Slashdot Mirror
Tech-Ed Funding to be Tied to Copyright-Ed?
feminazi writes "Ars Technica is reporting that California Assemblyman Ed Chavez has proposed legislation that would require recipients of an educational technology grant program to educate their students in copyright law as well. There are three areas of education that would be required: 'ethical behavior in regards to the use of information technology,' 'the concept, purpose, and significance of a copyright,' and 'the implications of illegal peer-to-peer network file sharing.'"
First off, let me say that I'm a strong supporter of the EFF, Creative Commons, and hold many libertarian (lower-case "l") beliefs. The thought of the government mandating the instruction of agenda-based ethics makes my skin crawl. However, in the interest of balance, here's a different viewpoint:
Like it or not, copyright violation is against the law. When you're learning about how to handle firearms, drive a car, invest in stocks, skydive--pratically anything that involves risk, the you're *always* taught how do those activities safely and in accordance with the law. Many people hate mandatory motorcycle helmet laws. However, does anyone really beleive that riders shouldn't be educated on this law and the reasons for having it? People who misuse technology are doing risky things: opening themselves (or their parents) upto identity theft by getting a trojan from a P2P app, allowing their PC to be turned into a DDoS zombie, sexual predators, and criminal and civil liablity incurred by swapping pirated music and software. Many of these risks are blown out of proportion by the press, but that doesn't make them any less dangerous. Computer users need all the education they can get. Too much technical training is focused on the nuts-and-bolts on how to do something with a PC. As pervasive as the Internet has become in our lives, perhaps we should begin to explore the larger social issues in intro-level instruction as well?
Entrepreneur : (noun), French for "unemployed"
Sure, at face value this is about getting kids under control for the benefit of the Copyright holders. But, so long as the education is accurate, can you think of a better thing than a population who understands copyright law, what a mess has been made of it, and how crippling the status quo is? Anything that serves to inform is good.
Regardless of what people's personal opinions are on p2p file sharing, the fact is that it is against copyright law. Should it be? Well, only people who understand the issue can intelligently consider that. So bring on the truth.
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.
Will this really work? Perhaps on a few individuals. As with many such compulsory "lessons", the students and teachers would go through with it. But they'd both know to disregard it. Thus it will have no effect but to waste time, money, and other resources.
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
Fuck you Ed. Politicians should be required to take ethics courses...
~S
Maybe that because it is different. Depriving a retailer of a physical product is not the same as downloading a digital copy from someone! If I download a movie off the net which I would never purchase anyways is far different than stuffing one down my shorts at Walmart. Walmart paid for that DVD and by stealing it, I have stolen money from them. If I download a movie I haven't taken something away from anyone. I'm not saying its legal or moral, but it isn't stealing!
http://religiousfreaks.com/I think formal, unbiased education on copyright law would be a great thing. Unfortunately, I don't think it'll stay that way for long. The copyright industries are going to see an "in" and send their lobbyists on a feeding frenzy.
Or did they just want the standard "corporate big-wigs getting rich should have their methods and profits guaranteed?"
Just want to know which I should be teaching...
I will never live for sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine.
To tell them to go to hell.
I was nodding along, thinking "sure, why not" right up until I read the part about "the implications of illegal peer-to-peer network file sharing."
Schools are not there for those kind of shenanigans.
I find this incredibly offensive, if PSAs and advertising doesn't cut it, then that is their problem.
The curriculum should not be set by interest groups.
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
I could maybe get behind this idea if one of the areas covered included fair use. Why am I not surprised this area is left out, especially in California. Remember, according to Jack Valenti "fair use is not in the law".
About a decade ago I got to know some of my relatives living in places like Poland and the Ukraine. Many of them grew up under the various communist regimes. This sounds an awful lot like what they had to go through at various levels of education. At least some of them were aware that it was nothing but indoctrination, and they went along with it because they had very little choice otherwise. But in their hearts they knew it was nothing but indoctrination, if not outright brainwashing. I would hope those in California would have a similar understanding of the situation they are in.
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
I earned my degree through a business/technology college. The CS/BSIT/BSMT degrees are all geared for consultants and entrepreneurs. A class on copyright law, application for, and general information about would be extremely useful. And a significantly better legal requirement then the manditory Constitution Day class.
-Rick
"Most people in the U.S. wouldn't know they live in a tyrannical state if it walked up and grabbed their junk." - MyFirs
I can easily see this having the opposite effect of its intention, namely programmers understanding the limitations and loopholes of copyright better than they do now. I mean how many projects have been shutdown by C&D letters sent under the DMCA? How many of those were bogus if you actually knew the law? If they're really going to teach copyright (Including the extensions and expansions), then maybe some programmers would better understand fair use and the "protections" provided by the DMCA.
Or maybe that's just my wishful thinking.
... And so it comes to this.
They can call it C.A.R.E.--Copyright Abuse Resistance Education. Maybe even have cops come in and show off a simulated pirated download, so the kids can identify them when they encounter them. Teach the students to avoid peer-to-peer pressure...
Copyright is a tricky area. There are many myths that education might help to dispel. Consider these myths: 1) If it doesn't have a copyright notice, it's not copyrighted. 2) If I don't charge for it, it's not a violation. 3) If it's posted to Usenet it's in the public domain. 4) My posting was just fair use! 5) If you don't defend your copyright you lose it. 6) If I make up my own stories, but base them on another work, my new work belongs to me. 7) They can't get me, defendants in court have powerful rights! 8) Oh, so copyright violation isn't a crime or anything? 9) It doesn't hurt anybody -- in fact it's free advertising. 10) They e-mailed me a copy, so I can post it. Phew, you know what? After all that, I'm taking up horseback riding.
If the students are *really* taught what copyrights are, how they were originally intended to work in the Constitution and the concepts of fair use, then the students will know when and how full of crap any 'anti-piracy' group might be. An educated group of consumers.
:)
This may end up as a blow *against* the industry lobbyists, as it could create an educated group of consumers. Any EFF volunteers want to teach a class or two?
Better for the MPAA/RIAA to leave them ignorant and terrified so they fold when the letter arrives in the mail.
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
An education system depends on quality educators in order to function well. That almost goes without saying. The end result of ideas like this may result in the destruction of the system in which it is "infecting". That will hold especially true if those who would receive such funding end up avoiding California.
Much the same has reportedly been happening with Kansas. As the debate over intelligent design heats up, many talented educators (at all levels, be it university or high school) are now considering either leaving the state, or are not considering taking jobs there. That is by far one of the most harmful things which can happen to an educational system.
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
"Hello, My name is Ed Chavez, I'd like to begin today by saying I am a puppet of 'particular music and filmed entertainment industries'. In this speech I will use buzz words and phrases to spread FUD in order to train you, such as 'content', 'illegal file-sharing' and 'costs to taxpayers'. I'm sure you're all aware of how precious bandwidth is. Oh so precious, like oxygen, gold, puppies and smiling babies. We should bow to the industry, for they provide us with such precious content for our precious bandwidth. Like petroleum, there is only so much bandwith on this earth, and peer-to-peer is consuming it, illegally no doubt. At this illegal, costly-to-taxpayers rate, the world will soon run out of bandwidth, and it will be gone to us forever. These industries are acting selflessly to protect us. They bravely sue grandmothers and 14 year old girls to protect the content we require to sustain our daily lives. Do you not love your benefactors? A vote against this measure is a vote for communism. You are against communism, aren't you?"
i don't care
And they can start the day with:
I pledge allegiance to the RIAA
and to the media conglomerates for which it stands.
One nation, under DRM.
With perpetual copyright and a compliant Congress,
for those with the most lobbyists.
Regardless of what people's personal opinions are on p2p file sharing, the fact is that it is against copyright law.
P2P file-sharing isn't against copyright law. Sharing copyrighted files, via a P2P file-sharing program, without the copyright owner's permission is against copyright law.
allow me to play devil's advocate for a moment
to me, it seems that the gist of your argument is that since you haven't gotten your hands on a physical thing, you haven't stolen anything. you aren't depriving a retailer of a product or the money they could have gotten in exchange for it.
i submit that a physical object is not necessarily required for theft. if you're a gamer, does it incur your ire when someone steals from you in game? if you developed a neat idea and had it on your hard drive, would it bother you when someone copied it onto their USB drive, and distributed it or claimed it as their own? how about your digitized poetry? your art? i'm not using these as exactly analogous to downloading a movie, but the concept of a noncorporeal object of value is important.
you also speak of downloading off the internet something which you wouldn't've purchased for. to be pedantic, that is not strictly speaking, true. by downloading it, you are spending clock cycles, storage space, bandwidth, and at least some of your own time to obtain said item. now, it may be true that you wouldn't spend $15 for a dvd copy of it, but would you pay $0.01 to see it, or download it? how about $0.40? if it's worth downloading for you, either you want to just have it for the sake of having it, or you've got mild interest in seeing it. either way, there's some price point where you'd be willing to exchange something of value for it. taking even a copy of it without reimbursing the 'owner' is, in a word, a theft. moreover, you don't get to set the price that you pay for it.
moreover, stealing is (amongst other things):
to take (the property of another) without right or permission
the act of theft
to get or effect surreptitiously or artfully
not to get into a slashdot debate about intellectual property, but legally, a movie is, generally speaking, the property of Some Entity Not You. you can be sure that said Not You entity will not give you right or permission to obtain said movie without paying.
now, that being said, i'm a proponent of p2p filesharing in the general case.
i loathe the RIAA and the MPAA and their tactics. i think they've taken entirely the wrong tack. not all theft is inherently immoral, mind you, though i'm notably quiet about the morality of filesharing.
i'm not saying i do it, and i'm not saying i don't.
and i think that you're right that downloading a file is significantly different from stuffing one's outerwear at walmart, but hey--let's not kid ourselves about what we, fundamentally, are doing, alright?
'ethical behavior in regards to the use of information technology,'
This would be the part where they teach kids that using technology to build a copyright mechanism that takes over your customer's computer, and creates security holes, such as the recent Sony-BMG scandal, is unethical. Or perhaps this would be teaching kids about the ethics of setting up a cartel wherein labels make a lot of money off record sales, and artists don't.
'the concept, purpose, and significance of a copyright,'
From this page:
"By granting the copyright holder exclusive rights over a work for a limited period of time, the system fosters the long-term dissemination of new intellectual works for society as a whole." (emphasis added). This would encourage children to discuss why the current copyright system in the United States, where the period of copyrighted works is continually extended, is fundamentally broken.
'the implications of illegal peer-to-peer network file sharing.'
And finally, children would learn that the big record labels took about 5 years too long to get into the online music distribution buisness, so that by the time they did, there were illegal free alternatives which produce superior (read: not DRMed, and therefore superior from the consumer viewpoint) products. We could teach kids that file sharing networks allow people to hear artists they wouldn't otherwise hear on pop-dominated radio stations and TV, and promote more diverse and creative music. And, we could teach them that illegal file sharing doesn't seem to have an impact on record sales.
Somehow I don't think this is what Chavez had in mind.
From a high school student perspective they'll take this about as serious as D.A.R.E. or Sex Ed; just another hour for kids to draw ligers and unicorns.
Wow - there's a piece of 90's pop-culture that hasn't really aged well in the slightest:
0 332617729
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=483760909
I think educating people on copyright is fine as long as it's mentioned that copyright in the US it's under the control of one knee-jerk company protecting a cartoon of a rat. If that's brought into the equation - then educate their brains out.
i find this kind of proposed legislation amusing, particularly since i don't think the movie and record companies really understand what kind of curricula could result from a mandate like this.
clearly what hollywood wants is a class that will teach junior and senior high school students to be good little consumers who will buy movies and music from regular retailers without question. they want these kids to each buy their own deeveedees and ceedees and encourage their friends to buy the same and not share.
however, a good civics curricula on copyright will include an historical discussion of copyright - why it was created by the english parliament in the 15th and 16th centuries, what the constitution says about copyright and the legislation congress has passed over the past 200+ years. also, a list of important court cases about copyright ought to be discussed. a discussion of what is legal and what is not should be an essential discussion of copyright.
i think a class on the subject would be a good thing, especially considering how importat content and information have become in modern society.
of course, when the media industries figure out that having a public that is fully conversant with copyright law, its purposes and limitations, then the legislation in question will probably die a quick death. the media industry's arguments about copyright being a 'property right' are based on a misinterpretation of copyright law and many of the media industry's positions on copyright are built on the public not knowing what copyright is about or what it's really for.
much of what the media industry wants in copyright legislation is dependent on the public being confused about about copyright. anything that clarifies copyright for the public will work against the media industries goals.
when religion is no longer the opiate of the masses, governments will resort to real opiates.
Well, what do you expect? This kind of political intrusion into education is an inevitable consequence of a socialised education system. The moment you take something out of private hands and let the Government run it, it's going to become a poorly-funded, poorly-run political football.
The solution is to privatise education completely, and let parents, businesses and charitable trusts run schools - and, more importantly, let parents send children to the best schools they can afford, schools of their own choosing (or, alternatively, homeschool).
The ultimate in subversion... after all, why should the public schools pay for books when they're willing to provide it for free!!
The important question is, will this education be a vehicle for {RI,MP}AA propaganda, or will it actually be informative?
But taking credit for others work isn't stealing, and why I HATE when plagiarism is taught like this. Plagiarism is FRAUD. Nothing more, nothing less. Severe, yes, but only fraud because it fits the definition perfectly whereas "stealing" it is obviously manipulated to fit in and still doesn't sound right.
If you believe in privacy, and believe you have "nothing to hide" at the same time, you're a goddammed idiot
i was born a free and sovereign being ..
..
..
..
..
..
..
.. so often espoused these days .. is a very convenient system for controlling natural beings .. by those in a privileged position of power.. haven't you noticed how the vast majority of politicians are either lawyers .. doctors .. or accountants ..
.. forgive me .. their education makes them qualified and gives them the "right" to rule over my life ..
.. though still to limiting links:
.. is knowing that it is destined to fail miserably and most likely with a catastrophic result .. though it maybe with a whimper do to a lack of atmospheric oxygen ..
i never granted anyone authority over my life and being
i don't require anyone granting me rights and privileges
and i never agreed to play by anyone's rules
but the vast majority of people
who have gone through the state controlled education system (mass brain washing) and grown up being influenced by a corporate controlled media (propaganda machine)
are not likely to know or remember this fact..
the vast majority of beings are/have accepted a "Social" world based on competition and control VS cooperation and empowerment
the rule of law and political party based democracy (limited dictatorships)
oh!
John Taylor Gatto - Challenging the Myths of Modern Schooling
http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/
The Underground History of American Education
http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/chapters/index.htm
some relevant
How I Clobberd Every Bureaucratic Cash-Confiscatory Agency Known To Man- Mary Croft
http://www.wealth4freedom.com/law/Mary.htm
Natural person - Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_person
Paradigm
http://www.naturalperson.com/
Natural Persons
http://naturalpersons.org/
the only comforting fact in my life
ie - through the poorly thought out and worded DMCA laws, that, through encryption technologies, will virtually extend copyrights to infinity..
Oh - that work is encrypted - you cannot decrypt it without authorization, meaning you can NEVER *legally* view / reproduce it without the encryption.
Encryption technologies for copyrighted works should have embedded date calculations that disable the encryption once the copyright period has expired, otherwise, the product illegaly extends copyright.
Who is general failure, and why is he reading my hard drive?
The MPAA has (rather unsuccessfully) held classes in high schools across the US (such as one they had about a year or two ago in Urbana, Illinois) ostensibly aimed at teaching the students about American copyright law. It was reported in the local paper (the News-Gazette) at the time. Their view, like yours below, was dangerously myopic and factually incorrect. The kids in Urbana saw through it and asked tough questions which the corporate representative couldn't answer.
Knowing how close representatives are to their corporate funders, I strongly suspect that any state program will be no different in California.
No, it's not blanketly "against copyright law". But it's so nice of you to dismiss the value of others opinions on the matter while asserting your own incorrect one.
In the US, distributing copies of any copyrighted work depends on the license under which the work is distributed. Under some licenses, legal distribution can occur. I can legally share copies of any Free Software program I want. I can share copies of any work not under copyright—works in the public domain. I can share copies of my own copyrighted works. And the mechanism I use to do this is immaterial (be it a "p2p" program or something else).
Digital Citizen
Entitled "Ethics in the Information Age" at University of Maryland (UMUC)
The text books for this class were
Case Studies in Information Technology Ethics (second edition) by Richard A Spinello, published by Prentice Hall.
Ethics in Information Technology by George Reynolds published by Thompson.
This class was anything but a "anti download" brainwashing session.
Most of it focussed on the kinds of issues we developers and engineers have to contend with in terms of protecting the privacy of customer data, product liability, international/cross-cultural issues, and things like that.
The course started with an overview of how to do an Ethical Analysis of a situation, then we discussed case studies for the rest of the term, and wrote opinions, etc. I think it was a very valuable experience, and I think that all IT professionals should, indeed, take this class.
Yes, we did talk about software piracy, and other forms of copyright/patent violation. By and large, the mood of the class in analyzing these issues was that yes, illegal copying is wrong, but not as wrong relative to say, stealing a car or killing someone. Mainly, I think we learned that making unauthorized copies of software in a professional capacity is especially bad (even if it's for charity) mainly because you're exposing a broader group of stakeholders (ie. your employers, their stockholders, etc) to the liability. It was really an interesting and enlightening class, and it make me think about some things I never thought about before.
These are my friends, See how they glisten. See this one shine, how he smiles in the light.
..complete with handcuff pictures.
..what about countries where it's legal to do that? Will they talk about countries that don't have any copyright law?
These advertisements were openly mocked when I was in school, and I can just imagine how badly they'll be laughed at. I find it interesting that they focus on peer-to-peer networks though. What about the evils of sharing music with your friends?
How about some history, or will that be re-written? Many developing countries didn't always hold foreign patent protection in the highest regard.
I actually don't have a problem with this in schools, so long as it's facts and not biased, legally processed corporate driven being presented.
..don't panic
*Whooosh*
I'm on your side. My comment was humor. Look at his "buying" line I quoted and look at how he used it and look at what it was he wasn't buying. And then look at the surreal usage of "stealing" that I ascribed to that sort of "not buying". If he doesn't "buy it" then he is "stealing" money out of someone pocket. And just to make sure this horse is throughly beaten to death, my point was to highlight the fact that things can get very surreal and logic goes out the window when you missapply words in that manner, and that maybe we should be more careful with our words.
-
- - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.