Slashdot Mirror


Alan Turing, the Inventor of Software

Roland Piquepaille writes "BusinessWeek celebrates its anniversary with a series of articles about the great thinkers and innovators from the past 75 years. The series stars with a profile of Alan Turing, "Thinking Up Computers." In case you forgot, Turing is the man who created the concept of a "universal machine" which would perform various and diverse actions when given various sets of instructions. In other words, he laid out in the 1920s the foundations of software. You'll find the introduction of Turing's profile, plus more details, photographs and references in this overview."

371 comments

  1. Ah, but is it a real article... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...or just a computer-generated one?

    1. Re:Ah, but is it a real article... by October · · Score: 5, Insightful

      But of course the real point is: could you tell the difference?

    2. Re:Ah, but is it a real article... by cluckshot · · Score: 1

      Judging by the other posts and etc, I would say it is a generated post, though I would doubt a computer generated it. Many "Gay" references indicate something else is going on.

      Also this is a bit of historical CRAP. No doubt that the man may have done some important things, but Inventing the Idea of computers is not one of them. The invention of the computer as a concept is as old as the vision of a machine that can do something. Bluntly "Prior Art." His sesquipedalian obfuscation of articulation is simply that.

      The history of the computer is more profoundly tied to Jaquard Lace and the US Census etc. I suppose that the code cracking efforts during the two world wars. R. Adm.Grace Hopper might have had some real influence here too. Ada might have entered the processes too!

      The deliberate warping of history for various political and other purposes is also a "Prior Art." It doesn't make it any less of a curiousity or right though.

      --
      Never Politically Correct ~ I prefer the facts If you don't like what I say, get a life, or comment yourself.
    3. Re:Ah, but is it a real article... by DuckDodgers · · Score: 1

      The Turing Machine is arguably the theoretical foundation of computing.

      So while you are correct that neither the idea of computers nor the first implementations of computers can be credited to Alan Turing, you might call him the father of the concept of programming.

    4. Re:Ah, but is it a real article... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      am i the only one who thinks alan turing is attractive? hehehe. someone should put him on hotornot. :)

    5. Re:Ah, but is it a real article... by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      There's also the Church-Turing Thesis, wherein they posit the concept of "most powerful finite computer", and that the Turing Machine (and equivalent ilk) satisfy it.

      It's a thesis because it hasn't been proven. However, no more powerful machine has been discovered that is still finite in nature. (In this case, it means no more than a finite number of operations in a finite amount of time.)

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
  2. Turing was also... by JessLeah · · Score: 3, Insightful

    gay. This is a fact that much of the mainstream media glosses over in noting his accomplishments. (It is possible that there is an anti-gay bias in the history book authors' community... ;) )

    So, any time someone says gays are just a bunch of promiscuous, stupid sinners, ask them if they've ever heard of Alan Turing... :)

    1. Re:Turing was also... by HBI · · Score: 3, Funny

      I doubt most of the media would pass a Turing test.

      --
      HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
    2. Re:Turing was also... by not_a_product_id · · Score: 5, Informative

      I've read a quite a few things that suggested cold-war surveilance by the british secret service was what drove him to suicide (they were worried that his homosexuality would make him a 'security risk'). IIRC that also led them to remove most of his access to top level work which increased his depression.

      --

      ---
      We spoke for about a half an hour. I don't recall a thing we said. - Colorblind James Experience

    3. Re:Turing was also... by the_mad_poster · · Score: 0, Troll

      At which point they would say:

      What fer now yer bringin' dem fajits 'round these here parts? I ain't never hearda no turin cep' for that Jesus thing, but it does fer surely sound like a fajit name tah me!

      Get me mah shootin' stick maw! We got summa them thar edurmacated city type folk on our front lawn! Git now! Y'hear?

      --
      Alito: A vote for Alito is a punch in the eye to put that bitch back in her place!
    4. Re:Turing was also... by JosKarith · · Score: 5, Informative

      Let's not forget that Turing's life was pretty much destroyed when his homosexuality became public knowledge.
      AFAIK he was robbed by one of his lovers and when he reported it to the police and they found out the relationship between the two they arrested Turing on charges of Lewd and Immoral Acts. This lead to a persecution that destroyed any chance of his working again, and eventually his life.
      Hell of a way to treat a man who saved hundreds, maybe thousands of lives by breaking the Enigma cypher.
      Who knows how much more advanced our understanding of AI's might be if it wasn't for institutionalised homophobia?

      --
      'Don't worry' said the trees when they saw the axe coming, 'The handle is one of us.'
    5. Re:Turing was also... by jea6 · · Score: 5, Informative

      I don't how it's relevant to discuss Alan Turing's sexuality in the context of his contributions to computer science.

      Maybe you' dlike to see somthing like this:

      BusinessWeek celebrates its anniversary with a series of articles about the great gay and straight thinkers and innovators from the past 75 years. The series stars with a profile of Alan Turing, "Thinking Up Computers." In case you forgot, Turing is the gay man who created the concept of an "universal machine" which would perform various and diverse actions when given various sets of instructions. In other words, he laid out in the 1920s the foundations of software. You'll find the introduction of Turing's profile, plus more details, photographs and references in this overview."

      Alan Turing's being gay was certainly an important part of his life. After all, the persectution he suffered contributed to his death. But to have to label him right off the bat everytime his name is uttered is absurd.

      In any case, had you read past the title and ad, you'd have come across the FIRST PARAGRAPH which reads:

      The rarefied world of early 20th-century mathematics seems light years away from today's PCs and virtual-reality video games. Yet it was a 1936 paper by Cambridge University mathematician Alan M. Turing that laid the foundation for the electronic wonders now crowding into every corner of modern life. In a short and eventful life, Turing also played a vital role in World War II by helping crack Germany's secret codes -- only to be persecuted later for his homosexuality.

      Before whining about gay-bias, RTFA.

      --

      sarchasm: The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who doesn't get it.
    6. Re:Turing was also... by NoOneInParticular · · Score: 5, Informative

      It wasn't exactly the removal of access that increased his depression, it probably had more to do with the forceful administration of hormones to cure his 'disease'. Due to these hormones he grew breasts. Not fun. That's the thanks he got for his war efforts and contributions to science.

    7. Re:Turing was also... by p2sam · · Score: 1

      If not for people like Turing and Tutt, the Allies might not have won altogether.

    8. Re:Turing was also... by Debian+Troll's+Best · · Score: 3, Funny
      gay. This is a fact that much of the mainstream media glosses over in noting his accomplishments.

      There are actually several mentions of Turing's sexual orientation within the linked article, including the horrendous treatment he received as a result of the increasingly open displays of his homosexuality he exhibited later in his life. It is a disgrace that such a key figure in the eventual overthrow of the Nazi regime (due to his contributions in cracking the Enigma code) could be subjected to such degrading mistreatment, not even ten years after the conclusion of the war.

      What the article does not cover, however, is if Turing were alive today, would he prefer the elaborate menu-driven splendor of dselect, or the minimalist elegance of dpkg. That's what I would like to see the media pay some attention to.

    9. Re:Turing was also... by Enigma_Man · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why is that important? Do you list whether or not a person is heterosexual in an article or biography about someone? What about the color of their skin or hair.

      I can just imagine all the articles. Joe Schmoe, a straight white man with brown hair, accomplished much in his life blah blah.

      Oh noooo, it's a conspiracy against the gay! Let's all point the prejudice finger.

      -Jesse

      --
      Nothing says "unprofessional job" like wrinkles in your duct tape.
    10. Re:Turing was also... by gclef · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You know what? I think that's a good thing, for one reason: his sexual orientation really has nothing to do with his mathematical and scientific achievements. Honestly, I don't care that he was gay. He was a great mathematician. That's all that matters.

    11. Re:Turing was also... by JohnGrahamCumming · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The article clearly points this fact out, as does every other frikkin' article on Alan Turing, to which the answer should probably be: WHO GIVES A CRAP?

      Why waste ink on this almost useless fact (other than it perhaps leading to the circumstances of his death) when there's a lot more worth saying about the guy.

      I just hope that if I ever doing something amazing that after my death we don't get to read:

      "John Graham-Cumming invented the Banana Wumpus Driver. At age 13 he realized that he was attracted to women and spent his entire life in pursuit of sexual encounters with various women until he finally married..."

      John.

    12. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Is it possible that his sexual preference is entirely irrelevant to his historical contributions?

      Ignoring something that is irrelevant is not the same as being insensitive to a topic.

    13. Re:Turing was also... by DickBreath · · Score: 1

      Why is that important? Do you list whether or not a person is heterosexual in an article or biography about someone?

      When a certian feature is common, it is not worth mentioning. When a feature is uncommon, it is worth a mention. It might not be worth a mention in a one sentence summary. It might not be the thing you mention in the first paragraph. But it certianly shouldn't be omitted. It is a very important and significant fact.

      The articles do rightly mention it and don't try to hide it.

      Mentioning that Alan Turing was gay is as relevant as mentioning that Steven Hawking suffers from ALS. It is an important fact about the man. Not something to hide.

      It is especially not something to hide because of the injustice that Turing suffered as a result.

      --

      I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
    14. Re:Turing was also... by Hooded+One · · Score: 1

      Being gay myself, I'm of mixed feelings on this.

      On the one hand, I understand the need to have positive examples of homosexuals who have contributed to our society.

      On the other hand, I don't think I'd want to be remembered as "that guy who did that really cool thing with the stuff... oh yeah, and he loved the cock." Even if nobody saw that as a negative thing anymore, it just has nothing to with my accomplishments, unless they're in the area of homosexual activism. Or porn.

    15. Re:Turing was also... by Lars+T. · · Score: 3, Funny
      "John Graham-Cumming invented the Banana Wumpus Driver. At age 13 he realized that he was attracted to women and spent his entire life in pursuit of sexual encounters with various women until he finally married..."

      And then you stopped? Yeah, right ;-)

      --

      Lars T.

      To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck

    16. Re:Turing was also... by rcamera · · Score: 1

      i pointed out that he was gay in a post yesterday and got modded as a troll

      --
      Wave upon wave of demented avengers March cheerfully out of obscurity into the dream
    17. Re:Turing was also... by Tri0de · · Score: 1

      Most of the idiot homphobes (wait- I'm being redundant) wouldn't know Turing from Barney the Dinosaur.

      --
      "Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts."
    18. Re:Turing was also... by Aardpig · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Why waste ink on this almost useless fact (other than it perhaps leading to the circumstances of his death) when there's a lot more worth saying about the guy.

      Perhaps because Turing was driven to suicide by an establishment which hounded and bullied him for being gay? By no stretch of the imagination is that a useless fact.

      --
      Tubal-Cain smokes the white owl.
    19. Re:Turing was also... by eaolson · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Why is that important? Do you list whether or not a person is heterosexual in an article or biography about someone? What about the color of their skin or hair.

      Depends. Was he persecuted for being straight? Did he lose his security clearance, get forced to take massive doses of hormones, and be driven to suicide in spite of his contribution to the WWII war effort?

      Any story that would try to talk about Turing but not even mention such details that were so critically important to his life wouldn't be complete.

    20. Re:Turing was also... by andalay · · Score: 1

      Thats slightly off-topic to include into the article. I knew Turing was gay. Anyone who knows anything about Turing besides what you learn about Turing machines knows hes gay.

      Its dumb to have to include sexual orientation when that clearly does not have any impact on the topic under discussion (innovators and thinkers).

      IMHO of course

    21. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think they were worried he would be blackmailed over his cottaging.

    22. Re:Turing was also... by minus9 · · Score: 1

      For trolling of this quality there should be a +1 Troll mod. If emoticons were not so stupid there would be a smiley one right here.

    23. Re:Turing was also... by Enigma_Man · · Score: 1

      The parent said that the "mainstream media" glosses over him being gay when mentioning his accomplishments. I don't like my accomplishments to be prefaced by "hetero" or "white", and I'm sure Hawking doesn't like his accomplishments to be prefaced by something like "Despite suffering from ALS". The parent poster is just pointing his prejudice finger (without even RTFA no less). I don't think that an uncommon (though being homosexual isn't _that_ uncommon) feature is worth mentioning if it has no relevance to the topic at hand. Why not mention he liked to have his nipples tweaked while we're at it?

      You are right though that it's not good to hide facts like he was persecuted for being homosexual, I just don't think it should be listed alongside, or despite his accomplishments.

      -Jesse

      --
      Nothing says "unprofessional job" like wrinkles in your duct tape.
    24. Re:Turing was also... by ch-chuck · · Score: 1

      Alan Turing also suffered from corns on his toes, which definitely shows an anti corn-on-the-toes bias in the news media since it is rarely mentioned.

      --
      try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
    25. Re:Turing was also... by flyneye · · Score: 0, Troll

      Dont forget folks,the british empire castrated poofs they caught back then too!

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    26. Re:Turing was also... by flyneye · · Score: 0, Redundant

      The English used to cure homosexuality with castration back in those days.bet he was threatened with that too.

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    27. Re:Turing was also... by vwjeff · · Score: 1

      Question. What does someone's sexual orientation have to do with their accomplishments? The fact he was homosexual means nothing.

      Is there an anti-gay bias in the media, sure. When people do not understand something they tend to not talk about it.

      So, any time someone says gays are just a bunch of promiscuous, stupid sinners, ask them if they've ever heard of Alan Turing

      This is not true for most homosexuals. This is also not true for most heterosexuals. The fact however is that the crazy minority get all of the attention. This is true for all groups of people.

    28. Re:Turing was also... by The+Evil+Couch · · Score: 1
      it's not quite useless. the reason why people being straight isn't typically mentioned is because that's our society's norm. you don't have to say that someone was straight, because it's implied by not stating otherwise.

      however, Turing was gay. it wouldn't be telling the full story if the fact wasn't at least mentioned (which is was) in the article.

      same sort of thing goes for anything that someone would want to write about George Washington Carver. as a black, he's a minority, and it needs to be implicitly stated that his was(which it also, typically is)

      it's an important detail which can't be left out, but you're right that it's not really the most important part when talking about scientific contributions.

    29. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      wouldn't know Turing from Barney the Dinosaur

      That's because Barney is gay too.

    30. Re:Turing was also... by flyneye · · Score: 1

      Well,I think he's already been outed.Putting him back in the closet isn't an answer either.
      lets take him out and put him on the shelf with other famous queers.Alexander the Great,Michelangelo,Benjamin Franklin,Andy Warhol... etc.
      Whats the diff really in this day and age? Sexual preference is broadly accepted as a subject when discussing those in the limelight.Pick up an entertainment magazine worth its salt and read!
      His accomplishments will always outshine the fact that he liked to smoke boys.

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    31. Re:Turing was also... by wcrowe · · Score: 1

      Ugh! I would have preferred NOT knowing that he was gay. It's like finding out that Albert Einstein liked to eat his own boogers.

      --
      Proverbs 21:19
    32. Re:Turing was also... by AlecC · · Score: 1

      Because his sexual orientation led directly to his suicide. It stopped him doing proper work after the war, and killed him when, apparently, he still had a lot more to give to computer research.

      If his sexuality had been, as it should have been, part of his prite life, then it would of course be unimportant and not worth mentioning. For most people nowadays that would be the case. Unfortunately, for Turing that was not the case. Any bio that ignored it would be to leave out vital facts about his laife and death.

      He was the best example I know of how anti-gay prejudice had deprived the world of talent. How many other talented gays (and women, and coloured people... ) have we lost through bigoted ignorance.

      --
      Consciousness is an illusion caused by an excess of self consciousness.
    33. Re:Turing was also... by AmicoToni · · Score: 1

      So was Leonardo da Vinci, according to most historians, although he kept a very low profile about it (for obvious reasons. Turing was not so lucky)

    34. Re:Turing was also... by Gannoc · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The article clearly points this fact out, as does every other frikkin' article on Alan Turing, to which the answer should probably be: WHO GIVES A CRAP?

      Because its a big freaking deal. Its not like he was a mathmatician who happened to also be gay on the side. After helping immensely in WW2, and inventing programming, he was forced to admit he was homosexual.

      He was imprisoned as a security risk, and forced to either spend the rest of his life in jail or take hormone injections. He chose the hormone injections. His career was over, and he wasn't allowed to continue to work on the thing he is now famous for. Its strongly suspected that the forced government injections helped drive him to suicide a few years later.

      FORCED GOVERNMENT INJECTIONS to try to stop him from being gay, and therefore easily susceptible to communists.

      I know many people are jaded by political correctness and media hype, but in this case, it is a BIG GODDAMN ISSUE that this guy was gay.

    35. Re:Turing was also... by Sri+Lumpa · · Score: 1


      If they are Europeans tell them that without fags* they would** live in the Third Reich.

      An yes, I am European.

      * sorry to homosexual to use this particular word but in this context I feel it has more impact and more power to convey the message than a more politically correct one.

      ** it would be more exact to say probably but, again, it dilutes the impact of the message.

      --
      "The obvious mathematical breakthrough would be development of an easy way to factor large prime numbers." Bill Gates,
    36. Re:Turing was also... by eyeball · · Score: 1

      I'm actually glad that (at least most of the time), tech biographies leave out any reference to the subject's personal life, since it generally has little to do with their works. I mean who cares if the guy that invented language X was married twice, or the guy that invented OS Y never got married.

      I think by glossing over the fact that Turing was gay saves us from having to read about every other non-gay inventor's personal life (oh except Linus' pot smoking).

      --

      _______
      2B1ASK1
    37. Re:Turing was also... by Monty · · Score: 1

      Well, think for a second. The end result was suicide, which is not something a person does on a whim. Yet he managed to accomplish everything he did in spite of how other people made him feel for his sexuality earlier.

      The key here is that the minority isn't just some minority, it's one that most people treated and still treat pretty badly. In this way, simultaneously being homosexual and one of the key figures in computer science is one of his accomplishments, not some trivial fact that we should ignore.

    38. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      : [The fact that Turing was gay] is a fact that much of the mainstream media glosses over in noting his accomplishments.

      And rightfully so. Are you saying he wouldn't have done those things if he wasn't gay. Are you saying he would have done more if he wasn't gay? I don't see a relation between his sexual orientation and his accomplishments, so the lack of mention indicates a lack of prejudice.

    39. Re:Turing was also... by dr_canak · · Score: 3

      I'm sorry, but:

      "Turing was also gay. This is a fact that much of the mainstream media glosses over in noting his accomplishments"

      I didn't know that being gay should be considered an "accomplishment." Certainly important in an autobiographical sense but not an accomplishment. I'm not trolling or flaimbaiting, just pointing out that the tone of the parent may not be as intentioned but it's a tone that suggests an agenda nonetheless.

      jeff

    40. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think the fact he was gay should be pointed out. Young people need heroes they can have something in common with. There are Christian heroes, African-American heroes, Texan heroes, war heroes from every region of the world.... and children from each of those groups/regions can look up to those particular heroes and say, "I want to be like him/her when grow up!" Well, Alan Turing can be one of those heroes that a young homosexual can look up to and say, "I can do great things too!"

      And hopefully, they won't get martyred like he was.

    41. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Is there an anti-gay bias in the media, sure.

      You don't get the Dallas Morning News, do you? They have a requirement that at least once per week, they must feature a full page article on a homosexual and paint them in the most glowing terms.

      For that matter, you must not watch much national news either.

      The pro-homosexual bias is extremely clear in both print and broadcast TV.

    42. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting
      Do you list whether or not a person is heterosexual in an article or biography about someone?

      And there you hit the nail on the head. Its a biographical article - about Turings life story - and of significant interest because of how his homosexuality affected his life. It may make no real difference to many other gay people being reviewed in the magazine in other places.

      If it was meant to be a discussion solely of his technical contributions, why then it wouldn't even need to mention the war, but would probably be out of PHB comprehension land, and so not in Business Week.

      It pisses me off that candidates for the UKs greatest wordsmith (Oscar Wilde) and scientist of the last century ended up dying (indirectly) due to the authorities prejudices.

    43. Re:Turing was also... by wwest4 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      > I don't how it's relevant to discuss Alan Turing's sexuality in the context of
      > his contributions to computer science.

      It's only relevant because he was a _persecuted_ gay. Now we know that perpetrators of this particular type of discrimination can be enemies of science. There are always a set of poltically correct ways to discriminate (e.g. awards, reputation, curriculum vitae) and politically incorrect ways to discriminate (gender, age, race, etc). Sexual orientation used to be an unquestionably acceptable criterion for discrimination, and Turing's example shows why that's changing.

      > But to have to label him right off the bat everytime his name is uttered is
      > absurd.

      That's like saying that we shouldn't say Jackie Robinson was black when talking about his accomplishments. His race is central to the the story of what baseball gained by his entry in to game. Turing's sexuality is central to the story of what computer science lost due to Turing's expulsion from the field.

    44. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Is it possible that his sexual preference is entirely irrelevant to his
      > historical contributions?

      It's relevant to the contributions he was prevented from making. If he wasn't discriminated against, it wouldn't matter.

    45. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I retract what I said (the parent post) after reading the other posts in this thread. His homosexuality did indeed affect his accomplishements. Had he not suicided due to matters relating to his homosexuality, he might have done more.

      However, the article reads like a résumé, and on a résumé, one avoids anything that's not immediately relevant, one avoids controversy, and one avoids even the hint of impropriety. The writters were justified in ommitting this bibliographical detail. If his homosexuality was the drive behind those discoveries and inventions, then it's another story.

    46. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > I didn't know that being gay should be considered an "accomplishment."

      I think you might need a basic grammar refresher, and some meds for your paranoia - a double entendre doesn't always mean someone has a hidden agenda.

    47. Re:Turing was also... by ctid · · Score: 1

      He was a great mathematician, to be sure, but he was also a great mathematician who committed suicide when he was convicted of engaging in homosexual activities and was forced to undergo treatment to "chemically castrate" him. He died at 42, so it's fair to assume that he would have achieved even more if he had lived. So I think his homosexuality is relevant, unfortunately.

      --
      Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
    48. Re:Turing was also... by kevin+lyda · · Score: 1

      his persecution for being gay has a lot to due with his mathematical and scientific achievements. namely: he'd have contributed a lot more to the field if he hadn't been driven to kill himself by authorities.

      i think that's something to note - and the article did note it.

      --
      US Citizen living abroad? Register to vote!
    49. Re:Turing was also... by ragnar · · Score: 1

      His sexual preference is mildly interesting in that it led to the demise of his career, but aside from this it isn't newsworthy. People in minority situations are trying hard to get the removal of their status from mention. How many times do we hear of someone referred to as a {black,latino,gay,etc} person for no apparent reason, other than to illuminate the presumption that a person is white and straight? I think we will make more progress to leave private and irrelevant matters aside.

      --
      -- Solaris Central - http://w
    50. Re:Turing was also... by tgibbs · · Score: 1

      Reports of the professional accomplishments of heterosexuals only rarely mention their sexual preferences. So emphasizing this fact specifically for a gay man might itself be perceived as evidence of bias. On the other hand, in biographies--where such personal information is generally regarded as relevant--Alan Turing's sexual preference is generally addressed.

    51. Re:Turing was also... by An+Elephant · · Score: 1
      I don't how it's relevant to discuss Alan Turing's sexuality in the context of his contributions to computer science.
      Actually it is relevant, if you know that in the original Turing Test the computer is not just generally asked to "pass for human"; the specific setting in which it is required to do so is a game where a man and a woman are trying to convince the referee about their genders (I think they're both trying to be the woman). Now, if you can replace a computer for one of the participants without the referee noticing, you pass the test.

      You think homosexuality is irrelevant to that?

    52. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What?!?!? That fucking breeder?!!?!? I'll never respect him again. God, that's DISGUSTING.

    53. Re:Turing was also... by pilgrim23 · · Score: 1

      Researcher X has a "inie" bellybutton. Researcher Y has an "outie". Politician A is left handed, Politician B is right. Different folks, different strokes. What DIFFERENCE does it make if a Man (woman, gender neutral expression denoting primate, whatever) is Gay, Straight, or prefers something else? I can see a discussion of someone's sexual preference, ethnicity, height, weight, country of origin, hair style, fashion sense, etc in the proper context, but, what has it to do with (to use a saying of that age) the price of tea in China? Yes previous generations treated homosexuality as a disease. They also treated Asthma with heroin... and an earlier crop of doctors treated you with leeches for almost anything. This should teach us to be somewhat wary of doctors in ANY era. Placing our modern mindset, morals and the like on an earlier era serves little imho. Turing was a great man. All geeks today owe him their gratitude. Yes he was mistreated and abused, more so if viewed by today's standards. Where this abuse, or even his preference reflects on the story of his research and discoveries, it pertains. Where it reflects more on someone's "agenda", it does not.

      --
      - Minutus cantorum, minutus balorum, minutus carborata descendum pantorum.
    54. Re:Turing was also... by jea6 · · Score: 1

      Here's what I think:

      The poster I replied to was whining that the anti-gay agenda neglects to mention Turing was gay despite the fact that the article says so in the first paragraph.

      I also don't think it's necessary for the parent story to say "Alan Turing, the Gay Inventor of Software". My sense is that people prefer not to be labeled. For example, "User 'An Elephant', a (gay|straight) (man|woman) from (Vermont|Israel), posts comments on Slashdot two to three times a year." Explain to me how your sexual preference, gender, location are relevant? They're not. In due time, I would come to find out that 'An Elephant' is a (gay|straight) (man|woman) from (Vermont|Israel). Or does your business card read (Gay|Straight) UI Engineer?

      As to your point of whether homosexuality is relevant to a Turing Test: In Turing's original proposal, the human participants had to pretend to be the other gender, and the test was limited to a five-minute conversation. These features are nowadays not considered to be essential and are generally not included in the specification of the Turing test [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turing_test].

      I'm not sure why that is not considered relevant today, I can imagine that a scenario that includes a gender-factor is more likely to be considered by somebody who more often considers sexuality. However, I don't think that's limited to British gay men.

      I don't think Turing's only contribution to society was that he was a gay genius; his contribution was that he was a genius.

      --

      sarchasm: The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who doesn't get it.
    55. Re:Turing was also... by Colonel+Cholling · · Score: 2, Funny

      No, you're not trying hard enough. Here's how it should go:

      The series starts with a profile of Alan "Big Gay Al" Turing, "Gaying Up Computers." In case you forgot, Turing is the gay man who came up with the gay concept of a "universal gay machine" which would perform lots of gay calculations while being tastefully decorated to match the curtains. Turing did a lot of gay codebreaking during WWII and contributed to the foundations of gay software and gay computer science. Fabulous!

      --

      I am Sartre of the Borg. Existence is futile.
    56. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Making a point of him being gay every time his name is mentioned might be an overkill, but you do have to realize that his sexuality played a very big part in his life, and how it ended.

      Why dont you see articles that say "this man was straight"? You see, straight men dont get given estrogen injections when they get caught with, say a hooker in the bed. They dont get criminalized for being with who they want to be with. Not very good with words here, but recognize the man for what he was.

    57. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Thanks. You've just proven my example. The parent "Idiot homophobes" comment has a score of 2, while my attempt to discuss the possibility that homosexuality may be an incorrect choice is modded "-1 Flamebait".

      Thank you for proving me correct.

    58. Re:Turing was also... by An+Elephant · · Score: 1

      I didn't mean to imply that they should have named him "Gay Genius", only to remind people about the gender thing and note that it is probably related to his sexuality.

      I probably should have put it in a reply higher up the thread... I didn't intend to contradict you at all, I agree with most of what you said before and all of what you said now.

    59. Re:Turing was also... by CTachyon · · Score: 1

      What the article does not cover, however, is if Turing were alive today, would he prefer the elaborate menu-driven splendor of dselect, or the minimalist elegance of dpkg. That's what I would like to see the media pay some attention to.

      My money is on dselect. He was a pretty practical guy a lot of the time (e.g. the Turing Test). dselect gives you a more straightforward idea of what's going on in dependency-land.

      --
      Range Voting: preference intensity matters
    60. Re:Turing was also... by pjack76 · · Score: 1
      I can just imagine all the articles. Joe Schmoe, a straight white man with brown hair, accomplished much in his life blah blah.

      Actually this happens all the time: "Joe Schmoe invented the gnordyfnort and helped humanity survive WWII. In his latter days, he suffered from Alzeihmer's, but died peacefully in his country house surrounded by his wife and four children."

      Mention of a man's family happens all the time in brief biographies, unless he was living with another man. Although that is starting to change.

      And anyway the current article really does mention that Turing was persecuted later in life, and I'd even say the article adopts a moral tone about the persecution.

      So I wouldn't use this article as an example of anti-gay bias, however I will assert that famous/important people's heterosexuality really is flaunted left in right in media. You just don't notice it because you're so used to it.

      --

      Wow, a lucrative publishing contract! I don't have to be evil anymore. --Meteor

    61. Re:Turing was also... by CTachyon · · Score: 1

      I think the fact he was gay should be pointed out. Young people need heroes they can have something in common with. ... Well, Alan Turing can be one of those heroes that a young homosexual can look up to and say, "I can do great things too!"

      He was to me, ever since I first read about him at age 17. In fact, tied only with Albert Einstein (mostly for his irreverent attitude toward seriousness and convention, and his opposition of McCarthyism -- I think of him as a proto-Discordian), he's pretty much my biggest hero.

      And to those who say that Turing's sexuality isn't worth mentioning: a hero is someone with a personality, someone defined by more than what they accomplished. Strip them of that, and they become a mere "historical figure". That's why people think history is boring.

      And hopefully, they won't get martyred like he was.

      Amen to that.

      --
      Range Voting: preference intensity matters
    62. Re:Turing was also... by whoever57 · · Score: 1
      This is a fact that much of the mainstream media glosses over in noting his accomplishments

      As opposed to the weblog wo which the article is linked, which merely make glaring factual errors, such as:

      This is a photograph of the Enigma cryptanalytic machine devised by Alan Turing
      There are 2 other problems. One is that the British goverment, for reasons that are not clear (stupidity probably) kept the existence of Bletchley Park secret long after the war, allowing the second problem to exist, which is US-centric re-writing of history claiming ENIAC as the first computer without challenge from those who had been at Bletchley park.

      While ENIAC clearly progressed the technology, one can consider it merely a step between Bletchley Park's Colossus and The University of Manchester's "Baby", which is claimed to be the first device to have all the components that are now considered characteristic of a computer.

      --
      The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
    63. Re:Turing was also... by bbagnall · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't Charles Babbage and Ada Lovelace be the first developers of software? I know both of them had several programs ready to go once Babbage had his computer completed in the 1800's. Unfortunately funding stopped. However, this is better than Turing ever did, because his Infinite machine was even more theoretical than Babbages.

    64. Re:Turing was also... by bezuwork's+friend · · Score: 1
      Benjamin Franklin?

      I never heard about this. Can you provide any cites?

      For a spectacled intellectual, I always thought he made a pretty good idol to mimic in the woman-seduction arena. What with his multiple kids, some illegitimate and all ...

    65. Re:Turing was also... by zaffir · · Score: 1

      I really don't see what being gay has to do with his accomplishments. If i want to learn about what he did, i don't care about who he was doing. I'll read his biography if i want more information about his personal life.

      --
      "Upon attaching the waterblock to my penis, I began to notice that I know nothing about computers." -- JRockway
    66. Re:Turing was also... by DickBreath · · Score: 1

      You are right though that it's not good to hide facts like he was persecuted for being homosexual, I just don't think it should be listed alongside, or despite his accomplishments.

      Being gay is not an accomplishment. So I would agree it does not belong in the accomplishments section.

      Being gay is not a hinderance to thinking, and thinking about mathematics in particular. Therefore, I would also agree that it would be wrong to say "despite being gay" as though it gave one an unfair disadvantage which must be overcome.

      Anything that purports to describe the man can not avoid mentioning his sexuality and related issues.

      The photographis were interesting to me. I had no idea what the dude looked like. Not bad.

      --

      I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
    67. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      no wonder Turing came up with a universal machine, cuz it goes both ways. hehe.

      okay a lame joke but i think it's funny.

    68. Re:Turing was also... by 2short · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Jackie Robinson would not be remotely as important historically if he were not black.

      Turing would be every bit as important historically if he were not gay.

      If you're talking about Turing as a victim of discrimination, obviously his sexual orientation is relevant. But most of the time when people are talking about Turing (this article for example) they are talking about his intelectual accomplishments, and his being gay is irrelevant.

      Sigh. If there is a lesson to take from the example of Turing, it ought to be that being gay should not have been considered a particularly important thing about him at the time.

    69. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Can straight people look up to him too?

    70. Re:Turing was also... by jak163 · · Score: 1

      And whether he would still use Windows on one machine or suffer through Wine.

    71. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you can look deep into his big brown eye.

    72. Re:Turing was also... by Hognoxious · · Score: 0
      I doubt most of the media would pass a Turing test.
      I always assumed that was what "YOU FAIL IT!!!!!" referred to.
      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    73. Re:Turing was also... by WWWWolf · · Score: 1
      "John Graham-Cumming invented the Banana Wumpus Driver. At age 13 he realized that he was attracted to women and spent his entire life in pursuit of sexual encounters with various women until he finally married..."

      [Applying the template from "Predictable Slashdot Humor in Nutshell" (1st edition, O'Reilly, 2004), vol. 1, ch. 1, section 2, paragraph 1]

      Ooooo, a geek experiencing several sexual encounters and/or getting married? Hell, yes, that is noteworthy.

    74. Re:Turing was also... by Hooded+One · · Score: 1

      You know, I was sort of teetering between both sides earlier, but now that I think about it, (and am not running late for my 7:30 English class), you're right.

      Part of where this gets complicated is that while being gay is obviously a matter of sexuality, on another level it is a matter of social status. The sexual aspect has little to do with Turing's accomplishments, but the effects on his social status are vital to understanding him as a person.

      I never really did the hero worship thing, gay or otherwise, but I know there are people out there who need that sort of thing, so for them I am glad we have examples like Turing.

    75. Re:Turing was also... by DuckDodgers · · Score: 1

      Turing would almost certainly be more important historically if he were not gay, because he could have continued contributing to mathematics and computing for the rest of his natural life.

      In that sense, his being gay is very relevant to his intellectual accomplishments because his ability to contribute was forcibly diminished as a result.

    76. Re:Turing was also... by DuckDodgers · · Score: 1

      I think your sexuality/race/creed/gender is only worth mention in discussions like this if your ability to achieve success was diminished by it.

      So if you do some really cool stuff and live a normal life, your sexuality is irrelevant. If you do some really cool stuff despite discrimination or mistreatment, or do some really cool stuff and then get killed or blocked from further contribution because of discrimination, your sexuality/race/creed/gender is noteworthy.

      Make sense?

    77. Re:Turing was also... by DuckDodgers · · Score: 1

      You'll find morons on any side of a discussion, so being labelled a homophobe for believing homosexuality is wrong is no different than being called a 'pinko commie' by a conservative or a 'heartless religious fanatic' by a liberal.

      On the other hand, I don't know of any reasonable, valid arguments against homosexuality. If you have some, I am willing to listen. I know and am friends with many homosexual and bisexual individuals who live perfectly normal lives, pay their taxes, do their work, do not have sex with children, and generally do nothing worthy of disapproval (save engage in homosexual acts, which of course is what you disprove of).

      In this case, I don't think homosexuals were seizing on Turing's achievements as an excuse for homosexuality. They are pointing out how his achievements were blocked because of other people's reactions to homosexuality. He was offered a choice of life in prison or hormone therapy simply because he was homosexual - do you have a justification for that?

      And your last full paragraph engages in the 'slippery slope' logical fallacy, in which one postulates that allowing one concession automatically assures that all other points will eventually be conceded. Permitting homosexuals to live in peace no more guarantees that 13 year olds will be declared legal adults than permitting adults to drink alcohol guarantees that all adults will become alcoholics.

      Divorce is bad for everyone involved - but having two people living under the same roof who despise each other is worse. The only solution is to only marry someone you will love for the rest of your life. Unfortunately, that can't be legislated.

    78. Re:Turing was also... by wwest4 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      > Jackie Robinson would not be remotely as important historically if he were not
      > black.

      I disagree. Jackie Robinson would not be remotely as important historically if he had not changed American baseball. His being black was not his contribution. It is, however, relevant to the story of his contribution.

      > Turing would be every bit as important historically if he were not gay.

      Turing almost certainly would have been MORE important historically had he not been a victim of discrimination. He was young and barely in his prime when he was essentially expelled from the scientific community.

      Both examples show great impact on a profession, and unfair discrimination against particular individual characteristics are relevant to each story. Certainly I agree that Turing being gay didn't cause his potential, but I strongly urge people to consider that his being gay, and the discrimination elicited thereby, is very relevant to the story of what would have been contributed by this man were he not gay.

    79. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      True enough, the slippery slope argument is a logical fallacy. But the truth is, it occurs in reality. Humans are always pushing the envelope on what is acceptable. It's in our nature.

      It is a truth that once homosexuality is widely accepted in our culture, then people with behaviours slightly outside that accepted circle will begin pushing for acceptance. It will happen -- the question is what will the behaviour be? Ask me again in 5 years.

      As for arguments against homosexuality. I'll avoid the Biblical argument, since that degenerates into an "Is not!", "Is too!" exchange.

      I debated even answering this -- I'm on a coffee break and don't really have time to put my argument into words. There is no "BAM! There you have it" argument against homosexuality.

      Maybe there's not a problem with it, and I'm a dinosaur. But I am greatly concerned that anyone who feels it's wrong is automatically lumped into the same catagory as the pinheads that chained Matthew Sheperd to a fence. That's quashing any reasonable debate and leading judges to legislate based on their emotions -- not what the majority has voted on.

      I don't believe that homosexual actions are so much a problem. That's part of experimentation and puberty and all that. The problem is when society starts endorsing the behaviour. There is a biological reason it takes two sexes to have children. There is a reason that children should have male and female role models. Yes, I know, plenty of heteros screw up raising kids and there are plenty of homosexuals that could be shown as wonderful models of parenting. However, if homosexual behaviour were so beneficial, I think evolution would have ditched the problem of maintaining a second gender a long time ago.

      Sigh. I suppose I deserve "Flamebait". But I feel railroaded and it pisses me off. On the one hand, there are the pinhead hate-mongers who need to be shut down. I don't want to be identified with them. But I don't agree with the "Free to be you and me" crowd either. There is a reason homosexuality has been quietly tolerated for 6,000+ years of written history. There is a reason it takes male and female to start a family. It seems like a bad idea to overturn that in a decade or two to satisfy selfish urges.

    80. Re:Turing was also... by Rei · · Score: 1

      I'm glad to see, at least, that the article mentioned this. So often, when recounting the lives of famous individuals who are GLBT, sexual orientation and gender identity are details that they don't feel comfortable mentioning (for example, John Nash, in "A Beautiful Mind).

      I thought it was great when an investigator tracked down what happened to the inventor of dynamic instruction scheduling, pioneer of VSLI, and author of one of the first books on the subject. At the time male, she has been living stealth as Lynn Conway since IBM fired her when she came out in the late 60s.

      --
      "She was out of her depth in a shallow pool." -- Peggy Noonan on Sarah Palin
    81. Re:Turing was also... by natoochtoniket · · Score: 2, Insightful
      I expect he would say somthing like, "In principle, there is no difference."

      Mathematicians are fond of saying "in principle, there is no difference" when the differences are only a matter of detail, and do not affect the abstraction. Essentially, the input (and output) of a Turing machine is a sequence of symbols. The input (and output) of a modern computer is a sequence of symbols. The nature of one (concrete) symbol is somewhat different, of course, but the fact that it is just a symbol is the same.

      The input to a TM is a sequence of abstract symbols. The input to a modern computer is a sequence of concrete symbols. We have 'mickeys', which are symbols that each represent a mouse-movement. We have 'clicks', which are symbols that each represent a mouse-click. We have 'characters', which are symbols that represent key strokes. And, we have 'ticks', which are symbols that represent the passage of time. But, in abstract principle, every one of these is just a symbol.

      On the output side, a TM produces a tape containing a sequence of abstract symbols. A modern computer produces a time-sequence of screen images. Each screen image may have quite a lot of information, but the aggregate of all of the pixels can still, in principle, be considered as one symbol.

    82. Re:Turing was also... by Hooded+One · · Score: 1

      Definitely. After thinking about it today and reading through some other comments, that's pretty much the conclusion I came to.

      At any rate, it's most certainly relevant in Turing's case. And I think most of the people putting down JessLeah for bringing it up, while not necessarily homophobic, at the very least don't understand the implications of the homophobia of others.

    83. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Indeed it was a conspiracy. It forced him to take his life infact.

    84. Re:Turing was also... by susano_otter · · Score: 1
      a game where a man and a woman are trying to convince the referee about their genders... Now, if you can replace a computer for one of the participants without the referee noticing, you pass the test. You think homosexuality is irrelevant to that?

      Why wouldn't it be? It seems like you're saying that Turing's homosexuality made him especially skilled at acting convincingly "femme" (by the standards of his day, whatever those were). I'm not at all sure that's a valid argument.

      And even if it were valid, that particular argument is totally irrelevant to the Turing Test discussion.

      Now, if you were saying, "only a gay smarty man like Turing had the special insight necessary to devise a test in which a computer and a human male both try to convincingly impersonate a woman!", that would be a relevant argument. A stupid argument, but at least a relevant one.

      Please note that in no discussion from the time I first heard of Alan Turing until this one here (over a period of at least fifteen years) has gender orientation ever come up as a relevant factor in the design or implementation of the Turing Test. Has every other person I've ever read or conversed with on this topic been completely clueless about this issue? Are you the only one gifted with a special insight into what's really important about the Turing Test? Let me guess: it's your gayness, isn't it, that grants you this special enlightenment?

      --

      Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

    85. Re:Turing was also... by An+Elephant · · Score: 1

      ehmm, no. Actually I'm quite straight. And I think that a man who finds his sexual orientation condemned by society is more likely than others to have issues of gender his mind. The argument wasn't that putting gender in the test was so brilliant -- from the reaction of generations later, it wasn't -- but that it was a flavor affected by his homosexuality. And in this, his homosexuality affected one of his important achievements, and was, therefore, relevant.

      Ahh, forget reasoning. You're a homophobic troll.

    86. Re:Turing was also... by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      Tell me more about why you think you are a failure?

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    87. Re:Turing was also... by jea6 · · Score: 1

      LOL. I wanted to go that direction but my goal for the day was +1 Insightful not +1 Inciteful. Now I can't even remember what the article was about.

      --

      sarchasm: The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who doesn't get it.
    88. Re:Turing was also... by falsified · · Score: 1
      I'd be pretty pissed off. If I was an amputee and I invented some amazing tool or, for example, helped to defeat one of the most ruthless governments in modern history, I'd want to be recognized for THAT, not for my amputation. (I don't mean to imply that being gay is a disfigurement...also, I don't actually have an amputation.) Pointing out a biological fact/personal choice has nothing to do with what a brilliant man he was.

      However, if the article is a biography, it's certainly relevant, as it ended up being a major factor in his ability to continue working in his field and ultimately led to his death.

      --
      HI, MY NAME IS ISAAC.
    89. Re:Turing was also... by cfuse · · Score: 1
      Why is that important? Do you list whether or not a person is heterosexual in an article or biography about someone? What about the color of their skin or hair.

      Why is this important? I'm glad you asked - it's because we're smarter than you ;-). In the same way that a left handed person is more likely to be smarter/more insane than a right handed person, it is behavioral, thus having a direct relationship with brain function - unlike the physical traits you mentioned.

      Cripes, if the advancement of the species was left up to you straight guys we'd still probably be banging rocks together.

    90. Re:Turing was also... by cfuse · · Score: 1
      I didn't know that being gay should be considered an "accomplishment."

      Well you're obviously not gay ...

      On a more serious note, when I came out, one of my (straight) friends actually congratulated me. No one who hasn't been in that position can possibly understand how important that remark was to me. That made me feel normal and OK, as opposed to how society made me feel: like a leper.

      Realising that I was not a deviant, that was an accomplishment.

    91. Re:Turing was also... by flyneye · · Score: 1

      LOL,I just threw that in to see if anyone actually reads the threads very closely.(you can find rumours of Ben skinny dipping with young boys,but probably nothing solid)yeah Ben was a ladies man.

      --
      *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
    92. Re:Turing was also... by Phurd+Phlegm · · Score: 1
      t wasn't exactly the removal of access that increased his depression, it probably had more to do with the forceful administration of hormones to cure his 'disease'. Due to these hormones he grew breasts. Not fun. That's the thanks he got for his war efforts and contributions to science.

      Unfortunately, at the time the codebreaking was still considered tippy-tip-top-secret, so his wartime contributions were never considered in sentencing. Apparently, being the kind of man he was, he was unwilling to try getting some influential person to intervene on his behalf.

      I'm still trying to figure out if the N-th grandparent was kidding about Grace Hopper's contribution to computing being greater than Turing's....ah, he must've been.

    93. Re:Turing was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


      There is a biological reason it takes two sexes to have children. There is a reason that children should have male and female role models. Yes, I know, plenty of heteros screw up raising kids and there are plenty of homosexuals that could be shown as wonderful models of parenting. However, if homosexual behaviour were so beneficial, I think evolution would have ditched the problem of maintaining a second gender a long time ago.


      Whether or not something occurs in nature says little about it's moral value. Be careful of the "naturalistic fallacy", where "is" implies "ought". 150 years ago, Darwin himself cautioned against uncritically trying to learn "moral lessons" from nature by citing how parasitic wasp larvae eat host caterpillars alive from the inside as part of their "natural life cycle". Probably a pretty horrible way to go, but if it's "natural" it must be "good". ;-)

      If you're uninterested by insect ethics, then here's an example closer to home--look at any technology every developed that changed how human do things "naturally". Agriculture--blew away hundreds of thousands of years of hunter-gathering lifestyle. Cheap, reliable lighting in the 19th cenury--suddenly, people had a whole new world available to do things at night (other than sleep, etc.).

      Sigh. I suppose I deserve "Flamebait". But I feel railroaded and it pisses me off. On the one hand, there are the pinhead hate-mongers who need to be shut down. I don't want to be identified with them.

      fair enough. There are constructive ways for reasonable people to disagree. But just be aware that there's a good reason gay people don't approach this as just another topic for debate. I happen to be straight, but I know I'd be irritated if some people comfortably discuss who I could love and even my right to exist as if it were some neutral debate topic.

      I'm not saying these conversations should happen; I actually value them if people try to be open-minded and fair whereever they'r original position is. I would not mod you flamebait b/c you seem to be trying to be reasonable.


      But I don't agree with the "Free to be you and me" crowd either. There is a reason homosexuality has been quietly tolerated for 6,000+ years of written history. There is a reason it takes male and female to start a family. It seems like a bad idea to overturn that in a decade or two to satisfy selfish urges.


      History may be a better guide to good living that biology, but it ain't great either. For most of those 6000 years, marriage was a property contract that looked little like the "bond of equals" institution we developed in the last century.
      Despotism was the standard (and accepted and highest) form of gov't for most of that period. Slavery was perfectly acceptable for most of that period too.

      There are many other counter examples. What about the "selfish urges" of democrats who wanted self-rule free from the dictactes of a foreign despot 200 years ago? What about the "selfish urges" of women to choose a role other than wife or mother in the last few decades?

      I agree that it makes sense for people to discuss major social changes, and that caution is often a good idea. That said, just b/c "that's the way it's always been" by itself isn't a good justification.

    94. Re:Turing was also... by dougkeenan · · Score: 1

      ... the first chess programmer, wasn't he? In a way he even qualifies as the first chess computer, since he had to manually operate his algorithm in the game.

    95. Re:Turing was also... by DuckDodgers · · Score: 1

      Thank you for the reasoned and thoughtful response. I disagree with much of what you say, but I'm grateful that you're willing to engage in a polite discussion.

      It is true that behaviors outside of homosexuality would push harder for acceptance once homosexuality was accepted. But that doesn't mean they would make any headway. The North American Man Boy Love Association exists, and has been fighting for (male) pedophiles' rights for years. But I believe people will continue to understand, as they do today, that the concept is an abomination.

      You are right that reasoned debate on many subjects is often quashed, and I do think it's wrong.

      If I recall correctly, there are enough passages in the Bible which condemn homosexuality that it takes a big stretch to say they all meant something else. However, the point is irrelevant since I am not a Christian.

      You would think of homosexual behavior was so counterproductive, natural selection would have removed it from the animal kingdom long ago. But it still shows up in other primates and a few other species.

      I personally don't put much stake into the experimentation and puberty viewpoint on it. The idea of sex with another man is so distasteful to me, I could not possibly experiment with it. That cements my position that sexuality is part of a person's fundamental psychological nature, because nothing could make me choose to be other than heterosexual.

      I think a lot of the historical prejudice against homosexuality has been from primitive views on the roles of men and women and the way reproduction worked. First, most ancient societies considered men superior to women. In homosexual encounters, one of the men had to be penetrated - i.e. take on the woman's role. This was considered degrading to all men and thus forbidden. Second, before the medical understanding of sex, it was believed that a man's semen was all that was required to make a baby. The semen had to be deposited inside a woman for the baby to grow, but they didn't know about how a sperm must join with the egg to form a zygote. That's why the Judeo-Christian religions considered male masturbation a grave wrongdoing - they thought spilling semen ouside a woman's body was infanticide. Similarly, when two men had sex the semen would not end up in women, and they thought it was infanticide.

  3. Alan Turing! by Phidoux · · Score: 3, Funny

    So now we know who to blame for the whole mess!

  4. True? by Black_Logic · · Score: 2, Interesting

    he died suddenly, almost certainly by suicide from eating a cyanide-laced apple.

    Has anyone else heard the rumur that apple computers logo is a tribute to Turing? Rainbow colored apple with a bite taken out of it and all? I wish I could remember where I heard that.

    --
    Ansi's and stupid tricks!
    1. Re:True? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Not an answer, but interesting...

      All apples contain cyanide (in the seeds)

      http://www.snopes.com/food/warnings/apples.asp

    2. Re:True? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      Not according to Woz:

      http://www.woz.org/letters/general/86.html

    3. Re:True? by javabandit · · Score: 4, Informative

      Just FYI, this is a much heralded rumor, but isn't true :

      http://www.turing.org.uk/turing/scrapbook/wondro us .html

      A lot of thought went into the Apple logo and what it signified. The guys over at Apple were very fond of making statements with imagery, design, and color.

    4. Re:True? by cybergrue · · Score: 1
      There have been lots of stories about how Apple corp gots its name. The most common relate to how there was an apple nearby when Woz and Jobs were thinking up the name for their company. I have never heard of the Turing connection before.

      On the topic of Turings death, there was a magazine article that looked into it (American Scientist I think) and raised serious doubts about the suicide theory. They concluded the death was accidental.

    5. Re:True? by OmniVector · · Score: 1

      the apple was originally just flat colored. they made it rainbow at the time because apple was the first to come out with color displays for consumer desktop machines, and wanted to emphasize this using the new logo.

      --
      - tristan
    6. Re:True? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As further proof, the rainbow flag simply didn't exist in 1977:

      http://www.planetout.com/news/history/archive/fl ag .html

    7. Re:True? by jesser · · Score: 1

      Even more convincing is the fact that the rainbow became a symbol of homosexuality in 1978, after the Apple logo was designed (1977).

      --
      The shareholder is always right.
  5. story is not quite right.. by ashot · · Score: 4, Informative

    "Turing is the man who created the concept of an "universal machine" which would perform various and diverse actions when given various sets of instructions. In other words, he laid out in the 1920s the foundations of software."

    Actually the turing machine served as the basis of the first hardware, not software. Its really the theoretical basis for the entire computing model.
    I don't mean to be picky, but I have my Automata Theory final in 5 hours and I just spent all night studying for it..

    --
    -ashot
    1. Re:story is not quite right.. by gowen · · Score: 1

      To a Turing machine the hardware / software split is a distinction without a difference. Its just a bunch of ones and zeroes and some simple rules for manipulating them.

      --
      Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
    2. Re:story is not quite right.. by JohnGrahamCumming · · Score: 4, Informative

      I think the point is that he described a machine that could change what it did based on "instructions" that were fed to it. In this case the tape of the Turing machine contains both the data and the program for a specific task.

      The machine itself just interpreted the symbols on the tape, but key to Turing's insight was that although he intially said that a Turing machine might compute a single function, he realized that that single function could be a Turing machine itself (hence the "universal machine") and so the instructions could come from the tape.

      This itself was fundamental because it meant that machines could compute functions of machine and lead to the Halting Problem: i.e. no machine can compute whether another machine will halt.

      If you still have time before your final read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turing_machine#Univer sal_Turing_machines :-)

      John.

    3. Re:story is not quite right.. by OmniVector · · Score: 4, Interesting

      the turing machine wasn't so surprising after learning push-down automata. it was evident that the push-down automata, not being able to represent languages like L = { a^i b^j ^k | i != j != b != k }, was too limited for general computability. The turing machine was just the natural theoretical progression of computablility based on simple algorithm deduction. we can generate anything using a turing machine if we can come up with an algorithm for it.

      the interesting thing about turing machines though is how they are maximal and nothing additional makes the turing machine more powerful (like non-determinism, multiple tapes, two way tapes, etc) because those can all be simulated with a regular turing machine using an algorithm adjustment.

      --
      - tristan
    4. Re:story is not quite right.. by bcmm · · Score: 1

      But he invented the idea that hardware and software were different!

      By comming up with the idea of a machine that ran applications, he has to be said to have invented apps also

      --
      # cat /dev/mem | strings | grep -i llama
      Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
    5. Re:story is not quite right.. by Kainaw · · Score: 1

      Actually the turing machine served as the basis of the first hardware, not software.

      I initially agree. Most of the programming roots come from Babbage-based ideas, which are commonly attributed to Ada's added notes when she translated his work. However, I have not seen anything about recursion in the work that Babbage and Ada did. That is primarily from Turing's area of work. So, after my initial feeling that Turing is hardware, not software, I'd have to change my mind and admit that the Turing machine did have a strong influence on software.

      --
      The previous comment is purposely vague and generalized, but all of the facts are completely true.
    6. Re:story is not quite right.. by dollargonzo · · Score: 1

      it might be the natural progression, but the fact that it's maximal and indeed is capable of general computation is most definitely not. there were systems of "general computation" which were discovered before turing machines (mu recursive functions, lambda calculus, unrestricted grammars). the only reason turing machines are so important is that they are easier to actually implement in hardware. lambda calculus is the basis for all of functional programming, for example, but that came a lot later.

      --
      BSD is for people who love UNIX. Linux is for those who hate Microsoft.
    7. Re:story is not quite right.. by ch-chuck · · Score: 1

      he laid out in the 1920s the foundations of software."

      Software was actually invented by Nikoli Tesla with the numerically controlled Tesla coil, as is clearly laid out in his patent describing 'coil taps by number' used to tune the coil. However historians conviently overlook this fact about the worlds greatest unsung genius.

      --
      try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
    8. Re:story is not quite right.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Ada did have an idea for pushing back instruction discs and then bringing them back, which can be used to implement iteration. Presumably one could build an explicit stack in addition to that and get recursion.

      Anyway, as an Alonso Church zealot, I think Alan Turing got entirely too much credit.

    9. Re:story is not quite right.. by mesterha · · Score: 1

      the interesting thing about turing machines though is how they are maximal and nothing additional makes the turing machine more powerful (like non-determinism, multiple tapes, two way tapes, etc) because those can all be simulated with a regular turing machine using an algorithm adjustment.

      This is also know as the Church-Turing thesis. While not obvious, it is really a statement about physics. Building a machine that is more powerful than a Turing machine depends on what tools I have to build the machine. This depends on the laws of physics. Therefore this question will never be mathematically proven since, like all laws of physics, it is empirical.

      However, if you assume a particular model of physics is true then it is possible to prove the Church-Turing thesis. There is a paper by Warren D. Smith that shows that the Church-Turing thesis does not hold for a model of Newtonian mechanics. In another paper, he shows the thesis does hold in a simple quantum mechanical model.

      --

      Chris Mesterharm
    10. Re:story is not quite right.. by ashot · · Score: 1

      damn.. thats awesome; I had no idea this tied in with physical laws; but then we glossed over the proof in class..

      --
      -ashot
    11. Re:story is not quite right.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That is a fucking brilliant paper. Seriously, UBER-GEEK material. Understand that, and buddhist masters are posing idiots comapared to you.

    12. Re:story is not quite right.. by OmniVector · · Score: 1

      i'd mod you up if i could :) very informative.

      --
      - tristan
  6. Give Credit Where It's Due by dupper · · Score: 3, Funny

    I think Lawrence Waterhouse and Rudy von Hacklheber deserve some credit, too.

    1. Re:Give Credit Where It's Due by comet_11 · · Score: 1

      Not to mention Al Gore. He invented computers, right?

      --
      By reading this comment, you immediately waive any and all rights regarding it.
    2. Re:Give Credit Where It's Due by WegianWarrior · · Score: 1

      Or Charles Babbage and his 1835 design for the Analytical Engine.

      --
      Everything in the world is controlled by a small, evil group to which, unfortunately, no one you know belongs.
    3. Re:Give Credit Where It's Due by Isaac-Lew · · Score: 1

      No, Gore invented the Internet. Bill Gates invented computers.

  7. Re:Turing didn't do crap. by zopu · · Score: 2, Informative
    Concepts that don't work? Off the top of my head...

    Equivalence to a turing machine is used in lots of CS proofs even today.

    The turing test is also still considered one of the fundamental challenges of 'weak' Artificial Intelligence.

  8. Aristoteles by Tei · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Well... Turing whas the inventor of turing machines. But Aristoteles provide the logic. So maybe a more accurate title can be "Alan Turing, the Inventor of Turing machine" or maybe "Alan Turing, the ''Inventor'' of Computers". Not true, but better title.

    --

    -Woof woof woof!

    1. Re:Aristoteles by AmishSlayer · · Score: 1

      That is like saying Newton can't take any credit for calculus because he built off of the math that other before him created (or better yet "discovered"). Newton made claculus from the rules of math, and more specifically the rules of trigonometry.

      Alan made a generic universal computer from the rules of logic. Logic itself is not computation, and cannot solve a problem, however, the application of logic can. Hence Alan is gets the credit.

    2. Re:Aristoteles by tybalt44 · · Score: 1

      This isn't really correct. Aristotle was certainly an important figure in the history of logic, but his brand of "logic" has little if anything to do with the kind of logic that a Turing machine uses.

      The rigorous study of logic is a much more recent innovation than Aristotle, and has its origins in the seventeenth century, while its true fathers were Boole and de Morgan, in the middle of the nineteenth century.

    3. Re:Aristoteles by surfimp · · Score: 1

      So if Linux is, according to Stallman, more properly "GNU/Linux", then what you're saying is that you're arguing for "Aristotle/Turing"?

  9. Universal machine? yes. Software? nope. by mwood · · Score: 4, Informative

    A hollow voice says, "Jacquard", whose NC looms were old long before Turing came along. Turing put a firm theoretical foundation under what others had been doing for some time.

  10. Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by JPriest · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Alan invented Enigma, a machine to decode encrypted messages from the Germans. With all the inventions that come out of war it seems like some countries *cough* *cough* go to war mostly for the economy and the technological advancements spawned from it.
    In today's more diverse world and more global economy, it seems like ware is less and less good vs evil and more a difference of opinion. One has to wonder if global peace would hinder technological progress.

    --
    Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
    1. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by zopu · · Score: 3, Informative
      Actually, enigma was the german coding machine that Turing and others were trying to figure out so that they could intercept encrypted german transmitions.

      This page has a description of the machine.

      Turing didn't invent the machine. The germans did.

    2. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by 16K+Ram+Pack · · Score: 1
      Not true.

      He invented a machine for decoding encrypted messages, known as a "bomb".

      IIRC the machine helped people run through permutations more quickly.

    3. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by NoOneInParticular · · Score: 1

      Not entirely true afaik. The enigma was the German encryption machine. He cracked the code (with help from those who captured these machines in the field). Funnily enough, the British, having access to the codes, didn't do much with the information that it provided, for fear that the Germans would figure out that they cracked it.

    4. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by magarity · · Score: 2, Insightful

      it seems like some countries *cough* *cough* go to war mostly for the economy

      Name one war that was not fought for economic reasons. Even the so-called Crusades, nominally fought for religion, were an excuse to keep increasinly powerful nobility in check by making them incur such a large expense as trying to invade the middle east. Every war I can think of has economic motives despite frequent facades of other purposes. Not that there's anything wrong with that; large scale human social activity comes down to economics.

    5. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      not true either. the bombs were originally polish.

      though breaking the enigma cypher was turing's accomplishment.

    6. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by gowen · · Score: 2, Informative
      Turing didn't invent the machine. The germans did.
      But not the German military. The Enigma machine was invented by a German businessman and engineer called Arthur Scherbius, whose company sold a commercial version throughout the 1920s. The German military merely bought some of these and modified it to add extra layers of encryption
      --
      Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
    7. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by johnjaydk · · Score: 3, Informative
      Enigma was the name of the German cryptographic machine. But there were differences in the versions the different services used and how they used them. The u-boat service was really bright about how they used it and therefore were by far the hardest version. It was this version that Turing worked on.

      Turings universal machine was implemented in the Colossus machine (the worlds first general purpose programmable computer). It was dismanteled and the whole thing classified after the war.

      After the war the british sold captured Enigma machines to their colonies but kept it secret that they had broken Enigma. Nice touch.

      The initial breaks into Enigma was done by the polish before the german invasion and the british work build upon their work.

      --
      TCAP-Abort
    8. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Post was in refrence to quote: "This is a photograph of the Enigma cryptanalytic machine devised by Alan Turing to decode encrypted messages sent by the Germans during World War II"

      perhaps Enigma was the german invention and "Enigma cryptanalytic machine" was Alan's invention?

    9. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by Insipid+Trunculance · · Score: 2, Informative

      Alan invented Enigma, a machine to decode encrypted messages from the Germans

      The Germans used the Enigma to encrypt messages and it was a polish mathematician, Marian Rejewski,who worked out the first attack on the Enigma cipher.He actually designed a machine to automate the process of figuring out the scrambler setting,which is known as a Bombe.Turing refined and improved these machines but he wasnt ,by any stretch of imagination,the originator of cracking up Enigma.

      --
      Wanted : A Signature.
    10. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by spaceyhackerlady · · Score: 1
      The Germans used the Enigma to encrypt messages and it was a polish mathematician, Marian Rejewski,who worked out the first attack on the Enigma cipher.

      When you look at a map of Europe in the 1920s it's no surprise that the Poles were interested in Enigma. I think shit-scared is a better term, with Germany on one border and the Soviet Union on the other...

      A propos The Gay Thing - had Turing not been so royally fucked over solely due to his sexuality, it would be the non-issue it should be. But he was royally fucked over, the only reason for it was his sexuality, and it was a direct cause of his suicide. A shame: the world lost a great thinker.

      ...laura

    11. Re:Killing people the only way to "Innovate"? by johnw · · Score: 1

      > It was dismantled and the whole thing
      > classified after the war.

      Not "It" - there were a number of them.

      > After the war the british sold captured
      > Enigma machines to their colonies but kept
      > it secret that they had broken Enigma. Nice
      > touch.

      Am I the only one who finds it obvious that the British government must have kept at least one of them? There's no point in destroying them (and putting about the story that they've been destroyed) unless you also keep one or two so that you still have said secret technology.

      Give it a year or two and I'm sure an original one will be found lurking in Cheltenham.

      John

  11. Inventor of software? by robslimo · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'd say his concepts defined the requirements or foundations of how the hardware would operate. Maybe I'm being pedantic as form follows function; software is dictated to a large degree by the base hardware.

    1. Re:Inventor of software? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not really - I don't know if anyone's ever built an actual 'Turing Machine', but it's more the theoretical underpinnings that are so very important.

      In a kind of thought experiment, Alan Turing invented a machine that, although highly inefficient, is capable of performing exactly the same calculations and of running the same algorithms as any subsequent computer. In a way, it's a kind of idealised theoretical computer, the simplest one that can be built.

      If I were to throw enough storage space at, say, my old Atari ST, it would be completely capable of emulating a top-of-the-range PC, down to the logic gate level if necessary (ignoring actual analogue display outputs, etc). Yes, it would take forever to calculate something, but it could be done. A Turing Machine is a bit like that - the idealised minimum computer, which can do anything a technologically more advanced one can do.

      Interestingly, even (currently mostly theoretical) quantum computers have the same limits as conventional ones, although they could be hugely faster. Read up on P vs NP and similar...

    2. Re: Inventor of software? by uxo · · Score: 1

      Ada Lovelace is usually credited as the first computer programmer, and a century earlier.

  12. Turing a genius? by WilyCoder · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I just finished Discrete Structures II. In this class we were to idealize a Turing machine, as a C program. We also went over Alan Turing's paper (the one linked in the article). My professor, who has been involved in cryptographic research for over 20 years, even he went so far as to say that Turing could be labeled a genius. Call me a dork, but I found the automatas to be one of the funnest parts of my CS education.

    1. Re:Turing a genius? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Call me a dork, but I found the automatas to be one of the funnest parts of my CS education.

      It's too bad that you didn't find so much joy in English class.

    2. Re:Turing a genius? by wk633 · · Score: 1

      Went so far as to say? I'd say it's a pretty well accepted fact that Turing was a genius.

    3. Re:Turing a genius? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Meh, it's a neologism constructed in the usual way, and its meaning is clear. "most fun" is clumsy. Let him be.

  13. Al Gore? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Didn't I read somewhere that someone had a conversation with Al Gore and it turned out that Gore failed the Turing test?

    1. Re:Al Gore? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe, but Al did invent the internet.

  14. Paging Charles Babbage by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    In case you forgot, Turing is the man who created the concept of an "universal machine" which would perform various and diverse actions when given various sets of instructions.

    What, your history books don't go past the 1900's?

    1. Re:Paging Charles Babbage by thetroll123 · · Score: 1

      Dude, that was an adding machine. The gap between a universal machine and an adding machine is everything-apart-from-adding.

    2. Re:Paging Charles Babbage by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think that Ada Lovelace should be given much more credit, she took Babbage ideas and took it several step beyond what he was doing, I don't even think that he understood the stuff she was doing.

    3. Re:Paging Charles Babbage by Doomstalk · · Score: 1

      You're thinking of Babbage's "Difference Engine", which was indeed a mechanical calculator. He also designed the "Analytical Engine" which was a full-fledged digital computer. The only reason the information age didn't occur in the nineteenth century is because he lacked the precision manufacturing processes needed to actually build it (I can't find a link about it, but a modern team actually built one which worked). Indeed, William Gibson and Bruce Sterling wrote The Difference Engine which, despite its confusing title, speculates what the world would have been like had Babbage succeeded in building the Analytical Engine.

  15. Ada Lovelace by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I always though Ada Lovelace was considered to be the first "programmer"

    1. Re:Ada Lovelace by Kainaw · · Score: 5, Informative

      I always though Ada Lovelace was considered to be the first "programmer"

      Ada added notes to Babbage's design of a calculation machine when she translated all his writing. In her notes, she wrote down mathematical steps for getting from point A to point B through the machine - basically describing the states that the machine would be in as it ran. Her writing is very similar to modern programming languages, but also very similar to algebra. While she was probably the first to write a series of algebraic expressions specifically for use on a mechanical calculation machine, she wasn't the first to write the expressions in specific order.

      In the end, she couldn't actually program because Babbage never built his machine. Instead, he started taking Ada to the racetrack. She became addicted to gambling and alchohol and died rather young. That whole part is usually left out of the "Ada was the first programmer" stories.

      --
      The previous comment is purposely vague and generalized, but all of the facts are completely true.
    2. Re:Ada Lovelace by CelticLo · · Score: 2, Informative

      Babbage did complete sizeable parts of both his Engines, and helped with the Swedish Engine that the British Goverment bought in the end.
      The Science Museum in London does have some of the punchcards attributed to Babbage and Lovelace, there are more owned by various trusts.
      As for Countess Lovelaces short life, well the excess of her parents probally bore just as much blame as Babbage...

    3. Re:Ada Lovelace by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Programming has nothing to do with execution.

    4. Re:Ada Lovelace by danila · · Score: 1

      She became addicted to gambling and alchohol and died rather young.
      Wikipedia says (though it's not a definitive source) that she died of cancer, which, IIRC, is not usually caused by alcohol or gambling.

      --
      Future Wiki -- If you don't think about the future, you cannot have one.
  16. Turing was gay and mistreated by society by drgreening · · Score: 5, Informative

    Not only was Turing gay, but his society "rewarded" him for his contributions by arresting and convicting him for a homosexual encounter. He was an honest man, and talked about it in court. And so then, the British government subjected him to chemical castration. His suicide followed that conviction. Please do your bit to stamp out anti-gay bias in your workplace and society. There are a lot of contributing, good people in computer science, and every other field. It's really a shame how most of the world mistreats them.

    1. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by Enigma_Man · · Score: 4, Insightful

      But that was a long time ago, when that was the accepted practice. I'm not defending it, just explaining that's not how it is today. I think for most educated people nowadays, it doesn't matter what sexual orientation you are. You don't introduce yourself: "Hi, I'm Bob, and I'm straight"... You're just Bob, and that's who you are. "Stamping out anti-anything bias" is the wrong thing to do, just don't be biassed at all. People are people, and nothing more. I hate all the special priveleges special interest groups get nowadays. You have to hire X amount of black and/or gay and/or female people... Why can't I just hire whoever is most qualified for the job hmmm?

      -Jesse, in a ranting mood.

      --
      Nothing says "unprofessional job" like wrinkles in your duct tape.
    2. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Eniga_Man,

      You aren't fooling anybody. Turing has you all figured out. :-P

    3. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by uqbar · · Score: 1

      Really? Last I checked the only special priviledges were going to heterosexuals. I've never heard of any quota for hiring lesbians or gay men. Where the hell are you getting these paranoid delusions?

      But hey, just wait for all the high tech brain drain when gay couples start deciding to relocate to Massachusetts so they can finally marry (minus all the federal benefits of doing do).

      There are real business reasons to take treatment of gay issues seriously. Pretending problems don't exist anymore doesn't help anyone...

    4. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by Brandybuck · · Score: 1

      But hey, just wait for all the high tech brain drain when gay couples start deciding to relocate to Massachusetts so they can finally marry

      What does an official "marriage" give you? A few tax benefits. That's it. No other benefits require government involvement. Perhaps the solution to this "problem" is to create a separate of marriage and state!

      Until relatively recently, government was not involved in marriage. If you were a serf you might have needed your lord's permission, but only because the serf was considered property. Except for that exception, historically you only needed her/his parent's permission. And if you didn't get it you could still elope.

      --
      Don't blame me, I didn't vote for either of them!
    5. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by uqbar · · Score: 1

      Actually there are about 1,400 special rights our government grants married couples (1000 Federal and an average of 400 in each state). I won't list them all here, but many are pretty basic things many straight couples take for granted (some of these are mentioned by another poster).

      Personally I'm against government recognistion of marriage and all special rights given to married couples. I resent the fact that single folks are given the short end of the stick - this is discrimination and it's real and it affects more than just gay folks.

      All the whining about "marriage tax" is pretty funny if you look at the actual economic facts (like auto insurance rates...)

    6. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think for most educated people nowadays, it doesn't matter what sexual orientation you are.

      You'd better tell that to Dubya.

    7. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by Frogbert · · Score: 1
      Actually there are about 1,400 special rights our government grants married couples (1000 Federal and an average of 400 in each state). I won't list them all here


      No? Realy? I was fully expecting you to.
    8. Re:Turing was gay and mistreated by society by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Homosexuality is a genetic defect, and like any other birth defect, I don't doubt that within my lifetime, we'll be able to screen for it and eventually wipe out the disease entirely.

      umm, homosexuality is a choices. just like all sexualt orientation. life is full of choices and some are harder then others. those that act on the choices presented to them in a way that is diferent then what society expects will be frowned apon. murder is a choice much in the same light.

      People, thru different experiences have different preferences. Some people like redheads and some like blonds, some like the efection a woman give wile others prefer the male effection. the bottom line is that with anything, there is a choice to act on the urges in one self and there is nothing stoping anyone from not acting on those urges. If there was then there would be a natural defense to rape.

      The defining part of homo sexuality as well as hetro-sexuality is the act of having sex, or performing an act that is considered as sex. Were most homo-phobes have problems is that (religion aside) sex and or sexual activiy is only natural in the act of reproducing. With reproduction being the focal point it is dificult to stray from the normal purposes of sex. Even though gratuious sex has become the mormal, it is still hard for some to except it when it is with another person of the same sex and takes all the repoduction away from it. (it's not natural). There is a fine line most people are not willing to cross.it is almost like petaphilia and most don't see the difference in the amoutn of perversion.

      I really don't care if 2 adults wanna have sex with each other, reguardless of the orientation. Were I do have a problem is in the push to make it apear natural that goes almost to the extent of recruitment for fresh gays in the pool. School children shouldn't be exposed to it, If someone want to come out of the closet, then they can pick the apropriate venue. It is not alright to be proactivly flaunting it on the streets like you are trying to get somones attention. (I fell the same way about hetrosexuals too) There is a time and a place for everything, Most of the gays i know also know that. some of the straight people i know need reminded.
  17. article doesn't mention by Gingko · · Score: 1

    Turing is one of the reasons that I'm heading to King's College to take my PhD (although the Turing room there is hardly a suitable tribute to his memory).

    The end to his story is extremely tragic (although this must all be taken with a pinch of salt) - apparently, had Turing's involvement in the war effor been known, he would have been saved the indignity of the trials and medical procedures that were foisted upon him. Given that he arguably won the war for us, that doesn't seem unreasonable. Unfortunately the paranoia surrounding the country after the war meant that Turing's involvement had to remain a secret until the 1970s which was clearly far too late. As a result, the intolerance of the time lost us the service of one of the finest minds and most decent men we've seen.

    henry

    --
    i don't do sigs. oops.
  18. Remember Lady Ada by VernonNemitz · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I see that someone else already mentioned Charles Babbage, who designed a mechanical proccessing engine, in addition to mechanical calculating engines. But Lady Ada Byron, Countess of Lovelace, wrote the first computer program for Babbage's Analytical Engine... (and you folks may recall that there is today a programming language named in her honor).

    1. Re:Remember Lady Ada by pkalkul · · Score: 1

      No, she did not. What she did do was write an insightful and articulate review of Babbage's work that is often seen in retrospect as a description of what a computer program might do.

      But Babbage's machine was never built and no program was ever written for it.

    2. Re:Remember Lady Ada by SpinyNorman · · Score: 2, Informative

      Actually, while Ada Lovelace saw the potential of Babbage's Analytical Engine, her inspiration for this was Joseph Jacquard's punch-card-progammable Jacquard loom. Jacquards invention was also later copied as Hollerith's computer punched cards.

      The distinctive characteristic of the Analytical Engine, and that which has rendered it possible to endow mechanism with such extensive faculties as bid fair to make this engine the executive right-hand of abstract algebra, is the introduction into it of the principle which Jacquard devised for regulating, by means of punched cards, the most complicated patterns in the fabrication of brocaded stuffs. It is in this that the distinction between the two engines lies. Nothing of the sort exists in the Difference Engine. We may say most aptly that the Analytical Engine weaves algebraical patterns just as the Jacquard-loom weaves flowers and leaves.

      Lovelace on Jacquard

      Jacquard loom

      Jacquard loom output

    3. Re:Remember Lady Ada by Jagasian · · Score: 2, Informative

      The significance of Turing's "machines" is not about inventing software. It was about re-affirming his PhD Supervisor's thesis of effectively computable. I don't expect non-CS people to understand this, but roughly 100 years ago in the field of metamathematics, there was a question as to the definition of computability. It had to be precise so that you could formally prove things to be computable or uncomputable.

      Originally there were attempts such as primitive recursive functions, but they were shown to not encompass all that is computable because they wouldn't allow you to "program" certain fuctions, e.g. Ackermann's function.

      Then came partial recursive functions and the lambda-calculus. Church formulated his thesis: if something is computable it could be "programmed" in either the lambda-calculus programming language or the partial recursive functions programming language. (note I am trying to dumb this down with modern computer terms) Both computational models or programming languages were equivalent, as an interpreter could be written for one, in the other.

      Church's student, Turing, wanted to come up with a more humanistic model of effectively computable. He decided to abstractly and formally define a human mathematician calculating something. Humans do this by using some amount of paper, a writing/erasing tool for creating/destroying symbols on the paper, and a finite set of rules for carrying out the calculation. Thus you have a Turing machine.

      Turing went on to show that you could write an interpreter/compiler for the lambda-calculus that ran on a Turing machine. This showed that the Turing machine was just as computationally powerful as the lambda-calculus and therefore general recursive functions. The other direction was also shown to hold: Turing machines could be emulated in the lambda-calculus.

      Therefore, Turing re-affirmed in a more humanistic terms that his teacher, Church was right: something is computable if and only if it can be programmed in the lambda-calculus.
      These kinds of questions: "what is computable"? Are extremely important in computer science and mathematics. You have to know what you are working with, which involves knowing when it starts and where it ends.

      Making computers and software is also an important thing, but Turing et al are famous for the metamathematics questions that they answered... not for computer or software engineering.

    4. Re:Remember Lady Ada by XSforMe · · Score: 1

      Excelent points you make in your post, I always had the nit-pick about exactly why Turing was so important when Lady Ada had practically been the first programmer.

      Also, lots of memories flashed from my now long gone computer language class. It would have been great assistance to be able to read your post while trying to figure out, exactly why was so important that lambda thingie they tried to teach us.

      --
      My other OS is the MCP!
    5. Re:Remember Lady Ada by johnw · · Score: 1

      And indeed, there is (at least) one named after Babbage.

      John

    6. Re:Remember Lady Ada by VernonNemitz · · Score: 1

      There was published in "Scientific American" magazine a while back an article about the computer program that Lady Ada wrote, including bugs. See this brief description.

    7. Re:Remember Lady Ada by Simon+Brooke · · Score: 1

      Sorry, this is wrong in so many ways.

      Turing wasn't Church's student for the very good and simple reason that

      1. Church was in Princeton in the USA
      2. Turing was in Cambridge, England.

      They both came up with separate, original proofs that the entscheidungsproblem was not soluable at pretty much the same time; neither was aware of the other's work. Nor did they meet until after both papers had been published.

      Obviously the two proofs were logically equivalent but they could not have been more different and it was Turing, not Church who produced the blueprint for the first computer: the universal machine which can compute everything which can be computed. Even today we say of processors and languages that they either are or are not 'Turing equivalent' meaning that they either are or are not equivalent to the machine 'U'.

      Furthermore, Turing did not show that you could run the Lambda Calculus on U (although it was implicit, because U could run anything which could be computed, and Lambda Calculus can be computed, therefore U could run Lambda Calculus). It was John McCarthy who did that.

      --
      I'm old enough to remember when discussions on Slashdot were well informed.
    8. Re:Remember Lady Ada by Jagasian · · Score: 1
      You are the one that is wrong. Church was the teacher of many of the first great computer scientists. Including Turing and Kleene. Your Wiki is wrong. Read Kleene's "Introduction to Metamathematics" or "Mathematical Logic" textbooks. I assure you that Kleene, one of Church's students and a founding father of computer science knows better than whoever threw together those Wiki pages.

      Turing's work was somewhat independent from Church's, but Church had his paper published first, and this prevented Turing from getting his work published... as someone beat him to the punch. Turing later revised his paper, including references to Church's paper, after communication with Church, and then got it published. Turing then became one of Church's doctoral students. Church's work was, at the time, more mathematical, while at the time Turing's was more humanistic. Church approached computability in terms of how we formally describe calculated functions, while Turing dscribed computability in terms of an ideal mathematician - something similar to Brouwer's earlier work on Mathematical Intuitionism. Read Turing's original paper! His machine is model after a human. Read Brouwer's account of constructive mathematics, where he defines mathematics as that which can be computed by the ideal mathematician.

      I really find it interesting that people time and again disassociate Turing's work with his teacher's. People confuse "Church's Thesis" with the "Church-Turing Thesis". It is either ignorance or people's inherent tendency to fail to see that the accomplishes of great people are due to a continuum of great people and great ideas. Where did Church get his motivation? David Hilbert and L.E.J Brouwer. Hilbert got his motivation from Brouwer, etc...

      I mean, did you even read the online version of Turing's paper that is linked from your Wiki page? I quote Alan Turing:

      In a recent paper Alonzo Church[2] has introduced an idea of "effective calculability", which is equivalent to my "computability", but is very differently defined. Church also reaches similar conclusions about the Entscheidungsproblem.[3] The proof of equivalence between "computability" and "effective calculability" is outlined in an appendix to the present paper.
    9. Re:Remember Lady Ada by Jagasian · · Score: 1

      I should also point out that in addition to your claim of independence of Church and Turing's works and that Turing wasn't one of Church's doctoral students... your claim that Turing didn't show the equivalence of computability (using his machines) and lambda-definability is also wrong. Just read the original papers.

      In my opinion, McCarthy just reinvented the lambda-calculus, or more accurately popularized a formal language to software engineers, that is roughly the same as the lambda-calculus.

      Why is Alonzo Church so lacking in popularity and Turing and McCarthy both so popular? Oh well, the actual works of Turing and McCarthy are definitive evidence of the contribution of Church... even if people today turn a blind eye towards this evidence.

      I guess this is thing happens all the time: Skolem and the incompleteness of formal mathematics, the Chinese and the printing press, Hitler and the extermination of semites. Godel, Gutenburg, and Bush are given credit for these things... but someone else did it long before them.

    10. Re:Remember Lady Ada by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      NO-ONE did it before Godel. Cantor came up with the diagonal argument, which came VERY close. But it really was Godel who "hosed everything".

    11. Re:Remember Lady Ada by Jagasian · · Score: 1

      You need to read up about Skolem's paradox. I recommend the following texts: "From Frege to Godel" by Van Heijenoort, "Introduction to Metamathematics" by Kleene, and "Mathematical Logic" by Kleene. Also, Godel didn't hose everything. Incompleteness applies to a specific formalization of mathematics... one that was already chastised for being flawed - LEJ Brouwer had been arguing that axiomatic classical mathematics was flawed... and not really mathematics.

  19. Yeah but .. by essreenim · · Score: 0

    The Abacus is the first real computer!!

    1. Re:Yeah but .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Depends, according to Turing, the thing that made the abacus was an earlier example.

  20. not by curator_thew · · Score: 2, Informative


    Nice try, but Ada Lovelace and Charles Babbage are recognised as the inventors of modern computing and programming. I suggest reading a bit about the architecture of the analytical, difference and related "engines" that he designed: they should remarkable similarity to a von neumann / harvard architecture (i.e. central processing units, memory banks, ALUs, etc).

    Not to undervalue Alan Turing's contribution though, but he was really breaking more substantial ground in the theory of computability; which really transcends software, hardware, and the trivial implementation details.

    Alan Turing actually fits alongside Newton and Eistein and those others who developed great universal insights.

  21. Turing by panurge · · Score: 5, Informative
    Let's not forget that Turing was unusual for his time in that he had practical skills as well as theoretical. He could actually machine the parts for relays and wire up electronics, at a time when mathematicians never got their hands dirty. (His time in the US, I am sure, contributed a lot to this.) His claim to be the father of software is based on his papers which actually discussed the whole organisation of a data processing center as well as the design of software itself, (before such things existed) and his early work with the Manchester computer, which involved advanced work into biological patterns. Since he had also been a lead consultant to the British Government in codebreaking in WW2 - not limited to Enigma by any means, but extending to voice encryption - he covered almost as many bases as John von Neumann.

    It's a bit sickening that already posts on this thread are making gay-bashing remarks about him. The history of how he was discarded by the British Government, believed to be partly at the instigation of the US government, is a sad story of how intolerance helped the British lose their early lead in computing. If he had been born forty years later, he'd probably be running an equivalent of Apple,Oracle, Sun or Microsoft, and no-one would care about what he did in his spare time.

    --
    Panurge has posted for the last time. Thanks for the positive moderations.
    1. Re:Turing by MrIrwin · · Score: 1
      "a sad story of how intolerance helped the British lose their early lead in computing"

      The british later did an excellent job of leading the way in computing with the LEO"

      There is no doubt in my mind that, genius as Turing was, Britain had plenty more computing epertise available (BTW, I know Pinkerton was from the US), the failure of British computing was purely commercial in the sense that LEO marketed "The commonwealth".

      Intolerance comes in when you think about US corporation reluctance to purchase outside the US.

      --

      And if you thought that was boring you obviously havn't read my Journal ;-)

    2. Re:Turing by panurge · · Score: 1

      The point was that the Ace was potentially a much more advanced design than the Ferranti/Manchester machine that gave rise to Leo. Although people like Newman and Blackett achieved quite a lot, I still think they were greatly handicapped by the failure of the Government and the Civil Service to make the most of the Turing design.

      --
      Panurge has posted for the last time. Thanks for the positive moderations.
    3. Re:Turing by OmniVector · · Score: 1

      sigh, and sadly that intolerance still exists today with gay marrage (or gay civil union, whatever you want to call it).

      --
      - tristan
    4. Re:Turing by jacquesm · · Score: 1

      only in backward, non-democratic countries though.

  22. Turing's wheels by ripcrd · · Score: 1

    IIRC, Turning used a bunch of wheels w/ gears to simulate the Enigma machine and break the code. Not entirely sure what he did after the war. Sounds like hardware to me. He also laid down the rules for the Turing test whereby we would be able to test an AI.

    I thought Babbage and Lady Ada Lovelace were the first software inventors. Or was that programmers?

    --
    --Somewhere there is a village missing an idiot.
  23. History of computers. by jsinnema · · Score: 5, Informative

    Here is a nice clickable overview:

    History of computers

  24. The Bombe by dunstan · · Score: 4, Informative

    Don't forget Turing's Bombes, which ran at Bletchley park deciphering intercepted German signals (see http://www.turing.org.uk/turing/scrapbook/ww2.html ).
    Of course, the real father of programmable computing was Tommy Flowers, who seems to have been largely forgotten.

    Dunstan

    --
    The last scintilla of doubt just rode out of town
    1. Re:The Bombe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just thought I'd leave a comment here to congratulate the poster of the parent. At least one /.er know a bit about history

    2. Re:The Bombe by frozenray · · Score: 2, Informative

      While we're at it, let's not forget that the bombes at Bletchley Park were a refinement on a Polish design. Turing made enormous improvements to it, but he was able to build on years of groundbreaking research by Rejewski and others in Poland.

      --
      "There are already a million monkeys on a million typewriters, and Usenet is NOTHING like Shakespeare." - Blair Houghton
  25. Almost right by ZurichPrague · · Score: 4, Informative

    "... he laid out in the 1920s the foundations of software"
    Actually it was the 30's (especially given that he was born in 1913, so even at the end of the 20's he was still a teenager).

    But at that same time in the thirties, the German Conrad Zuse wasn't just 'thinking it up' but doing it. Unfortunately, by being in the wrong country at the wrong time, he still is rarely credited.

    1. Re:Almost right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lots of teenagers write notable software. Imagine that Turing was an 18 year old German teen who is trying to drum up bidness for his Mom.

    2. Re:Almost right by 1iar_parad0x · · Score: 1

      The Turing Machine was never meant to be the model of a computer. It is the ultimate definition of what it means to do math. It just happens to be that programming is math. There is no distinction. That's why Kleene's use of recursive functions to describe mathematics was important too.

      I'll rant again....
      CHURCH'S THESIS, CHURCH'S THESIS, CHURCH'S THESIS!

      Conrad Zuse was a brilliant engineer. However, he never formalized the ultimate mathematical definition of what it means to compute! Hardware and software are indistinguishable in this regard.

      **Actually a rather pedantic point. Turing defined the notion of discrete state-based computation. Thus creating a definition of what it means to do math. However the notion of computation (even by logicians) has been noted to include analog and continuous phenomena.

      --
      What do you mean my sig is repetitive? What do you mean my sig is repetitive? What do you mean....
  26. [OT] Re:Turing didn't do crap. by lukewarmfusion · · Score: 1, Insightful

    I've been thinking about the Turing test lately and I wonder if it's not inherently flawed. It requires human perception, which is fallible and inconsistent, to validate the quality of AI. I certainly think it's an important component - that is, drawing from human ability to recognize animated life - but being able to fool a human being isn't the same as artificially intelligent.

    If you add in self-preservation as a requirement (Asimov) perhaps it would be a better test.

    1. Re:[OT] Re:Turing didn't do crap. by zopu · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Depends how you define intelligent, I guess (and that's probably the toughest problem with AI).

      The turing test only works in terms of 'weak' AI - that is that actions determine intelligence, and internal state doesn't matter.

      Strong AI on the other hand, says that to be intelligent, you must not only act intelligent, but also be intelligent internally.

      On the other hand, the self-preservation requirement doesn't really strike me as a facet of intelligence. A suicidal person might still have the intelligence to write a thoughtful note...

    2. Re:[OT] Re:Turing didn't do crap. by Scarblac · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It requires human perception, which is fallible and inconsistent, to validate the quality of AI.

      Worse, it requires the AI to fake human fallible and inconsistent human perception. Any test that requires an AI to wait for a bit before giving the answer to a hard numerical problem is a daft test.

      The Turing test tests humanness, not intelligence. There is no reason for (artificial) intelligence to be similar to a human's at all.

      --
      I believe posters are recognized by their sig. So I made one.
  27. A small point omitted in the article by gubachwa · · Score: 5, Interesting
    The one thing that the article doesn't comment on is the bizzare form of suicide method. It is one thing to ingest a poison like cyanide, but for it to be "a cyanide laced apple" is not particularly common.

    Turing was an amateur chemist in addition to being a world-class mathematician. His choice of suicide method was intended to lessen the impact it would have on other members of his family, in particular his mother. By eating a cyanide laced apple, it has been speculated that he wanted to make his death look like an accident. His mother would think that he had been performing some chemistry experiment, and then forgot to thoroughly wash his hands before eating the apple. Having one's son die is bad enough, but for it to be a suicide is doubly worse.

    On the more dramatic side, if one were so inclined, it could be said that his method of suicide was rather symbolic. Turing had partook in what was in his day forbidden. For this, he had been "cast out" of his chosen profession and what he loved to do -- in some sense, his Eden. As a final gesture before leaving this world, he ate a piece of forbidden fruit that was symbolic of this fact.

    It's a tragedy that the ignorance and intolerance of first half of the 20th century could have driven such a brilliant man to suicide. If it weren't for Turing, much of what we take for granted today may be a lot different or may not even exist at all. Hopefully the world has wisened over the last 50 years.

    1. Re:A small point omitted in the article by DataCannibal · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Well I think that someone as well educated and as well read as Turing would be aware that the Bible makes no mention of an Apple as the "forbidden fruit". IIRC it only refers to "the fruit of he tree of knowledge".

      At a wild guess I would say that the apple idea came along due to Northern Europeen painters who knew mostly apple trees.

      --
      No but, yeah but, no but...
    2. Re:A small point omitted in the article by jacquesm · · Score: 2, Interesting

      do you mean to imply that today we are so enlightened that absolutely no homosexual and / or lesbians commit suicide anymore because of their treatment at the hands of the 'others' ?

  28. Spyware by jbfaninmo · · Score: 0

    So he's the bastard that is responsible for all that spyware I'm consiantly cleaning off of computers.

    Thanks alot buddy!

  29. The Turing Option by mikestro · · Score: 0

    In case anyone is interested, check out the book "The Turing Option" which is based loosely on Alan Turing's concepts/etc:

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/04 46 364967/002-6669792-7192001?v=glance

    -Mike

  30. As I learned it by UrgleHoth · · Score: 1

    Ada is credited with being the first programmer

    --

    Dogma - "let's just say we'd like to avoid any empirical entanglements."
    1. Re:As I learned it by Minna+Kirai · · Score: 2, Informative

      Ada is credited with being the first programmer

      That's a lie. Ada was rich, and to keep her paying for Babbage's project, he had to make her feel like she was accomplishing something. He figured out the Bernoulli program himself, explained it to her, and let her write it out.

      Then in the 20th century, that lie was reinvigorated by educators wanting to supply girls with technical role-models.

    2. Re:As I learned it by jacquesm · · Score: 2, Funny

      actually, that in fact does make Ada the first programmer, Babbage would be a 'systems architect' :) She was just a lowly coder...

    3. Re:As I learned it by Minna+Kirai · · Score: 1

      She was just a lowly coder...

      You could call her, at most, a "technical writer".

  31. What Turing Worked For and Against by perfessor+multigeek · · Score: 5, Informative

    Actually, according to what he wrote in his letters and the memories of his friends, it was not so much the surveillance per se, as the overall inability to get work done or have a satisfying life that left him feeling so hopeless. The hormones did awful things to his body, from reduction in sex drive to growing breasts, the police bullied a street kid into faking the confession that led to Turing's conviction, the funding in England was getting routed around him and his travel was impaired by government restrictions. (This, keep in mind, while the Americans were surging ahead in computer design and would have been delighted to have Turing join them.)

    Oh, it was death by a thousand cuts while the nation that owed so much to him mostly looked on and let him be humiliated and kept from his work.

    Also keep in mind folks, that Turing, while thought of a theoretician, was arguably even more important as an operations guy. He led the effort to confront Churchill with the initial absurdly low levels of funding at Bletchley Park (the British code-breaking center), he played a key role in getting the staffing figured out and codes to the right places, and so on. IIRC, he was not averse to picking up a soldering iron and stepping into the physical work of *building* the computers.

    Of course, this isn't even getting into his late in life interest in things like how to use a computer to replicate patterns in nature like the spots on the side of a cow. Work that was leading him decades ahead of anybody else to the concepts we now know as fractals and chaotic phenomena.

    We'll never know what we've lost, but at least we're getting better at admitting who people like him were.

    But then, when we've still got stuff like A Beautiful Mind not even mentioning that Nash was mostly gay (the real reason he lost his clearance was not for mental illness but because he was found in bed with a young man) we've clearly got a long way to go.

    Rustin

    --
    Data is the lever, rigor the fulcrum, brains the force that drives it all.
    1. Re:What Turing Worked For and Against by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      (This, keep in mind, while the Americans were surging ahead in computer design and would have been delighted to have Turing join them.)

      I doubt the Americans attitude to homosexuality at the time would have been any different.

    2. Re:What Turing Worked For and Against by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      It's widely acknowledged that Turing was hounded to suicide because of his homosexuality. He shouldn't be trivialised as the inventor of software. Turing is the father of Computer Science (Von Neumann is the father of Computer Systems Engineering).

      The inventor of 'Software' does not go to Turing, Von Neumann, Babbage or Lovelace, it is reasonably well known (and taught on good computer science courses) that Al Alkorim Musa (cant remember the spelling) an Arab from the middle ages who formulated the idea of a 'list of stepwise instructions with iteration, condition, and branched control flow' (as a way of describing complex building plans). The subroutine did not appear until hundreds of years later with electronic computers. Hence the word Algorithm.
      Also see Algebra.

    3. Re:What Turing Worked For and Against by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      I think that "Al Alkorim Musa" is meant to be Muhammad ibn Musa al-Khwarizmi. His name is where the word algorithm derives from. However, the idea of an algorithm predates Al-Khwarizmi. The idea of "software" would seem to include instructions provided to some mechanical computing device to customize its operation. You could probably argue that the abacus was the earliest manifestation of this concept. I don't see much point in naming an "inventor" for these concepts though(other than nationalistic bragging) as these are really very general and appear in a number of different places and times.
      It would be nice if you could provide a reference disussing your "Arab from the middle ages who formulated the idea of a 'list of stepwise instructions with iteration, condition, and branched control flow' (as a way of describing complex building plans)". I don't think that al-Khwarizmi was responsible for this, of course I could be wrong... maybe you are thinking of al-Khashni, or someone else.

    4. Re:What Turing Worked For and Against by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      If you eat this apple
      Then you will be put out
      Else you will remain alive forever

      Ya, it goes back quite awhile.

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
    5. Re:What Turing Worked For and Against by perfessor+multigeek · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I doubt the Americans attitude to homosexuality at the time would have been any different.
      Um, actually, then and there it was. Keep in mind that Britain was still desperately broke while the U.S. was rolling in cash. Meanwhile Parliment was in the hands of Big Government socialists.
      For this and other reasons, doing leading edge computer work in Britain meant working closely under the same sorts of government dimwits who were making him miserable in the first place.

      Meanwhile, in the good old U.S.A., much computer development was in the hands of private companies like IBM which, I remind you, kept a vigorous division operating in Nazi Germany until right before the Allies arrived.
      I'm not making a moral statement one way or the other (at least not in this here post) but the consequence was that there were jobs in the U.S. available to Turing that would have been backed by the simple desire to have his skills available to increase their bank accounts.

      Would he have been square in the sights of McCarthy and his self-hating gay scumbags within a few short years? Maybe. But we'll never know. But we do know that "the Americans" were far from uniform in their attitudes and plenty of them, including plenty with cash and other brilliant computer guys already there, would have welcomed Turing with open arms.

      Rustin

      --
      Data is the lever, rigor the fulcrum, brains the force that drives it all.
  32. Nope, he cracked Enigma by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Enigma was the cipher (and machines) the Germans were using.

    The machines Turing designed to crack the Enigma cipher were called Bombes.

  33. Re:Turing didn't do crap. by mr_z_beeblebrox · · Score: 1

    Babbage did the real work.

    Don't forget the poet Ada, who was set to be a programmer long before Turing (yes, for Babbage)

  34. Neither by HBI · · Score: 1

    Unquestionably he'd use Gentoo.

    --
    HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
  35. "In case you forgot" by ehintz · · Score: 0

    Ahh, yes, I was wondering who this Turing fellow was, but couldn't for the life of me remember. Now that we've cleared that up, can you remind me about this Linus Torvalds guy? And who the hell are Dennis Ritchie and Ken Thompson?

    Really, I don't think too many self respecting /. readers will have "forgotten" who Alan Turing is... Perhaps a simple link for the n00bs would've been more appropriate.

    --
    ehintz
    1. Re:"In case you forgot" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Linus Torvalds, Dennie Ritchie and Ken Thompson are merely engineers. Not that they are nobodies, but their achievement is not on the same level as Turing's.

  36. Biographies and a correction by GoPlayGo · · Score: 2, Informative

    An excellent biography is "Alan Turing, the Enigma" by Andrew Hodges, 1983, updated American edition 2000: http://www.turing.org.uk/book/

    Derek Jacobi starred in a 1986 play about Alan Turing and also the excellent 1996 television adaptation. Videos can be purchased.

    The site linked by the slashdot article incorrectly identifies a photograph of an Enigma machine. It shows the cryptographic device manufactured by the Germans to encode and decode messages. This is not a device invented by Turing. He had a key role in the development of the programmable computing systems used by the British to crack intercepted German messages.

    --
    The game of Go (Igo, Weiqi, Baduk) has the simplest concept and the deepest play.
    1. Re:Biographies and a correction by lseltzer · · Score: 1

      I agree heartily on both points. I bought the Hodges biography several years ago when it was only available in England, now it's in print in America. A bit long and detailed at times, but it seems very complete.

      And the error on the page identifying the enigma machine as the bombe was pretty sloppy.

  37. Turing more than a genius by kid+zeus · · Score: 4, Informative
    Among other things he 'invented' the concept of digital recording of data. More interesting, the reason behind it (supposedly) was that he and his true love at school used to talk about death and the soul, and Turing was intrigued with discovering a way to record the information he felt made up the human soul, so that death would lose its sting and they would never have to be parted (mind being more important than body to him).

    Definitely one of the handful of brightest minds of the 20th Century and one of the people most individually responsible for the victory of the Allies after WWII. His subsequent treatment was vile and deplorable, but hey, how is that new in the military? Check out those prisoners... mmm, mmm, mmm... that's some good stuff. Considering the hypocrisy involved in the British Military going after a homosexual for being a security risk, well, I'll just leave off here.

    Turing's work on AI was so revolutionary that the entire field pretty much languished for a couple decades after his death until people finally started to pick up where he left off.

    1. Re:Turing more than a genius by Amiasian · · Score: 1

      So, Turing is sort of like a real life Londes (Bebop)?

    2. Re:Turing more than a genius by kid+zeus · · Score: 1

      Yes! Exactly. When I first watched that episode years back, I instantly thought, "Wow, they're doing a Turing riff. How cool is that?" Granted, maybe it was a riff on some intervening riff (not exactly an untapped story concept in sci fi), but as far as I can tell it all traces back to Turing. Like Aasimov taking R.U.R. and running with it.

  38. Don't forget Church! by amightywind · · Score: 1

    Turing's contributions were obviously profound but Lisp fans demand that Alonzo Church's contributions be given similar recognition.

    --
    an ill wind that blows no good
    1. Re:Don't forget Church! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (HUZZAH!)

  39. the Test of time by moviepig.com · · Score: 1
    Don't forget about his proposal of the "Turing test", which ascribes intelligence to a machine if can successfuly masquerade as human via typewritten conversation.

    More than a practical test, it continues to illustrate the inherent limits on such tests and concepts.

    --
    Seeing bad movies only encourages them. Watch responsibly
    1. Re:the Test of time by iworm · · Score: 3, Insightful
      As he defined it the test was actually:
      The new form of the problem can be described in terms of a game which we call the "imitation game." It is played with three people, a man (A), a woman (B), and an interrogator (C) who may be of either sex. The interrogator stays in a room apart from the other two. The object of the game for the interrogator is to determine which of the other two is the man and which is the woman. He knows them by labels X and Y, and at the end of the game he says either "X is A and Y is B" or "X is B and Y is A." The interrogator is allowed to put questions to A and B.


      The idea of identifying gender, rather than human or not human, is actually much more subtle than might be at first realised. He of course meant this to be extended as we all nowadays quote the test, but the original idea is subtly elegant... He was tackling the problem from the other direction: forget a computer pretending to be "intelligent", but what do we mean by "thinking" - If a man can "pretend" to be a woman, as per his test, what does that prove? That he is a woman?! Of course not... Thus was does it mean to be a woman, etc etc - Turing was a genius with amazing insight and perception.

      What a loss.

    2. Re:the Test of time by itsNothing · · Score: 1

      A prof i had in grad school (from Oxford, of course) claimed that the Cambridge students had a parlor/drinking game during Turing's time which consisted of ... having a male and female in a separate room, and passing notes into the room with questions designed to determine which of the two was the male and which the female.

  40. Coming soon from Hollywood: by StoatBringer · · Score: 1

    The Alan Turing Story, starring Will Smith as Turing, showing how this plucky young American invented computers and saved the girl!

    --
    Cress, cress, lovely lovely cress
  41. Enigma/Bletchley Park by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Alan invented Enigma, a machine to decode encrypted messages from the Germans. Uh, No. Turing invented the Bombe, which was used to decode the Enigma transmissions made by the germans. It was the germans who invented the Enigma machine. Given that the Enigma machine when properly setup could encode over 15 million million million combinations, cracking it was no mean feat. If you're in the UK I can recommend a visit to Bletchley Park which these days is a fascinating museum. And if you're knowledge of Enigma is based on Hollywood schlock like U-571 i'd suggest you read up on the truth! Also, kind of fittingly a park in Manchester is dedicated to Alan Turing with a statue of him. It sits between the UMIST institute of science and technology and the gay village.

    1. Re:Enigma/Bletchley Park by DataCannibal · · Score: 1

      UMIST = University of Manchester Institute of Science and Technology so 5/14 of your last sentence is redundant :-)

      --
      No but, yeah but, no but...
  42. turing archive by jcupitt65 · · Score: 4, Informative

    If you're interested in Turing, you might like the Turing Archive. This site has scans of a lot of his personal papers and research notes. You can read all his unpublished stuff too :)

  43. Alan Turing: The Movie. by AtariAmarok · · Score: 5, Funny
    "The Alan Turing Story, starring Will Smith as Turing, showing how this plucky young American invented computers and saved the girl!"

    Starring Halle Barry as his love interest, Lady Ada Lovelace. Famous for its one-liners used during gun battles with Enigma Nazis: "Code This!" and *BLAM!* BLAM!* "You failed the Turing Test.". Directed by Jerry Bruckheimer, it features Enigma machines that blow up like the Hindenburg whenever the wrong code is entered.

    Negotiations are underway with Barry Sonnenfeld's production company to bring back the giant robot spider from "Wild Wild West" to make an appearance as the very first computer bug.

    --
    Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
    1. Re:Alan Turing: The Movie. by Dusabre · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Even if it was the above, it wouldn't be as ghastly a travesty as "A Beautiful Mind". A tale which Hollywood perverted in its anti-intellectualism to cure the complexes of the intellect-limited, so that the genius hero ends up telling the world that its not brains that matter but heart and love. The movie hero professed his love to his wife who had stood with him through madness. The real-life genius got dumped.

    2. Re:Alan Turing: The Movie. by wormbin · · Score: 2, Funny
      Negotiations are underway with Barry Sonnenfeld's production company to bring back the giant robot spider from "Wild Wild West" to make an appearance as the very first computer bug.

      Turing: "Time for some Extreme Programming!" (loads shotgun with a loud ka-chink)

    3. Re:Alan Turing: The Movie. by X86Daddy · · Score: 1

      Sadly, I would pay to see this film.

  44. Actually, by bshroyer · · Score: 1

    I thought it was "Whoa to hice".

    --
    The cure for cancer is coming: Reovirus
  45. Re:Universal machine? yes. Software? nope. by Otto · · Score: 2, Informative

    Jacquard developed looms that could be controlled by using punched cards, but this wasn't really
    "programming" as such. What Turing created was the concept of algorithm execution, which until then nobody had come up with.

    Algorithm execution is where the data and the sequence of instructions for manipulating that data are all part of your input. Jacquard's loom was more along the lines of just the data being in his punched cards, while the sequence of events that occurred was built into the loom, and only dependant upon the punched cards for specific info about position and such.

    --
    - Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
  46. How about Lady Ada Byron ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Not to take anything from Turing but wasn't she recognized as the first programmer by coding a virtual program for a virtual (now working) computer conceived by Charles Babbage in 1843?

    http://www.agnesscott.edu/lriddle/women/love.htm

    "When inspired Ada could be very focused and a mathematical taskmaster. Ada suggested to Babbage writing a plan for how the engine might calculate Bernoulli numbers. This plan, is now regarded as the first "computer program.""

    1. Re:How about Lady Ada Byron ? by cr0sh · · Score: 1
      Yes and no...

      First off, yes - she did do exactly as you describe. As far as whether they work or not...?

      You see, no one has yet built a complete Analytical Engine (you are thinking about the Differential Engine - which calculates differential equations). Part of the engine (the Mill) was assembled from the "mass" of parts Babbage left behind when he dies (by his son, I believe) - but the rest of the machine was never completed.

      Other builders/inventors, inspired by what Babbage left behind (both physical works, as well as his writings), went on to construct other "Differential" engines - but none (that I am aware of), ever attempted what he designed for the Analytical Engine (that is, a fully mechanical base-10 programmable calculator - which had multiple registers for "memory", and the ability to "loop" and "branch" - it was almost Turing complete!). Most likely because of the immense mechanical complexity involved, thus the great amount of money which would be needed to construct it.

      I have always thought it was a pity that Babbage hadn't looked into electrical or electro-mechanical devices to build his machines. Telegraph relays and such were available in his time period, the "punch card" did exist (Jaquard's loom). However, it would take Hollerith to make this connection (and even then, only for tabulation - not general computing/calculation - though some later adapted his machines).

      It is a pity - for had Babbage recognized the importance of electricity for his designs, he could have used Boolean logic (which he was very familiar with - he was one of the best mathematicians of his time) instead of base-10 (which he used because it reduced the complexity of various mechanisms, as well as having this reduced complexity being easier to power mechanically by steam).

      Whether historically it would have mattered is difficult to say - there is a very good chance it could have changed the world (for good or better who knows) - imagine a 50-70 head start in computer technology - it boggles the mind with the possibilities (and yes, I have read the Difference Engine - but the alternate timeline would go even more sideways had Babbage utilized an electromechanical approach)...

      --
      Reason is the Path to God - Anon
  47. Re:Al Gore never said he invented Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I hope you're aware that I was joking...

  48. Re:progressing from PDA to TM by mitchkeller · · Score: 5, Informative

    What you have understand is that Turing didn't know about push down automata (PDA) when he developed the Turing machine (TM). Turing formulated the TM as a way to show that our formal axiomatic system for mathematics was undecidable (that is, there are statements whose truth values cannot be determined algorithmically). When he designed it, the states of the machine were compared to human states of mind. Finite automata (FA) and PDAs are things that logicians and theoretical computer scientists have developed over the years as simpler models of computation. By teaching about them in an automata theory class, students are more prepared for the concepts of the TM. If I just plopped the general definition of a TM down in front of a person, they'd probably run screaming from the room or at least be horribly confused until examples of simpler devices were presented. (Also, FAs and PDAs have the nice property of recognizing regular and context-free languages, respectively, which allows a discussion of formal languages and their recognition to progress in a natural manner.)

    I guess that my point is that the way we are taught mathematics (and that's what the theory of computation is) does not always coincide with the order in which the ideas were developed, no matter how natural the order they are taught in might seem. (For another example, consider that most calculus texts develop differentiation before integration, which is historically backward. The only text that I know of that presents calculus in the historically-correct order is Tom M. Apostol's Calculus. However, in his Mathematical Analysis, he follows the traditional order of differentiation first.)

    --

    "You will only be remembered for two things: the problems you solve or the ones you create." Mike Murdock

  49. Still open by 12357bd · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Turing left a bunch of still new ideas unexplored. Just look at his 48's paper Intelligent Machinery> .

    Recurrent connectionism was the starting point, and P machines have not even been explored.

    What's in a sig?

    --
    What's in a sig?
  50. Re:good riddance by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful
    I shouldn't reply, but anyway...

    It's arguable that Turing won the war by decoding the enigma. If it wasn't for him, the Nazis would've probably won - and you'd presumably feel right at home. Twat.

  51. re: Such a forward thinker... by inacoffeebuzz · · Score: 1

    He also foresaw a day when computer porn would no longer just be on punchcards...

    --
    I saw it. I stepped on it. My bad, but other life forms are likely to visit our planet at some point.
  52. Dangling Chad by AtariAmarok · · Score: 1
    "He also foresaw a day when computer porn would no longer just be on punchcards..."

    Punchcard computer porn? This explains that early XXX effort, "The Adventures of Dangling Chad".

    --
    Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
  53. Revisionist History by lophophore · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Read about Konrad Zuse.

    IMHO, he invented the first programming language.

    Details here

    --
    there are 3 kinds of people:
    * those who can count
    * those who can't
    1. Re:Revisionist History by BigBadBri · · Score: 1
      Interesting, and frightening too.

      Imagine the chaos if the Germans had had bureaucrats with vision, and had properly funded and supported Zuse.

      His 'computing universe' idea (alluded to at the end of the article) seems so similar to Wolfram's recent ideas that I was tempted to think the whole article was a hoax, but there are far too many links on Google for that.

      --
      oh brave new world, that has such people in it!
    2. Re:Revisionist History by lophophore · · Score: 1

      Re: Wolfram.

      Yeah, I thought that too. So much for Wolfram's "original idea..."

      --
      there are 3 kinds of people:
      * those who can count
      * those who can't
    3. Re:Revisionist History by ammoQ · · Score: 1

      Fortunately, Hitler and his bureaucrats did not believe in anything but brute force, guns and tanks and planes. German physicists (e.g. Otto Hahn) even had the general idea about the nuclear bomb - but Hitler didn't believe it would work.

    4. Re:Revisionist History by BigBadBri · · Score: 1
      There's a link to the English translation of his paper here.

      Don't know whether you've read it, but I'm just about to.

      --
      oh brave new world, that has such people in it!
    5. Re:Revisionist History by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And a nuclear bomb is not bruce force? No, Heisenberg made the wrong calculations about the amount of uranium required for a bomb and he didn't press for sufficient funding for a plutonium research project.

      Later, Heisenberg tried to justify himself by claiming he tried to twart the Nazis, but that is not so believable.

  54. Young Turing by AtariAmarok · · Score: 2, Funny
    "Lots of teenagers write notable software. Imagine that Turing was an 18 year old German teen who is trying to drum up bidness for his Mom."

    I think you are referring to the "Young Turing" movie "biography" starring Yahoo Serious. This details Turing's life growing up in Australia where he rassles crocodiles and invents shoelaces and joins a rock and roll band. Later, when he grows up, he invents computing when he figures out how to crack RIAA encryption in order to download the latest "Wyld Stallyns" tunes.

    --
    Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
  55. John von Neumann by zCyl · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Actually the turing machine served as the basis of the first hardware, not software.

    It's usually John von Neumann who is given credit for inventing the modern concept of the "stored program" in the mid 40's. So if I had to pick a single person to label the inventor of software, I think I would probably choose him. Turing could perhaps be labelled a father of computing.

    But then again, those are all just subjective labels. :) The important thing is to acknowledge which contributions they each made and try to do it correctly without letting the labels get in the way. And for that, I turn you to the expert:

    Alan Turing
    John von Neumann

    I don't mean to be picky, but I have my Automata Theory final in 5 hours

    Good luck. :)

    1. Re:John von Neumann by Knights+who+say+'INT · · Score: 1

      Von Neumann (together with Oskar Morgenstern) is also responsible for beginning Game Theory, and several advances in risk economics that would eventually lead to, hmm, the modern mess of derivative markets.

  56. Tsk tsk. by JeanPaulBob · · Score: 1

    A good faggot is a dead faggot. Good riddance

    Look, if you're going to make ignorant, bigoted insults, at least put in the time and effort to make them properly constructed ignorant, bigoted insults. I mean, it's bad enough being a jackass--why make yourself a dork, too? See, you switched up "good" and "dead". What you said doesn't even make sense.

    1. Re:Tsk tsk. by charlesbakerharris · · Score: 1
      A good faggot is a dead faggot. Good riddance

      Wow, you've just implied the divine redemption of all gay people. What profound theological and moral thought! Strong work!

      I mean, if dead gay people are good people, then all gay people end up good at some point! Can you then make the argument that they are saved? :)

  57. This guy should be the hero of gay rights. by Gannoc · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If he had been black/female/whatever, and accomplished what he did, and in the end was imprisoned and eventually driven to suicide as a direct result of his ethnicity, he would be constantly brought up as a grim example of racism.

    Children in school would learn about how the man who cracked Enigma and might have literally saved WW2 was eventually driven to commit suicide....

    While no gay person I know has even heard of Turing. I never heard about him until college.

    I think its another case of people not giving a damn about geeks...

    1. Re:This guy should be the hero of gay rights. by CelticLo · · Score: 0, Troll

      Maybe you should find yourself some better company if know of yours has ever heard of Turing?

    2. Re:This guy should be the hero of gay rights. by ctid · · Score: 4, Interesting

      In Manchester (in the UK) you can find a statue of Alan Turing. It is in Sackville Park in the city centre, right by the Gay Village. He is holding an apple, which is meant to represent the way he took his life. The first time I saw that statue was quite late in the evening and at first I thought there was somebody actually sitting there - it was a very spooky moment.

      --
      Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
    3. Re:This guy should be the hero of gay rights. by Brandybuck · · Score: 2, Insightful

      He should be a hero of computers, not of gays. What did he do to champion gay rights? Merely being gay? He wasn't even killed for being gay, he committed suicide.

      Being gay and famous isn't heroic.

      --
      Don't blame me, I didn't vote for either of them!
  58. Suicide not a certainty by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    It's not an absolutely accepted fact that Alan Turing did in fact commit suicide - his mother always denied that he would have done it, suggesting that it was his terribly careless nature which caused him to accidentally eat an apple which had come into contact with potassium cyanide.

    Andrew Hodges, whose biography of Turing is the most well read, is a fairly active gay-rights campaigner (more power to him), and it benefits his agenda to accept the death as suicide without writing perhaps slightly more about the circumstances surrounding Turing's death.

    1. Re:Suicide not a certainty by CTachyon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Now, come on. How does a computer scientist (for lack of a term broad enough to cover Turing) accidentally eat an apple laced with KCN? AFAIK cyanide isn't a common fixture of most computer/math research labs, and Turing as a (dabbling but competent) chemist would certainly have the common sense to not let a cyanide spill go uncleaned.

      I mean, think about it. What would you do if your government arrested you and said, "Hey bub, you read too much porn and we think porn-reading is a mental illness, so we're putting you on estrogen to kill your sex drive. For life, probably, since nobody can really cure porn-reading. Oh, and you'll grow boobies. If you don't like it, you can take prison instead, where people will ass-rape you daily for being a porn-reading sicko. Have a nice day!"? (On the odd chance that you're a woman, instead imagine some mythical hormone that withers up your breasts, kills your libido, and turns you into a tomboy.) I'm not sure that I know any people, regardless of gender or sexual orientation, that wouldn't be demeaned and degraded by such a radical forced change to their identity.

      --
      Range Voting: preference intensity matters
    2. Re:Suicide not a certainty by Hognoxious · · Score: 0
      ... we're putting you on estrogen to kill your sex drive. For life, probably, since nobody can really cure porn-reading. Oh, and you'll grow boobies.
      If I had boobies, I wouldn't need pr0n. I'd just stay at home and play with myself.
      I'll get me coat.
      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    3. Re:Suicide not a certainty by Rei · · Score: 1

      ... you know, that *can* be accomplished. ;) Search for keywords like "M2F" and "DIY", "estrogen" and "DIY", "estradiol" and "DIY", etc. Get on a mailing list, say you're a desparate M2F afraid of counselling (but that if you think you'll be able to get the nerve eventually, but you need hormones now) and ask for a legit overseas pharamacy that doesn't require a prescription (or, simpler, just go down to Mexico), purchase any form of estradiol, take it for at least a few months, and that's it. For more interesting results, take domperidone after a year or so (a dopamine inhibitor that, through a feedback mechanism, spikes your prolactin levels). ... of course, you know that they won't just go away when you're bored with them, right? ;) And you may not appreciate the other side effects very much. ;) And if you're not an m2f, you'll probably end up like Turing. But yes, the human body is quite malleable. Female bodies are even more malleable than male; odds are, you've seen at least one f2m in your life and didn't even notice; they look just like natal (albeit short) men, assuming they can bind their breasts down enough or have already gotten a mastectomy.

      --
      "She was out of her depth in a shallow pool." -- Peggy Noonan on Sarah Palin
    4. Re:Suicide not a certainty by Z4rd0Z · · Score: 1

      Sounds like his mother was in denial. I've seen this from a number of people I know (and people I don't know) whose family members committed suicide. The best excuse I've heard yet is "he didn't hang himself on purpose, he was just trying to get off sexually". I've heard that in three different places, two of which I knew the person or a member of their family. My wife's cousin OD'd on heroin, and his mother says "well, his liver was shot and he was about to die anyway". The singer Nick Drake OD'd on antidepressants and his parents say it couldn't have been suicide because he'd been upbeat and the doctor never told him the pills could be lethal, he just took too many on accident. And Kurt Cobain couldn't have committed suicide because friends report he'd been in a good mood the last few days of his life, right? Here's a clue: people about to commit suicide frequently show improvements in their moods. That's because they finally have a purpose in life: to off themselves!

      --
      You had me at "dicks fuck assholes".
    5. Re:Suicide not a certainty by CTachyon · · Score: 1

      Except that it would kill your sex drive, so you wouldn't care about the boobies. Besides, I doubt that after the novelty had worn off you would find your own boobies attractive -- gay men don't have the option of standing in a mirror all day and saying "Oh, me, you're so hot!", so odds are you wouldn't either, even if you kept both the libido and the breasts.

      --
      Range Voting: preference intensity matters
  59. Other fine monuments: the A662 by eetiiyupy · · Score: 1

    He is also commemorated by a small stretch of the Ring Road aroung Manchester. We know how to hype our National Heros.

  60. Re: His homosexuality lead to his death by gaijin99 · · Score: 2, Informative
    His sexual orientation would be irrelivant, except for the minor little detail that anti-homosexual bigotry is directly responsible for his early death. Turing was insturmental in the British war effort, and had he lived computers might be decades more advanced today. The fact that he was driven to suicide because he was gay makes the fact of his homosexuality important.

    My point here is that simply in and of itself anyones sexuality is pretty irrelivant, but the prejudice surrounding homosexuality directly impacted Turing's life. Because fo that failing to mention that he was gay would be similar to failing to mention that Beethoven was deaf. You'll notice that you don't often see articles about Motzart talking about how he was able to hear either. These facts were important to their lives, in a way that, say, Albert Einstein's hetrosexuality wasn't. Streightness is not mentioned much because it is assumed that a person is streight unless its otherwise specified, and due to its wide acceptance hetrosexuality simply doesn't affect a person much. However other sexual specifics are mentioned when its important (JFK's affairs, St. Francis' chastity, etc).

    --
    "Mission Accomplished" -- George W. Bush May 1, 2003
  61. Boolean Algebra? by Prince+Vegeta+SSJ4 · · Score: 1

    I thought George Boole, could be more accurately called 'The Inventor of Software'. Doesn't boolean algebra lay the foundation for which programming is based upon.

  62. Ya, because reasoning with bigots works by EvilAlien · · Score: 2, Insightful
    OMFG TURING WAS GAY? WOW, A GAY MAN ACCOMPLISHED SOMETHING! ORGANIZE A PARADE!

    Who cares? Aside from the fact that Turing's sexuality is not ignored, it would be a good thing if it was. Let me guess: if it was something that the mainstream media obsessed about, you'd post comments about how homophobia in mainstream media glosses over Turing's accomplishments in favor of irrelevant discussion of his sexual preferences.

    Go read Cryptonomicon if you need to obsess about what everybody's sexuality is.

    --
    perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'
    1. Re:Ya, because reasoning with bigots works by American+AC+in+Paris · · Score: 1
      Who cares? Aside from the fact that Turing's sexuality is not ignored, it would be a good thing if it was.

      Y'know, the fact that he was gay wouldn't be an issue if it hadn't been the driving reason behind his public humiliation, state-ordered castration, and suicide.

      Alan Turing's sexuality is important to demonstrate one very simple and essential point: One of the history's single greatest scientistific minds was destroyed by a petty, bigoted obsession with his sexual orientation.

      Had society been able to cope with the fact that he loved men, he could have contributed to the advancement of computer science for decades to come. It's a challenge to even imagine what else he would have discovered in this time. Instead, we're left with a shameful record of how we sacrificed one man's brilliance to protect the moral delicaices of others.

      Turing's sexual orientation is, unfortunately, an integral part of his life's story. It demands attention, if only to help society avoid repeating such disgusting persecution in the future.

      --

      Obliteracy: Words with explosions

    2. Re:Ya, because reasoning with bigots works by HeyLaughingBoy · · Score: 1

      I think both sides of this are missing something important: people are saying "who cares if he was gay" because it truly doesn't matter and normally shouldn't be made an issue.
      But there was a time when this would have been all that mattered. The majority would be trying to pretend that he wasn't, because "gays can't make that kind of contribution."
      The fact that this discussion/argument is happening at all is a glimpse into how far we have come as a society to realize the irrelevance of sexual orientation.

      Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure that after I read another few posts, I'll be reminded of how many lightyears we have still to travel {sigh}...

  63. Uh, no... by centauri · · Score: 1

    I think you'll find that Lawrence Waterhouse was really the father of modern computing. I'm surprised his grandson Randy hasn't popped up here to set you guys straight.

    A Secret Admirer

    --
    Don't blame me, I voted for Durga.
  64. Re:George Washington Carver was also... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ugh! I would have preferred NOT knowing that he was black. It's like finding out that Albert Einsteim liked to eat his own boogers.

  65. Apple's moniker by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Almost certainly comes from their love for the Beatles

  66. Remarkable:Turing was also... by paraphase · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Hell of a way to treat a man who saved hundreds, maybe thousands of lives by breaking the Enigma cypher.
    The Enigma had more combinations than there are molecules in the visible universe...if the History Channel told me right. More than "4*10^26" if "Enigma+combinations" is Googled.
    No small feat.

  67. eh? by Tired_Blood · · Score: 1

    Timely information during war is priceless. The Allied effort in Africa during WWII was aided considerably with the code-cracking.

    True, the English didn't want to expose that they were listening to EVERY conversation - but to not use the info would be foolish.

    AFAIK, to hide the fact that they knew everything that was being encrypted, they would establish alibis. Something like sending a surveilance plane during the day to fly near areas where military presence/movement was greatly increasing (just make sure that plane gets NOTICED). That way, the Germans would assume that the English found out because of that damn plane instead of the detailed reports being sent through their cracked channel (which enjoyed continued use).

    The German navy was better at security, but it was still based on a mostly broken system. They could have at least randomized the sequence of characters used on the wheels.

    --
    This is not my sig.
  68. Gay ?? Onion spoof by LesDawson · · Score: 4, Funny

    I like how the poster complains that it wasn't explicitly made clear he was gay - as if that was relevant at all. This reminds me of an Onion spoof :

    Alan Mathison Turing was one of the great, gay pioneers of the computer field.
    He inspired the now common terms of "The Turing Machine" and "Turing's Test.", and preferred the company of men to women. As a mathematician he applied the concept of the algorithm to digital computers, and liked to kiss and hold other men.
    The homosexual's research into the relationships between machines and nature created the field of artificial intelligence. His intelligence and foresight made him one of the first to step into the information age. His sexual preference was for men.

  69. The 3 Pioneers of Computing were ... mad by itsNothing · · Score: 4, Informative
    It's interesting to examine the lives of the 3 pioneers of theorical computing: Kurt Godel, Emil Post and Alan Turing.

    Turing developed a model for computers (the Turing machine). He developed the proof of the Halting problem. That is, given a program and a input to that program, you cannot generally determine if the program will terminate execution.

    As you're probably already aware, Turing was arrested and imprisoned for homosexuality. After he was released, he undertook a multi-month project to extract cyanide from the pits of apples. After he had sufficient quantities, he drank it and died (aged early 40s).

    Kurt Godel was responsible for developing the mathematical proof of undecidability. Given a system with the capabilities of "simple" arithmetic, he showed that there are propositions (i.e. statements) you can make within the system which can be neither proven nor disproven. This is equivalent to Turing's "halting problem".

    Godel was paranoid, and believed that people were trying to poison him. He only ate what his wife cooked. When she died, he stopped eating and starved himself to death.

    Emil Post was an American mathematician (Columbia Ph.D., i think) who developed a proof of undecidability many years before Godel. In addition, he developed a model for computation which is similar to Turing's machine (it uses a pre-loaded queue to both hold the input string, and to hold the results of intermediate computations). He developed a proof of undeciability based upon his machine model (the "Post Correspondence Problem").

    Post was a manic-depressive for most of his life. He lost an arm in an accident as a child. He had a hard time holding jobs after receiving his Ph.D. due to his depression. In the 50's he was treated for depression using Electro-Shock therapy (for interested readers... for a real shock go look up the 1948 or 1949 Nobel prize for Medicine :-). After one of his "treatments", he suffered a heart attack and died.

    So, in conclusion, it's rather interesting to reflect upon the fact that the foundations of computer science comes from three individuals who suffered clear psychological problems. (And they wonder why nerds work in the dark :-)

    1. Re:The 3 Pioneers of Computing were ... mad by powera · · Score: 2

      Haven't you ever read H.P. Lovecraft? The forbidden knowledge drove them all completely insane until it caused their deaths. The conclusion is that once somebody figures it out, they are no longer in a position to care about it, and are too mad to tell anyone else.

    2. Re:The 3 Pioneers of Computing were ... mad by cfuse · · Score: 1
      So, in conclusion, it's rather interesting to reflect upon the fact that the foundations of computer science comes from three individuals who suffered clear psychological problems.

      Ahem, homosexuality is not a psychological problem. I know it can look that way, but as strange as the 'Queer Eye for the Straight Guys' men are, they aren't insane.

    3. Re:The 3 Pioneers of Computing were ... mad by itsNothing · · Score: 1

      Although i would absolutely agree with you that homosexuality is not a psychological problem, i think it's safe to say that spending months extracting cyanide from apple pits with the intension of suicide is an indication of a psychological problem. Wouldn't you agree?

    4. Re:The 3 Pioneers of Computing were ... mad by cfuse · · Score: 1
      Although i would absolutely agree with you that homosexuality is not a psychological problem, i think it's safe to say that spending months extracting cyanide from apple pits with the intension of suicide is an indication of a psychological problem. Wouldn't you agree?

      Yes. Any right thinking person would have bought apples in bulk, thereby cutting production time from months to days.

  70. Babbage, Ada Countess of Lovelace were first by crovira · · Score: 1

    with the diference engine.

    Sorry.

    --
    MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
  71. Re:George Washington Carver was also... by wcrowe · · Score: 1

    Yes, I see where you're going, but you're wrong. There is a difference between appearance (black) and behavior (gay). It is wrong to persecute someone on appearance. To discriminate based on behavior is not only correct, it is sometimes necessary.

    --
    Proverbs 21:19
  72. A reason to mention his affectional orientation... by brinn10 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Did Turing's affectional orientation effect his contribution to computer science? Certainly, even if only because his life was cut short by cruelty. But there are more important lessons to be learned as well. The permanent state of exception (extra-legal state of emergency, think Patriot Act) and the selection of a single group for sacrifice to the "good" of all (think not of gay marriage but of the response, several states have stripped LGBT individuals of even basic protection under civil law) exactly mirror the conditions of the democratically elected government of 1930's Germany. Several theoriticians like Giorgio Agamben have studing the juridical conditions that brought about the Nazi's Reich. Technology may be exactly the tool that prevents these things from ever happening again.

  73. Nobody creates an idea. by Thinkit4 · · Score: 1

    It's this mentality that leads to patents. Someone else would have discovered these ideas if this nice man hadn't.

    --
    -I am an elective eunuch.
  74. Enough already by mike260 · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Are there a lot of overzealous gay rights activist moderators today?

    "Homophobia is bad!"
    Well, durr...

  75. Re:Universal machine? yes. Software? nope. by WegianWarrior · · Score: 4, Informative

    While Jacqard certainly has a major place in the history of computers, his looms can not be said to been computers in the sence we use today as they could "solve" only one problem - how to make fabrik.

    No, the true inventor, if such a word can be used, of the true programable, mulitpurpose computer is one of Great Britans great geniuses from the early 1800s - Charles Babbage. In 1835 he presented a design for a programable, mechanical computer - the Analytical engine. It was to be powered by steam, and would been 30 meters long (roughtly 100') and 10 meters wide (roughtly 30'). It would use cards simular to those invented by Jacqard for input, while output was via a mecanical printer (rather simular to the printingpresses employed by newspapers), a curveplotter and a bell. Unlike modern, binary machines it would use base 10 in it's calculations.

    Ada Lovelace, as someone else pointed out, was the first programmer for the analytical engine. It would have employed a launguage very simular in most respects to modern assembler, including the possibility to branch and loop.

    More on his analytcal engine can be found here.

    --
    Everything in the world is controlled by a small, evil group to which, unfortunately, no one you know belongs.
  76. online Enigma by scubacuda · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Check out this online Enigma machine.

    Play with that a while, and you'll see why that was such a bitch to crack.

  77. correction:Remarkable:Turing was also... by paraphase · · Score: 0

    ".....we need in order to calculate the theoretical number of possible Enigma configurations. It is simply the product of all five values calculated above. That astounding number is 3,283,883,513,796,974,198,700,882,069,882,752,878, 379, 955,261,095,623,685,444,055,315,226,006,433,615,62 7,409, 666,933,182,371,154,802,769,920,000,000,000 which is approximately 3 × 10^114. To see just how large that number is, consider that it is estimated that there are only about 10^80 atoms in the entire observable universe. No wonder the German cryptographers had confidence in their machine!"
    from: http://www.nsa.gov/publications/publi00004.cfm

  78. You ever been straight-bashed? by brinn10 · · Score: 1

    This is such a weak arguement, I am shocked seemingly intelligent people use it. The reason not to mention that some one is straight, hetero, a breeder, etc, is that people are not beat to death for being straight. There are not counties voting to ban and arrest straight people(Tennessee anyone?). There are not governments that arrest and execute straight people(most of the African continent and Caribean). I can pass as a straight man, and have never been mistreated for it. But I have been surrounded by five men and beat to the ground because I'm gay. If you support open-source and the progressive era of invention and discovery, how can you not see that the world does not judge men like Turing by their talent, only by the labels that are put on them?

  79. Re:Universal machine? yes. Software? nope. by Tablizer · · Score: 1

    [From Babbage link] A variety of Action Cards perform non-arithmetic operations related to the calculation. The Action Cards are: B - Ring a bell to attract the attention of the attendant.

    Mr. Babbage invented chr(7) back then. Now THAT is impressive :-)

  80. Troy by pommiekiwifruit · · Score: 1
    Next thing they will be claiming that Achilles never fancied blokes. Oh wait.

    I can't wait for the Alexander the Great biopic from Hollywood where he will be a straight blond American.

    1. Re:Troy by Hooded+One · · Score: 2, Informative

      While Troy will be noticeably lacking in Orlando Bloom-on-boy action (much to the fangirls' dismay), the upcoming movie Alexander has no such problem.

      "Jared Leto has recently been cast to play the role of Hephaestion, Alexander the Great's best friend and homosexual lover in Oliver Stone's latest movie, "Alexander". The role was originally offered to Brad Pitt but was turned down due to pressure from his wife, Jennifer Aniston. Alexander is to be played by Colin Farrell."

      Mmm...

    2. Re:Troy by Hognoxious · · Score: 0
      I can't wait for the Alexander the Great biopic from Hollywood where he will be a straight blond American.
      If diminutive convict descendant Mel Gibson's involved in any way, no doubt that there Xerxes (or is it Darius - I always get them two mixed up) herbet will have a British accent. Oh, and it will probably be shyte, too.
      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    3. Re:Troy by pommiekiwifruit · · Score: 1
      Cool, I take it back! Not Charlie Hunnam but he'll have to do :-)

      Apparently there is also a case to be made that the relationship between Achilles (Brad pitt) and Patroclus might have been exaggerated by later (e.g. Athenian) commentary anyway.

    4. Re:Troy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you stupid cunt - mel's family is from america, they moved to australia after his dad won big on jeopardy. true, mel's a fucking lunatic, but get your fucking facts straight. ass.

  81. Wouldn't Babbage Be the First Software Developer? by bbagnall · · Score: 1, Redundant

    Wouldn't Charles Babbage and Ada Lovelace be the first developers of software? I know both of them had several programs ready to go once Babbage had his computer completed in the 1800's. Unfortunately funding stopped. However, this is better than Turing ever did, because his Infinite machine was even more theoretical than Babbages.

  82. Error about Enigma by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 1
    From the article:
    Through endless hours and logical deduction, they unraveled the Enigma code used by the Germans to send messages to field commanders and U-boats.
    I could have sworn that ENIGMA was unbroken until they got their hands on an ENIGMA machine.
    --
    Drill baby drill - on Mars
    1. Re:Error about Enigma by jorgen · · Score: 1
      I could have sworn that ENIGMA was unbroken until they got their hands on an ENIGMA machine.

      The first crack of the ENIGMA was done by polish codebreakers even before the war. The cracking of later versions of the ENIGMA at Bletchley Park essentially build on the polish efforts.

    2. Re:Error about Enigma by black+mariah · · Score: 1

      The Polish teams work wasn't so much a crack as it was a deduction of how the machine worked. This played a major part in eventually breaking the code, but it wasn't until the British team figured out the order of the letters on the wheels that ENIGMA was actually broken.

      --
      'Standards' in computing only impress those who are impressed by things like 'standards'.
  83. He is, to me by TuringTest · · Score: 1

    My nickname is chosen after the fact that I am gay and I admire Alan Turing.

    There is a blog, Gaygeeks, in which Turing is a well-known hero.

    --
    Singularity: a belief in the "God" idea with the "demiurge" relation inverted.
  84. He'd turn in his grave by sugarmotor · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Whenever the name Turing comes up, I think he would turn in his grave if he saw what kind of software is being produced today - buffer overflows ... rampant waste of memory and processor time ... Y2K stuff etc.

    He would have been delighted with a 1GHz / 1GB RAM machine and now it is just taken for granted.

    --
    http://stephan.sugarmotor.org
  85. George Boole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ha?
    Boolean logic has a lot more to do with machine computation.

  86. The real question is... by ShaggyBOFH · · Score: 1
    What if he lived in todays world and patiented the concept?

    --
    --- Just say no to negativity.
  87. Halting Problem by pluvia · · Score: 2, Informative

    Just to clarify, the Halting Problem is undecidable, not impossible.
    i.e. There are many cases wherein one machine can compute whether another machine will halt.

    1. Re:Halting Problem by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah, that gets to me. I was interested in "dependent" type theory, and fouind that most CompScis, in their own world a bit like the physicist's "spherical cows", had abandoned dependent types because they had been proved to be formally undecidable in the general case.

      BUT IN THE VAST BULK OF ORDINARY EVERYDAY CASES, you can do useful compiler optimisations with them, dammit!

  88. Molecules in the universe by old_unicorn · · Score: 1

    Isn't Avogadro's number 6 x 10E23? That's the number of atoms in one mole of a substance, i.e. 12 grammes of Carbon 12. Therefore 12 Kilogrammes has 6E26 atoms. Therefore there are a few more than 4E26 molecules in the visible universe, I suspect.

    --
    ***You learn something Every day. And then you die.***
    1. Re:Molecules in the universe by Impy+the+Impiuos+Imp · · Score: 1

      IIRC, about 10^^(70 or 80) subatomic particles, and 10^^120, if it were packed solid with neutrons.

      I can't believe I'm still being hammered by the 2 minute limit. Can't they realize people can type in a message quite quickly?

      --
      (-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
  89. A little something more... by cr0sh · · Score: 1
    I just wanted to note that Babbage was aware of using punched cards to control his Analytical Engine - indeed, he had forseen using punch cards for the output of the engine - so that the cards could be read via a printing device - divorcing the printing from the computing parts, unlike the Difference Engine (ie, offline printing).

    I just want to clarify that I didn't mean to imply that Babbage didn't know about punch cards - he did, to a very great extent.

    I reccommend that if you want to find out more about Charles Babbage and his contributions to computing, you should read "The Difference Engine" by Doron Swade (ISBN 0-670-91020-1) - I think /. has had a review on it in the past, as well - it is an excellent book which clears up a lot of confusion about Babbage, Ada, and a whole host of other characters (steampunk as reality?)...

    --
    Reason is the Path to God - Anon
  90. Actually, no... by cr0sh · · Score: 1
    The ability to manufacture all the parts for the Analytical (and Difference) Engines all existed at the time of Babbage. The modern team you refer to actually did build their recreation of the Difference Engine to the "spec level" of Babbages time - the only thing different was that they used mass-production techniques to make all the parts, rather than hand tooling each individual part.

    Babbage employed a series of very skilled draftsmen/engineers of his time (in some ways, they were the best in their fields).

    I would say most of the problems with the Analytical Engine not being built had to do with Babbage's constant redesign of it, along with not being able to secure the funds to build it - coupled with other reasons.

    As for the Difference Engine - it is interesting to note that Babbage had a falling out with his main engineer/draftsman - over payment or somesuch for work. This individual (Clement), through a series of disputes, eventually killed the relationship and contract with Babbage (and the Treasury, which provided the finance). Most of the parts that were built ended up being melted down as "scrap", others were used for test models. The other drawings and models, etc were eventually returned to Babbage, but only after some very drawn out legal ordeals. I liken a lot of this similar to today's patent disputes and/or copyright disputes.

    Finally, in a way, a form of "DRM" also helped put nails in the coffin of the Difference Engine - in that Clement, when he left, took all of the tools and jigs needed to build the parts with him when the contract ended (actually, IIRC, it was part of the contract he signed with Babbage, that any tools or jigs he constructed, along with all rights, would remain with him at the end of the contract). In a way, it would be like having the code for a project, but your programmer leaves with the one copy of the compiler, which he wrote...

    --
    Reason is the Path to God - Anon
  91. Re:George Washington Carver was also... by black+mariah · · Score: 1

    I think his point was more along the lines of "I didn't know that, and really didn't care to know." It's like seeing pictures of Cindy Crawford taking a dump. Yeah, you know she does but... you'd rather not know about it.

    --
    'Standards' in computing only impress those who are impressed by things like 'standards'.
  92. well... by akintayo · · Score: 1

    There are quite a few benefits that are gained from marriage.
    The right to visit your spouse in the hospital. "Family only"
    The right to 'pull the plug' on your spouse.
    The right to inherit property from your spouse.
    The ability to be covered under your spouse's insurance.

    I am gonna disagree with your presentation of historical fact also.

    --
    Woe be on to them, all who rise against poor people, shall perish in a the end. Buju Banton
    1. Re:well... by Brandybuck · · Score: 1

      The right to visit your spouse in the hospital. "Family only"

      That's up to the hospital. I've been able to visit many friends in the hospital, even terminally ill friends, without having to marry them.

      The right to 'pull the plug' on your spouse.

      Make your wishes known in advance, and someone else can. Of course, why this is considered a "benefit" is a whole other topic...

      The right to inherit property from your spouse.

      Write up a will. Duh!

      The ability to be covered under your spouse's insurance.

      Like hospitals, this is up to the insurance company. Most will allow you to specify ANYONE as the beneficiary.

      --
      Don't blame me, I didn't vote for either of them!
    2. Re:well... by akintayo · · Score: 1
      The right to inherit property from your spouse. Write up a will. Duh!
      Depending on the juridstiction spouses have an automatic right to inherit property. This generally trumps a written will, and would prevent the surviving spouse from being unfairly disinherited.

      Like hospitals, this is up to the insurance company. Most will allow you to specify ANYONE as the beneficiary.
      Coverage is different from being a beneficiary. A beneficiary is generally someone who collects on a life insurance policy, while coverage means that your qualified expenses will be paid by the insurance company

      --
      Woe be on to them, all who rise against poor people, shall perish in a the end. Buju Banton
  93. I misread the header... by Flashpot · · Score: 1
    and had to do a double take. Alan Turing; most certainly one of a handful for which "inventor of software" could be applied.

    Darl McBride, on the other hand...

    --
    That which does not kill her only prolongs my agony.
  94. Don't Forget Tommy Flowers by plusser · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Tommy Flowers in my verdict was more important to the development of the first electronic computer than Turin. Tommy built Colossus under Turin's direction during the Second World War and is often overlooked as he turned Turin's ideas into a reality.

    Tommy died quite recently in comparative obscurity. After the war he tried to encourage the Post Office (whom he worked for) to develop a digitally controlled automatic telephone exchange. The Post Office (now BT) didn't understand what he was suggesting, so digital telephone exchanges were not developed until the late 1970's, some 30 years later.

    It takes a genius to come up with an idea, but it takes another genius from an engineering background to turn them into something that will work.

    1. Re:Don't Forget Tommy Flowers by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I had the pleasure of working with Tommy a few years back. He said he was getting ready to go back home to die. He had so many stories about working with Turing. Tommy said it was "shamefull what they did to poor Alan", and helped motivate me to try to do work that would make a real difference.

      Hawking and Penrose, Watson and Crick, Turing and Tommy - so often there's a great theoretician and a great engineer (in the classical sense). It's hard to evaluate one's work without the other.

  95. Re:Universal machine? yes. Software? nope. by mwood · · Score: 1

    Um, no. The idea of an algorithm was invented by an Arab (al-Khowarizmi, or something like that) centuries before Turing *or* Jacquard. We also get the word "algebra" from the title of one of his writings.

    Hmmm, what you seem to be describing is the idea of representing programs and data in the same store, which IIRC is due to von Neumann.

    As to whether or not something is "programming" seems to be subjective. The loom has hardware to arrange the threads this way or that; the computer has hardware to add or shift. Either way there are some data which the machine would interpret as "do this, then do that." One is a data-driven device which operates on thread; the other a data-driven device which operates on data.

  96. Also... by Rei · · Score: 1

    Also, it was kind of stupid to begin with - giving him estrogens to try and stop his sex drive. There have been androgen blockers out there on the market almost as long as estrogens. Heck, even licorice and cannabis are androgen blockers to some degree. Estrogens are only partially effective at blocking androgens on their own - ask any male to female transsexual. :)

    --
    "She was out of her depth in a shallow pool." -- Peggy Noonan on Sarah Palin
  97. Re:Universal machine? yes. Software? nope. by mwood · · Score: 1

    Ah, terminology.

    "universal machine" here is a rather specialized term. A Turing machine is able to evaluate some set of computable functions; a universal Turing machine is able to simulate any possible Turing machine and so can evaluate any computable function. Whether or not Babbage's Analytical Engine is equivalent to a UTM is a question I'm not skilled to answer, but I'll bet he had no idea how to think about it in those terms. What Turing gave us was worked-out theory on what is and is not computable, and some ideas about classes of computable functions and what it takes to evaluate them.

    Did the Countess of Lovelace ever actually write code for the AE? It was never built and could not be built until quite recently due to the manufacturing tolerances required. A few years back someone built a portion of the "mill", but a complete AE as Babbage envisioned it has never existed.

    My original point was about calling Turing the "inventor of software". Depending on your definition of software, it goes way, way back. That has very little to do with a "programmable, multipurpose computer" which, while a really valuable object, isn't what the article discusses.

  98. This story is a troll... by jjsjeff · · Score: 0, Redundant

    Al Gore invented software!

    -J

    1. Re:This story is a troll... by geekoid · · Score: 1

      At least he didn't invent reasons to go to war.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  99. Re:progressing from PDA to TM by CargoCultCoder · · Score: 2, Informative

    Turing formulated the TM as a way to show that our formal axiomatic system for mathematics was undecidable (that is, there are statements whose truth values cannot be determined algorithmically).

    Not quite. Kurt Godel demonstrated that mathematics (or any sufficiently powerful "formal system") was either complete (all valid statements are decidable) or inconsistent.

    Turing demonstrated that -- assuming you want your system to be consistent -- there is no finite, deterministic method for determining whether a given statement in that system is decidable or not.

    I.e., not only is mathematics "sullied" by these undecidable statements, but there is no way to neatly characterize them.

    This was the last nail in the coffin of the Hilbert Program. (David Hilbert was a leading German mathematician of the early 20th century). Hilbert asserted that mathematics can be characterized as "an inventory of provable formulas", without possibility of inconsistency (i.e., it was not possible for 'A' and 'Not A' to be true at the same time). Godel proved that not all formulas are proveable. Turing destroyed any remaining hope by proving that there was no way cordone off the unprovable formulas.

  100. First developer? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Odly enought the first programmer is often said to be Ada Lovelace in the 1830's. It was all theory and paper based but the basic idea of a program was there.

  101. He was not the inventor of software by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Alan Turing was not the inventor of Software. That distinction belongs to the daughter of the poet Lord Byron, Augusta Ada Byron (1815-1852) who worked with Babbage on the Analytical Engine.

    Turing is instead considered the founder of computing science. See http://www.turing.org.uk/ for more information.

    Please try to get your facts straight. These editors really should lift their game.

    1. Re:He was not the inventor of software by CypherOz · · Score: 2, Informative

      In the annotations, which were called "Notes", Ada Lovelace described how the Analytical Engine could be programmed and gave what many consider to be the first ever computer program.

      She described the Analytical Engine in the following way [6]:

      The distinctive characteristic of the Analytical Engine, and that which has rendered it possible to endow mechanism with such extensive faculties as bid fair to make this engine the executive right-hand of abstract algebra, is the introduction into it of the principle which Jacquard devised for regulating, by means of punched cards, the most complicated patterns in the fabrication of brocaded stuffs. It is in this that the distinction between the two engines lies. Nothing of the sort exists in the Difference Engine. We may say most aptly that the Analytical Engine weaves algebraical patterns just as the Jacquard-loom weaves flowers and leaves.

      She also wrote in the Notes [6]:

      Again, [the Analytical Engine] might act upon other things besides number, were objects found whose mutual fundamental relations could be expressed by those of the abstract science of operations, and which should be also susceptible of adaptations to the action of the operating notation and mechanism of the engine . . .



      Ada Lovelace born 1815; Alan Turing born 1912


      The sexy chic wins! Too bad that the Ada programming language was named after her - way to formal, I think she would have liked something kool like perl - a love^^^^necklace of perls :-)

      --
      You want a signature? You can't handle a signature!!
  102. Really? by smoyer · · Score: 1

    I thought it was Randall L. Waterhouse

  103. Surely... by gidds · · Score: 1

    As others have said, surely the best sign of a healthy and bias-free society wouldn't be that they felt able to mention his sexuality, but that they did't see the point of mentioning it?

    --

    Ceterum censeo subscriptionem esse delendam.

  104. Re:A reason to mention his affectional orientation by susano_otter · · Score: 1
    So far as I can tell, technology, like the law, is still just a tool at the end of the day. It wasn't the laws of Germany that "brought about the Nazi's Reich", it was the Nazis. Technology killed the Jews at Auschwitz, after all, but we don't look to technology when we assign blame.

    A culture could share some infrastructural characteristics with 1930s Germany indefinitely, and still never spawn anything even remotely as horrible as the Third Reich. The creation and suspension of laws do not a tyrrany make.

    --

    Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

  105. Turing did NOT invent software! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turing invented the calculating "engine".

    It was Ada Lovelace (in whose honour the programming language was named) who invented software and instructions.

    The perfect pair to be misunderstood and marginalised - a gay bloke and a technically-savvy woman.

  106. WW-II could have been lost... by lildogie · · Score: 1

    It's been said that, if British Intelligence had been as squeamish about homosexuality during wartime as it was during peacetime, Turing would have been arrested sooner, and Germany would have won the war.

    (Paraphrasing Simon Singh in "The Code Book.")

  107. I Still Say a Turing Machine by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Is a Honda Goldwing!
    There is no infinite tape with simple instructions in my version.

  108. What about Kleene, Post, and Church? by 1iar_parad0x · · Score: 3, Informative

    Although I see no problem paying respect to an underappreciated mathematician, I'm always a little weary of how we seem to forget the contributions of others. For instance, Martin Davis in his book "Computability and Unsolvability" refers to Turing machines as a Turing-Post machine (perhaps a nod to his former undergraduate advisor). Also, Kleene invented the notion of a "primitive recursive functions". This was shown by Alonzo Church to be equally as powerful as Turing's Universal Computer. In other words, there were alot of guys involved in developing the foundations of computer science. How often do you hear of Emil Post, Stephen Kleene, and Alonzo Church? Heck, it was quite 'en vogue' to create fundemental models of computation|mathematics. I've seen models bearing the names of Markov, Godel, etc. "Computability: An Introduction to Recursive Function Theory" by Nigel Cutland has a chapter devoted to the subject.

    --
    What do you mean my sig is repetitive? What do you mean my sig is repetitive? What do you mean....
  109. so smart gays should be treated special? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Isn't that special treatment?

    But seriously, george bush is president,
    gay marriage is still illegal in most of the us,
    and PEOPLE and GOVERMENTS are still PANICKY PREJUDICIAL OPRESSIVE SOBs, welcome to Earth, enjoy your stay

  110. Alan turing is a geek? And he's gay? Shocking! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I mean just look at his picture, who'd have ever thunk it

    http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/04_ 19 /art04_19/0419_24innova.jpg

  111. lifes odd by geekoid · · Score: 1, Funny

    I would of thought the founder of Lisp would be gay...

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  112. Lobotomies: A Nobel Prize Winner by itsNothing · · Score: 1

    The 1949 Nobel Prize for Physiology and Medicine was awarded to ANTONIO CAETANO DE ABREU FREIRE EGAS MONIZ for his work showning that pre-frontal lobotomies were effective in controlling behavior for certain psychoses.

  113. Re:Universal machine? yes. Software? nope. by Otto · · Score: 1

    Um, no. The idea of an algorithm was invented by an Arab (al-Khowarizmi, or something like that) centuries before Turing *or* Jacquard. We also get the word "algebra" from the title of one of his writings.

    Hmmm, what you seem to be describing is the idea of representing programs and data in the same store, which IIRC is due to von Neumann.


    What I'm describing is not an "algorithim". I'm trying to explain the concept of "algorithim execution" and I'm obviously not having a lot of success... So go Google for it or something.

    As to whether or not something is "programming" seems to be subjective. The loom has hardware to arrange the threads this way or that; the computer has hardware to add or shift. Either way there are some data which the machine would interpret as "do this, then do that." One is a data-driven device which operates on thread; the other a data-driven device which operates on data.

    I agree, but I think the difference is in the more general purpose nature of the computer processor than the loom. I highly doubt the loom's instruction set is Turing-complete. :)

    --
    - Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.