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iPod Mini Design Flaw?
terradyn writes "Over at iPodlounge they've discovered that the iPod mini's have a major issue with their headphone jacks. It looks like the jacks connection to the main system board is extremely poorly engineered and so normal use will wear it out and cause lots of static after around 35-40 days... If any pressure on your iPod Mini results in crackling and static, you should return your iPod immediately to an Apple store for a free replacement. They're also theorizing over in the forums that the iPod Mini shortage may be a cover for this problem..." Update: 04/12 01:08 GMT by T : billybob writes "Someone in the forum thread originally linked to has posted pictures of the iPod taken apart, demonstrating the problem."
to punch that annoying jogger who wants to "jack in" and "check out my tunes!"
...for being cheap and uber-stylish. For $50 more you could have had a regular iPod with way more storage, but noooooo, you HAD to get an Apple MP3 player in something other than white!
The Ipod Mini freezes costantly. This was supposedly fixed in pre-production but my mini and many other's mini locks up several times a day.
This wouldn't happen if the headphone connection was digital, encrypted, with error correction, as it should be in DRM. Told you so.
Its all one grand unified ipod conspiracy if ya tell me...the shortage...the colours....u know its all related to the greys and the smoking man too! Better get my tin foil ipod cover out.
We played dungeons and dragons for 3 hours.....then i was slain by an elf
Either that, or they didn't do any field testing. If you just hit the buttons, you'll be okay. These failures are happening after the case has been exposed to the normal tensions it'd get being in somebody's pocket... did they do that test?
You can do a lot of testing and still overlook a problem if you're not looking for it.
Well, sounds like a case of dry solder joints to me, which means the solder used to connect parts to the motherboard has not been correctly applied and/or heated, leaving it weak. Could also be a simple socket retention issue.
The good news is that this is usually easily fixable, opening the device and re-heating the joints that connect the socket to the board, maybe also applying a little epoxy to reinforce the socket, as a little movement can agrivate the problem.
The bad news is that if the soldering is not up to spec, the entire device could suffer from long term unreliability, especially in a device that will see constant movement and vibration, such as this..
Possibly they have used a surface mount socket with only the solder connections to retain it, and it really needed some form of positive retention because the case is not strong enough to provide the rest - this would make it a little harder to fix by resoldering, but the theory is the same.
After all, it's not really a DIFFICULT problem in engineering, if this problem is happening a lot then someone has REALLY dropped the ball here.
The predicted cause for this is that everything inside the IPM case is connected to the case with flexible rubber-like stuff, *except* the headphone jack (which is connected rigidly- standard practice for headphone jacks but unfortunate here).
Repeated stress on the case, then, puts stress on the headphone jack and eventually it may lead to the audio problems expressed at iPodlounge.
This should be an extremely easy fix for future IPM revisions, and I'd imagine Apple will be taking care of their customers.
As a sidenote, I had an iBook's logic board fail out of warranty due to a manufacturing flaw and I called Apple on I heard that Apple the flaw- they sent me a box, postage prepaid, in which to send my iBook back, repaired it, and sent it back to me. No money out of my pocket. Very cool.
I can't think of a single portable music player that I have owned in the last 20 years that did not suffer from this problem. Indeed, it is the fear of such a problem that has kept me from buying any MP3 player.
Everything from an original Sony Walkman, to discount store AM/FM radios, to expensive Sony and Phillips CD players have suffered from this annoying loose headphone jack disease. Some may suffer earlier than others, but none have survived without a little home soldering work more than a year.
I bought a 40gb two weeks ago.
No problems yet. I love it.
Best $500 that I should have put towards tuition I ever spent.
My impression is that the engineers at Apple that work on the iPod are rarely stopped on the street and mistaken for Steve Wozniak.
The battery-life meters on the 3rd-generation iPods are nothing short of random, and now this. For what they're charging for these things, why doesn't the battery indicator work as well as the one on my two-year-old $49 cell phone?
Thank God it is only a mini design flaw! I thought for a while that it might be some major flaw. Fortunately, that was not the case. I can sleep tonight.
Sincerely,
Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
"Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
I don't know who is and who isn't aware of this rule of thumb, but working at a big Mac development house (no McDonald's jokes plz) taught me one thing. Never ever EVER (shake a baby) buy first revision Apple products. Since the beginning of time, I think Apple has looked at people who buy their newest line not as their first line of customers, but their last team of product testers.
.mac account, why can't you see it on your desktop!?!?")
Nearly every Apple product that I've seen come out in the past five years, I've known someone that has to return a Revision A product because Apple just dropped the ball on one thing or another. Don't get me wrong, their products are quite amazing and I'm envious of all my Apple fanatic friends that have everything, but if you're going to be on the bleeding edge and pre-order things before Apple's even done making them, of course you're going to see something wrong with the first batch. If you think otherwise, then why don't you try to release an idiot-proof product to people that want their mp3s automagically synced from their work desktop to their iPod to their car to their laptop to their servers to their friend's computers in the UK. ("it's on my
...but I ramble...
That and better reflexes. You're like 10th.
Also, how does an issue like this get addressed for international customers? I'm guessing Apple has the policy of free shipping, etc only for US-based customers.
Don't people even read the title of the article anymore? It's a mini design flaw.
Oh, well, then, HELL! Why don't you just glue a 4 GB CompactFlash card to an LCD screen, toss a scrollwheel on, and beat Apple at the iPod game?
I tell you why. It's because you, sir, are a dumbass. Let me count the ways:
1. It's a 4GB miniature hard drive. Not a CF.
2. It also contains a microprocessor and related hardware which: talk to the hard drive over the ATA bus; parse the filesystem; keep track of the songs in a (relatively) intelligent and rational way; feed data to an MP3 decoder chip; manage to keep said MP3 decoder chip fed properly, i.e. not too much and not too little, but just enough, Goldilocks; interpret your input and figure out what it is that you want it to do; and talk to the aforementioned LCD screen. Not just "making the scroll wheel work", thank you.
3. The actual cost of the silicon I've described - not counting the hard drive - is relatively insignificant, it's true. Especially in the large quantities Apple are purchasing. So? Design, assembly, testing, etc. are not insignificant costs for such a device. I've been there; I know. At NO point have we discussed the software design, the UI design, or the industrial/mechanical design. These are also significant.
I challenge you - you, personally! - to develop a design of similar quality and capabilities for even as little as twice the cost, at twice the size and half the battery life. It's a pretty safe bet that you can't. When you figure in the cost of the hard drive (it's a Toshiba; look it up), there's no way you can come close. The only thing you've said that's even remotely correct is that it's barely worth $250. That's kinda cool, really. If it was worth more, it would cost more. I personally like it when stuff is worth what I paid for it.
Frankly, until you know something about designing a consumer device this complicated, your opinion about how good a job Apple did isn't worth squat. But who knows? Give Apple a call. Tell them you read on some website how bad a job they did, and tell 'em you can do it better. Be sure to have a tape recorder ready to preserve the sound of hysterical laughter.
Sheesh.
Ce n'est pas un vrai mouvement de robot!
I have this EXACT problem with my 1st generation iPod. There is a hard plastic collar around the jack, and after three months of pocket-related stress, the jack began to hiss and the left channel began to fade in and out. I KNOW Apple did not forsee this design flaw in the first gereation. I have not had the pleasure of usiong the second or third generations to compare. I simply mess with the plug until the music returns. Too bad there is not a Firewire headphone. That would be kick ass!
is it that bad seein a hot chick again? if i see a hot chick walkin down the hall i dont say "repost"
It sounds as though the jack socket is prone to dry joints where it solders to the board. Either that, or the contacts are losing their springiness after a few insertion cycles.
Dry joints can be repaired "while-U-wait" in any suitably-equipped workshop -- or at home, but it's fiddly and I'd be reluctant to open up such an expensive precision instrument {and anyway, 30-40 days is well within the 12 month statutory guarantee period}.
I'm guessing that the PCB would be double-side surface mounted, reflow soldering both sides. The long-term solution is going to require a PCB redesign and new solder paste masks -- either too much solder or too little solder can cause poor joints; and maybe they should spec a socket with a plastic lug on the underside passing through a hole in the board, which would give it a bit more stability. Using a traditional socket with through-hole pins would be even more secure, especially if dummy pins were added for mechanical support, but would require an additional operation to hand-solder it in place.
It's understandable that Apple is using delaying tactics, as it will probably require a long round of accelerated testing to determine exactly what the problem is and how best to fix it. {I used to work in the R&D department of a company which designed and made electronic control modules, by the way}.
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
Wait... It supported OGG and it had problems?
BLASPHEMY!!
My brother has a first generation iPod (not a mini) that has the same problem. It was out of warranty, so I attempeted to fix for him.
The only thing holding the surface mount jack onto the board was the solder connections, and it seemed to me that the solder was unusually soft. You could push it around pretty easily with a pair of sharp tweezers.
I can't say that I was impressed with the design and execution.
Better then the $500 I spent last month on booze?
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
As with all products, no matter who makes them, you should probably buy a warranty if none is provided. Fortuantly, all Apple hardware products come with a one-year limited warranty against defects. So before you flame, remember that your product is probably in warranty, and that Apple would be more than happy to replace it because they desire your business.
...
there was a comment up a few that said to desolder the jack, put epoxy between the jack and the board, then resolder the jack. flux wouldn't hurt either, so long as you clean it off when done. wd40 would only work because it's a cleaning agent. have you tried cleaning the jack/plugs?
Apple needs to spend less money on 'designers' and more on 'engineers'. Disclaimer: I have a Powerbook and an iPod, this is tough love speaking here. Faz
Massive design flaw found in Apple product, Slashdot prints neutral article. Any bets on the tone if Microsoft made the IPod?
Will Microsoft replace my copy of Windows with one that works well? For Free?
That was a very common problem among the first generation iPod (5GB) . That model had contacts for remote surrounding the headphone jack and the plastic part separating the jack itself from the surrounding contacts very often broke. Go to Apple's discussion forums -> iPod -> Usage and search for "brokne jack" and see for yourself. Most of them, including mine, didn't stop at producing statics, but stopped producing any sound eventually.
I tried to repair it through Apple. Apple Europe refused to repair it for free, saying that the part does not break for itself even though my iPod was still covered by warranty.
I was bitten by faulty iBook (went to service three times and every time Apple refused to cover the cost by warranty. I don't even feel like contacting them for that iBook motherboard paying back program), too, and wonder why I still have faith in Apple, especially the European branch. (Apple Japan was prompt and helpful repairing my iBook when I was visiting Japan.) They have a huge issue in their QC. They should stop manufacturing their goods in Taiwan.
People like to liken Apple products to BMW or Mercedes, but maybe it's more like Ferrari. Expensive, looking cool, but requires a lot of maintenance...
Pshaw - so much for Apple's superb engineering innovation!
Sony has for many years been the leader in crappy minijack technology. Just ask anyone who has used a microphone with one of their minidisc recorders!
Three Squirrels
I had that with one of my electric guitars -- after years of smashing it into the heads of drooling hot chicks in the audience screaming lustily of BFG9000 the Rock God, the guitar cable would do the exact same thing. If I didn't sit perfectly still, I'd fizz in and out if I was lucky, and then usually completely lose it.
I opened up my guitar and pushed the prong that makes the connection at the end of the cable plug inward toward the centre in order to "tighten" the connection when it was plugged in. That fixed it.
I was back to using it as a pre-emptive birth control device in no time.
I'm not normally an irrational zealous dickhead, but I figure "When in Rome..."
Im guessing they use it for space saving. You would need two rca plugs to replace one 1/8 plug. a better idea would be a modified banana plug, with some sort of grounding mechanisim from the plug to the frame of what you are using, then use the plugs for +R and +L audio.
-William
God is everything science has yet to explain.