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Microsoft May Delay Windows Vista Again
UltimaGuy writes to mention a Reuters report, stating that Vista may be delayed again, this time by up to three months. From the article: " The research note, released to clients [by the Gartner Group] on Monday, said the new Windows Vista operating system is too complex to be able to meet Microsoft's targeted November release for volume license customers and January launch for retail consumers. A Microsoft spokeswoman said the company disagreed with the Gartner report and it was still on track to meet its launch dates."
I certainly didnt see this coming!
MS/Hurd
Okay, I am getting tired of these delays. If I hadn't seen a beta, I would claim that Vista is vaporware. How many times does this make that it has been delayed? Maybe the reason for the insane specs is because by the time it gets out it will run on old, outdated computers.
The views expressed are mine own and do not express the views of my employer.
"Microsoft still wants to get it out as soon as possible, but slipping from January to March is nowhere near as bad as slipping from shipping before the holidays to after the holidays," a group of Gartner analysts wrote in the report.
What is this, a game console? What does Microsoft care if it slips for the Holiday season? If anyone gets a computer for Christmas, they're still likely to get it with Microsoft products. If not (i.e. they buy an Apple), I don't see that having Vista out will help that much.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
"We won't be releasing it any time soon, but please enjoy the view."
Haven't they finished taking out everything that makes it different from XP yet?!??!?
Duke Nukem 3D project managers?
Now if MS actually can meet its launch date, the industry media will praise them, rather than saying, "uh, wasn't this supposed to be released three years ago? And where's all the good features, like Nomad and WinFS?"
vista (vs't) pronunciation
... "distant" ...
n.
1. A distant view or prospect, especially one seen through an opening, as between rows of buildings or trees.
Hmm
"Cats like plain crisps"
Did't we know this months ago?
If this is actually the case, I think Microsoft deserves what's coming to them. The only reason they still have so much market share is because of inertia, but if they can't actually ship a product (even at the already delayed date) they deserve the mass defections that hopefully will be coming. They've dropped a ton of features, they can't ship on time, even Joe six pack will at some point realize that this isn't the company that should be in control of his computer. Like it or not, people aren't going to switch to Linux or OSS because it might be better or because open source is a better sofware development model. They're going to switch because they're having a problem. Nobody's going to go out of their way to fix a problem they don't have. Luckily for us, MS is doing a great job creating those problems.
I've always pictured the color of OS zealotry as a sort of bright flamingo pinkish hue
"Microsoft still wants to get it out as soon as possible
Amazing insight. Worth every penny spend on the report
Help fight continental drift.
It's like announcing that a herd of turtles is reaching the finish line. It's big, it's bulky and everyone knows it's coming. The question is anyone will give a hare's tail once it finally arrives - or will the rabbit (or penguin) finally win the race?
Proof by very large bribes. QED.
For everyone here that is dogging Vista, you sure are pissed when it gets delayed even more. I would figure that you would be loving the fact that Microsoft is pushing it farther and farther back. It sure seems like you guys can't wait for it to be here. I say when it gets here, it gets here.
Click Click Bloody Click PANCAKES!
than ridiculously full of bugs. If they rush a product that isn't ready it would generate even worse publicity than constantly delaying it. It's done when it's done (tm). Inevitably (for those of you who don't like MS), it's still going to have a heaping pile of flaws, but hopefully not as many. No one wants another Windows ME.
...clearly you aren't familiar with their history of being a pain in the ass. As soon as Leopard comes out, I'm going Mac.
It's a girl!
"It's not THAT late."
"Still better than Linux"
"It's only because MS is so far ahead already; they feel no need to rush their product out the door."
"This time they'll get the security issues right."
"Damned if they do, damned if they don't. You Linux advocates complain no matter what; admit that this way they'll avoid the bugs!"
"It's Windows! It's the biggest project anywhere! 3 million lines of code! And it's Vista, the biggest upgrade yet! What's a few months between friends? Vista is WAY bigger than any Linux distribution!"
"Microsoft has to be enterprise ready. Linux is for dweebs and nerds. Of course Windows has a longer release cycle; that's 'cause its better"
"It's not fair; if MS didn't have to deal with all these vindictive, nerdy hackers, Windows wouldn't take so long to develop. Imagine if Apple or Linux had to deal with these black hat hackers."
"We're MS. The Volume Goes to 11 Here."
Did I miss any?
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
...perhaps Micro$ofts goose will finally get good and cooked like they have deserved for so long.
Tired of all the isms, don't exploit people as an employer, or a government, mmmmK?
No, really, who cares? Are there people clamoring to get their hands on this new OS ASAP (WTF BBQ) and who will be extremely put out if it is not available until later on in the future? My question for these people is: what will this new OS do for you that isn't true right now?
And as a side note, I am really bloody tired of reading stories about things that "analysts" think. "Joe Analyst issues a note to Judy Analyst, under the table, in the back of the classroom. Investors giggled to themselves and rubbed their index fingers together..."
-b
myselfmusic
Vista Screenshot
The headline is kinda sensationalist...Gartner is projecting that MS won't ship Vista based on the released data of beta2...pure speculation on thier part based on how Win2k's cyle worked...
sorry, but nothing to see here...
Is there anyone left who does not think that Windows Vista is a big long drawn out trainwreck. A project that has to be delayed over and over and over and over. Compare this to the development of the OS they copy. Apple has shipped product over and over.
If you can't manage to ship one of the two products you make all your money on, what does that say about the management of Microsoft?
This is gartner reporting; This is the same group that in 1999 reported that Linux/OSS would penetrate into the server market at most 1% and into the web server market at only 5% by 2004 (5 years). Sadly, Linux was already beating those numbers at that time.
Generally, Gartner ( and IDC and a few others ) are some of the worse are guessing what the future holds. In fact, I would suggest that their incompetence is so bad, that I would guess that they get at most 25% correct; which means, that most companies would be better off betting against them.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Personally I don't understand why anyone would even consider touching this before its been out for at least a few months if not a year. It's quite apparent they are trying to rush this thing out the door. I'll be highly surprised if it isn't one huge bug infested mess. I certainly wouldn't want to depend on it for anything.
Microsoft announced, in a (very) recent press release, some of the exciting technlologies in Windows Vista. Apparently, the aging NT kernel has been scrapped, and the new Windows kernel will use a combination of the GNU/Hurd and the L4 microkernel to power its next-gen operating system. While desktop users might not care about what is under the hood, they will be amazed at the next-gen Windows desktop, which uses the E17 shell. Gamers of the world will rejoice, because Microsoft has replaced the venerable MS Solitaire card game with Duke Nukem: Forever. In a possible attempt to squash threats from the World Wide Web (again), Microsoft has leveraged Udanax infrastructure to provide 'transclusion' technologies. This will surely be the greatest Windows Operating System ever, if not the greatest Operating System ever!
---- "XML is like violence. If it doesn't fix the problem, you aren't using enough."
I'm a bit of a Microsoft fanboy but personally I think they should just give up on Vista. It's a trainwreck of a project and I can see another Windows ME in the making. I can't see many compelling reasons to deploy this in an existing environment. It's (for the most part) just a Windows XP clone with a few new features with a pretty UI and steep hardware requirements.
Microsoft should take all the half decent features out of Vista, back port them to Windows XP and call it Windows XP Service Pack 3 or Windows XP R2 then site down and have a good long think before they try this again.
It's about time Microsoft seriously thought about re-architecting their operating system from the ground up. If we can get Windows applications running under Linux with WINE, then surely Microsoft can get Windows applications running under some new operating system thus satisfying the backwards compatibility requirements. There are far too many issues with Windows appearing that are grounded in its architecture such as reduced privileges which is difficult to make work because Windows is not truly multi-user etc. etc. etc.
Give it up, start again and do it properly.
Am I the only one that remembers that "Longhorn" was supposed to follow XP about three years? I went a Googling and found plenty of chatter back in 2002 about how pissy customers would be if their new, expensive Software Assurance didn't include an upgrade to the new OS within three years. One of Microsoft's VPs even suggested MS would "do something" if the date slipped that far. It seems that the reporters don't remember anything preceding the original, official release date of 2005.
OK, first of all, this is Gartner, not MS making the claims. From the article:
said the new Windows Vista operating system is too complex to be able to meet Microsoft's targeted November release... [emphasis added]
Yes, this is the same Gartner that said that Linux was too complex to have been written by Linus Torvalds...
But, it gets better:
Once production starts, it usually takes between six- to eight-weeks for PC manufacturers to load the operating system onto new computers, Gartner said.Six weeks! - and I thought I had a slow hard drive when it took two hours to install Linux.
Perhaps that should have been "six to eight weeks to begin shipping..."?
The society for a thought-free internet welcomes you.
What is this, a game console? What does Microsoft care if it slips for the Holiday season?
All sorts of juicy Software Assurance Program subscriptions expire this year. Years ago, Microsoft managed to sucker companies into paying a large lump sum for all the Windows updates over the next six years - including Vista!
If companies get nothing at all for the duration of the contract, I think you'll see a lot of lawsuits and I know you'll see a lot of dropped "assurance" subscriptions.
Microsoft is delivering vista to companies even if it has to come in a box with crayon on the disc in place of a label.
Now you also know why the consumer release is later, because this release is just to meet obligations and in no way will be ready for primetime for you or I.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
And a lot of Slashdotters care, because a lot of us work for software companies whose products have to run on Vista.
Sorry, sorry.
"Words of wisdom: drop that zero and get with the hero" -- Vanilla Ice
Windows 95 brought TCP/IP and a web browser. Windows 98 brought USB and FAT32. Windows 2K/XP brought multi-user and NTFS. Quick, in 30 seconds or less, what is Vista is going to have that's interesting? I predict it will a draconian DRM thingy to go with some product activation scheme even more onerous that WinXP. Yeah, that's got me excited...not.
It could be that they wait for the outcome of what the European court will say. It is said that it could take up to a year before a decision is made.
Having then an OS out that goes against those rules might not be a wise choice. Prosponing it a bit might give them enough space to follow the law.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
In reponse to this news, Apple stock was up 3% today.
This is a dangerous game Microsoft's playing.
-- If you try to fail and succeed, which have you done? - Uli's moose
Make a reasonable release goal based on the amount of work that needs to be done, and stop stating release dates to appese the market.
That what most people want, a reasonable estimate. I doubt the delays are because of any extra bug fixes. More like bad management of an overly large and complex project.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Well just to throw this out there, I sort of care. Not really about the next version of windows, but where my support is going to sit. Right now company I admin is all win2k. It's stable with no problems. Didn't really see a reason to go with XP and I still don't. But driver support is starting to lag. I have until 2010 until extended support runs out, but the bigger issue is what happens if machines burn out and I can't get 2000 to load because of lack of drivers. Skipping the XP upgrade saved us a LOT of money. So did sticking with office 2000. But at some point we're going to have to upgrade, and the current MS schedule is going to determine if we upgrade to Vista - which may be a bomb, or wait until the version after that, assuming it can come out before 2010.
Yeah, well, it ... it ...
IT HAS A 3D USER INTERFACE!!!1!1!!!1111
Whew. 28 seconds.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
My question for these people is: what will this new OS do for you that isn't true right now?
Apply this question to any OS release, be it from Microsoft, Linux, Apple, or someone else. Generally there are things that people come to expect in the new release. Sometimes it's better security. Sometimes it's better stability. Sometimes it's improved networking, better utilization of CPU resources, or something else.
For a long time now, Microsoft has been billing Vista as The Next Big Thing. As they promised in their March 21 road map update, "Windows Vista will deliver great value to businesses by seamlessly connecting people to information, enabling increased mobile and remote productivity, significantly reducing deployment and support costs, and providing a more secure and compliant desktop platform. For consumers, Windows Vista will bring clarity to the world of personal computing, enabling people to more safely and easily accomplish everyday tasks, instantly find what they want, enjoy the latest in entertainment, and stay connected at home or on the go."
Microsoft's credibility has been sliding for years now. Regular everyday people are starting to realize that Microsoft isn't the only game in town. Apple is coming on strong and getting increasingly aggressive in its marketing of the Mac. The Linux user base continues to grow.
Microsoft advocates used to be able to claim that no matter what the technical limitations of the company's products, it was always run very well. Products shipped on time. You could usually figure that even if it was mediocre now, whatever Microsoft product you were using would probably be better in a year, and markedly improved in two or three years. That's certainly not the case now, and continued inability to deliver makes Microsoft a less reliable vendor.
If you always figured Vista wouldn't amount to much, the delay obviously won't matter to you personally. You could probably measure the slide in Microsoft's influence by the increase in lack of concern over Vista delays.
As for analysts, it sure would be great to get paid to engage in the same sort of random speculation we all do on Slashdot anyway. Hell, for reliable predictions about the technology market, I'd pick any ten Slashdot readers over any ten analysts any day.
Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
* All the links to MSN are being removed. Probably for business or regulatory reasons. No links means you're (in theory) not pushing MSN, and you're being Web Homepage neutral. Or, it could be they're giving up on MSN? That would be very hard to believe.
* Unix tools are now optional? Considering the growth of Linux, this is surprising since more and more businesses actually are using these tools (especially "rsh" and "ssh". You'd think they'd want more compatibility than less. Wonder if "optional installation" means that you have to select it when you install it, or whether you have to pay for it. My take: Dell will probably include them anyway since so many people need them.
* FrontPage is a major component for many web pages and is a major feature for ISPs. How will this affect all those FrontPage webpages? Will FrontPage still be an optional component in the Server version? If not, how will this affect the ISPs?
* Lack of email support for HTTP via WebDAV: Is this a security concern? How will this affect people? Do a lot of Webmails still do this?
===============
Cringely has a whole theory that Apple (using MS own source code) will include the Windows XP API in their next release of OS X. (See http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/pulpit20060420
I find it hard to believe that Apple would actually be able to do this. However, people I know who work in these places tell me that Apple actually does have licensing rights to the Windows 2000 API (and therefore to most of Windows XP API). Rumors have it that MS gave Apple the licensing rights in exchange for the licensing rights for Mac OS 9 and the NeXTstep code. If that's true, Steve certainly got Bill to drink quite a bit of Koolaid.
Your problem here seems to be with the patent office.
While you're at it, you might want to try and dig up a quote from Microsoft saying they invented "tabbing between hyperlinks".
We've been inspired by the comment that Microsoft's anti-spyware software is "the best product they've ever invented".
Source for this quote ? Certainly a cursory Google search shows nothing outside of that website.
"The user experience is far from ideal but Microsoft has no choice as a result of the defeat it was handed in a patent infringement suit that was filed against the company by Eolas."
Ignoring that the Eolas patent dispute was a complete farce, did Microsoft claim to have invented anything the patent covered ?
Incidentally, it's pretty clear the person writing that is one of those who supports the existing, utterly broken patent system that allows Microsoft and others like them to patent things like "tabbing between hyperlinks".
I am the winner, do I get a prize?
No. You have not satisfied the criteria. Documented evidence (ie: quotes with first level references) of Microsoft claiming to have invented something they didn't.
I mean, if it's as common as you say it is, it should be *trivial* for you to find half a dozen or more examples of quotes from Microsoft saying "we invented $EXISTINGTECHNOLOGY". Something that clealy and unambigiously demonstrates them claiming to have invented something they didn't.
In this case: A wide view of many things far far away.
Seriously, I'd like Microsoft more if they just shut up about what they were "going" to do, and would just DO it. If I was MS, I'd write, test, debug, test and debug some more, and have a fully operational OS before I even announced what i had. Kind of like Apple, when Steve Jobs walks out with a new toy: It's a real product and it works well enough to show off its cool features. Only then would I open a beta to public parties and tell them to hack at it for a while. Once the bugs that the coders missed are caught (like referenced here: http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/05/02/ 2216235) then I would begin selling it. Also if I was MS...I'd have a bigger house. Seriously.
/. look like Richard Stallman. (You know, he's the type of fanatic who converts his mp3's into .wmv files "so they play better on a Windows machine...") He told me that he heard there was another delay announced, etc. and that it was because they were "making Windows better." While I can't argue with that logic, I asked him why he was so against trying Linux. His answer was that "it's open source". When I asked him what was wrong with that, he told me that open source meant that anyone could rewrite the code in the OS files on his machine!
I first caught wind of Longhorn in early 2004, and I'm by no means on the cutting edge of tech news. We (meaning average Joe Shmoe's) thought "Ooh, a new Windows OS...XP was such a great step from ME, maybe this Longhorn will be even better!!" At that time XP was still fairly recent, I upgraded to XP in 2001. I had no choice...I was running Windows ME and I needed something better. Like most folks in my shoes at that time, Linux wasn't an option. 5 years ago, the GUI options for a Linux noob/Windows user weren't very appealing. Plus I thought chmod was something you did to mod your ch...whatever that was... Flash forward 5 years: Longhorn is now Vista, but its still vaporware for the mass market. Linux is making HUGE strides in user interfaces for the desktop. My girlfriend, who is rather computer illiterate, runs Ubuntu or Damn Small Linux depending on the machine.
I had an interesting discussion tonight with a co-worker of mine who makes all the MS fanboys on
*sigh*
I don't know if he's just that dumb...or if there is some MS propaganda going around regarding OSS. Neither would surprise me much.
khasim (12/9/06): In a blind taste test, more people preferred Coke over the Pepsi that I had previously pissed in.
No, seriously. I'm testing it and it simply doesn't work very well for me. Not on my reasonable high-end system with reasonably standard components. It's unstable, lacks many drivers and hangs quite frequently. The system keeps prompting me for drivers for 'unknown devices' with no obvious way to turn it off. The GUI has so many changes that it's essentially a steep learning curve. Nothing is simple anymore.
The UAP 'feature' is very annoying, and dialogs fall all over eachother trying to warn you for yet another dangerous action that some piece of software is attempting to run.
My opinion: Back to the drawing board.
(System: Antec case, Asus A8N-SLI Premium, AMD64X2 3800+, 2GB Kingston RAM, ATI Radeon X800XL 256MB, 2x Maxtor 250GB SATA RAID-1, Maxtor 80GB PATA)
To Terminate, or not to Terminate, that's the question - SCSIROB
But it is the first Windows-OS with a graphical user interface.
It's just like Malibu Stacy with a new hat.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.