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KDE 3.2.0 Released
Quique writes "KDE 3.2 has just been released. The official announcement is available at the KDE site and the source tarballs are being replicated to the mirrors. There are already binary packages for a few distributions. Besides the usual bugfixes and new features, this release has been highly optimized and runs way faster than previous versions. This is a good opportunity for Windows users to migrate to a free desktop."
OK, so they are using Windows, most probably because it came preinstalled and optimized on their new Dell/Gateway or HP computer.
Some of us geeks actually chose to buy Windows XP, as at least some of the software we run only runs under Windows. Sure, some of it has Linux equivalents, but not all, and until it is all of it, we need Windows.
Yes, it's a catch-22 situation - no software means no users, means no software. One thing has to give before the other will, but I'm afraid that that thing won't be me.
It's official. Most of you are morons.
I want KDE 3.2 in my system!
However, I spent quite some time tweaking my KDE 3.1 settings, and right now it works flawlessly (at least, for my needs)... apparently, there's no need to upgrade.
So, I don't know if I should compile/install KDE 3.2 myself, or wait until my distribution includes it in its next release (I'm using Slackware).
What do you guys think?
Any bug reports so far? (I know it's just released, but that's the wonder of Open Source.... many eyes!!!).
This isn't meant as a troll but don't the Gnome folks lambast KDE for being less "free" than it?
Personally, I use Gnome only because I tried KDE about 3 years ago, didn't think much of it, switched to Gnome and have never been bothered to go back and try it again.
Hey ... at least I'm honest about it.
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KDE runs on how many platforms now? It's not up to the KDE organization to make binary packages for RedHat whatever... That's what a distro is for. RedHat says "this set of packages work well together" and they haven't said that about KDE 3.2 yet. If you're going to complain to anyone, complain to RedHat.
Maybe you think you can get Internet Explorer for free as well?
Well, consider this:
Somebody has to be working on coding the Internet Explorer, and they definitely get paid.
Where do you think the money comes from?
Conclusions? That's right, you don't get it for free.
The web sites crawling so I can't find out. What do they mean by RDP support? They integrated an RDP client, or it runs an RDP server?
Of the three remote protocols I'm forced to use at work with Windows (RDP aka Terminal Services, pcAnywhere and VNC), RDP is by far the best. Internet problems left me with nearly 700ms of latency for a while yesterday... but RDP was still usable. The same can't be said for the other two protocols.
It's *not* talking MAPI, and never will. Exchange >= 2000 can WebDAV for that purpose, that's also what Ximian uses. And it's just well documented at MSDN. We just lack people that actually use Exchange and are willing to volunteer. If we had them, thing would be likely to go a lot faster.
Daniel
Unless it actually runs on Windows, or it has some emulation in it that actually runs _all_ Windows programs without hassles, I can't see the point in switching from Windows to KDE.
Depends, maybe you would like to use software not available on Windows? Or maybe you already found all the linux replacements. The KDE application base is huge.
Besides that, I'm really frustrated with peaple like you. KDE 3.2 is out. It has many improvements, but no... it's not finished. That's propably why it is not called KDE Final. OSS on the desktop, for that matter, is not finished, thank you for pointing out.
Many of your critisisme are valid in some way - I would go into that disucssion - but please, try to see the way OSS has come and be a little bit more gratefull. I'm not talking to you personally, but also to all those people that can't stop hammering ad perpertuum on all those things they think are wrong, while there are many progressions already made. If you don't like it, fine; use windows or something else that thinks is better.
Got a couple of small children and this would be useful. My three year old already uses KDE (that I've set up to limit his access). Kiosk mode would be even better since I can control websites, etc.
BTW - I actually set up a Linux box for him because of gcompris (which is buggy at times, but pretty neat). Although, his favorite games are Frozen Bubble, Tux Kart, and Tux Racer.
A goal is a dream with a deadline
This is a good opportunity for Windows users to migrate to a free desktop
The desktop might be free but my time isn't. See, I already own Windows. It's installed, working fine, and arranged just the way I like it. It doesn't cost me a thing as it's already paid for.
If for some reason I was dissatisfied with my Windows experience I would have to get and install a new OS, install this updated free desktop (assuming it didn't come with the distro), download the apps I need to be productive (as a Java developer I could pretty much continue to work without impact), and learn to use the new OS/desktop combo.
All this adds up to money. I have a salaried day job and I do hourly contract work at night, with more hours than I can handle on the contract. Any time setting up a new environment (for no reason) is money directly out of my pocket. And it may even cut into my bzFlag playing time!
Windows XP is quite stable and secure. We've never had any problems in our house. Of course, the hardware router, AV software, and Windows Update help.
On a tangential note, I'm about to dump OpenOffice. What a dog. I gave my wife my copy of Office XP and I've been using OO for the occasional letter or spreadsheet. Even for that limited work I find its performance to be unacceptable. Another driving factor - through the Microsoft Home Use program in conjunction with my day job I can get the latest Office (professional version) or Project for $20 each. Full retail? I wouldn't switch. $20? Oh yeah, I'll pay $20 for improved performance.
Where I live (Sweden) You are not allowed to use the word "free" (or gratis which is the translation) in an ad without really giving it away.
:-)
.haeger
Free (gratis) means no strings attached here so if someone sais "Buy one, get one for free" You can actually go in and ask to have the "free" one and they can't deny You that. If You know your rights.
Naturally noone in their right mind uses the word "gratis" in ads anymore here.
One could only hope that our government would disallow more bastardisations of words (and standards).
You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. -- Harlan Ellison
There is a KDE for Windows project that runs using cygwin. It is pertty slow (and a little buggy) but the fact that it runs at all is nothing short of amazing and a testiment to how far the Cygwin project has progressed.
I'd personally like to see how much of a speed boost (if any) they could get from running under SFU since Microsoft makes it freely available now.
KDE runs adequately under Cygwin on win 32.
:-D
There is even a KDE ports tree for cygwin sitting on sourceforge http://kde-cygwin.sourceforge.net/
Not running 3.2 yet tho.
Good intro to KDE for win32 users
Worst
Most regular users who choose, for whatever reason, to use Linux will rely on the installation process to set up the windowing system. So when all distros include it as one of the choices in a few months, regular users will be able to benefit from this.
The other market of regular computer users is the business/corporate users, and if they want to, I am sure their IT staff can compile KDE for them.
Other than that, people who would download and compile KDE already know a bit about linux, and how its software is distributed.
One thing that i noticed is their instant messaging application - it seems to be a bit like Trillian on windows.. Has any of you experienced this and can tell the difference?
*sigh* While it's true that there are Linux equivilants for many/most windows apps there are reasons why you might want to use Windows over it. Off the top of my head: X apps tend to lack polish when compared to their windows counterparts. App installation and uninstallation requires either compiling by hand, or using tools that require root access. Lack of consistancy between apps and their UI. Driver support still is not there. Try comparing Ninvidia's latest Linux offering with their Win32 for example. Now before you slam me or mod me as flamebait bear in mind that I use Linux on all MY home machines. My wife and daughter use XP and will continue to do so until they can sit down and USE their computers without having to futz around with the OS.
there are free desktops for windows available.
And with litestep no Linux WM can compare, cause it's real customizable.
And maybe kahakai can compare, when it has more snipplets to make things easier.
Geoshell is from the Programmer of the Explorer, because he need something to debug the Explorer during development. And the concept of bars is just like the concept behind gnome.
There is also a blackbox port for windows.
And there is much more.
just my 0.02
Oh come on. Geeks find friday night the perfect time for installing KDE 3.2. What else are you doing to do? Wine already runs mydoom[1], and if you are a true geek you don't have much else to do while waiting for the next interesting project.
[1]Something a couple of us did at wineconf last weekend. grabed a copy of mydoom, put it on a linux machine and traced the run. Examined all the files is created/modified (mostly garbage), set the local machine to www.sci.com and watched is try a DOS attack on ourselves. (loopback is well able to keep up). Then we found the magic sequence that the port accepts. We didn't actually finish, dinner got in the way when I left, but we were close.
That is what real geeks love to do in a socal setting.
As a professional developer, you should jump at the chance to learn a new operating environment and new API. At the least, it's another buzzord on your resume. It might give you a head start working with similar APIs in the future.
A programmer who won't learn is the sort whose work is most easily outsourced to a $3/day coder in Bangalore.
"Integrate OO.o into KDE" "Integrate OO.o into Gnome" "Integrate OO.o with the Windows desktop". Yuck. Who thinks this crap up?
Here's a better idea. Take that lame dog StarOffice out behind the barn and integrate it with a bullet through the skull, then implement the features you want into KOffice or Gnome-office. It'll be faster, more integrated, less ugly, and easier to use.
0 1 - just my two bits
Games. XP is far more useable than 2K in this respect (although not even close to 98). XP is a nice compromise between the two.
Also driver support (can't get drivers to run bizzaro hardware under 98 anymore).
And you can tweak the display to resemble 2k, and disable most of the crapware (although I haven't found a way to get rid of media player).
And I got my copy for $5 #). No activation required.
If it weren't for the fact I tend to change hardware quite a bit, I might have bought a legal copy of XP (I did for 95 and 98). As it is, a bootleg was more attainable then explaining all of my hardware changes to MS (imagine getting "permission" to reinstall 'cuz I found a SCSI card and wanted to try it out).
XP is solid. By far the best thing MS has done, although with all the crap moving down the pipe, I find myself hoping for a port of Wavelab that will run on Linux (don't tell me equivalents, I like Wavelab).
That, better driver support, and something inbetween Lindows and Debian (I want it to just work without being as constrained as I am with XP), and I would use Linux in a heartbeat (as well as my friends and family since I am their technical support).
Cubase would not run under Linux.
The latest versions of Rosegarden (http://www.all-day-breakfast.com/rosegarden/) have proved as stable as Cubase in my experience[1], and the feature set is getting very impressive. Well worth checking out.
[1] Rosegarden is officially unstable, whereas Steinberg ship unstable code as full customer releases.
Chris
If we consider pre installed machines, so does Linux.
How is the operating system "out of the box" if it comes pre-installed? What I mean is that given a PC, I can chuck a WinXP install CD in, boot from it, and be somewhat sure that I will have a working system when the install finishes. In my experience, this is rarely true for any but the most newbie-friendly of Linux distros. Though I admit RH9 was a huge step forward in this regard.
What you're saying is "If I do all the right things, and keep patching all the time, it's fairly secure.". Please name a modern OS this isn't true for.
It is exactly as you say. However, Linux proponents regularly call Windows insecure because of this fact, completely forgetting that Linux is the same.
For most people $650 is a bit too much to cough up.
Come on. Noone actually pays $650 for Photoshop. Everyone who needs it professionally gets a license from where they work (or a heavily subsidized price). Everyone who doesn't just gets it off their favourite warez network. So how much a certain piece of software costs is really irrelevant when comparing features, because to many users, price is not an issue anyway.
I'm going to skip over the "STFU NOOB" bit because I intended that one as a bit of a joke.
But please, tell me how much amount of your free time is consumed by inserting a boot CD and then asking it to install the working system to HD.
Last time I wanted to try Linux, it took several distros before I found one that would even install and boot without errors. Each one took roughly as long as Windows (some longer) to install. Once I had found one that worked, it was a pain getting everything looking and working the way I wanted, and installing software, mostly due to a great deal of the configuration having to be done through text files, and many drivers only being available as (broken) sources that I had to edit manually to compile. That, and Galleon kept crashing... So installing Linux, especially for a first-timer who is used to getting stuff working without outside help (as I have always been able to in Windows, at least for common tasks like installing software and drivers), can really be a HUGE waste of time.
One could of course argue that people who have so strong opinions about how something works, even though they they admit that they don't use it are idiots too...
I don't currently use Linux, but that doesn't mean that I haven't; in fact, I have. Then I stopped using it for reasons partially mentioned above. I do however work in technical support at a university where we do have to support Linux, so I'm "forced" to deal with it on a daily basis even though I don't run it on any of my own PC's.
Quality, performance, value; you get only two, and you don't always get to pick.
I see a lot of foolish comments about not being able to do anything useful with a KDE desktop. the only thing you cannot do just as well with kde3.2 compared to winXP is play games. thats it people, nothing more no arguements accepted. so in the corperate areana windows can put it's head between it's knees and kiss it's ass goodbye
Finally, someone who knows what the hell is going on. There are ALOT of companies out there with thousands of employees who basically sit there are enter bits of data into a single app, or take customer service phone calls, or maintain basic spread sheets. What do these non skilled people need Windows for? They are not installing apps on their own anyway. Why pay MS $100+ per seat when more often than not they can deploy Linux thin clients or basic systems for what could be massive savings.
Well boss, instead of upgrading all the hardware and the software we installed Linux. Its faster, more secure,free, and we were able to reuse most of our existing desktop systems. We saved the company millions of dollars. With the desktop hardware we could not reuse we made backup SMTP, DNS, and web servers..once again, with no cost to us for software or hardware. All we have to do is hire 1 or 2 competent people to maintain all this stuff. Of course, we'll have to pay them slightly more and give them good parking spots because they actually come with a friggen clue.
so in the corperate areana windows can put it's head between it's knees and kiss it's ass goodbye
So I've been hearing since 1998...
The method for installing new software is distribution-dependent. Lindows has 1-click installation. Since starting on Linux (with Slackware), I've seen pretty much everything, including tarballs that need to be compiled and installed by hand, self-extracting archives with built-in installer, and package-based installers. Most of the package-based systems have a graphical installation tool that allows you to browse a catalog of packages and select the applications you want to install. The rest of the work, including dependency checking, is done for you. To me, this is at least as easy as double-clicking an install icon because I can be sure that any dependencies that must also be installed will get the most up to date version available.
On one of my machines, which is running Gentoo, I perform my installations from the command line, but that's as easy as pie. To install Mozilla, I simply type 'emerge mozilla' and it calculates all the dependencies and installs everything needed. And it even gives me the option of installing a pre-compiled (binary) package or compiling from source (which I usually choose because this machine is slow and needs every bit of optimization it can get).
GreyPoopon
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Why is it I can write insightful comments but can't come up with a clever signature?