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Assessing Internet Viruses Like Human Epidemics

underpar writes "This ComputerWorld.com article discusses the UCSD's $6.2 million attempt to study Internet viruses in a manner similar to the study of human epidemics. Stefan Savage, a computer science professor, is quoted in the article as saying, 'We'll be focused on what vectors are used, just like in assessing West Nile, to spread computer viruses and ultimately try to develop defenses to prevent them from spreading.'"

61 of 171 comments (clear)

  1. Hasn't this been done before? by wikdwarlock · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This hardly seems like a novel idea. Isn't the whole calling a computer virus a "virus" supposed to help us understand it in a biological/human way?

    --

    "I must not fear. Fear is the mind killer." -Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear
    1. Re:Hasn't this been done before? by hashish · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yeah, and this does miss some points. Viruses in humans can mutate and attach themselves to other viruses. Until a computer virus does this they eventually die out when the PC gets patched.

      But i guess it was fun for someone to do...

    2. Re:Hasn't this been done before? by Mshift2x · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yes. This has been done before. We've done this in our calclulus class. We've used a program to map the 'lifecycle' of a virus. First numerous vulnerable PCs, the way in which they spread to eachother, new vulnerable computers being connected to the internet, patching of the computers. It was all pretty cool stuff.

    3. Re:Hasn't this been done before? by darkain · · Score: 5, Interesting
    4. Re:Hasn't this been done before? by Mistlefoot · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Viruses do mutate.

      Just need a little bit of help from humans.

      How many mutations of sasser have we seen?

      Actually....I'd bet more viruses are mutations then original.

    5. Re:Hasn't this been done before? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      It has. It is actually a pretty interesting problem. There are a number of things that make studying computer virus different than biological viruses. One area of interest is incorporating the network topology into the model. Computer networks tend to be 'scale-free', the internet certainly is. Most epidemiological models (SIS, SIR etc) assume completely mixed populations. When you put them on a different network topology you can get different results.

      Vaccination strategies center on trying to lower R_0. In computer networks it is possible to have a vanishingly small epidemic threshold. Also, in scale-free networks the hubs are central to viral transmission. These papers
      http://www.cosin.org/publications/condmat0205260.p df/
      http://www.cs.princeton.edu/courses/archive/fall03 /cs323/links/pastor-satorras.pdf/
      contain these ideas.

      Generally in a scale-free human disease network like STD transmission you want to vaccinate the highly connected hubs. Since the transmission time for viruses on computer networks approaches zero you can run into some serious problems. Such as it is not possible to 'vaccinate' enough of the network hubs in time=> no real way to stop epidemics on computer networks via 'vaccination'. Hopefully this research will provide better answers to these questions.

    6. Re:Hasn't this been done before? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      A virus could rewrite itself if the code was sufficiently modular.

      A simple example would be to change ports opened on infested machines to random numbers. They could also actually attach themselves to system libraries or applications (like they used to), rather than just saving themselves to the hard disk in several places as they do now.

      However a more interesting example might be a virus which had lots of different modules, some performing similar functions and redundant (much like stretches of dormant DNA). For example several ways to spread - via email, via email using outlook replying to messages already stored, via port-scanning on the local network etc. several ways to copy itself, semi-random destinations for copying, etc etc. Only some of these would be active at a time.

      On infection, the virus would copy itself and in the process shuffle its 'genes', thus suppressing some of those functions and enabling others. This would make it harder to spot, and much harder to write, so thankfully it's probably not going to happen. It'd probably have to be trained extensively on a little test network to come up with a virulent strain.

      Of course this isn't analogous to biological viruses, but would use some of the same tricks.

      Selection pressure would be provided by the environment of PCs and anti-virus software.

  2. Too easy by MuckSavage · · Score: 5, Funny

    "...just like in assessing West Nile, to spread computer viruses and ultimately try to develop defenses to prevent them from spreading.'"

    Ummm, don't use windows?

    Sorry, had to say it.

  3. Distinction... by z3021017 · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Computers can have their data wiped for a new, clean beginning.

    Humans can't.

    --
    Bored? Visit my exciting counter page!
    1. Re:Distinction... by fatman22 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      In humans it's called "dying"

    2. Re:Distinction... by Fred+Foobar · · Score: 2, Funny

      Then what? Reincarnation?

      --
      It was a really good paper.
  4. Why West Nile? by Curunir_wolf · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why not study it like they do the AIDS virus? That is, it's obvious that certain behavior will greatly increase the risk of infection, and some, based on location and lifestyle (OS) have very little chance of infection at all.

    --
    "Somebody has to do something. It's just incredibly pathetic it has to be us."
    --- Jerry Garcia
    1. Re:Why West Nile? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      some, based on location and lifestyle (OS) have very little chance of infection at all.

      Thus explaining why people who use Linux and people who never get laid tend to be the same people.

    2. Re:Why West Nile? by aussie_a · · Score: 2, Funny

      Are you saying I can contract aids from my hand? I better get out the latex gloves then...

    3. Re:Why West Nile? by xombo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      +4 interesting?!?!!
      As a gay man I take offense.
      Straight women, specifically minority women, have the highest infection rates of AIDS right now. Don't even think that because you're straight and don't take it in the ass that you're immune.

    4. Re:Why West Nile? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That is not how this comment was meant, I think. Regardless of sexual preference, an example of a high-risk lifestyle would be having promiscous unprotected sex. A low risk lifestyle would be to be involved in a long-term monogomous relationship.

    5. Re:Why West Nile? by PitaBred · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I know that this is terribly offtopic, but this is EXACTLY what pisses me off about "minorities." You assume that someone is insulting you because they use the term "lifestyle." Lifestyle can be having promiscuous sex, going to clubs, sitting at home and masturbating, and of a LARGE number of things. Yet you think someone means you, and you're being discriminated against, thus giving you the right to... something. Reparations, additional rights, whatever.
      Excuse me, but grow the fuck up and get over yourself. You're nowhere near as special as you'd like to think you are.

    6. Re:Why West Nile? by Mordaximus · · Score: 2, Insightful
      As a gay man I take offense.

      No, I don't think it's your sexual affinity, I think that it's the fact that you are a total bigot. Parent post didn't even hint at gay, rather (s)he mentioned location and lifestyle, yet you're up in arms. Spend less time looking for ways to take offence to what people have to say.

      You assume parent poster isn't gay, you assume that parent is male and that (s)he doesn't participate in anal sex. And you got all of that from a rather insightful post from the parent. Hope you make yourself sick, you certainly make me feel that way. Because yes, you are way prejudiced, and fucking paranoid to boot.

      Don't even think that because you're straight and don't take it in the ass that you're immune.

      You realise where you're posting - a giant blog populated by a like-minded group of individuals who are generealy stereotyped as unwashed, Star Trek convention attending virgins who live in their basement decorated with Farscape posters? What an idiotic thing to say to an audience that is probably most sensitive to any group that is that has been the target of stereotypes and misconceptions.

      You'd be smart to apologise to parent poster.

  5. Interesting Academic Exercise by tony3w · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This is an interesing academic exercise, but the basic defenses that have been preached for years work just fine:

    - Avoid IE for surfing
    - Avoid OL/OE for eMail
    - Firewall (in and out) all OSes with large numbers of exploitable bugs
    - Automate patching
    - Warn on Anomolous behavior
    - Have a virus scanner that is up to date

    I don't even rely on the last one and I've been virus free for the past 9 years!

    1. Re:Interesting Academic Exercise by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      " - Have a virus scanner that is up to date

      I don't even rely on the last one and I've been virus free for the past 9 years!"


      Ummm......... how would you know?

    2. Re:Interesting Academic Exercise by aussie_a · · Score: 2, Funny

      I don't even rely on the last one and I've been virus free for the past 9 years!

      Or so you think

    3. Re:Interesting Academic Exercise by Osty · · Score: 2, Informative

      Most of your list is good, but I take exception to this item:

      Avoid OL/OE for eMail

      For one, Outlook and Outlook Express are two separate, distinct applications. For another, Outlook itself has been pretty secure since service packs for Outlook 2000 (that's three versions ago, for those who are counting), which remove malicious attachments so you can't execute them. Outlook XP and Outlook 2003 do that out of the box.

      However, I surf with IE, read mail with Outlook, don't automatically patch (Windows Update is set to download and notify me when it's ready to install, but I get to choose when is a convenient time to install), and so on, and I haven't had a virus in years. (last virus I had? Michealangelo. Yes, way back in the day.) It boils down to common sense. Don't install/run software you don't trust (in this case, I mean downloaded from a trusted source, since little Windows software is open source so you can't often audit the code), setup IE to ask you (or disable) to run ActiveX objects, don't visit warez sites, only visit "reputable" pr0n sites (yes, there really are such things!), etc.


      Avoiding computer virii, like avoiding biological virii, comes down to common sense. Don't engage in risky behaviors, and you'll significantly reduce your exposure and likelihood of contracting a virus.

    4. Re:Interesting Academic Exercise by glpierce · · Score: 2, Informative

      "- Automate patching"

      I disagree with that one. I've found that there is nothing more annoying than having an application decide to launch itself while I'm working. All of a sudden, my word processor isn't listening for my typing (or it is doing so at an alarmingly slower rate), while I'm in the middle of a thought. Add in the fact that many updates on Windows require a restart, and you've got nothing but trouble on your hands. If you can set a schedule for a time you're never around (e.g. lunch break for office workers or class for students), you'd be fine. Otherwise, just remember to do it often. I've set up "Run Weekly" folders on my family members' desktops, and gave them a disclaimer that if they don't do everything there every week, I will not help them with computer problems under any circumstance. Far better than having them think their computer is slow or broken every time something wants to check for an update, in my experience.

      --
      G
    5. Re:Interesting Academic Exercise by SJS · · Score: 4, Informative

      This is an interesing academic exercise, but the basic defenses that have been preached for years work just fine:

      Um.... the actual basic defenses being preached go back much farther than you suspect. The Internet did not coincide with the development of the computer, or viruses.

      Basic defenses are:

      • Don't trust live data
      • Don't let random programs run on your machine if there's any data accessible -- i.e. control access to your machine
      • Don't engage in risky/stupid behavior -- practice safe computing
      • Long-term backups are important

      'Avoiding IE for surfing' should be "Don't use Microsoft Internet Explorer, full stop." Likewise, "Avoid OL/OE for eMail" should be "Don't use Microsoft Outlook or Outlook Express, full stop." Both of those fall under the category of "risky/stupid behavior". Just because your boss tells you that you have to use 'em doesn't make it any less risky.

      Firewalls do two things -- one, they hide your network, so as to keep the black hats away from the data on your network, and two, they hide broken systems that are running insecure programs. This pretty much counts as controlling access to your machine.

      I'm not a big fan of automated patching. Patching, yes, but if you automate it, you offer Yet Another Way for the black hats to sneak in to your system. A program that contacts another program to download programs that are replacing programs on that machine fails to (1) control access to your machine and (2) you're trusting "live data".

      "Warn on Anomolous behavior" sounds good (intrusion detection systems are sometimes based on this concept), but it doesn't really help too much in *preventing* viruses.

      An up-to-date virus scanner is the belt you use in addition to suspenders; it's there to catch your goofs, where you're falling down on the job. As a mitigation strategy, it is good for your network... but it's already too late to get your system back into a pristine state. (Thus a good backup strategy is essential.)

      In "the old days", you could bring a system back to a known-good state by powering it down, inserting known-clean read-only media, and booting it up again. (In hindsight, those floppy-based systems had a lot going for them. If you were careful, you could avoid exposing your system to viruses, even if you ran a known-infected program.)

      It's a bit harder on modern operating systems. For one, there isn't a good way to run a program in isolation. If you're lucky enough to get a statically-linked program, a chroot jail is a simple place to start, but chroot jails aren't terribly secure, and there's not a lot of statically-linked programs out there these days. Setting up a chroot jail can be prohibitively expensive (in terms of time or disk space).

      User-mode Linux and virtual hardware (e.g. Virtual PC) are even more expensive in terms of disk space and set up costs.

      Both chroot jails and user-space operating systems tend to keep a program from usefully interacting with other programs. If the output of one program is the input to another, and they're running in different jails/VMs, I need to start worrying about networking in order to facilitate communication. More complexity!

      You can always partition your system so that /, /lib, and /usr are read-only, while /var, /tmp, and /home are noexec, but that's not often done, and more often than not, systems are shipping (or defaulting to) single-partition installs. (Madness, I say, madness!)

      What would be nice is a system like chroot, but would make the entire system (to that process and sub-processes) read-only, aside from a list of directories, and no-exec, aside from a _different_ list of directories, and at no time would you have the same aspect of a filesystem both read-write and execut

      --
      Pick One: http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/~stremler/sigs/sigs.html (Note - disable Javascript first!)
    6. Re:Interesting Academic Exercise by aussie_a · · Score: 2, Funny

      It's insightful cause the mods are idiots? It was an attempt at Funny. I've given up on trying to get modded appropriately. If I get a mod whether it be -1 Flame-bait or whatever I'm happy cause it means at least SOMEONE read my post.

    7. Re:Interesting Academic Exercise by tony3w · · Score: 2, Interesting
      I actually used to use Outlook as my preferred mail client. Then they 'updated' it and prevented my mail-viewing template from working properly. I basically created a filter that (before any non-text email was rendered) removed a list of about 15 strings that had potential for being harmful (ActiveX, XSL, CSS, JS, images, etc.) The geniuses that updated OL in OfficeXP SP2 changed the behavior of OL to actually pre-render the HTML content before it hit my filter. So the images were downloading, CSS would format the text, JS would run, etc. That's when I ditched OL in favor of Mozilla Mail.

      I recognize that there are some rudimentary protections in SP1 and SP2 that supposedly make some of this content 'safe,' but given the ease with which people have found cross-zone scripting, redirecting, and spoofing problems I would rather just use something that gives me more control over the content that gets executed on my machine.

      If you still use Outlook/IE, please patch it now to correct the latest JPEG overflow in addition to a few other holes from the past few months. That only prevents the currently known-to-work problems from biting you. If history is any indicator, there will be quite a few more in the future.

      You stated that you don't automatically patch, but have Windows Update alert you when there is a problem. That's an excellent idea as long as you actually install the patches that most affect you. I used to promote that behavior but found that most people just ignore the 'ready to install' notification and contract the malware that would have been prevented. I don't advocate 'automatic install' from WU for all people. There are other excellent methods of automating patching (SUS and SMS come to mind for organizations.)

      Unfortunately, common sense avoiding doesn't work anymore with executable content. Defense-in-depth is necessary. You have to set up independent layers (Good software selection, AV, Firewall/IDS, AutoPatching) to protect you because it's really inconvenient to surf without JPEGs and you didn't even know to block them until 6 months after the problem was found...

  6. Fixes by Zevets · · Score: 5, Insightful
    While this will study will explain how viruses spread, will it really tell us how to cure viruses.

    We all know how smallpox spreads. We do not know how to cure it.

    We know how viruses spread, but we only know how to remove it from a computer, not how to fix the problems of viruses.

    This study will show us where to put better virus filters, which is useful, but it will not tell us how to stop the creation of viruses and malware, which is what we really need.

    --

    Mod Wisely.

    1. Re:Fixes by wikdwarlock · · Score: 2, Interesting

      IANACSM (I am NOT a CS major) but I would think that "stop[ping] the creation of viruses and malware" is impossible for any application short of Hello World! Viruses and malware have found a niche online, just like virii and bacteria in RL. I would assume the best hope, as with the wetware versions, is peaceful, mostly unobtrusive cohabitation, not irradication.

      --

      "I must not fear. Fear is the mind killer." -Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear
    2. Re:Fixes by halowolf · · Score: 2, Interesting
      This reminds me of a documentary I saw about various RL viruses and such that could be made to completely harmless, as long as we stopped attacking them with drugs and different treatments.

      There was an example about all the big cats species around the world (except for 1) that all had a virus that appeared to be completely harmless to them. Also there was an example of what I vaguely remember as a cholera outbreak that the more it was attacked with drugs the more virulent and damaging it became.

      The point of the documentary was that instead of using bigger and badder drugs to attack these nasties (which could lead to them becoming more nasty since they have to adapt so that they can survive) that another way that they could be effectivly treated was to guide their evolution to a place where they can exist within us but do no harm.

      However i'm not comparing this to computer viruses :)

    3. Re:Fixes by hunterx11 · · Score: 2, Funny
      We all know how smallpox spreads. We do not know how to cure it.

      In computer terms, however, we pwnt teh shit out of smallpox.

      --
      English is easier said than done.
  7. STD's by Fred+Foobar · · Score: 5, Funny

    Computer virusen are actually like STD's. Windows has sex like crazy without any protection, and of course Linux doesn't have sex at all, just like its users. :)

    --
    It was a really good paper.
    1. Re:STD's by BigZaphod · · Score: 5, Funny

      Well that's easy... The Mac community is like a party at the Playboy mansion. There might be a lot of people there, but they are all of a certain higher standard and have a set of "unwritten" rules of behavior that the outsiders don't understand (hence their not being invited). So they can have lots of fun sex-play, but not so much actual sex as Windows - and yet everyone else wants in on the party under the impression that it is SAFE non-stop sex and drugs, when in reality it is non-stop stripping and lap dances while being high on caffeine pills.

  8. The problem with the metaphor... by halivar · · Score: 5, Funny

    This hardly seems like a novel idea. Isn't the whole calling a computer virus a "virus" supposed to help us understand it in a biological/human way?

    I don't like likening malicious computer use to biology. If we call Sasser a "virus", then we would likewise have to call port-scanning a "forcible proctology exam".

    You don't want to know what buffer-overflow exploits would be called...

  9. I dont know if its such a good analogy. by nmoog · · Score: 4, Funny

    It will amount to the equivilent of "the virus seems to be spreading because mankind has taken to licking diseased rats. Also, the new trend of sneezing directly into each others mouths also appears to account for some of the outbreak..."

  10. Apples to Oranges by Katz_is_a_moron · · Score: 5, Funny

    If humans were susceptible to as many viruses as Windows, we would all be dead.

    1. Re:Apples to Oranges by savagedome · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Actually humans *are* susceptible to a lotttt of viruses. Its the immune system that you should be thankful for. If you need a layman's read to get a feel of what we are made of, get hold of the book Genome by Matt Ridley. Very fascinating.

  11. The difference is... by Tyrdium · · Score: 2, Insightful
    ... most organisms don't want to get viruses. From what I've seen from doing tech work, the average user doesn't care about viruses. Hell, half of the time, they don't even know what they are, and their definitions are two years out of date because they don't want to pay for the subscription! And I won't even mention the lack of Windows updates and the horrid use of IE... [/rant]

    Also, natural selection means that species will likely eventually gain a resistance to whatever virus is affecting them (granted, the virus will also adapt). Not so with computer users, unless ISPs decide to start shutting down access to infected boxen.

  12. The best solution... by bizpile · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The best solution, in my humble opinion, is quarantine. Get the infected user off the Internet. My ISP does it and hopefully many others do too.

  13. Hello? Viruses????? Doorknob? by Mulletproof · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Um, the epidemic thing ain't an original thought, let alone new news. Infact, I seem to remember an that article said it was good that the internet have all these pesky bugs here and there. Like the human body, countermeasures will be inacted to not simply limit the current infection, but help future minor and potential major outbreaks as well. The tactics of the small cases help devise strategies to deal with larger cases and so forth. I mean, naming the damn thing a virus oughta lead you strait to this line of logic that is now amazingly being considered breaking news here...

    Next story, please.

    --
    You need a FREE iPod Nano
  14. Hello??? by fred911 · · Score: 2, Funny

    $6.2 million ?????? $6.2 million ??????

    It better be a sucess not an attempt!

    Where have our values gone?

    --
    09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B - D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
  15. Linux tagline by microsopht · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Computer security analysts have also warned that more viruses in the future will be written to attack systems that run on the Linux operating system and hand-held devices like cell phones.

    Every article seems to have his tagline attached.Looks like people cant seem to wait for Linux Viruses!

    Perhaps they wanna entice people into writing L.virus

    1. Re:Linux tagline by unoengborg · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Well, if the security of the average Linux distro will not get better this is an accident just waiting to happen.

      Most Linux distros relies on the same types of protection of illegitimate use as windows. Just like in windows we have users and groups with read, write and execute permissions. It is therefore likely to have similar problem if sombody decides to write malware like viruses.

      So far this has been fairly uncommon, perhaps because there are more constructive ways for hackers to make a difference in the open source world than in the land of Microsoft.

      Furthermore, Linux have the advantage of having more skilled users than windows. The average Linux user would be much harder to fool into open e-mail attachments etc than the average Windows user. But as the use of Linux becomes more widespread we can assume that it will get into the hands of users just as badly educated as the average windows user usually is. They will run their systems as root and do stupid things just like they do in windows today. As a result we will see more problems on the Linux platform.

      The fact is, that if you avoid MS-Outlook, don't open attachments from unknown people, make sure that you always have the latest security patches from Microsoft installed, the chance of getting hin in windows is quite small. So far I have never had a windows virus, neither have my wife and we have used windows since the release of NT4.

      Clearly both Linux and Windows needs enhancements to protect it from clueless users. Microsoft will probably try to do this by shutting the user out of his computer and only allow trusted software to run through the use of their TCPA system.

      In Linux we have the SELinux stuff NSA put into the latest 2.6x kernel series that provides mandatory security. It makes it possible to on an application basis control what files an application may read. write, execute or even see regardless of what user that runs the application including root. In similar way it is possible to control what capabilities an application have with regards to e.g. networking or memory.

      In this kind of system anything that isn't explicitly allowed is forbidden so if you have a good security policy a virus would be allowed to do very little harm and have limited ability to spread.

      E.g you could configure your system to refuse to execute anything downloaded by mozilla or you favorite e-mail client until you explicitly allow it from a password protected user role. This would of course not prevent mozilla from doing some harm if the virus was running within the mozilla process perhaps as a result of a buffer overflow security breach. But even here SELinux could help. If mozilla only could see html files and only was allowed to alter them if you had the role of webmaser the damage would be limited.

      So, Linux already have the tools to be secure. The problem is that they are not widely used, and in the cases they are, security policys are often to lenient. One reason for this might be that the tools for creating policys are too hard to use.
      I'm happy to see that SELinux is enabled by default in the new Fedora Core 3 test release.

      --
      God is REAL! Unless explicitly declared INTEGER
  16. The computer-organism paradigm doesn't work by mark-t · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Because living organisms are more or less static, and if it weren't for evolution, would be completely unchanging. Living organisms can defend against viruses reasonably well because they know what they are and can therefore easily recognize anything that doesn't match that, and just go bezerk on it.

    Desktop computers, on the the other hand, are not static systems at all. So there's no really good way for a system to differentiate what's not really supposed to be there from something that was deliberately put there by the user. As I said, this isn't a problem for a living organism because that's a closed system, and anything new that gets put into it, without suitable precautions taken beforehand, will be attacked by the body's defenses as a foreign invader. Such a mechanism implemented on a desktop computer would render the computer practically useless for anything that we take for granted that programmable computers do today.

    1. Re:The computer-organism paradigm doesn't work by Qzukk · · Score: 4, Interesting

      So there's no really good way for a system to differentiate what's not really supposed to be there from something that was deliberately put there by the user.

      Thats not a good way to categorize things, given the number of malware and trojans "deliberately" installed by the user. Rather, we should identify the malware based on its behavior: Does it alter other executables not installed with it? Does it connect to one site repeatedly? Many sites rapidly? Does it attempt to access the addressbook? Mail itself out? Make multiple copies of itself in the windows directory? Edit registry settings it doesn't create? Remove or replace other files that weren't installed with it? And so on...

      Once we look at it that way, its fairly simple to identify malware as its operating, and once its identified, the cleanup process can begin.

      --
      If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
  17. Conjecture on their conclusions by Large+Bogon+Collider · · Score: 3, Interesting
    If their conclusions about computer viruses vs biological viruses are similar then my guesses as to the outcome are:

    1) Monoculture is bad in containing viral spread (good for other operating systems)

    2) Since viruses cannot be totally eliminated, a virus resistant host is important (good for most other OSes)

    3) Effective antivirus/vaccination efforts should be made (most open source OSes are intrinsically resistant to attack)

    4) Public education to help prevent risky behaviors (open OS users are generally much more computer adept)

    See a pattern here?

  18. I'm involved, any questions? by nweaver · · Score: 3, Informative

    I'm involved in the center, at ICSI in Berkeley.

    If people have questions, feel free to ask.

    --
    Test your net with Netalyzr
  19. OK, let's go with this by bigberk · · Score: 4, Interesting

    In a biological system (an ecosystem) you want a large diversity of species participating in the system, so that environmental fluctuations and pathogens don't wipe out large parts of the ecosystem all at once.

    If you extend this to interoperating computer systems, then ideally you want a variety of platforms (indeed, operating systems but also processor architectures and device types).

  20. Internet Virus Hoaxes by monsterhead78 · · Score: 3, Informative

    Periodically I get frantic messages from members and friends with "important messages" about new email and
    computer viruses that are actually hoaxes. While savvy Internet users can usually immediately spot the hoaxes,
    many of our members can be both intimidated and frightened (not to mention the time and effort wasted when the
    messages are passed back and forth, to spread these 'alerts/hoaxes'). Running virus checking software can also be
    a very time-consuming endeavor (especially on a large Local Area Network), when you find that you have
    stopped everyone from working for several hours to check for a hoax, it can be really embarrassing.

    My advice is to do a little checking on your own before you excitedly message all of your friends and associates,
    and possibly embarrass yourself by wasting a lot of their time. Here are some of the better sites that track both
    email and other computer viruses and virus hoaxes. I rely heavily on the U.S. Department of Energy Computer
    Incident Advisory Capability's (CIAC) Internet Virus Hoaxes page, but the others all have good and usually
    current information.

    Between them, they describe more than a dozen hoaxes, from Good Times, to PENPAL GREETINGS, to Join
    the Crew. Background, including the actual "warning" message is provided. These sites provide a valuable service
    to the Internet community, especially for new users.

  21. Two words by unixbum · · Score: 5, Funny

    Natural Selection.

    If only this applied to computers :)

  22. Sounds familiar... by Napoleon440 · · Score: 2, Funny

    "...and we shall call it Skynet."

  23. No charge online virus scanner by tepples · · Score: 3, Informative

    how would you know [that you've been virus free without installing antivirus software]?

    Periodically launching IE (after having firewalled it to connect only to microsoft.com and trendmicro.com) and going to Trend Micro's HouseCall site will tell you whether you have a virus on your machine, and you don't even need to pay for virus definition updates. Run a HouseCall scan overnight once a week (put something in Scheduled Tasks to remind you), and you'll be able to tell Windows XP SP2's security wizard the truth that you are already taking antivirus measures without having to shell out for Norton.

  24. Primary sources... by StefanSavage · · Score: 5, Informative

    FWIW, readers should always understand that when they read a news story they are getting a reporter's interpretation of an interview that itself attempts to simplify a larger story. Inevitably, this means that technical details don't survive the translation. To wit, on the second page of the proposal we write: While it is tempting to repurpose the epidemiological models of infectious disease in humans [29], Internet pathogens are in fact quite different--they are authored by intelligent adversaries. Consequently, traditional stochastic analyses are highly fragile tools for predicting the dynamics or limitations of future outbreaks. For those actually interested in what our center is planning to do, I've made the proposal and the summary available. It also gives some insight into what an NSF grant proposal looks like for those who are curious. - Stefan

  25. Flipside by xixax · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I am somewhat surprised that virus writers do not use virus ecology/biology more.

    In real Life, the really nasty, viruses are the ones that have a comparitively low lehatlity. This allows the infected hosts to continue spreading for a long time. And/Or the (early) symptoms are pretty mild, so hosts will often ignore them.

    Hmmm... sounds like most mail relay trojans. I know a few people who *continued* to use thus infected machines, because the inconvenience of cleaning it up is more work for them than having a slower connection now and then. They did not care that they were hosting a trojan.

    Xix.

    --
    "Everything is adjustable, provided you have the right tools"
  26. Hate to say it... by MortisUmbra · · Score: 2, Insightful

    But I honestly think the only way we are ever going to alleviate this problem is by writing, as some others have done recently, "virii" to exploit these know holes and patch the machines they exploit.

    Then of courseon could forsee a sort of arms race whereby virus authors write in the ability to stop another program from using the same exploit to gain entry to the machine and patch it. So basicly it would be an early bird gets the worm sort of scenario where whomever infects the machine first wins.

    Still I think its better than leaving it up to a bunch of lazy computer users who make the rest of the world suffer because they are either too inept or too lazy to patch their machines.

    --

    "The saddest words of mice and men, are not those which were, but should have been."
  27. Difference between computers and organisms: by cr0z01d · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Organisms can die from diseases. A virus won't destroy a computer, the worst case scenario is a wipe and fresh install. This means that Microsoft can make their software bug-ridden.

    Maybe if viruses were to fry hardware, we could see some improvements.

    1. Re:Difference between computers and organisms: by ESqVIP · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The recent viruses (including worms and trojans) on the computing world are more like "smart" parasites than killers. They don't go as far as some biological viruses (though the ones that overuse your bandwidth are getting quite close).

  28. "Viruses" vs. "Parasites" by ites · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The problem with the terminology (and attempts to use it as a model) is that it implies that human diseases and computer viruses are somehow based on the same mechanisms and can be fought in similar ways. This is obviously untrue. Human and computer viruses may spread in similar patterns, that's not related to how they work, rather the way they are transmitted. A forest fire also spreads by contact.

    A better analogy for computer viruses (and trojans and spyware and worms) is the "parasite", since this is a general form that is found at many, many levels: parasites in our blood, in our cells, in our societies, even in our genes. (The bulk of genetic material appears to consist of parasitic DNA).

    Looking at computer malware as a disease misses the point. Actually, looking at human viruses as "diseases" also misses the point.

    The thing about parasites is that they are inevitable but that there is an implicit balance between a parasite and its host population that generally ensures that the parasite adapts to becoming less harmful and eventually passive or even cooperative. (Which is why there are ten bacterial cells for every human cell in your body).

    Parasites only get out of control when the host population has insufficient variation. It's not a troll to say that the Windows monoculture is the fundamental cause of the current plague of malware.

    Variation is the basic solution to parasitic behaviour. Given that, parasites will move only slowly, will adapt to causing less harm (or they will kill their hosts and die as well), and will eventually form the basis for an immune system (fighting off other parasites).

    It's inevitable that 60-70% of all software running on all computers will, eventually, be parasitic.

    This topic was explored in some detail by HeironymousCoward on Slashdot, about a year ago.

    --
    Sig for sale or rent. One previous user. Inquire within.
    1. Re:"Viruses" vs. "Parasites" by Tony-A · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hmmm, very interesting.
      It's inevitable that 60-70% of all software running on all computers will, eventually, be parasitic.

      My first reaction is to violently disagree. It is quite possible to knock that number down, way way down. There are even some things we can do like recover back to a previous state. "I wish I hadn't done that. Wish granted."

      However, the question is how uninfected is it worth taking the trouble to be. I'm afraid the answer is that it's a lot more trouble than it's worth.

      The problem with "generally ensures that the parasite adapts to becoming less harmful and eventually passive or even cooperative" is that is true of the survivors and not necessarily representative of the original population. This makes avoiding a monoculture all the more essential to having something survive.

  29. A "meatspace" analogy... by WebCowboy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...for the parent post's suggestions, point-for-point:

    - avoid drugs and alcohol
    - avoid saturated fats
    - wear a condom if you screw around
    - practise good hygeine (hint for some of the /.ers out there---that means bathing/showering, shaving/haircut and brushing teeth) and exercise regularly (ie. stand up and move around--outside of the basement when you can)
    - get that funny mole checked out if it gets bigger or suddenly loses or grows hair
    - get your flu shot

    BTW...if you don't rely ona virus scanner, how do you know you've never had a virus on your PC? Without scanning your PC these days, you could have one and never know because the paylod didn't damage anything important, or bugs in the virus code or your particualr configuration prevented it from invlicting damage...

    Anyways, I don't have to do a bunch of research to tell you what comuting is like in human terms:

    - We are currently in mediaeval times. The unwashed masses are ruled by the tyrant King William (Gates) III and are subject to his whims. The fear of MSGod drives them to give tithes to the church of Pope Steve Ballmer.

    - The unwashed masses are relatively ignorant and are truly unwashed...poor hygeine is rampant, as is malnutrition, making conditions ripe for major plagues

    - the privleged MSCE Nobles who know better build fortresses...with moats and "firewalls"...to protect their domains from the savage outside world

    So look to the middle ages to see what computing has in store for us in the near future. There is hope though:

    - Linus Torvalds and his merry band of rebel bandits are out trying to steal market share from the rich to share with the poor. (yeah I know...Robin Hood is legend not history...whatever)

    - A holy man--one Eric Raymond--has written a protest against the indulgences of the powers that be and nailed it to the door of the cathedral...for all in the bazzar to read.

    There is a little optimisim trying to crawl out from the rock that is the cynic in me...I'm waiting eagerly for the renaissance of Free Software (the rise of Democracy as it were)

  30. Everything-is-like-biology fallacy by Pan+T.+Hose · · Score: 2

    Comparing every aspect of computing and networking to biology is not any less fallacious than trying to understand how does a car work looking at it like it was a biological organism. Real life has evolved randomly together with virii and parasites but all of the software including any kind of malware was intelligently designed. The most common misconception resulting from such a reasoning is that computer malware will always be relatively harmless because killing the victim is not smart from any parasite's point of view. Wrong. A deadly worm quickly spreading and erasing all of the data an hour later would not survive so long as Code Red, but it doesn't have to survive in the first place if that is not important for its creator. Survival is not important because software doesn't have to live long enough to evolve. It is designed and created manually and then released. It can be written for months or years and then live only few hours if that is the purpose of writing it. I think that assessing the spreading patterns of Internet malware like those of human epidemics might be very interesting but there is a hidden fallacious reasoning that comparing the virii themselves to human diseases will somehow help fighting them which leads to concentrating on spectacular effects instead of boring causes of the problem. The problems are buffer overflows which can be completely eliminated, running code from untrusted sources, etc. It has nothing to do with literally anything known in the real world any more than proving a theorem does. Another thing is comparing Internet to a population and fighting malware in the context of epidemics. This is foolish. In reality, there is a user with a computer and her data. She can lose her data or some of her secrets may become public and in that case she won't say "that's OK because this epidemic disease is contained and the population of computer users will survive" because if she loses her work she doesn't care about other computers. When she gets broken into she shouldn't think "I am sure my system will keep working because killing it would be disadvantageous from the evolutionary standpoint for the software" becuase the ultimate reason of the attack is not just the existence itself. The reason may be getting user's credit card number or performing a DDoS attack. The reason may be causing panic by deleting everything. The reason may be anything. And the problem is not millions years of evolution side by side with parasites but using "gets" instead of "fgets." It's not that we don't know how does the malware work or that we cannot write secure code. Look at KeyKOS or EROS. Look at OpenBSD. Look at Debian. Do we have any "epidemics" there to contain and to fight? No. Such studies are interesting but only because observing symptoms and effects is interesting. If we really want to stop malware we should start from reading the source code of EROS instead of analysing global patterns in problems with Windows. Please read this paper from 1979: GNOSIS: A Prototype Operating System for the 1990s. The problem is that we have 2004 and still the most popular operating system completely ignore the solutions from the 1970s.

    --
    Sincerely,
    Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
    "Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
  31. if we're going to use analogy- then by way2trivial · · Score: 2, Funny

    we're comparing human virus and computer virus, and that makes Microsoft the mucus membranes... right?

    --
    every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random