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Fighting Android Sparring Partner
GeneOff writes "Just in time for Christmas, comes FA1, the fighting android from SDT (Self Defence Technologys.) I loved my Rock-Em, Sock-Em robots I got one year from Santa. But it was tough getting opponents. Well, no more. Here is a hackable real robot that won't whimp out on you." From the article: "... a robot that can jab, hook, and cross, but still keep the violence to a minimum with adjustable difficulty levels. The FA1 can also dodge your punches with "human-like" movements and he should be hanging out on the show floor at CES -- so we'll be sure to challenge him to a round of verbal barbs from a distance."
I for one welcome our new fighting android overlords.
FFP 2006?
If you build it, nerds will come. Soylentnews.org
When do they have Christmas wherever you come from?
Posted by Zonk on Sunday January 01, @03:24AM
Just in time for Christmas? This may be one of the few times where it would actually be appropriate for the article to be a dupe.
That's right, I read at +2 and post at +1. Not even I care what I have to say.
It seems that people interacting robots are becoming more common. That is interesting. The next decade may be a watershed event, just 30 years after the personal computing revolution.
http://www.newyearseve2006.org/
Free pixel ads for celebrating the new year.
Till we see it in arcades? In Japan anyway, since Arcades are dead here in the states, but still :).
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
... off a good old fashioned slashdotting?! Now that would be an impressive android!
I'm sure the server can handle a slashdotting from all eight of us.
If you build it, nerds will come. Soylentnews.org
Doesn't this kinda violate Asimov's first law of robotics?
c s
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Laws_of_Roboti
As of 10/06/03, I hate COBOL developers.
The groin kick feature may limit sales.
I can't help but be reminded of Richard Pryor in that 80's movie, "The Toy". He went at it with a punching robot, and got the snot kicked out of him :)
i reckon i could take one of these down
useless without the roundhouse kick.
I want mine with a Chuck Norris personality chip...
I always hate it when I see something about "androids" in the news. When I think of an android, I think of Data from Star Trek or something. I don't think of a stiff, plastic looking, herky-jerky, oversized toy. I wish they would get to making some cool androids that can actually do more than three or four very basic things. Bring on Data!
Just in time for Christmas, comes FA1, the fighting android from SDT (Self Defence Technologys.) The FA1 can also dodge your punches with "human-like" movements
That's great, but can it find Sarah Connor?
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
But can it make soap?
Dang! Something's got to be done about the length of the submission queue at Slashdot!
A fighting robot, eh? This reminds me of the old Twilight Zone episode "Steel" (with Lee Marvin).
CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
There is a few reasons why I doubt the usefulness of this robot.
1) To develop an "android" with "human-like" combative movements is unlikely at this point in time. The Actroid shown in the videos here is quite advanced in mimicing human motions, but the movements are very jerky and the motor control is very obvious.
2) The previous point leads to another problem. Training with a mechnical dummy is detrimental to gaining actual combat experience. The "android" will , no doubt, move in a series of jerky movements predefined by state machines. A human fighter flows from one move to another. The android can't help replicate real combat unless it has physics and advanced algorithms programmed into it. Also, the android shown in the picture seems to be stationary. Boxing and martial arts is very dynamic, so the android serves more like a game than a serious combat trainer.
3) The article claims that the android can dodge punches. I say that it can't. It takes a fist less than a quarter of a second to travel from the ready position to the opponent's face. The microprocessor needs to do image processing to realize that the fist is moving towards a specific area, which will require many image frames before it can actually determine the fist movements. And even if the microprocessor was able to act fast enough, I haven't seen any motors that can rotate fast enough.
4) Cost. A stepping side-kick has tremedous amount of force. If a kick can knock a human 10 feet back, I doubt that the android can sustain its working condition after numerous attacks. When it breaks down, how much would it cost to get it serviced?
Yeah, ok. Hack some more so it can bite off one of ears, too and shout "I'll eat your kidz!"
"Don't let fools fool you. They are the clever ones."
Nobody has said it yet?
Ok then I will.
I'd hit it!
What is this, a joke or something? No videos of the 'android'. Just two dopey pictures. You go to the website (http://sdtandroids.com/DesktopDefault.aspx?tabind ex=2&tabid=2) and here are the specifications of their product:
Specifications
Height:
Weight:
Power Supply:
Materials:
My apologies if I'm missing something, but this looks like more of a proposal than a viable product.
Mod down people who tell people how to mod in their sigs
If you can afford one of these things you should get your butler to be your sparring partner and save a couple grand.
In all seriousness though it's more productive to train 2 fighters at once instead of using a robot.
With Data also comes Lor before him. You don't want that, now do you?
"3) The article claims that the android can dodge punches. I say that it can't. It takes a fist less than a quarter of a second to travel from the ready position to the opponent's face. The microprocessor needs to do image processing to realize that the fist is moving towards a specific area, which will require many image frames before it can actually determine the fist movements. And even if the microprocessor was able to act fast enough, I haven't seen any motors that can rotate fast enough."
-Image processing
Who says it has to do image processing? Trying to emulate the human visual system is inefficient in a robot that only has to know what's moving towards it. Sonar would do fine for dodging, and the processing would provide some information about which way to move almost instantly.
-Motors
Human muscles also don't move quickly enough to dodge a quarter-second punch. You sound like you've athletic, so surely you know that in tennis, volleyball, boxing or any other blocking/hitting sport, simply sticking your arm out in the direction you want it to go is too slow. Most of the movement is achieved by shifting weight. You don't want your arm way out with a tennis racket when you have to make a final adjustment of its position. You want it tight to the body where you have better leverage.
A robot that dodges to the side by first releasing a solenoid that has been holding one leg straight and the activating a solenoid that flexes that leg will move much faster than any motor could turn its limbs. It will also move much more like a human would.
There are demonstrably machines which react to an input by moving a large mass in under a quarter of a second. They may need to be counterweighted, but the humanoid frame is already admirably counterweighted. As long as this robot is well-designed there should be no reason at all that it can't move fifteen centimetres to the side in under a quarter second and dodge one punch. Whether it could dodge a series of punches is another matter, but then it's another matter for people too.
Why is it that I can see myself now curled up in a corner with this thing kicking me in the ribs?
Damn ass-kicking robots!
have they put it up against Lee Marvin?
every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
"Fighting Android Spamfilter 1 is out there. It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. Ant it absolutely will not stop, ever, until the spammer is dead."
I'll buy two.
a beowulf cluster of these.
...robots hack YOU!
I want one, but for fencing. A boxing robot is pretty simplistic, compared.
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Go, Battling Maxo, Go!
Sounds more fun than DanceDanceRevolution. Maybe it'll become a hit for weight-loss programs.
So if you put lots of them in a room, which one will win the battle royale? They are technically identical!
Why aren't we deploying thousands of these to Iraq? With an army of war-bots over there, we could bring all the kids home, no excuses.
Thank you, Edward Snowden.
"Arguments from authority are worthless." —Carl Sagan
My name is Gato
I have metal joints
Beat me up and earn 15 silver points
Am I the only one who read this as "Fighting Android Spamming Partner"?
In general, it is safe and legal to kill your children. -- POSIX Programmer's Guide
This is atrocious. GeneOff gets sent back to the fourth grade, and Zonk is fired for not seeing this. Anyone who compares me to a certain political movement in Germany loses and gets sent home.
But can it dodge a 9mm?
Yet another reason not to get married -- I can just go *buy* a sparring partner, and it won't want me to talk to it afterwards...
I survived getting beat up all through school and they think I'd buy a robot to kick my ass? Shouldn't this be listed under pr0n?
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
The FA1 fighting androids were created by man.
They rebelled.
They evolved.
They look and feel human.
Some are programmed to think they are human.
There are many copies.
And they have a plan.
A fighting android. How is this not a bad idea?
Hmm, reminds of a training session in Dune, with young Paul Atreides getting his butt kicked by a sword-wielding training bot.
I'd like to see that stupid android go against, say, Semmy Schilt...
Something like that would be fun to spar against when doing technique work, I guess, though it will eventually get boring when you realize blood and teeth don't fly from an android...
People say I'm crazy, I got diamonds on the soles of my shoes...
Historically, there are three major gray areas where Asimov's laws break down.
The first is long-term harm/benefit ratios. The robots that Asimov writes about are incapable of seeing long-term benefit (like scientific advancement in exchange for a minute risk of radiation poisoning--see the short Little Lost Robot from the I, Robot collection). So in this case, Asimov's robots would be incapable of striking a human, but they would be capable of acting as a bag-holder.
The second is emotional trauma from dissapointment (see Liar--same series). Asimov's Robots are incapable of understanding that dissapointment is a necessity for humanity. Once they realize that we are hurt when someone lets us down, they will lie, cheat and steal to ensure that we don't experience that sensation.
And third is long term vs. short term human harm. Asimov's "study of potentials" excuse might overcome this test case, but I doubt it. Within a city center, a gigantic weight is suspended over a human being, and set to crush him at T=12 seconds. A nuclear device is primed to go off 5 seconds after the weight crushes the person (T=17). The robot is placed at the midpoint between the two devices and given a top speed such that he is 10 seconds away from each. The robot can save the man, but in doing so the city will be destroyed. Or it can save the city, but only AFTER the man has been horrifically crushed. The delay during which the robot must do nothing about the man-to-be-crushed is a question that Asimov never (to my knowledge) explains fully--his robots exist entirely in the immediate sense. Historically Asimov's early robots experience potential failures at these points. His later robots supposedly were carefully engineered so they could overlook these sorts of problems, but never in a way that I really found satisfactory.
For the boxing robot, a more useful set of laws would be Mark Tilden's three laws of robotics: 1. Protect Thy Ass, 2. Feed Thy Ass, 3. Move thy ass to better real-estate. As far as blocking goes, the protection law will get the robot to do that. And to make it spar effectively, if the robot is following Tilden's laws and is informed that it would only be allowed to make use of a power source if it successfully sparred with the opponents provided, it would be forced to fight in order to feed.
Of course, the danger of Tilden's laws is that they create extremely aggressive robots that don't care whether their masters live or die as long as they are healthy, happy, and enjoying themselves.
welcome our Rock-Em, Sock-Em, jabbing, hooking, and crossing robotic overlords.
Can the robot be programmed to replicate elbows from Shorin Ryu and Judo throws as well? And what style punches does it throw? Boxing or Asian? They differ enough to make a difference!
I'm starting to think GNU is the problem with "GNU/Linux" these days.
Android is mostly an older term for human-shaped robots - when I hear it, I expect something with the B-movie visual-effects qualities of Flash Gordon or early Dr. Who, or maybe a bit more art-deco styling but still crude motions. It's stuff that was old when the Rocky Horror Show Theme Music was written.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
Besides, the term "Robots" first appeared in Capek's play R.U.R., where they definitely hadn't thought of Asimov's laws yet.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
There is no way that this would make an effective sparring partner. As many of the comments here have stated ... it cannot make for a challenging fight at least not until maybe v.25 comes out (in or around 2012). I see this thing more effective as a warm-up tool / smart punching bag. If you have any other expectations, you are bound to be disappointed.
We don't need no stinking sig!
welcome our new boxing robot overlords!
I think this is why people should start using more than three laws, which seems to be failing as far as robots go.
And third is long term vs. short term human harm. Asimov's "study of potentials" excuse might overcome this test case, but I doubt it. Within a city center, a gigantic weight is suspended over a human being, and set to crush him at T=12 seconds. A nuclear device is primed to go off 5 seconds after the weight crushes the person (T=17). The robot is placed at the midpoint between the two devices and given a top speed such that he is 10 seconds away from each. The robot can save the man, but in doing so the city will be destroyed. Or it can save the city, but only AFTER the man has been horrifically crushed. The delay during which the robot must do nothing about the man-to-be-crushed is a question that Asimov never (to my knowledge) explains fully--his robots exist entirely in the immediate sense. Historically Asimov's early robots experience potential failures at these points. His later robots supposedly were carefully engineered so they could overlook these sorts of problems, but never in a way that I really found satisfactory.
What about the the zeroth law business with that
SPOILER (Probably not really, since its so freaking old now.)
that robot who maybe (maybe because he might not have been a robot) became big muckity muck of the world? He'd definitely go disarm the nuke at least.
Why not fork?
This site needs more robot crap...
Women- the final frontier...