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VIA Announces Lead-Free Motherboard
linuxprox writes "VIA announced today that their AS-1210 motherboard will be the world's first lead-free motherboard. 'The transition to 'green' manufacturing for VIA has been very smooth and we have been able to ship lead-free processors and chipsets since the end of last year,' said Richard Brown, Vice President of Marketing, VIA Technologies, Inc. 'The AS-1210 clearly demonstrates the technology leadership of VIA and Yamashita in being the first to market with a lead-free motherboard that meets the requirements of the international market.'"
http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/2
And more from Intel:m
http://www.intel.com/research/silicon/leadfree.ht
And more information from AMD:u rces/0,,30_182_4040,00.html
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/TechnicalReso
Disclosure: I don't work for, or own stock in AMD or Intel. I haven't purchased an Intel chip since the Pentium came out.
-ted
All my plans of turning worthless motherboards into precious pencils has failed!!
--- We need more Ron Paul!
VIA Green Computing page
It's too bad they don't do monitors. Those CRTs are the biggest source of lead in computers. Of course, I don't like electrons being shot at my face, so it's not all bad, but still. They are a pain to dispose of.
Cross your fingers for affordable OLEDs. (fp?)
Aren't most Printed Circuit Boards already green?
Ah, nevermind...
New lead free motherboard*
*Supply your own solder.
So I shouldn't have been eating my old motherboards all these years?
Please confirm my Slashdot friends! Woe is me...
Your hybrid is not saving the environment. Its purpose is to make you feel good about buying something.
Now I can let my toddler chew on motherboards without worrying about that pesky lead!
Thanks VIA!
This doesn't do a thing about the lethal levels of sheel negceba that go through most boards, not to mention the chemicals used in most non-paper capacitors, which are not only lethal poisons, but as tasty as anti-freeze to most animals.
Add to this the PCBs in the transformer that go with their power supply, and you've pretty much only addressed the fourth worst problem. The real problems have several orders of magnitude more impact on the environtment and worse -- solutions already exist to solve all three for prices only 5-10% higher than what they pay for existing chemicals!
For some reason I thought that all of the discrete components were going to be surface mount instead of through the board when I read that the board was "Lead free"...
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
...is in pencils--a form of carbon. Won't get that past here.
-I am an elective eunuch.
Of course i didn't RTFA but .. are they too expensive?
I fail to see the consumer advantage on this kind of thing.. maybe they'll do some kind of special ad campaign..
Marketing guys just love to be able to say thing like "We're environment friendly" :-)
The Nec PowerMate eco computer, released in 2002 supposedly has lead free solder on the motherboard. To quote a press release, "The unit also contains a motherboard made with lead-free solder, which protects both the individuals involved in reclamation, and the ground water in case of disposal". I assume this means that there is no lead in the motherboard? Unless capacitors or other parts have lead?
50% more mercury...
:)
It's a joke people...
my pre-1963 computer only takes leaded!
Just like how coal plants release more radition and heavy metals into the environment that nuclear plants. But which ones to the 'enviros' target the most, the nuke plants because it gets them more press.
How do you connect peripherals? Oh wait...
Show me on the doll where his noodly appendage touched you.
Mobos don't just suddenly dematerialise when you're through with them. Instead they sit in land fills and get rained on and leech lead into the groundwater.
They don't do this out of altruism, they have to if they want to sell their products on the EU market, since from 2006, all electronic products will have to be lead free.
You should be punnished for that. Still, at least it wasn't a pun about German sausages, eh? They're the wurst.
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
"[T]he campaign of fear now being waged against genetic modification is based largely on fantasy
... Greenpeace has harmed the environmental case."
and a complete lack of respect for science and logic."
Greenpeace co-founder Patrick Moore.
"Solar power and windmills are not a realistic way out. Nuclear energy is the only real and practical solution, but there has been such a hysterical reaction to it."
James Lovelock, developer of the Gaia Hypothesis.
"Extreme weather events are definitely on the decline over the last 40 years."
Dr. Madhav Khandekar, a meteorologist with 25 years experience at Environment Canada.
"They have cheated the case and I am angry about that, because that will come to our account. They use bad data, as well as for the Brent Spar as for the French nuclear tests. I am against nuclear tests, but one should use scientific, sound arguments
Paul Crutzen, Nobel Prize winner for his work on the ozone layer, who cancelled his Greenpeace membership.
"In truth, what the environmental community has become is a money machine"
Alfred Runte, environmental historian, board member of the National Parks Conservation Association from 1993 to 1997 and author of Yosemite, The Embattled Wilderness.
"In 2000, say World Health Organization and other studies, malaria infected over 300 million people. It killed nearly 2,000,000 - most of them in sub-Saharan Africa.
[...]
"[these deaths] are due in large part to near-global restrictions on the production, export and use of DDT.
[...]
"Where DDT is used, malaria deaths plummet. "
Paul Driessen, author of Eco-Imperialism - Green Power. Black Death. - "A former member of the Sierra Club and Zero Population Growth, he abandoned their cause when he recognized that the environmental movement had become intolerant in its views, inflexible in its demands, unwilling to recognize our tremendous strides in protecting the environment, and insensitive to the needs of billions of people who lack the food, electricity, safe water, healthcare and other basic necessities that we take for granted."
"Greenpeace is lobbying against industry plans to exclude products such as DDT from a POPs [persistent organic pollutants] phase-out."
Greenpeace annual report, 1999)
Interesting to see a company that is succeeding with lead-free... They are requiring the phase-out of lead-free components by 2006, and now a lot of companies are scrambling to change their product designs and processes to make this possible. I haven't heard of much success in this area.
I think electronic components have a blanket exemption for now, but this exemption is coming up for review soon. Just to be safe, most companies (including mine, which is part of an exempted industry) are trying to come up with lead-free products.
Not sure how much of an effect this will have... I remember reading that on average, electric components are less than 1% lead. In addition, the substitutes being explored to replace lead solder (silver and antimony) may actually cause more groundwater pollution, because they are more soluble. Doesn't seem like it's much more than a feel-good measure.
In that article, PCBs refers to polychlorinated biphenyls, a poison, not printed circuit boards. I'm not aware of any connection between the two.
The House Small Business Subcommittee on Regulatory Reform and Oversight held a hearing today on "Green Gazelles." The term is used to describe a fast growing business that utilizes environmentally friendly processes in its operations. Look for this trend to contine as a niche market for consumers who are willing to pay more for "green" products. Of course, there is no official certification to determine whether your business is "green" or not so feel free to turn off some lights in your store and advertise away!
Actually, the earliest pencils WERE made from lead, until graphite was found to be a much better substititute. I wouldn't nitpick, but I think the above nitpicking gives me more than ample justification =). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead
No water needed for making? What was it? 150 gallons of water just to make memory sticks?
Well, obviously, it's not putting lead out into the environment when you trash your old MOBO.. I guess it doesn't help that there are still other harmful materials in PCB's, but, every little bit counts. You have to work your way around one problem before you can focus on the next..
Just when you make it idiotproof, some idiot builds a better idiot.
Lead is on of the problems in many landfill sites with contamination of ground water, and also increasing the cost of reuse of the land after the dump has stopped operating, as inevitable some lead has found its way there, the old common culprit being car batteries and the like.
Computers and other electrical goods are a lesser but probably more common concern these days as it makes up a large volume of waste, I think most people know to dispose of car batteries and other things with large amounts of lead and other heavy metals properly now or at least the shop that changed it does and the high concentration of lead makes extraction and recycling practical.
there are more important issues regarding PCs and the evironment. Why don't PC manufacturers make computers that use less power? Nvidia's new graphic card needs a 450 watt power supply - so what if the mobo is lead free? The thing still draws enough power to burn twice as much oil as needed.
It's cool that they're getting into the push for lead-free electronics. It's certainly not easy or cheap to validate lead-free components. I work in acoustic micro imaging, so I look at the insides of ICs, MEMS, and other electronics all day. we get a lot of work from companies doing moisture sensitivity level testing for lead vs. lead free parts. The lead free parts have to go through a hotter solder reflow profile, so any moisture will cause even more damage. The insides of most of the parts look like someone set a bomb off. it takes them a long while and many iterations before they can pull it off right.
:P.
So, props to them for getting with it.
disclaimer - I don't work for these guys, nor do I buy their products. I'm just a concerned scientist
However, it's too bad reasonable voices like these are being ignored. And organizations like Greenpeace, PETA, the Sierra Club are being taken over by crazies. The Sierra Club in particular used to be a club for hunters and outdoorsmen, but has turned into an eco-nazi propaganda organization.
I agree that DDT and nuclear power would do quite a lot of good for the world, by the way.
My other first post is car post.
A lead-free motherboard? No leads? How am I going to plug anything into it?
Or do they mean no lead-time...? it gets delivered as soon as you order it. Now that would be nice.
(Spudley Strikes Again!)
Without lead, am I going to be able to desolder the exploding tawain capacitors in order to replace them with good ones, or do I just have to buy a new computer every 6 months now?
(note to mods: if you still havn't heard of the capacitor problem, go google about it before modding)
Morphing Software
I'm not qualified to say how this can be safely disposed of, or whether it really needs to, but an awful lot of old electronics do end up in public landfills and other locations where they could potentially leach(sp?) into groundwater. It's something worth considering when people are upgrading their electronics and computers annually.
"Studies have shown that people who eat peanuts live longer than those who do not eat."
No, it doesn't mean much for you or me, but when you start moving millions of pieces, the lead starts to add up. Yea lots of other nasties are used in the fab process, but hey, why make it worse than it needs to be?
The semiconductor company I work for has pretty high volume (nowhere near intel though...) and we went lead-free not too long ago. Customers demanded it, so we gave it to em.
http://computerfan.de/fun/HP_Gabon.jpg
If you mod this up, your slashdot background will turn into a beautiful sunset!
I will feel soooo much better when my son pulls chips off his motherboards and sticks them in his mouth! Thanks VIA!!!!
To-do List: Receive telemarketing call during a tornado warning. Check.
Miniscule traces perhaps, but miniscule traces from hundreds of thousands of components is a whole hell of a lot. Besides, I'm sure the plants that produces these parts are a lot cleaner, environmentally.
So quit your whining, cleaner components are good, whether your talking traces or massive amounts. For everything that happens there's always someone whining about it.
"I use a Mac because I'm just better than you are."
The article has a site load meter... and it's not entirely red yet... what's the matter with us fellow /.ers? Have we become weakened?
Learn something new.
If you view environmental concerns as a luxury good, it makes sense that people only addressed such issues after the average person in society accumulated a fair ammount of wealth.
to quote the Cato Institute here:
And to say that without capitalism there wouldn't be polution to begin with, is to say that it is bad that technology that allows humans to look beyond the brutish nature of the world.
Happy Industrial Revolution Day!
http://while-true.blogspot.com/
Robo-Blogs of the world: UNITE!
Granted the KT133 was a stinker, and largely the reason early Athlons were percieved as unreliable, but since then they've been solid. I'm posting from a KT600 box, just finished a KM266 econo box, and have build dozens of other VIA based boxes including my VIA EPIA based Car Computer!
political correctness has met the IT sector once again. For gosh sakes, what's the problem? I don't plan to eat my motherboard - you might argue "it's thrown away one day", but some miniscule trace of lead found in the solder isn't going to hurt anything - more goes into the environment when i lose a sinker fishing than when I throw away a dozen motherboards.
There's a reason why my State banned the sale of lead sinkers. For gosh sakes, what's the problem with trying to be more environmentality friendly? If VIA can sell a lead-free motherboard that works well at a decent price and make a profit while doing so why is this political correctness? It's being a good corporate citizen. Why is this a bad thing?
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
Interesting.. I can completely see where you're coming from, as society today seems to be about 'consuming', which in turn boosts our economy.. which gives $$ to producers to influnce consumers into consuming even more.. A perpetual problem really..
While I don't see the conservation movement returning (well, unless we run into a problem of a shortage or we overflow ourselves with unrecyclable wastes), I do see working towards 'green' solutions as a compromise for conservation.
It would be nice to buy one MOBO, and use it for years, however not only would this be unfeasable for the manufacturer (.. they have to make $$ of the next-latest & greatest), but it's unfeasable for technology in general.. If we didn't have faster and faster machines, then we wouldn't be able to accomplish the problems we've solved with bigger and badder machines.. and if we didn't purchase the next-generation technologies in each product cycle, there would be no reason for technology to increase..
It's sad, but it's reality.. =/
Just when you make it idiotproof, some idiot builds a better idiot.
The mix of tin and lead in solder varies somewhat depending on the application, with 60/40 and 70/30 being common. I was curious myself about the claim of "Lead-Free" since every solder joint in the system would have to have lead, right? From VIA's Lead-Free Manufacturing page:
Of course, I don't know what everyone's got against lead. If all the claims you hear were true then my old man (who breathes in solder fumes for up to 80 hours a week) should have died of lead poisioning forty years ago. He reckons milk is the answer. :)
There have been lead-free solder alloys available for some time. The early ones were based on bismuth, but the melting temperature was so high it tended to fry all the components on the board and even cause the boards themselves to delaminate.
m 338.html
The current favorites are the tin/silver/copper alloys, such as this: http://www.alphametals.com/products/solderpaste/o
Their melting ("reflow") temperature is only about 20C above the standard 63/37 tin-lead solders, so it's not too hard on the boards or components.
Believe it or not, there's a lot of science that goes into putting all those little parts on the board, melting the solder and cleaning up !
You don't know how lucky you are - if this was 500 years ago, you'd receive the medieval punishment for telling bad puns.
You'd be drawn and quoted.
Weaselmancer
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
The origin of the problems is typical heavy metal toxicity - lead has many available electron orbitals that can form weak bonds with proteins. At the active sites of enzymes, where there are many ligands on the protein, the heavy metal can sit in there, and bind tighter than the intended species. This essentially blocks the action of those affected enzymes. Different heavy metals have different affinities for different enzymes [0], so have different effects, but that's the general mechanism for heavy metal poisioning.
The next problem is that because the metals bind to proteins, they stay there, so that as each plant or animal is consumed, there is a concentrating action as you move up the food chain. Thus, for example, herbivourus fish might collect a small quantiy of mercury, the fish that eat them have more, and the tuna that eat those have even more. Ok, that's not lead, but I can't reacall a specific example for lead at the moment - the principle still holds. It's worth noting that the typical human diet puts them at the top of the food chain.
There is a difference between lead as a metal, and lead in a compound. It should be clear that the lead that is the problem is bioavailable lead - a solid lump of the metal might not be the biggest source of lead - although I suspect that chewing on a block of lead would be as bad, or worse than the paint.
With lead in a fish tank, I suspect that the lead forms a thin layer of an oxide or similar, that reduces the rate the metal dissolves at. This is similar to aluminum and chromium, but I think it's less efective. The small lead released would probably be less damaging to the fish that the effect of other metals (for example, iron would make the tank acidic, aluminium would make it alkaline, and so on). That's a case of minisming hard (although I'd suggest that a plastic would probably be better).
[0] Non enzyme proteins tend not have that many bindable sites, and those that do generally don't suffer much. It's principly enzyme blocking that's a problem, in general.
You know, if people didn't go out and by new mobos every six months because they're substituting for diminished manhoods, then they wouldn't be trashing their old mobos every six months. This race to get the biggest and fasted CPU and GPU on the block is much more dangerous than the lead in a mobo that's being used past its planned obsolescence date.
I think this just depends on what you do with the old mobo. Perhaps I am alone in this, but I rarely throw away working electronics. I can usually either find some use for them, or find someone who wants them. My last computer was given to my girlfriend who doesn't feel the need to upgrade as often as I do. I have given coutless parts to friends and family, because I had replaced them, and they could use them. About the only thing I have considered throwing away is my old 486, which I haven't been able to find a good home for. I haven't brought myself to do it yet, mostly because I am a pack-rat, that and the fact that it was still working perfectly the last time I fired it up (though I did put newer hard drive in it, to get it there). Even that, I would rather give to someone who will use it than put it in a land-fill. I've considered a school, but I think its too old for even them.
I guess my point is, it isn't the upgrade cycle that is causing the problem, its the idiots who throw out perfectly good hardware. Sure, it won't run the latest games well, but it might do well for someone's over-glorified typewriter.
Necessity is the mother of invention.
Laziness is the father.
I don't know about milk, but apparently cilantro (coriander / Chinese parsley) can help. When patients are given soup with plenty of cilantro juice in it, their levels dropped much faster than those who are receiving normal treatment only. Of course, this isn't scientific evidence, and they have no idea if it works on its own, or just as an aid to conventional chelation. Still, it is something to keep in mind.
ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI
What in the hell? Green does NOT mean living in a thatched hut eating berries. If 6 billion people reverted to hunter/gatherer the planet would be stripped bare in less than a year. No green wants that.
For F's Sake people, use your brains and quit spouting propaganda at each other.
Green means finding a technological solution to the fossil fuel problem (finite supply, source of pollutants). There is absolutely no reason to think that a hydrogen powered SUV is in any way a step backwards.
Green means putting solar on your roof and becoming energy self sufficient. Maybe even sell surplus back to the grid. (yes I am aware of the pollutants that solar manufacturing potentially represents, however a) its localized and controllable, b) advances over time will lead to reductions in the pollutants, as scale of economy increases)
Green means finding a technology solution to feeding our children without destroying the land that we grow it on (or perhaps you think that the Dust Bowl was good for our moral fiber?) The answer here is not patented genetically modified foods, which can't be seeded from the previous year's crop and require exorbitant licensing fees to biotech companies.
Green means encouraging/funding zero population growth (i.e. replacement births). Yes this is "family planning". In most nations of the world family planning means just that, planning how many children to conceive - or rather how many NOT to conceive. But to bass ackward U.S. conservatives all they see is 'abortion' when they hear family planning. Sheesh.
Green means smart progress, yet people like you spout your bullsh*t anytime you are confronted by the idea that change can be good. No no! Protect my comfortable status quo! Never mind that even if we did nothing, eventually it will be changed for us by the laws of physics!
Sorry for the rant, mods do with me what you will..
CRT there's a kilogram or so, used to shield the user from xrays.
Yeah, but that's mixed in the glass, and isn't going anywhere for the next several millenia or more. In several hundred million years when that glass gets subducted under the mantle and remelts, I doubt humans will be around to worry.
I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.
The trouble with lead free solders is that they all have considerably higher melting points than lead-based solders. The "standard" lead-based solder has a melting point of 183C. The best available lead-free solders have melting points in the 220C range. That's a big jump. All the manufacturing processes have to be reworked. Some components need to be redesigned for higher soldering temperature tolerance. Some components must be repackaged in different plastics. It's not trivial.
Here's a good summary of the issues.
CRTs do not "use" X-rays, but they certainly produce them. In fact, Roentgen discovered X-rays specifically using a CRT. The X-rays are produced when the cathode ray strikes the glass wall or the screen itself.
If it happens, I will make sure NOT to melt down any Via motherboards to cast lead bullets for our muskets.
Go ask anyone who's got a child who's eaten lead-based paint and is now sick forever if lead is safe. This is a GOOD thing. If we kept our components forever no one would care, but people in countries like China are disposing of all that US waste - and killing themselves by doing so. It's deplorable. I'll be looking into this.
Lindows Steals Copyrighted Art and Promotes Porn
Stick to programming. Your physics isn't all that hot.
How can we continue to believe in a just universe and freedom to eat crackers if we have no ale?
For what? You did just like I said. Besides, do you think that copying from a google search with the keywords extreme, quotes, environmentalists is a deliberate and constructive way to contribute to a discussion?
Ok, that begs the question: how many parents are feeding lead-based paint to their children?
Seriously, though, people aren't generally in direct contact with the lead contained in their motherboards, cards, hard disks, etc. The problem is supposed to occur at disposal time when it is alleged that lead and other heavy metals leach out of the refuse and in to the water table, and hence into the local water supply/food chain. With recycling companies breaking-up computers and other electronic devices into their constituent materials and reselling "raw" materials this should become less and less of an issue.
I'm not convinced of the lead problem myself. There isn't anything in this world today where everyone says it's good for you and nobody is saying it will kill you - just look at diets and mobile phones. One well-known atmospheric scientist who is a big proponent of global warming at the moment was pushing the coming of an ice age in the 1960's and 70's. His excuse? He was "wrong" back then. So, who's right and who can you believe?
If you were to look at this from an anti-Lead-Free point of view, one could wonder whether Lead-Free petrol has benefited the environment or not, since Lead-Free petrol has caused increases in SO2 emissions which cause H2SO4 acid rain and decimation of forests in Sweden and Norway as well as damage to old and ancient structures in France, Italy and Greece.
What exactly is this "kilogram" you speak of? I think it might just exist in the same alternate universe where people get to upgrade their computers annualy.
The pollution isn't appreciable at your consumer (and disposer) end - the critical mass is in manufacturing. And in the landfills loaded with your neighbors disposed boards. Every one of us does our part, whether we notice or not. The same might be said for your lost sinkers, but the scale is too small and diffuse to matter (yet).
Capitalism eats away at the communistic principle of hiding production costs where the Party collects its dues, the factory, obscuring the full costs including disposal and even occasional cleanup. So corporations with a sustainable strategy are getting out from under their eventual liability by moving to cleaner production. Intel is one of the most forward-strategic corporations on the planet, and Via is their competition, with a longterm survival attitude. You might drop this "political correctness" kneejerk and get with the program for a livable future, like the rest of us.
--
make install -not war
However, Roentgen tubes use much higher voltages (100 kV at least) than CRTs (about 25 kV), and so the intensity of X rays is much lower. The screen itself, made of thick glass with a trace amount of lead, is sufficient to stop them. I tried to measure the radiation at the screen with a dosimeter, and got nothing except the usual ambient radiation (10 micro Roentgen / hour or so).
good job!
first, many eu companies produce in taiwan, malaysia and so on. second, many non-eu companies produce in eu (amd in dresden for example)
Conservatism: The fear that somewhere, somehow, someone you think is your inferior is being treated as your equal.
Correctly rated as "troll". But to enlighten you...
One mobo is not a big problem. But the zillions of circuit boards thrown away every year, when they're all taken together, *are* a problem. It's the same as smokeless zones - one campfire is not a problem, but an entire city with coal fires screws up the air.
You don't plan eating your mobo, but wherever they're shipped to (usually China) for "recycling", this shit dissolves out of the piles of boards and seeps into the water supplies. So people over there are *literally* eating and drinking the metals out of your mobo. Life expectancy in those areas is pretty damn short, due to poisoning from lead, cadmium, arsenic and other nasties.
Grab.
There isn't anything in this world today where everyone says it's good for you and nobody is saying it will kill you - just look at diets and mobile phones.
Yeah, but there are many things that everyone says are bad for you, and no one thinks are good. Lead is one.
With recycling companies breaking-up computers and other electronic devices into their constituent materials and reselling "raw" materials this should become less and less of an issue.
BTW, How many computer recycling companies are accepting computers from your area? Maybe I'm just uninformed, but I haven't heard of any that would take my old computer parts.