Slashdot Mirror
Back to the Bunker
Oldsmobile writes "On Monday, June 19, about 4,000 government workers representing more than 50 federal agencies will say goodbye to their families and set off for dozens of classified emergency facilities stretching from the Maryland and Virginia suburbs to the foothills of the Alleghenies. They will take to the bunkers in an "evacuation" that sources describe as the largest "continuity of government" exercise ever conducted, a drill intended to prepare the U.S. government for an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks. The vast secret operation has updated the duck-and-cover scenarios of the 1950s with state-of-the-art technology -- alerts and updates delivered by pager and PDA, wireless priority service, video teleconferencing, remote backups -- to ensure that "essential" government functions continue undisrupted in an emergency."
Farewell!
Huh ?
It seems evertyhing is provided for survival of "government" elite - who have the wealth and/or connections to get elected and appointed.
But what about hordes of people who constitute 'the people' in the declaration of independence ?
Read radical news here
"an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks"
Would that be the November 7, 2006 Congressional elections? Or the November 4, 2008 elections, showing exceptionally long-range planning?
--
make install -not war
When the emergency preparedness procedures are woefully inadequate in cases where the responsible agencies are operating from their regular offices, why should I believe they would be effective when staff are trying to react in a situation of real chaos.
Is the men to women ratio favourable in Dr Strangelove's eyes? I mean, of course every many would have to perform his 'duty to his country' often with many women to repopulate the earth, but I think they can all suck it up and deal with it.
Tibbon
tibbon.com
for the mess to begin with.
Mmmmm... maybe be sure to save the Telephone Sanitizers this time around.
Ok, conspiracy theory over!
today is spelling optional day.
"...to ensure that 'essential' government functions continue undisrupted in an emergency."
So now they're going to practice their coffee breaks, giving rude service to the public and wasting our tax dollars on dubious projects... all from underneath a fortified bunker, to ensure this very fine tradition is not lost in the event of a nuclear attack?
The leadership of this country has a wildly overblown sense of self-importance. Even if we were to lose every politician in Washington, we have the largest prison population in the world, a vast pool from which to build a new government.
The vast secret operation has updated the duck-and-cover scenarios of the 1950s with state-of-the-art technology
So, posting it on slashdot counts as secrecy nowadays.
liqbase
RICE_BABY: "LOLZ IN DA BUNKA WHERE U @?"
CHAIN_MAN: "AT DA DOOR OPEN UP LOL"
SHRUB: "B SERIYUS U 2"
BROWNIE: "YEAH U NEVER KNOW WHOS GONNA SEE YER MESSAGES"
WASH_POST: "YEAH LOL IN UR NETWORK READIN YER MESSAGES SEE YOU IN THE PAPERS"
RUMMY: "LOL SEE YOU IN GITMO ALL YOUR RIGHTS ARE BELONG TO ME"
WASH_POST: "OH SHI..."
Please help metamoderate.
While the Wa Post columnist - it should be noted that this is an opinion piece, not an article - is obviously not too fond of the idea, I'd say it still has at least some merit.
With increased WMD proliferation - from big budget nukes to dirt cheap chemical weapons - that can be used to attack the U.S. capital and government installations, I'd say that such a plan is smart to have as a backup. Should Iran wake up one day and decide to nuke Washington (a possibility in the future), we would certainly be able to retaliate and turn it into the Islamic Republic of Glass Bowl or Parking Lot (pick your favorite), but what would happen to all of the government infrastructure there? We're not just talking about continuity of elected leaders, but about the civilian side of the government as well, which this plan seems to focus on, too.
While nuclear war with Russia or another fairly heavily armed power (i.e. China) remains an enormously remote possibility, exchanges with countries that possess only a handful of nukes (Iran, North Korea, etc.) are much more likely. In such an event, the U.S. would not need to focus simply on making sure the attacker is completely wiped out - this is a given - but that it can survive a relatively small attack affecting only a handful of cities such as Washington and New York rather than a widespread nuclear holocaust in which all of this would simply be moot anyways.
The author is obviously unhappy with the inefficiency of this program, but I'm not entirely convinced by his arguments. Security, backups, etc. are always inefficient. Security and efficiency are always at odds with each other. Spending hundreds of millions on a backup that MIGHT be used is entirely inefficient EXCEPT when you need it, in which case it becomes a necessity. Combine this with the fact that the government is also not known for its efficiency and you've got a problem.
The U.S. isn't getting ready for nuclear holocaust any more, as many slashdotters have claimed and the author seems to hint at. It's getting ready for a limited nuclear exchange in which, yes, things like the patent office and budget offices must continue operating in the months and years to come when their main offices have been wiped out but a vast majority of the U.S. has been left unscathed.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending every action of this program. I would encourage others, however, to take a more nuanced look at it. And nuance is something slashdot appears to be lacking these days. It's likely my karma will pay for it, but so be it.
(As a side note, my "confirm I'm not a script" word was "senate"... coincidence?)
... for an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.
The 2006 mid-term elections?
As Leslie Fish points out in The Digwell Carol if we take the chance to bury them now, maybe we can get on with our lives. Anyone else feel like chipping in for a concrete pour to be arranged at the mouth of bunker this week?
but the USA PATRIOT Act forbids discussing this in any form.
I am at risk myself because I told you this as discussing what the USA PATRIOT Act forbids is also forbidden.
"Moreover, since 9/11 and Hurricane Katrina, the definition of what constitutes an "essential" government function has been expanded so ridiculously beyond core national security functions -- do we really need patent and trademark processing in the middle of a nuclear holocaust? -- that the term has become meaningless."
Just before the blastwave hits, as I put my head between my legs and kiss my ass goodbye, my final thought can be "maybe I'll be dead but at least the patent system will live on..."
It's good to know we will be able to handle an occurrence that has killed less than 1000 people each year. I wonder if we'll be prepared for another realistic disaster like Katrina or Rita, or if we'll be prepared for the millions who die of heart disease. Hurry to the bunkers!
First, my personal observation is that about 98% of Federal employees are dedicated and hardworking. Unfortunately the 2% that are not tend to be a) executives or b) customer-facing. Second, if we can provide essential services with 4,000 people - why are we paying for millions?
I still have my stash I prepared for the Y2K crises.
Mmmm. I think some of this stuff needs to be updated. And all the beer I stashed is long gone.
I'm sorry, 9/11 wasn't a catastrophe of national or even regional concern. It was an isolated, one-off local emergency. It didn't threaten the average american, it didn't interrupt or negate the federal and regional bureaucracy's ability to operate, and it certainly wasn't a national crisis. To this day its greatest long-term effect has been the destruction of an entire country as simple retaliation
9/11 was a local disaster affecting one municipality.
Hurricane Katrina was a regional disaster affecting a couple states.
The race riots in France were a regional crisis
The student riots in France were a localized crisis
If bird flu suddenly spread like wildfire killing hundreds of thousands to millions in multiple states, THAT would be a national-level crisis.
------- "From bored to fanboy in 3.8 asian girls" ----------
Looking back at the Cold War-era bunkers, several (civillian) VIP's noted that, although they had been informed of the facilities and the contingencies for their use, they never would have actually gone into them.
Because, as this article hints, they would have had to leave their families to do so.
Thinking about the "human factors" involved...would their be enough warning for anyone to be able to make it to the bunker in time? Would the roads/airspace/transit function well enough to get them to the bunkers? Would they leave their families to do so?
The US free market: two halves of a government-granted duopoly are free to set the market price.
All you'd need to happen with the execs were safely away is some cooked up "terrorist" attack, maybe a series of dirty bombs going off coupled with a financial crisis. Good excuse to roll the military out into the streets.
Nah, couldn't happen here, right? Just because something similar happened...well, several times in the past is no reason to think it could ever happen here.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
"Agency planned exercise on Sept. 11 built around a plane crashing into a building
... were running a pre-planned simulation to explore the emergency response issues that would be created if a plane were to strike a building. Little did they know that the scenario would come true in a dramatic way that day."
Wed Aug 21, 7:45 PM ET
By JOHN J. LUMPKIN, Associated Press Writer
WASHINGTON - In what the government describes as a bizarre coincidence, one U.S. intelligence agency was planning an exercise last Sept. 11 in which an errant aircraft would crash into one of its buildings. But the cause wasn't terrorism -- it was to be a simulated accident.
Officials at the Chantilly, Virginia-based National Reconnaissance Office had scheduled an exercise that morning in which a small corporate jet would crash into one of the four towers at the agency's headquarters building after experiencing a mechanical failure.
The agency is about 4 miles (6 kilometers) from the runways of Washington Dulles International Airport.
Agency chiefs came up with the scenario to test employees' ability to respond to a disaster, said spokesman Art Haubold. No actual plane was to be involved -- to simulate the damage from the crash, some stairwells and exits were to be closed off, forcing employees to find other ways to evacuate the building.
"It was just an incredible coincidence that this happened to involve an aircraft crashing into our facility," Haubold said. "As soon as the real world ( news - Y! TV) events began, we canceled the exercise."
Terrorism was to play no role in the exercise, which had been planned for several months, he said.
Adding to the coincidence, American Airlines Flight 77 -- the Boeing 767 that was hijacked and crashed into the Pentagon ( news - web sites) -- took off from Dulles at 8:10 a.m. on Sept. 11, 50 minutes before the exercise was to begin. It struck the Pentagon around 9:40 a.m., killing 64 aboard the plane and 125 on the ground.
The National Reconnaissance Office operates many of the nation's spy satellites. It draws its personnel from the military and the CIA ( news - web sites).
After the Sept. 11 attacks, most of the 3,000 people who work at agency headquarters were sent home, save for some essential personnel, Haubold said.
An announcement for an upcoming homeland security conference in Chicago first noted the exercise.
In a promotion for speaker John Fulton, a CIA officer assigned as chief of NRO's strategic gaming division, the announcement says, "On the morning of September 11th 2001, Mr. Fulton and his team
The conference is being run by the National Law Enforcement and Security Institute.
___
On the Net:
National Reconnaissance Office: http://www.nro.gov/
Central Intelligence Agency ( news - web sites): http://www.cia.gov/
National Law Enforcement and Security Institute: http://www.nlsi.net/ "
Although his link is from "prison planet" the original article is from AP.
Tired of all the isms, don't exploit people as an employer, or a government, mmmmK?
Weren't government agencies practicing for the exact same situation as 9/11 just prior to it happening?
I might need a tin-foil hat here, but it just seems to convenient that they are having a 'practice run' like they were practicing before 9/11.
Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
that have occured since & including 911, have also coinsided with a massive government/military training drills (911 and london)... and the since the U.S. is building up a strike force for what appears to be a July attack on Iran... the conspiracy side of me is going "Hmmm...." in an ominous tone. ...do we need to be digging out our grand fathers bomb shelters for a "camping trip" with the family? Sigh...
Well, you have to look by comparing the times for our time and their time.
In 1770, even the 'white land owners' being 'the people' was a HUGE step in the direction of freedom. The outlook on humanism has to be proportionally far-fetched today too.
Read radical news here
> steal to their heart's content if they knew they
> would never be caught and punished.
Some civilisations are stronger than that. During the Blitz, which lasted 8 months, London, Liverpool and other British cities lost around 50K lives, and a million houses - that was a catastrophe! Discipline did not break down, the British went on to defeat Rommel in north Africa and eventually triumphed over Hitler and his henchmen in Europe. Criminality during the war was rife, of course, but general standards remained in place. We tend to be fearful about our society, mostly due to sensational rubbish in the media, in my opinion.
I stole this
No where in there does it say anything about attractiveness to females! 10 women for each man and you don't even have to attractive! Where do I sign up?! Nuclear war now!
EvilCON - Made Famous by
The U.S. isn't getting ready for nuclear holocaust any more...
The US population, it seems, isn't ready for any kind of serious event. Read the rest of the posts in this topic for an example.
Rather than trying to prevent a serious event or planning to deal with the consequences, the public view seems to be one of denial, fantasy, and conspiracy theories. Nothing bad can happen (denial). Diplomancy, disarmament, and environmental awareness will keep us safe (fantasy). And it's all about Haliburton anyway (conspiracy theories).
And it's expressed and reinforced by making fun of people who are just trying to be prepared. Bravo.
It's apparently going to take a few more attacks over several years for Americans to finish the process of growing up. I'm glad I don't live near any likely targets.
I'm not a political science major. (Science? I guess the term is used loosely.) I have no idea who your witty asides are referring to or what their political persuasions are, or even the names or intersections of of their various persuasions.
I don't think I'm a marxist. Atleast I don't recall mentioning anything about collectivising anything but hey if straw man arguments are the way you swing so be it.
Of the responses I could decipher
a)If you don't know the list of nations under our thumb then you've wasted money on a worthless education.
b)You do make a valid point about america being a self interested actor that routinely , overthrows popularly elected govts in favor of strong man dictators that stay in line with regard to our economic interests. If you don't think this has anything to do with (a) then obviously we're operating under totally different rulesets for understanding realiyt.
c)you brought up the image of the america the batterer and the liberal apologists. I explored the metaphor for you to see why the liberals are worried. Again if you don't understand it you have a strange way of perceiving reality.
d)At which point their appetite for the fruits of sweat shops, young prostitutes (how young will they go?)
So, you're either a liberal in support of foreign policy or you're a pedophile...
The republicans have been found time and time again of running prostitution rings and sweat shops abroad as hospitality suites for the well to do. My question was what happens to these appetites when they don't have foreigners to feed on? What happens to american women and children when these monsters come home to roost? How you twisted that to slander me is another leap of mushy pol. sci. thinking that your type is famous for.
e)Oh how do these other nations compare to our amazing power? The SCO (shanghai cooperation organization) combining russia and china are determined to stamp out our influence and bases in the region. Without our bases in the region we become less and less able to monopolize the oil supplies in the region. Once our dominance of the oil is gone, what reason does anyone have to export to us at the current rate? We can only push them to slave labor while they need oil backed in dollars. Which remains backed only because of our control of the shipping lanes in the region. With their recent moves in the region (new pipelines etc) they aim to secure their own access to oil. Which reduces any necessity for trade with us. India remains a key contender in the region. Sure, they don't have the ability to reach into america, but making our oil supplies insecure is a trick they too can join in. It seems their recent accords with the SCO seems to indicate a lack of enthusiasm for a US plan to use them as a china counterweight, regardless of the measely bones we toss them every so often.
f)The atrocities in iran occurred during a US backed regime quite similar to the iraq script, we supplied the means for the overthrow of a popular govt to a more brutal, though more favorable despot. This puppet was then overthrown and his band of traitors executed by the popular insurgency which then became the present govt. Oh of course atrocities happened but the USA and britain funded and made it happen. Whoops.
g)As to your 'argument' of the caveat. Let me ask you this. Is it your position that criminals not be brought to justice and compensation made? Sure one can argue that this would be unduly difficult for the criminal, since he's gotten used to having the things he stole etc. but is it just? If you don't think it's just then you understand why their people hate us. Sure you're right, from a realistic stand point they're in no position to bring the dominant power to justice. But given the chance they will do everything to hasten our downfall. h) the ones who work two jobs to make ends meet aren't the ones writing policy or even being presented with a truthful accounting of our actions both past and present at home and abroad. they're being robbed blind w