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Reviews for Digital Camcorders?
bluprint asks: "I've been looking for information regarding digital camcorders. Googling for 'digital camcorder reviews' (and other variations) of course brings up tons of results, but I thought I would get input from the slashdot crowd. Does Slashdot have any suggestions on these camcorders considering price, features and quality? I plan to use it for my summer vacation, but also intend to keep it for many years (possibly even after I have kids, in a couple years), so I'm willing to spend a little more for something high quality, which uses media that will be around for a while. I'm not interested in fancy/artistic things like video editing on my computer, I just want high quality video, preferably keeping it under $1000. Are there suggestions on where to read some thorough, quality reviews of different products, and maybe even educate myself about what to look for in a digital camcorder?"
i've found dvspot.com to be a wonderful resource
price, features and quality? I plan to use it for my summer vacation
You need the most powerful zoom you can find. The bigger the zoom, the further away you can be from the nudist beach.
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
Get one with a low LUX number. The lower the number, the better it will record in low light situations like indoors.
A lot of camcorders ***cough***Sony***cough*** advertise having things like "Night Vision", but have a really crappy LUX rating, which makes them useless unless you are outdoors in the bright sun or in total darkness.
I'm a big fan of the canon line. The quality is great, the image stabilization is amazing, and the form factors are way more usable than the other major brands. I always felt like I was going to accidentally flip switches and press buttons with everyone else's cameras. Anyways, my humble opinion. It's a place to start looking.
I've heard from pros that you really want a camcorder with three CCDs. They pick up more detail in the darker parts of the image. I think the cheapest are in the $1,500 range, though.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
Best camera for the price. Flourite lense. Small form factor, better quality picture and sond than anything for less than a Canon XL-1.
It has FireWire out as well as super video. The picture quality is breathtaking and Canon has better red tones than anybody. Enough features to do about what ever you want. Absolutely intuitive user interface, great battery life.
It Rocks.
I'm not interested in fancy/artistic things like video editing on my computer, I just want high quality video, preferably keeping it under $1000.
Not to be a troll, but wouldn't this question be better suited for a consumer electronics discussion board? I find it odd that you would ask the slashdot crowd about a product whose computer interface capabilities you care nothing about.
That being said, I have a $499 Sony digital-8 handycam. It works great, uses the ubiquitous digital-8 tapes (same form factor as hi-8), and has USB and firewire connections to boot!
I'd rather be a conservative nutjob than a liberal with no nuts and no job.
Ended up buying a Panasonic 3CCD camcorder on their recommendation and haven't looked back. They never seemed to give it a proper review, but it was still named their camcoder of the year.
Now I'm lusting after the JVC HDTV camcoders which record MPEG/2 to miniDV.
My computer fears my disk space requirements.
1) Get the best optical zoom you can, digital zoom is extremely overrated. Same goes for digital cameras too.
2) A format you are comfortable with (MiniDV or Digital8). After doing research for my digital camcorder I found that the mini-dvd format is completely ludicris and an utter waste.
3) Compatability - this could only be an issue if you don't have a Firewire port...if you don't...get one.
4) If you already have a digital camera don't even bother with looking at those features. Who wants to stop recording, mess with settings, take a picture, and mess around again just to take a picture that you could get with a digital camera faster and usually better quality.
5) Hot-shoe addon slot-thingy - great for zoom-mic's and external lights (ie expandability)
I think that's it...it's been a while since I purchased one (almost 2 years) but it has completely been worth it.
"I want to spend less than one thousand dollars on a camera that will have great video quality, last me >10 years, and I don't want or need to edit on a computer."
If you don't want or need to edit on a computer THEN WHY GET A DIGITAL CAMERA? Digital cameras are used SO YOU CAN EDIT IT ON A COMPUTER, without any hacks or having to go through a VCR and then to a TV-in port on your computer. I edited a movie with iMovie today and it was fine, I was glad to be able to do that instead of dubbing a VHS and hoping that it would work out ultimately, however bad it looked. Digital video looks good, and will look good, and if you compress it with a good codec (mpeg-2, divx;-)) it will still look good compressed.
Perhaps the biggest reason people go digital is the ease of transfer to a computer, and perhaps the low cost of media. If you are really into high-quality analog video (film) seems to be still hanging around after all of these years, and there is no doubting the quality of the result, as well as the archive capabilities.
However, you did ask for digital, so here is the answer. I'd probably go with the miniDV format. With this, you have tons of options. I've seen miniDV cameras on ebay for less than $100 (albeit first-gen low-qual, no frills models). The real high-quality route seems to be going with the likes of the Canon XL-1 (and related models). I've seen some great quality results coming from these cameras, and I spotted one in use during the filming of The Italian Job (check out the dvd special features to see it used), presumably for proof shots, dailies, etc.
Not sure if that helps you, and even the miniDV format may be obsolete in another couple of years.
Good Luck!
He might have some reviews worth reading.
Dan Ruther's Site
Fellowship 9/11
When searching for a camcorder, you'll be given a choice between Digital Image Stabilisation (DIS) or Optical Image Stabilsation (OIS), with the optical being much more expensive. If you ever wish to shoot image from a moving source (a car, train etc), then definately go for optical image stabilsation. It uses mirrors to stabilise the image instead of software, and produces a less jerky image, especially when you zoom in. Canon's are pretty good in that respect.
Revolution = Evolution
The guy can spend up to $1K and you recomend a toy?
the lens is garbarge compared to a real camera, and it doesn't zoom. see http://www.dansdata.com/cooldv350.htm
Many of the midrange DV cameras have a still mode, and can take flash memory cards
Consider the Panasonic PV-GS70. It's the cheapest 3ccd camera you're going to buy new...MSRP of $999. 3ccd's will help in low light and give a greater picture quality. Unfortunately, compared to Sony, Canon, and other Panasonic offerings, the GS70 uses a smaller CCD, so low light performance isn't THAT great. Still, the picture is excellent.
You're going to be best off spending the most possible, especially if you want the camera to last a long time. I would also consider a Canon GL1 or GL2, a Sony TRV900 or TRV950, or a Sony VX1000, VX2000 or VX2100. All of those cameras are more expensive, but considered industry standards as far as lower end 3ccd prosumer cameras. Also, they're excellent in low light.
Also, I would consider buying used. You'll be able to pick up a Canon GL1, a Sony VX1000, or a TRV900 a lot closer to your $1000 price point.
Also, a few general rules: If you wont use it for stills, don't be swayed by high still picture resolutions. Stick with MiniDV as opposed to DVD recording camcorders or other formats (Sony offers several), and go to a store and check the camera out yourself. Sometimes the "feel" of a camcorder will simply put you off regardless of how great it is.
Check here for reviews and what not:
www.camcorderinfo.com
www.dvspot.com
Also, google for whichever camera and clips. I've found several comparisons with actual clips from all of the above mentioned cameras.
Good luck!
If you plan to take it on vacation, size matters. A big camcorder with lots of features will go unused.
I have a Canon Elura. For various specs reasons I won't go into here, I chose it over the small Sony's. I've been very happy with it. The best part is that I can fit it into a (large, jacket) pocket and carry it around, so I have it with me on vacation. It's also a pretty good camcorder.
Do choose a camera that uses mini-DV. The MPEG cameras can only be used with special Windows software that comes with them, and don't take great video. The mini-DV format is as open as these things get, and you can edit the results in several different packages.
You do have tradoffs with these tiny things. The biggest is that you often get camera noise on the soundtrack. Because of the mechanics of the situation, that's hard to avoid without an external microphone.
Another good purchase I made was on a short(!) book on making videos with my camcorder and iMovie. Its section on using the camcorder (don't zoom, shoot a little introductory footage, etc) really made a difference -- without it I would have been just wasting tape since I wouldn't have wanted to view the result.
And finally, expect to make a 5-minute video from your full day of filming. That's just the way it is.
Not to be cynical, but if you just want something for taking home movies, I wouldn't spend a lot and get something "to last".
Why not, for example, spend $500 today and get something nice, and then $500 a couple years from now when you have kids. By that time, you'll probably be able to buy a High Definition Camcorder for that price. Progress in the digital imaging world is moving forward pretty quickly
I mean, I wouldn't spend that kind of money unless you need all those features now and you probably don't.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
The key to making video watchable is to edit. Take a lot of footage and edit it to make the footage watchable. Instead of leaving the camera on for 30 minutes at the birthday party. Make a 2 minute music video showing the highlights. People will want to watch that, it's more easily distributed via the Internet.
Finally, even if you don't believe in editing, importing digital video to computer and making a DVD out of it is very easy. Plus it's easier to send and store DVDs than it is to send and store VHS tapes.
Tripod stability: This is important. The DVDA-69 has a shock-stabilised tripod mount, which allowed it to score a perfect 5 out of 5 for the "4-way fat bitch fuck fest test". As regular readers know, this is where we get over 500kg of pounding lesbian flesh to get jiggy in a tub of jelly and film the whole damn thing. Lesser cameras produce an unwatchable shaking mess due to the harsh vibrations. The DVDA-69 felt barely a tremor during this tough test due to the inertial stabilisation and digial shake correction. Fantastic.
Flesh and genital colour tone reproducibility: The DVDA-69 was presented with our standard test panel of 3 vaginas (one hairy, one pierced, one shaved) and 3 penises (one regular, one large, one 'rock splitter'), and tested for accurate flesh tone reproducibility. The CCD sensor did a reasonable job, reporting back 89% faithful colour repro even on an 8x macro pussy zoom shot, but for those seeking ultimate chromatic reproduction, try the new Panasonic CockViewer 7000 (see our previous review). 3 stars out of 5 on this test.
Sound capture authenticity: Again, we used our standard voice test panel of "Oh yeah do you like that bitch?", "I'm gonna cum all over your titties!" and "Give it to me give it to me give it to me SQUEEAAALLL", captured through the standard camera microphone. The DVDA-69 did a good job of capturing mid to high end frequencies (it scored a perfect 100% in the 'anal jab scream' test, but there was some distortion in the optional 'blacks on blondes' sub test where our Barry White sound-alike test subject was able to induce a bit of fuzziness with an orgasmic "Oooooohhh yeeeaaaahhh". 4 out of 5 stars.
Environmental robustness:. The toughest test of all. Basically everyone just jizzes all over the camera lens and we see if it still works. Things were going well until some spooge leaked into the tape compartment, requiring tedious manual cleaning. Not a real competitor here, and certainly bested by the Canon PowerGyno A700 Intruder Edition, which was not disturbed by even the most savage gang banging facial action. Sony is really going to need to work on this if it is going to be seen as a serious player in the home market. 2 out of 5.
Summary: A reasonable entry by Sony into the crowded home camcorder market. Good performance for standard types of fuck-filming, and you can expect your pounding, flabby buttocks to be faithfully presented on the screen during playback. The camera has several ease-of-use features, such as a 'Thumb-off' record button, allowing the user to simply hang the camera around their neck when filming 1st-person blow job scenes, allowing both hands to be used to guide the girl's head onto the end of your cock. But the lack of moisture resistance means that hardcore users will need to look elsewhere for top-quality gyno movies. 3 out 5 stars overall.
and the whoever stated above regarding the 8mm tapes as the same "form factor" as Hi 8/ D8 is a complete nerd.
"complete nerd" is not an offensive term on SlashDot, I suggest substituting "complete jock".
They can take it as a compliment, while we laugh at their good looks, physical presence and puny brains.
http://jesus.everdense.com/
I just inherited $7500 from my grandmother, God rest her soul. I want to do something good with the money. I believe my first purchase will be a donut. I want to spend less than $1000 on the donut. It has to be sweet, and low in fat if possible. I like chocolate filled, but I might be willing to consider just about anything with a nice glaze on it. I've searched the web for donut review sites and haven't found any, so I figured I'd put it to the slashdot crowd. So, what kind of donut can I get for under a grand?
-_-_-
There are 0x40000000 types of people: those who understand 32-bit IEEE 754 floating point, and those who don't.
I played around with making videos back in the days of VHS-C, as did my Dad (who, before that, used to make movies with Super-8 film). Although video editing software is much easier to work with than the edit controllers then available, it's still a bitch to do. To make something watchable, you end up shooting 10 times what makes it to screen, particularly of the interesting bits of whatever it is you're doing. Therefore, you're too busy shooting to enjoy whatever it is you're there for in the first place. Despite image stabilizers, to get decent footage (and to stop your arms getting tired) you need a tripod anyway, as well as extra batteries, auxiliary microphones...and it goes on. Getting decent-quality sound is also a bitch. Then you have to edit it together. Often, once you get home you find that you're missing key things, so for future events you start making a shot list to make sure you get everything...so, to make watchable videos you end up becoming a video director rather than a participant.
If you're not into all that, you just want a record of a few things and you'll settle for Aunt Mildred being recognisable, a low-end camera will do the job just fine, and spending more than that is a waste. You'll make a far better video with a $500 camera with the right accessories and a bit of effort than a $2000 camera stupidly used.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
--Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
Things to note:
-MiniDV is the way to go right now (decent tape prices, wide availability, good resolution, small size).
-MiniDVD's are expensive and not good for motion stuff (optical skip!).
-MiniMPG tapes are pricy but smaller. The quality is actually less than MiniDV due to the inherent compression, since it's native MPEG2 format (yeah, I know MiniDV is compressed, but not nearly as bad).
-Digital8 is more of a stop-gap between the world of digital and Hi8. Lower resolution and uses 2x the tape (so a 90 min Hi8 tape only lasts for 45 min)
- Be wary of zoom and resolution claims. High levels of zoom is pretty impractical (digital or optical) due to your shaky hand, and the speed of the zoom (ever notice that TV and movies don't whip up and down from 1x to 40x)? Resolution is another tricky thing. All media formats have a standardized resolution, so a mega-pixel camcorder won't be any better (at least on a normal CRT TV) than a lower res one.
- Lens quality is important, as the light-gathering abilities (and distortions) affect the image actually more than the CCD itself. Try to get the best you can get in that respect.
- If you only have a CRT TV (or older projection TV), the limitations of your TV will hold back the quality of the video. You'll notice a HUGE difference in quality from your computer screen vs the TV.
- You're going to have to transfer the material one way or another, even if you don't edit it, if you want to share your memories. The general public doesn't have MiniDV VCR's and such. Even the MiniDVD you have to duplicate if you want to share the video. Keep in mind a possible loss (potentially major) of quality when transferring to another media, whether it be VHS, VCD or SVCD (preferred).
Editing video has become surprisingly easy, but still pretty time-consuming if you want to make something nice. But the quality you get is phenomenal. It's like your own TV show, to your liking. Once you start, it's hard not to get hooked. Good luck and happy video memories!
I've used Canon's ZR series DV camcorders since the "10" version and I have been very satisfied. They are small and use the ubuqitous MiniDV tape standard. They have a hotshoe on and can accept an external mic (essential). Some features that mean nothing: takes still pictures, too! Has a 500x digital zoom! Accepts flash memory of some sort! Baloney. Just make sure it's MiniDV, has firewire and a few sensible extras like can take an external mic, or can digitize input from a VCR.
Also, I would advise anyone to rethink the "I'm not interested in computer-based video editing" idea. Lesson for you folks. Ten years ago young fathers everywhere bought up non-digital camcorders like crazy. The result is a shoebox filled with really crappy home movies that nobody wants to watch, even the people who shot them. The reason is because they aren't edited.
Life is largely boring. If you shot an hour of video you might get 15 minutes of usable stuff. Cut out the crap. Add some music, add some titles. It makes all the difference and with basically free editors from just about everyone there's no excuse not to do it. Burn yourself a DVD when you're done, even. Do not let your hour-long boring-as-hell-movie sit in a shoebox for lack of editing.
You like your Macintosh better than me, don't you Dave? Dave? Can you hear me Dave?
For what its worth, I've had a panasonic minidv camcorder (18x optical zoom) for a number of years. My shots have started to come out much better when I started to use a tripod.
..
The "Image stabilization" both cameras have helps, but if you want the shots to look really good use a tripod or brace the camera on something (a tree/wall). Its a royal pain in the butt to lug one around. but they have some very small light ones that do the trick. If you don't you risk making viewer sea-sick or having video that looks like blair witch
Note that the more you zoom in the harder it becomes to hold the camcorder steady. to that 22X zoom is harder to hold steady zoomed in than a 10x.
My camcorder has a "headlight" that clips on the top. It lights things up. This has been very usefull, because most consumer camcorders will record in low light they tend to use a slow shutter speed and look grainy. (This kills batter life though)
I'll summarize someother points:
+MiniDV is great. Almost broadcast quality (NTSC).
+get a good lens on the camcorder
+3 CCD is better for better color/sharper but may be out of you price range
+Image stabilization is good. Optical stabilization is better than digital but both work
+Buy the biggest battery you can find and use the one that comes with the camcorder as a spare.
Happy shooting
When's the last time you watched a movie that showed a lot of zooming? Did you know that film camera lenses don't even have zooming capabilities?
Once Upon A Time In Mexico had several shots with zooming, albeit it was 'filmed' in high definition with the Sony HDCAM 24p- it had a zoom lens, among other interchangeable lenses. Lots of tv shows and some movies are being shot with cameras like this. You don't notice zooming in a Hollywood movie any more than you notice the focusing, because professionals know how to do it subtly and effectively.
You should notice that every movie has lots of extremely high focal length shots, especially for back-and-forth conversations shots- it's a sure sign of a very amateurish production to always use the default wide angle. The point of a zoom lense on a camera is not to shoot while zooming, but to allow a huge number of different focal lengths. Since anyone using a cheap consumer camera is unlikely to buy or want to hassle with lense add-ons, and no low-end cameras have interchangeable lenses, a big optical zoom gives them maximal freedom.
You're right that it is annoying to shoot scenes very close by because these cameras are telephoto oriented, but there's always more stuff further away from you than closer by.
I bought a Sony DCR-TRV33 about half a year ago when I decided I wanted a digital camcorder. I payed around 630 for it, seems like you can get it for around 560 now. I like it alot, but you can definitely get something better by now for under a $1000. Now onto my real point. /. knows, the internet is great because between ebay, pricewatch, pricegrabber, and the other shopping bots, you almost never have to pay retail for anything. You must however be very careful when buying expensive electronics such as digital camcorders online. Once you choose a model, do not buy it from any site that does not EXPLICITLY state that your camcorder is NEW, INBOX, FACTORY FRESH, and that it comes with a new manufacurer's US warranty. Not just any warranty, a US warranty (assuming you live in the states). A seemingly valid warranty from Sony Japan won't do you any good. If this information is not clearly stated in the item description or in the site's FAQ, you can pretty much guarentee your not getting a new product with a valid warranty.
When I payed 630$, the MSRP was around 800$ at sonystyle.com . As everyone on
The second thing you need to lookout for is sites that push accessories. Its no secret that companies in many industries make all the money off accessories. You can get an inkjet printer with a rediculiously high DPI for 70$, but a black ink cartridge for said printer is 35$. Gillete was happy to send me a free Mach3 Turbo in the mail, since two replacement blade cartridges costs more than the razor. Its no different for camcorders. Every site will try to sell you zoom lenses, extra batteries, extended warranties, tripods, carrying cases, etc. When I first tried to order my TRV33 from one such site, because they had a low price and a US warranty, I recieved an email telling me I had to confirm my order by telephone. I called and the guy on the other end supposedly was confirming my order but really tried to sell me accessories and an extended warranty. When I declined and said I just wanted the camcorder, he said it was being drop-shipped directly from Sony, and would arrive in a week. It never came, and it was never going to. Because I didn't order any accessories, they simply didn't process my order. There are plenty of shady websites like this when in it comes to camcorders, and many sites are actually the same company. I know that was lengthy, but its good information to go in with when looking for a good price on whatever camcorder you decide on. In summary:
1. If there is not an explicit guarentee that the product is new and factory fresh with a valid US warranty, find another site.
2. If you didnt buy any accessories and have to call to "confirm your order", find another site.
Don't just buy from the cheapest place on pricegrabber, you get what you pay for.
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Forget /. Just go to the Simply DV Bulletin Board. A wide range of users from novices (who ask questions) to pros (who answer them).
When they came for the communists, I said "He's next door. Take him away. Goddam commies."