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
    8. Re:Nice one by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The AV3000 was hacked by Dogger, The moment he released his work Archos got funny about it and made him take it down. avos.sourceforge.net

  6. Does Archos play non-evil formats? by Thinkit3 · · Score: 1, Interesting

    That is, vorbis or FLAC? Are the video formats patent-encumbered? There's no need to use Evil formats when Good ones are out.

    --
    -Libertarian secular transhumanist
    1. Re:Does Archos play non-evil formats? by The+Human+Cow · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Apparently the hardware decoders are not immediately able to play vorbis or anything other than MP3, and the processor is too slow to allow software conversion on-the-fly. That said, they're still working on a way to do it.

      --
      The Human Cow - bringing you scrumtrelescence since 1995
    2. Re:Does Archos play non-evil formats? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh for god's sake kill yourself.

    3. Re:Does Archos play non-evil formats? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      come my pretty, come to the dark side... Muwahahaha

    4. Re:Does Archos play non-evil formats? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the archos has a HARDWARE mp3 decoder. and a hitachi HC11.

      sorry :(

    5. Re:Does Archos play non-evil formats? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      From Rockbox FAQ
      17. You mention supporting Ogg Vorbis and other file types on your list of ideas. What is the status on that?

      Pessimist's Answer: At the current time we believe this is not very likely. The Micronas chip (MAS3507) decoder in the Archos does not natively support decoding and there is very little program space in the player to implement it ourselves. The alternative would be to write a software decoder as part of the Rockbox firmware. However, as much as we love our players, the computing power of the Archos (SH1 microcontroller) is not fully sufficient for this need.

      Optimist's Answer: We can play any format if only we can write code for the DSP to decode it. The MAS 3507 (and 3587) are generic DSPs that simply have MP3 codecs in ROM. We can download new codecs in them and we will be the first to celebrate if we can get OGG or FLAC or anything into these DSPs. Unfortunately, we have no docs or tools for writing new MAS DSP code and Micronas is very secretive about it. If anyone can help, please get in touch!

      The recent release of Tremor (integer Ogg decoder) indicates it uses around 100 KB for lookup tables. That's not unreasonable for a decoder, but we only have 4 KB for both code *and* data. So the grim reality is that Ogg will never be supported by the Archos Players and Recorders.

    6. Re:Does Archos play non-evil formats? by gunpowder · · Score: 1

      According to the IRC logs of last week some guy claims that he has access to the neccessary docus, but the rockbox-developer don't even consider looking at it, unless they get official permission to use it. They just want to get sure that they don't break any (ie. DMCA) laws.

    7. Re:Does Archos play non-evil formats? by TerryMathews · · Score: 1
      --
      -- Terry
  7. RockBoxx is a OSS posterchild. by bjarvis354 · · Score: 5, Informative

    I can attest to the superiority of the RockBoxx firmware. The list of features keeps growing when other commercial vendors would have stopped implementing new features. I use RockBoxx for its great handling of VBR MP3s for instance.

    I only hope the RIO Karma team is listening! I just bought one for my girlfriend and I plan to get one once my archos gets dropped too many times.

    1. Re:RockBoxx is a OSS posterchild. by Jad+LaFields · · Score: 1

      RockBox is great. I bought an Archos about 8 months ago because it was more than $100 dollars cheaper than an iPod at that time, and RockBox has made it usable. I hate trying to work with my friend's Archos as he still has the original firmware. I consider my inability to convert him to RockBox to be my worst failing in the open source zealotry field, worse than the number of people I know who still are using IE instead of Firebird. Some day I should just steal it from him, install the software myself, and let him see what he's been missing.

      RockBox is also a great example to use when explaining the concept of open source software to "normal people". I've noticed that if you talk about Linux most get hung up on the fact that someone's "giving it away for free", but if you describe how sucky the Archos firmware is and how these guys just wanted to make it better and set it up so others could help them and then give it away for free because who the hell's gonna pay for new firmware for an MP3 player (although donations are accepted, I'm sure), then they get it.

      --
      [SIG] It's like putting a moose in the blender -- a recipe for disaster!
  8. Archos Jukebox Multimedia by rf0 · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Well it would be nice if there was firmware for the Archos Jukebox Multimedia but speaking to the people who devloped Rockbox they said that its just to hard. Have to wonder why. Oh well its all fun

    Rus

    1. Re:Archos Jukebox Multimedia by lou_soyur · · Score: 1

      The fact of the matter is that none of the developers (myself included) own a Multimedia unit to work with. The possibility is always there, but for us, right now the _need_ isn't there.

  9. DUCK Tape by tds67 · · Score: 0

    No need to search and replace, because I think DUCK is a brand name for duct tape.

    1. Re:DUCK Tape by SweetAndSourJesus · · Score: 5, Informative

      Here's a fairly good bit on the Duck vs. Duct argument.

      --

      --
      the strongest word is still the word "free"
    2. Re:DUCK Tape by thynk · · Score: 1

      Interesting page, thanks for the link. However... there is a mistake on the page. Duct/duck tape is NOT the same as 100 mile an hour tape. There is a lot more that is different than just the color. Oh well, can't win 'em all.

      --

      Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment.
  10. Impressive. by The+Human+Cow · · Score: 4, Insightful

    As cool as this sounds, you really can't appreciate what these guys have done until you see the video running. It's far more watchable than I thought at first. Now to figure out how to convert video to .rfv for some late-night porn^H^H^H^HDivX viewing!

    --
    The Human Cow - bringing you scrumtrelescence since 1995
    1. Re:Impressive. by DarthWufei · · Score: 1

      Nice to see you, THC, and I'm just as happy as you are. Time to load these files on my Archos and test it out. I swear, Rockbox is one of my favorite open source projects. They never cease to amaze me.

  11. Re:rockbox by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yo Darwin!

  12. Rockbox == great!; Archos == questionable by jbs0902 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I have been a long time evangelist for Rockbox. They have really made the Archos a wonderful device. Far better than the official firmware.

    That said, the quality assurance portion of Archos has really gone downhill. My local BestBuy stopped carrying the Archos due to too many returns. My old Player (6GB) is sound as a pound, and about as heavy. But, my FM Recorder (20GB) is an unmitigated POS. It has had a lovely clicking sound (HD, I assume; however, I returned it and had the HD replaced. Still clicks. Archos Return-guy said they were getting a ton of returned FM Recorders) And, the FM Recorder will occasionally go into a "never-ending reboot" cycle. Where it partially boots, then reboots, and repeat, until after being left alone for a few hours it decides to work properly. So, the FM Recorder (out of 90 day warranty) is now treated with kid gloves as a home stereo MP3 player, and the old Jukebox is for the car and airplane. Someday I'll replace the HD in the Player.

    So, Archos is nice, if it works. Looks just like a USB HD without any needed proprietary software like the other HD MP3 players. I just suggest you stick with the Player or plain-old Recorder and avoid the FM Recorder. If I had to do it again, I'd still get the Player but the SliMP3 (or newer) would work better than what I use the FM Recorder for.

  13. s/DUCT/DUCK/ by Da+w00t · · Score: 2, Interesting
    What, you've never heard of Duck Tape? Maybe he prefers the name brand over generic brands.

    Get a load of all the uses for Duck Tape:
    --

    da w00t. mtfnpy?
  14. I Love my FM Recorder by Rob+Riggs · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Your experience with the FM Recorder does not match mine. My FM/R has been rock solid. The battery lasts long enough to handle the Denver/Tokyo flight. The drive does click on occasion, but I have to hold the thing near my ear to hear it -- or be recording with the built-in mic. It's barely audible. The FM/R has been with me on 10-12 transatlantic/transpacific flights and has never had a problem. I take the thing everywhere in my briefcase and use it as an external drive at home and at work. It's even been dropped a number of times. Never a problem.

    The thing I like most about the FM/R is that I can recharge the it from the USB port. The charger that was shipped with the unit was a real POS and fried the first week I had it. I've never missed it.

    The RockBox upgrade is a must though. These guys have done an awesome job.

    --
    the growth in cynicism and rebellion has not been without cause
    1. Re:I Love my FM Recorder by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      testimony 1: rockbox fm version has problems. user offers hearsay evidence about the number of these fm versions being returned.

      testimony 2: a single user decides that his single experience should be weighed and measured. "my fm rockbox is good"

      well by all means, let's all fucking rush out and buy them.

      not

  15. A better idea by plinius · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Clearly what is needed is not another tiny hard drive-based video player.

    What you people should be doing is hacking one of those DVD-based video players with the 10 inch screens, adding a USB port or something.

    Future PDAs will be converged devices, with phones, cameras, and DVD....at least until MRAM arrives.

  16. great stuff on that site by The+Tyro · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It was the first place I got the hardware mod instructions for my old 6gb archos mp3 player (nothing like having a 20gig version before you can even buy one in the store).

    Somebody else mentioned it... the charger that came with the archos really was a POS... the wires frayed on mine, and I ended up cutting them and attaching spade connectors (yeah, I know... unsafe, but it was all I had at the time). Soon after that, the transformer went out entirely, and now I have to change batteries.

    Oh well... at least it survived a longish SW Asia military deployment for the afghanistan war (wish I could say the same for all of our equipment).

    --
    Even if a man chops off your hand with a sword, you still have two nice, sharp bones to stick in his eyes.
  17. Re:Rockbox == great!, but get the right Archos! by gunpowder · · Score: 3, Informative

    Yes, there are some (design) problems with Archos FM Recoder.

    Probably the most important one is that you can't change the (Li-Ion) batteries. And unfortunately Li-Ion batteries degrade after 2-3 years due to a chemical process, regardless how often you use/recharge the batteries. Look at your mobile telephones, and you know what I mean ...

    BTW, this problem also affects the Archos 'Recorder V2' (which is basically a FM Recorder without the FM Radio) and the Apple IPod and actually most MP3 Players/Jukeboxes. Don't buy anything that doesn't use ordinary, replaceable AA(A) NiMH-batteries, otherwise you can throw your MP3-Player away after 4 years.

    The best (Archos) choice is an old Archos 'Recorder 20', (without FM or V2) which is powered with 4 AA-NiMH-Batteries, graphical b/w display USB 2.0 and Digital/Analog IN/OUT and builtin-MIC. Unfortunately they are rather difficult to get these days, as they were the predecessor of the FM-Recorder and are not officially sold by Archos anymore.

    N.B.: the 'Studio' Series is basically a 'Recorder Light', with only USB1.1, no Digita/Analog IN, no MIC, and only a text display (no graphics).

  18. MOD PARENT(S) UP!!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    this could enable ARCHOS players to play OGG, WMA, FLAC ... not only MP3!!!!

  19. Do It Yourself by meehawl · · Score: 1

    What you people should be doing is hacking one of those DVD-based video players with the 10 inch screens, adding a USB port or something.

    Every time the great Rockbox guys get a mention on /. there's always some poster who tells them to go do something that the poster is more interested in.

    If it means so much to you then why don't you go do something with one of these DVD players? Nobody's stopping you. The Rockbox code is even GPLd so you can start from there.

    This is analogous to what happens when people post in cool hacks for old 8-bit pcs, or for tiny web servers, or for bizarre WiFi rigs. Sometimes people just do stuff because they already have the hardware, they know it well, and it gives them a buzz.

    --

    Da Blog
    1. Re:Do It Yourself by plinius · · Score: 1
      Sometimes people just do stuff because they already have the hardware, they know it well, and it gives them a buzz.

      That's quite true, I've thought about numerous "useless" projects myself, like screwing around with my old 386 laptop.

      My point however was, ultimately things are leading to convergence of portable devices. We can wait for industry to do it, or we can "have fun" beating them to it.

  20. Reverse Engineering by meehawl · · Score: 2, Interesting

    some guy claims that he has access to the neccessary docus, but the rockbox-developer don't even consider looking at it, unless they get official permission to use it.

    Why not use the old, tried-and-tested method of clean-room reverse-enginering? Recruit several people with no Rockbox programming exposure to look at the documents and write their own version of the specs, noting entry points, API calls, and so on. Get them to publish the documentation using some version of the GPL. Then fire them, put them out to pasture. Ensure they never communicate directly with any of the Rockbox programmers regarding what they read.

    Then get people who have never read the original documents to create code implementing the published doduments.

    Because of increasing restrictions on reverse engineering in the US, the document analysis team should be based in the EU or Asia. Or preferably Russia or China.

    --

    Da Blog
  21. What is an .rvf file? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Because that's what the movies are...

  22. Duck Tape, from Duck Products. by syukton · · Score: 1
    --
    Reinvent the wheel only at either a lower cost, greater effectiveness, or your own personal enrichment and satisfaction.
  23. and version 2.1 was released too! by eshefer · · Score: 1
  24. Let's see you do THAT with your fancy iPod by smcdow · · Score: 1
    Rockbox is the main reason I went with Archos instead of getting an iPod. AFAIK, there is no way to write your own software for the iPod. I spent a couple of evenings reading the Rockbox source code, and it's put together very well. With the new plugins architecture, it's very easy to write your own modules for it.

    This thing really, really rocks.

    Rockbox is an Open Source replacement firmware for the Archos Jukebox 5000, 6000, Studio, Recorder, FM Recorder and Recorder V2 MP3 players.

    --
    In the course of every project, it will become necessary to shoot the scientists and begin production.
  25. Re:Rockbox == great!, but get the right Archos! by adolf · · Score: 1

    Why throw it away when the batteries wear out? Just buy new ones. Lithium batteries aren't terribly rare these days. The replacement process looks at least as simple as swapping screw-secured AA's on my 3-year-old kid's toys.

  26. Re:Rockbox == great!, but get the right Archos! by gunpowder · · Score: 1

    Yeah, ONE company that is specialized in manufacturing custom batteries. Do you believe they will still produce this batteries in 5 or even 10 years? I seriously doubt it.
    Not to mention that you propably don't have this possibility for no so popular MP3 players!

    And come on, $69 for a battery? 4 AA (2300 NiMH) batteries cost FAR less than that, and you still be able to buy AA batteries for the next 20 years.

  27. Not quite... by haraldm · · Score: 1

    Not exactly on a 1.5"x2" screen. That makes for about 0.3" tits -- in black and white, that is.

    --
    open (SIG, "</dev/zero"); $sig = <SIG>; close SIG;
  28. i can back this up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    my FM Recorder was just sent away for warranty.

    the hard drive does click occasionly, and it is noise.

    for mine, the audio output jack broke, and it doesn't charge anymore.

    and i treated mine like gold, didn't misuse it at all.

    great system otherwise though.

  29. Re:Rockbox == great!, but get the right Archos! by adolf · · Score: 1

    Naah. You've got it all wrong.

    That's ONE company specializing in selling "custom"[1] batteries to end users. They're actually manufactured by God-knows-who in some far-eastern sweatshop, just like almost everything else small and toxic that we buy these days.

    No matter. $5 says that the Archos battery is not anything of any remarkable uniqueness, anyway. The greatest involvement Archos had in the design of this battery was the shape and color of the plastic shell that it comes in[1]. Otherwise, it's just an off-the-shelf part from a catalog, much like the LCD, hard drive, microswitches, DSP, and other comprising hardware. Like these other generic parts, this particular battery is probably used in a number of different products.

    Another $5 says that they (Archos) switch suppliers for all of these parts depending on who's got them cheapest today, and/or phase of moon.

    Alas, it might not be very easy for you or I to locate a good overseas source of such a battery. Which is why we pay an importer $69[2] to do it for us and write up instructions. If your time is worth something, it's probably a good deal. Otherwise, there's bound to be cheaper suppliers (and methods) if you're willing to look for them.

    1: Do you really think a small company is going to tool up a factory and start making specialized lithium batteries for their miniscule market? Niet.

    2: Of course this costs more than a few 2300mAH AA NiMH cells. It's also more convenient[3][4].

    3: You do realize that lithium batteries are lighter and more space-efficient than NiMH AAs, don't you? This translates directly to extra space in your pocket.

    4: And don't say "but I can carry several 2300mAH AA NiMH battery sets and have several times as much runtime!" Who cares? If I'm removed from my usual surroundings long enough that I'm afraid my batteries will die, I'll just plug it in while I sleep. (You do SLEEP, don't you?) This means I'll have to have charging gear, which consumes space, but then so do AAs. If you really want to save space, standardize on USB as a charging system for all of your gear[2]. Plug it into the wall, or the car, or even the laptop (if you want to borrow some juice from another big-honkin' Li-ion battery). Do the same with your phone, or anything else that can charge from 5 volts. 2 cables and 2 adapters instead of at least 4 combination units and a USB cable to accomplish the same.
    USB is, dreadfully, not going away anytime soon - one might as well use it for something.

  30. Re:Rockbox == great!, but get the right Archos! by gunpowder · · Score: 1

    I'll try to answer some of your questions and comment on some of your statements:

    No matter. $5 says that the Archos battery is not anything of any remarkable uniqueness, anyway. The greatest involvement Archos had in the design of this battery was the shape and color of the plastic shell that it comes in[1]. Otherwise, it's just an off-the-shelf part from a catalog, much like the LCD, hard drive, microswitches, DSP, and other comprising hardware. Like these other generic parts, this particular battery is probably used in a number of different products.

    Certainly the Archos Li-Ion is not a very special or unique battery. But it is nothing you can get at the supermarket either. Exaclty what you implied: it is not a off-the-shelf part.
    BTW, did you deliberately skipped my question whether this/these companies will still produce the replacement batteries for the Archos in 5 or 10 years?


    1: Do you really think a small company is going to tool up a factory and start making specialized lithium batteries for their miniscule market? Niet.

    Usually s.o asks a question, and expects it to be answered.
    Anyway, of course I doubt that aswell. But that's why there are standards you can follow/implement. Or form an alliance with a larger company.


    2: Of course this costs more than a few 2300mAH AA NiMH cells. It's also more convenient[3][4].

    How is it more convenient for the customer to have to order batteries if they are broken? Or even not being able to replace them at all? I'd rather like to be able to go to the shop around the corner to get replacements, at a cheap price.
    And by the way, you can't make up an new argument by simply referencing other arguments.


    3: You do realize that lithium batteries are lighter and more space-efficient than NiMH AAs, don't you? This translates directly to extra space in your pocket.

    And you realize that Li-Ion are practically useless after 3 years?
    And that Li-Ion batteries can't be used in all applications where NiCd and NiMH-batteries can be used (Heavy-Duty)? IMHO I consider the idea of using Li-Ion batteries in MP3-players not to be a very good one, at least for most cases!
    Li-Ion batteries *have* their advantages, but they cannot replace NiMH in every area.


    4: And don't say "but I can carry several 2300mAH AA NiMH battery sets and have several times as much runtime!" Who cares? If I'm removed from my usual surroundings long enough that I'm afraid my batteries will die, I'll just plug it in while I sleep. (You do SLEEP, don't you?) This means I'll have to have charging gear, which consumes space, but then so do AAs.

    You really don't understand why somebody uses battery-powered portable devices, do you? BTW, this also applies to non-rechargeable batteries: to be able to travel without the need to connect to a power socket. And they would prefer if they could do that as long as possible.
    Sometimes you just don't have the possibility to recharge batteries for a couple of days, and that's when replaceable batteries come handy.

    If you really want to save space, standardize on USB as a charging system for all of your gear[2]. Plug it into the wall, or the car, or even the laptop (if you want to borrow some juice from another big-honkin' Li-ion battery). Do the same with your phone, or anything else that can charge from 5 volts. 2 cables and 2 adapters instead of at least 4 combination units and a USB cable to accomplish the same. USB is, dreadfully, not going away anytime soon - one might as well use it for something.

    I'm not primarily interested in (USB) charging systems, or that the device is the smallest and lightest possible when looking for a portable device. It's nice if it has these features, but the most important part is that I can use it (does the job), and use it while travelling, and use it as long as possible!

    If I have to open the device to replace batteries, since

  31. Re:Rockbox == great!, but get the right Archos! by adolf · · Score: 1

    And by the way, you can't make up an new argument by simply referencing other arguments.

    You must be new here.

    I'm not primarily interested in (USB) charging systems, or that the device is the smallest and lightest possible when looking for a portable device. It's nice if it has these features, but the most important part is that I can use it (does the job), and use it while travelling, and use it as long as possible!

    The only application I can think of where recharging is not an option while one sleeps, is while backpacking. I'd hasten to say that "batteries for the MP3 player" would fall a bit short of being on the list of things to carry on my back for a few weeks, but maybe my priorities are wacked.

    That said, if size really isn't as important as replacable batteries, just buy a battery holder of reasonable shape and capacity, and plug it into a modern Archos. Might be good to remove the existing Lithium battery to save power loss as heat if it should try to charge it, too. And since the wide, flat battery compartment consumes very little space, you've still got a fairly small portable.

    Fasten it together with duct-tape, velcro, epoxy, needle and thread, or whatever suits your fancy. I'd probably craft something out of stainless. YMMV. whatever.