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Software Vending Machines
anubis__ writes "CNN details a sort-of software vending machine named 'SoftwareToGo' that CompUSA is testing out in their Seattle, WA, Dallas, TX, and San Francisco, CA stores. The upside to this vending machine is that your CD is burned when you request it, so the latest patches available for the software you're buying might already be included with the installation. The downside, like anything requiring some level of technical aptitude in the US, is that the machines are avoided by the masses of shoppers." This has been in the works for a year or so.
...but as other people noted in the last thread, you miss out on some of the other other niceties. For one, I hate "online" manuals. You can take your PDFs and stuff 'em. I treasure my spiral-bound manual for Neverwinter Nights.
Also, about patches: this would be nice for things that need updated patches, like Windows.... except Microsoft won't sell Windows or Office at these kiosks! Erk.
Auto-reply to ACs: "Truly, you have a dizzying intellect."
"I can not bring myself to believe that if knowledge presents danger, the solution is ignorance" - Isaac Asimov
The public has in the past shown an aversion to these sorts of machines. Complex vending machines look intimidating, usually are hard to use and the consumer if often afraid of "accidently" buying something or "breaking" the machine.
Thalasar
How is this somehow better than downloading the software from the Internet? So I can hold a new CD? I can burn that myself. I really don't see the market unless you are stuck on a 56K modem.
IF I want some burned software I can download it from the net - even after paying for it ;-)
But if I go to a shop I want a pressed CD - these hold longer.
You know those little stickers...
"This machine will not release free product"
Then a little picture of the machine falling on a stick figure. Maybe it'll be a Penguin?
There's just no coin slot to insert your payment.
Not games, or most desktop-targetted apps, because you can't burn their precious anti-copying schemes.
.pdf or README file.
And if it was going to be higher-end office type stuff, like OS's or DVD authoring, or ANYTHING that costs 19.99 or higher, and people are going to want the box, the official CD, and most of all - THE MANUAL.
Dead tree manuals are easier to read than some
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
Wow. I can't tell you how many times I've said "Gee, I'd really like to buy software from a vending machine at a computer store". I mean, it's so much easier than just pulling it down off the shelf, and there are so few things that could go wrong with this.
OK, sarcasm aside, if I'm going to buy software from a store, I want the box, a paper manual, and all that other stuff that goes with shrinwrap software. If I wanted a CD-R and no printed materials, there are other ways to do it.
I'm a very active CD archiving person, with live music (think phish/dead/etc, its all legal, but thats really beside the point). In the long term, say 6-8 months, I find that alot of my burned disks become unreadable...which would annoy me alot more if my 400 dollar copy of windows XP pro was burned onto it. I wonder if this is addressed at all by this system, or is the buyer just screwed?
"Give someone a program, frustrate them for a day... Teach someone to program, frustrate them for a lifetime."
One might refer to Microsoft as a Vending Machine.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The story is a dupe, the topic is boring, the facts weren't checked. WE GET IT!!
This is the technology that might replace their obsolete distribution model.
--
Ride, shoot straight & speak the truth.
"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." - Hanlon's Razor
now instead of kicking a machine for your $0.65 snack getting stuck, you can get really mad when your $60 game gets stuck!
The downside, like anything requiring some level of technical aptitude in the US, is that the machines are avoided by the masses of shoppers
He's right on here. Despite being more convienient to a college campus and half the price, people just didn't want to use a machine. There is a different mindset for poeple who know what they want and shop online, most people, however, seem to want to look and touch before they buy.
"Debian Linux - 6 CD's, $6.00"
"Mandrake Linux - 3 CD's, $3.00"
"Fedora Linux - 3 CD's, $3.00"
"Gentoo Linux - 1 CD, $1.00"
"Knoppix Linux - 1 CD, $1.00"
"Vector Linux - 1 CD, $1.00"
"Peanut Linux - 1 CD, $1.00"
"Microsoft Windows XP Home - 1 CD, $89" This actually might be a good way to get novices to try Linux, especially the Knoppix (or the BitDefender Knoppix based "Linux Defender", which makes an excellent recovery disk)...
...sheet music, that is. I used to work for a music store, and we had a machine for sheet music that was similar to this one. You put in your money, select your song and key, and it prints out.
I don't recall ever seeing anyone using it, which made me mad mostly because I was the one who had to unload it from the truck and it was dang heavy.
People in general are just not going to want to do anything more than push one button, maybe two. It's a lot easier to paw through the bargain bins and the store shelves.
I also just don't trust something like this. Personally, I want to take something physically from a shelf and walk it up to the counter so that I know exactly what I'm getting.
Do you feel safe sticking $100+ into a vending machine? I mean, it's a pain enough to try and stick a single dollar bill into a Coke machine, but try sticking five or six twenties in there.
Also, these would be targeted like ATMs, but probably with less security. They'll probably sit inside the store, but without the procedural security of a cashier's drawer.
Will the product be cheaper than the boxed version? If not, why wouldn't you just buy the boxed?
"The upside to this vending machine is that your CD is burned when you request it,..."
So...I gotta wait 4 minutes before I find out the machine has taken my money and now the disc is jammed in the damned chute!!!!!
Ummmm...I think I'll pass on this one.
"A microprocessor... is a terrible thing to waste." --
GeneralEmergency
I was living in NY when they first rolled out the Metrocard vending machines. Its amazing how long it took the average person over the age of 35 or so to get a card. There were people with stacks of these cards because they couldn't figure out how to renew an old one.
Maybe in about 4 decades when the vast majority of society is technically adept, but by then they'd probably come up with something new that dumbfounds us oldtimers. As it I refuse to send or reply to cellphone text messages. I don't need another language of shortcut keys taking up valuable brain space.
My days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle...
I recently saw one of these in the store. They're kinda impressive, easy to use, and rather techno-geek aware. Unfortunately, like everyone else said, no one uses them. I imagine it's not because of some desire to pull software off the shelf, but rather, because the only software you can print out is utter crap. I've found better software sold at Goodwill. Sure, I suppose if I wanted a ripoff of Mario Teaches Typing or 101 Card Games, I could use this machine. I glanced through the selection, and out of 300 or so titles to chose from, I couldn't find a single one I would be interested in for any reason -- even if they were free! Throw some Linux distros, a few good MS products (with updates) FreeBSD, porn, movies and music, something worth buying, and I think these machines will take off.
Half the software industry is trying to make all these hi-level security iso so that CDs can't be copied.
Half the software industry is moving toward "Software-to-go" so that software can be distributed easily.
Which is it? You can't have both.
Imagine the kids opening up a generic, burned CD from CompUSA instead of the flashy box with screenshots. You can forget riding home in the backseat of the car and ripping the plastic off to scour the manual. I guess you can stare at the white CD sleeve and get lost in the Times New Roman font displaying the name of the software printed on the front.
In a few years, these are in every CompUSA, but selling those shareware/PD collections, game demos, windows service packs, maybe a linux distro. Cheap stuff, a couple bucks a CD.
They'll make a decent profit off of it, and people will like it because it's easier than scraping download.com.
NOONE is going to stick their credit card in a vending machine and trust it to spit out a $500 photo-editing suite or a copy of Windows Server. Well, some would, I wouldnt.
And as for games, well, people who pay retail prices for games want the box for teh shelf. Besides, as I already said in this story, you cant burn the copy protection.
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
... and that's about it.
Seriously, one the most expensive things for a retail establishment is forcasting and maintaining physical stock. It costs in staff(stock handlers), floor space(often more than the retail space), and risk(loss & damage, obsolete or unpopular products). This "innovation" kills two birds with one stone, just-in-time stock management, and customer self service.
My other sig is in the wash.
To err is human. To arr is pirate.
Seems to me that, if you already know what you want, these kiosks could be nice. No need to hunt around to find the one dusty copy of Mavis Beacon you want to buy (and you KNOW someone out there wants one).
The problem is that it's damn annoying to browse on these things, and that's where they'll lose the casual shopper. It's the Amazon model - if I know what I want, I'll go online. If I want to browse, I'll head to a brick-and-mortar bookstore and thumb through some books. Borders will also kick me out if I try to shop past closing time, thereby giving me my life back.
I've long wondered where there are no music-vending machines like this? You have this small vending machine with touchscreen where you can select albums/songs, drop in your $5 (or less if less/cheaper music chosen) and walk away with a nice, fresh-burned cd in 3 minutes. Takes very little room, no possibility of music theft, no need for security gates.
:)
Cost of hardware very small, built from off the shelf components, software simple, built on free opensource components. Songs would be downloaded over broadband from central location at demand, most popular titles could be cached locally. All the new music would be available on all machines instantly.
There are endless places where machines like this could be used, places where you have some time to kill anyway. Think bus and railway stations (get something new to listen on the road), supermarket queues (machine a bit away from checkout, let your cd burn while you stand in row and get fresh cd from the salesperson in end), gas stations (you get handled a wireless tablet to choose tracks by the refill guy, free cd if you buy a full tank!) etc etc. Cost of distribution virtually zero, meaning high returns for artists, very convenient to customers, they get exactly what they want where they want it.
Heck, someone offer me a contract and Ill take care of both software and hardware. Distributors, any takers?
This is a system that has only one real customer, the merchant. It's sole purpose is to make life easier for the retailer and provides very, very few benefits to the consumer. It has all of the hassle of buying from a brick and mortar store with none of the benefits.
The only advantage of a software vending machine to the consumer is that they always get the latest version of the software. In any reasonably stocked computer store this shouldn't be an issue anyway.
Seeing as how I've had the misfortune of buying software that didn't work (reimbursement still pending):
Who do I approach if the purchase warrants a return?
This is not my sig.
Yeah, the original says that it is unfortunate that hardly anyone is likely to use them. This may be true from the standpoint of the companies making a buck off the machines, but I've found this the biggest blessing in the case of these movie ticket machines.
:D
In my case though, they are used just often enough that they get fixed when they break. And it is really surreal when the ticket line is backed out to the street and around the corner, and I can just walk up to the machine and have my tickets in 2 minutes. The fact that hardly anyone uses them is one of the most attractive features in my mind...
Of course, buying software from a machine? Seems an inefficient distribution mechanism in that you are already at the store. If they put these in malls IN PLACE OF a software store, they might be on to something. But there is still a plethora of problems ("Jefe, what is a plethora?") with getting software distributors on board (it was mentioned that MS won't allow thier product to be distributed this way), maintaining the machines (stock of CDRs, CDR quality/life expectancy, paper manuals (will it print them, restocking paper & ink, keeping the machine in a dry place), mechanical failures, etc). It would seem that there would have to be a live person present simply to keep the thing running smoothly. And again, at about 4 minutes per transaction MINIMUM due to burn time, not to mention browsing and the inevitable slow user (I HATE being stuck behind people at the ATM that you just KNOW are 12 o'clock flashers), the efficiency of the system is debateable. And what about the inevitable coasters? Do you seriously think that they will use sufficient hardware/software to minimize these (read: Windows and Roxio = coasters)?
I could go on, but bottom line, it will take years to iron out the kinks, and by then, the whole thing will be moot due to increased bandwidth to the average user allowing efficient and widespread Internet distribution.
Oh, was that my outside voice?
Think of all the things that could go wrong...
1. Bad burns. Who do you go to if you get a bad copy? Can you get a refund?
2. Who maintains the file server that the vending machine uses. I am sure a rouge CompUSA employee could easily throw a virus or two on the ISOs.
3. How do you get the CD key?
4. Who wants to stand there and wait for a CD to burn?
5. I hope they use a damn good burner, most will wear out rather quickly.
Not a sermon, just a thought.
[n8.r0n] http://petesweb.spymac.net/
Do we know this?
Personally I think this is just another way to charge the same price for less product and less service.
"Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
My God! We are reinventing the wheel.
When I had an Spectrum, a company called Labware created something like this. Its name was EDOS. Given that in 1988 computers used to work with cassettes (Spectrum, Amstrad, Commodore 64 & 128...), it recorded software to cassettes.
It was a computer with a tape recorder and was to be installed in software stores. When you wanted a program, the EDOS connected (through a modem) to Labware, downloaded it and recorded to the tape. Software didn't stay in the EDOS longer than the time it needed to record.
Here is a photo.
Where is the revolution, then?
Of course it means that salespeople would have to actually have a clue! rather than being glorified greeter/stockboys they would have to know their stuff and be able to sell it. It'd be a great tool for "penny profits" sales from selling those share ware tools we all use along with accessories like scanners, cameras, etc...rather than pointing customers to ONLY the $400 photoshop for family pics.
In short the machine fills a niche...but not one that's useful for a Mega-store. It would be a Godsend to a local shop that doen't want inventory though...and it'd get customers in the doors again!
This could be quite nice for abandonware and niche marketware. A lot of overhead is involved in producing CD-ROMs, packaging, shipping, having a good distribution network, etc. That is why so many good programs become abandonware. At some point it is no longer worth the effort to keep older classics and niche programs in the distribution network and in stock. It would be nice to select some old Infocom text adventures, classic Atari ports, Sierra and LucasArts adventure games, etc burned onto a CD.
There is a lot of great software out there that have disappeared from the shelves over the years and the legalities of getting copies over the internet is a concern for some. It could also be a nice distribution channel for programs like WordPerfect, OpenOffice, etc since many stores only carry MS Office.
I'm sure this would make hackers oh so happy. How long until someone infects one of these with a nice virus (as it will be surely running windoze). Perhaps you can buy an infected copy of Windoze for a discount?
May as well paint a giant bullseye on the things.
Already being done
You can accomplish anything you set your mind to. The impossible just takes a little longer.
I was in CompUSA today looking for a new LCD monitor, and noted that they had some of the SoftwareToGo machines already up and running. Walked over and gave the thing a look-see. Everything is accessed through a touch-screen interface. Browsed through some of the software titles that they offered; it made this horrid beeping noise each time you clicked on the "down scroll" button, and any time you selected an option, more beeping noises. I felt rather embarassed having the thing reward me for making choices by spitting out little ringing sounds; this will probably drive away people who want to browse software in peace. Most of the titles were budget titles, and nothing I was interested in either. All in all, I won't be using the system again anytime soon.
If people are concerned about the wait while the disc burns, this could be a solution:
The machine keeps one copy of every combination or selection already burned.
Face it, people are not going to want to browse through hundreds of titles with this thing - too many button pushes. So there will not be too many titles available, hence no need for a large amount of pre-burned discs.
So, when you push the button to buy disc #12, it pops out immediately... then the machine burns a new copy while you're already out the door.
oh shit. I probably should have patented this.
This space available.
is really for tunes, movies and other "entertainment content" for mobiles and pda's. the problem with downloading this type of content over the air is that (a) it's costly, (b) the transfer rates are low. the vending machines can offer high transfer rates at low immediate cost. so, for example, you can waiting at the train station and decide to purchase a 1hr documentary to watch/listen to on the trip: you download it at local bluetooth/IR/usb rate in, say, no more than 1/2 minute. it's effectively the multimedia equivalent of the railway bookshop or newsstand, and surely profitable: it won't work so well for infrastructure/productivity/etc applications, but will for audio, video, tunes, etc. sounds like a great idea.