Tiger Early Start Kit

cheers by millahtime · 2004-10-20 10:35 · Score: 4, Interesting

Here's hoping the G5 powerbook comes out at the same time as Tiger. That is a mac fans wet dream.

Re:cheers by bhtooefr · 2004-10-20 10:54 · Score: 2, Interesting

Keep in mind, Apple likes their boxes QUIET. I'm thinking you could get away with two big ass heatsinks and fans on that 2.5GHz G5. Also, from what I've heard, the 12" AlBook has some heat problems, so Apple could release a hot laptop...
Re:cheers by over_exposed · 2004-10-20 10:57 · Score: 2, Interesting

Oh I know... My 15" power book get's plenty warm. There are times when it's uncomfortable on my thighs. That's with a 1.5 GHz G4. This is what leads me to believe it would be nearly fatal to have a G5 on my lap :-)

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"The object of war is not to die for your country, but to make the other bastard die for his." - Patton

Don't forget about NDA by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-20 10:36 · Score: 5, Interesting

There's some nasty NDA business going on.

You can't even talk to other devs about Tiger if you have it.

DRM'ed? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-20 10:39 · Score: 1, Interesting

Of course if the product isn't DRM'ed then there may be a deluge of piracy. Blake said it best -- "Tiger tiger, burning bright..."

Mouse gestures for Dashboard? by hunterx11 · 2004-10-20 10:40 · Score: 3, Interesting

Does this mean that Tiger will support other forms of mouse gestures?

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English is easier said than done.

Oh how I wish by thammoud · 2004-10-20 10:42 · Score: 3, Interesting

that the Linux GUI toolkits just copy the Mac rather than Windows and stop the bickering and come up with a Unified desktop.

Apple has made Unix a dream desktop OS. I just hope that they support 64bit Java on this thing. I will buy it and switch from Linux (Fedora 64bit) if they come out with a 64bit powebook in a heartbeat.

Re:But there is no ... by Night+Goat · 2004-10-20 10:50 · Score: 5, Interesting

Realistically, how much of a gain would student developers get by developing for Tiger over Panther? It makes more sense to learn to program on a released OS than on a beta one. What if something goes screwy? Do you blame it on the OS or your inexperience?

Core Data = good idea, weak storage by chmod+u+s · 2004-10-20 10:52 · Score: 3, Interesting

Core Data sounds like so many other great 3rd party tools out there, except now part of the OS (so to speak). A standardized object-relational persistence mechanism and design studio - Awesome. But why only:

A text-based XML file format
A better performing binary file format
A high-performance, SQLite-based database file format

Why not an odbc/ado/adsi type of interface that will allow the use of any persistence mechanism? Using LDAP or any sql-92 compliant existing database would be useful. Hey apple, you listening?

Re:Core Data = good idea, weak storage by DrJay · 2004-10-20 11:30 · Score: 2, Interesting

Basically, that capacity's not there because Apple doesn't guarantee that any of the databases that work with these things are going to be installed on a user's system or network - they want to make sure it works for users of a desktop OS. Adding SQLite to a system is damn light weight and doesn't create much in the way of security concerns. The same can't be said of the major SQL databases. Apple's right not to add them as part of the general distribution.

That said, adding that capacity to Server would rock. My guess is that they're just getting things to work in relatively simple situations first before moving on to something like you're suggesting. Adding plugins to Cocoa software is laughably easy - I expect to see extensibility a plugin SDK for CoreData somewhere around 10.4.3 or so...

JT

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______ This mind intentionally left blank.

All these new features... by DA_MAN_DA_MYTH · 2004-10-20 11:00 · Score: 3, Interesting

I mean the one that would force me to upgrade, is if on their DVD application they had an option to leave the window always on top.

I like to watch AntiTrust (Shhh... Don't tell anybody) while I'm coding.

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"It takes many nails to build a crib, but one screw to fill it."

Land Rover CKD by justfred · 2004-10-20 11:07 · Score: 3, Interesting

"I hope that the next corvette to come out of GM costs $200,000 and comes in a bunch of boxes"

Land Rover offers an option in some countries of "CKD" - "Complete Knock Down" that comes to you in boxes, you get to put it together. Unfortunately you can't get these in the US (tho they tease people with them at auto shows: http://www.rockcrawler.com/trailreports/SEMA2003/l androver_d110.asp

Keeping it simple by SuperKendall · 2004-10-20 11:16 · Score: 4, Interesting

Any app that really needs something like LDAP or JDBC or what have you can still use those.

To me, the idea of provided a core OS service that essentially acts as a really nice standard embedded DB you can use quickly, is awesome. I'll continue to write apps using more standard databases, but there are smaller apps I have in mind that can really make use of this feature. I was already looking over small DB's and debating about the best way to move forward with an embedded DB in an app.

Fundamentially the configuration and administration needs of an embedded DB vs. an external DB are different, and I don't mind treating them differently.

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"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley

Marginal or Marginful by SuperKendall · 2004-10-20 11:21 · Score: 2, Interesting

As others have noted, developer tools come with every Mac - that costs nothing, this is early release dev program kind of stuff.

However, I would question that bit about lower margin than Linux. There may be more Linux boxes around, but if you count the users willing to pay for things which base do you think is larger?

And I think in some ways you might even be better off than you would be developing with Windows, because while there are a LOT of Windows users, there are also a LOT of programs competing in whatever space you want to cover. With the Mac there are still a lot of opportunities for programs to come in and grab a big chunck of market share pretty quickly.

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"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley

GCC 4? by i_c_andrade · 2004-10-20 11:21 · Score: 1, Interesting

Good lord, is GCC all most there?

Spotlight and Backup by Drishmung · 2004-10-20 11:26 · Score: 4, Interesting

http://developer.apple.com/macosx/tiger/index.html says:

In a nutshell, every time a file is saved, it is examined for meta-data and content, which is then placed into an indexed database.

I wonder if Spotlight calculates (or could be made to calculate) an MD5 for the file. This would be useful for backup. If the backup program looks up a file's MD5 in its catalog and finds it already there, no need to back up again. This would survive arbitrary renaming or moving (the metadata would still need to be backed up for each file), and would make for major efficiencies when backing up multiple machines on a network (only one copy of Hei.dfont, Osaka.dfont, xxx.App, etc. in the backup set).

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Protoplasm. Quiet Protoplasm. I like quiet protoplasm.

Re:Spotlight and Backup by Drishmung · 2004-10-20 13:32 · Score: 2, Interesting

And also, Retrospect already does something like this and has for years. It's not particularly innovative. The interesting thing is detecting identical files. Having the operating system calculate MD5's for you seemed to me the interesting thing.

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Protoplasm. Quiet Protoplasm. I like quiet protoplasm.

Between Linux and OS X... by Qbertino · 2004-10-20 11:33 · Score: 4, Interesting

.. I presume the air will get thin for MS in the long run. Look at those features. It's like "Gee, that would be really cool to have" and three years later OS X has it, 5 years ahead of all the rest. I find the Automator one of those supercool things. Those things that will eventually put me out of business when everybody can automate his tasks with a few mouseklicks. But it's cool nonetheless.

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We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca

Anyone else notice.. by iONiUM · 2004-10-20 11:36 · Score: 4, Interesting

That in the RSS feeds demonstration for Safari, the site they use is Slashdot?

Just thought that was interesting..

+4 insightful to the guy who's never run AIX :-) by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-20 11:55 · Score: 5, Interesting

Seriously, AIX stands for "Ain't Unix."

All the "high end virtualisation, monitoring and enterprise volume management" that AIX includes does not make up for basic, fundamental problems with things like shared library handling. Everything is fscking hard coded to /usr/lib. Put shared libs in /usr/foo/lib and there is no way to make AIX search that lib path! And yes, we have support from IBM. Their solution was to symlink our libs to /usr/lib. Yuck.

Also, the fact that IBM doesn't update their Open Source repository is inexcusable. Try compiling apache on AIX sometime. It isn't fun. Actually try compiling any open source software on AIX.

Now, if you are an IBM drone, you will say, "you should buy their integrated Websphere." But, the problem with this is vendor lock-in. AIX is worse than fscking Windows for vendor lock-in.

Some of IBM's consultants are really bright, unfortunately you need that. Extensive experience with Linux/*BSD/Solaris/Irix is NOT enough to adequately anticipate/fix problems that crop up with AIX.

At a small shop, AIX is just a pain in the ass. At a big shop with ~1,200 AIX servers supporting >35,000 desktops in a whole bunch of locations (don't ask) it's a nightmare.

Ironically, there is nothing that we do with AIX that we couldn't do better/cheaper with Linux. Hell, we could probably get better support for it too. I suggest that the era of Big Iron in the enterprise is over. Cluster cheap linux blades.

I'm sick of the Slashdot IBM fanboy syndrome. There are plenty of companies to be excited about (like Apple!). There are plenty of operating systems to evangelize (like Linux or *BSD!). AIX/IBM are not the horse to bet on. They suck worse than almost any other vendor.

Oh yeah, Lotus/Domino sucks just as much as MS Exchange.

DANGER Will Robinson!!! by jafac · 2004-10-20 12:14 · Score: 1, Interesting

Maybe I'm misunderstanding this, but it says that Dashboard hosts applications called Widgets, which are written in HTML, which have access to "plugins" which can be written in Objective-C.

Isn't this the same mistake Microsoft made with ActiveX (ie. Virus-writer's best friend)?

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These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.

Good points. by itomato · 2004-10-20 12:16 · Score: 2, Interesting

OS X may not match up to AIX or HP-UX on some of those features; scaling, high-end virtualization..

However, it does have some new technologies that might have more direct impact for more people and deliver on some age-old promises of computers making life easier; workgroup management , server task automation & client management, and volume management of its own. Not to mention everything they're doing in regard to clustering with Xgrid, and authoring software (Xcode).

Granted, the Apple stuff is new, it's not necessarily the *best*, and not even fully *out* yet, but you have to admit that there are great advances being made there, providing evidence that much attention is being paid to what AIX, HP-UX, Irix, and Solaris do best (right now). Plus, Steve's got something to prove since NeXT did so poorly against them all when they were at their peak.

Re:Quicksilver by FuzzzyLogik · 2004-10-20 12:26 · Score: 2, Interesting

While some of what is being put into Spotlight will do what Quicksilver, Launchbar, Butler, etc do there's still a lot of other things that spotlight doesn't do. Really all spotlight does is search files and data. It'll replace the itunes search, the contact search, and what have you but i don't think it'll be as intuitive to use for finding a folder fast, or running an application, the thing i like most about quicksilver is you don't even need to use the mouse, where it seems spotlight will almost require it to an extent.

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Kyle
http://www.unlogikal.net/

Re:Only a few things missing by IAmATuringMachine! · 2004-10-20 12:35 · Score: 4, Interesting

While I was interning there this summer, we had a pretty big power outage, lasting maybe 30 minutes. A bunch of people were pissed about some lost work and productivity, but then it dawned on us.... Having all the developers lose power was the best test of the filesystem we could have ever asked for!

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"Computer Science is no more about computers than astronomy is about telescopes."
-E. W. Dijkstra

They used to do this by MacFury · 2004-10-20 16:05 · Score: 2, Interesting

I remember in the mid nineties Apple would send me videos about various subjects. It was basically a guy talking about something like OpenDoc for a half hour, describing it in more detail than the press releases, showing sample applications, etc. I think these were phased out with the ever growing popularity of the web.

Re:Retrospect has done this for years by Drishmung · 2004-10-20 16:27 · Score: 2, Interesting

Does it MD5 them though? I thought it looked at the size, last mod date and a few other things, but did not run a digest over the whole file. I.e. it tries to be 'smart', or at least 'cheap', when calculating a signature. I've fairly sure that if you take a file and save it over itself without changing the contents that Retrospect will back up the whole file, because it thinks it has changed.

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Protoplasm. Quiet Protoplasm. I like quiet protoplasm.

Quartz Extreme, Core Data, Spotlight, Automator by TheInternet · 2004-10-20 18:44 · Score: 3, Interesting

Call it whatever you want, patches are still patches. The list of new features is not revolutionnary, by far (http://www.apple.com/macosx/tiger/)And it's not like they did it only once. Jaguar, Panther, and now Tiger...

I think the problem is that you're reading the watered-down description of the OS intended for casual consumers.

Quartz Extreme, Bindings (both Jaguar), Core Data, Spotlight and Automator (all Tiger) are certainly not "patches".

- Scott

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Scott Stevenson
Tree House Ideas

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