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Therapists use Virtual Reality for Veterans
ahoehn writes "NPR is reporting that researchers from the University of Southern California along with the Office of Naval Research are simulating combat situations which cause Post Traumatic Stress Disorder for theraputic purposes. Their immersive virtual reality technique seems to consist of the game Full Spectrum Warrior, headphones, and a set of VR goggles. From the article: 'The object is to help veterans come to terms with what they've experienced in places like Iraq and Afghanistan by immersing vets in the sights and sounds of those theaters of battle.'
One can only assume that soon someone be reforming carjackers by letting them play the GTA."
I'd think that this technology would be more useful as a training tool, to help new soldiers learn what to expect in combat. Also, couldn't this be used as a physological filter, to identify those most likely to come down with Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder in the first place?
No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. - Winston Churchill
. . . for pervs in hawaian shirts?
Therapists use Virtual Reality for Veterans
Did anyone else read this "the rapists use virtual reality for veterans" ?
Because reforming someone and treating them for PTS is entirely in the same ball park.
One can only assume that soon someone be reforming carjackers by letting them play the GTA.
Obviously, this should've been "soon someone done be reforming". Pft.. these posters need to learn English.
Therapists using this for pedophiles?
im sure it will be tried at some point, somewhere... And claimed to be 'theraputic'.
One bit I worry is that we will be condemming our troops to Nintendo Wars, programming robot killers who return to home unbalanced. The GTA Defense may actually be real in 10 years.
Sorry about the writing. Robot fingers, you know? Cliff Steele in DOOM PATROL #23
One can only assume that soon someone be reforming carjackers by letting them play the GTA.
Because, as everyone knows, a criminal hijacking cars results in the same trauma that soldier experiences when his humvee is blown up.
I can't believe someone could even equate the "thrill" of performing a criminal act with the trauma of war.
The psychologists are trying to help the soldiers understand why they act and react the way they do after a traumatic event. One Mash episode scratches the surface of this type of therapy. A doctor experiences something which seems ordinary in the daily life of a soldier, but he later tries to prevent another physician from administering gas anesthesia to a patient in need of surgery. During therapy the doctor comes to realize the the "ordinary" experience was actually a mother smothering her child to prevent the nearby enemy from finding the group's location.
A PTSD soldier desires a normal life.
-Adam
Good job trying to patronize treatment that could help people whom selflessly risked their lives (even if you agree with it or not) to help protect your country and you. Your little GTA comment was completely unneccesary.
One can only assume that soon someone be reforming carjackers by letting them play the GTA.
This is a cheap shop that vividly reveals the author's ignorance.
In the first place, there is an enormous moral difference between carjacking and attempting to kill and capture, for example terrorists in Afganistan.
Moreover, PTSS is a *real* issue. People going to war see unpleasant things, and dealing with that may be difficult. The intention is not to get them to feel bad about what they did, but to adjust to life where getting shot at is not an issue.
Scuttlemonkey should be ashamed.
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I thought video games CAUSED violent behavior?
...now I just don't know what to believe...
By the time you've rhymed one line, I've already busted ten; You rap in exponential time and I'm big-O of log(n).
I'm a disabled veteran and have struggled to come to terms with what I've been through during two deployments. I expect an apology from you and Slashdot in general for posting such a demeaning thing about those who've tried to protect their countries.
Sure we could use this on criminals. Just give them a little shock when they're naughty. And it'll be just like that Clockwork Orange business where this idea worked great.
Think about how much bigger the post traumatic stress load must be on the other side(s) of this war, that takes 10 - 100 times as high casualities, and presumably has very few therapy options available.
I don't know much about PST, but I can't think it will manifest itself in ways that are good for anyone.
Why are they doing this? The soldiers knew what they were getting into when they signed up, they knew the risks. If they felt they couldn't handle the stresses of war then they shouldn't have signed up.
... such as replacing human therapists with computers.
... where to begin, so many horrors to choose from. So show some fucking respect for vets, okay?
The army needs all the soldiers it can get. Recruitment numbers are not good. Stop-loss orders are in effect. Perhaps AWOLs are up, I'm not sure.
In any case, the army has a basic interest in keeping soldiers in fighting trim. If videogame therapy helps return a soldier to the battlefield, that's a good thing for the army. Second best, returning a soldier to a non-combat support task. Failing that, finding a way to lower VA costs
Just a thought -- I'm not army myself, not really qualified.
I must say, too, that there are some profoundly insensitive posts in this thread. Don't talk to me about Wasting Taxpayer Money on vets. I don't happen to support the Iraq wars, but goddamit, soldiers keep getting fucked by their superiors, war after war. World War One: bonus marchers. World War Two, Korea: post-war bomb testing, irradiated vets, cancer, official denial. Vietnam
-kgj
-kgj
I really hope that Full Spectrum Warrior is a better theraputic tool than it is a video game.
-B
Something none of the military brass like to talk about... PTSD, overwhelmingly, debilitates soldiers who have personally killed people. "Combat stress" -- from being shot at -- is incidental by comparison. The ones ordered to slaughter unarmed civilians, particularly women and children, get it worst. (Bomber pilots and artillery specialists do the most of that, but find it easiest to pretend; they don't usually see their victims fall.) Those who think honestly know draftees are really no different from civilians. Soldiers who "only" had their legs blown off get off easy, again by comparison.
My father used to call Viet Nam vets with PTSD crybabies. I asked him if he (as a Naval officer, earlier) had ever been obliged to kill anybody. He must have thought it over carefully, because I never heard him criticize a vet after that.
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Actually the difference is that soldiers (unlike even police officers and firefighters) work for the federal government as instruments of American political will. A police officer works for the city of Phoenix, and a firefighter works for Westchester County, but a soldier puts his life on the line on behalf of every American.
When a police officer saves a life or kills a criminal and gets a medal, he is recognized for the effort he has made on behalf of his community. When a soldier receives such recognition, it is for acts on behalf of the entire nation.
Also, there is a critical difference in that soldiers are called up on to kill people. That's not something that might come up in their jobs, it is at the core of their jobs. They are asked to do the very thing that society teaches us all not to do. The recognition that veterans receive is largely because soldiers not only take risks, but they are made to kill.
They are the proxies for you and me and John Kerry and George Bush. Whether you support the war or not, the soldiers are still killing and dying because our representative government sent them to do that job on behalf of all of us.
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Sights and sounds aren't enough, I don't think. The sense most strongly liked to memory is the sense of smell. I by no means have PTSD like a lot of these guys do (I never came under direct fire, just had to worry about mines and unexploded ordinance mostly), but the smell of diesel exhaust or bug repellant still make me feel distinctly twitchy. I used to also get nervous seeing war movies, but after a couple years I was able to watch 'em fine without feeling like flipping out. But even to this day, driving behind a school bus if I catch a whiff of that diesel, my stomach tightens up.
If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
Then reality comes by and smacks them upside the head. Some come to, others suddenly find a new belief in war is wrong, this war is wrong et al, anything to deny their obligations that they took so lightly when they enlisted.
Back on subject, most soldiers end up having no problems, they adjust to what they have to do and need to do. The killing, the maiming, the friends dying or losing limbs. See a man holding his intestines in his hands, thoughtlessly trying to put them back in, or another cradling his just blown off leg.
Some disconnect from these. Others have a harder time disconnecting. I can see playing a violent game can help people disconnect. Help them overcome the guilt they often feel from surviving where others died horrible deaths.
Or any sort of combat situation. The closest I've come is when an arsehole tried to mug me - broke my nose but didn't get anything so I wasn't even a little bit stressed by it.
Now, don't automatically dismiss my next thoughts because of that though. I'd like to try and say a few things and hopefully get my point across clearly.
Firstly, War is Hell. There is no doubt about that. To take a man - and I say that as a general sexless term - and put them in a situation where they could, at any moment, suddenly be dead, can not be good for their nerves in the first place.
Imagine being on a camping trip with your buddies. You've had a few beers, caught a couple of fish, and are generally relaxing around the camp fire while waving off the odd mosquito and keeping warm in your goretex (or whatever) jacket.
"The mosquitos seem a bit heavy tonight." says one of your friends as you hear a particularly loud whining noise, and then his face is half-gone and he's dead.
There's no thoughts that come of something like that. It's just "flight or fight" time. You can run, or you can kiss the dirt and crawl into your tent.
Your goretex jacket is suddenly army greens. The mosquitos crack through the air. People are shouting directions, orders, for medical help, and just generally screaming in pain. Your fishing pole has become a large calibre, semi-automatic weapon, hard to tell if it's loaded or even what the exact calibre is in the bad light from the fire and with dirt on your hands. The tent is a fox hole or low trench with a shitty green tarp overhead.
It's hard to think, to see clearly. You're scared - scared of dying, scared of living in pain, scared of ending up alone, scared of getting captured. There's the smell of mud, burning wood, maybe blood. At any moment a grenade might drop in and remove a limb if it doesn't kill you right away.
And this, why you're out here, is because some guy in another country had decided that his piece of land wasn't big enough, or because he had to show "johnny foreigner" who's the boss.
You're probably not even in your own country, defending it against invaders.
"What the fuck am I doing here? What's going on up top? Why did I ever join? Will I ever see my wife again? Was that Hank that just screamed? Oh God I don't want to be here!"
I don't know if this is a quote or a paraphrase from someone else but someone'll probably say it one day - "Those who would make war, would not if they had to fight it."
I don't agree with war in general. I think it lost most of it's honour and principles of necessity when kings stopped going into battle with their soldiers. At the same time though I do feel sympathy for those who've been through war. I can only imagine in a small and pathetic way, like above, what it's like to be in the middle of a battle.
If this new approach, using VR to confront and wear away the affects of Shell Shock, can work, I hope it get used and helps all those that fought in wars and came out broken. I hope they can rebuild their minds and put them to use in a new, and productive endeavour, remembering without terror what they once went through so they can hopefully dissuade the next generation from joining up the "defense" forces.
There shouldn't be war any more. Our final act in the military should be to disband it as a fighting unit, gather up all the veterans with shell shock, and try to heal them.
International commerce and the almighty dollar is the new weapon in our information age. Maybe when this time is over and we're scrabbling for the bits after a societal collapse we'll need to fight again, but now, there is no need for it.
If a man is terrorising a society, take out that man. If a dictator is harming his people and they've cried out for help, take out that dictator. We have the technology today, when used correctly, to end wars before they even start.
Idealistic and naive, maybe, but I'd like to at least dream that we won't all end up one day completely fucked because of some scared little egomaniac sitting in an irregularly shaped office barking orders into a phone. Maybe if they had to fight, we wouldn't.
His name is Robert Paulsen...
The government is representative of its citizenry as a whole. It is certainly does not represent me specifically, given that I'm opposed to much of what it does on my behalf. But just because I don't agree with its current policies or leadership doesn't mean that it is not a lawful or representative government. Soldiers don't have the luxury of deciding not to obey the government when they feel it doesn't represent their interests.
2. lots of police are federal employees. ever heard of park rangers? the FBI? border patrol?
Sure. They get medals and awards and other special recognition, as soliders do. Generally they get it when they put their lives on the line.
3. police have to kill sometimes too. its part of their training. but they do it in a legal system, where they have to pay if they kill innocent people.
Agreed. Aside from those in federal employ, they are not being called to do so on behalf of the entire nation. Soldiers operate in a legal framework, but the parameters of that framework are determined by their civilian leadership, as we've seen in Iraq. As I mentioned earlier, soldiers are called upon to kill, in many cases in morally ambiguous circumstances. That makes their sacrifice exceptional, because they have to live with the consequences of that killing long after they are out of the combat zone.
4. if u are a proper right wing nutjob, then doctors who do abortions are also 'trained to kill' on behalf of 'society' and representative government. im still trying to figure out why soldiers are 'different'.
Doctors who perform abortions are acting on behalf of individuals, not society as a whole. When a doctor performs an abortion, they're doing it for one woman.
I'm not suggesting that you should value soldiers any more than you value a UPS driver, the bum on the street corner, your physics professor, or you dentist. But there are reasons why society as a whole treats soldiers differently.
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