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Stores Use Discount Cards To Notify Of Recall
crazyj writes "USA Today is one of many sources running a story about how some supermarkets used their "discount" shopping cards to notify customers of a beef recall. Interestingly, some stores did not use the information because they felt it violated the customer's privacy. I always use a fake name and address when I sign up for those, but do others feel that the stores were justified in 'violating' their privacy agreement?"
Is it really invasion if the store where they signed up for this card notifies them of various things?
The violation of privacy is that they collect and keep the personal information in the first place. Not using it to help consumers is then just a way of avoiding bad publicity and demonstrating to their customers that they actually have the data and can contact them. I.e., the concern is a PR concern, not a legal one. (Most likely, their agreement says that they can change it at any time anyway.)
1.) You die horrible death.
2.) You're privacy is infringed on.
pick one.
When I sign up for a supermarket card, I should be able to check a box which says "contact me if I bought a product under recall". Then they can call me or send me a postcard.
Given that there is no moral reason for them not to contact the purchasers of the tainted beef, they would have been held liable had they not used every means at their disposal to contact the purchasers.
John
...it's perfectly fine. You voluntarily gave your contact information to establish a beneficial business relationship with your store. They already use that info to target you with coupons and special offers, so why shouldn't they use it to warn you of major health concerns?
If I receive a form letter in the mail saying "Such and such beef is tainted, please check your package before eating. If you are concerned, return the beef to the store for a free refund", I'm not going to think, "Those f***ers used my personal info to send me a form letter!" I'm actually going to go check my beef and hope like hell I haven't eaten it yet. I probably wouldn't give a second thought as to why or how I got the letter. It is sufficient that I received it and was properly warned.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
In terms of justification, I must admit that "By the way, we thought you might like to avoid an agonizing death" is a somewhat better reason to invade my privacy than "Here's a coupon for 50 cents off your next purchase of adult incontinence control products."
Die miserable painful death from bovine spongiform encephalopathy... or have my privacy invaded. For once, I think the invasion is justified. When it comes to my health and well-being, I'd prefer they let me know - my right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness definitely trumps whatever the hell I said when I signed up for that grocery store card.
I'm not the only one who uses fake information on some of these cards, am I?
Does this mean Monday my cat's going to get a call from Safeway?
WARNING: If accidentally read, induce vomiting.
I think the first thing you have to acknowledge is that the warning that you could have received tainted (mad cow) beef is more important than being trivially bothered with a notification of such. As long as the information was only used for this purpose, and the whole scenario is clearly documented and an explanation was sent with the notification, I see no problem with it. It's sometimes necessary to remove one's tin foil hat from their covering their eyes.
Jamon
I can count to 1023 on my hands. Ask me about #132.
I think there is a thin line you cross between invading privacy and simple concern for your customers. As far as I can tell in this case, the supermarkets are merely looking out for their customers health. It is cheaper for them to only the mention the recall information at the store than sending letters out to hundreds of customers.
I don't really see this as crossing that line.
--
The last digit of pi is four.
One of our local supermarkets changed it's name and had a big facelift , with the result of raising prices across the board and SURPRISE ! Introducing a customer card that replaces coupons with swiping your card.
I don't think I'm getting anything in exchange for my information, since they raised prices at the same time they did this. So as far as they know , I'm a black mother of two.
The fact that no one understands you doesn't mean you're an artist.
I believe that for reasons such as public health, using readily accessible information to provide valuable notifications to those who need it should not only be done every once in a while, but should be routine.
The only thing I fear is a slippery slope...a few months from now, it's not just tainted meat or a toy recall, but a sale on your favorite brand of foot fungicide.
One solution would be a simple declaration of accepted usages for customer cards upon signup. For example,
[ ] I want to receive promotional notices
[ ] I want to know when my cow is mad
[ ] I want no notifications of any sort
We already see this regularly on the web, but I haven't seen it on those customer loyalty card applications. Perhaps it's time for this idea to be implemented. Instead of deciding what's best for the customer, let's try the novel idea of letting the customer decide what's best for themselves.
- Fill in a fake name and address on the card, and don't worry about being contacted.
- Fill in your real name and address on the card, and get warnings such as this one.
The form I filled out for my supermarket card had the usual "Check this box if you do not wish your name and information given out to qualified vendors, etc," but lacked a "Please do not contact me with further offers" box. However, I have yet to receive any mail from said business, including flyers.Truthfully, if they have your address, it was your decision, and you should be happy you received the warning. If they don't, that's just the price you pay for privacy. I'm certain somebody in the office or the neighborhood got the warning and would be perfectly willing to alert you in the future.
Access denied: Not enough clue for requested operation.
But I ate that last night....
:)(smile)
Simply sending a message to the owner of the card doesn't qualify as an invasion of privacy in my book. It would be a violation of privacy had these stores sent people's address information to a third party, but they didn't do that. Privacy means, "Keep my information confidential." It doesn't mean, "Never contact me."
im a vegetarian, you insensitive clod!
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i worked as a checker-bot for a year at a local grocery chain, and i can safely say that maybe only a fraction of a percent of shoppers appreciate those stupid ass cards. i actively encouraged customers to just lie on the applications, and often if they were complaining i would just hand them a card and throw away the accompanying application. i think it is definitely an invasion of privacy if they are tracking what you are buying for any reason, and it is way beyond what they should be allowed to do.
Except in this hamburger here... urp.
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Recently, I've been helping clean up the legal mess left behind by a woman who was leading a 'criminal lifestyle" (Crack whore), until she OD'ed. (Ive been helping with this on behalf of her daughter, whom a close relative is adopting). What does this have to do with the story?
We found that this woman gave obviously false information to everyone she ever got a card from. In a small town of about 10,000 people, where all the streets are named according to an obvious pattern, she still listed made up addresses such as "anytime place" or "1313 Mockingbird lane" on every grocery discount card, blockbuster type movie rental or whatever she got, going back 8 or 9 years. In a town with only one set of numbers for the first three digits of the local phone number, she entered what are apparently completely random strings, and sometimes mixxed letters and numbers, again without anyone apparently looking at them. On one, she listed her work address as 1600 Pennsylvania Ave, Washington DC. Guess what her job description was?
Not a single business evidently looked at the information she filled in on those forms, and she had over 30 such cards, literally including one for every grocery store in town. She ripped off several of the movie rental places for tapes, was wanted for bad checks and other crimes where an address might particularly matter at various times, and still, no one noticed any of this.
We weren't too surprised that some pharmacies had ignored forged perscriptions and fraudulent signatures, or that she had pawned things with tickets in obviously false names (Her favorites when buying drugs seemed to be astronaut's names, and David Bowman). What we are surprised by is how many business that DIDNT have an incentive to look the other way obviously did so. Many of these lost money from their unconcern rather than made any.
At first glance, it's like this whole system is built to work only for criminals. Still, if only the crooks were doing this, stores are not going to be dumb enough to keep getting stung with bad checks and such. Ergo, lots of otherwise honest people must be filling these things out with just as spurious information.
Who is John Cabal?
Remember that cluster of e. coli cases in Pennsylvania last year? Contaminated green onions from Mexico supplied to a restaurant chain, but could have just as easily been supplied to a supermarket.
If I voluntarily hand over my real contact information (customer-initiated opt-in) to a business, I would EXPECT them to notify me of product recalls, regardless of their privacy policy. I would be upset if they didn't.
Things aren't recalled just because they don't work - they are recalled for safety reasons. Recalls are always bad publicity, so no cpmpany in their right mind does one unless they are directed by the government, or feel they will be soon.
... that is, if, and only if they do everything at their disposal to contant you immediately about the situation. I, for one, welcome our new supermarket-management overlords. *ducks*
Seriously, though, I think I'll take a very Kant-like view on this (if I remember my Philosophy class correctly). I'll argue that since the supermarkets have this information at their disposal, it is their duty to notify their customers. The article quotes Katherine Albrecht, the founder of an organization called the the "Consumers Against Supermarket Privacy Invasion and Numbering", as saying "Sure it would be useful to have someone contact me if I bought something tainted, but at what cost? A total food-supply surveillance network?" The fatal flaw in this argument is that the supermarkets already have what she calls the "A total food-supply surveillance network". That's why you get the discounts; they are paying you for this data. Now, since they have this data, they can save your life by calling you on the phone and telling you not to eat a piece of meat you bought at their store. I believe that the ethical use of this customer data demands that at the very least they give you a call on the phone, and/or do whatever it takes to inform you that the product they sold you may put your life in danger.
Not that it would have helped me. I put a false name and number on the form when I signed up for my supermarket discount card(s). (Not that they care, as this still probably generates useful demographic data of some kind for them.) Good thing I don't eat meat.
Dear Valued Customer,
Our records show that on 1/6/04 you purchased 2.5 pounds of beef at our store in Seattle. It has come to our attention that this beef may have come from a suspect supplier, and there's a chance it may have mad cow disease. You are welcome to return your purchase to the store for store credit, whereupon it will be destroyed.
We obtained your contact information from your "frequent shopper" card. If you feel this is a violation of privacy, please disregard this notice.
Signed,
Some Supermarket Chain
QFC supermarkets posted a sign saying concerned shoppers could call to find out if they had bought suspect meat via their id.
Then, if and only if the customer called, QFC only told the shopper. Not any third parties.
I wouldn't want to catch the gruesome mad cow disease, so full ethical marks to QFC for offering customers an informed opportunity to consent.
As interesting are the dogs that didn't bark, bureaucracies hiding behind a privacy comfort blanket: giant Kroger, Safeway and Albertsons chains said they have no plans to take such a step. Perish the thought - publicise they have poisoned me ?
Katherine Albrecht, founder of Consumers Against Supermarket Privacy Invasion and Numbering, hit the nail on the head at the end of the story. rtfm.
"Congress - the best democracy money can buy"
The point isn't that the store has your name and address. That isn't what the privacy issue is about. You gave them that information, of course they know! The issue is about the store tracking what you buy. Signing a card for discounts isn't an acknowledgement that they will be tracking your purchases. In fact, they don't need this at all. You're in their store, and they can watch what you buy if they like. I mean they've always done this with credit card numbers.
Is it an invasion of privacy because the bar tender remembers what drink you ordered last time? Isn't it the same thing?
"he drew his sword Ringil that glittered like ice... and he wounded Morgoth with seven wounds..."
Law always is a weight between the Civil Liberties of an individual versus the safety of the public.
There are many scenarios where Civil Liberties being violated may or may not be justified:
To me, this is nowhere as serious and imminent a threat, as Mad Cow can't be transmitted from person to person (last I remember). Still, a customer has a right to know whether he or she may have bought infected meat. This right to know outweighs the loss of privacy that is at hand.
/^[A-Z0-9._%+-]+@[A-Z0-9.-]+\.[A-Z]{2,4}$/i
Ahh! There are lots of excellent card games you can play with those consumer tracking cards from your local supermarket. Here are some of my favorite:
1) Collect All n Cards! For example, collect cards in the names of all the world leaders. Or try a variant, where you assign points for how well recognized the world leader's name is. For example, leaders of major western powers, and other leaders commonly in the news, who are still in office might be worth seven points (Tony Blair, Gerhard Schroeder, Pervez Musharraf etc), former major world leaders would be worth 5 points (Benito Mussolini, Chiang Kai-shek, Theodore Roosevelt, etc), and three point for lesser-known world leaders (Luiz Da Silva, Thaksin Shinawatra, etc). Extra Bonus: George Bush is worth ten points. Then swap them with your friends to get a complete set! (NOTE: there are innumerable variations on this game. Collect authors, your pet's names, vulgar names, etc...)
2) Swap them at parties as introduction cards.
3) If the store lets you use your phone number in place of your actual card, give the main switchboard number of any large business in your area. Then get your friends to do the same thing. This is extra devious because it must absolutely **** with the store's consumer preference tracking database. (This isn't strictly a game with the cards, but it's a game made possible by the cards, and can be a helluva lot of fun, especially if you get some reward for every x dollars spent -- if enough other people are playing the game, you'll randomly get rewards!)
4) Worry young cashiers by first acquiring a large number of cards, then open your wallet, take them out, and spend a minute or so pawing through them until you find one you like. Make sure you finally choose one along the lines of "Uri Fuckov" to get an extra chuckle as the clerk tells you to "have a good evening Mr. Fuckov."
5) Invent your own games! The only limit is your creativity.
What grocery store do YOU shop at? :O
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one day you get a recall notice for something someone else purchased.
try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
Loyalty cards, membership cards.. whatever they care to call them. JUST SAY NO!
For christ sakes, at least credit card issuers are required to provide a privacy statment to it's clients allowing them to opt out. Isn't that envasive enough?
I NEVER use ANY loyalty card. Ever. If they want to profile me (or my statistical type) they can PAY me. Not visa versa. And a "discount" doesn't fuqin count!
When they first started the 2 tier pricing, I'd check out.
Cashier: Got your bonus card
buyer: no, scan the store card (they never hear that)
Cashier: your total is XXXX
Buyer: let me ask you.. do you get paid more when you charge more?
cashier: ?????
buyer: then why the @#*( wouldn't you apply the discount all the time?
cashier: ???????
They don't get it. Here's the deal.. NEVER PARTICIPATE. You gain NOTHING?
Here's the moral I wish more people grocked:
If you want to profile me you can PAY ME.
You don't pay me with a discount, cause I won't buy without one.
I've never been refused a discount due to the fact I dont have a profile account.
I can't beleive how stupid the consumer is.
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From the story: "I always use a fake name and address when I sign up for those...".
This only makes a difference if you NEVER use a credit card. If you use a credit card once, they have your true name and address, and they associate it with the discount card.
...because I put a mini-discount card thing on my keychain, so if I lose my keys, there's a chance that someone who finds it will take it to the nearest Albertson's (as the little card says to) and a cashier can just scan the barcode and they know where to return my keys to.
I belong to the ______ generation.
So did I (Barlo Mung) :)
But when I pay with my credit or debit card they always thank me by name because it pops up on their screen or print out.
If I was designing that database I'd have it populate the empty fields with the known info when someone pays by card. Such as name, address, phone number etc.
Anyone know if they do this?
The invasion of privacy is having a "pre-approved" credit card sent to the address I provided for get discounts on food, that is what I consider an invasion of privacy. What they seem to be saying is that it is ok to invade my privacy when it is done in the name of American Express. But when they have to identify themselves directly for the purpose of saving my life instead of the indirect invasion of junk mail... well, then that is just too much invasion for their taste. Or, put another way, too much trouble. After all, the current system of let them figure out it is tainted on their own is "working fine."
And, btw, shortly after applying for a store preferred card, I got both the preferred card and an American Express pre-approved card with the same exact typo in my name. I guess it goes to the bottom line, they get money from American Express and they don't get any additional money for warning me. They also seem to bank on that I won't put two and two together that the American Express offer is related to the preferred card. If they can pro-actively sign me up for credit, then they really damn well better be able to pro-actively call me about a recall. I hope that the CEO of a food chain gets charged with murder due to criminal negligence during one of these cases. Then we will see if they consider the current system to be "working."
The most impressive site I've seen about this stuff is
Consumers Against Supermarket Privacy Invasion and Numbering
They've been tracking all manner of invasive (and, unfortunately, pervasive) supermarket marketing techniques for quite a while now.
Any retail or wholesale discount card that is not a line of credit, nor an instrument of debt (e.g, debit card) cannot require the consumer to disclose ANY information. They cannot even require you to provide your name! They cannot tie the use of a financial instrument (such as a credit, debit or check) back to the discount card account. Lastly, any consumer may lend or give their discount card to anyone else. You can use your discount card, hand it to the next person in line and apply for a new card the next time you come into the store if you wish.
At my California supermarket, at the bottom of the form there was a small box that says "I decline to provide any information". When I received my discount card application I quickly went to the very bottom, checked the box and immediately handed it back to the clerk. They clerk was clearly puzzled, but with a little prompting I managed to convince them I and completed the form and so I got my first card. Then to demonstrate the anonymity, I gave my card to the next person in line who didn't have a card. I'm currently using a card that I friend from out of town picked up (who also checked the box) and gave to me.
Some supermarkets have been slow to update their application forms, even thought the California law started 1-Jan-2001. I have had to help a friend deal with a supermarket who didn't want to give him a anonymous discount card. A call to the HQ of that supermarket cleared up the matter. (BTW: The store's excuse was that they had printed too many of the old forms that required comsumer information to toss them. Lame!) Perhaps the California law needs to be changed to prohibit the stores from even asking for such data?
So I won't be notified of a beef recall anytime soon. Not that I care. I'm a vegitarian. :-)
chongo (was here)
I've also gotten cards as "Illegible scrawl" at some stores, depending on their procedures for trading the card for the paper.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
Hmmm. Randall's, Albertson's, and Kroeger's are all the same company. In fact, in that string of grocery stores in the article they listed of companies that said it violated privacy, they are all the same company. :)
When I was in Texas at a Kroeger's, my wife and I went and got a card to get a quick discount, filled it out with fake information. Then the cashier, who just happened to be the assistant manager, chuckled when I told him I had a Safeway's, Albertson's, and Randall's card in my wallet. He said I could've used any of them, they're all owned by the same people. :)
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This BSD crap is going too far. We might know what causes it (these protein fragments labeled 'prions'), but then again, we're not really sure.
Dude, BSD is dying, hadn't you heard? This BSD crap won't be going on for too much...
Oh wait, you weren't talking about kernels, were you?
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Interestingly, some stores did not use the information because they felt it violated the customer's privacy
BS!... What probably happened was that the lawyers got the list of the people that MAY be affected by the issue and decided that it would be cheaper to pay "real" claims as they come in rather than lose customers and invite "frivolous" litigation due to a possible scare.
--
Time is on my side
The only reasonable expectation of privacy is that laid out in the privacy policy you agreed to when getting the card.
Any actions involving the information provided which are not explicity documented in the privacy policy are definately not permitted.
I'm always considered the possibility that in twenty or thirty years from now when the USA Medicaid program is bankrupt, that the data gathered from these supermarket cards will be used as a justification to deny medical benefits to people. Whent the system is broke, the administrators have to do something to ration what few medical benefits that will remain and food purchase data seems the best reason because they can blame it all on the users.
"I sorry ma'am but your request for perscription drug benefits has been denied because our records show that for ten years between 2000 and 2010 you consumed an average of 0.5 kilos of beef a week. Your present medical condition is a result of your own negligence."
This would seem absurd except for the fact that the government is using twenty year old marijuana misdemonor convictions to deny current benefits like housing assistance and graduate student loans presently.
Before you tell me how absurd and paranoid I am, remember that people would have labeled paranoid anyone who said twenty years ago that everybody would have to pee in a bottle to test for heroin in order to get a simple job like selling shoes.
It's probably a good idea to keep out of corporate data bases as much as possible because unknown people can simply and arbitrarily destroy your life on a whim by using this data. This can be done either by delibrate malicious intent by identity thieves and zealous prosecutors or just corporate mandate.
Millions of jobs are disappearing in the US due to bad political and corporate decisions. Any justification to pin the blame on the worker themselves will be eagerly sought out and used against them. Expect this type of data mining for blame-the-victim tactics to increase in the future in the USA.