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The Purposelessness of FPS Professionalism
Doley writes "Over at GotFrag, there's an article discussing the financial and evolutionary problems related to professional FPS gaming. The piece explains: 'Regardless of how many fans exist, how many people play Counter-Strike, how many tournaments take place, or how many sponsors participate, Counter-Strike will never truly be a sport. Never will the players make an excellent living playing the game. Possibly, in time, the top teams from each country will be able to make a decent living - a living that we are all capable of making by simply attending college. However, because the majority of cream of the crop players and teams cannot make Counter-Strike a true career, the purpose of the entire structure and making it to the top is destroyed. Until purpose is put back into our community, the situation will continue to worsen.'"
The one problem that will forever doom competitive computer gaming is that gaming isn't meant to be a spectator sport. Since the dawn of sporting events, sports have been designed around the viewer, not the player. On the flip side, comptuer games are soley designed for the enjoyment of the player.
What I don't understand is how it's gotten as far as it has. Probably a lack of understanding on my part as I can barely understand the reason of watching professional sports, but the whole idea of WATCHING someone else play a computer game for fun is just... the funniest thing I've ever heard.
The problem with counter-strike and many video games as a sport is that they can't really be watched. In any traditional sport, there's some obvious object on which to focus the camera (a ball or a puck in most cases). The action usually focuses around this one object. Similarly, there's also no walls obstructing views of all participants except a few. Most rounds in CS are won by eliminated each individual member of the other team, thus making there as many focal points as are players on the team.
You could handle this in one of three ways. First, don't watch it live and show "important" clips (where people are killed or die). That would allow fans to see all the important stuff, but would have the feel of a highlight reel in sports (you know somethings going to happen) and it fails to give context to the action. You could focus on one player the whole time, but then you'd miss stuff.
One of the most fun things about CS is the element of surprise (which is not possible in, say Goldeneye since the opponent can see your screen), but at the same time, this same innate inability to see what's going on is what makes it a horrible spectator sport.
-- Political fascism requires a Fuhrer.
Possibly, in time, the top teams from each country will be able to make a decent living - a living that we are all capable of making by simply attending college.
:P
"Simply attending" college does not guarantee that you will make a decent living. I know some college grads who are unemployed and struggling, while I know people who never even attended college, doing incredible things (and are particularly well off).
If you're good at something and like it enough, you can turn any hobby into a living really. Decent or not.
Some of us would definitely prefer to play computer games all day (and get paid for it!) rather than sitting through another English class.
of a particular team unlike in sports, where people really enjoy cheering on their favorite team(usually the hometown team, but not always). It makes it a lot more "interactive"(while it isn't really interactive, cheering/booing at least gets the person involved). The teams have mascots, they have history. And finally, you are looking at human beings instead of cg generated ones. It's much harder to cheer a team of geeks than it is to cheer on a team of very athletic individuals.
Until purpose is put back into our community, the situation will continue to worsen
Cure cancer and then we will talk.
Blarf.
Computer games are infinitely more akin to chess than to soccer or badmitton. Whereas the spectator is a large component of the latter events (which means that people are making money selling tickets) but at a chess tournament only interests an aficianado of the game who can appreciate the sublime situations that are developing on the board, or computer screen. Thats why chess tournaments aren't held in stadiums and they charge the players and admit the fans for free. I suspect that the FPS competition will survive in this form for perpetuity as the game companies will also support it for marketing purposes.
00010111 always try everything twice
I presume they call it the CPL to mean CounterStrike Professional League, and that's certainly an interesting concept. But aren't most sports leagues amateurs(even the Olympics are technically sponsored amateurs, which is ridiculous on one hand, considering the expenses one has to go through to get there, but makes for less athletes whose biggest claim to fame is the number of logos on their jackets). Now why is it a problem that professionals can't play a game they enjoy, just for money? The article is certainly right about it making no business sense to be a professional in those conditions, but why is it a problem? Is game playing so horrid that you have to pay people to make them do it and get better at it?
Won't admitting that it's not a way to earn money except if you're #1 mean the only people entering will be those who enjoy the game itself, above and beyond? (And who can afford the plane ticket to prove it? Or can find a sponsor to buy them a plane ticket in exchange for a logo on a t-shirt?)
Let me rephrase that, maybe it'll make more sense: Just what does counterstrike gain from having people who earn a living from doing nothing else?
He first said that CS would never be a sport, then he said that CS players would never make a good living from it. Two different ideas.
As for why CS will never be a sport, I've already said something about that in an earlier thread.
Rob
I see pro FPSing as being similar to the old Roman sport of gladiatorial matches, with the exception that nobody gets killed and there's no Christians being thrown to the lions. It's a guilt-free bloodsport.
What was old is new again, no?
Hail Eris, full of mischief...
E pluribus sanguinem
It's just a game people, well seriously it is.
:).
This was the same rot that happened in the quake community. Quake & QW went through its glory days but slowly faded from favor, along came quake 2 and then quake 3, each fragmenting the community a bit resulting in the original quake/QW community demise. Ultimately it did not matter that much as by this stage other bigger and better games came along (CS) that drew in the crowds with a few stragglers left filling the excess of servers.
The only difference in the CS community is that it seems to have come on much more suddenly, this is quite probably due to the absence of any CS2 & CS3 which would have fragmented it and shifted players and popularity away subtly rather than people jumping ship entirely. And to compound the situation, with the lack of 'the next big thing' it seems that there is nothing captivating enough to for the majority to move too.
As for the future, Doom III does not seem to fill that void, and nor does HL2 even though this has a better chance. One of the problems is a surplus of games, none of which are stellar. Remember Quake was the first, and CS was a fluke, a mod with just the right ingredients. I do hope something will develop that will become 'the game' to play but until then...
As for me, I'm going to stick with my nice intimate RA3 community. No Lama's here
Old Skool
GPLv2: I want my rights, I want my phone call! DRM: What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
Multiplayer FPS have only been around for 11 years (DOOM). For the most part the games have been designed for the single player experience, multiplayer was not an important part up until 5 years ago. The genre is very young. Professional sports didn't become multi-billion dollar operations in 5 years. There are stories of pro football players having second jobs to survive during the early years.
That said, there are issues with computer games which will need to be dealt with for the popularity to rise to those of sports:
1. High Turnover - As soon as CS2 or something better comes along, everybody will drop CS. Major sports don't have as significant change. You then establish a player legacy, the best will remain the best, people follow careers and teams. If suddenly they changed basketball to have 15' baskets the game breaks, its no longer about players who dunk, its about the purest shooters. The technology needs to get to a point where one game can have decades long legacy.
2. Following the action - the technology needs to be developed for good spectator views. There just hasn't been any focus for developers to work on this. Hockey is a sport that suffers on TV because its hard to follow the action. If things aren't presented well, it just becomes confusing.
3. Widespread play - People like to watch what they play. There is a small population that has a good computer, broadband access, and enough money to dish out on a $50 game. Compare that to spending $20 on a football/basketball/soccerball and going out to the park. As technology becomes more widespread the number of people interested in FPS games will rise and so will the fan base.
D6 63 0D 70 89 81 BB 8E 7B 7C 5F 5D 54 EA AB 73
Have you ever tried watching a FPS game, or any other gaming tournament on a gaming channel on TV? Even just showing the clips, it's terribly boring.
Just try putting yourself in spectator mode for a few hours... you'll reconsider that idea.
Tibbon
tibbon.com
Two opinions put forth in the article:
If I don't get paid I won't play.
If I have to give up my college career to play CS professionally I won't play.
First let us put things in perspective here. As far as I know, very few sports have been lucrative for athletes in the beginning. Did people playe soccer 100 years ago to make money? No, since there was no money in soccer then, people played for the fun of it, for love of their sport and, probably, for fame and glory. How many of todays professional athletes make enough money to earn a living? Many of them have 'real' jobs on the side to make ends meet. Of course, this depends on the sport in question.
Second, having to give something up to do the other is a common thing, often referred to as making a commitment. Many people give up their promising careers in athletics, soccer, etc. to follow a more 'standard' route to earning your living. Some of them go for it, deciding they will pursue their dreams of getting to the olympics or something similar. If they succeed, good for them, if they don't, well , good luck to them.
It is not unlikely that one day, there will be money in playing CS professionally, or any other computer based game. But it will take time and no amount of whining is going to make it happen faster, only hard work and inventive ideas on how to bring CS out to a wider audience.
'Regardless of how many fans exist, how many people play Counter-Strike, how many tournaments take place, or how many sponsors participate, Counter-Strike will never truly be a sport.
Do you know how many people take swimming lessons, ski lessons or whatever and want to be an athlete? Yeah, a lot. Probably as many as CS players.
Never will the players make an excellent living playing the game.
Neither does athletes. My cousin did windsurfing, and even tough he was #1 in Canada for many years, it still didn't pay the bills
Possibly, in time, the top teams from each country will be able to make a decent living - a living that we are all capable of making by simply attending college.
Yep, just like traditional sports, if they're mainstream enough.
So, how is CS different?
I find it amazing that people even consider FPS games and games like Counterstrike to have a future! (No, this is not a BSD is dead troll).
The bulk of the industry that put counterstrike where it is today (Microsoft, Valve, etc) are all desperately trying to kill off PC gaming and move to console gaming.
Consoles don't do FPS, nowhere near the league of pro counterstrike. Can you imagine a professional tournament for ? Where all the contestants bring in their PS2 from home and their controllers with analog sticks? It's not going to happen. There simply isn't anything professional about consoles.
But you look at the next great generation of computer games, and even those are being ported over to the console arena. Even DooM3, the same DooM that made PC FPS gaming what it is today is being released on XBox. That's how great the pressure is from the console moguls on the gaming industry. They don't want big cash prize CS tournaments. They want you strapped to your couch playing PS2. And history has shown, what the corporations want is where the market goes (See MS Windows).
I am government man, come from the government. The government has sent me. -- G.I.R.
I think there's definitely room for games to become spectator sports. As graphics start to get better, there will definitely be an interest in it. I just think people will be watching it live on their computers though rather than on TV.
Imagine your current favourite sport, but instead of just watching the picture the broadcaster sends you, you can have the main action in a little window, and be exploring as much of the game as you want in your main window. Getting in as close as you want. Or maybe just watching the whole thing from four angles at once...
An earlier poster was right that spectator sports need a centre of attention like a ball or a puck, but there is plenty of room for current sports games to be watched (FIFA Football, Madden NFL) or for mods of FPSs that involve an object (like capture the flag, or any of the sports mods for FPSs like bombing run for UT2K3).
The ideal would be a 3D version of Blood Bowl. It's understandable to current sports fans, but it's also violent and fantastical (or at least more so than real life sports).
I attended an organised LAN in England recently as a spectator. It was badly run. We had to wait 30 minutes before any gaming was done. When the gaming was on all we could hear was some idiot commentator who hadn't grasped that you can't commentate on a Counter Strike match, it's unnecessary and embarrassing. Because we couldn't hear any sound effects from the game it felt like watching some weird silent movie. 10 minutes in to the match the server crashed and we had anther 30 minute wait for them to fix that. Once that was fixed and the matches started again they decided to have a 30 minute gap between each map. I decided to leave at that point. Maybe Counter Strike will have a better chance of being consider a sport when the events actually show some of the game rather than a blank projector screen.
Maybe so, maybe not. Build a time machine and travel 50 years into the future. Maybe playing computer games has become a sport. Playing with a skateboard wasn't a sport either in the beginning. And apperently these days people can make a living out of that.
I used to be head admin of a large, UK-based Counter-Strike league, which contained about 90 different teams from across Europe. The one over-riding message I took away from this is that Professional Gaming is killing the fun in games.
When I first took up my role, in February 2002, Counter-Strike had only made its "breakthrough" into the mainstream comparatively recently. The CPL was still a fairly distant organisation, mostly associated with the Quake series. The league I adminned offered no real prizes, other than the free use of a clan server for a few months, and even at division 1 level, was treated as "fun" by the participants.
I ran the league for about 16 months and during this time, I saw the ethos of the community, as well as any sense of fun, brutally and remorselessly stripped away by a growing focus on Professional Gaming. First of all, there was a growing clamour to adjust our rules and maplists to match exactly those used by the CPL. If we threw a slightly different map into the cycle, we'd get whinged at by teams who claimed that "it wouldn't help them practice for the CPL qualifiers. Worst of all, it wasn't just, or even primarily, the top level teams who were complaining about this. I was never a particularly brilliant Counter-Strike player; I was competent enough, in a mechanical way, but I lacked the reactions and aim necessary to be great at the game. But there were teams who I could have beaten single-handed, from the bottom division of the league, complaining that they weren't getting the practice they'd need to qualify for the CPL.
The next ugly little spawn of pro-gaming to rear its head was sponsorship. At some point in Q4 2002, it seemed that every team under the sun suddely had sponsorship. A few at the top were sponsored by Intel, AMD etc, while the rest were sponsored by Frank's Kebab Emporium or Scunthorpe Tourist Board. With money involved (even though the monthly quantities in many cases were less than I earn in a day at work), teams suddenly started refusing to accept losses, without going through as many rounds of appeals as they could get. There'd always been an element of this; I can kind of understand a team feeling hard done by after losing a very close match in which external factors such as network blips may have caused interuptions, but suddenly, everybody was convinced that if they accepted their losses with good grace, their sponsors would dump them. For the first few season's I'd adminned, I'd done a weekly roundup/commentary for the league's website. This was a pretty inoffensive document; who beat who, how the next week's fixtures might go, details of one or two of the more interesting matches. This had always been well received. However, I started getting an increasing number of complaints from a small, but growing, minority of players. I couldn't comment on a match they'd lost, because their sponsors would dump them. I couldn't comment on a match they'd won and give any kind of credit to their opponents (something I always tried to do, particularly if a team was on a losing streak), as this would diminish their victory and their sponsors would dump them. So the roundups were discontinued. Of course, this trend intensified and, before I knew it, teams were refusing to show up for matches they thought they'd lose, as they figured a default would upset their sponsors less than an actual loss.
By the time I'd been running the league for 12 months, I'd had enough. The mature, fun community I'd once known had evaporated; all that was left was a bunch of wannabe-pros, who were all convinced they were going to make a living off playing games. I was, at this time, coming to the end of my period as a student and getting ready to start a full-time job, so I was starting to understand how the "real" world worked a bit better. In a couple of cases, I actually tried to suggest to players of a similar age to myself that maybe pro-gaming wasn't going to work as a career. This didn't win me many friends.
I'm always wary of the modern trend towards e
Two of the top names people know in gaming, Thresh being the first, Fatal1ty being the current one prove this guy right. They both have won several tournaments at the top spot, but still find the need to have other sources of income. Both have managed to turn their popularity into a source of income. Thresh has done well behind the scenes helping on things and giving endorsements. And Fatal1ty has teamed with ABit to help make gamer products, with his name on it, so some kickback cash there.
This isn't like some highly rated sports figure signing off on some product for a bit more spending cash. It's because they know gaming is not a way to support themselves alone yet. While some "large" prizes have been given out, Fatal1ty only won $20,000 for Quakecon. After tax, thats probably less then what minimum wage full time would gross in a year. So, something else has to pay the bills too.
sport Pronunciation Key (spôrt, sprt)
n.
1.
1. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
2. A particular form of this activity.
2. An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
3. An active pastime; recreation.
4.
1. Mockery; jest: He made sport of his own looks.
2. An object of mockery, jest, or play: treated our interests as sport.
3. A joking mood or attitude: She made the remark in sport.
5.
1. One known for the manner of one's acceptance of rules, especially of a game, or of a difficult situation: a poor sport.
2. Informal. One who accepts rules or difficult situations well.
3. Informal. A pleasant companion: was a real sport during the trip.
6. Informal.
1. A person who lives a jolly, extravagant life.
2. A gambler at sporting events.
7. Biology. An organism that shows a marked change from the normal type or parent stock, typically as a result of mutation.
8. Maine. See summercater. See Regional Note at summercater.
9. Obsolete. Amorous dalliance; lovemaking.
Regardless of the third definition, sports require actual physical activity. Sitting on your ass moving a mouse and punching keys is not a sport much less an actual "job".
That means no tradition in the game. It means you can't be a fan of one team for years, even if you want to, because they'll end up playing stuff that might simply not interest you. It very likely means that nobody will be able to make a career of it, and that alone shoots the whole concept to hell right there. Rules for scoring, the ideas of performance, will not simply become more advanced... they will make lateral jumps every few years.
Sure, it's possible that someone could develop a game and then propagate its rules through successive waves of technology, to provide a stable experience on which professional leagues could be built. But why the hell would anyone even begin to undertake that effort? Video games are sold largely on novelty, and that novelty is primarily looked for in gameplay-- technological advance is simply expected. Nobody except the kids who want to make a living playing games-- and probably not even most of them-- would be interested in such a thing. That's just not enough of a support base to make it happen.
No, the fact that it's not in the least a test of athletic prowess is the reason that it's not a sport.
This whole article is based on a false premise. "If we can't earn our living solely from the game, it isn't a sport." Frankly, that is pure garbage.
Most athletes earn their money not from salaries or tournament prizes but from sponsorship. This applies as much to athletes in highly-popular sports as to any others. There's a reason why Anna Kournikova made a fortune in spite of being a frankly indifferent tennis player, and that's bcos she used her looks to get massive sponsorship deals. I wouldn't need to take my socks off to count the number of tennis players who've made a million bucks from tournament prizes in their entire lives, but the top 20 players will be getting way more than that a *year*, courtesy of Nike, Reebok, Slazenger and the rest.
The only exception to this is in sports where the athletes earn their money through wages - football, baseball and soccer, for example. In these, wages are covered by tens of thousands of people paying to see them play each week. Until you can get tens of thousands of people to watch CS tournaments, you can forget this.
So only those guys who get sponsorship are likely to make a living out of it. That means either you get sponsored, or you cut your standard of living until unemployment benefit or some part-time job can finance your life while you devote your time to your sport, or you live off savings in the hope that you'll get sponsorship before they run out (ie. "burn rate" like a startup business), or you go work for a company that produces stuff for that sport and get your practise time as "product testing". In *every* minor sport, these are the available options for aspiring athletes.
To the author of this article: I suggest you go and talk to some rock climbers, hang-glider pilots, cross-country runners, parachutists, motocross riders, skaters (street or ice), discus/shot-put/hammer throwers, rowers, swimmers, or simply female athletes in traditionally-male sports (like soccer). Go whine to them that CS can't succeed as a sport bcos it's *so* hard to make a good living out of it. And when they've laughed in your face (or kicked the living shit out of you), maybe you'll have some perspective on your situation.
Grab.
People are so dumb. Anything you can do while drinking and smoking at the same time can not be considered a sport!
btw -- this means bowling is out, too.
but it sure as hell isn't a cone, mate. Oh, and what do you call that thing you play rugby with? a ball? yeah, it's not round either.
Most other sports, the technological development is fairly slim. Sure, there's a different baseball now, I hear. Different padding for U.S. Football. However, fundamentally it's tactics that change. And one goal of promoting sports is physical fitness. What does one get with an FPS tournament? Better eye/hand coordination?
That's gotta fit into your schema somewhere
In 1994, I was physically and socially inept. I spent days and nights tweaking my computer, playing games, coding, troubleshooting, etc. I didn't shower all that often, and my back muscles were atrophied to the point where I couldn't walk straight. At 6"1, 150lbs, I would exhaust myself at doing 6 (six) push-ups. The upside ? Over the years, I've gotten really good at online FPS games. Ever since Doom deathmatch, and throughout Quake, Threewave CTF, and others, I've been noticing something. Something I couldn't grasp. I had no term for it, and all I ever tried to do was to recapture it. It was this feeling of knowing everything other players do at any point in time. I felt like I could read their minds. I didn't think and then move, I simply WAS in the moment, doing the most efficient maneuver at the time. Without being nervous, without my hands shaking. Most of the time, however, that feeling was just not there. It's like I kept beating my head against an invisible wall, and the harder I hit it, the harder the wall became. Suddenly, the below-average players were effortlessly whooping my ass, as I kept getting stuck in the easily predictable movement patterns of old. In 1997, for unrelated reasons, I started working on getting myself into a semi-acceptable semblance of shape. In 2000, I started studying martial arts. That's when it really hit me. I would come back from the class, launch Unreal Tournament or Tribes, and suddenly, I was going with the flow again. I was "in the zone", calm, empathic and extremely efficient. I was being invited to clans left and right. Sometimes, this feeling of effortless grace transferred (gasp) to real life as well, and I found that I can, at some rare occasions, suddenly be as funny, charming and adaptable as some of my far more extroverted friends. I've come to learn that there are physical ways of harnessing and developing this feeling of going with the flow. Martial arts have helped my FPS skills a lot more than FPS skills helped my martial arts. Mind you, this is not limited to martial arts. Every football player has these moments. Every boxer or tennis player does. Everyone in every physical, real interaction which involves other live humans, eventually comes to feel these divine moments of just BEING there. The feeling of spontaneous, creative movement, which is NOT something that you've done before, but is only unique, and perfectly suited, to the circumstances of the given moment. When I was a small boy I deluded myself with statements like "computer games like Pacman improve your coordination !". Why, sure they do. But they have a limit. Beyond that limit, life is no more. On the other hand, physical activity which involves creative interaction with other people is inclusive of the qualities that computer games cultivate. Unlike them, it is not a dead end. Instead of leveling your virtual representation in a MMOG, or developing your flow in FPS, consider investing your time into leveling up in a physical skill that is applicable to more than just computers. It is good. It is good for life.
You mean it won't be possible to make a living from just playing games. Oh my god. You mean you will have to do something that might benefit society in someway?!?!?! Now if only we can get people to stop watching normal sports & reality TV too.
I've experiments to run, there is research to be done on the people who are still alive.
Another reason why cs is being held back is the general sportsmanship of the community. It's just pure trash. I have played cs for 3 years and I am currently in Cal-Premier(one step below cal-i) and attend most of the CPL's. Unfortunately, I've noticed one of the biggest differences between CAL-p and the lower-tier leagues that I've played in, is that most teams will pull out all the BS they can to beat you. Many teams find loopholes and ambiguity's in CAL's rules to totally screw their opponents. For example, CAL rules states that a team can refuse to play on a server if there is a ~75 ms difference of ping. So players will start messing around with their netcode rates to raise their ping and make a fair server seem very unfair. So than they make you play on their server, which they are very comfortable with, and their opponent pings +50 to, for the whole match. You can make a complaint to the CAL admins, but many CAL admins are very biased as they are "befriended" by many players. So sometimes you're just SOL in some matches. I'd also like to point out that about 50% the matches I've experienced have involved trash talking and threats (idle threats mind you), it gets pretty annoying.
In terms of online leagues and tournaments, professional gaming will go nowhere...at least for quite a while. In CAL-i there really aren't any conferences. So teams from the east coast will play teams in california and etc. This often causes ping issues which leads to teams fighting over which server to play on. There have also been many incidents of intentional shutting down of servers and hacking.
I think if CAL got sign-up fees from it's players they could really cut down on all the BS. But servers will still crash on accident, packets will be lossed, and the netcode for cs is inconsistent. Unless, you're on LAN your bullets don't always land where you expect them too. I think the game needs to move on to a new engine (which is why im exicited about HL2 being released with CS). The technology for cheap, reliable gaming servers and fast, reliable, internet connections also needs to improve if professional gaming is to go anywhere online.
Once this happens, who knows what will happen with CPL.
Abaddon: An Xbox 360 Indie game
Purpose? The Counter-Strike community has or had purpose? Thats a laugh. Maybe their purpose was to l337 q0wnz0r h4x0r people but I can't think of a real actual purpose the community had.