Linux Cell Phones Coming Q1 2007

eldavojohn writes, "Prepare to salivate. D-Link has announced plans to put an unlocked Linux phone on the market in early 2007. Some features: Dual-mode WiFi and GSM/GPRS. Up to 24 MB of memory for user file storage, such as music and videos. 2-inch, 176 x 220-pixel color display. Opera browser. Email client. 3.4 ounces (95 grams). Tri-band (900/1800/1900) GSM radio — meaning it should work with any GSM-GPRS SIM card, including pre-paid SIM cards as well as those from traditional GSM service providers. Will it really be this easy to wean myself from the Microsoft mobile teat?" The phone is expected to list for $600.

Comments

Wow!

[commisaro]

Only $600? I bet that's pocket change for your average Linux enthusiast!

Re:Wow!

[Musrum]

Sure is. Consider all the money they save not paying the "cargo cult" tax for a crap OS which will be "out of support" in a few years.

Re:Wow!

[commisaro]

Shoulda clarified: I use Linux. My comment was just a joke :p

Re:Wow!

[Sinbios]

They must have saved /some/ money with all the open source stuff; after all, I heard free software was a pretty major incentive for using Linux :P

Re:Wow!

[Norailyain]

You guys don't seem to realize what /*really*/ rocks withe that phone : the Wi-Fi feature that allows you to switch on a cheap VoIP tariff while you're coming back home with a GSM communication going on. (In France, the price of a local communication with GSM vs. VoIP is incomparably more expansive) In fact, this phone has been launched by the French Telecom provider Neuf-Cegetel as the first mobile/VoIP device in France ; and I believe it is sold around 200 ... with a 12 month commitment. By the way, I have been told that the above described feature doesn't work very well for the moment.

Re:Wow!

[just_forget_it]

That is what cell phones really cost. The free phone you get when you sign up for a two year plan is not the same thing. This phone may be expensive, but the firmware is unlocked and you can use it with any carrier you please. Also, it's not crippled by the provider. For example, Verizon flashes all of their phones with their own software, limiting it's capabilities. Created a ringtone and want to transfer it to your phone? Sorry, that feature, even though part of the original firmware, is not part of the Verizon version, but you can purchase that ringtone for $2.99 from the wonderful Get-It-Now service! Want to buy an accessory from the manufacturer? Sorry! Nothing but Verizon accessories work with their phones. You catch my drift...

Buying a locked phone often means you also have to sign a contract, locking you into that provider for 1-2 years. You may pay more for unlocked equipment, but to me, it's completely worth the free-as-in-freedom-ness.

Re:Wow!

[Greyfox]

Yah. I saved $600 by not buying Microsoft products.

Re:Wow!

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, D-Link must be taking a loss on these, since Linux alone costs $699.

Re:Wow!

[Anonymous Coward]

The average linux user should have plenty of money , he hasn't paid for his OS or apps, and the computer he found in teh trash.

24 MB of memory?

[dohzer]

Do we need to move the 'M' and 'G' keys further apart, or are we stuck with the low memory?

Re:24 MB of memory?

[just_forget_it]

That does seem awfully low, considering I just got a 2 GB flash drive for 40 bucks. If I'm paying $600 for anything, skimping on memory is not a good way to attract me as a customer, especially since they could likely fit chips that hold 100 times the capacity in the same space.

Re:24 MB of memory?

[dohzer]

Even if it doesn't come with 2GB, you'd think they'd give you the option to add that 2GB card of yours (as long as it's their flash card of choice).

24MB of Memory?

[aero2600-5]

Up to 24 MB of memory for user file storage, such as music and videos.

24MB of memory? That's about 4 songs or a 1/3 of a music video.

That doesn't sound too appealing.

Aero

Re:24MB of Memory?

[Jeff DeMaagd]

24MB is good for about four minutes of QVGA H.264 video. So no, it's not really worthwhile. If you are lucky, you might fit about six songs on it.

The linked "article" mentions no expansion slots.

Re:24MB of Memory?

[johanw]

You should compress the video better, remember the screen size of the phone. I have a Nokia 6230i which plays H263 .3gp videos. When I convert a complete Stargate episode of 42 minutes the file gets about 17MB. Quality is poor, but cartoons like Star Trek animated do fine (23 mins - about 10MB per episode). Why store 640x480 video on a device that has low memory and can't show that many pixels anyway?

Re:24MB of Memory?

[mnmn]

I'd sooner rather have a microSD slot in the phone.
A miniSD card is $25 CAD for a gig. By the time this phone comes out it'll be cheaper still. I hope the 24MB is really the RAM.

Re:24MB of Memory?

[Matt McIntyre]

My last 3 phones have had slots for card memory. My newest phone, cingular's 8125, has a 1 gb sd card. Hopefully they will integrate that option into the phone but from what Ive seen on the D-Link press release it does not look like they will.

mmm

[Anonymous Coward]

Prepare to salivate.

Preparing to salivate...
Salivating commencing...
Salivating complete.

Re:mmm

[dohzer]

Wow. Imagine when you actually get to use the phone!

Re:mmm

[Anonymous Coward]

Please don't start a two hour yipping session .....

Re:mmm

[Anonymous Coward]

Incidentally, Motorola use Linux on their A85 phones. Even more telling, they use SELinux to impose their DRM system on the user. So much for all those claims by Red Hat that SELinux and it's pervasive mandatory access control wasn't the basis for a DRM system, eh.

Lying fucks. Now if they can only be hoenst about their work with IBM on a Trusted Computing based Linux systems with locked down kernels too.

Umm...

[MrNaz]

Where on that page does it say anything about Linux?

Re:Umm...

[Anonymous Coward]

Good point, try here:
http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS9525079329.html

Re:Umm...

[freitasm]

http://www.wneweb.com/mobile/more/gw1.htm is the ODM for this device. It runs Linux.

Re:Umm...

[nihaopaul]

luckily it didn't proclaim to be the first linux phone, since the e2800 has been out for some 3 years here in china, i should know, i worked on the graphical interface - first phone to use photographs as icons i might add, great phone poor distribution, hey same price!

Usability seems lacking

[BadAnalogyGuy]

The small screen and form factor with barely-raised keys will be hell for anyone trying to admin their company's servers from this phone.

While I applaud the attempt to reach out to Linux enthusiasts, I think that many will be turned off because of what they can't do rather than what they can do with this phone.

And a design to go with my lifestyle

[BadAnalogyGuy]

I guess my lifestyle is 'looks like crap', which is really not that far off, actually.

Re:And a design to go with my lifestyle

[Qadesh]

That is one ugly phone

Some things missing

[gsasha]

Not clear if they are missing from the article or from the phone itself...

1. Bluetooth - extremely important for connectivity.
2. Connector. The Qt Greenphone's solution to this is simple and elegant: its only connection is a mini-USB socket.

On the other hand, D-link does not claim their phone to be an open platform - but if it isn't, think if you will be able to install your own VOIP app? And if not, what's the point?

Agreed..

[Animaether]

..for that price, it would have to deliver a significantly better bang.

Dual-mode WiFi - what is that? B/G? cool, but nothing new.
GSM/GPRS - where's EDGE? Where's UMTS? Where's HSDPA?
24 MB of memory - okay
- for storage - not okay. 24 MB? That's expandable by SD/MiniSD/MicroSD, right? And how much working memory is there? Or is this the same memory and do you lose everything when you power down? (a la pre Windows Mobile 5)
2" screen - not too bad on that
176 x 220-pixel - wtf is that? Where's 240x320 or even 480x640?
color display - 4096? 16k?
Opera browser - pre-installed, they mean, I hope. Can you replace it? (not that I can think of a reason to)
3.4 ounces (95 grams) - that *is* nice, however.
Tri-band - quad band, please?

Now to RTFA because the summary was silly in listing features without detail. Be better if it had been a more generic blurb.

Re:Agreed..

[MrNaz]

All the extra feaures are coming in the second iteration, after they've finished suckering in the following:

SELECT * FROM users WHERE money > bains;

Re:Agreed..

[Anonymous Coward]

ERROR: Identifier 'bains' not defined (0xDEADBEEF)

Re:Agreed..

[rec9140]

For the US market, they may as well give up now.

GSM - Strike 1 - While this may be the prominent format outside the US. Its is NOT the de facto standard in the US. Remember GSM was MANDATED not chosen by marketplace forces, MANADATED by governments. Have a GSM version all you want, but without a CDMA version, you've locked your self out of 90% of the US market from the start. GSM is not the format to try to push in the US. Have both, better make it a true world phone do GSM and CDMA.

900/1800/1900 - Strike 2 - Frequency coverage is again way too outside US specific. Lack of the 800Mhz coverage used in many areas means your stuck with 1900 in the US and its poor building penetration and in some areas NO SERVICE as there are 800 only areas. Thats why all the US carriers require 800/1900 coverage. This would also make it more of a world phone by adding in 800 where used.

If their primary market is outside the US, they are 100% on the spot, but if DLink is going to try to sell this in the US. They will be required to make these changes to get it to sell.

This won't last in the US very long due to the above 2 reasons alone. Price is another factor. While many of the hordes are buying or getting conned into contracts and subsidised phones, I have not had one in years. I purchase a new phone off EBay, do an online ESN change, done. I don't change my plan (it doesn't even exist any more) and NO CONTRACTS. I its been that way for years, probably 6+ and I have had Verizon since it was BellAtlantic Mobile and they first came along, so thats a little over 20 years for that account. I've had exactly 4 phones during that period. Started with a UBC9000 brick, changed to a Nokia, then had a Audiovox 9000 and have had a 9155 for about 2 years now.

I won't be purchasing one for the two reasons above. As I am not using either of the two worst networks in the US. TMobile or Cingular. I may as well have no coverage as these two are the worst carriers in the US market. The current marketing crap from one of them is spin on a study thats bought and paid for anyway.

Re:Agreed..

[squiggleslash]

Remember GSM was MANDATED not chosen by marketplace forces, MANADATED by governments.

It was neither. In Europe, it was chosen by the operators who were mandated to meet and settle on a common standard for the 900MHz band. For the 1800MHz band, it was initially chosen by operators who weren't mandated to settle on a common standard, but after 1800MHz GSM become widespread, was mandated in the remaining countries who hadn't implemented it yet. Regardless of which, it's a great standard. The "GSM was imposed by governments on unwilling, tortured, operators" is a common meme from Qualcomm's IS-95 shilling operation.

Have a GSM version all you want, but without a CDMA version, you've locked your self out of 90% of the US market from the start

By "CDMA" I assume you mean IS-95 (the most recent version of GSM, UMTS, uses a CDMA air interface.) In the US, the two standards are currently neck and neck. Cingular, the US's largest operator, uses GSM. T-Mobile and a number of regional operators also use GSM. GSM is available in the vast majority of locations in the US where cellular service of any type is available.

900/1800/1900 - Strike 2 - Frequency coverage is again way too outside US specific. Lack of the 800Mhz coverage used in many areas means your stuck with 1900 in the US and its poor building penetration and in some areas NO SERVICE as there are 800 only areas. Thats why all the US carriers require 800/1900 coverage. This would also make it more of a world phone by adding in 800 where used.

This is the one point you've made so far that has any remotely true validity. 800MHz support would help in the US. That's not to say it's 100% necessary, with a number of operators 1900MHz is the only frequency available. 1900MHz isn't awful, it's just there's more coverage when you combine the two, and in certain locations 1900MHz can be difficult to get. Cingular gets a poor (800MHz) signal in my home, T-Mobile's (1900MHz) is relatively good.

One hopes that the phone's support for 802.11 means that it also supports UMA, which will in the long term counter many of the disadvantages of higher frequencies.

If their primary market is outside the US, they are 100% on the spot, but if DLink is going to try to sell this in the US. They will be required to make these changes to get it to sell.

Not really.

First, you presume IS-95 users would want a PDA phone. That's not my experience, and I was a Sprint PCS customer for three years who before that was on GSM networks in the UK and used a PDA phone for a long time while there, so I've been on both sides of the fence.

The last thing I want to be is stuck with an oversized phone all the time. On IS-95, the only way to have two phones is to have two accounts, complete with seperate phone numbers. On GSM, for those occasions where a smaller phone would be more useful, it's just a matter of slipping the SIM out of one and into the other. The market for PDA phones is thus tiny, if not non-existant, on IS-95. On GSM, Blackberrys, Sidekicks, and others are relatively popular. Sidekicks, FWIW, are also, in practice, subject to the 1900MHz frequency limitation.

Limiting PDA phones to GSM isn't a bad idea, it's a good one. It's a waste of development time to try and develop such a thing for IS-95 users. When Verizon and Sprint PCS and Alltel stop treating their customers like crap and finally implement RUIM cards, we might see that change. But right now, none of the operators are using a version of IS-95 that is PDA friendly. That's a shame, but that's the way it is.

Second, as I mentioned above, there are plenty of existing PDA phones in the US that sell fairly well that are limited to the one band (1900MHz). I think it would be a good idea for them to improve that, but it's hardly a "this will make or break whether we can

Re:Agreed..

[toleraen]

1. Cingular, the largest mobile carrier in the US, operates on GSM.
2. Cingular, the largest mobile carrier in the US, operates primarily on 1900. T-Mobile, the other major GSM carrier, uses only 1900 on their networks in the US. While not having 850 does suck a bit, you're not cutting off the entire market.

Guess you've had a bad experience with Cingular/TMobile, though from what you say it doesn't sound like you've ever had a plan through them. I'll take my Cingular account over my old Sprint account any day of the week.

Re:Agreed..

[aplusjimages]

I read somewhere that it comes pre-loaded with ringtones taken from the movie "Revenge of the Nerds". So you can assign Ogre yelling "Neeeerds!" to your best friends ring.

Re:Agreed..

[rec9140]

1) GSM Is the REQUIREMENT in Europe by MANDATE. You can gloss it over with this or that, the "standards" were set up so one format met those standards, GSM. Suffice it to say you see it one way I see it another, and were not going to agree except to disagree. I heard the various arguments on this for a while and have not changed my opinion. GSM=MANDATED.

2) CDMA in its various formats is the de facto standard, in the US. NO CDMA you've lost out on 90% of the US market. Verizon, Sprint, Alltel (which may as well be Verizon, why don't they just merge and get it over with), US Cellular and a slew of other local and regional carriers. The fact that CDMA is going to be the air interface for the "new and improved" GSM shows they fubar'd with their anti US mind set. Pick the better technology, and thats not GSM.

3) Cingular can promote/crow all they want about being bigger sub count wise, that don't mean a thing. Their network is CRAP! CRAP! CRAP! Poor coverage, poor building penetration, lack of comparable coverage to Verizon. And as for TMobile, I would LOVE to use TMobile for 2 reasons - Catherine Zeta Jones and Deutsche Telekom. One their coverage SUCKS! Its even worse than Sprints 1900 CDMA network. Three networks I wouldn't touch Cingular, Sprint, TMobile in that order. Coverage, Coverage, Coverage and the ability to make a call in that coverage is all that matters. 99.99999% of my very limited calls are voice. The once in a blue moon tether to laptop for emergency and SMS to back up an alpha pager.

4) Verizon is not limiting me or making me ask for permission to use my phone. I purchase a phone which 1) Meets the requirements of the NETWORK ie: 800/1900, CDMA and AMPS (there are still and will continue even past the deadline to provide it analog areas, mostly rural, thus if you have a CDMA only phone your cooked). 2) Meets the features I need. I have had 4 handheld phones FOUR in 20+ years of service.FOUR. Compare that to others, some peple change cell phones more than they change socks and underwear. My present 9155GPX phone is as low tech as it gets. Supports 1x data for tethering and WAP or the low speed packet for tethering/WAP. It doesn't have color, doesn't act as a PDA or any of that other stuff, and I am not likely to purchase a phone that does either. I don't need it I pick up phones when they are cheap, and meet my requirements. I only gave up the Motorola UBC9000 brick because they never really made a CDMA version (it was made) just very low release volume. So I had to get a compatible phone.

Persons using what ever phone that is 1900 only or any other single band only will realize the problems they have the first time they go some place where there is ZERO 1900 coveage, but tons of 800 coverage. I can think of several areas I go to that fit that criteria and will into the near future. The 800 has been built and these carriers will upgrade it, but there is barely enough volumne for the carrier already there for another to come in and build a new 1900 network or add 1900 unless they have saturated their 800 capacity, and in these areas thats very unlikely. 1900 only phones and digital only phones may work great as long as you never leave neverneverland NYC or similar metro area. I can drive just a few miles outside the my "metro" area here and a CDMA only or TMobile, or Cingular would all be DEAD! NO SERVICE. Verizon, Alltell both work. Spirnt will work a little longer than Cingular and TMobile, but not much, and Sprint still has a huge hole. Just look at their coverage map it looks like a highway map. Off the highway, NO SERVICE!

I don't think that "pda phone" users really care a hoot about what band or not, this crowd only wants the gee whiz features. Getting those may cost them functions in another area like making a call period in some areas. The majority of cell phone users don't understand the underlying issues of the differing formats and frequencies. I would love to see the phone selling structure in the US radically change. Thats one area which I will gladly tout th

Re:Agreed..

[MrNaz]

D'oh! Posts where you deride other peoples' stupidity are NOT posts you want to make typos in.

I still got modded "Funny" though... at least the mods didn't notice hehe!

Re:Agreed..

[squiggleslash]

GSM Is the REQUIREMENT in Europe by MANDATE. You can gloss it over with this or that, the "standards" were set up so one format met those standards, GSM. Suffice it to say you see it one way I see it another, and were not going to agree except to disagree. I heard the various arguments on this for a while and have not changed my opinion. GSM=MANDATED.

A COMMON STANDARD is the requirement by Europe, and then only on the 900MHz, and after it became defacto on 1800MHz, on 1800MHz too. GSM was the standard that was picked by the operators. GSM was not pushed by any governmental organization, it's a flat out lie to imply that it was.

Any state government in Europe can also make available other frequencies for mobile phone service running whatever services operators want. Indeed, that's how 1800MHz came about - because Britain opened up that frequency for operators to use. Both operators chose, off their free will, without even having to pick a common standard, GSM. Had they, and the dozens of operators that followed, picked something else, that'd have resulted in a different environment.

You can gloss over this as much as you like. You can say that because governments told operators they had to choose a common standard, that it's some kind of terrible crime against the holy goal of free marketism. What you can't say is that GSM specifically received government support.

Quite the reverse. The only standard I see being given mandated government support is IS-95, which the US government has done - often to the detriment of US interests. When IS-95 was pushed on the Chinese by the Clinton administration, the fall-out was immense, with the Chinese Government deliberately using it as a weapon against the US's attempts to deal with human rights violations. Qualcomm's lobbying, and the US government's incompetent caving in to such lobbying, has probably actually ensured many human rights abuses couldn't be prevented.

Yet, despite this well documented support of IS-95 by governments, for some reason it's the Europeans who get it in the neck. Because the European community had the audicity to want to replace the situation where the entire community had half a dozen or so incompatible analog standards with no roaming with a situation where someone could at least buy a phone that was guaranteed coverage anywhere in the area.

Oh the humanity!

BTW Vodafone experimented with a version of GSM that used the same air interface as IS-95 in the mid-nineties and ended up rejecting it, not because of politics or legal reasons, but because Qualcomm wasn't able to come up with a system that worked well for them. Nothing stopped them from running it, any more than anything stops European operators from implementing GPRS, EDGE, or UMTS.

2) CDMA in its various formats is the de facto standard, in the US. NO CDMA you've lost out on 90% of the US market. Verizon, Sprint, Alltel (which may as well be Verizon, why don't they just merge and get it over with), US Cellular and a slew of other local and regional carriers. The fact that CDMA is going to be the air interface for the "new and improved" GSM shows they fubar'd with their anti US mind set. Pick the better technology, and thats not GSM.

FWIW, CDMA is not a standard anywhere. It's an air interface technology. You might just as well argue that "Packet switching" or "Plastic buttons" is a standard.

IS-95, which is what you meant, is not the de-facto standard in the US. The biggest operator in the US is Cingular. Cingular operates a GSM network. GSM has many other operators, including T-Mobile, some of Alltel (in the old Western Wireless regions), and various regional operators. And before adding up customer figures, remember that only half of Sprint's customers use its IS-95 network.

It is a flat out lie to argue that 90% of US users use IS-95. I would be surprised if IS-95 is used by more than 45% of US cellphone subscribers.

Secondly, the fa

Re:Agreed..

[LuYu]

That's expandable by SD/MiniSD/MicroSD, right? And how much working memory is there? Or is this the same memory and do you lose everything when you power down?

Yeah, that was my first reaction, too. When I first glanced at the article, I figured I would almost be able to forgive D-Link for claiming the GPL was invalid . The phone sounded good enough that my convictions would have kept me feeling guilty while I imagined having this thing.

But without expandable storage (1GB minimum), I really cannot imagine even paying one hundred dollars for such a device (even if D-Link did do the honorable thing and apologize publically to the Linux community).

Fortunately, a few Chinese companies and one French one have come out with similar things. These others, however, do not come with D-Link's stigma of being the first company to bring the GPL into court. And the "unlocked" thing is irrelevant outside of the US because only US phone companies are so greedy as to "lock" users cellphones from them. This is the same stupid mentality that gave rise to stupid ideas like DRM.

Re:Agreed..

[squiggleslash]

Cingular runs pretty evenly on both 1900MHz and 800 (or 850, depending on who's terminology you're using) MHz, depending on the area. Cingular is made up of a bunch of old B networks and AT&T's old A network (history: AT&T Wireless was an aquisition by AT&T, it used to be McCaw Cellular), and both these networks also bought a large amount of PCS spectrum.

But, yeah, T-Mobile is 100% 1900MHz. It's useful to have a dual band phone as you can then roam onto 850MHz GSM networks, but T-Mobile's roaming arrangements are a little wierd so...

Re:Agreed..

[mrchaotica]

Look at the pictures of the first and last devices you mentioned, and then look at the pic of the D-Link one from the article. They're all the same phone!

Re:Agreed..

[RzUpAnmsCwrds]

In Europe, it was chosen by the operators who were mandated to meet and settle on a common standard for the 900MHz band.

Sounds like a mandate to me. Now, that's not necesarily a bad thing - we mandate lots of things in the US, including wireless standards (ATSC anyone?).

Regardless of which, it's a great standard

No disagreement there. I walk around with a GSM/GPRS/EDGE Treo 650 on T-Mobile.

By "CDMA" I assume you mean IS-95 (the most recent version of GSM, UMTS, uses a CDMA air interface.)

No, he means CDMA2000. IS-95 was superceded years ago by CDMA2000.

The market for PDA phones is thus tiny, if not non-existant, on IS-95.

Better tell Palm to stop making the Treo 700p/700w and 650 CDMA. Better tell HTC to stop making the Apache. Better tell RIM to stop making CDMA BlackBerry devices. Better tell Motorola to stop making the Q.

Your argument doens't make any sense. Walk into a Verizon or Sprint store - what do you see? PDA phones - more than in a T-Mobile store and as many as in a Cingular store.

Second, as I mentioned above, there are plenty of existing PDA phones in the US that sell fairly well that are limited to the one band (1900MHz).

Not on Cingular. All phones sold by Cingular are at least US dual-band (850/1900); most are US tri-band (850/1800/1900) or quad-band (850/900/1800/1900).

It's a waste of development time to try and develop such a thing for IS-95 users.

Clearly Motorola, HTC, RIM, Palm, and Samsung don't think so.

Re:Agreed..

[FrostedChaos]

Whoa there, cowboy. I'll sell you all the non-standard junk you want, and the evil gubment can't do nothing about it.

Want some 234.56 volt, hexagonal power outlets for your home? Only $.50 each. Of course, you'll have to buy all your appliances from me, but that's a small price to pay for FIGHTING the MAN. And my prices are very REASONABLE.

Re:Agreed..

[btsfh]

That or the mods felt the typo was amusing.

Re:Agreed..

[SeaFox]

This is the one point you've made so far that has any remotely true validity. 800MHz support would help in the US. That's not to say it's 100% necessary, with a number of operators 1900MHz is the only frequency available. 1900MHz isn't awful, it's just there's more coverage when you combine the two, and in certain locations 1900MHz can be difficult to get. Cingular gets a poor (800MHz) signal in my home, T-Mobile's (1900MHz) is relatively good.

Cingular is 850mhz. This phone actually doesn't support the largest carrier in the U.S. Although they do have some areas of 1900mhz from their aquisition of AT&T wireless.

Lame!

[AEton]

No wireless. Less space than a Nomad.

Lame.

Re:Lame!

[RuBLed]

I doubt the wireless part... but considering the current driver support for wireless devices in linux, it might be possible that all your statement is true :)

Re:Lame!

[denoir]

..no wireless, no 3G, no bluetooth, no GPS and 24 mb memory. What year do they think this is? 1987?

Re:Lame!

[lordofthechia]

It does have better battery life than a Nomad but can I play all my favorite Genesis games on it?

Re:Lame!

[strider44]

If a mobile phone doesn't have some sort of wireless communication technology then it probably won't do well in the market place. I'm pretty sure this does have some wireless stuff in it though.

Re:Lame!

[Anonymous Coward]

Has anyone ported OpenBSD to this phone? :)

D-Link

[Anonymous Coward]

if their phone is anything like their cable modems, it will be pure crap. Their DCM-202 cable modem has an http interface for setting some config values and checking errors. I'm not going to mention the broken javascript that doesn't work with firefox (oops, I just did), but I will mention that if your cable signal is having problems (the one time you'd most like to check the event log), you can't connect to it. An nmap scan shows absolutely nothing. Talk about a piece of shit.

All these features don't matter

[DietCoke]

I'll give a damn about all those features when I can drop an unconverted xvid file on the phone in less than five minutes. Make that several movies.

In the meantime, all a phone needs for me to be happy is those little number thingies, a send button, and an alarm. And I'll certainly not be paying $600 for it.

Re:All these features don't matter

[lixee]

In the meantime, all a phone needs for me to be happy is those little number thingies, a send button, and an alarm. And I'll certainly not be paying $600 for it.

Your geek membership has hereby been revoked.

Press Release from d-link has more info.

[Animaether]

Read the article, and it hardly has any further information, other than a picture (welcome) and dimensions (also welcome - and not too bad).

But a bit more info is in the actual Press Release from D-Link;
http://www.dlink.com/press/pr/?prid=299
--
Talk time - up to 5 hours GSM, 2 hours 802.11 wireless mode
Messages - up to 30 messages can be stored at 459 characters each
--
Can't say I'm impressed with that - but it explains why it's a bit lighter, smaller battery. The number of messages stored however is just pathetic.

Had to still google for Dual-Mode; it actually just means it has a phone radio and another form of wireless communications. Lame terminology comes to mind; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual-Mode_Mobile_Phon es

As for the rest of the info - not in the PR either.

But for those of you who have been whining about "I don't want a camera in my phone!" - there you go.. Linux, WiFi, no camera.

Re:Press Release from d-link has more info.

[Anonymous Coward]

Hmmm... All the information from the PR is actually on the article as well. You didn't read it really?

Re:Press Release from d-link has more info.

[Anonymous Coward]

But for those of you who have been whining about "I don't want a camera in my phone!" - there you go

I know someone who routinely visits places where cameras are forbidden. A phone is okay but not a camera. He was complaining that these days it's hard to get a NICE phone that does NOT have a camera... Once this is out I'll suggest it to him...

Re:Press Release from d-link has more info.

[Animaether]

Read more closely and you'll note that several specs are actually missing in the article. The single paragraph summarizing talk time/etc. isn't complete. Anyway :)

old tech done worse

[juventasone]

There's a lot missing here compared to existing competitors. At the very least 850MHz GSM, EDGE, and UMTS. These are standard equipment in established WiFi phones like the Nokia E61 and others. Will this phone be important to anyone who doesn't want to hack it?

Re:old tech done worse

[photomonkey]

And even moreso, how popular will this phone be when it costs $600 to take a chance at a 'hack' that might render the phone inoperable?

I don't doubt that some will buy it to play, the market volume isn't there to support a $600 phone with less features than the freebie phones given away with new contracts.

that's a tough question. lets go to the videotape

[macadamia_harold]

Will it really be this easy to wean myself from the Microsoft mobile teat?

Gee, I dunno. Lets check the next sentence: The phone is expected to list for $600.

There's your answer! "no."

What about the GPL?

[Anonymous Coward]

DLink has a history of ignoring the GPL...
http://www.gpl-violations.org/news/20060922-dlink- judgement_frankfurt.html

Re:What about the GPL?

[Anonymous Coward]

Not to mention the Denmark/router/NTP rubbish, and their general poor quality in the networking market. It's pretty hard to choose between D-Link and Microsoft.

Re:What about the GPL?

[jack_csk]

How difficult would that be? You don't see Microsoft going out abusing someone else's NTP server, do you?

The high cost of FREEDOM?

[Travoltus]

Are you free to put ring tones on these things? Are you free from the proprietary systems of regular cell phones that make you pay for every little tiny thing you add onto them?

If so, I will gladly pay $600 for one.

Re:The high cost of FREEDOM?

[Sinbios]

Last I checked, I could stick any 192kbps> mp3 on my phone and use it as a ringtone, as well as install a variety of Java applications and games for free.

What is it, you ask? Motorola V360. Cost me about $140 after tax, and that's Canadian.

Wait, I mean, it's custom made for me and you can have it for the low low price of $600!

Re:The high cost of FREEDOM?

[amliebsch]

I'm pretty sure you can use your own MP3 ringtones on any Motorola that has a transflash slot. Ringtones I've placed on my E815 using this process:

- Star Trek TOS "communicator" sound
- Windows XP Startup sound
- Windows "new mail" sound
- The Halo music cue from the Bungee loading screen
- Steve Ballmer yelling "Developers, developers, developers, developers, developers, developers!" (This one's my favorite!)
- The "cloaking" noise that stealth tanks made in C&C Gold
- A computer beepy noise from Star Trek TNG
- The "come on down music" from the Price Is Right
- The first four bars from "Clocks" by Coldplay
- The Windows "chords" sound (This being the standard error dialog sound for Windows, it really irritates office mates)
- The first phrase of the "Cantina Band" music from Star Wars
- Jim Carey as Lloyd Christmas making "the most annoying sound in the world"

You act like it's more expensive...

[nobodyman]

In the USA, a $300 phone is probably subsidized by your upwards of %50. That's why they lock you into multi-year contracts and sell you the first 10 seconds of a Blink-182 song for $2.50 a pop. I'm not sure if this is as big of an issue in Europe because I believe SIM cards are portable across service providers by law.

Don't think that this $600 phone is any more expensive than equivalent piece of hardware from T-mobile or Verizon. Considering that I'll be able to install whatever the hell I want on it I'd say it's a steal.

This phone is the last thing service providers want on the market -- the only thing they'd have left to differentiate themselves from the competition is rates and service (the horror!!). I predict they'll try to kill it.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[mackyrae]

What are you talking about? Cell phones are like $100 in the US. At least, in Pittsburgh they are. And I realise the economy there sucks so a lot of stuff is a bit cheaper than say NYC, but still.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[PCM2]

In the USA, a $300 phone is probably subsidized by your upwards of %50. That's why they lock you into multi-year contracts and sell you the first 10 seconds of a Blink-182 song for $2.50 a pop.

Uh, no. A BlackBerry 8100, brand new, retails for about $400, maybe a little less. Subsidized upwards of 50 percent (like mine was, because I signed the contract), it goes for $200. No contract, it's list price.

$600 is expensive for a phone.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[Korin43]

You're either referring to the price of cheap phones, or you didn't read the "with contract" part.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[irc.goatse.cx troll]

Don't think that this $600 phone is any more expensive than equivalent piece of hardware from T-mobile or Verizon. Considering that I'll be able to install whatever the hell I want on it I'd say it's a steal.

To my knowledge, you can install whatever you want on the pda/smartphones from the bignames. The only difference here is you won't have anything to install because its running Linux. Linux is nice and all, but unless you feel like writing your own software don't expect this phone to be very useful. The OS a phone runs means little more than what apps you have access to, and Linux on a a phone just doesn't have the selection yet and probably never will.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[b0r1s]

Sidekick III was over $300 with contract (24months).

$600 is definitely pricey, and those features don't seem to match up favorably with the other high end units out there...

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[StarKruzr]

To my knowledge, you can install whatever you want on the pda/smartphones from the bignames.

Not on a Sidekick, that's for damn sure. And the phone's software is always crippleware -- crippled Bluetooth, no wifi, no provisions for wifi. Extra software is always absurdly expensive.

But this is Linux, which gives you control of the phone's hardware and the ability to run anything you damn well please on it.

I kind of can't believe someone has actually done this. If D-Link actually gets this thing out the door I'll be shocked -- and more shocked if carriers don't ban the thing from their networks.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[cyberon22]

Hmmmm.... I paid about $40 USD for the last phone I purchased here in China. This was a low-market Motorola with a black and white screen. While slightly cheaper phones were available they weren't much cheaper. Most of the market here involves sales of pre-paid phones that retail for around $100 USD. No-one was taking a loss selling me that phone -- the phone service uses pre-paid cards and can be used with either the China Telecom or China Unicom networks.

Assume you will get lower costs because this stuff is all being manufactured in China. And then add a 100% markup for stuff sold through American retail outlets. But your average phone should still not cost over $150 USD retail. So I highly doubt that anyone is subsidizing your phone. You are simply being ripped off because of a lack of competition in regional US cellular markets.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[trailerparkcassanova]

Linux is nice and all, but unless you feel like writing your own software don't expect this phone to be very useful.

Yeah, that's the problem with Linux and open source embedded systems; nobody ever writes software for that stuff.....

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[Anonymous Coward]

The great thing about Europe (ok, among others) is that we have so Many laws! In Spain for example there's no law making service providers not lock the mobiles they sell.

- the A.C.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[Directrix1]

Linux on anything means you can run any Linux program that fits within memory on it. You can run fuckin' firefox/abiword/gnumeric, full applications not watered down PDcApable software.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[BenBoy]

> I believe SIM cards are portable across service providers by law. Nope; at least not as of a couple of years ago (last time I travelled in Italy). This was, granted, a cell that worked off of pre-paid sims, rather than under contract ... couldn't switch providers, as the phone was sim-locked.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[Arterion]

Not that you can't write your own software for a PocketPC. In fact, the only reason I'd ever want one is because I can write my own software for it. As far as this linux phone goes, I'm curious as to how easily one can port software over to it. For some reason, I don't think it's going to be easy. Even if it is, most programs will probably need have the interface redesigned anyway to be useful at 176x220.

Having access to a command line on your phone is neat (Yes, I've always wanted bash on my phone!), but again, of limited use considering there's no keyboard. I guess you could use the number keys, but you'd have to be something of a masochist.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[germanStefan]

I don't know about Linux phones, but the nokia 770 internet tablet has a large linux developer community writing and porting software to it, all for free. I would get one of the devices if it had a keyboard...

Saying that linux doesn't have software is naive. I know plenty of people who use it for their daily OS without ever needing to turn to Wine to run windows software to fill a void. There may be some quality/testing issues with some of the software, but there is a ton of interesting stuff out there. Especially now with mono, Linux will sooner or later gain the ability to run lots of stuff written in the .net stack. I think it can already run a bunch of stuff.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[mackyrae]

Yeah, those probably are cheap ones, though they do go a bit lower. $150's about normal I guess....right? But you're right, I didn't see "with contract". I don't know if other areas have this, but Cricket gives unlimited calling for $32/month. For $40 you get caller id and voicemail, and like $45 gets unlimited texting too. I think you can also get unlimited web time.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[irc.goatse.cx troll]

I'm saying linux on the phone doesn't have software. It's like comparing WindowsMobile and Windows -- Same name, a lot of similarities, but the fact that somethign exits for one doesn't help you much with the other.
At the very least you would have to recompile something to get it running on the phones arch, but chances are we're talking full interface redesign to fit remotely on that screen. Apps that were intended to be ran on >1024x768 with a full keyboard on a modern machine will be completely useless on a phone. Things like gtk are so inefficient that I wouldn't even consider it on such a low battery here every wasted cpu cycle counts.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[Anonymous Coward]

As a result of my wanting to be anonymous (to corporations and the govt.) and distrusting the credit system since I've been in highschool, I've paid chash for almost everything. I have no credit.. not bad credit.. no credit. I have to pay full retail for cell phones on prepaid accounts because otherwise they want from $400-$600 as a deposit for a contract. I got a LG 4015 and had to pay $130 for it while everyone else gets it for free. Someone is subsidizing it. That new pantech C300 will cost me $120. A Razr V3 is $199.

Re:You act like it's more expensive...

[cjb110]

I'm not sure if this is as big of an issue in Europe because I believe SIM cards are portable across service providers by law.

Not quite, most providers in the UK release locked phones, however the law does say you can move to another provider (without charges if your outside your original contract) and keep your number. However this isn't really the best idea, as the calls/sms's will still go through your old provider, then from them to you. It won't cost more to do this, but your reliant on two sets of systems to be working.

Plus changing number is a good way to keep down on all the crappy marketing calls.

Back to Bacl

[Anonymous Coward]

One might be able to use two of this telephones back to back without the support of a network, at least in WIFI mode.

Oh, please...

[Anonymous Coward]

The phone is expected to list for $600.

We're not living in the nineties anymore where mobile phones were some kind of status symbol.

There are cheap mobile phone with less annoying features (that would break anyway or reqire a virus killer(!)) available at eBay for $10 or less...

$600... hahahahaha... that's pretty insane...

D-Link Plan

[ValiantSoul]

Make phone
Say linux
....
Profit!!!

Re:D-Link Plan

[sharkey]

Missing step: Hardcode Stratum-1 NTP server in Demark.

Rediculously crappy.

[Atlantis-Rising]

My phone is almost two years old; it has a 640x480 65K color screen, 192 MB of memory, a 520 Mhz processor, B/G Wifi, Bluetooth, UTMS, and GSM, dual video cameras, and expansion by SD if necessary. It came unlocked, and if you really wanted, you could also put Linux on it- (there's a linux port out there.) For god's sake DLink, get your act together.

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[Anonymous Coward]

Really? Did it come with its own backpack to lug it around?

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[ctscan]

No it's probably a HTC-universal (Qtek 9000 etc) or another phone from HTC http://www.europe.htc.com/products/. Agreed, they run windows mobile, but they have a lot more features (UMTS/HSDPA - EVDO - WiFi- Bluetooth - SD card - higher resolution) than this phone for a lower price. I mean, memory for 30 messages and 300 contacts? That's ridiculous in this day and age

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[glesga_kiss]

Agreed; I have a two year old device from HTC and it pisses all over this new one. I would have breached it's 300 contact limit already and I've installed enough apps to use up the 24 meg twice over. And that's not including software on the SD-card such as TomTom which comes in around about 700 meg. Hell, I even run a RAM disk on it to swap 32meg of the main RAM for a little extra high-speed storage for web cache and mail attachments.

24 meg? What were they thinking? Flash ROM is cheap cheap cheap these days; you can get a 2gig SD card for around $40. They could have given it up to 256 meg without even blinking.

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[mgblst]

Bullshit. No phone has that screen size, and is over 2 years old. The first one to break the 320x240 battery are the Nokia N90s. Unless you have something really weird, which isn't really a phone - please tell us what phone this is.

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[ctscan]

That's not entirely bullshit. Like I said above, he probably has a HTC Universal, a phone that I also have and is roughly 1.5 years old. It's a WM5 phone/PDA with a 640x480 screen

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[Atlantis-Rising]

It is indeed an HTC Universal, branded an Imate Jasjar. And I've run Linux on it, too!

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[kwalker]

Who did you have to kill / have sex with to get an HTC Universal for less than a grand USD?

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[talonyx]

Give us a model number!

Re:Rediculously crappy.

[Atlantis-Rising]

Look on E-bay; or buy a locked one from a carrier and go on XDA-Developers to get the unlocker tool. You can get them carrier-locked for close to 300 bucks, and unlock it yourself, or you can buy it unlocked and fancy-free for maybe 900 US. If you know what you're doing, you can get them relatively cheaply.

Linux cellphones came long back...

[wannabgeek]

The headline is misleading.

I have a Motorola A780 - which is based on Linux too, and it is triband and it's unlocked too (Most of the GSM phones you buy in India are unlocked). IIRC, the whole A-series of Motorola is based on Linux. Yes, my phone does not have Wi-fi, but the plug talks as if it's the first Linux based cellphone.

Low memory?

[knightinshiningarmor]

I was certain he meant 'K'

After all, "Why would anyone need more than 640KB?"

Depends on what they mean

[Sycraft-fu]

Generally, the Windows smart phones have little memory on board but are expandable. Mine (PPC6700) has 40MB total storage memory, of which 33.5 is free after the default loadout (that's not an OS store, that's stored in a separate location). However I can drop an MiniSD card in and get 2GB of storage if I wish. The included storage is mostly useful for apps. You generally want those on the hardware itself rather than a card.

However if it's limited to 24MB than ya, that makes it kinda worthless for storage of any kind.

Should I?

[sumi-manga]

... I for one welcome our imperial data storing pocket friendly linux kernel cell lords

...But...

[Squapper]

...do they run Windows?

Re:...But...

[sumi-manga]

Yeah, but on VMware...

Re:...But...

[Anonymous Coward]

How about Wine?

Re:...But...

[Anonymous Coward]

[pedantic ballsniffer]
Boch maybe, not VMWare, unless it uses an X86 processor
[/pedantic ballsniffer]

That's what many of the MS based phones cost

[Sycraft-fu]

I just got a PPC6700 and that's what it lists for. Of course the provider gives you a knock down rate if you get a contract, as with all phones, but it's full list price is $600. Phones are always done like that, their list is quite high, you can usually get one for no contract for somewhat less than list, but they are offered for real deals if you get a contract. Often they are actually sold at less than cost, however the company knows they'll make it back up on having you as a customer for a year or two.

Ahem...

[djupedal]

My Motorola E680i & A1200 both run Linux, and I've had the E680i for a year now...

Of course, living in Asia makes this a bit easier, but hey, anything beats having MS on a phone.

3G

[drstock]

Why GSM and not 3G?

And the big deal is?

[traveller604]

My Nokia N91 has WiFi and GSM/GPRS, up to 4 GB of memory and a bigger color display. It also has more connectivity (3g), and well loads of stuff really. COmes with a better OS too, Symbian 9.1. Oh and it costs less and is available right now!

Re: They need to make it cheap

[SolitaryMan]

And I'll certainly not be paying $600 for it.

As a person who was looking for a new phone two weeks ago, I must agree. What I really would like to see is free software based cheap phone, without extra features I have PDA for.

$600 For...

[bangenge]

Dual-mode WiFi and GSM/GPRS. Up to 24 MB of memory for user file storage, such as music and videos. 2-inch, 176 x 220-pixel color display. Opera browser. Email client. 3.4 ounces (95 grams). Tri-band (900/1800/1900) GSM radio

WHA?!

Not to sound fanboi or anything, but the nokia N80 has much better specs at a slightly lower price point, and is available now. Wifi, 3g, 3MP cam, 40MB memory (upgradeable via miniSD), and it comes in 2 colors. And that's not even their newest model (alhough the N80 is arguably the most feature packed). Sony Ericsson phones OTOH try to cater to a more specific crowd -- ie. walkman phones, cybershot phones -- so I have don't have a phone in mind that has that all around capability from SE now. Yes, those other phones run symbian, and not linux, but if Dlink plans to make money out of this, then they either have to lower prices or push out much better specs, preferably earlier than Q1 2007.

Needs UMA+GSM

[MDMurphy]

T-Mobile's beta trials of GSM plus UMA (Unlicensed Mobile Access) sounds a lot better option than "any old GSM SIM and any old SIP account" If you're going to do it all with one handset you'd probably prefer it didn't act like two different phones with no linkage.

It's nice and cool to have a single handset, address book and UI, but if you were dealing with 2 phone numbers and 2 voicemails it's not going to be as convenient. I think the options a carrier can provide to make it all look like a single phone would outweigh a small extra feature or two a roll-your-own package would give you. ( Like running Linux )

D-link vs Qt Greenphone

[S3D]

Greenphone is 695$ vs D-Link 600$, open platform, SDK (though you seems have to buy Qtopia License for development), have BT, mini-USB, touch-screen, 128Mb flash vs D-Link 24Mb, 240x320 screen resolution vs D-link 176x220. Major advantage of D-link is WiFi

24 fucking megs??

[Khyber]

Excuse me? My Compag LTE ELITE 4/50CX has that much memory, and it was made well over 14 years ago. WTF is a cell phone doing with that tiny amount of memory when we'll store far more than that with the help of a badly-obfuscated and non-assembler language and a horrible filing system? I mean, Java, and such, are CRAP on phones I've owned. The best were pure logic-circuit/assembler operated, and they were faster to respond (near-instant) than my java-based phone updated from unofficial firmware upgrades that were custom pre-programmed, I've had FAR BETTER results with my OLD cell phone, and my cell company can't even tell the difference. That's damn-near sad. I put out phone calls five seconds faster than most "rave" users in my area.

Re:24 fucking megs??

[ZoomieDood]

Don't you know??? It's to keep you from installing DD-WRT!!!

That's right... no ssh, no vpn, no...nothing...

no.. wait! There's a prompt!

It accepts numbers only... No strong passwords there... although, there's pi.... nobody would guess that.

ANY Sim card?

[SeaFox]

Tri-band (900/1800/1900) GSM radio -- meaning it should work with any GSM-GPRS SIM card, including pre-paid SIM cards as well as those from traditional GSM service providers.

Isn't most of Cingular's network 850mhz? This is why there are many separate "U.S." and "European" versions of GSM phones. T-Mobile (last time I looked at new phones) generally offers the "European" version (900/1800/1900) which even when unlocked aren't as useful on Cingular's network (unless you're on a patch of the old AT&T Wireless network, which was also 1900mhz). But the "American" phones include the 850mhz frequency instead of 900.

What a ripoff

[Nightspirit]

First of all you can get equivalent phones for about $300 with no contract here in the US. Maybe not with opera installed, but tack on an extra $30 and you're still way under.

For that price I would expect it to have 128mb ram, bluetooth (how can it not have bluetooth?!?), miniSD or sd, voiceconnect, speakerphone, and a better screen. And that is what I would expect with a MS phone. One would think a linux phone would be $100 cheaper.

And of course linux fans just *love* d-link

[myxiplx]

Hmm... d-link... would that be the company that recently tried to claim the the GPL was invalid in a german court case? Yeah, can see Linux fans climbing all over each other to buy stuff from this company...

I also recall D-link being in the press recently for configuring their hardware to synchronise to someone's private timeserver, costing the individual running it several thousand in bandwidth fees.

At one point I'd have said D-link were a quality brand. Now I'm not so sure...

Re:And of course linux fans just *love* d-link

[sopuli]

Yes, and let's not forget that in relation to that court case D-link stated:

"Regardless of the repeatedly-quoted judgement of the district court of Munich
  I, we do not consider the GPL as legally binding."

So who is going to buy this phone?

WHAT?!?!?!

[Khyber]

Will it really be this easy to wean myself from the Microsoft mobile teat?

Are you a Microsoft troll or are you fucking stupid, since most phones run a mobile version of Linux or Java to begin with?

Re:WHAT?!?!?!

[dnaumov]

They don't. Not to mention JAVA is not an operating system at all.

Re:WHAT?!?!?!

[Khyber]

Duh. Java's the programming language responsible for shitloads of security breaches on most Windows computers. Still, it doesnt' fucking matter, Phones are programmed using Java, hence THEY FUCKING RUN JAVA.

Microsoft phone?! Never seen one

[Mr Europe]

Will it really be this easy to wean myself from the Microsoft mobile teat?

Microsoft phone is a rarity. It's the Symbian-OS which is the majority.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbian_OS

Microsoft lists ten models with Windows Mobile (in Americas)
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/devices/sma rtphone/americas.mspx

Re:Microsoft phone?! Never seen one

[dunkelfalke]

you forget pocketpc phone edition. they are also phones although in pda format. very very handy.

Re:Microsoft phone?! Never seen one

[jcern]

those are just the smartphones. there are also the pocket pc phones which run windows as well.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/devices/poc ketpc/phone/americas.mspx

Re:Microsoft phone?! Never seen one

[Anonymous Coward]

Symbian OS has majority for smartphones, yes. But for all phones, Nokia Series 40 has much more marketshare.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Series_40

Re:that's a tough question. lets go to the videota

[Rix]

$600 isn't a particularily high price for a cell phone, usually your network provider will provide a subsidy.

Great...

[Anonymous Coward]

So now we have to worry about our cell-phones constantly getting hacked on top of dropped calls?!

Re:Great...

[RPoet]

Excellent point. Not to mention that Linux is so hard to use. Who will want a phone that requires you to type in "ls", "mkfs.ext3", and write SMS messages with "ed" while you're trying to get XFree86 running with the right drivers after upgrading from Slackware 3? This is dead-on-arrival, sorry.

Re:Great...

[shish]

I bet you won't be able to install Quake 3 just by sticking the CD in and clicking "next" a few times either 9_9

Oooooh! Aaaaaah!

[chaparrl]

Ooooh! Aaaaah! I love Linux, but $600 big ones for this? Get real. I read TFA. It's ugly, it's $600, and I'm flacid. And 24mb storage? Maybe as a Cingular give-a-way.

get a Nokia 770 and a cheep cell phone instead

[DumbSwede]

I just got a Nokia 770 with a 4 inch 800x480 screen running Linux WiFi Bluetooth. 64MB internal Mem and upto 1Gig in the postage stamp size SMM (SSM?) memory modules.
$350 direct from Nokia

I love the form factor and with a cheep bluetooth phone then for less than $500 you have all this and more.

Re:get a Nokia 770 and a cheep cell phone instead

[Ddalex]

I bought a 770 about two weeks ago. Worked ok for a week (occasional software crashes on 2005 version), than it died with the "white-screen". I'm struggling with Nokia for a week now to get it serviced. Until then I'll be seriously pissed off, 'cos I enjoyed the lil'sucker.

Re:get a Nokia 770 and a cheep cell phone instead

[DumbSwede]

Had mine just over a week now. It came with 2005 also and I was a little disappointed, but I upgraded it to 2006 and now it seriously rocks. This gives it Google Talk and the ability to load Gizmo which I did. The upgrade is easily done from USB. Try going through the 2006 upgrade, it is likely you do have a hardware problem, but who knows.

Also download the emencoder software to your desktop and start converting videos for 770 use. The 770 doesn't handle many codecs directly with the default player (GPlayer is available), but unless you are viewing a lot of podcasts or YouTube directly I think you will find optomizing your videos on the desktop and then USB downloading them into the 770 a pretty good solution. Emencoder seems to handle everything and crunch it down to rideculously small size files.

Hope you resolve your hardware problems soon (hope I don't run into any), but in general the 770 is a much better solution for the linux gadgeteer than the EXPENSIVE puny cellphone mentioned here.

Re:Umm...Wistron NeWeb?!?

[lazyBob]

Made by Wistron NeWeb? I have one PHS/GSM dual mode phone made by this company (distributed through Taiwan PHS operator). So little features and too many bugs make this phone barely useable. I have no trust on this company since then.

rtfa

[WiFiBro]

These strange abbreviations 'gsm', 'gprs' and 'wifi' actually mean this device can connect in various ways and without cables, yes.

Re:rtfa

[strider44]

Do I have to draw the joke above the head picture for you? Great Grandparent made a joke in reference to the slashdot announcement on the iPod - "Less space than a Nomad, no wireless. Lame." Not very funny or applicable in this situation but hey, he probably liked it. I was making fun of him saying that a mobile phone had no wireless. Now I've wasted about a minute of my life explaining that - I feel silly.

Profoundly lame specs

[nikanj]

Let's compare this device to the N95, which is also coming to market soon.
D-Link | Nokia
2-inch, 176 x 220 | 2.6 inch, 320 x 240
No camera | 5 mpixel camera (although this seems to be a negative side for slashdot readers)
GSM | UMTS (Means actually usable speeds for data connections)
24 MB | 160 MB embedded (both extendable)

In addition, the Nokia device has bluetooth, GPS(!), a real connector for headphones, tv-out etc. Prepare to salivate, if you are willing to buy crappy D-Link hardware (do you really consider D-Link to be a premium supplier of hw?) just because it runs Linux.

The lack of the 850MHz band

[UberChuckie]

Not having the 850MHz band is a problem for North America. In the cities you might be fine with 1900MHz, but going in the subsurbs or the country side is going to be a problem.

Re:The lack of the 850MHz band

[astrokid]

Comments about the lack of 850MHz affecting North America are a little sensationalistic. I think T-Mobile is doing just fine without it.

I believe Cingular is really the only carrier that relies on the 850 range. (although... I am unsure if T-Mobile has roaming agreements with Cingular)

850 Mhz band

[brunes69]

Tri-band (900/1800/1900) GSM radio -- meaning it should work with any GSM-GPRS SIM card, including pre-paid SIM cards as well as those from traditional GSM service providers

Without the 850 band this phone will have poor to no reception in lots of parts of North America.

Let me ask...

[Godji]

How is this superior to the Qtopia Greenphone?

Re:Let me ask...

[Virtuall]

Greenphone isn't a consumer phone, released in limited quantities and costs $700 ;)

Re:Let me ask...

[UngodAus]

Actually, if this is based on the GW1, it will be a QTopia phone anyway.

Re:Let me ask...

[UngodAus]

I just got confirmation, this is a Qtopia phone, so, altho it will likely be nowhere near as open as the greenphone, you should be able to dev something for the greenphone and have it work out of the box for this phone.

Mobile Thin Clients

[Doc Ruby]

If architecture geniuses can work out virtualization so that an app can span two networked CPU nodes (across a very latent network), so eg. the GUI layer objects can run on this phone and the rest of the app can run on hosts across the LAN (or Net), these phones could become the front end to a fantastic network app collection.

As it is, Web apps and VNC bring us to virtual virtualization. If we can tune the Linux for just GUI and networking, so the GUI is really interactive, we're virtually there.

Re:Mobile Thin Clients

[Psiren]

I don't see the problem as lack of CPU power. It's the HCI that's the problem. Unless you have something at least the size of a PDA, it's difficult to do anything serious on it because of the small screen and awkward input, so it doesn't matter that the CPU power isn't there. I suspect that smartphones will die out. Those that really need them will just end up using PDA's with phone capabilities, or just use VOIP.

Re:Mobile Thin Clients

[Doc Ruby]

What's the difference between a smartphone and a PDA with phone capabilities? And how does VoIP exclude any of those, when the voice is just a feature of the UI of the apps accessed by the "phone"?

Re:Mobile Thin Clients

[Psiren]

Like I said, HCI is the problem. The difference is a PDA sized device is more or less usable for interactive programs, whereas most smartphones I've seen so far are still phone sized devices. The screen is tiny and the keypad is useless for any significant amount of text input. Couple a wireless headset with a PDA with phone capablities and you have your smart phone, but at a useful PDA size.

Re:Mobile Thin Clients

[Doc Ruby]

I'm still not getting you. My Palm Treo 650 is the same form factor size as my nonphone PDAs. So are the Windows versions. Smartphones are basically PDAs with "voice networking".

GSM again?!

[Virtuall]

Am I wrong or there isn't a single Linux UMTS device in the world? Why?

Re:GSM again?!

[speculatrix]

not out of the box.. but you can put a 3G data card into a laptop, or the latest Flybook has a 3G modem built in.

Why not..

[Anonymous Coward]

Just make your own cell phone?

Does it run L....

[Awod]

oh wait... nevermind....

Re:Does it run L....

[UngodAus]

Must be a Sla... oh wait... nevermind... :)

Make it a SIP phone!

[extremescholar]

How about a shot at interfacing a SIP client into the phone. Then when you went to 802.11 you could have a wireless phone ala Cisco 7920. Yum.

Re:Make it a SIP phone!

[UngodAus]

Qtopia comes with a sip client out of the box, so yes, this is doable.

Motorola A910

[Anonymous Coward]

The price (if it ever ships) on that phone is $500. And it was promised in 2005/Q1 2006.

I'll believe it when I see it.

Also, a contradiction in the article

[Anonymous Coward]

Judging by the fact they said it'd be unavailable through conventional means and will only be sold through plans and cell phone dealers, it'll more than likely be locked, maybe, like all phones, it will be unlocked, nokia's phones are unlocked, but when they get in the hands of cell phone companies, they're locked unless you can figure out the code and put it in right without permanently disabling your cell phone

If they did offer it unlocked through conventional means... well watch how fast SIM cards would be outfitted with a really restrictive DRM.

The question is, where can we find this phone for sale unlocked?

GSM Bands

[Tintivilus]

800MHz support would help in the US

GSM in the US is 1900Mhz and 850Mhz. T-Mobile uses the former exclusively, Cingular uses both.

900/1800/1900?

[malachid69]

Yeah, good luck with that. I got my 900/1800/1900 tri-band phone yesterday, only to be told by Cingular that they ONLY support 850 MHz in the entire state of Oregon - and that is always roaming and/or finding no service.

Rest Assured - It Will Suck

[ickoonite]

I've had the misfortune to use two of D-Link's products in my lifetime, and if at all possible, I'd like to avoid ever having to repeat the experience again. First was a USB wireless adapter (I think it was the DWL-122) which claimed Mac OS X compatibility, but delivered an inability to put the machine to sleep and kernel panics instead. Fora suggest that I was not alone. Needless to say I returned it for a refund.

The other is the ongoing saga of a DSL-G604T ADSL router that a friend uses. It is Linux-based, but it sucks beyond belief. From a truly dire web interface for configuration to regular connection drop-outs, it is the worst router I have ever had the misfortune to encounter. If this is how D-Link do Linux, I am petrified to think of what they might try to pull off with this mobile. It's clear already from the specifications (no Bluetooth, a mere 24MB of storage, etc.) that it is not exactly a top-end device. I fear the worst.

iqu :|

Wait a minute

[Anonymous Coward]

I thought Linux and open source was supposed to makes things better and cheaper. This is neither. I would rather have a Treo700/750 for the same price as this thing, less if I sign a contract. I am so glad open source has saved me from getting more capability for less money and sooner by delivering a product like this. Usually I only get less capability than other commercial offerings (but it is free, so it can be justified sometimes), but this product does not have the price savings on its side. For this I think it will flop, unless they cut the price to $200. D-Link is not a company that can charge a premium for its products, that is Cisco's job.

Not really good comparison

[Kadin2048]

The SK3 doesn't have WiFi, it's basically nothing but a regular phone with a QWERTY keyboard and email/IM software. Not a particularly fair comparison. A better one would be something like the Nokia N80, which has WiFi and retails for around $520, MSRP $900. (source)

But even just looking at the Sidekick, it'll run you $400+ if you can find an unlocked one from a legitimate retailer.

The phone is expensive, sure, but if you want the features it offers, it's basically on par with other similar devices. The question is how many people are that interested in having Wifi that they're willing to cough up 500+ bucks?

New Cell Phone Communications Paradigm?

[Hyperi0n.v2]

It is time the Open Source community created portable software for cell phones that allowed an informal zeroconf network to form when any capable phone was in contact with each other. Using p2p technology like BitTorrent, and from stuff like Tor, this ad-hoc network could blanket a large area REGARDLESS of service from cell phone towers, and route messages and data to and from users of the system, and over the internet. For example... Out of a group of a dozen cell phones, two have a WIFI connection at hotspots, 4 are in communications range of the two with wifi, and the other 6 are in range with the previous 4. Like the cross-continental BBS messaging system of 'yore... and the Torrent systems of today, the network information would route itself in a decentralized manner over whatever available means existed. Without having to pay a monthly service... just having this software... you could get: VOIP over internet at WIFI, or if latency is low enough. VOIP and Video Conferecing over the network... similiar to Skype. Texts/IM/email/ringtones/games/etc via WiFi or routed decentralized over network. If this software was completely open, and it was adopted by major manufactures (who didn't have an interest in the current service modal), critical mass could be reached and we could have a FREE AS IN BEER communication system. As storage space becomes more prevalent on these cell phones... software like asterisk can be used to increase features... voicemail 'in' your cell phone, etc not from a big service company. The technology, while young, exists that we can have a FREE COMMUNICATIONS system without the need of traditional cellular infrastructure. How liberating would this be for humanity?

No beer?

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux phones: "Free" as in... $600.

There will NEVER be a CDMA version for the USA

[Anonymous Coward]

Have a GSM version all you want, but without a CDMA version, you've locked your self out of 90% of the US market from the start

By "CDMA" I assume you mean IS-95 (the most recent version of GSM, UMTS, uses a CDMA air interface.) In the US, the two standards are currently neck and neck. Cingular, the US's largest operator, uses GSM. T-Mobile and a number of regional operators also use GSM. GSM is available in the vast majority of locations in the US where cellular service of any type is available.

There will *NEVER* be any CDMA version of a Linux-based smartphone sold by any of the USA cdma wireless phone companies. Virtually all of the US cdma carriers will refuse to allow the ESN of any non-branded phone onto their networks anymore and furthermore, they only want phones that they can artificially cripple and lock all the features out of them to prevent the end-user from having any features that do not provide an auxilary revenue strem for the wireless carrier... e.g. cannot have any ringtones or wallpapers on your phone unless you BUY them from the carrier... putting your own custom ones on that you make yourself on your PC and transferring them to your phone is strictly forbidden anymore. Sure there are still a very few CDMA phones around that you can do that with, or that you can hack to re-enable the ability to do so, but these are getting fewer and farther between. A Linux-powered CDMA smartphone would put far too much power back into the hands of the customer, and that is EXACTLY what the cdma wireless carriers DO NOT WANT!!!!! And they'll go to great lengths to prevent you from having what YOU want on your CDMA phone. They basically all want to limit your choices to what color of RAZR do you want.

Oki 900

[dave562]

I want my Oki 900 back! Until then, I guess I'll make due with my Samsung i730. It only locks up once every couple of weeks and wirelessly syncs with the Exchange server back the office so I can keep up to date without having to get to a web browser. The fact that it also works as a modem is pretty convenient too for those random occurances when I'm at a client who doesn't have an internet connection.

No keyboard?!

[bradgoodman]

What, no keyboard? Do they even understand the people this is trying to appeal to?

rebadged WNC

[ilsie]

I have not seen any mention of the fact that this is a rebadged WNC GW1 and that you can already import it as the Qtopia twin for around $250 unlocked.

Where's the imcosys linux phone?

[tinpan]

What about http://www.imcosys.com/? This phone looks like a good buy for 350 euros and was supposed to be out earlier this year. Anyone know what's up with it?

Motorola A780 came in late 2004

[lalleglad]

And it has a Linux 2.4.20 kernel on it, or at least the one I have has.

A Motorola page about it, which may not even be the most complete or detailed page:

http://direct.motorola.com/ENG/Web_full_specs.asp? Country=GBR&language=ENG&productid=29784&strPrimar yOption=FS&lSecondaryOption=-1

One that isn't true anymore on that page is that the flashcard maxes out at 512MB, because I have a 1GB micro-SD card and it works fine (it is sort of slow to index it when filled up, but it works).

And in 2005 it even got the Silver Medal for Products of the Year 2005, PDAs and smartphones:

http://searchmobilecomputing.techtarget.com/produc tsOfTheYearCategory/0,294802,sid40_tax302454_ayr20 05,00.html

I am very happy with it because it is so full of functionality, but I only wish that Motorola would continue developing and fixing the software, because it has some annoying things to it when using it a lot, eg. the calendar and phonebook should be more flexible in configuartion, and they should equip it with more RAM so it could run the USB connection and/or GPS functions at the same time as other applications.

All in all it is a great piece, but I only wish Motorola would finish it, as it so far SW wise only seems 95% complete. It is the only mobile phone with Bluetooth that I know of, that will connect to any other mobile I have tested it against, whereas other Motorola/Nokia/SonyEricsson seems to get into trouble some time or another.

The only thing it misses to be real modern even today (except for a little more RAM) is A2DP (Hi-Fi Stereo Bluetooth), and if that could be put into it, it would really kick ass, and I wouldn't be so worried about missing WiFi, or about Nokias N95 with its 5mpix autofocus camera (A780 only has 1.3mpix fixed focus), because the A780 has a real PC/PDA feel to it whereas N95 with its Symbion60 probably is more like a regular mobile. And then I would choose the A780's Linux/Qt UI anyday!

24 megs??

[Anonymous Coward]

come on.. you could barely fit 8 songs on their if your lucky

Comparison to Trolltech's Qtopia Greenphone?

[yetimon]

Is anyone familiar with the Qtopia Greenphone? I wonder how this compares spec and feature-wise?

Re:Comparison to Trolltech's Qtopia Greenphone?

[UngodAus]

It's definately not a greenphone, but it's definately Qtopia. Here's the greenphone specs to compare with http://www.yuhuatel.com/english/omega.php (ignore the 512/512 they say, it's 64M mem, 128M flash).

D-Link phone / router

[Eun-HjZjiNeD]

Now all i have to do is wait for the cell/router. If it needs help it will call me, i can call back to reset it, and be one my way again.

Ah, the life of a network tech might just get easier.

Re:One would think a linux phone would be cheaper

[chickenandporn]

Linux is not as easy as you think -- sure, there's the initial kernel and such done for you, but few F/L/OSS projects/groups recognize the existence of others. Interoperability is a lottery ticket lost in the back of your sofa. The "plays well with other children" checkbox is resolved at great expense by integrators such as Samsung and Motorola. The smallest malfunction risks a dreaded handset return -- or we the community sue them for the smallest error.

Consumers just want something that works, uncaring what's under-the-hood. As an engineer and architect, I want components that play well together, and will over the next five years of continued integration and development. As a geek, FOSS is cool, and maybe I'll get the podcast-receiver built for my A1200-over-PAN/BT.