Slashdot Mirror


Einstein Has Left the Building

Ant writes to tell us of an interesting editorial by John Horgan that is being run by the New York Times asking "will there ever be another Einstein?". The author looks at why Einstein holds such a hallowed position in public opinion and why it will be so hard for any one physicist to attain the same level of fame today. From the article: "The paradoxical answer, Gleick suggested, is that there are so many brilliant physicists alive today that it has become harder for any individual to stand apart from the pack. In other words, our perception of Einstein as a towering figure is, well, relative."

101 of 443 comments (clear)

  1. As Einstein once said... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Imagination is more important than knowledge."

    1. Re:As Einstein once said... by moro_666 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Therefor i imagine that finding a real Einstein among 6 billion people can happen more often than you think.

        However i'm not sure that many of them Einsteins ever discovered that they are so brilliant at all...

      --

      I'd tell you the chances of this story being a dupe, but you wouldn't like it.
    2. Re:As Einstein once said... by Lodragandraoidh · · Score: 4, Insightful

      More importantly, this may be impossible because of what we are trying to measure and how we are trying to measure it. What is light? A particle? A wave? It has qualities of both - so the question of 'exactly what it is we are measuring' is not ascertainable and is a cautionary tale for us: we only know as much as we think we understand at any given moment; new ways of approaching hard problems can alter what we consider 'reality' in the blink of an eye.

      There is always a duck-billed platypus to throw a monkey wrench into the works...

      --

      Lodragan Draoidh
      The more you explain it, the more I don't understand it. - Mark Twain
    3. Re:As Einstein once said... by FukYa · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I sort of disagree here. I think what is most important is that we are on the outside of a black box trying to control what is within by sending in effectors and observing changes. Using this method, no matter how precise, we will never know what is in the box, and so will never know of all the possibilities that we are missing.

    4. Re:As Einstein once said... by OldAndSlow · · Score: 3, Insightful
      The next step is to do away with the models and know exactly what it is that we are measuring

      I think you misunderstand modeling. Take a brick. The very act of measuring the length of the brick involves modeling. Most of us use a very simple model that we learned in elementary school: length, height, width, volume. length > width; width > height; volume = length * width * height.

      But the brick doesn't have these simple dimensions. Look closely and you will see that the brick has rough edges. Our simple model of an ideal rectangular solid doesn't capture all of the details of our brick. I would go so far as to say that the brick doesn't have length, only our model of the brick does. Indeed, this discussion is actually about a model brick because like snowflakes and fingerprints, no two bricks are alike. So talking about bricks requires that we all share some mental model of what a brick is.

      For an introduction to some of the difficulties of measurement, see Mandelbrot's description of the lenght of coasts in "The Fractal Geometry of Nature."

  2. Personality, not brains by JehCt · · Score: 5, Insightful
    ScuttleMonkey's summary is bunkum. Einstein was unique because of his character, not his genius. The masses recognized that Einstein was an extraordinarily humane and humble man.

    From Wikipedia:

    Einstein himself was deeply concerned with the social impact of scientific discoveries. His reverence for all creation, his belief in the grandeur, beauty, and sublimity of the universe (the primary source of inspiration in science), his awe for the scheme that is manifested in the material universe--all of these show through in his work and philosophy.
    Albert Einstein was much respected for his kind and friendly demeanor rooted in his pacifism. He was modest about his abilities, and had distinctive attitudes and fashions--for example, he minimized his wardrobe so that he would not need to waste time in deciding on what to wear. He occasionally had a playful sense of humor, and enjoyed sailing and playing the violin. He was also the stereotypical "absent-minded professor"; he was often forgetful of everyday items, such as keys, and would focus so intently on solving physics problems that he would often become oblivious to his surroundings. In his later years, his appearance inadvertently created (or reflected) another stereotype of scientist in the process: the researcher with unruly white hair.
    After the war, though, Einstein lobbied for nuclear disarmament and a world government: "I do not know how the Third World War will be fought, but I can tell you what they will use in the Fourth--rocks!"
    1. Re:Personality, not brains by toddbu · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Einstein was unique because of his character

      I think that the same holds true of virtually any public figure, whether it's a singer, actor, or politician. How many times to we hear the media speak of a President of the US (past and present) working to build his legacy? I don't think that Churchill or FDR spent much time worrying about legacy, yet history counts them as great men. The more you try to secure your place in history, the more elusive it becomes.

      --
      If you don't want crime to pay, let the government run it.
    2. Re:Personality, not brains by AKAImBatman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Einstein was unique because of his character, not his genius. The masses recognized that Einstein was an extraordinarily humane and humble man.

      BWHAHAHA! Is this the same Einstein who pissed off 90% of his professors in college because he was such a rogue?

      Einstein was a giant among physicists because of his extrodinary intelligence. He asked the questions no one else thought to ask, and produced the answers through nothing more than logical deduction. The answers he produced were so profound and world changing that it took decades for science to really grab ahold of them.

      But perhaps the most interesting part about Mr. Einstein is that he was heavily anti-institutional. His rogue personality not only clashed heavily with the "established" scientific community (who thought they had all the answers when they had precisely zilch), but he tore them apart and made way for a completely new breed of scientist.

      Will there ever be another Einstein? No. No more than there will be another Isaac Newton. There will be a completely new figure who will have such an incredible way of looking at the Universe that it will put everyone else to shame.

    3. Re:Personality, not brains by Surt · · Score: 5, Funny

      Indeed, and we have such a visionary among us now, with a truly revolutionary view of the universe that will shatter the existing framework:

      http://www.timecube.com/

      --
      "Who is the Journal of Quantum Physics going to believe?" --Stephen Hawking
    4. Re:Personality, not brains by CheshireCatCO · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't see how the fact that Einstein was a rogue contradicts the other traits. Gandhi was undoubtedly humane and I think we probably agree that he was humble. But he was also pretty anti-establishment. While it might be reasonable to associate the rogue trait with lack of humility, I don't think it's a given.

    5. Re:Personality, not brains by TapeCutter · · Score: 5, Informative

      His credo and that fact that his humanity was revealed in the way he tried to live by it. This is what people loved and respected. Newton was at least an equally great genius but unfortunately he was also an arsehole, his work (like Einstein's), is simply admired as an acedemic artifact.

      --
      And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
    6. Re:Personality, not brains by Anpheus · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Really, I thought Euler had already deduced that space might be curved due to the properties of the universe, but was unable to find corroborating evidence and failed to publish his theories after decades of searching. At one time, he chose to try and determine the angles between three mountain peaks using techniques he developed for measurement, but was unable to establish that space was curved because the difference was within acceptable error for his equipment. Laser inferometry showed that he would have had to be accurate between 1-10 and 1-20 degrees in order to show that space was curved. The fact that he deduced this and sought evidence for it without any prodding or any recorded reason make Euler clearly the intellectual superior. Nevertheless, I must agree with earlier posters, Einstein's personality are what made him a household name.

    7. Re:Personality, not brains by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Dude, what the fuck is that? That's craziness. I had to clean my brain with a Q-tip after that, and you know what came out? Brain spooge. Sorry, I have to go, there's blood coming out my nose.

    8. Re:Personality, not brains by grcumb · · Score: 4, Interesting

      "I don't think that Churchill or FDR spent much time worrying about legacy, yet history counts them as great men."

      Churchill cared so much about his legacy that he wrote a 6 volume memoir of his actions during the war, modestly entitled "The Second World War." It's good reading, but make no mistake about its purpose. From start to finish it's an apologia for his every action during that time.

      And when talking about Roosevelts, I'm more prone to remember Eleanor Roosevelt as the modest one. This is a woman who, in the dark days of segregation, drove through southern towns with a pistol on the seat beside her, to address groups like the NAACP. When a bunch of up uptight matrons refused to allow a black soprano to perform at Constitution Hall in Washington, she arranged to have the concert at the Lincoln Memorial. 70,000 people attended.

      Eleanor Roosevelt was also the driving force behind one of the most important documents since Hammurabi - the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

      Churchill and Roosevelt were both extremely dynamic personalities who knew exactly how to present themselves to the public, and whose private faces were sometimes strikingly different from their public ones. That said, they both made important - critical, even - contributions to world history.

      --
      Crumb's Corollary: Never bring a knife to a bun fight.
    9. Re:Personality, not brains by ozmanjusri · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But perhaps the most interesting part about Mr. Einstein is that he was heavily anti-institutional.

      Lemme see, he was an anti-institutional rogue when he was a young student, and became a thoughtful, humble man when he matured. Whoever heard of that happening before?

      --
      "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
    10. Re:Personality, not brains by Dmala · · Score: 2, Funny

      The difference being that Han shot first, Einstein wouldn't have.

    11. Re:Personality, not brains by nacturation · · Score: 2, Funny
      This is the true gist of timecube:
      "You maybe academically retarded.

      Academia Retards By Fact Earth Has 1 Day When Dead Still, And 4 Days Within 1 Earth Rotation, losing 3 days retards humanity.

      Are you stupid and evil?"
      Truly, a visionary.
      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
    12. Re:Personality, not brains by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      quick google turned up this

    13. Re:Personality, not brains by Fred_A · · Score: 5, Funny

      An example of Einstein explaining technical matters to the layperson (paraphrased from memory):

      Reporter : Mr Einstein, can you explain to us how the wireless works ?
      Einstein : Well, you know the telegraph, it's like a very long cat, it has its tail in New York and its head in Los Angeles. You pull the tail and the head mews.
      Reporter : Uh, yes...
      Einstein : You see, the wireless works the same except there is no cat.

      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    14. Re:Personality, not brains by kisak · · Score: 2, Informative
      Eh, Gauss did experiments to check if space was curved, not Euler. And Gauss definitely had a reason to check it out, since Gauss, together with Lobachevsky and Boylai, was the first to realise that there are other types of geometry than the Euclidian. With this knowledge it is natural to want to experimentally test what kind of geometry our space has.

      What makes Einstein so-called "intellectual superior", as if this is some kind of competition, is that Einstein connected gravity together with the geometry of space, creating a unified theory of all accelerated systems. Hilbert at the same time as Einstein also worked out how to use Riemann geometry to describe space, just to point out that there are many great mathematicians and physicists who have been thinking about how space curves in the history of science.

      --

      --- guns don't kill people, people with guns kill people ---

    15. Re:Personality, not brains by I_M_Noman · · Score: 2, Funny
      Gauss, together with Lobachevsky and Boylai, was the first to realise that there are other types of geometry than the Euclidian.
      And ever since I meet this man
      My life is not the same
      And Nicolai Ivanovich Lobachevsky is his name, hey!
      Nicolai Ivanovich Lobache-
      I am never forget the day I am given first original paper to write. It was on analytic and algebraic topology of locally Euclidean metrization of infinitely differentiable Riemannian manifold. Bozhe moi! This I know from nothing. What I'm going to do? But I think of great Lobachevsky and get idea - ahah!

      (Well, you know the rest.)

    16. Re:Personality, not brains by hackstraw · · Score: 5, Interesting

      "History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it."

      -- Winston Churchill


      Currently, we have:

      "To those of you who received honours, awards and distinctions, I say well done. And to the C students, I say you, too, can be president of the United States."

      -- George W. Bush, speaking at Yale University's 300th commencement ceremony

      Sorry, I don't know of any quotes that reveal much character from a US president in the last 40 years.

      Here are some others though from before then:

      "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."

      -- Theodore Roosevelt

      "America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves."

      --Abraham Lincoln

      Check out this progression:

      "Government is not reason. Government is not eloquence. It is force. And, like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."

      -- George Washington

      to:

      "The Founding Fathers knew a government can't control the economy without controlling people. And they knew when a government sets out to do that, it must use force and coercion to achieve its purpose. So we have come to a time for choosing."

      -- Ronald Reagan, October 27, 1964

    17. Re:Personality, not brains by corbettw · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Check out this progression:

      "Government is not reason. Government is not eloquence. It is force. And, like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."

      -- George Washington

      to:

      "The Founding Fathers knew a government can't control the economy without controlling people. And they knew when a government sets out to do that, it must use force and coercion to achieve its purpose. So we have come to a time for choosing."

      -- Ronald Reagan, October 27, 1964


      There isn't as much difference between those statements as you seem to imply. Consider the very next sentance in Reagan's speech:
      "Public servants say, always with the best of intentions, "What greater service we could render if only we had a little more money and a little more power." But the truth is that outside of its legitimate function, government does nothing as well or as economically as the private sector. "

      Also consider his famous line, "Government is not the solution to our problems, government is the problem." There's a reason why Reagan is considered the father of the modern conservative movement, and it's not because he was pro-government.

      --
      God invented whiskey so the Irish would not rule the world.
    18. Re:Personality, not brains by Cat_Byte · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I don't think any of the above based on sunrise/sunset would be correct except twice a year around equinox. At best it would still be a few seconds off and for half the year it would be > 24 hours/one rotation.

      --
      Two roads diverged in a wood, and I - I took the one the bus load of girls just went down.
    19. Re:Personality, not brains by saider · · Score: 2, Funny


      Schrodinger would have both shot and not shot. However it would collapse into one of the outcomes once you watch the movie.

      --


      Remember, You are unique...just like everyone else.
    20. Re:Personality, not brains by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's not clear how much choice Roosevelt had. The American public was still quite strongly isolationist (it had taken an attack on American soil by the Japanese to bring the USA into WWII). The exploitation of the working class by the Robber Barons in the 20's and the Depression were also fairly fresh in people's minds, whereas Communism's faults and weaknesses were not as apparent as they are now after 40+ years of Cold War. Also think about how many North Americans went to fight on the communist side in the Spanish Civil War. Could FDR have convinced the American people (France, England, and Germany were spent) to mount up a war effort to topple communist Russia and China, without fighting a strong 5th column?

      The US atomic arsenal was empty, Russia probably wouldn't have folded like Japan did under nuclear threat, and FDR couldn't be sure he would succeed in an invasion of Russia where the German military had failed. More importantly, I think FDR sensed that the internal political alliances built fighting a war against Germany and Japan would not hold in a continued fight against Russia. It would tear the USA apart politically the way no other issue had since slavery and would do worse to an already exhausted Europe. Perhaps he also trusted in the long-term superiority of democratic capitalist society, but I think primarily he sensed that there were too many wounds and fissures in the fabric of American society that needed to heal before communism could be tackled. It was a big gamble, and one we seem to have mostly won.

      Critical, yes. Decent or respectable, not at all. Abhorrent and inexcusable, definitely
      You must be Republican :-). Trying to impose moral absolutism in politics may work for a while but in the end it will cause a backlash and is doomed to failure. Politics is all about compromise and fighting the battles you think you can win. Great statesmen are just far better than the average politician at galvanizing popular opinion that their way is correct, but they don't lose sight of that fact. Sun Tzu effectively said to only fight the battles you know you can win, and otherwise to avoid conflict until you can arrange conditions where you can win. That wisdom is 2000+ years old and well worth remembering.

  3. They don't make 'em.... by DoraLives · · Score: 4, Funny

    like they used to.

    --
    Is it fascism yet?
    1. Re:They don't make 'em.... by Overly+Critical+Guy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Einstein is so famous because pop culture made him famous. There were lots of brilliant physicists back then, and there are many today.

      Same with Stephen Hawking. He's famous in pop culture today mostly because of his disability, which fits with the media's love of handicapped geniuses (aside from eccentric looking geniuses, like Einstein).

      --
      "Sufferin' succotash."
    2. Re:They don't make 'em.... by UserGoogol · · Score: 2, Informative

      No it doesn't. That is one way of interpreting the concept of wavefunctions, but there are others.

      --
      "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity." -- Hanlon's Razor
  4. Show me by brian0918 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Show me the "brilliant physicists" that have published four papers in one year, each individually deserving of a Nobel Prize.

    1. Re:Show me by toddbu · · Score: 4, Funny
      If there weren't OTHER physicists publishing similar papers first, perhaps some physicists would. That's the point.

      So is your argument that publishing quality work is a zero sum game? I bet our good friend Einstein would have loved the Internet. Then he'd have blogged about ten good papers per year.

      --
      If you don't want crime to pay, let the government run it.
    2. Re:Show me by Dr.+Spork · · Score: 4, Insightful
      I think what I meant is that Einstein was making a theory for data that others collected, and that theory wouldn't have happened without that data which needed explaining. You can't do even theoretical physics in an intellectual vacuum. At the start of the 20th century there was an explosion of new observations about things large and small. That was also almost the end of the time when you can do most of the amazing and shocking research in a modestly-funded university lab.

      Now you (usually) need huge accelerators and expensive satellites to collect fundamental data... and when those things produce readings, many people find out about them simultaneously, and the race is on. We just don't build many of these in a year, and we don't build the stuff that would really show us something exciting, since it would cost too much. So fundamental physicists may be somewhat starved for data, which is why they to off on adventures into this purely abstract mathematical string theory wonderland. Of course, they're a clever lot, and if we let them work on it longer, maybe the will find a way to test it.

    3. Re:Show me by ozmanjusri · · Score: 3, Interesting

      At the start of the 20th century there was an explosion of new observations about things large and small.

      And now with databases and networking we can aggregate data across disciplines like never before. Fertile ground for a new Einstein, I would have thought.

      --
      "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
  5. This is pretty obvious by poopdeville · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is pretty obvious. While many people were studying physics while Einstein worked, the mathematical methods they used tended to be relatively primitive. A precocious undergraduate can easily understand the state of physics up to Einstein's first few papers. This is not to say that Einstein wasn't insightful. He certainly was. However, we're now studying the fruits of his insights, and it takes a few years of graduate school to become an expert in even a small field. If there is a next Einstein, I foresee people studying him for years after becoming a Ph.D. before they become "experts."

    --
    After all, I am strangely colored.
    1. Re:This is pretty obvious by v1 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If you think about it, it makes sense that a scientist in his era would shine brightly. At the time he was in his prime, there were a lot of important discoveries being made which opened up a lot of new territory in which to make new discoveries. Now you could view science as a much more mature study... there may still be a lot of room for new discoveries but they are not the easy ones that can be expressed with 5 characters like "e=mc2". Now such similar discoveries require collaboration of teams of scientists several years of work to publish papers that would require hundreds of pages of text to describe.

      I suppose I can summarize this by saying it's not that the people are not as brilliant as they used to be, but that the noteworthy acheivements that are yet to be found are much more difficult to conquer, so we see them much less frequently.

      Another possible influence on this may be that at Einstein's time, there was a world war going on. There's nothing quite like the military to concentrate talented people for research and development, and to provide a nearly limitless source of funding to speed up the research. We don't have that now.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    2. Re:This is pretty obvious by techno-vampire · · Score: 3, Informative
      Another possible influence on this may be that at Einstein's time, there was a world war going on.

      There was a world war going on in 1905 when he published his papers? Really? Which one?

      --
      Good, inexpensive web hosting
    3. Re:This is pretty obvious by EvanED · · Score: 2, Informative

      Now you could view science as a much more mature study... there may still be a lot of room for new discoveries but they are not the easy ones that can be expressed with 5 characters like "e=mc2"

      Are you really that sure about that?

      I'll agree that the chances of another discovery where such a profound statement (that energy and mass are convertible) can be made in so simple a form is unlikely, but by no means is it impossible. I have a suspicion that if you went to 1904 and asked someone if such a statement could be made so simply you would have gotten a reaction similar to yours.

      Another possible influence on this may be that at Einstein's time, there was a world war going on.

      Keep in mind that special relativity was 1905 and general 1915. At the time he published his two biggest theories (or at least the most well known, even among people who have done some physics studying) he wasn't yet anywhere near the Manhattan Project or anything like that.

    4. Re:This is pretty obvious by nmb3000 · · Score: 5, Funny
      This is not to say that Einstein wasn't insightful. He certainly was.

      I agree.

      MOD EINSTEIN UP!!!

      Re: Relativity (Score:5, Insightful)
      by Einstein (0) <speedoflight@gmail.com> on Tue Sept 18, 1905 12:42 PM

          E = mc^2

          Suck it.

      --

          God does not play dice with the universe.
      --
      "What do you despise? By this are you truly known." --Princess Irulan, Manual of Muad'Dib
      /)
    5. Re:This is pretty obvious by C0llegeSTUDent · · Score: 2, Funny

      That would be World War .5 beta

      Next time use wikipedia, or else you will make a fool of yourself.

  6. Uh? by Quaoar · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What about Hawking? You can't tell me many lay people with no interest in science don't at least know of him.

    --
    I'll form my OWN solar system! With blackjack! And hookers!
    1. Re:Uh? by wass · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Hawking has contributed to the fields of GR and cosmology, but can you tell me the major discoveries and research he's conducted? Just because he writes a pop-science book and you've heard of him doesn't make him a 'great' in physics. Of course it doesn't mean he's not 'great' either.

      So he's done some novel things within cosmology, along with Penrose, Rees, and others, but how does that compare with Einstein? Which of Hawking's discoveries do you think is worthy of a Nobel Prize, specifically why should Hawking get one over other cosmologists? Einstein should have had at least a few more Nobel prizes (special relativity itself is worthy, not to mention GR, and his study of Brownian Motion is pretty good too).

      While Hawking is well-known (he'd probably be less famous if he wasn't in a wheelchair), Einstein's research ran a much wider gamut, including opening up entirely new areas of physics.

      --

      make world, not war

    2. Re:Uh? by Isotopian · · Score: 2, Interesting

      What about his groundbreaking work on Black Holes? (Hawkings Radiation, anyone?) Stephen Hawkings is as close as we have to a modern Einstein, IMHO.

      --

      It's poetry with a beat behind it! And guns! They're like beatniks with automatic weapons.

    3. Re:Uh? by zerocool^ · · Score: 5, Funny


      While Hawking is well-known (he'd probably be less famous if he wasn't in a wheelchair)

      The wheelchair and speaking device is the tradeoff for sacrificing all that DEX and CHA for the high INT.

      --
      sig?
    4. Re:Uh? by Psykus · · Score: 2, Informative

      We all know he's moved on to his rap career...

    5. Re:Uh? by Kjella · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The wheelchair and speaking device is the tradeoff for sacrificing all that DEX and CHA for the high INT.

      The intelligence he probably had, but there are a lot of brilliant people who never get that far. One of the reasons he's come so far is because he's had a lot of time to work on it sitting in his wheelchair. Most discoveries are made by relatively young people, often single and often without children. Cue the "geeks can't get laid" jokes, but it is much simpler than that.

      If you got up early to get the kids to kindergarten, and well Tommy wasn't feeling very well so you're considering taking him to the doctor, and they were yelling and now you have a headache, and you're wondering what you should get your wife for the upcoming anniversary, and today you have to drive Billy to soccer practise, and your wife wanted to buy some new curtains for the kitchen that you had to see, but then again she promised she'd make it up to you later tonight and...

      Chances are pretty slim you'll do any late studying with your physics book. That interesting experiment you didn't finish in the lab will just have to wait. And you haven't exactly done any deep insight on theoretical physics today either. Which is not to say all it takes is time - most people could spend lifetimes and not connect the dots, but that of the few that could, it requires more of you than just the intelligence.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
  7. huh? by danielk1982 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "The paradoxical answer, Gleick suggested, is that there are so many brilliant physicists alive today that it has become harder for any individual to stand apart from the pack. In other words, our perception of Einstein as a towering figure is, well, relative."

    There were *many* brilliant physicists in Einstein's time as well.

  8. As modern physicists approach Einstein's fame... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...they become infinitely massive. Hawking achieved 99.99999% of Einstein's fame and he ended up in a wheelchair from the stress.

  9. no need for name calling by gadzook33 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Gleick's just jealous (but Wolfram is livid and Feynman is rolling over in his grave).

  10. reign in the drug companies by User+956 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    an interesting editorial by John Horgan that is being run by the New York Times asking "will there ever be another Einstein?"

    With all the parents doping up their kids on antidepressants, I'd say not likely. (We're already seeing that Generation Y can barely wipe its own nose in the workplace. )

    --
    The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
    1. Re:reign in the drug companies by aussie_a · · Score: 2

      That Generation Y article is bunk. "They are asking for more flexibility and have no intentions of becoming a slave to their jobs." It makes it sound like a bad thing. Yeeesh.

  11. Applied Theory? by TGK · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Einstein is also credited with a huge crossover from the theoretical to the applied aspects of physics. As a population, we tend to see the theoretical side of physics as more complex and intimidating, but the applied side as more down to earth and relevant to our day to day lives.

    Einstein's work straddled this line within his lifetime, making him a figure of daunting intellectual prowess and yet still accessable (in some small manner) by the average man. Surely this combination of theory and practice has strengthened his legacy.

    More over, Einstein lived at the height of the modernist movement in world history - a time when advances in technology could do no wrong. In the minds of many (and they would be wrong) he single-handedly brought about the revolution in the views society holds on technology. While Einstein is not to be entirely credited or blamed for post-modernism, he is often thought of as the turning point by the public at large.

    Information technology, more than any other force, has accelerated the theoretical side of physics away from the applied aspects of the same. We are capable of manipulating mathematics with far greater precision and finess than the physical world we inhabit. As a consequence, it would seem unlikely that any physicist will straddle that line between the theoretical and applied worlds in the near future.

    --
    Killfile(TGK)
    No trees were killed in the creation of this post. However, many electrons were inconvenienced.
  12. The Conclusion is astonishing by glomph · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Yes, in the past several hundred years, at any given time, there have been brilliant physicists. I've known/worked for some of the best. There are one or two who really stand out in each era of physics, and Einstein overlapped several of these. Newton, Kepler, Galileo, Maxwell, et al are the true greats, and Einstein is in that category.

  13. Hindsight is 20/20 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Its very easy to say today that Einstein's works are simple and obvious. Thats because they are first year teachings for most students today. However, we stand on the shoulders of giants. Someday a lot of things will seem very obvious, and those people who do the hard work of making that so will be worth of comparison with Einstein.

  14. Deep vs Narrow by ThatGeek · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I would argue two points.

    First, once you get an iconic person, that's it. The game is up for quite a while. Ever notice how all the caricatures of muscle-types take after Governor Arnold? Or how all psychiatrists take after Freud? This is not because we haven't had people with more muscles (we have) or analysts who have not helped larger numbers of people. When you have an icon, you might as well keep it. It's a reference that everyone already "gets".

    Second, I would argue that as time goes on, it becomes harder and harder to dominate a field. Look at da Vinci. He was a brilliant man to be sure. But if he were alive today, he'd never have been able to master so many fields. There is just so much research out there about the most minute aspect of any field that no one would have time to keep up. And why would we idolize the guy worked in one very small subset, when these people of past years could dominate so many fields? In a way, they had it easy. Anything they looked at represented a new area of science much the way that any explorer who sailed from Europe a thousand years ago would have been able to claim a new territory. It's much harder now; I've tried!

    Also, for those of you who have read the story, I suppose the article should not have asked "Will there be another Einstein?", but rather "Will there be another ThatGeek?". And no, there won't be as I've already registered the nick.

    --
    What are you eating? isItVeg?.
    1. Re:Deep vs Narrow by Tablizer · · Score: 2, Funny

      Anything they looked at represented a new area of science much the way that any explorer who sailed from Europe a thousand years ago would have been able to claim a new territory. It's much harder now; I've tried!

      I am not sure if that is a story we want to hear or want to avoid. Did you by chance try to be Nepolean also? :-)

  15. Einstein could be understood by Jjeff1 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I think a lot of his popularity has to deal with the fact that E=mc^2 is simple enough for anyone to remember. That and his theories were used to create the atomic bomb, ending WWII.

    Those 2 things make Einstein much more tangible to the average person. One can remember what he actually did, and see an enormous practical application.

    1. Re:Einstein could be understood by Dr.+Spork · · Score: 3, Insightful
      I don't think you appreciate the genius of Einstein completely enough. Special relativity, which has E=mc^2 as a consequence, would have been proposed by somebody real soon after 1905, had Einstein chosen to be a bullfighter instead of a physicist. I mean, the Lorentz transform was already around; Einstein just said it wasn't a device for calculation but an actual description of reality. Good idea, but not one that we needed an Einstein for.

      I think general relativity is a very different story. Without Einstein, it might have taken decades to work it out. I mean, really, it's just an amazing piece of work, and something that's hard to work up to incrementally.

      So you're right about E=mc^2 being easy for people to remember, but in a way that's a shame, because it shouldn't be taken as anything like his greatest work.

  16. Re:Of course there will be another by pinkocommie · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm reasonably certain that people around the turn of the last century were also saying similar things and i'm reasonably certain a century into the future the same will be true when they look back at us. I guess one could say maturity would depend on ones perspective.

  17. Resume padding by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    What are you, an immortal vampire or something?

    1. Re:Resume padding by GeffDE · · Score: 2, Funny

      Dude, check out his ID! With one that low, he must be. D'oh!

      --
      It has been a nervous year, with people beginning to feel like Christian Scientists with appendicitis.
  18. that, but also. by User+956 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Part of Einstein's fame probably has a lot to do the the impedending atomic bomb.

    That, but also, he was an interesting character. He's got a catchy tagline (E=MC2). He had funny hair.

    The fact that he was utterly brilliant, and revolutionized the way we see the world takes a back seat to the fact that your average person sees him as they would a cartoon character. Until we get another person with a comparable combination of brilliance and memorable traits, then no, we won't see "another Einstein."

    But that doesn't mean we'll never make any more progress in physics.

    --
    The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
  19. Re:What about... by kid+zeus · · Score: 3, Informative

    Actually, not one of them is considered to be in Einstein's class of intellect. The 'smartest' man in physics is supposedly Edward Witten, founder of M-theory. If you listen to the top theoretical physicists talk about him, he seems to be in the running for most brilliant physicist of all time.

  20. Einstein had Charisma by wass · · Score: 3, Informative
    Einstein did amazing research across the whole gamut of physics, that's something that is much harder to do these days. For example, his miraculous year, he posited the theory of special relativity, came up with the photoelectric effect (which was a major leap for the study of quantum mechanics), and documented Brownian Motion (which was a major proof for accepting statistical mechanics of particles, especially in fluids). But that was just one year, he made brilliant subsequent contributions to quantum mechanics and of course the theory of general relativity as well.

    Einstein put Relativity on the table, which was previously unknown except to a few as something funky going on with Maxwell's equations under a Galilean transformation. This was an entirely new field. And, when extended into General Relativity, is a huge deal. Not many people get to discover a whole new field of physics like that. Newton did with mechanics. But with E&M, it was several people making discoveries, such as Ampere and Faraday and some others. And the full theory wasn't really collected nicely until Maxwell, who also corrected Ampere's Law. And that's only the classical theory, Quantum Electro-Dynamics is another huge thing. But within classical E&M, you can say Maxwell fully documented it, but it was already an explored field (no pun intended, seriously).

    Thermodynamics and Statistical Mechanics had many people make major contributions, specifically when thermodynamics was found to be described entirely within statistical mechanical formalism. Boltzmann made major contributions, eg coming up with entropy and statistical ensembles, but his work wasn't accepted by the community and he ultimately wound up killing himself.

    One physicist that may have come close to Einstein in breadth is my favorite, Lev Davidovic Landau. Any graduate student of physics should be familiar with at least some of his ten-volume "Course of Theoretical Physics", otherwise known as Landau-Lifshitz. Landau's grad students were known to be confused during meetings where he would shift topics from superconductivity to hadron interactions, etc. Landau made many amazing contributions, and also won a Nobel Prize, but he wasn't able to open up any entirely new fields of study like Einstein was able to. He made contributions to other fields, such as 2nd-order phase transitions, superconductivity and superfluidity, etc, but no entirely new fields.

    Finally, Einstein was also rather active politically and socially, he didn't confine his efforts to the laboratory (well, really his desk since he was a theorist). He also had quite a unique physical appearance, which also contributed to his popularity. But I think, from a popular point of view, his contribution of relativity, which is probably one of the biggest scientific blowbacks to something that was previously accepted as scientifically true and complete, was the dominant factor. Of course scientifically he made many other major contributions, but for the newspapers, trumping over Newton is a rather 'hot' story.

    --

    make world, not war

  21. Didn't anyone see Family Guy? by TheOtherAgentM · · Score: 3, Funny

    Einstein worked at a patent office and stole Smith's Theory of Relativity.

  22. My take on this... by N1ghtFalcon · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's funny, because I actually spent quite a long time a while back thinking about this issue. In the end, I would say it's really difficult to give a certain 'yes' or 'no' answer.

    On one hand, there is the issue that information that humans possess is increasing at exponential rate, if not faster. At one point in history, you could be a painter, a sculptor, a mathematician, a philosopher, a physicist, among other things, and still be useful to the society in all of those areas. Today however, such thing is unrealistic due to the fact of how deep each area goes, and how much must be learned of the works of those who came before you in order for you to get to the level of being able to make personal contributions.

    On the other hand, you do have to remember that a century or two ago, physics was thought to be a "finished" science. As in, many physicists around the world believed that the Newtonian model has given them all that is needed, and most viewed physics as a done deal. We understand how it works, nothing more is left to learn, move along. Then came Einstein and turned the whole thing upside down.

    While on my commutes to and from university last semester, I downloaded audio lectures on particle physics. One of the very first things the professor said was "today, most particle physicists believe that we have a solid understanding of what the world is made up of, and that, unlike a few decades ago, we really have gotten to the bottom layer of the universe." He ended the lectures (which were extremely interesting btw) by saying that as good as the standard model of physics is, we still have 23 quantum numbers that are unattainable through mathematics, ideas which defy logic, and a bunch of other theories like string which may also be onto something.

    Overall, I think that if any conclusion is to be made about the state of physics today, I would say that no, Einstein hasn't left the building. In my opinion, we are still missing something crucial about the way the world operates, but we may not realize this until advances in other technology areas such as space travel. Individuals still can make great breakthroughs, but because of issues such as the amount of foundational knowledge, the number of people working on the same things, and the money needed for some of the research, it may be more likely that future discoveries will need to be left to teams of scientists, rather than individuals.

    1. Re:My take on this... by Fnkmaster · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The problem is all these nifty unification-type theories only have observable, testable consequences at energy levels far, far beyond that we can produce in any earth-bound laboratory, and we haven't figured out any ways to observe cosmological effects that they might predict either (probably because those energy levels only happen in the early nanoseconds of the universe).

      Unless and until somebody can work around that rather fundamental set of issues, it seems like these more aesthetically pleasing models of the universe that produce the same observable effects as the rather ugly hodge-podge we call the Standard Model are likely to remain in the realm of mental masturbation.

      As soon as you realize all of this, pursuing further study in physics becomes rather unappealing, or at least it did to me. I look at most modern physics research and I am beyond underwhelmed by it. The only people reaching for the big questions are basically mathematicians and nobody really cares which flavor-of-the-day theory they generate next week because it has no meaningful consequences for the real world.

      There are some unsolved physics problems but only a few of them have the potential (in my judgment) to change the way we view the universe, and those that do will require incredible intuitive leaps from what science currently offers in the way of explanatory tools. Oh, and few people seem to work on these hard questions and if you express an interest in working on them, expect to be treated like a quack.

  23. General improvement? by Twisted64 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I can't say much in regards to Einstein, but I know that it is getting harder to point out musical geniuses, because the bar is constantly being raised. There are thousands of violinists, who are perfectly happy to practice all day to produce perfect performances. Anything less and they simply won't be noticed. I heard a professional musician comment, some years ago, that nobody stands out any more, because so many are at the level of Heifitz.

    I played the violin for about 15 years, and had to stop, because for me the strain of a performance + the need for constant practice overshadows the joy received from playing. I now play quite happily at the back of the second violins in an orchestra - room for fun, and mistakes are rarely heard :)

    Anyway, my point is, perhaps something similar is happening in the field of science.

    --
    Consciousness is a myth. Trust me.
    1. Re:General improvement? by Quirk · · Score: 2, Funny
      ...so many are at the level of Heifitz.

      Not that I, by any stretch of imagination or schooling have the right to comment, but, I will.

      No, there aren't many who are at the level of Heifitz.

      As an aside, your post and profession provide me with an opportunity to ask if you know whether an anecdote I've heard is apocryphal. I was told Fritz Kreisler loved the night life and hated to practise. On occasion he shared the stage with Sergei Rachmaninov who would request Kreisler put in some audition time only to be brushed off. During a joint performance Kreisler lost his place and while improvising leaned into Rachmaninov and asked: "Sergi, where are we?". Rachmaninov was said to have tersely replied: "Carnegie Hall ."

      True, or apocryphal? Do you know?

      --
      "Academicians are more likely to share each other's toothbrush than each other's nomenclature."
      Cohen
  24. Re:WWII by scotch · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Today, radical military tech is common-place

    I'm having trouble parsing this one; if it's radical, it can hardly be common place, no?

    --
    XML causes global warming.
  25. wrong.... by bergeron76 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Einstein's brilliance stems from his ability to think outside of the box, in a practical way; and before "thinking outside of the box" was a tagline and not an actual concept.

    I'm no Einstein, but I do think in a Bergeronian way. I take a concept, invert it entirely, and think - Why has traditional thinking prevented this from working? and Could it actually work (contrary to popular accepted practice)? Ignore the existing reasoning for why it doesn't work. You will either a) confirm that it doesn't work; b) have an epiphany and a resultant breakthrough or c) something else

    Traditional thinking dictates that a square peg can't fit into a round hole. Of course traditional thinking doesn't consider that obscure 4th Dimension - which makes it possible to fit a square peg into a round hole.

    --
    Don't think that a small group of dedicated individuals can't change the world. It's the only thing that ever has.
    1. Re:wrong.... by irm · · Score: 3, Funny

      Because that 4th dimension give you the time to take that square peg over to the belt sander and trim her down.

    2. Re:wrong.... by Jim_Callahan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If you use a fourth dimension, then you're moving a square peg _around_ a round hole, because you're displacing it from the space in which the hole exists.

      Sorry, kid, your brilliant physics was trumped by your incorrect use of basic vocabulary. Don't get too hopeful about that philosophy degree, eh.

      --
      ...it's really a sad day for America when we require a goddamn ACT OF CONGRESS to make our DVD players work properly. ~
  26. Re:Newton by CheshireCatCO · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Hm, I don't think I can agree with that. Newton was unquestionably one of the most brilliant mathematicians of all time. (Most historians will put him in the three-way tie for first with Gauss and Archimedes.) As a scientist, Newton had a sort of mixed track record once you factor out his mathematical breakthroughs. A lot of the things he did were sitting around waiting to be connected up by the math, once the Calculus arrived on the scene. (For example, the inverse-square law of gravity was generally suspected to apply to gravity by many scientists of the day, include Hooke, Wren, and Halley. But none of them could actually prove that it gave the right behaviors for orbits without Newton's mathematical skills.) If you read the works of Galileo, a generation before Newton (and who Newton almost certainly must have read, although I don't have a source on that), you can see that the man was so close with his physical principles, but lacked the mathematical tools to put it all together. (And he lacked the mathematical genius to create the tools.)

    Einstein, on the other hand, was NOT mathematically gifted by any stretch (although he wasn't stupid, either), but had an amazing ability to understand the physical principles and their general consequences. Plus, he was far more loveable than the cold, often caustic Newton.

  27. Re:The atomic bomb ruined physics in many ways by wass · · Score: 3, Insightful
    After the invention of the atomic bomb, governments realized that physicists could actually do something useful. Funding poured in and physics became a business.

    That's right, it's not like governments ever funded people to use physics to predict the trajectory of a bullet from a large gun before the atomic bomb. And moreso, it's not like they ever decided that for large distances the Coriolis force and air resistance need to be properly accounted for and thus they never needed to fund the development of electric computers.

    Nor did they ever need to understand physics to figure out the design of aerofoil wings, or the best shape to make ship hulls, before the atom bomb.

    --

    make world, not war

  28. Re:Newton by EvanED · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It's not just a matter of that Einstein is more recent, it's that Newton is wrong. Even though from my understanding Newton's work was a much bigger jump at the time than was Einstein's at his (which is somewhat of a biased view as just yesterday I read most of Feynman's "Six Not-So-Easy Pieces" so am more familiar with the working leading up to special relativity, while I don't know much about the giants Newton stood upon), the fact that its Einstein's, and not Newton's, that marks our best understanding of the universe I think is a major factor in Einstein's fame.

    This is, of course, related to the fact that Einstein is more recent, but still deserves mention.

    (And on a side note, let me just say that learning about aspects of relativity, even as much as I can, has convinced me that if there is a god, He has quite the sense of humor and creativity.)

  29. Things have changed by Ogemaniac · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Show me modern physics papers that contain math that most people with any scientific or engineering background can understand, and that are just a few pages long.

    The unsolved problems that people are working on today are much more complex, so comparing the rates at which they are solved is meaningless.

    When I was slogging through my 250 page PhD dissertation, I came across an article about disserations of such famous people as Schroedinger and other physicists of the 1920's - whose entire dissertations were about as long as Section 1.1 of my introduction.

    Trying to compare now and then is all but irrelevant.

    1. Re:Things have changed by zerocool^ · · Score: 5, Funny


      When I was slogging through my 250 page PhD dissertation, I came across an article about disserations of such famous people as Schroedinger and other physicists of the 1920's - whose entire dissertations were about as long as Section 1.1 of my introduction.

      Don't make excuses for yourself: Schroedinger's dissertation was of infinite length until observed.

      ~Will

      --
      sig?
    2. Re:Things have changed by Tablizer · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The unsolved problems that people are working on today are much more complex, so comparing the rates at which they are solved is meaningless.

      Or maybe it's just that nobody has found the simple solutions yet. Maybe the next Einstein will find something simple that makes string theory an embarassment in throwing brute mass math at the problem. Ya never know....

  30. Not Allowed by parodyca · · Score: 2, Funny

    There can't ever be another Einstein. The Hebrew University of Jerusalem holds the trademark and they'd never allow it.

  31. Exactly! I think thats the point. by suso · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I think that all this tells us is that society has moved on (ahead) and if you want to achive the same level of fame that you have to work harder at it. For his time, Einstein still had to do a lot. Its not like it was easy. Likewise, its not easy 100 years later to achive the same level of fame. Perhaps Richard Feyman or Carl Sagan came close, but of course neither of them don't have an opera with their name in it (AFAIK).

  32. We don't need another hero... by hung_himself · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Not to denigrate Einstein's prodigious achievements but general relativity would have been impossible were it not for Riemann's (and Gauss before him) work setting up differential geometry. Not to mention, the contributions by Lorentz, Minkowski and other contemporaries who we forget in our quest to annoint a scientific messiah. It seems that the public *needs* a quaint ubermensch to worship with rather than accepting the more mundane truth that scientific advances occur from the concerted work of many very bright people.

    On a scientific level, had Einstein not existed, someone else would have done the work eventually - the tools and conditions were in place for these discoveries to be made. But on a societal level, it probably would have been necessary to invent him...

  33. Re:Newton by mclaincausey · · Score: 2, Interesting
    A lot of the things he did were sitting around waiting to be connected up by the math, once the Calculus arrived on the scene.
    That's an odd thing to say, since Newton invented Calculus. Oh, sure, you can rightly say that Leibniz discovered it slightly before Newton, but since he didn't publish his findings, Newton was forced to discover it for himself.

    Newton was a prodigious asshole, but he was also the most profound physicist, and among the best mathematicians, of all time.

    --
    (%i1) factor(777353);
    (%o1) 777353
  34. Re:Sour grapes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    But Einstein is the posterboy of scientific brilliance *because* standard physics of the time had so many blindspots. There has to be some unoccupied intellectual ground in for a super genius to make "a huge and profound leap." In other words, once the wheel has already been invented, it's harder to make so much progress so quickly. When intellectual fields and/or society maintain large blindspots, it's easier for an individual to make significant leaps by seeing what others can't. Maybe today physicists maintain fewer blindspots. If a clone of Einstein came onto the physics scene today, it's not clear that Einstein 2 would be all that noticable. It seems like a lot of brilliant minds are already tackling all the problems within physics, and I have to doubt there's so much room for more "huge and profound leaps."

  35. Re:What about... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting
    String theory is patent rubbish

    On what grounds?
    But as a physical theory, it is untestable for one

    This is completely false. There are many tests that could confirm string theory. Whether there are any (below the Planck scale an accessible to human experiments) that can falsify it is another matter.
    and based on shoddy foundations from what I've understood for second.

    This is also far from true. The foundations are speculative but there are many physical reasons why those foundations were postulated. Polchinski gives a good overview.

    Ok, I never got past beginning graduate quantum mechanics but you get enough of a flavor for the way things are done.

    I did get past graduate QM, and graduate quantum field theory, general relativity, and string theory as well, and I would respectfully suggest that you do some reading about its motivations and accomplishments before you dismiss it. You will note that Glashow doesn't even call it rubbish, let alone "patent" rubbish (implying that it is obviously wrong). He merely says that it has not yet suceeded in making any new predictions that have been confirmed by experiment — which is true, but does not make a theory "rubbish".

    Personally, I think it is rather overhyped relative to its accomplishments, but the fact remains that it is the best candidate we have for either a "theory of everything" or even just for a theory of quantum gravity (and I am saying this from the perspective of someone who has worked on a competing theory).
  36. Unexplained Phenomena by Keith+McClary · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Back in 1900 there were a few Unexplained Phenomena such as the Michaelson-Morley experiment, spectral lines, what held the positive and negative kinds of matter apart.

    In retrospect we realize that these were major problems that required fundamental new theories.

    There are also some Unexplained Phenomena today, it's just a question whether these are misinterpreted experiments or something new that existing theory can't explain.

    When there comes to be too much unexplained stuff, people start thinking outside the box, and we get another Feynman. Or Einstein.

  37. Re:Newton by EvanED · · Score: 3, Informative
    If you were to calculate the motion of a pitched baseball under Newtoinian and Einsteinin phsyics, the difference would be too small to measure, and for all practical purposes, they'd give exactly the same answer.

    I'll agree that if you're using physical laws to do calculations and you use Einstein instead of Newton to calculate the flight of a baseball, you're doing way too much work.

    But that doesn't make Newton right.

    I'm gonna quote Feynman because he expresses my feelings very well. This is from Six Easy Pieces (p3 in my copy; you can also find it in the "atoms in motion" chapter of Lectures), but I should say that this is a thought I've had long before reading this:

    We said that the laws of nature are approximate: that we first find the "wrong" ones, and then we find the "right" ones. .... For example, the mass of an object never seems to change: a spinning top has the same weight as a still one. So a "law" was invented: mass is constant, independent of speed. That "law" is now found to be incorrect. Mass is found to increase with velocity, but appreciable increases require velocities near that of light. A true law is: if an object moves with a speed of less than one hundred miles per second the mass is constant to within one part in a million. In some such approximate form this is a correct law. So in practice one might think that the new law makes no significant difference. Well, yes and no. For ordinary speeds we can certainly forget it and use the simple constant-mass law as a good approximation. But for high speeds we are wrong, and the higher the speed, the more wrong we are.

    Finally, and most interesting, philosophically we are completely wrong with the approximate law. Our entire picture of the world has to be altered even though the mass changes by only a little bit. This is a very peculiar thing about the philosophy, or the ideas, behind the laws. Even a very small effect sometimes requires profound changes in our ideas.
  38. Re:Exactly! I think thats the point. by suso · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Duh! I wasn't putting him in the same class as Einstein. I just said that he might come close in terms of how many people know about him. Quick ask someone to name as many scientists as they can. I bet in 5 out of 10 respondants that Carl Sagan and Richard Feyman will be in the list. And I was talking about Scientists in general. Not just physicists.

    But of course leave it to someone on Slashdot to nit pick my comments.

  39. Einstein was the frst slashdotter! by Spy+der+Mann · · Score: 5, Funny

    This is not to say that Einstein wasn't insightful

    At first, he was a troll.
    Then he became interesting.
    But he was very underrated.
    His theories were all flamebait.
    But he was very informative.
    And insightful.
    Once in a while, funny.
    And now he's getting overrated?

    Wow!

  40. Experiments and Focus by Starker_Kull · · Score: 4, Interesting

    In most cases, the major advances in physics were preceded by the discovery and measurement of new phenomena, or old phenomena to a new & unprecedented level of accuracy. A great deal of Galileo's insights were inspired by the telescope, which allowed him to see, in great detail, that the old "imperfect earth/perfect heavens" dichotomy of Aristotle and Official Church Dogma were patiently not so. This led to rapid-fire advances in astronomy, which in turn gave Newton the crucial data to test his theory of gravitation; it's easy to assume big things attract other big things - it is the exact AMOUNT that was crucial, and when he first compared the acceleration at the Earth's surface vs. the acceleration the Moon was undergoing to keep in orbit around the Earth, he found that his inverse square force assumption was way off. He stayed quiet for a decade, when new and much more accurate data came in, correcting the previous estimates of the size, and therefore the distance of the moon. And then the acceleration of the moon towards the earth was exactly right to fit the acceleration of objects near the earth's surface and the assumption of fall off of force by the square. Then he started talking about Universal Gravitation a bit more.

    Einstein, and the rest of the quantum physicists, were following up on the recent discovery of both radioactivity and the unification of electricity and magnetism by Maxwell.

    The point I am (longwindedly) making is that ultimately new data drove the physics. We are at a point right now where it is so expensive to probe in areas we have not looked that we have an embarrassing richness of theories to match a paucity of data. The only clear-cut result that I know of that is outside the bounds of the Standard Model of particle physics is the recent revelation that neutrinos seem to change their type (electron, mu, and tau) as time passes, based on the distribution of neutrinos received on opposite sides of the Earth from the Sun (Sci-Am, I think about a year or two ago). In biology, OTOH, we have just recently been able (due to computer horsepower) to sequence massive numbers of genes, as well as make crude computer simulations of what kind of proteins these genes would construct. It is a new tool, the computer, that is allowing biology to seize the spotlight.

    There will be more Einsteins, but perhaps in biology rather than physics for a while....

    (DISCLAIMER: IANA scientist, but sometimes wish I was....)

  41. strange viewpoint by abes · · Score: 3, Insightful
    First, it's a bit weird he compared Einstein to Watson and Crick. It's true, that Watson and Crick are known for discovering DNA, but stole heavily from Rosalind Frankin. Additionally, they published a single finding. Einstein wrote *several* groundbreaking papers: brownian motion, photoelectrical effect, special theory of relativity, general theory of relativity. The photoelectric effect showed that light is a packet, or quanta, giving birth to quantum mechanics.

    Second, why should we expect another Einstein, or Newton? Given that anyone's accomplishments must be measured relative to the common populace, we would expect people of such stature to be rare.

    There are many factors that go into what makes someone great. Part of it is certainly being in the right time and place. Another is the social climate. Is Einstein the equal of Newton, or vice versa? That is difficult to say. They lived in completely different times. Could one do the same accomplishments as the other? One common element that appears between the two is that they were both fairly prolific (Newton did calculus, physics, and ironically enough, why light is a wave). I'd be curious if other people could come up with other historical science figure that also had several major findings. Feynman? Turing?

  42. Will there ever be another Einstein? by jawahar · · Score: 2, Insightful

    YES, IMHO. Provided we have the same ENVIRONMENT, ECONOMIC and SOCIAL conditions. They seed and stimulate the right individual.

  43. Re:Exactly! I think thats the point. by toddbu · · Score: 2, Interesting
    But of course leave it to someone on Slashdot to nit pick my comments.

    So then would it be wrong of me to point out that you spelled Richard Feynman's name incorrectly for a second time, even after I oh so subtly pointed out that fact in my last response? Or perhaps you were speaking of an alternate reality in which a low level government official inadvertently dropped the "n" when transcribing Feynman's last name on his birth certificate? :-)

    Quick ask someone to name as many scientists as they can.

    I really doubt that your average Joe could come up with these guys. You'd be more likely to hear Bill Nye, or Dr. Jekyll, or that dude who created Frankenstein. Seriously, when we live in an era when fewer than 1/2 the people in this country can name the sitting VP, do you really expect them to come up with either of these guys? I'd be really surprised if 1 in 10 could even name a real scientist. In my unscientific poll of our household, everyone came up with Einstein. For a second scientist, I got Edison, Galileo, and Bill Nye.

    --
    If you don't want crime to pay, let the government run it.
  44. I cannot believe it. by Wilson_6500 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Nobody has mentioned the late Richard Feynman?

    A humoristic and personable genius figure--or at least he comes off as such in his books. Maybe it's all crap--I don't know. I seriously think that his image could bolster the reputation of physicists the world over.

  45. Re:The atomic bomb ruined physics in many ways by Jim_Callahan · · Score: 2, Informative

    The shape of ships' hulls had nothing at all to do with physics predictions. Ideal shapes were determined by a fellow named Froud(sp) in Britain several centuries ago by carving wooden models and putting them through the liquid equivalent of a wind tunnel. Completely empirical process, no mathematical modelling whatsoever beforehand (though one result, the dimensionless Froud number, is one of the most important dimensionless numbers in engineering, right up there with the Reynold's number).
     
    So, yeah, as another fellow stated, it was an engineering problem, not a physics problem. Even today, the use of physics directly applied to the problem of ship's hulls will break your computer if you attempt to solve for a limit on something like speed or overall drag resistance. (Not that it can't be solved, in a way, but it imvolves what my professors call "engineering approximations", i.e. assumptions that are maybe true in limited circumstances).
     
    Ballistics, I'm told, was similarly empirical, though I don't know anyone specializing in Aero so verifying your assertion regarding airplane wings would take more work than I'm willing to exert.

    --
    ...it's really a sad day for America when we require a goddamn ACT OF CONGRESS to make our DVD players work properly. ~
  46. Thus the establishment has always argued by snowwrestler · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Throughout centuries numerous scientists have argued that the simple questions have all been answered, that only the niche, complex and esoteric aspects will be studied from here on out. In fact many physicists felt that way shortly before the end of the 19th century.

    Today I'm betting that, like then, there are still plenty of fundamental questions left to answer (although we might not know how to ask them yet). And the funny thing about truly fundamental questions is that they usually have pretty simple answers. But getting there through established theories and avenues of experimentation is often impossible; it takes a major shift in thought.

    But the results can still be simple. While the mathematics that Einstein ultimately employed to describe the theory are complex, the general relativity theory itself is so simple in concept that high school kids can grasp it by simple analogy--the rubber mat with heavy objects on it.

    And in fact Einstein himself struggled with the math--but that did not prevent him from formulating the theory. The theory came first, then with help he found the math that could describe it. Einstein's problems with advanced math did not keep him from making major breakthroughs, and I doubt it will stop the "next Einstein" either.

    --
    Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
  47. complexity does not necessarily mean brilliance by Quadraginta · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I dunno. One of the things that made Einstein great, from the scientific point of view, is that he cleared away a great deal of 19th-century complexity in optics and mechanics and replaced it with a theoretical framework of such dazzling simplicity that anyone could grasp its basic principles, but of such power that understanding its full implications demands high intelligence and decades of sustained study.

    It's like the way Copernicus swept away the huge complexity of the Ptolemaic astronomer's theory of planetary orbits, all those cycles and epicycles, with the simple and powerful idea of the elliptical orbit. Or how Mendeleev replaced the 18th century's bewildering lists of correlations between chemical properties of substances with the simple and powerful organizational principles of the Periodic Table.

    Even in my own experience as a theoretician I find the truly brilliant ideas are not complex. They're insights that drastically simplify and clarify. They're the kind of things that, when you understand them, make you slap your head in awe and envy.

    So, from this point of view, the hideous complexity of modern high-energy physics theories could well be a sign that they lack brilliance, that another Einstein is needed to clear away all the baroque epicycles, so to speak, and replace it all with something beautifully simple and far more powerful.

    Of course, this might not be true -- it might instead be the case that the basic structure of the universe is simply too complex for ordinary humans to understand even its principles. But I find this hard to believe (for no logical reason, I admit).

    So I personally disagree with Mr. Horgan. I think he's just channeling Albert Michelson in 1896 ("The more important fundamental laws and facts of physical science have all been discovered....Our future discoveries must be looked for in the sixth place of decimals.") Like Michelson, Horgan thinks that because no revolution has happened in 50 years one will never happen. But it was almost 300 years between Newton and Einstein. So I'd give it another century or two before giving up.

  48. The fact of the matter is, genius is rarely by holyexcrement · · Score: 2, Interesting

    recognized. Some scientists from this generation will stand out in retrospect, just as some from previous generations did. The fact that the general american public no longer knows who is at the forefront of scientific innovation merely speaks to the sad state of scientific education in the United States. If the situation does not change, we will all suffer the consequences.

    --
    and wish in the other...
  49. there will be another discovery! by recharged95 · · Score: 2, Insightful
    that his colleagues' belief in hyperspace theories in spite of the lack of evidence will encourage the insidious notion that science "is merely another kind of religion."

    I agree to that comment in the article such that we (the applied physics community) are somewhat wrapped with the theoretical clan of Einstein wannabes. Physics back in 1905 was not separated into 2 styles (theoretical & experimental/applied). You created a theory, then a gedanke experiment, then a physical experiment and finally provide an application--doesn't happen currently. In addition, quantum mechanics and following software OOD has completely turned our thought process on its head. From that and the computer, a lot of the other disciplines (Math, Biology, Chemistry and others) are using so many physics-derived concepts that the category "physics" has become blurred aside from pure theoretical studies. Then again, most cultures nowadays are so wrapped up into politics or $profiting$ that the real science is missed to be rediscovered years later--as Einstein found.

    I think the next revolutionary discoveries that are "categorized under physics" will either be in Biophysics or non-linear science (aka Chaos Theory). Lots of interesting applications and major shifts in our 'thought processes' are evident in those studies. Cynically, the next Einstein will likely come after we all are convinced that Intelligent Design is fact and Math&Science are not requirements in High School anymore (J/K)--nah, really, there will be another "Einstein" from the TFA's context... in due time.

  50. The building is now a Walmart by FishandChips · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The article misses out on a couple of things, perhaps. Einstein also stands out because he was an intensely moral man who had interesting and brave things to say on the sheer mystery of life. He was a highly gifted communicator who wrote well on a wide range of subjects far beyond his own field.

    Even if you don't subscribe to the "myth of genius", men of such rounded accomplishment are very rare. Knowledge has expanded so rapidly that it is hard enough to know your own field, let alone know enough worth saying about other fields. Perhaps Einstein's was the last generation that could span, if not all knowledge, then a substantial part of it. We are all specialists these days.

    Besides, we now live in a world in which enterprise and individuality of the Einsteinian kind are less appreciated. Since his heyday, so much has been subordinated to the dismal science of economics, the realm where the beancounter is king and inspiration is seen as a shocking waste of tax dollars or corporate profits. Arguably, the closest equivalent to Einstein today is not a scientist but the Dalai Lama, another gifted communicator who understands that knowledge alone is not enough.

    --
    Las qué passoun
    tournoun pas maï
  51. Einestein - Why he is so great. by asadz31 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    1. Einstein became famous and a household name in the year 1919, when during a solar eclipse, it was found and experimentaly proved, how gravity of the Sun bends light (which was predicted and measured by Einstein about 15 years back (1905))

    2. Einstein became famous when he redefined Newton's definition of gravity, proving that "action of a distance" is wrong.

    3. From Einstein's theory of gravity we know (and in fact we are now trying to measure it now a days) why a distant supernova changes the height of Empire State building.

    4) Einstein's is famous because of the nature of his invention, we have been living in a Universe which is defined by him; for example: the concept of relativity, which is highly unintuitive concept, but the moment we understand it, we say "how the hell he understood/guess it".

    5) Einstein is famous because of his definition of time-space relationship is more than a science fiction.

    5) Einstein is famous for his look; he just looks like a genius; and on the top of that he is humble.

    Now question is would there be another Einstein? Yes, of course, but not in our lifetime.

    However, there are lots of inventions in the area of particle physics, as Richard Feynman once said, "Now I can say nobody understand particle physics", it's a extremely complicated area to understand any behaviors of those sub atomic particles; so it has little meaning to ordinary people.

    Anyone can get Einstein like fame, by answering and proving one of the following questions,

    1. What is gravity?
    2. Why is the Universe so large and so old?
    3. (How) did the universe begin?
    4. (How) will the universe end?

    We will know at least one answer of the above within next 500 years. A new Einstein will born.

  52. Re:Easier than reading the Heisenberg paper by vertinox · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Every time I read that, the content changes into an unpredictiable state.

    --
    "I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
    -Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)