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New Genres For The Revolution
Last week's Gamasutra question of the week dealt with the possibility of new genres for Nintendo's Revolution system. Some interesting answers from the industry, as always. From the article: "I would say the interesting part is not what new genres will come about, but how most existing genres will be transformed by this. For example, fighting games will no longer have to be about special moves and combos when you can simply put one controller in each hand and start punching and blocking like in real life (maybe strap one on a leg to kick). "
I absolutely hate fighting games that rely on memorizing combos to determine who is the better fighter. Even on the Gamecube, fighting games like Smash Brothers break this horrible standard and let everybody smash buttons and do every move with ease.
Nintendo has been creating new genres for a while.
FanFictionRecs.net
If this is done well then I can see the revolution being used for excercise as well as fun. Much like what the Eyetoy was marketed to do, minus the rootkit.
"Oh boy"
My big fear is that the Revolution is going to over-popularize shallow physical gaming such that everyone starts doing it and suddenly cooking simulators and orchestra-conducting games are going to be popping up on all formats.
So what's next? I think Simpson's nailed it!
Bart: I want to go to the Yard Work Simulator.
Marge: But when I ask you to do yard work... *sigh*
Will I have to argue with my co-worker to get them away from their "Work Simulator"?
Proof by very large bribes. QED.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I can just see a wave of porn games cumming out for this, Just imagine its not the size of the controller, its the way you use it!
For example, fighting games will no longer have to be about special moves and combos when you can simply put one controller in each hand and start punching and blocking like in real life
With our luck, we'll have the kids doing the Mighty Morphin' power rangers coreographic routines to activate the combos..
Huh (move) hah (move) hah (move) hoh!
(eew)
If fighting games take the same amount of effort as actual sparring (or even shadowboxing) then what's the point?
I mean, I guess it would be nifty to be able to find a sparring partner in the computer, but still, might as well hit a real human.
For those who don't know about 'gorilla arm', there's a reason why touchscreens and VR controls haven't become huge: they cause more fatigue than standard low-impact controls like keyboard/mouse
I believe that, best-case scenario, the Revolution's controller is going to give developers the "Permission to Think Freely," to borrow the term.
If conventional wisdom is correct, creativity in large game development studios is hampered by publishers' requirements: bring about a return on their investments by recreating past successes. (This means sequels and titles that stick closely to existing genres.) The smallest developers often follow a similar path: they want to start turning a profit so that they can actually eat lunch once in a while. So, they (the ones who are supposed to be doing all the innovating!) tend to stick to tried-and-true themes as well. Just look at all the Match 3 games out there.
Perhaps the Revolution's controller, simply by being completely nutty, is going to give larger development studios the impetus to ask what crazy things they can do with it? Publishers will not only allow this approach, but demand it. Their press releases will be filled with all the newfangled things a particular title will do with the controller.
Maybe.
I do lament the fact that, out of the Big Three, the platform that seems to court indies the most is the one that has received such a lukewarm reception. If Nintendo opened things up similarly, I'd love to be able to develop games for use with the Revolution controller.
But maybe that's just the lazy me talking. When I think about it, there's probably plenty of innovation we can pull out of the keyboard and the mouse.
We're indie. We're working on our 14th game.
We don't know exactly how it works, but we have some pretty good hints:
1. The controller is supposed to contain a gyroscopic sensor, like the one found in WarioWare Twisted. It may control more than one, since it's supposed to be able to detect pitch and yaw as well.
2. The console is supposed to come with sensors to place on the TV, so those can be used to not only figure out how large the screen is (useful in figuring out where on the screen the controller is pointed) but also distance through triangulation. That may be done with infrared or RF.
This page specifically says "[The controller] interacts with a sensor bar placed above, below, or near televisions. The bar contains two sensors that communicate with the controller using Bluetooth technology."
OTOH, i could see the warning on the packages:
I would like to see games that helps or motivates a person to train their physical fitness with controllers hand-held and/or worn on the feet with an adjustable clip. With a controller on each limb I would imagine all sports that don't involve resistance could be developed for. Consider a game in which a player competes directly against a boxer or martial artist. Consider aerobic exercise a la Dance Dance Revolution.
...
-Anonymous
This was what I was thinking, in addition to the other standards (light sabers, wands, avatars):
Karate games (with pads on elbows, gloves on hands) - controller in dominant hand;
Dance games (similar);
Rave games - at first, like dance games, later it will interact with external lighting pods and change the music itself (feedback loops), and multiple players will make it behave differently - in advanced forms it will be used for online parties, dance competitions, and mini-raves for teens;
Karaoke games - the controller will have a voice mike expansion for this, and as you move it and press buttons, different karaoke effects will kick in - again, will borrow concepts from Rave games above - really annoying if you have bad singers, of course, and likely to show up on Police Blotters;
Inevitable FPS variants - Be The Cop, Be The Grunt, Be The Spy, Be The Warrior, Be The Gerbil, whatever. But more fun than the ones they crank out now
Online games like Sims 3: The Revolution where people literally interact with the game - also at home versions.
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Yeah, isn't that terrible? Games that reward skill and experience! Heaven forbid! I mean, what's the point of a game where a newbie can't defeat a seasoned player by smashing the buttons really fast?
Circumcision is child abuse.
... Massively Multiplayer Online Solitaire
John Madden is booked to be the announcer in a series that will surely take the market by storm.
Latewire
Think of controlling...let's just say for common reference point, controlling a Macross style Veritech fighter in robot mode. You can make the robot go in any direction in any time by moving the controller in that direction. This ALONE would actually provide much more control than any other single controller that I've ever seen. Full 3-d axis control. Put on top of that the ability to change the angle of reference by pointing the controller in a different direction. It would probably be foreign for about..10 minutes? Then it would become comfortable. After a few hours, then it would become natural. After a few days of play, assuming a top-notch level of responsiveness, you'll be amazing yourself with the feats that you can perform.
Yard work, when done for real, is horrible, sweaty, and you might possibly even get some grease (or insert horrible... err.. stuff..) on your flesh.. For REAL! "Yard Work Simulator" (nice title you market it) on the other hand lets you get the same physical excercise but with the added option of - 1. Slaying yard martians (poss) 2. Emptying nuclear bins or 3: slaying flu birds and disposing of them (in the correct way of course) in wacky places, for points!!!! And all for fun too.... and backed up by that 'I must get to the next level to seee what they do next with the graphics' feel. Thats why a Revolution controller strapped to your shin could make all the difference.
You mouselook and aim with a mouse on a pc... whats the difference? I think the Revolution will be a big hit with adult gamers like me, I love 1st person shooters on PC too but n ot on consoles, that is I think untill the revolution comes out.. I cant wait!
put one controller in each hand and start punching and blocking like in real life
Ah ah ... This always crack me up : video games are for slackers and couch potatoes. Real life fighting means at least leaving your basement and going to practice some kind of sport ... (well yeah ok, there's DDR ... that's a little different ;)
With that aggravating beauty, Lulu Walls.
Resident Evil 4 is a kiddy game that Nintendo tried to censor? Resident Evil Remake? Resident Evil Zero? Killer 7? Eternal Darkness? Metroid Prime? BMX XXX? Gun? Medal Gear Solid? Splinter Cell (and every other Tom Clancy game)? XIII? There are many other M rated games that are on the Nintendo Gamecube. And then, of course, there are the many, many T rated games. I know, I know. Don't feed the trolls.
Click on that link. That picture is not the Revolution controller I've seen. Has there just been a revision?
Unfortunately, American football (or even soccer) is not violent enough teach true hand-to-hand combat that occasionally break out in European stadiums.
Oh yeah, i'm going to love all the inevitable news stories that will crop up after the first one of those that lets you pull over the perp and then switch the controller over to "club mode."
This Space Intentionally Left Blank
...a Richard Gere simulator?
Not only does the controller appear to have a large number of degrees of freedom, all the ideas for having one player use multiple controllers magnifies this immensely. The genius is that it will be *intuitive* to use multiple controllers. One in each hand is the obvious bit, and the article suggested strapping one to a leg for kicking in a fighting game. One person suggested making a headset for "free-look" type uses. You could have a fighting game with one controller in each hand to punch/block, one on each leg for kicking/moving, and one on your head for ducking/dodging etc. 5 controllers all for one person might seem inane, but if they made alternate controllers that had no buttons but just the positioning detection with little velcro straps, you would no longer feel like an idiot strapping one to your ankle. Now, once you imagine this little "mini" controller sans buttons, there's all kinds of interesting new directions. I don't know how many of these can talk to the Revolution hardware simultaneously, but if you could get 12-16 going at once, you could have all kinds of fun with "home motion capture." Imagine a movie making "game" where you act out all the parts in motion capture. Imagine a totally new style of dancing game, where you *really* dance. Or imagine a dance instruction "game" for two people. You and your partner strap on ankle bracelts, wrist bracelets, and maybe something around the shoulders, and really dance. Add in a scoring mechanism for accuracy, toss in an online component for competition, and you're in a whole new world. Now you're really talking about a revolution.
.5 sec while the animation finishes. In effect, now you're just talking about mouse gestures in 3D space. If the on-screen avatar doesn't track your movements accurately, smoothly, and convincingly, then you're just memorizing gestures to trigger a move--and that would be physically tiring with not much reward, and we'll go back to pressing buttons.
However, this also illustrates the biggest challenge to be faced by Revo developers, IMHO. In all current games, your characters have canned animations to represent your moves. You press the A-button or whatever, and the sword swipe animation playes. It's pre-rendered, beginning to end. Revo games will have to do realtime skeletal animation, so that you can begin swiping your sword, check it mid-stroke, and block with your shield. If you use physical movement to trigger canned animations, it will feel surreal, and you'll quickly give it up because it won't be responsive. You'll start to swipe your sword, and the game won't respond for
In my opinion, this is a good thing. For *years* what we've needed is better physical modelling, not better graphics. Better physics and better AI are really the key to better gaming. Graphics have been mostly "good enough" for 5 years, while physics and AI have only changed marginally since 3D games became ubiquitous. AI's a tougher nut to crack, but we have to have physics to make our virtual worlds interactive. So hopefully developers will target the older demographic that Nintendo is after. They don't really give a rip about better graphics (to a point), but make the controlls unresponsive, the physical simulation overly simplistic, or otherwise make the experience jarring, and you'll lose them in 5 minutes flat, never to return. Win them over, though, and I think you'll have a license to print money.
If anybody has the guts to try something really radical, there are interesting times ahead. We shall see...
Be The Gerbil
Nope, not Richard Gere sim, perhaps I should have said Be The Hamster.
Yes, for Hamtaro Interactive games.
I expect small fry will find these really fun, well, and all those Furrie Folk.
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Looking at the picture in the referenced article it looks like Nintendo changed the controller a bit and it looks like that it may either be an analogue or a digital joystick. It also has two underside buttons, vs the one in the initial version. Compare:
- controller-at-a-glance-20050915061358181-000.jpgn trol.jpg
- original: http://things.wordherders.net/archives/revolution
- article: http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20060215/rev-co
This leads me to believe that Nintendo is still tweaking the controller and that we may see some more changes in the final version.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
The gyros detect the direction (yaw, roll, pitch) of the controller and the angle of the controller.
An accelerometer detects the amount of movement in 3D space that you make. It's probably in the same unit as the gyros (see some examples at http://www.dprg.org/projects/2003-01a/).
This is all you need to determine your position in 3D space. The gyros give you the direction, and you can derive the speed and distance traveled by the controller from the acceleration (assuming there is a clock that times the duration of the movement).
It's quite trivial and does not require any sensors outside of the controller, or any additional inputs such as bouncing infrared beams.
Depending on how fine tuned the spacial sensors are, the controller may not even have gyroscopes.
You can look at it two ways:
1) Spacial sensor positioned near the center of gravity for the remote. Two gyroscopes measure pitch and yaw, respectively.
2) Four spacial sensors are on (or near) the four corners of the controller, one per corner. Their position relative to the sensors connected to the cube tell its spacial position, and their position relative to each other tell the pitch/yaw.
However, I think that 1 would be easier, as you'd have to do less calculations on the fly.
Everyone is harping about the new posibilities for physical interaction in Revolution games, but it is safe to say that most gamers (US anyway) are not fond of anything more physical than pressing a button. I know what you're saying... what about DDR? I own a copy of DDR and the dance pad, it is a nice departure from the button mashing nature of video games, but in truth it is the social / competitive nature that gives it popularity. Nintendo might be in a position to cash in on the dwindling arcade industry if they adopt the unique technology for arcade use. I only bought a console version of DDR because of the competition at arcades. In fact, that is the same reason I own a console version of Time Crisis. People stopped going to arcades when console hardware caught up to arcade hardware, but Time Crisis and DDR still pull in profits for many arcades because they draw in crowds of spectators and long lines of people waiting to play.
Most of the games in arcades that use traditional control schemes are never touched where I live. Time Crisis, DDR, and some of the aging SEGA racing games draw the big crowds. Nintendo should encourage developers to develop games that capatalize on the one aspect of arcade gaming that is still profitable. That said, the duality of arcade and console titles does not mean that the game could not survive solely as an arcade or console title, but they certainly seem to sell better.
There are so many people still talking about gesture-based controls. I'm of the opinion that gestures will be the bane of game players for a while to come.
Swinging the controller for ball and raquet sports is not going to to work, because you have no reference point for the ball. I play table tennis, and I'm pretty good at it for an American. I have played an arcade table tennis game where you swing plastic raquets to hit the ball on screen, and it was unplayable. Why? There was no ball to hit. It ends up as yet another unintuitive indirect control method.
Don't even get me started on lifting the controller to jump and crap like that. I'm as excited about the Revolution as anyone, but there are going to be a heaping load of bad control schemes if developers convince themselves that they can sacrifice accuracy for "intuitive" gestures.
So, finally, after all this time, jerking the controller frantically *will* actually help Mario jump over a pit.
### 1. The controller is supposed to contain a gyroscopic sensor, like the one found in WarioWare Twisted. It may control more than one, since it's supposed to be able to detect pitch and yaw as well.
Wondering if the Revolution will actually use these, since the sensor in WarioWare Twisted is rather limited. It can only detect relative movment, not absolute and it is very easy to decalibrate it, not much an issue when you play the normal game modes, but if you play the same game (one that involves rotating the GBA into the same direction all the time) in WarioWare Twisted for a while the sensor starts to detect rotation when the GBA doesn't move, requires a reset to get out of that again. So with these it would be impossible to have a lightgun like behaviour.
In general I have a hard time to imagine how one actually plays Revolution games[1], sure the Rev Controller is kind of like a mouse with more axes, there is however one fundamental issue, a mouse can be lift up and repositioned, with the Rev Controller there would however be no such thing as 'lifting it up' for repositioning. So what if I want to turn left, then more left and then even more to the left? At some point I have to reposition and that either has to be done via some button press or some kind of advanced gesture detection, neither of these sound exactly intuitive or robust.
[1] Mostly refering to first person shooter games here, since that was one type of genre that was especially advertised to be played well with the Rev controller other type of games such as a Black&White style strategie game might not have such problems at all.
Yep. To learn that kids are going to have to play hockey.
Whats wrong with some good old fashioned posing? Would make for some intresting games if special moves were pulled off by posing. A lot of super sentai (Power rangers original name in Japan) type things use this sort of thing for transforming or pulling off a finishing move. Why not make it so you do so in real life?
If they included a mic in the revolution you could easily pull off a decent Kamen rider game (where you'd pose and shout henshin to transform) or use it to call on various armourments and allies.
While power rangers is called childish in the western world, in Japan it is huge and been going on for 30-40 years. Which means a lot of adults love the series and would kill to be able to do the things the various riders/rangers do.
I like muppets.
Although the grandparent is trolling, there is a slight bit of truth to that. One of the reasons why they are lagging behind both Microsoft and Sony is because they took so long to permit Mature games. The biggest reasons why is they used a cartridge on the N64 which was very expensive to produce, and they used a proprietary disk in the gamecube; which was not only controlled by Nintendo, but also prevented DVD playback. People today want all in one units which both Sony and Microsoft knew that's what their customers wanted. Nintendo will finally be releasing a system that has DVD playback, but it may be a bit too late for that. That is the reason Nintendo is third on their console sales and could end up third on their handheld sales if they don't start listening to the ones that pay's their bills, their customers.
One last thing that Nintendo has made a mistake other than technology is they bullied their third-party support for many years. They have always had inferior hardware, but since they released the NES slightly before the Sega Master system, they had an advantage over Sega. With third party support they had most of the exclusives that were blockbusters, whereas Sega had little third part support. Where they bullied their third party supporters was with content as they wanted everything sanitized, they also wanted to control distribution of the games. Nintendo tried that with Sony, it backfired and led to Sony developing and releasing the Playstation. Once that occured, most of their third party support went over to Sony and all of the good games was released for the PSX. Nintendo had a few good games for the N64, but they were expensive and most were First or Second party releases. A few good games were released from third party companies. NOw that Nintendo also has to deal with Microsoft, I doubt Nintendo will be able to recover, especially if they don't start listening to their customers wants and needs.
I'm not trying to troll, in fact I would love Nintendo to remain in business. I would, however love to see Nintendo with a more competitive attitude, use better technology, and listen to their customers. I admit, they finally did when they decided when it wasn't profitable to censor the games that are released for their systems. Again it might be tad bit too late for them.
p.s. Although Nintendo's next system will have DVD playback; according to Nintendo, the ability to play DVD movies will not be built into the machine itself. Consumers must purchase a 'dongle,' or key, to unlock the functionality. No information regarding the price or availability of this device has been provided yet.
Well?
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Whoa! Theres a third handheld out there? I thought I was just the Sony PSP vs the Nintendo DS and GBA. I'm pretty sure the Ngage has fallen off the charts already.
I'm absolutely certain that there's a "trigger" button that tell the thing when you want it to detect motion. To "reposition", you'd just release the trigger, move the wand to the right, press the trigger, and go left again. To me that seems intuitive and it's certainly the way I'd expect it to behave for most games. Otherwise it would be far too easy for an involuntary movement to screw up your gaming.
End of lesson. You may press the button.
This is a sentiment I hear a lot among PC FPS enthusiasts. As a former PC FPS player turned console FPS player, I'd say the big difference in mindset that most PC FPS players can't wrap their mind around is what does "far superior control" mean? Is being able to aim more accurately superior? Because the simple fact of the matter is that by this metric, the mouse and keyboard combo is a "far superior control" to holding a rifle in your hand and firing it, and something is distinctly perverse about that.
If a new controller came out where you could just think where on the screen you wanna shoot, and you would hit it with 100% accuracy would it make the game more fun? Under most PC FPS enthusiast's line of thinking this is better control, yet I think it's obvious to most people the game wouldn't be much fun anymore at that point.
Frankly, anything that reduces the amount of people jumping around wildly while firing sniper rifles in mid-air with pinpoint accuracy I consider a good thing, and so I'm quite pleased by the lower accuracy of console controllers over the mouse and keyboard. With console controllers, you can be fast, or you can be accurate, but it's very hard to be both. Y'know, sort of like with a real gun.
Ever seen robot combat anime? The stuff in space?
Imagine two people actually manipulating controllers in space and trying to destroy each other.
Initially it will be pretty free form, just orientation but no real way to make their motions somewhat realistic.
Eventually some mechanism for making the players not act crazy, then you can simulate dogfights with hand held little planes AWSOME!
Last time someone tried that (Sega w/ Shemue being the genreFREE (Fully Reactive Eyes Entertainment)), it didn't end up so good. The game did have boring parts, but it was a good concept and more of an "interesting life simulator" then your typical game. Although with the DS and probably the Revoluion, Nintendo has been making different kinds of games that are pretty hard to fit into any other genre.
In undeveloped countries, the consumer controls the market. In capitalist America, the market controls you.
My main hope for the Revolution is to get as freakin far away from genre's as possible. Genre's are bullshit easy pidgeonholes for developers, marketers, and the rest to use and abuse. Many of the best games always are labeled as "genre-defying" or some such in the media. Electroplankton, Nintendogs, Katamari Damacy, Spore, Animal Crossing, and many others. These are the truly innovative titles and none fit squarely in a "genre."
Moreso than trying to apply old stale bystanders to a radically new device, try thinking outside the box and go in new paths. We've all played enough Fighters, Sports, RPG's, etc. Let's actually move in new directions and get back to the single genre: FUN.
http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
Or watch their parents at Little League games.
sort of like in real life, if you move like a spaz when doing things you screw up?
Snowden and Manning are heroes.
Nintendo stopped censoring with the creation of ESRB ratings, their reason for censorship was not for some greater moral cause, but rather so parents could be confident that they were buying something that would not be a seriously bad influence on their kids when buying games.
the ESRB ratings gave that info to parents and so Nintendo did not need to continue to restrict content.
Snowden and Manning are heroes.
This first part is from memory, but I'm certian you're incorrect when you say Nintendo has "always had inferior hardware".
NES was second to the Sega Master System, this is true.
The SNES was the most powerful system durring the 16 bit era. Excluding exotic choices like the Neo-Geo. It's rivals were the Genesis which has a higher clock speed, but was nowhere near as capable, and the Turbo Grafix 16, which IIRC was an 8 Bit system with a 16 bit graphics coprocessor (or some such trickery).
The 32 Bit era, Nintendo skipped over. Unless you want to count the Virtual Boy which did indeed use a 32 Bit RISC processor. For mainstream home consoles of the say where was the 32X, which was just an add-on to the Genesis. The Saturn, which I believe was the least powerful of the "True" 32 bit, mainstream entries durring that generation. The PS1, and two odd-balls. The Jaguar, which was billed as 64 bit. This is often disputed, and I don't have background to prove or disprove the internals of Atari's last offering. The N64 was of course also 64 bit. Technically superior in most ways, save for game media. Cartridges, while much, much faster than optical media (especially back then) could not hold a candle to the sheer volume that discs can hold. But in terms of raw horsepower, I beieve that it's generally accepted that N64 lead that generation, not that it mattered.
Come around to the current (or is it now previous?) generation. The 128 Bit era. We have four contenders. The Dreamcast, which is dead and burried roughly equivelent to the PS2 from what I understand. The PS2, which is regarded as not only underpowered for this era, but a bitch to code for, the gamecube which seems to surpass the PS2 in all technical respects, save for DVD playback, and disc capacity. And the X-Box, which is generally accepted as leading this generation in technical specs. Visuals alone prove that the pecking order goes PS2GCNXBox Look at ports like Splinter Cell, or Resident Evil 4. The polygons they needed to cut from RE4 to run it on the PS2, were just... just wow.
Come to my second point. DVD playback. Are you aware that Microsoft already does (did?) this with the origional X-Box? X-Box "can not" play DVDs out of the box. You "have to" buy the remote control / DVD playback dongle pack in order to unlock this feature. The reason for this is simple. All DVD (legal, compliant) devices must be licensed by the DVD consortium. This licensing is not free. Microsoft's way of dealing with this was to rather than pass the cost of licensing each x-box and having to raise the sticker price to compensate, they took out the license fee, and took out the ability, unless you specificly went out and purchased the kit, and directly paid for it yourself. Saved money for the folks that didn't care to have their x-box play DVDs. Nintendo is probably going the same rout here. They are, after all known for keeping costs down.
Sony on the other hand had DVD playback out of the box with every PS2 they sell. I'm not sure if they're passing the costs along, simply eating the cost, or if they're exempt from the cost (Sony sits on the board of the DVD consortium, so perhaps it's possible that they don't have to pay like other companies do to license DVD rights).
The bits about Nintendo bullying it's licensees and censoring game content is correct, but ancient history. Those practices died out durring the SNES era. Nintendo was influential in founding the ESRB, and once that was done, they took the reigns off so to speak. Titles like Mortal Kombat 2, Conker's Bad Fur Day, and Geist would not be possible if they maintained censorship.
I tend to disagree with your views as to what Nintendo "should" do. Best technology? Nintendo has had the best and they've had the worst. The industry has shown multiple times that it doesn't matter. Both in terms of gameplay (how *fun* is it?) and sales (PS2 anyone?). Should they listen to their customer base? To an extent absolutly. But remember, listening t
Touch everywhere, even when inappropriate.
Taking time to learn the idiosyncrasies of an engine can be quite rewarding, it just takes time.
And Super Smash Bros. Melee has that in spades.
Will I have to argue with my co-worker to get them away from their "Work Simulator"?
Harvest Moon? The Sims? Animal Crossing?
Theres a third handheld out there?
Yes, and it's called GP2X. Available only by mail order, this handheld video game platform specializes in free software, freeware, and shareware.
The only problem with your idea is that the player lacks true immersion. I really think that this controller represents the first step to true VR. After programmers get used to this controller, how it can interface with a game, what new genres it can support, the natural progression in 5-6 years is to use VR headsets for total immersion.
What good would that be if you have to look away from the TV just to look any direction in the game?
The fact is, there are games on the Genesis (like Gunstar Heroes) that would not have been feasible to port to the SNES. Likewise, there were SNES games (like StarFox) that would have made terrible Genesis ports.
Or memory access speed. Or texture cache. Or ease-of-programming. Or any number of terrible design flaws that kept programmers from taking full advantage of the CPU, which was significantly faster than the PSX's.The reason the PSX won developer support hands-down in that generation isn't sheer dumb luck: Sony gave developers a nicely-designed and well-supported piece of hardware. Meanwhile, Sega, Nintendo, and Atari were putting together some of the most horribly-designed consoles since the pre-NES era, and then wondering why developers had the audacity to flock to the new-comer to the market. Sega's and Nintendo's already poor relationship with developers didn't help matters any.
Funny how the guy from Lionhead didn't think about the obvious application to Black and White, and seem to dismiss the controller as mostly for gimmick games. Lionhead even promoted a controller (glove) very similar to the rev controller concept, as being the ultimate way to play Blach and White.
WARNING!
Prolonged use of the brainwave sensor may cause nausea, headaches and mild hallucinations. Discontinue use on the first symptoms of schizophrenia.
Or you can be forced to join some cult formed by a comatose hacker thats hunted by the BeBop crew.
Yeah, it'll be somewhat limited, but you could still use it for leaning/looking around corners and making your FOV a little more natural with slight scanning left/right/up/down. Sitting here typing this, I can gain maybe 45 degrees in any direction and still keep my eyes on the moniter without undue effort. It would take some getting used to and might be disorienting, but the fact that it's easy, natural, and kind of reflexive would be a huge advantage. Making looking and aiming independent has some advantages if you're not overloading the control complexity, so it'd be worth a shot to see how it plays. Particularly if you're using the main controller as a sword, and a second controlloer for a shield, you can't use your hand's to look around, so if you can make a head-tracking solution workable, it opens things up a little.
Also, as much as I ragged on the "gesture" approach in my earlier post, it's different with your head. In a Rainbow Six or other squad combat type of game, you could potentially issue orders with "head gestures." In other words, select a team mate by pointing at him (with the regular remote) and nod your head in the direction you want him to go. Voice commands are probably a better way to go for that, but it's worth thinking about the possibilities.
I don't think it really counts as it doesn't play any commercial games in English nor is it marketed in the US. You have to get it in the grey market.
well said. just look at the Gameboy. I piece of @#&$, graphically, next to the Game Gear, TG Express, Lynx, Swan and NeoGeoPocket. Yet, add up all those console sales, triple it, then triple that, then triple that once more. Gameboy still leads them all. It's all about gameplay.
However, this also illustrates the biggest challenge to be faced by Revo developers, IMHO. In all current games, your characters have canned animations to represent your moves. You press the A-button or whatever, and the sword swipe animation playes. It's pre-rendered, beginning to end. Revo games will have to do realtime skeletal animation, so that you can begin swiping your sword, check it mid-stroke, and block with your shield. If you use physical movement to trigger canned animations, it will feel surreal, and you'll quickly give it up because it won't be responsive. You'll start to swipe your sword, and the game won't respond for .5 sec while the animation finishes. In effect, now you're just talking about mouse gestures in 3D space. If the on-screen avatar doesn't track your movements accurately, smoothly, and convincingly, then you're just memorizing gestures to trigger a move--and that would be physically tiring with not much reward, and we'll go back to pressing buttons.
Don't sweat it, Inverse Kinematics is pretty popular these days.
That doesnt sound like a new genre to me, more like just expanding and improving on current and old genres. Dont get me wrong, expanding and improving is obviously how video gaming continues to grow, but dont lable it as creating new genres when it isnt.
I'd expect a Viewtiful Joe game to implement that first.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
Moreover, it's painfully obvious that for the bottom and side images the front was simply mirrored. You can tell from the lighting, bevels, and not to mention the lack of any way to open the battey case.
Here's a little demo by Tim Etler that shows how the Revolution controller would work with a FPS.
You might also take a look at this video.
Think of it more like an analog joystick than a mouse, where it'll turn as you point toward the edges. Probably with faster rotations the closer you're pointing to the edge and an area toward the middle of the screen where you have a bit of wiggle room for adjusting your aim without looking all over the place.
The Farewell Tour II
Europeans: too embarrased to dance around fighting
Japanese: house too small to dance around fighting
Americans: too fat and lazy to dance around fighting
Oh Nintendo, have you really forgotten the PowerGlove?
Actually, I think the controller is generally a good idea. N will come up with some interesting games for it. But most 3rd party developers won't have a clue what to do with it. I predict that the European and US consoles will start to ship with ordinary controllers, even if only 3rd party ones in a bundle, after one month on sale.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
I have been playing Quake II this way years ago. However, I did so in a VR Cave, so turning around quickly was easily accomplished by just physically turning around. Let me tell you, wearing those 3D shutter glasses and seeing those badass weapons precisely attached to your hand, swiftly following its every move, is absofuckinglutely brilliant. The cost of the hardware is prohibitive though, not least because in order to set it up, you need to devote a large (and I mean large, even if you use mirrors you need plenty space behind the screens to set up the projectors) room to it. However, I hear affordable VR goggles of decent quality are just around the corner. Interesting times lie ahead!
but what do i know, i'm just a model.
I agree that a lot of PC FPS games have far too accurate controls. But console controls go too far the other way, which is why they mostly have some sort of auto-aim to compensate. I'm halfway through metroid prime 2 at the moment, which would be impossible without the autoaim. The problem is the tiny range of motion of the console controllers: you can either have accuracy but bringing the gun to bear is slow, or rapid turning but innaccurate shooting.
Hmm, how about a Strap-On Genre?
ducks
This may come as a surprise to you, but some people prefer not to have their heads bashed in. Even non-lazy ones.
Pikmin Revolution: "Play with your friends each of them being an individual Pikmin!!" (113 controllers required to play)
//WR
They really don't have much entertainment value left. Why leave home to play video games at $1-$2 a play, when you can pay $20-50 to play at home as much as you want?
Just because you can, does not mean you should.
Also, they have an arrangement with Gyration to use their gyroscopes in the Revolution controller. What you describe is exactly how Gyration's "air mouse" products work, so it's not much of a stretch to assume that Nintendo might use the same system.
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Speaking of fun fighting games, just imagine Punchout on the Nintendo Revolution. A controller in each hand to simulate gloves. Gameplay would be incredibly intuitive. Punching with the controller would translate to different types of punches (jab, cross, hook, uppercut). Bringing both controllers up to your face could simulate blocking. Moving both controllers to the side would simulate dodging. I am warming up to the potential here...
yea.. except viewtiful Joe is based on these Sentai shows and they have oh.. a 30 year history and release a game for the latest at least twice a year. But yea you're quite right, lets pick a new shiny series over one with a huge long standing fanbase.
I like muppets.
Probably for the first time in my life, I just got giddy at the idea of a game. Dance Dance Revolution - Waltz Edition. Just think, you can look like an idiot stepping around your living room, but then you could totally go impress your wife/girlfriend/"the ladies" I can't wait to see what the Revolution can do.
If the wand is to move an aiming reticle, and the joystick is to turn, then how do you move forward/backward and strafe?
I fear that the reality will be far different. Rather than making the big devs come up with something original, the controller is going to 'force' them to ignore the Revolution completely.
As you noted, these companies are all about a cheap, quick buck. That means making one version of a game and porting to the other competing platforms. If the Revolution doesn't ship with a standard (normal) controller, and instead requires significant customization of the game to allow it to be playable, the big companies will just skip the Revolution version altogether. Even more so if the adoption rate for the Revolution is similar to the Gamecube's.
I...I'm attacking the darkness!
A new shiney series with Capcom behind it making games like mad. As air fills any vacuum, Capcom fills any market with sequels. And while movie and TV tie-ins tend to be derivative shovelware Capcom is more likely to add some not-tried-before feature so I doubt a tie-in would use the mechanic first.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
I can't wait to buy Dance Dance Revolution Revolution!
The US Army: promoting democracy through unquestioned obedience
You have no idea about the Japanese games market and how many "TV tie-ins" are extremely good games there.. I suggest you slap yourself till you understand that US tie ins doesn't equal Japanese tie ins
I like muppets.
No idea? I've played my fair share of crappy tie-ins, I see them rated very low in Famitsu. Some tie-ins are good but the majority is still trash. Never mind that many of those tie-ins DO get released in the west.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.