nVidia Announces MXM for Notebooks

Giant_Panda writes "NVIDIA just announced a new mobile graphics interface for PCI Express based notebooks (PR here). NVIDIA is calling the interface MXM (Mobile PCI eXpress Module), and they seem to have the support of the Taiwanese notebook ODMs on this one. HotHardware has a few pictures and details on the technology - it looks like MXM is a royalty-free standard too, so other mobile GPU manufactures like ATi may even make MXM modules. (More MXM Info - HardOCP, Tweaktown)"

Comments

Upgrade video card!

[ajiva]

Will this let me swap out the video card in my (future) laptop? That would definitly increase laptop life...

Re:Upgrade video card!

[hattig]

Definitely. I've got an ancient laptop (HP Omnibook 4100), and the only thing holding it back is the 2MB graphics (neomagic). If I could get a 4MB ATI then I could have a full 32-bit desktop :(

Oh wait, I only use it to run emacs and xterm.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[Anonymous Coward]

You can do that now. Have a look at the "gaming" laptops out there, like the Alienware.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[donnyspi]

Seems strange that the vid card is the only thing holding you back on a machine that has a Pentium II and is maxed out at 96MB RAM.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[DAldredge]

It doesn't require a supercomputer to get work done. not that I follow this advice as my desktop is a dual processor Athlon with 1GB ram, but still for a lot of work a large system isn't needed.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[SilentChris]

You can already do this (big red letters on this page).

Re:Upgrade video card!

[Short Circuit]

You'd be surprised at what one can do on an old notebook.

I had a PPro 166 notebook that was extremely useful. It ran WindowMaker and gvim just fine. That was all I needed for a mobile platform.

My desktop did any heavy lifting I needed done.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[hattig]

Weird, I've got 160MB in mine, and only because the 256MB SODIMM was out of stock. Amazingly, a 266MHz PII isn't that bad if you aren't running a heavy desktop and don't want to play intensive games or video.

To be honest, the backlight is a bit dodgy now so I probably couldn't tell the difference between 16-bit and 32-bit. Did have issues with neomagic and xfree86 in the past though, but not on the last install (Gentoo).

Re:Upgrade video card!

[Anonymous Coward]

Listen to DAldredge, he's insightful (my ass...).

Re:Upgrade video card!

[Anonymous Coward]

You probably couldn't tell the difference between 16bit and 32bit, because the LCD is limited to 16-bit. In fact, most LCDs are hardware limited to 16 bits (one among many reasons professional graphics artists prefer CRTs.) I would imagine that there are a few 32bit LCDs out there, but they're going to be ungodly expensive--even more so than anything Apple puts out.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[bhtooefr]

Wait a sec... you said PPro?

What was THIS monster (FOR ITS TIME)?

Re:Upgrade video card!

[Anonymous Coward]

What the hell are you babbling about? Get a clue, will ya? LCD panels are quite capable of displaying 24 bit color. What the hell is a 32 bit LCD panel? You're just making shit up to sound smart.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[SphericalCrusher]

Yeah, if only it was that easy. Heh, and ATI wouldn't need to make an MXM video card; their mobile Radeons are awesome!. It'd just be a waste of time.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[Short Circuit]

Thinkpad 760XL. Maybe it was a P or PII. It's been a while since I last used it.

Re:Upgrade video card!

[bhtooefr]

Ahh... that's more like it. The 760 line was Pentium I. I know, because a friend of mine had a 760ED.

Nice... er, RAM modules!

[Txiasaeia]

Mmmm... Maxim with notebooks... wait, huh? What the hell? I clicked on the "few pictures and details" links and all it comes up with are shots of freaking computers!

MXM looks exactly like....

[AciDive]

MXM looks exactly like AlienWares Do-It-Yourself Upgradeable Mobile Graphics Technology.

Re:MXM looks exactly like....

[DAldredge]

Alienwares modules only work across their systems. This new nvidia design will work across different brands of laptops.

Re:MXM looks exactly like....

[JustNiz]

I expect thats what prompted Nvidia to do it.

At least this will be a standard, meaning pricing will be fairer and range of choice should be better.

Thank god, this is well overdue.

Re:MXM looks exactly like....

[stienman]

I suppose by 'exactly' you mean 'completely different'.

Apparantly it's "EASIER TO INSERT THAN AN ALIEN PROBE" though, according to the article.

I wonder if MXM comes with that feature? I'd hate to be part of Alienware's demographic.

-Adam

Re:MXM looks exactly like....

[Dark Lord Seth]

But hopefully without the Alienware price tag.

Re:MXM looks exactly like....

[SmackCrackandPot]

But hopefully without the Alienware price tag.

Too right. I'm in the market for a new PC with a high-performance graphics card. While Dell system's are cheap, their sales and customer support is now unusable. While AlienWare's systems are extremely attractive, the prices start at 3500 pounds (5000 dollars) for a gaming system. I also looked at the various retail stores and the standard systems available through mail order (Dabs.com), but they only seem to sell the low-end desktops or server systems. There must be some other manufacturers in-between?

Re:MXM looks exactly like....

[KarmaMB84]

The AlienWare modules appear to be entire card and cooling solutions while the MXM modules appear to be smaller and the cooling system is provided with the notebook.

Ten Leading Notebook Manufacturers

[Capt'n Hector]

Any idea on who those "ten leading notebook manufacturers" are?

Re:Ten Leading Notebook Manufacturers

[obsid1an]

From The Register:

"Nvidia said it had already won the backing of Far Eastern ODMs like Quanta, Wistron, FIC, Uniwill, Clevo, AOpen, Tatung, Arima, Asustek and Mitac, all of whom have said they will offer MXM-based notebooks. Since these ten already account for many of the world's name and no-name notebooks, MXM is likely to grow by stealth, becoming a de facto standard."

Re:Ten Leading Notebook Manufacturers

[Zocalo]

Yup. They are listed in the penultimate paragraph of this article at the Register. The main thing is that many of these manufacturer's also make the cases for the big players who seldom actually manufacture their own cases.

Re:Ten Leading Notebook Manufacturers

[Anonymous Coward]

WTF is an "ODM"?

Re:Ten Leading Notebook Manufacturers

[DAldredge]

ODM Original Design Manufacturer or someone made a typo while trying to type in OEM

Re:Ten Leading Notebook Manufacturers

[nomadic]

Nvidia said it had already won the backing of Far Eastern ODMs

Far Eastern? Isn't that a little bit of a melodramatic term? So we'll start seeing the notebooks with MXM next year, when the Silk Road caravans arrive! Think of the fabulous silks and spices we'll see along with our notebooks!

its kinda cute

[INeededALogin]

in a weird, square computer fetish sorta way.

MXM...

[I_Love_Pocky!]

This would be sweet on a machine with MMX running XMMS.

Re:MXM...

[Anonymous Coward]

I was hoping to see a MCM on this product, but all it had was a BGA and some CSP's.

Re:MXM...

[Soul-Burn666]

And what will be playing on XMMS? XM tracker files ;)

Nope, but...

[Kjella]

....there aren't *that* many around, compared to desktops. Notebooks standardizing? Cool. I'd love to see what you can do with this and some DIY/mini-itx/nano-itx project...

Kjella

Re:Nope, but...

[aristotle-dude]

Oh man, you have way too much time on your hands.

People buy laptops from name brand companies because they want extended warranties and service in case they break and they don't want them to break down on the road.

If you are a business man on the road, you want a laptop that you can count on and will easily work with any LCD projector. Time is money in the business world.

what does Intel think ?

[johnjones]

ok 2 questions that none of this touch apon

the PCI Express spec would not have anything to say about this kind thing ?

Intel is BIG in the graphics area what will they be shipping ?

regards

John Jones

Re:what does Intel think ?

[hattig]

This is using PCI-Express, just with a different slot more suitable for the task. c.f. mini-PCI and PCI.

Intel do integrated graphics. They'll probably simply have non-MXM notebooks that aren't upgradeable, or use a dummy pass-thru MXM card like the article suggests. Yes, that means that connector also has video in pins.

OMGOMG!1~~

[Leffe]

• 
  
• One notebook design, sold into many notebook products
  
• One notebook design that can use any graphics solution, from any vendor
  
  
• One notebook to rule them all
  

power consumtion

[Jotaigna]

those desktop graphic card giants should learn something about this little fella.I dont see extra hard drive power plugs or a 480W power source.

Re:power consumtion

[PhrostyMcByte]

You are thinking of nVidia. ATI's X800 line uses less power than their older 9800 line. It still only requires a 350watt psu. IIRC they are both still using power levels within the AGP spec, it's just that many motherboards can't handle the higher end of the limit.

To abuse a familair quote...

[stienman]

One small step for OEMs, one giant leap for consumer choice.

-Adam

Missed opportunity?

[Ianoo]

I won't deny this is a great idea for graphics, but surely with a little more work, adding internal connectors for communications and audio, this could be turned into a generalised standard that would finally replace those horrendous semi-proprietary mini-PCI cards you find inside laptops?

Imagine the possible combinations of devices you could fit into a laptop with two of these slots accessible externally so they could specify their own connectors, or alternatively wired up on the motherboard to USB, FireWire, RJ-45, RJ-12, a few Jack plugs and the video ports on the outside of the macine, all available through a 250-pin connector?

Re:Missed opportunity?

[aristotle-dude]

Imagine the possibilities for meltdown when the stupid geek puts in too many running hot components into a confined space.

Fried laptop anyone?

Re:Missed opportunity?

[ckaminski]

mmm yeah, it's called PCMCIA/Cardbus, and it's about 10 years old now.

Re:Missed opportunity?

[sonpal]

... those horrendous semi-proprietary mini-PCI cards...

Mini-PCI is an open standard, just like PCI. You even buy the specifications from the same place, the PCI SIG. What nVidia is doing is pre-empting what the PCI SIG will eventually come out with, perhaps in the hopes that the PCI SIG will adopt their standard as the official PCI graphics standard for laptops.

If a couple of big players like Dell and Toshiba adopt it for their notebooks, this will most likely become the standard.

Someone else on this thread added that CardBus does exactly what you are asking for. I would also like to add that audio capabilities should be absorbed into the video card anyway so that you can send it a single datastream and get both video and audio out, so you don't need to add audio capabilities to the bus.

Re:Missed opportunity?

[m1chael]

"Imagine the possibilities for meltdown when the stupid geek puts in too many running hot components into a confined space."

I call it the solution to over-population.

Re:Pictures are slashdotted - mirror

[Anonymous Coward]

don't click above.

ITX?

[91degrees]

This would be nice on an ITX machine. Not many of them have upgradeably graphics (None of the quiet ones AFAIK). Lack of graphics upgradability has been putting me off buying one.

Re:ITX?

[bhtooefr]

Commell makes a Mini-AGP board (Pentium M goodness, too). It seems some Dells take Mini-AGP, so you can even get reasonably recent graphics.

Also, you COULD settle for PCI...

What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[Zen Programmer]

What does everyone hvae against (capitalizing) the letter 'E'?

I guess in nVidia's case it's not just the letter 'E' that they subjugate for the more favored 'X' (eXpress), since they also choose 'V' over 'N' in their name (nVidia).

I guess it's just so much cooler for stuff to be eXtreme or eXpress, rather than Extreme or Express. Bah, stupid marketing.

Re:What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you a linguistic luddite who wishes to stand in the way of progress? What's your real complaint?
It's just as good as blog, plog, or tebibyte, which are here to stay. /sarcasm

Re:What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's simple, really. If you're going to abbreviate it MXM, you have to emphasis the X in "express". Now this raises the interesting question: Why abbreviate it MXM? Even simpler. We all know that MXM is Roman Numeral for 1990. What significance does 1990 have for nVidia? None, but we all know that all products are worthless until version 3. Thus, it won't be long before we have MXMIII, which, uncoincidentally, is the year that nVidia was founded. /removes tongue from cheek

Re:What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[Jeff DeMaagd]

The worst part is when people confuse PCI-X, which is an existing standard with commercially available (although expensive) motherboards and parts, with PCI-Express, which there are no commercially available motherboards or parts. People shorthanding PCI-Express to PCI-X only serves to confuse the issue.

Re:What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[ckaminski]

Nor PCI-E, which IIRC, is also NOT related to PCI-Express.

So do we call it PCI-XP? <shudder>

Re:What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[Enigma_Man]

Soon, it'll be eXtRemE!! ... now why does that look familiar? :D

-Jesse

Re:What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[Anonymous Coward]

How about just calling it PCI-Express? It won't add anything significant to your typing time.

Re:What does everyone have against the letter 'E'?

[ryszards]

It's NVIDIA, not nVidia. They changed that ages ago.

and laptop makers would go for it because?

[SuperBanana]

Will this let me swap out the video card in my (future) laptop? That would definitly increase laptop life...

And notebook makers would want this because?

I think not. GPU vendors won't do it, because OEMs won't do it, because sales & marketing at the brand-name level won't go for it. In any market where there would be a desire for this sort of thing(ie, gamers who want to be able to upgrade), they'd loose potential sales(said gamers wouldn't buy a new notebook).

I can see something of a market for letting companies use the same mobo with different GPUs for different markets. They'd probably either make it tough to get to to discourage swapping, use warranty seals over screws, etc...maybe even toss something into the BIOS.

Even more likely is that makers will use it, promise upgrade cards, and then never deliver. The industry has a long, long history of marketing expansion slots/upgrade capability they have no intentions of utilizing.

Re:and laptop makers would go for it because?

[mill5ja]

Unless you consider the fact that many people don't buy the high end laptops (with their higher profit margins) because they can't upgrade the video card. It makes them generally unsuitable as a PC gaming platform.

-jason m

Re:and laptop makers would go for it because?

[aristotle-dude]

Ok, who in their right mind would consider a laptop a heavy gaming platform?

Laptops are for students and business travellers to do work on.

Re:and laptop makers would go for it because?

[drinkypoo]

It's just this kind of ignorance that laptop makers are trying to fight - and succeeding. Laptops have a number of advantages over desktops even when used at home; They all have flat panel displays, they consume less power than desktop systems, they generate less heat, and they take up very little space - no more than a large picture-book when you fold them up.

These days you can get laptops with 1GB or more memory, 80+ GB 7200 RPM UDMA drives, DVD-RW drives, and a 17" TFT. Admittedly, they cost more than an equivalent desktop, but they can go anywhere you go and do all the work you can do.

Now the question is revealed to be "why would a laptop manufacturer want to support this?" They make a certain amount of money because people are forced to buy new laptops because they aren't expandable. The answer? Because consumers (myself included) have been demanding it for a long time. If you are slightly clueful, you can upgrade your laptop's processor and memory in many cases, and you can certainly upgrade storage devices in most cases, but you can't do anything about the video. There is a market (however small, clearly large enough to convince nvidia to develop a solution) for laptops with upgradable video even though they will come at a slightly increased initial cost. Further, since they are basing this on entirely open standards, there appears to be no reason not to make products which comply with the standard, since they can be adapted from existing designs without changing anything but the form factor. While that is not an inconsiderable obstacle, it is certainly nowhere near insurmountable. The question is, do enough consumers really desire this for it to be worthwhile at this point?

Where I hope this is leading is to modular, 100% commodity notebook computers. Wouldn't it be nice if, instead of buying a complete solution from compaq or sony or even dell you could just go buy one of several standard case sizes, install the appropriate flat panel (assuming your device even needed a display), and pick out the motherboard, cpu, memory, and video card that fit your needs best? ATX has shown that computer manufacturers can and will create devices which conform to a given standard. Why shouldn't we do the same thing with notebooks?

You'll also need..

[Anonymous Coward]

.. a brand new 400W power supply for your laptop to run your mXm nVidia video card!

Re:You'll also need..

[unborracho]

For those that don't have any idea what this post's parent is talking about: http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NjE0 An article on the (ridiculous) power requirements of the new nVidia cards. If I had mod points, i would mod parent up.

Re:Q: Who is the worlds best Jewish cook?

[Anonymous Coward]

lol

Re:Fire Bush in 04

[Anonymous Coward]

and it wouldn't stop talking!

ATI module in picture

[MyDixieWrecked]

This picture shows examples of various shaped boards for use in different laptops...

notice that the center bottom one has an ATI chip? I don't see ATI mentioned anywhere in the article... hmmmmm

Re:ATI module in picture

[MyDixieWrecked]

*turns red*

um, nevermind. I see it. Other manufacturers will make MXM stuffs... blargh.

Re:ATI module in picture

[jcostantino]

All of the boards are different shapes with different connector locations (and presumably - different type connectors)? That's stupid. If this were a standard, it should mandate a particular set of physical dimensions for the board and locations for the connectors.

Who cares if you can buy a Dell Inspiron and upgrade the graphic card a year from now with a new one you can only get from Dell? What if you want to buy a different manufacturer's card or a 3rd party card? It's just another manufacturer lock-in if you can't buy an OEM board or swap cards between laptops.

Re:ATI module in picture

[KarmaMB84]

I'm guessing those pictures are boards that are used in current notebooks. The MXM stuff will be tiny squares with a connector on one side.

Re:42

[Anonymous Coward]

6 x 9?

RTFA please

[BayBlade]

Can anyone here spot the poster or moderators here who didn't?

Let me save you all the increadible effort and paste the following from the first paragraph which is obviously too far for some of us to read:

A few companies, like Alienware and Toshiba, have recently introduced upgradeable notebooks, but they each use different standards. Alienware's parts can't be used in Toshiba's notebooks, and vice-versa.

nVidia should announce

[poelzi]

the first working linux driver with power management