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Guido Goes Google
revividus writes "It seems that Python creator Guido van Rossum has received an offer from Google, and accepted it. Here is also some confirmation."
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That's great. I'm moving all of my scripts to Python now. If the guy's name is Guido, it's gotta be good!
hello dear sirs my name is jamesh i are india (bihar) can u guide me install red had linux 9?
well, let's hope the dupe has more info than those two lines.
...the only thing I can think of when I hear the name Guido is Tom Cruise driving a Porsche and being chased by a pimp.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
I really do think it has been hampered by having a less rigorously standardized basic class library than Java or .NET. It would be great to see Python get some better documentation tools as well so that it'd be easy to generate documentation on par with the Java and .NET documentation.
:)
And of course if Google wanted to really screw with both Sun and Microsoft, especially Microsoft, they could create their own cross-platform web and gui toolkits and a free RAD GUI builder a la Visual Studio for Python. If they could create a Python framework on par with Swing or Windows Forms, there'd be quite a bit of wailing and gnashing of teeth in both camps
Click here or a puppy gets stomped!
An offer you can't refuse
I thought it was funny...it was worth the time to read it anyway.
Everyone seems to assume that his main purpose with Google is to do Python.
I'm not saying that assumption is not true. It's just that he is a huge talent. If I had a gargantuan project to run, I'd hire him no matter what the language.
I wonder if the management types have figured out that anyone who can create and run a large successful open source project is a much better manager than the average MBA.
So... Since Guido got an offer and Larry Wall didn't, does that mean that Google has tipped its hand in the debate?
If brevity is the soul of wit, then how does one explain Twitter?
I imagine Google is prepared to use whatever language is appropriate for a project.
I rarely criticize things I don't care about.
Here he is in revenge of the nerds:9
http://sunsite.uakom.sk/sunworldonline/swol-02-19
2 years and no mod points. Join reddit. Because openness is good.
Maybe all the hype around Java did disappear. This is what you get when drinking decaf.
The winning offer was the one that had first-line indented paragraphs.
We just love a guy that gets so wrapped up in his work!
We've got penguins, we've got pythons, and we've got a lemur with a minigun...this zoo rocks!
After hearing the report, Ballmer threw a Hissssy fit.
Someone reported a problem with a mouse at Google Central and the recruiter got to work on hiring the python guy.
With a keen eye on competition, Google is just trying to catch up to the number of reptiles employed by Microsoft.
So is google becoming the new Xerox Parc?
In L&S's "Anatomy of a search engine article" they wrote:
In order to scale to hundreds of millions of web pages, Google has a fast distributed crawling system. A single URLserver serves lists of URLs to a number of crawlers (we typically ran about 3). Both the URLserver and the crawlers are implemented in Python
http://www-db.stanford.edu/~backrub/google.html
A way of returning a favor, perhaps?
He's back! In programming language form!
Google offers new jobs to both Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer.. then again.. just give me a job instead.. plz?
/. is good for you.
By hiring Guido, they are clearly stating that there's only one way to do it. And that way is, of course, with Python.
Yes, I see a Google search for 'perl' now has a transcript of Monty Python's Parrot sketch as the first hit.
Web, Search: pr0n
Google: No results found.
Search: Is there someone else up there we could talk to?
Google: No, now go away before I taunt you a second time.
In case you missed it, the point of this post is that no matter how many times we repeat something on Slashdot, that doesn't make it a undeniable fact. Yes, it's completely offtopic and it was modded fairly, but it's still a good read.
Bored? Browse Slashdot with a +6 modifier for Troll comme
lollerbiscuits indeed
His Wikipedia entry is already updated with the information:
;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guido_van_Rossum
At first, I thought somebody was playing a prank.
Considering that last year google hired some of the main Java language guys (which still do talks about Java) last year; Joshua Bloch and Neal Gafter). Their background is mainly language/compiler design, my impression was and still is that I wouldn't be surprised if google was just working on their own (new) language. This just confirms this a little bit more ...
- sigs are for wimps.
Google is powered by python so having its creator on the payroll will rock.
Yes!! Finally we are gonna see web-enabled ABC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABC_programming_langu age/!
While Perl is still my sentimental favorite, I'm open-minded about programming languages, especially those that are as widely used as Python. I've never been able to really understand Python, though, because of its bizarre syntax. (insert Perl syntax joke here) It's always seemed easier to just do what I need to do in Perl, since I know it so well.
If I'm reasonably proficient in Perl, what would I gain by using Python instead? I'm not trying to troll here, I'm just wondering what I'm missing. If Google uses it internally it must have an advantage over other languages, but I've never not been able to do something in Perl if I really wanted to.
google.py: import Guido
The confirmation refers back to the original announcement. It isn't independent confirmation so I don't see how it bolsters the argument.
Not that I doubt Guido was hired by Google, but couldn't some reporter phone him up?
Let me first say that I love Python. I find that dynamic typing makes it easier as a developer and saves time. However, on projects where there are multiple developers and maintainers, is dynamic typing a hindrance? I suppose it comes down to if you document thoroughly what comes in and out of a function/class. Anyone have any thoughts on this? I'm curious
Then I realized it would be pretty cool to work for Google. Time to sharpen those Python skills...
-Rob
Biblical fiscal responsibility
Best. Post. Ever.
Whom ever modded this off-topic has a near terminal lack of breadth of vision.
Say bad words about my book, in cold oatmeal, or I shall sue!
It might be nice to see some of the Guido python style in Google's future software though.
absolutely.
Often times it's only required to rewrite the most crucial bits of an app. This is fairly straightforward in Python.
A very interesting project that aims to create a faster Python implementation is PyPy, funded by the EU, by google (with Summer of Code) and by a lot of programmers that donate their own time.
Even the Psyco guys say that the future is in PyPy!
There's a hidden treasure in Python 3.x: __prepare__()
I see Google on a slow steady track to gaining a Monopoly.
Step 1: Undermine all current Monopolies with "Free" products paid for by advertising.
Step 2: ???
Step 3: Monopoly!
Cheesy Movie Night
some people just don't 'get it.'
Xerox is the best example of people who give away the store trying to sell the butt wad to their customers.
They were so focused on selling photocopiers that any idea presented to them had to be couched in terms that they could understand. (Their 'selling seminars' were also, in my opinion, tissues of lies because the product sold itself, in spite of what those Bozos were spewing. When they got some competition the company just folded until the got some management who hadn't 'drunk the kool-aid'.)
PCs GUIs and laser printers were beyond their ability to comprehend them that it was useless to even try.
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ALF_programming_langu age
AJAX is working for Google fairly well right now, but it's probably not an end-all answer. Javascript is fine for writing small apps, but it's not that great of a language. And even with the distance diminishing between browsers, it's still a pain to write cross-browser code. One of the great accomplishments I've seen of javascript (besides maps.google) is the FCK editor, but even that can be slow, and takes large amounts of memory.
Looking ahead, I suspect Google knows that Javascript will eventually have to dumped. M$ already has an answer, .net. They have their browser, and they can afford not to have to worry about being cross-platform.
In the end, the web browser is not a great for doing things besides browsing the web. On top of that, with EOLAs legal suit against embedded applications, full fledged internet apps seem to be the only way to go. If Google is to survive, they need the tools and framework in order to deploy such apps.
Google goes Greedo.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
For the curious......
The Zen of Python (by Tim Peters)
Beautiful is better than ugly.
Explicit is better than implicit.
Simple is better than complex.
Complex is better than complicated.
Flat is better than nested.
Sparse is better than dense.
Readability counts.
Special cases aren't special enough to break the rules.
Although practicality beats purity.
Errors should never pass silently.
Unless explicitly silenced.
In the face of ambiguity, refuse the temptation to guess.
There should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it.
Although that way may not be obvious at first unless you're Dutch.
Now is better than never.
Although never is often better than *right* now.
If the implementation is hard to explain, it's a bad idea.
If the implementation is easy to explain, it may be a good idea.
Namespaces are one honking great idea -- let's do more of those!
SO Funny! naming a language off a lame british tv show. Damn, that is so cool. I got it, I'll create a new language and call it Alf.
Stupid nerds.
Well... Some Mothers do 'Ave 'Em.
"I'm not impatient. I just hate waiting." - My Dad
Then again you're an idiot for posting FP messages...
Bitter? Party of one?
I like weave but I am waiting to see what will come out of the PyPy project - the author is the one who wrote Psyco (the JIT compiler for Python).
Then there is Pyrex where Python can manipulate C data with language extensions, as opposed to weave where C code is inlined into the python code and Python data is manipulated in C.
It is true that as a scripting language Python is slower than (byte)compiled languages. But it is slower by a constant factor. In other words people would say "Your Python solution is 4x slower than my Java solution!". What this means though is that just by upgrading the hardware that Python runs on, one can reach the speed of execution of the compiled program. In other words Python on an Athlon 64 fx 57 might run faster than java bytecode on a 1Ghz Athlon, or might even run faster than C on a 100Mhz machine (I am just making these numbers up, maybe someone knows of some benchmarks?). The point is that application that required C 15-20 years ago can probably be re-written in Python now.
Hmm Python's garbage collection...I dunno about that.
Its nice to be important but its more important to be nice
Now they just need Gigli.
https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere
'Flying chairs', coded by Steve 'monkey' Balmer.
Step 1) Develop several important and useful programming languages.
Step 2) ????
Step 3) Profit!
Unfortunately I think my languages are just too powerful for Google, really. I'm not sure they can handle them. That must be why they haven't called me yet...
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
I once rigged IE to run client side PHP scripts. Worked flawlessly.
If they went for cubed instead of squared, shouldn't it just have fizzled, giving out c times less energy, instead of blown up?
Send email from the afterlife! Write your e-will at Dead Man's Switch.
In soviet russia Python googles beowoulf clusters on Linux!
But seriously. Why is google hiring the head of python? It seems very interesting. The speculation that they are creating a language is an interesting idea. However it seems very unlikely in my opinion. I mean why create a new language?
Google is moving at a very rapid pace and I don't think it can sustain this level of activity for a very long time. But then I don't know what there management setup is like. If they have flattened it like a startup.
Lets see what happens.
Charles Wyble System Engineer
In the interpreter, do:
>>> import this
Send email from the afterlife! Write your e-will at Dead Man's Switch.
"Googley greedoly woo" just doesn't have the same feel to it.
You can hold down the "B" button for continuous firing.
Does Google know something I don't know?
Hmm. I'm glad Google is providing opportunities for so many worthy people. But, from what I've heard, it's an intensely secretive atmosphere with little publicizing of work outside your own group. For that matter, my impression has been that unlike most large tech companies, Google doesn't like to work with universities -- they prefer to just hire the best faculty outright rather than collaborate.
I'm reminded of the Microsoft Research brain-drain from a few years ago, when everyone was paranoid about what MSR was doing to universities. They gobbled up dozens upon dozens of top academics, and then . . . well, we haven't heard much from them since. Google is now doing the same thing to the open source community, to who knows what effect.
Google will be exhibiting at SCALE 4x this year.
did he update that himself?
I am unique, just like you, and you, and you...
One line?
... course I'm totally high, so what would I know? Lemur with a minigun was what finally drew out that laugh you can't stop fast enough.
That shit reads funny as hell as a paragraph!!
Specifically: What can a Java programmer do that a Python programmer cannot?
I suspect the answer lies in the libraries -- Java has standard GUIs and lots of libraries for doing damn near everything. But the verbosity! I cringe every time I start a new Java project.
I tried Python/Jyton for a bit and indeed did get used to the white space thing. The classes seemed weird beyond belief: __foobar__ just sucks as does explict self reference for all instance variables. But again, I suspect I can get used to it.
Anyhoo .. any insights into limits from a Java point of view?
Those creatures contributing code to your project ... they're called people. Although I haven't contributed to Python, it seems reasonable to assume that he has managed people quite well. I agree that what most people think of as management is pretty grindingly not fun. I'd still hire him to run a major project and insulate him from all the functions that look like management. He wouldn't feel like he was managing and nobody would feel that they were being managed by him and yet the results would be excellent.
#google strategy
while(stock > 400):
for company in buyoutlist:
company.purchase()
spend_money()
for phd in smart_people_list:
phd.hire()
release_cool_google_tool()
(might be syntax errors in this, I work with so many languages I get confused myself)
`... Python get some better
documentation tools as well so that
it'd be easy to generate documentation
on par with the Java and
documentation.
I make this same mistake everytime I program in python. If you dont read the docs [1] & other peoples code you can write functional code, but with a third to a half bloat penalty. That is of course unless you read lots of example code or the docs...
So check again. Because PyDoc [2] is a tool that displays the documentation, from the source. It is pretty much on par with Java and
Reference
[1] google on `PyDoc the module`, `look for Ka-Ping Yee and PyDoc`:
http://www.google.com/search?q=pydoc
[Accessed Friday, 23 December 2005]
[2] PyDoc, `The python documentation module by Ka-Ping Yee and PyDoc`:
http://del.icio.us/goon/pydoc
[Accessed Friday, 23 December 2005]
peterrenshaw ~ Another Scrappy Startup
Good thing Google didn't go guido...
Google: "Certainly! What kind of pr0n would you like to see?"
"How about some lesbian three-ways?"
"I'm afraid we're fresh out of those."
"Well, no matter, how are you on bukake?"
"We never have bukake at the end of the week."
"Tish! Well, then, some face-sitting, please."
"Normally say 'yes'...today, their camera broke down."
"Not my lucky day, is it? Bondage?"
"Nope."
"Balloons?"
"Nope."
"Paris Hilton?"
"Oooohh, we've been out for a week, was expecting it today."
You can minimise this problem by having strict naming conventions for variables, objects, methods etc that give hints to type and scope. For example:
Then just make sure that any explicit casting ends with assignment to an appropriately named thing, e.g lfAmount = (float) aiAmount + Math.PI
And you can confim that conventions are being adhered to by running completed source files through a script full of arcane regular expressions. Hours of fun! Or use a strongly typed language.
Vino, gyno, and techno -Bruce Sterling
1. Guido announces changes to python.
2. Google uses lots of python.
3. Google thinks best way to remain compatible.
4. Google hires Guido to find best way to make all Google python code compatible to future versions.
5. Guido announces changes to python.
Perhaps not exacly like this, but I think hiring Guido to google is going to stabilize python atleast that much that future versions of python won't break the entire python based code base of Google.
Emacs is good operating system, but it has one flaw: Its text editor could be better.
I strongly suspect that the reason is that what Python loses in having a compiler idiot-check things, it more than gains back in sheer readability. In other words, it's useful when editing someone else's code to have a compiler check that all arguments are present an accounted for; it's more useful to have your time-to-understand what you're editing in the first place halved.
(I'm currently the 3rd maintainer of a large body of Python code, and I used to work as a Java programmer. I've also taken over as lead of open source projects started by others, in both languages. I prefer Python.)
In the thread Greg Stein says:
:)
And we have a couple other ideas on how to help the open source
community. We're working on it!
Does that mean google will add a sourceforge like source managament to their arsenal?
Somehow I'm not surprised...
Wonder what the future plans are?
p2p system? IM service? ntp servers? anon ftp servers? mirror of the entire current net? internet2?
1 Earth is warming, 2 It's us, 3 it's royally bad, 4 we need to take action NOW
This is a good practice with any kind of language, since compiler checking doesn't give you guarantee that the code works. With very high level languages like Python it is easier to keep this practice: you just have to reinvest some of the devlopment time that Python allows you to save in implementing and mantaining a good test framework. You will end with a net gain in development time anyway, AND with a very robust code that will give you very little trouble during final integration, qualification and maintenance.
Ciao
----
FB
Does anyone know why he left Elemental Security, the startup he joined with Dan Farmer? That can't be a good sign for the company.
Agreed on all points but one. Well said :)
The point where I would change something is... you added the 3D rendering time onto the python control code's time. But, these will run in parallel. You can tell the 3D card to render all that stuff, while the python (or any other) code is handling input events, doing AI, etc.
Well, I for one welcome our new Python-enhanced overlords!