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Astrologer Sues NASA Over Comet Probe
0110011001110101 writes "NASA's mission that sent a space probe smashing into a comet raised more than cosmic dust -- it also brought a lawsuit from a Russian astrologer. 'Bai is seeking damages totaling $300 million -- the approximate equivalent of the mission's cost -- for her "moral sufferings," Izvestia said, citing her lawyer Alexander Molokhov. She earlier told the paper that the experiment would "deform her horoscope." ' "
Obviously at least one Russian citizen has wholeheartedly embraced the US style of democracy.
The NSA: The only part of the US government that actually listens.
Oh, and she didn't see this coming?
It appears the inhabitants of Tempel-1 are lawsuit-happy as well.
>> "What would the robut do? Frame someone!"
I wish NASA would be as cynical as I am in their response. "Are you going to cry about it?" Then proceed to blow chunks out of 10 or 15 more comets, to show them who is boss.
Home of the midwest loser - www.say-10.net
That settles it! I'm going ahead with my lawsuit against slashdot. I've never gotten a first post, and its fucked up my chi.
.
Is this why she's suing? Because, thanks to NASA, she doesn't have any morals, and therefore is absolutely fine with the idea of frivolous lawsuits?
Is this what happened to Jeffrey Vernon Merkey too?
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
A few years ago a psychic in florida sued a MRI facility. Her claim was that the MRI had robbed her of her psychic abilities.
You may be persecuted by American space agencies today, dear Libra. However, despite your "moral sufferings" you will be able to gain great fortune from friends, family, and coworkers. Embrace your lawyers, Libra, for they will save you from the unnatural entropy of the universe caused by space probe crashes!
If this goes through I will counter sue for one billion dollars. The damage to my karma this will cause will be HUGE. I mean it. I will be so mad at this woman that my aura will never be the same. I could end up coming back as a rat or worse fan of Ayn Rand or some other low form of life.
What amount of money would be enough to make up for this eternal setback? A billion would be a good start.
On a more reasonable note. You can sue anyone for anything. It is nothing but a stunt.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Right, because "inane, utterly frivolous lawsuits" never EVER happened in the US so far. Ever.
Je n'ai pas d'avenir Je n'ai qu'un destin Celui de n'être qu'un souvenir C'est pour demain
She earlier told the paper that the experiment would "deform her horoscope."
NASA: Okay - how's about this - we spend all the money required to create a new horoscope, which incorporates the changes we made to the "fabric of the universe", and has just as much predictive power as your old horoscope.
Total price: $0.
Studying astronomy instead of astrology: Priceless.
For bullshit predictions based on the position of the planets at the moment of your birth, there's Madame Marina Bai. For everything else there's NASA.
Education is the silver bullet.
If the Russian court agrees to let this case proceed, it opens the door for all kinds of inane, utterly frivolous lawsuits from astrologers, witch doctors, faith healers, and every other kind of kook out there who wants to make a quick buck by accusing actual scientists of violating some crackpot principle.
On the other hand, it would also show very clearly that there's absolutely no evidence that such crackpot theories are valid. Think about it - this woman stands to gain $300 million if she can show that her particular crackpot theory is valid. If the court case proceeds, and she can't show that astrology works - given some pretty damn big incentive - then perhaps less people will be inclined to believe in astrology.
By the way, what's the deciding factor between whether or not something is a) a crackpot theory, b) a superstition, or c) a religion? Seems to me, the amount of believers and money involved has something to do with it.
A crackpot theory is typically believed by one or two people. Astrology is a cottage industry. And Christianity has a billion believers and stupid amounts of money.
The whole Zodiac system was made up 2000 years ago, on the idea that your 'sign' was the one that the sun rose into on your birthday. At the present time, the Earth has precessed something like 15 degrees, so the sun actually rises 1 sign away from where it originally did. (thanks Bill Nye!)
Fuck these goddamn superstitious idiots anyway, we left the caves a long time ago.
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
Yeah, the next thing you know a bunch of fundamentalist christians will be trying to force through laws to push their form of creationism into public classrooms.
No way, that'll never happen. That's just taking it too far.
On a side note, I have to leave Texas before my children get in to school. I already had my "linux" fish ripped off my car once since I moved here.
The REAL reason they popped that comet, was to improve the Feng-shui of the local celestial neighborhood.
This issue is a bit more complicated than you think.
Nope, not a chance. The publicity would just legitimize astrology. When the suit was finally decided in NASA's favor, believers would just spin it that NASA had better lawyers.
People who believe in astrology don't do so because of logic. They cling to the hope that the universe is not just a giant machine, that they are somehow made unique among humans by their keen intelligence, inside knowledge, and special placement in it.
Raise your children as if you were teaching them to raise your grandchildren, because you are.
The woman is suing the government for depriving her of her ability to make an income in her current profession.
Bullshit.
Changing the course of a celestial body in no way deprives this person of her livelihood. She's supposed to read the movements of the stars, right? Ok, so this was one of them. We, humans, products of the universe, make changes to it just like stars and planets exert their own forces on comets. An astrologer should be reading the movements, not complaining about them being made.
Now, naturally, since she's just making this shit up anyway, what it really amounts to is an increase in her ability to make income; she can call all her clients up and say "You must come in immediately for a new reading, as NASA has just fucked up the heavens." and dupe these poor sons of bitches yet again. And if anybody thinks this lady is up to anything but a (successful) publicity stunt, you're way off base.
Also, in more direct conflict of the parent statement:
1)TFA doesn't say she's suing them for loss-of-business damages, but "moral sufferings" ....you just made that up.
2)300 million? How long would it have taken her to earn that much? Because that's what the damages would be determined by if the cause of action was what you claim. It isn't.
Given a choice between free speech and free beer, most people will take the beer.
She should have seen this turn of events coming.
--
make install -not war
And i do believe they will let the case proceed, as the judge recommended that the astrologer and her defendant find a specialist who would be able to tell whether the experiment caused and increased threat of comet impact. It seems that they are trying to spin the case into a demonstration against the US "solving all problems, scientific ones included, with bombs." (quoting the astrologer herself) Yeah, so it might be absurd, but it seems that in foreign politics, everything goes for the Russians.
Man is a slave because freedom is difficult, whereas slavery is easy.
Ah yes, so now the woman has to show in court that astrology really works -- which she can't, of course. Unfortunately, her answer will be that the fact that it doesn't work validates her claim: NASA changed the universe so that she cannot really predict anything anymore. And of course she will bring in a string of witnesses who will claim that her predictions before this date were faultless.
People who believe in astrology don't do so because of logic.
People who believe in anything that isn't objectively verifiable, do not believe because of logic. This includes religious belief, since it is, by definition, faith-based. Faith is not rational or logical- it is merely a manner in which we choose to structure our worldview.
Nope - but telling people in AIDS-stricken regions that using condoms is a sin... not so cool.
Education is the silver bullet.
Heres a hint. Making up numbers does not legitimize your point. In my experience, but then im from northern florida, the vast majority of the time its someone trying their best to convince me that I am going to hell because im an athiest. IF it were just a matter of "live and let live", that would be FINE. However, the religious zealots are most of the problem (again, from MY experience). I cant remember ever hearing of atheists assaulting religous people's person or property because they had a god sticker on it. However, I see and hear the reverse all the time. Happened to my wife (back when she was just my girlfriend). She had a pro Wicca bumper sticker and some god nut busted her windshield and wrote nasty stuff on her car with a magic marker, stuff along the lines that they should bring back witch burning. Kind and wonderful people, they are.
I've seen astrolgers that don't know me but have written up complete reports about who I am and what I feel, think, and believe -- without ever having met me.
James Randi did an experiment where he handed out horoscopes to a class of (college) students and had them rate how closely they matched reality. Most of the students said the horoscopes were accurate. He then had them swap horoscopes, and they found out that they all had the exact same horoscope. Now, how could ONE horoscope match everyone? Because it was filled with generalities and vague statements, that's how. The students themselves filled in the details where they were missing, and sub-consciously remembered the 'hits' more than the 'misses'.
Now, without knowing the exact circumstances behind your case, I can't tell you for sure that's what happened. Only you can, if you choose to look at what happened objectively.
I've seen people healed by faith healers,
Really? If you can prove that, you might win $1,000,000! Go to www.randi.org for details.
I've met psychics who can vividly describe situations and people that later become part of my life.
I sense a... man, or maybe a woman. He is tall, maybe short. BLond hair, maybe brown or black. You'll like this person, or maybe hate them.
How'd I do??
And before you start talking about "cold reading", I have a solid background in psychology, and did not give these people a chance to meet me or be exposed to me to cold read me.
You may "have a solid background in psychology", but you don't understand what 'cold reading' is. Cold reading does NOT depend on meeting the victim before hand, or even knowing anything about them before hand. That would be 'hot reading'.
From Wikipedia: "Generally, the cold reader will make a series of vague statements, will observe the subject's reactions, and then will refine the original statements according to those reactions"..."even without prior knowledge of a person, a psychic could still obtain a great deal of his subject's history by carefully analysing his or her look and other background information, such as gender, religion, race, education level and place of origin."
So, let's apply Occams Razor. Either there are people in this world who can 'speak to spirits', 'read minds', and have other paranormal powers (but choose to eke out a living reading palms instead of, say, getting the winnign lottery numbers). OR, there are people in this world who are frauds. Fakers. Con men.
WHich is more likely?
Yes. I live in KS and the media royally screwed up reporting on what really happened. The Board of Education simply stated that teachers are "allowed" to offer alternatives to evolution. They were never forced to do so and evolution was never removed from the curriculum. In fact, the ruling had little affect outside of allowing teachers to critique evolution if they so chose.
Scientology, my friend, sciencefictionology...
Maybe it isn't wildly successfull among the people, but it seems to attract som wildly successfull people.
I choose to remain celibate, like my father and his father before him.
Today's Sesame Street was brought to you by the number e.
It's not just the Christians. Those who believe in the FSM want their theories put into classrooms too.
William of Ockham had no beard. The most likely explanation is that it was chewed off by squirrels every morning.
Look at your trunk lid again. No fish, right? Look closely. See that salamander? Yes, that one, next to the keyhole. The fish was not stolen. It merely evolved.
Where were you when the voynix came?
My understanding of the KS debate was whether to explicitly deny that no form of creation other than evolution was possible or not.
Bad understanding.
Evolution theories are NOT creation theories. Whether current scientific theories of the evolutionary processes are complete and/or 100% correct is one thing. Feeling the need to say that, because the science is incomplete, creation dogmas might be valid is quite another thing.
https://app.box.com/WitthoftResume Code: https://github.com/cellocgw
Here are some of the facts involved in the famous McDonald's coffee lawsuit. That particular lawsuit was not an example of a frivolous lawsuit; there are plenty of others, but that isn't one.
Liberty in your lifetime
In an unprecedented prank, NASA engineers sent capsule with astrologer and her lawyer towards Mercury. Her parents sued over the suffering endured by her daughter while sharing the tiny capsule with a lawyer. "Ok, I must admit that part was not nice", said a nerdy NASA engineer. Oddly enough, this "astral trip" was part of a previous settlement...
Keep in mind that they have a special "Celebrity" branch whose members are treated to a completely different experience than the regular rank & file...
Surrounded by atheist barbarians who want to force their children into gay marriages, perform mandatory abortions on their pregnant daughters and burn all bibles in the libraries. You can never stop watching for those barbarians, else you will wake up to find 24 hours porn programming on all TV stations. With a bare-breasted Janet Jackson doing the weather.
Ah, sort of like slashdotters ;-)
Loose lips lose spit.
Hmm... What do you call it when you are warned that your coffee is dangerously hot by the state safety officials but you decide to go ahead and do it anyway because it allows you to squeeze out more juice per grind?
Negligence maybe?
So, on average each customer burned himself 70 times on the same cup of coffee? Damn...
^]:wq!^M
IN COMMUNIST RUSSIA, THE COMMET SMASHES-
Dear god, I can't go through with it. The one place where the stupid joke might actually belong, too.
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
>> Like quarks ... where's the objective verification
In the Large Hadron Collider you will find the answer. Here or here or a more wider search
>>What about the hadron boot-strap? Branes?
Not sure what you mean about boot-strap, but as for the Hadron family, look for..."Large Hadron Collider"
You may not SEE them, but evidences are conclusive enough. When experiences match theory closely, it holds proof of existence.
>Branes
Branes..ah! Branes...Wait for the next version of the LHC. We'll know if it's just theory or not in a few years, so hold your breath! Even more! The Higgs boson might give up to the LHC and show up at last (he's the one supposedly responsible for giving its mass to a particle - so it's somewhat a big deal). And the nice thing is that, since it's theory (again), we'll soon be fixed on wherever it exists or not. If not, other theories will try to explain mass and will be tested. Until we find out.
>>I think we take a lot on faith without realising it. Much of that is based on someone elses faith too!
That is where your mistake is. Science is not faith-based but fact-based. Faith has no room in the scientific process. Confidence in one's experiments or theory is only confidence and has to be tested to be considered valid.
>>And I don't see Occam's razor as being a logical method.
The Occam's razor is not a method for conducting science, it is a simple thought and a guidance as to where to look at: the most simplest explanation is the first you should consider. It assumes (generally rightfully) that nature takes the shortest paths. As do humans. But again, it is not a method - at all.
It is not banned in TX wholesale. My understanding, which is not complete as I don't have kids yet, is that each "ISD" (Independent School District?) has the power to set its own curriculum. Mine seems to teach both, I find this to be a horrible failure in society (that and the fact that PE is taught more rigorously than math, at least here). Creationism is not science, period.
I'm finding there are 2 types of Texans, one I dislike a lot, and the other I like a lot. The neo-con lunatic is the kind I can't abide, but I'm finding these are not natives, they seem to be imported. The other kind of Texan is the gun toting, fuck government, don't tax me, if-I-want-to-kill-myself-being-stupid-let-me kind. I like them a lot and I did not find this in either California or anywhere in the north east.
And yet a significant proportion of the students said that the horoscope matched them. This is the entire point - that it wasn't a genuine horoscope, but people believed it fit them. It was written in horoscope style - full of vague waffle that could fit just about anyone. And of course people will generally remember the hits and ignore the misses. It's just human nature - and professional con-artists are very well aware of how to take advantage of human nature.
Wow. Just.... wow.
And you seriously just accept that? The notion that, for a very small expenditure of time on their part, they could walk away with one million dollars.... one million dollars that they could donate to any charity in the world (if they weren't interested in the money themselves)... and yet they say they're not interested?
Bullshit. Sheer undiluted bullshit.
Oh, and by the way - I can turn invisible and fly through the air. I just don't feel like demonstrating it to anyone, not even for money. You see, money's not that important to me, so that's why I make my living working an eight-to-six office job. So... what do you mean, I'm talking crap?? Don't be so close-minded!
Just out of interest, why don't you ask your psychic pals exactly how much money would have to be offered to make it worth their while? Ten million? A hundred million? A billion? Ten billion? If they just keep saying that "it's not worth their effort"... at some point you just have to realise that it's bullshit.
If I could earn (cue Dr Evil voice) "one meeeellion dollars" simply by demonstrating an ability I possess, you can bloody well be certain that I'd do it.
The reason your "psychic" acquaintances don't take up the Randi challenge is because they know it's incredibly unlikely that they'd pass, and it'd be an embarrassing waste of time for them... though I suspect the embarrassment factor would be the biggest component.
Pot, meet kettle.
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." -- Philip K. Dick.
If your psychic acquaintances had any genuine abilities, they shouldn't disappear just because they're faced with a sceptic. The reality is that very few "psychics" have enough faith in their own abilities to put them to a genuine test.
The sad thing about sick minds is that they can pervert any belief system. That's not the fault of the belief system, that's the fault of the minds.
"He who would learn astronomy, and other recondite arts, let him go elsewhere. " -- John Calvin, commenting on Genesis 1
The coffee spilled while she was removing the lid, as a passenger in a stopped car, in an attempt to add cream and sugar -- something very common among coffee drinkers. While many jurors did not originally feel that the case was warranted, after seeing the evidence, they were particularly struck by McDonald's callousness in the case. The plaintiff received third-degree burns on 6% of her body as a consequence of the spilled coffee and initally requested compensation for her medical bills, which for such extensive burns are significant. McDonald's knew that the risk existed, as they served their coffee very hot. They'd seen cases of this happening before (from first to third degree burns), settling out of court but not changing their policies.
As a long-time coffee drinker, I frequently have a cup of coffee in the car. It spills. But third-degree burns are not part of any rational person's expectations of the consequences of spilled coffee. If you're going to serve something that carries that sort of danger -- one beyond normal expectations for the product -- to a place where it's well-known that spills will occur, at the very least there should be clear warnings. Maybe you disagree, but twelve people who actually listed to all the facts (and were not predisposed one way or the other) didn't.
Of course, now you often can't get McDonald's coffee that's hot enough and they put warnings on their cups, which isn't necessary (though to do otherwise may make them guilty of not protecting their stockholders). So it seems silly in retrospect, as the beverage is just as hot as you'd expect, but with warnings. Still, warnings never hurt anyone.