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The Future of Linux on Laptops
katie_york writes "CoolTechZone discusses the future of Linux on laptops after HP and Ubuntu's recent announcement. 'What would be even more exciting for Linux is if other OEMs, similar to HP, took the same approach by partnering with selected distributions of consumer friendly Linux and started offering an alternative not only in third world regions, but also in the United States. In addition to that, support for Linux on the desktop side of things would be just as welcomed.'"
"started offering an alternative not only in third world regions, but also in the United States" .. Didn't HP launch it in Europe and South africa ..perhaps im wrong.
I was unaware i lived in a developing nation , such as um the whole of Europe
The only things certain in war are Propaganda and Death. You can never be sure which is which though
through a different, smaller mfg, though. so perhaps when this article states 'like HP' they mean, Dell?
do you have shinyfeet?
What would be great is if everybody started moving to the LSB so that you could use virtually ANY Linux on the hardware. This crap where all you need is a different variation on software packaging and you have a different operating system has GOT to stop.
One thing that you may be overlooking, is that many of these people won't have been windows users, or computer users at all. They'll learn unix and linux just like a windows user learned windows. Experience is the best teacher.
I'm surprised this doesn't draw more attention. I mean it wasn't that long ago that one vendor had MS threaten to withdraw their windows reseller's licence just for offering a machine with no pre-installed OS. I mean we're not even talking about support here - they went ballistic just because someone offered the consumerbase choice.
In fairness, I should say that MS have no objection to vendors offering linux systems. Just so long as they're about three times the price of the wndows equivalent, run on crappt hardware, or are otherwise deeply unappealing. It seems to help the vendor hides the machine away or refuses to admit it exists as well.
Don't let THEM immanentize the Eschaton!
It would seem that the it would make more sense at first to design a desktop that is 100% linux compatible. The vast majority of Linux machines are acting as servers of some sort or are being used by us geeks that are locked in a basement with no windows anyway, and have no reason to be portable. I don't see the average college kid running out to buy a linux machine for school, nor do I see executives deciding to buy linux machines for their traveling businessmen.
You can also get more horsepower for cheaper. I'm sure that are plenty of people that want a Linux laptop, but if I was going to specifically design hardware for linux, I would start with a desktop. I would probably also include the US, but that's another story.
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The problem with linux on laptops is that it is very difficult to find the right drivers for every peice of hardware like the graphic card, the sound card, etc. If HP designs a laptop from the ground up with linux in mind, they can make sure that the parts they choose come with good drivers, or at least froce the manufacturers to provide better drivers.
1. How many true "geeks" run a system "as it is shipped" Im willing to bet most of us reinstall for one reason or another soon as we get the system. Maybe we want a diffrent partition setup? Maybe we want to make sure there are no Vendor installed CPU wasting crap installed.. For what ever reason most geeks reinstall the OS soon as the computer enters there care.
2. I don't want to be limited to what I can run.. I don't want to be "taxed" for software I will never use.
So in the end I really don't care what OS's you offer.. What I want is the ability to order a laptop void of any OS at all!!!
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I disagree, I've been running Ubuntu at home for 6 months now, and I don't have to do anything. When updates are avail, you get a little icon by the clock, you click it, enter your password, and have it install/configure everything; just as Windows does, just as Mac does. While Ubuntu doesn't have all the media stuff installed by default, I think some basic instructions about how to install them via Synaptic would suffice. I just rebuilt my mom's 2.8G Dell - it was "slow" due to her using XP and collecting plenty of spyware and such. It's now an XP / Ubuntu dual boot so she can have an option to play in Linux. Yes, she's mid 60s now, and I've been on Linux for about 7 years. While I loved learning on Slack/Gentoo for my servers (now freebsd) I like not having to do anything to make my desktop work.
So, I think once setup properly (which I'd assume HP would do) Ubuntu is a perfect choice for non-techies to get into Linux on the desktop. For people with Linux exp like me, I love seeing how everything 'just works' after years of battling with apps/libs/kernels to get things just right on the desktop. I've got Ubuntu on my iBook, but would make my next purchase an HP if they bring it here in the US of A (sorry for the war everyone, we're not all brain dead over here...)
bo
bad_outlook
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Is this vague enough for you?
In my opinion, one of the most important aspects of a laptop is how well it enters and leaves sleep mode. Use an Apple laptop for an idea of how close to ideal you can get.
My IBM laptop, an older model, does not sleep well, the battery may last a little longer, but its not dead like an Apple laptop is. Perfect entering and exiting sleep mode, and Linux will get a toe-hold
He asked for examples of how a preinstalled Linux will have problems. In a preinstalled laptop, the wireless card will already be selected to be one that works in Linux and will already be configured.
My Acer 1362WMLi works almost perfectly with Ubuntu as it stands, but guaranteed Linux-compatible hardware would of course be nice!
As for usability issues, lots of people I deal with barely know how to use Windows. However, there's two ways of looking at this -
Either it means a different OS will throw them completely, or they'll have a blank canvas to learn on. I didn't really know how to use Linux effectively three weeks ago but now it is a hugely rare occurance for me to boot into Windows as I'm able to do everything as I could before, well, in fact, in many cases better than I could before and more easily too.
Ubuntu also manages my battery far better than Windows. This is not true across the board however, as I previously used Suse 9.2 Pro, which swallowed my battery life quicker than Windows.
Finding the right tool for the job would appear to be the issue we face, deciding which distro to promote for which type of user might do much to encourage Linux uptake, at least in my opinion.
Chances are they are going to have to choose from a very small list (by comparison to a Windows machine) of upgrades that now work with their version of Linux.
For fuck's sake, why don't you actually try a Linux installation sometime, instead of perpetuating this ridiculous bullshit story of Linux's hardware support "problems." Send it back to HP? Are you on drugs?
Linux has excellent hardware support. There is one major wireless chipset that does not have native support, and thus requires you to use the windows driver through ndiswrapper. There are some winmodems that don't work, or are hard to make work. And there are a few printers yet out there that don't behave.
Now, to put that in perspective, lots of printers won't work with Windows XP. And lots of wireless cards won't work in Windows 9x. Various legacy stuff doesn't work on newer versions, and the number of times you'll need a third-party driver is vastly higher in my experience on Windows than Linux. I've got 3 usb->serial dongles; in XP, they each need a different driver, none of which came with the OS....if you want to use them with XP, you'd better have the CD that they came with. Each one is automatically recognized and assigned a device file when plugged into any modern Linux box. Same story with my Sprint PCS phone's data connection; Linux just recognizes it as an ACM device, and you can use the regular dialup setup. To do that in Windows, you have to find a driver, which is very difficult without buying a $40 outlook-sync program.
The truth of the matter is, more hardware will run on modern Linux than any single version of Windows ever produced. Your post was 100% sheer FUD. And if you disagree, and want to come back here and bitch and moan some more, why don't you start with theorizing at least one upgrade you can think of that a normal user would be able to do himself on Windows, but would have to send the box back to HP to accomplish on Linux. I dare you.
Given a choice between free speech and free beer, most people will take the beer.
Reminds of a story about Americans on a guided tour in Sydney one day.
One of the tourists asked a question about Australia and ended their question with ...compared to other places in the third world?
I suppose Americans, like Australians, are bombarded with news features either about their own country or the "third world" and they can be forgiven for thinking that the third world is everywhere else.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
... HP is launching these notebooks in regions where Windows piracy is high because they can rely on the security of selling them to people that will buy just because they're cheaper, but will eventually install a pirated copy of Windows instead of Ubuntu. Not very promissing for Linux I say. Heck, the bundled FreeDOS even makes this easier...
I disagree. I see more and more people opting for laptops with >=17" screens. These usually have dual drives and whatnot, and wind up being ridiculously powerful email readers. Ain't no way I'm calling a 12lb laptop with a 17" screen a notebook. It's barely a laptop and more like a lower-leg warmer.
-- I have fans? Wow.
HP and no one else should fear Microsoft when it comes to offering choice to their consumers. That they cannot extend this offer to the US, assuming it has to do with MS, is above all in my humble opinion, an acknowledgment of the sad state of American justice and politics and its relationship with corporations.
Just the perception of a third world geek :)
The revolution will not be televised.
All I care about is: will they make suspend/hibernate work on their hardware? Nothing else matters as much on a laptop, but I have never yet seen it running without any problems on any Linux laptop. (I know some people have it running "flawlessly", but I've never seen it, and not having it working makes a laptop much less useful...)