Los Angeles to Consider Open Source Software

lientz writes "According to an article at FederalComputerWeek, the city of Los Angeles is considering using Open Source software as a cost cutting measure. From the article: "...city officials could save $5.2 million by switching to OpenOffice... rather than purchasing a Microsoft Office product at $200 per license for 26,000 desktops. The savings would go to a special fund to hire more employees for the police department, a major focus for city officials right now, he added.""

Comments

Heh

[Anonymous Coward]

Now watch microsoft drop that price from 200$ to 10$....

I can just smell it on the air.

Re: Heh

[Black Parrot]

> Now watch microsoft drop that price from 200$ to 10$....

I don't know about that. I called a press conference and announced that I was going to play Doom instead of Age of Empires, and I didn't get one red cent out of the cheap bastards.

Re:Heh

[goon america]

No, just watch a swarm of Microsoft lobbyists descend upon the city, donating enough to local politicians to equal the amount they would save in the city budget by switching to Open Office. This solves the real problem for both parties, which for the politicos is not the city budget but the campaign budget, and for Microsoft is not profits but control.

Re:Heh

[oskard]

I bet MS will just create another study explaining why Linux is, in reality, a more expensive alternative to Windows. Same thing with OpenOffice to Office.

I don't exactly buy it, but I can see how training and technical support are necessary yet costly in the work environment.

Re:Heh

[Rhone]

Except the whole TCO crap is not an issue for an office suite the way that it could be for an OS. No one needs high-priced experts to administer OpenOffice for them. It is a drop-in replacement for MS Office, as long as you don't need perfect compatibility with MS Office formats.

Re:Heh

[TheGavster]

Microsoft is really all about the profits. If you can get a million in sales with a quarter mill of lobby money, its a smart move. Of course, this goes for any business (even the not-evil ones)

Re: Heh

[Anonymous Coward]

Calling mom & dad down to the basement is not what I would describe as "calling a pres conference" :)

Re:Heh

[Master Bait]

When will those politicians learn to take Microsoft's money and then go right ahead and get open source software in spite?

Re:Heh

[morcego]

I beg to disagree.

Yes, your view is somewhat correct, but simplist.

Just because you are selling 1Mil doesn't mean you are profiting 1Mil.

Considering how much Microsoft spends on marketing, lobbing, lawsuits, employees, failed products, I would say their profit margin is around 20% tops (maybe not even that much).

So, to break using a quarte mil on lobby, they would have to sell at least 1Mil AND a quarter. Of course, that would still be good business, since they would not be loosing and money, and would be able to collect the real profit down the line, by maintaining market control.

I remember a particularly interesting case here in Brazil. The major bank around here (public bank) was looking to provide its customers with a given product. Two companies reached the end of the tests, Microsoft and another one. The product in question was Microsoft Money. The non-microsoft producted ended up being the best choice. So, what did Microsoft do ? Gave Money for free, thus winning.

It all ended up in court. Last time I checked, the other company was dropping the case, because Microsoft was able to push it so long they(the other) were running out of money.

Now, back to the subject, it is even possible Microsoft will be giving Office for free to LA, even tho USA laws are a bit more hard on things like this. Then again, who knows.

Re:Heh

[NanoGator]

"as long as you don't need perfect compatibility with MS Office formats."

That's actually the reason we didn't use OO at my previous job. It wasn't so much a problem adopting it internally, but we communicated with outside people as well. (This was two years ago, though. Not sure if it's still true today.)

TCO could actually matter in the case of "I spent too much time trying to make this work with another person."

Re:Heh

[HanB]

It all ended up in court. Last time I checked, the other company was dropping the case, because Microsoft was able to push it so long they(the other) were running out of money.

Typical. Ever since the Xbox it became so obvious that the only thing they do is trying to harm the fair chances of others.

If I could convince the CEO of such a company to stick with his initial decision. To make him realize that he's killing the only chance of having a fair competition with this stupid decision.

Next time there won't be no OpenOffice deal, next time there won't be no Open Source people. And guess what M$ will do when there is no competition... They'll make you pay double to make up for the last time you threatened to walk to the competition and it ``costed'' them so much money.

Negotiating Ploy?

[mordors9]

It just sounds like a good way to get M$ to lower their licensing fees.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[mordors9]

The general acceptance by the world as THE office suite? Most school systems use MS Office for teaching students, so the possible employee base is more likely to be familiar with it than OpenOffice. And no I am not a MS fan, I use Slack for my home desktop. But you have to accept reality, while hoping it changes.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[britneys 9th husband]

And 99% of those employees probably aren't doing anything all that complicated with their word processor anyway. Offer a half day training session on OpenOffice, give everyone a quick reference card or something on "how to do common MS Office tasks in OpenOffice", and you're done. Then offer more advanced training to the 1% that need it.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[Grax]

I think the preferred solution would be to provide a large donation to the OpenOffice project. They could still save $4.2 million per year and the $1 million would be good for the project and buy valuable development time they could use to implement any features they needed for their environment.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[EnronHaliburton2004]

Its not like a word processor requires any support

"Where's the grammar checker?"

I dare say, the grammar checker is the one thing that keeps me on MS Office. Fixing my stupid wording wording mistakes as i type along is incredibly valuable. Spell check is great, but I really want the grammar checker also.

It's so transparent in Word (And it works in Outlook 2003 now) that most people barely even notice it, and would really start to miss it when it is gone.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[Requiem Aristos]

Yes, but you actually /looked/ for the missing menu item. Most of your average users will see that the option they want is missing, and will sit there waving their flippers like a thalidomide baby until they get a half hour retraining session for that one option.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[Lehk228]

sit there waving their flippers like a thalidomide baby

Can I steal that line?

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[killjoe]

That's so cool. The idea that open source software will hurt the profitability of Microsofts monopoly products is the beauty of market forces at work.

Unfortunately for MS this relentless downward pressure on their profitibility is not going to end and indeed will increase with time.

Their stock price is already pretty much stagnant so I see no good reason for anybody to invest in MS stock if they are interested in growth.

All around bad news for MS which means good news for everybody else.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[slam smith]

I think the better question is how did WordPerfect manage to lose to Microsoft.

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[legirons]

"Most school systems use MS Office for teaching students"

Things like that change as if blown by the wind. The lifecycle of a "school software" fashion isn't even as long as most people spend learning it.

It must be only 14 years now since I was taught a RM (research machines') desktop publishing system on an early PC, which was eerily similar to programs on the BBC-B which we'd used previously.

A couple of years after that, we were using software on the Archimedes A3000 computers, which had its own word-processor software (and a lot of freeware and shareware - popular magazines were still printing source-code in each issue)

Different labs at that school were just getting PCs, but since it was MS-DOS 5, we were actually using databases and word-processors written by a teacher in our school, since commercial software was either not available, or not usable.

At home we were using Ami Pro, the best word processor available. In fact I remember being marked-down on an exam question asking "what's the key to initiate a spellcheck" because the examiner had assumed WordPerfect for DOS, and I had assumed Ami Pro for Windows 3.11

After school, I left for the "real world", and got a job somewhere they were using WordPerfect. The macro system was a mess on that program, but they were replacing it with Microsoft Word systems.

At university, MS-Word seemed to be the standard, until we tried to group-edit a 200-page thesis on "university standard" old machines, and couldn't write more than a page before it locked-up in protest at the document size. On the first project we perservered, cursing Word all the time. On the second project, we discovered LaTeX (the real standard for university word-processing)

Now I'm working again and we use Word. But it seems like every sensible company is converting to OpenOffice. And presumably once AbiWord gains features, it will succeed OpenOffice (because it's ground-up Free Software, as opposed to a late conversion, so inherantly better technically)

Could you have said even 10 years ago what word-processor I'd be using today? Why even care what's being taught in schools? (and conversely, why should schools care what's currently being used in industry)

Re:Negotiating Ploy?

[Jondor]

Don't know about the rest of the world, but around here (the Netherlands) office was installed for free on every new computer. Well, we didn't hear about that one before uh? Of course the fact that WP's windows version sucked big time didn't help either. Especially since windows, yes you guessed it, was free with every new pc..;-)

Typical tactic

[null etc.]

This is the typical tactic used by governments in order to get Microsoft running back to their doorsteps, courting them with low prices.

There's nothing to see here, move along.

Re:Typical tactic

[bkzitalsux]

This story ws covered on NPR last week (at least in the LA area). The reporter explained to the clueless what OSS was and the benefit of putting more cops on the street with the money saved. She then moved on talk about the "TCO" of going OSS, as if the status quo had none. Evidently coached (or brainwashed or funded) by MS or the reseller for the city.

I'd be amazed if LA were to switch. Pleased, but amazed.

Police is good

[Space_Soldier]

I would rather have more police officers than Microsoft Office licences. If the federal government did this, I wonder how many FBI agents, CIA agents, NSA agents, radiation-proof suits, and other goodies could be bought!

Re:Police is good

[wmspringer]

Three reasons:

1) People are familiar with MSOffice, so you don't have to train them on OO.o

2) People in charge assume that since MS is expensive and well-known, it must be better

3) OO.o doesn't make campaign contributions

Re:Police is good

[venicebeach]

Remember, these are Los Angeles police officers. Do you really want more of those?

The money is going to fund police?

[GNUALMAFUERTE]

- The government is the one that allows the existance of propietary software, and the first to damage Free Software (For example, with software patents).
- The government profits from Free Software
- Instead of giving part of that profit to HELP FREE SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT, it's given to other government-dependant institutions.

No intention to flame, but, how is this a good thing?

ALMAFUERTE

Re:The money is going to fund police?

[mabhatter654]

First, the State govt is not who deals with software patents and outrageous copyrights...although they have much more influence on the Feds than any OSS fans could ever hope for.

The real goal of govt "profits" for patents and such is to benifit the public...the State using OSS is a prime example of that technology comming back to benifit everybody. The state's interest is in benifiting people...not generating some kind of cash flow! If the state can do the same work with OSS and not have to pay a private company millions of dollars they can use that money for other things...again, the state's interest is in acomplishing the goals to help people [collect taxes, child support, protect environment, etc] It's a misguided history of the govt paying for everything from private companies to the exclusion of other voluanteer or public interest groups. The current administration's tendency to "outsource" everything under the sun demeans the true purpose of govenrment.

Re:The money is going to fund police?

[mattyrobinson69]

the use of open source software in large organisations (5.2M / 200 is a lot of licences) means 26000 people (thats a lot of people, did i work that out wrong) will get their first taste of free software, and perhaps some workers will think "hmmm, i'l get rid of that illegal copy of ms office at home and get open office since its legally free"

also, more mindshare = more developers

Yet another announcement

[bigtallmofo]

This is great that there's another announcement of a government agency considering OSS. Hopefully this one isn't a ploy to get cost concessions from Microsoft like so many other announcements apparently have been.

Re:Yet another announcement

[Kjella]

Of course it is. A basic intro to game theory.

Let's say the MS price is $50 mill, OO price $60 mill (including luser training, compatibility issue etc. etc. aka TCO).

If that was the case, why should MS give a rebate? They wouldn't.

Now let's the MS price is $50 mill, OO price $40 mill. Now they consider switching, MS comes in with a $35 mill offer.

The key words here are credible threat. To make concessions, Microsoft must believe the threat is credible. That means that the cost is actually lower. So it is rational for them to suggest it, rational for MS to make a counter-offer, and rational for them to accept it.

So don't worry. OO is closing in, and sooner or later the demanded cuts get too much for MS to accept. It is just a matter of time.

Kjella

as others have pointed out

[Raleel]

MS will lower their prices for the city gov't. there is no way they are paying full price. I'd be shocked if they payed more than $30 per license.

Macros

[tyleroar]

Gordon Haff, a senior analyst and IT adviser at Illuminata, said business value should be the main concern in transitioning to an open-source environment. "The decision-making for the state or local or federal government could be essentially the same as for a corporation," Haff said. "Does it save money when all the costs [are] taken into account? And that includes conversion costs, retraining costs, perhaps costs of getting and writing or converting software that doesn't run on an open-source platform."

That's a very good point. OpenOffice is great and all, but what if they have lots of macros written for the Office suite? Once OpenOffice has implemented compatibility with macros, there will be no reason to not switch. The other thing that occurred to me, is why do they feel like they have to upgrade? Why can't they stick with the version they have?

Re: You get what you pay for

[Black Parrot]

> Windows XP, Microsoft Office, and all the rest, these programs actually work.

Get an account, Bill.

Microsoft Response

[AfterSchoolSpecial]

"The savings would go to a special fund to hire more employees for the police department, a major focus for city officials right now."

Steve B. (Or Bill G.): "You see, open source makes you less safe and secure than windows products...oh wait...crap."

And a fine tactic it is.

[Noksagt]

The fact that Microsoft cowtows to tactics like this by lowering their prices gives legitimacy to OpenOffice.org. If MS didn't view F/OSS as a viable thread, they wouldn't lower prices--they'd pull strong-arm tactics and say "yeah--good luck with that. When your migration fails, you can come back and give us the same deal as we are proposing now."

Lowering prices not only validates OO.o as a useable alternative, but also proves that F/OSS is a truly disruptive technology--MS can't get away with charging what they want to anymore.

Re:And a fine tactic it is.

[behindspace]

I agree, OO.o was the best thing I ever migrated to. Everyong I know was acting like "you can't do that, you'll come crawling back to M$FT" I switched about 8 months ago, and have since converted my office, my friend who runs a computer shop (he now fully endorses OSS, and OO.o, Firefox, and Thunderbird come with all of his new computers, unless a customer wants to have M$Orafice and pay the $200+). The town of North Hampton NH is looking into the migration as well, same with the town of Methuen MA. sure, both these cities combined aren't even the size of a city block in LA, but still, it begins to prove the point that F/OSS does prove to be a powerful competitor to M$...

Re:And a fine tactic it is.

[GoofyBoy]

>The fact that Microsoft cowtows to tactics like this by lowering their prices gives legitimacy to OpenOffice.org.

The purchasers could have done this with any office suite. Its just that OO/OpenSource is the latest IT buzz word.

Purchasers were doing this before OO was around. And they do it in many different industries.

Writing up motions are nothing. Wake me up when they actually do something with OO.

Re:And a fine tactic it is.

[Jason Earl]

Office 97? Office 2000? How about something with at least a comparison to one of the last two versions. However, I guess if you are using Office for basic word processing it makes sense to compare Open Office to Office 2000, since there is feature-parity between those two.

Why? Well over half of Microsoft's customers are still on these two versions of MS Office. OpenOffice.org isn't really competing with the newest versions of MS Office because those people have already spent their money.

If you need business process automation rather than word processing, you'll have to pay for a license, even if it's Star Office.

There is nothing inherent in MS Office that makes it a better fit for business process automation than OpenOffice.org. In fact, Microsoft generally pushes folks that want to use MS Office as part of a business automation process to upgrade to the more expensive "Enterprise Edition" of MS Office so they can use the fancy XML document types.

With OpenOffice.org you get XML document types by default and for free. Combine that with Zope (which handles OO.org formats natively, and has workflow support) and you are most of the way there (you just need some business rules). You certainly are farther along than someone who just has the standard version of MS Office.

Re:And a fine tactic it is.

[Jason Earl]

Yes, InfoPath is pretty neat (of course it only comes with the Enterprise Edition and it requires a great deal of development work and piles of auxilary server software before it does anything actually useful).

You should take a look at some of the cool stuff being done with Zope and Plone before you assume that I have handed you such a loaded shotgun. SharePoint, InfoPath and all of the other new MS Office technologies are cool, but they are more along the lines of development tools than part of the MS Office suite. Either way, you can bet that the city of L.A. isn't using any of these tools, and the only way that they can afford them is to spend money that they currently are hoping to spend on police officers.

But TCO could still be high...

[wasted]

...due to costs associated with license administration and the risk of fines resulting from audits that find that the licenses were improperly administered. If it takes a bunch of man-hours to track the licenses and ensure compliance, the cost of those man-hours goes into the total cost of ownership. Those costs are avoided (usually) with free-as-in-beer software.

Or I could be wrong, and MS would grant a low-cost blanket license.

Re:But TCO could still be high...

[morcego]

That is what site licenses are for. Not to mention that Microsoft has some softwares to administer that. Which, of course, they charge for.

There are always more oportunities to keep people that are locked on a give archtecture giving you money.

Let's start spreading our own FUD

[britneys 9th husband]

What does a cop make, about 52k/year or so? We need to start fighting fire with fire. Here's the new FUD we can start spreading against Microsoft:

Through its licensing fee structure, Microsoft tried to take 100 police officers off the streets of Los Angeles.

Re:Let's start spreading our own FUD

[amliebsch]

Two FUDs don't make a truth.

Smaller communities would benefit most from OSS

[TykeClone]

I'm on the city council of a (very) small town, and because of that I'm on a mailing list for an Iowa municipal issues magaizine. This month they had an article in it about reducing Microsoft licensing costs - by using the state purchasing power. No mention of Open Office or any other competitors.

In Iowa, there are a few population centers, a few "larger towns", and many towns with low enough populations that they can run the entire municipal government with two or three employees. These are the kinds of places that don't have the built-in MS infrastructure and could migrate to OpenOffice fairly easily. Larger communities may have the infrastructure in place the makes it more difficult to migrate away from Microsoft.

Seeing headlines that LA is thinking about going open source is interesting, but there might be thousands of other communities in the country that could see a proportionally greater benefit from that software than LA would - but they'd never make the news.

with 5.2 million..

[ThomasFlip]

you could hire people to make your own damn office sweet.

Re:OpenOffice Access

[cttforsale]

It's called
1. make your Access database an ODBC datasource.
2. Start any Open Office app and click Tools--->Data sources.

This is under MS Windows, which is what they're still using....

I know. Certainly not a replacement. But it is there...

communism

[DrIdiot]

http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/01/14/162624 8&tid=109 Better watch out because L.A. is turning communist, according to Bill.

Pilot Program

[nurb432]

Lets hope this spreads among other states too.

We are tax payers, everyone write a NICE letter to their local representatives..

Forget the simple "replace Microsoft.. they suck" angle, this sort of move saves money..

Re:You get what you pay for

[EEBaum]

I gotta agree with you. This is why I eventually let my linux partition deteriorate and die. For a while it was fun, but I found myself falling behind on the maintenance. With all the other stuff I have going on, I simply don't have the time or effort to significantly investigate the workings of the OS, not to mention make it work like I want it to.

I've opted to have one less thing to talk about with great knowledge in computer circles, and I haven't really minded.

The problem, I think, is that open source software wants to have its cake and eat it too. It often goes for raw functionality without usability, with the mentality of "if I can figure it out, so can you!" This is fine, if you want "open-source-types" to use your software, but you really can't complain if Joe User doesn't want to do a significant amount of research before setting up a computer.

It's like modernist composers who write art music very inaccessible to the average listener... sure, it may be an absolutely magnificent piece of music, and I'm not saying you shouldn't write it, and I'm not saying whether it's better or worse than something more common-listener-friendly. However, if you complain that nobody wants to listen to it, you have only yourself to blame.

something for nothing

[hankaholic]

I'd like to see large organizations that realize a quantifiable savings due to the use of OSS contribute a small portion of the savings back to the projects that made it possible.

If using OOooo.oOo could save them 5.2 million, how about a one-time gift of 5% of the annual savings to the project leaders? Saving a net of $4.94 million would still be a huge boost to the budget, and I'm sure that OOooO could benefit quite a bit from a one-time $260k donation.

Re:something for nothing

[cyberfunk2]

I'd like to see the people in charge who save money by using open source get the bonus. Now thats a real incentive not to go w/ the status quo.

If it suddenly becomes finacially incentive for the politicians to consider OSS, you're gonna be damned sure they will.

Re:OpenOffice Access

[ptlis]

Er... Open Office Base perhaps? Included in the OO.o 2 preview releases it seems to be an Access-like front-end for a real RDMS, none of the built-in access bullshit which dies if there are greater than 5 concurrent connections to it.

Well

[simontek2]

I wonder if they will call me. I finally opened my shop. The Open Store www.theopenstore.net

Letting the people decide.

[Thats_Pipe]

Ok, cities around the country are considering Open Source. Are there going to be any sort of vote for whether a city wants to switch? Government is in place for the people and if their money is being thrown away on software that can easily be replaced then I would say most people would be in favor. If it did come down to a vote, I would expect the majority of people to go with the more cost effective solution.

Or pay for mod's you need in an Open Source one.

[khasim]

You're right. But they don't have to pay to write one from scratch.

That's a lot of money to pay for developers to add in any features/functionality that you want but does not exist in OO.org.

Save $2 or $3 million this election cycle and save even more next cycle.

The best thing is, every year you can keep investing in development and still claim that you're saving $$millions$$ in license fees.

And if you hire local programmers, you're also "creating good jobs".

My experience: OO need less support.

[Futurepower(R)]

"maybe has a little less support"

When you have "26,000 desktops", commercial support is not a factor, because you have your own support staff. Also, my experience with Open Office is that the help messages are better and there are fewer serious quirks than Microsoft Word 2000. (I've never tried Office XP because I decided to get off the Microsoft time waste train.)

I'm guessing governments have not adopted Open Office sooner because most government officials did not have enough technical knowledge to feel confident in committing thousands of desktops to something that didn't come from Microsoft. It is "you can't get fired for choosing Microsoft, even if the software doesn't work well".

When someone chooses a software package, they are choosing business partners, because so much staff time is invested in becoming comfortable with software and in using it. Officials are beginning to think about this: Is is sensible to want to be the business partner of a company that has been so adversarial toward its customers, and which produces software of amazingly bad quality?

If you test Open Office, be sure you test the latest version, 1.1.4. Version 2.0 will be available in April or May of this year.

Generally, when you send documents outside your company or organization, it is better to send PDF files. That guards against accidental changes. To make PDF files in Open Office, just click the PDF icon in the toolbar. To do this in Microsoft Word, install additional software.

Re:My experience: OO need less support.

[Jason Earl]

No, comparing OpenOffice.org to past versions of MS Office is just good common sense. If Los Angeles were already on the newest version of MS Office then this wouldn't be an issue, as they would have already spent the $5.2 million. The fact of the matter is that not even half of Microsoft's Office customers are on the newest version.

Los Angeles basically has three choices. They can stick with what they currently are using, they can spend $5.2 million and upgrade to the newest MS Office, or they can migrate to OpenOffice.org and pay the one time migration costs. The fact that the politicos have already tied the upgrade "savings" to an increase in their police force means that they are serious about making the switch. There could be very large political ramifications for the politician that took $5.2 million earmarked for more policemen and spent it on software licenses. That's a very hot-button issue in L.A.

No one is going to argue that OpenOffice.org has as many features as the newest version of MS Office. The question is whether OpenOffice.org is better than the version of MS Office that you happen to be using right now. Throw in the fact that OpenOffice.org means that you no longer have to worry about licensing issues for new PCs and OO.o starts to look like a pretty good deal.

The truly scary part, at least for Microsoft, is that if Los Angeles switches to OO.o then lots of other businesses and communities that deal with Los Angeles (and there are piles of them) are also likely to experiment with OO.o. Everyone has to deal with the government.

What would be news is....

[oliverthered]

if part of the saving went on funding OSS or programmers to help make the OSS more suitable to their needs.

Embrace and extend as the saying goes.

BS: They won't pay $200/desktop for Office.

[LazLong]

I've been involved with negotiations with M$ for a site with 16000 desktops. We didn't pay anywhere NEAR $200/desktop for Office, M$ desktop OS's, CAL's, and TSCAL's. If the article actually has based the savings on a figure of $200, they need to go back and do some fact checking. Else, it's more FUD and sensational journalism.

I don't want to sound like a M$ shill. However, if we fight them with the same BS FUD tactics we are no better than they.

Re:Solution:

[zapadoo]

Training is a big issue; but not the ONLY issue by far.

In a recent former life I built document and workflow management solutions - integrated with "office" applications, as well as with line of business applications (permits, licensing, parks n rec, planning, GIS, etc) - for large municipal governments.

Training was always the second largest cost impact after licensing itself.

Chances are LA uses some form of document mangagement solution (Hummingbird, Open Text, or others) and perhaps even more than one.

Strangely there are no "open source" DMS applications really ready to cut a large scale "desktop" (as opposed to "webtop") deployment, although it frankly would not be that difficult an endeavor to design and write one in this day and age. Quite a lot of the work was all the furtzing about with Microsoft as their products would tend to break integration ever so slightly with every new release.

There is more to it than just putting files under management; larger organizations also have records management rules which need to be followed, the DMS needs to manage these as well, and there are zero, as far as I am aware, open source records classification and retention application with document management capabilities suitable for a large deployment.

Again the metadata management is not terribly complex, but to date its been a rather arcane, boring, business and government-centric requirement that the open source community has not responded to.

I'd love to see an open source solution come out of such a big migration but there may be a chicken/egg scenario with the lack of a DMS / Records Management solution preventing them from moving.

Saving licensing costs on a DM/RM system could pay for an open source solution to be developed. Typical costs for a 1000 seat implementation (software only) tend to run around 200 - 500K depending on options.

And no, Microsoft does not have a Records Management solution and their DM piece is sorely lacking, so they don't have a compelling edge there themselves.

I'd be interested, and am even somewhat qualified, to work on such a project.