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Why Apple Failed in the 90s
An anonymous reader writes "With news of amazing sales figures for both Mac hardware and the iPod, the future for Apple looks bright. But it wasn't always that way. The 90s were a bad time for the company, and Roughlydrafted.com has a look at Apple's failures of the previous decade." From the article: "During the development of Mac OS X, Apple polished the existing classic Mac OS, and salvaged what it could of Copland developments. Apple modernized its existing Mac APIs into Carbon, which would run software in Mac OS 9, and later allow it to run natively in Mac OS X. Despite fixing the obvious flaws in Apple's operating system offering, Mac OS X did not in itself solve Apple's problem. The company now only had an improved platform that nobody had any reason to buy. The real solution to Apple's problem was stumbled onto by a fortunate accident. "
Any bets on what the fortunate accident was?
http://michaelsmith.id.au
Why Apple Failed in the 90s
Because they had no clear corporate direction and their price/performance sucked an ass?
(just a guess)
Push Button, Receive Bacon
The comuting landscame might well have been different in Apple had made better decisions in the past, but that's life and mistakes are made
As I type this on my MacBook Pro though I can say for sure that Apple isn't going anywhere soon (I say that becasue this is the first Mac I've owned that has given me no reason to move back to Windows
With OS X and hardware which is merely moderately expensive, they might stand a better chance, but it's hard to see how they'll ever really compete with MS Windows. I guess from Apple's perspective, even if their share rises from 2% to 4%, that is still a 100% increase for them even if it's still insignificant to to a market from a whole.
reticent to license OS X to other PC vendors or sell it to run on beige boxes now that it is Intel. They tried something along those lines with the clones, and as the article states it was a complete disaster. Ultimately besides a few loud people, most of the people who would buy OS X for generic PCs are the ones who would buy a mac anyhow, so Apple loses profit while barely increasing market share. Not a good tradeoff from the corporate perspective I would think.
Monstar L
Me too!
The wikipedia page is more informative than this article...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Computer
Which after reading it, provides better insight than the article....
Non sequitur: Your facts are uncoordinated.
"The company now only had an improved platform that nobody had any reason to buy. The real solution to Apple's problem was stumbled onto by a fortunate accident." ... and this is where it ends, to be complete later. What a waste of time.
No Steve Jobs.
Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
The performa line from the mid 90s was probably their worste move. I know a number of mac fans that went out and purchased one of these machines not knowing how gimped they really were. Tons of the "good" mac software couldn't run on those machines as they had much lower quality components. The bigest problem was that they had no math co-processor.
Virtually none of the documentation for these systems mentioned that they were less than a real mac, so most of the people that purchased them just ended up thinking that the whole platform was a joke.
This is when I went from a strictly mac guy to a *nix fan, eventually being forced to move to the PC. I must say OSX has got me saving my pennies to get back into the mac world.
I personally loved the Mac's back in the 90's. I built a very successful commercial retouching business where our primary software/hardware was Photoshop on OS9 Mac's. OS9 performed well as you could lock down memory and dedicate it to Photoshop (no OS swapping). This is something that is sorely missing from OS/X and Windows.
Yes, there were/are WIN32 calls to ask Windows to not swap, however, there is really no guarantee. (Maybe there is now?) Photoshop has a more efficient swapping mechanism based on image tiles rather than the OS with small pages.
For the general business or home computer user, I agree, the 90's Dell's years. Apple fell short of expectations.
I think Apple's success with the iPod and iTunes really boosted their overall marketing effort. Had it not been for those products, we probably would not be having this discussion.
-G
hard to see how they'll ever really compete with MS Windows. I guess from Apple's perspective, even if their share rises from 2% to 4%,
One CEO once said "US Steel is not in the business of making steel. We're in the business of making profits."
Mac's market share is not the most important number. Mac's profitability is much more important.
GM's got huge market share but is losing money. You don't see people saying "BMW will never really compete with GM."
Just because MS' self-imposed measure of success is dominating every market with 90% share doesn't mean that this is the only metric of success.
Penny - plain text accounting
The article does not in fact give the answer! Presumably it will be unveiled in the sequel ("Coming up next...") advertised at the end of the page.
They mention the analysts were wrong that Apple needed more Apple market not more PC market, and that some execution (Performa) was done badly. That at least is true, and why Mom had to use a PC for a while until she got back to Macs.
Of course I was a Mac person in the 90s even though Apple had screwed me a number of times. Now Macs are better but PCs (with XP) are better too. If they can come out with Leopard this year instead of next year they will do much better at Christmastime I bet.
I didn't even bother reading TFA, as that website hardly comes close to displaying correctly in firefox. Out of curiosity, am I alone here?
Ok, I have to say this and I don't care how I get modded. Sometimes you just need to say what's obvious to you.
I've been reading Slashdot for years and years. No one really talks about it but this site has an obvious agenda which is anti-Micro$oft. Do I care? No. Is it a big deal? No. I'll continue to read this site like I have for years because they cover great things in the technology industry but don't even tell me that this isn't true. It's so blatant to me.
"Why Apple Failed in the 90s"
"Microsoft's new beta software reviewed as 'terrible'"
"The Ugandan government is adopting Linunx"
Let the flaming begin!
when it was clear Apple was going to take forever to deliver a next-generation OS.
Copland gave me hope, but then they scrapped it. At that point I was a little disappointed, but was in no big hurry to switch.
By the time Rhapsody was in the works, it was really time that Apple got a new OS. The poor multitaking and bad memory management were a pain to deal with, and I was exited that maybe there was hope. I installed a beta version of it and was quite impressed (even though there weren't many apps available).
But then (in 1998) it, too was scraped (or transformed into OS X), and it was clear it was going to be quite a while before X came out. At that point I jumped ship over to Slackware Linux, which fulfilled pretty much all of my expectations.
I patiently waited until recently, when I picked up a MBP and am again enjoying the Apple experience.
Oh no! I'm shocked! Nobody every mentioned that ever in all the years Slashdot exists in any article.
Do the admins know? Somebody should tell them!
At the beginning of the 1990s, there was an Apple Computer. At the end of the 1990s, there was still an Apple Computer. Count it as a success, considering all the companies that did not make it.
Where were you when the voynix came?
Something to mention about why the clones failed--Apple paid for all of the R&D costs while the clone-makers were the ones benefitting. In the x86/Windows world, R&D costs are generally spread out amongst the chip and board manufacturers. With Apple in the mid-90s, almost all of the R&D costs were squarely shouldered by Apple. The clones all used the reference board designs, even down to the add-in HPV video cards used in the 1st gen PPC machines. Now that they've moved to the x86 architecture, a lot of the costs are spread back out to other manufacturers. This time around, cloning might be possible, although they'd lose a bit of money from their very respectable hardware margins.
This guy's the limit!
/. has always been a Linux site, and fairly openly. The Linux crowd partially moved over to OSX and so the site became more supportive. What exactly is the great insight here.
Coming up next: why journalists failed in the 90s!
Or perhaps a journalists job is to report on what's happened, not stuff that hasn't happened.
The revolution will not be televised... but it will have a page on Wikipedia
No... that's why they had to get him back
The revolution will not be televised... but it will have a page on Wikipedia
>After Columbus discovered America, everyone and his dog can give 1001
> reasons why columbus has succeeded. Where were these expects before then?
Actually he failed.
His goal was to reach India (to establish trade os spices/etc through sea).
He end up in Caribbean islands with no spices to trade (he found some gold there
tho it was not much).
King John II of Portugal refused to sponsor him based in the advise from a council of astronomers and seamen (they said Colombo's calculations of longitude were wrong).
So I guess the experts were in King's John II court.
There's no great insight just an observation. I just don't understand why the site has to be so cheerleader'isk. Why can't they report the facts without the jabs?
There have been many companies that have failed during the 90-ties... the greatest loss propably beeing Digital.
Apple did survive and they are now in a better position than they've been in the last 10 years... and it really doesn't matter if it is caused by a mp3 player or by the move to Unix.
--
Tru64, propably the best UNIX in the world... too bad some jerks killed it.
The 90s and early 00s were a time of commodity hardware. In these new days of proprietary form factors and integrated sound/video/everything people have resigned themselves to the fact that they will not be upgrading specific hardware components during the life of their machine and are getting a Mac.
yes, but that's easily fixed with a few changes to the wikipedia page!
They accidentally spilled blue paint on the iMac prototype... the rest is history.
Because it is not really a technology news site, it started as a blog (before the word was coined), and developed into a community site. There are plenty of technology news sites that pretend to be objective. They are boring. Why should /. immitate them, when it has been pretty successful doing what it does?
It wasn't just Apple. Nearly all of the integrated PC manufacturers, meaning those who developed integrated systems, from the hardware (in some cases including the CPU) through to the OS, either collapsed or nearly collapsed in the 90s. The reasons, of course, were first that Intel continued to increase the price/performance of its x86 architecture, leaving most RISC systems offering either worse performance, or only marginally better performance (at much higher prices), and second that Microsoft continued to improve Windows 3.x, in particular taking advantage of the revolutionary (for x86) improvements provided by the i386. Microsoft also released Windows NT, an OS architecturally comparable to Unix, but with a much lower price (than commercial Unix systems).
One notable exception to the shakeout of the early 90s was Sun Microsystems, largely because of its OS, but when Linux eventually caught on, Sun started to implode too.
On the whole, I think Apple supporters are far too harsh in their criticism of Sculley. In most ways, the original Mac was no match for its competitors, not only the Intel/Microsoft PC, but also other 68k-based competitors like the Amiga. The first Mac that really did outshine the competition was the Mac II in 1987. It was expensive, but unlike the original Mac, it offered state-of-the-art hardware. The core OS was still rather poor, but the GUI was amongst the better ones in the market.
Sculley's big mistake was joining forces with IBM and Motorola in the PowerPC debacle, but almost everyone at the time (apart from Intel) thought Risc was the future, and that the x86 would die, so it's hard to criticise him for that. If Apple had gone with x86, it could have continued to offer premium PCs (much as it did in the late 80s, and dies today), and channelled all of the money wasted on the PowerPC into developing a modern OS, as Microsoft had done with NT.
Apple's real problems came under Spindler, who tried to turn Apple into a producer of low-cost, high-volume systems (something Steve Jobs supposedly wanted to do with the original Mac as well), which is a business model that can't sustain the high R&D costs associated with developing a custom OS (and hardware, although Apple has gradually moved out of that market in most respects). All that happened was that Apple was reduced to offering inferior hardware at higher prices than competitors. With the switch to x86, Apple has finally caught up with Intel PCs (Macs are basically Intel PCs with stylish enclosures and a trendy OS), but is unlikely to ever be able to offer superior hardware again, as it did in the late 80s. That's simply the reality of a market where specialisation has made it impracticable to build integrated systems.
"They couldn't run DOS or Windows, which was the definition of PC ever since IBM applied the letters to its first home computer."
This is where I stopped reading, and knew that the author was talking out of his ass. There was never a hard and fast (and agreed upon) definition of a PC, with the sole exception of what that first letter means: Personal.
The notion that a PC wasn't a PC unless it ran MS-DOS is ludicrous to say the least. PC was an attempt at a brand name rather than a generic description, but that isn't how it actually worked. The term PC instantly came to describe a class of computer that could be purchased by individual consumers. I had personal computers from Radio Shack (CoCo 2 and 3) which didn't run MS-DOS long before I had a personal computer from an IBM compatible reseller.
Several years ago, I booted up my old CoCo 3 and found that the BASIC ROM had a Microsoft copyright. So it's easy to argue that RS-DOS (Radio Shack DOS) was really MS-DOS in disguise. The RS-DOS BASIC syntax was remarkably similar to GW-BASIC. But I hardly ever ran from RS-DOS after getting Microware's OS/9. If you want to see just how pathetic MSDOS+IBM were for the time, fire up an IBM clone running MS-DOS and the CoCo 3 running OS/9 Level 2. The latter cleanly blow the doors (and Windows) off the former.
It's always been much harder to be your own local apple store as opposed to being a local whitebox PC store. Apple had some rather hefty fees associated with retailing new products and aftermarket was dismal as well. For a long time they didn't even offer one penny discount to retailers, nada, although requiring a 50 grand bond/weird sales license deal IIRC and imposing severe restrictions on the sales, etc. The scrambling local vendor who jumped through that expensive hoops then got the privelege of paying full retail for his units and add ons (few anyway) from Apple, then had to try and make it with Apple inc undercutting their price via their online or at the end of the telephone store! Yes, it could and has beeen done to be a local neighborhood mac store, but it was and is still very difficult and expensive and mostly doesn't exist. They failed to take advantage of the local neighborhhod aspect.
It's hard to buy an apple when you can't even see one any place for sale near you. This is 2006, I can go to various cities near me that have computer stores large and small, from big department stores that offer computers *blahmart, etc, and then like office depot, etc, to the smallest whitebox shop, maybe going on two dozen stores now locally to me in three different cities in a 20 mile diameter, and not a single mac for sale. It's unobtainium, and people aren't going to go out of their way to try and track it down and drop serious cash when they have right at their fingertips a huge variety of shapes sizes colors and functions and prices of computers they can just grab and go home. I can go out right now and get a used "$99 full bundle-internet ready!" package locally to me (which isn't all that bad a deal either usually there is so much good enough used stuff on the market), all the way to some high end stuff or custom built to order-but no macs, none.
Price / perfomance / quality ratio was never an issue.
Corporate direction? Ok, ill buy that.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
When you watch Star Trek, you root for the Borg, don't you? Admit it, you admire their efficiency and lack of self-importance.
Since you made some generalizations about me as a Mac owner, I'll make some about you: You think that public art is a "waste of money" and you usually "don't get it". You can't imagine why someone would spend extra money for a prettier car. There should only be two types of cars on the market: Dodge Caravans (for folks with kids) and Honda Civics. You don't understand fashion and wouldn't ever just buy a shirt that you saw because you liked it - you would only buy it if you had some pre-existing need for a shirt. You hate people in business suits, but you also hate people who dress "differently" from societal norms: punks, goths, artists, etc.
That's fine - diversity is what makes humanity so interesting. Some of us like to enjoy our pointless existence for the short time that we're here, and others of us are border-line autistic.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
It's easier to maintain system stability when you write all the drivers.
It's easier to write drivers when you limit the hardware support. Unfortunately, the other side of that scale is market potential...
GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
I think we should call the process of changing reality this way "wikiality." ...what do you mean Stephan Colbert already coined that term?
GLaDOS for President 2016! "Well here we are again. It's always such a pleasure." -- GLaDOS, 2011
Slashdot apple summary:
If not for their hardware Apple would have failed in the past, is failing now and will be failing in the future. Their products were almost killed, are being killed and certainly will be killed unless they stop making hardware now and WHAT IF NONE CARED???
I've been a loyal Mac owner since 1989, and I heartily agree that public art is a waste of money.
-ccm
Too much Law; not enough Order.
This, from a novel written in the late Nineties - about the real reason Apple and the Mac exists.
MARY R147
GO HERE if that link is overwhelmed
People do not expect this kind of thing, but it very well may be true on a completely different level, which exists beyond the thinking of most everyone else.
Is there any validity to this? If it is true, it changes everything, because it means that the current success of the Mac, iPod and OS X comes from a very unexpected place. You would almost have to watch HEROES to get a clue about where it comes from.
I know you may think this borders lunatic fringe territory, but you owe it to yourself to at least consider it.
~ 'Ro'ger 'Bor'n '' '''' '
"Glad to have gotten this off my chest. Your mileage may vary."
From the article;
...anyone have a copy/summary?
"Service Temporarily Unavailable
The server is temporarily unable to service your request due to maintenance downtime or capacity problems. Please try again later.
Apache/1.3.33 Server at www.roughlydrafted.com Port 80"
If you need to ask why, then you obviously haven't been paying attention to what you've been reading here and everywhere else.
But is has less awful photoshops. I particularly disliked the ones with Apple execs as ugly snowmen, although the ubiquitous flame effect made every single one about as pleasant as a self-inflicted shotgun blast to the crotch.
Amazingly, TFA manages to be even more unprofessional than a Slashdot discussion about Microsoft.
USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
People who hate Microsoft founded the site, and still control it.
I would say that a very high percentage of people who love computers, as opposed to simply making a living off them, hate Microsoft.
For many of us, Microsoft's invasion of pretty much everything we held dear made computing a gray, unlovable world whose primary feature was continuous crashes.
Windows 2000 came close to fixing the crashes, and Windows XP was less gray and grim than previous versions. Just as Microsoft started to look almost tolerable, an explosion of malware came, creating waves of horrible problems that required you to become a security expert just to run a PC.
At the same time, open source software, whether free as in liberty or beer, gave us new hope for an alternative that wasn't priced out of the market by the soulless commodity PC. It co-opted the commodity pricing but added an interface we're familiar with and like.
At the same time, it was still a commodity PC, a product that was slapped together by the cheaper-is-better brigade. It's great to save money, not so great to be saddled with hardware that scrapes our knuckles every time we added RAM.
So Apple came on the scene. Want a system that works at base like Linux, but has style and flair and beautiful fonts? Want something more modern than that awful X-Windows, that wasn't even that great when it was founded 30 years ago? Want some cool ways to get reative with photos, music and video?
Well, then, Apple's stuff was made for you.
Apple has created an interesting split among us. Those of us who like using our computers instead of tinkering with them, and who have some disposable income, love Apple. Those who think the principle of open source is better than having things work out of the box, or who don't have the extra bucks, love Linux. Sometimes we'll have fights, sometimes bitter ones, but in the end we're really cut out of the same cloth.
(Have you ever noticed the bitterest fights often come from people who are almost the same? But that's a question for another day.)
I hope that has explained something of the reason for Microsoft hatred, and why Slashdot covers the stories it does, the way it does.
D
Okay. Same story, my vision:
... and ends up with an underpowered (for what only its OS was needing) machine, but a Real Nice one, for "only" $5000 (or was it $7000? With its printer, maybe. Can't remember off the top of my head.) It was a cube running a really nice Unix...
... we all know the rest : iMacs, iPod+iTunes, and now i686mac.
At some point in the eighties, Steve Jobs told the rest of Apple "Okay, so we're gonna build really nice computers, shaped as cubes, running a *BSD, and charge a metric assload of $ for them."
Anwser : "You're fired."
Steve goes a little away and sets up a company to do just that...
He never could sell enough of them to turn any sort of profit whatsoever, even when he finally equipped them with enough RAM to do something useful, though. He tried to make a pizza-box version, too, which was better (and nicer looking IMO).
While that company was going from Good Idea to Bankruptcy(sp?), Apple was following, what with that crazy idea for a hardware vendor to let other make *cheaper* clones... the idea not to cut their prices as a logical consequence was not a good one either...
Then with NeXt almost dead and Apple not far away from their Final Doom either, they call Steve back to save them. Then he says "And NOW we're gonna do what I'm saying and get it RIGHT this time", and goes on "and we're gonna make those cubes running BSD, and..."
Making laws based on opinions that stem up from false informations leads to witch hunts.
Does TFA use the word 'beleaguered'? (/.'ed already, so can't check) No Apple-is/was-in-trouble article can be taken seriously without it.
Im in agreement here. But really, Im just having issues with this RoughlyDrafted kid getting linked to two-three times a week. It seems to me like an attempt to maneuver eyeballs for click-throughs...
Cynical? Well sure, but my real point is that the information this person has used in their several articles:
In sum, these articles are more screeds than accurate research.
Disclaimer: I am a Macintosh user of 15 years standing. Having "lived" a lot of the history reported on that blog, I feel qualified to speak on this...As someone who has been an Apple developer since 1989, the assertions made in this article are ludicrous at best. They show signs of someone that has perhaps read about the company's history, but not been involved with them in any significant way (nor was it researched with any depth).
That this meaningless trash makes it onto Slashdot and Digg simply amazes me.
...Jobs wasn't there. next question?
i speak for myself and those who like what i say.
I could try to follow your way of thinking now ... but I fear my brain could explode.
If my computer help days are any indication, J Random User expects YOU to tell him about Macs, no matter how unsatisfied he is, he will NOT try to learn about the alternatives. He will just bitch and moan about how expensive it gets to maintain this computer, while trying not to spend a cent more than he has to, and hoping he could just junk it. When non-techies have a bad experience buying technology, they don't assign blame to themselves(for making the wrong choice) or to the maker of the technology(since for them it's all the same). They blame technology in general. As a better educated user, you can(if you are so inclined) let them know the experience can vary with the provider, and not despair. You can also share stories, either of what worked for you, or what didn't. Some of it may even be good business for you(they might pay you to install them a Mac). Then again, Macs tend to be lower-support than PCs, especially on AppleCare YMMV.
I sort of speak from a mid-90s perspective here, when I was using SGI computers because I just couldn't take how ugly X-Windows on Linux looked. SGI's sense of aesthetics was class-leading until Steve Jobs unveiled MacOS X. No matter what else you may say about Steve, his mastery of computing aesthetics has been absolutely unsurpassed in our largely beauty-deprived industry.
The mid-90s were where I founded a lot of my deepest views about computing, and this is an intersting problem for Microsoft. I would never buy an American car beause I hate the way US automakers made inferior junk in the 70s, and don't trust them. I can say the same thing about Microsoft; however much their OS may have improved, I still remember how horrible it was back then, and fear that if I use it it will once again leave me bitterly disappointed as it has in the past. (Even the machine I use to test my work on Windows makes me think this is still all too true).
I have a comparable problem with Linux; I love my MacOS X products, they serve me exceptionally well, so there is little point in trying something new, especially if it's still at least somewhat inferior. (Having to apt-get display drivers is a bit of a clue that this is still the case.)
In the 90s, where SGI was too expensive, Windows too crashy and Linux too raw, I was ready for something new. That opening seems to have pretty much closed for me today since I'm so happy with where I am, and - amazingly enough! - my chosen side has even been gaining considerable market momentum..
D
Of course your point is proved. Slashdot has always been "Linux Rules!"
If you think that promoting a deserved underdog operating system and highlighting the glaring flaws of Windows counts as "negativity" then our definitions of that word differ.
You bring up the issue of retailing which I am surprised that no one else has touched on yet. I think one thing that has been huge for Apple has been the Apple retail stores. People buy iPods for various reasons and then when they go to the mall or when their spouses drag them to the mall they see hey it's an Apple store let's go in. They encounter a different shopping experience than what you get at Best Buy, Fry's, Circuit Sh*tty, etc. It kind of drives home the BMW kind of cache to the products. I have more detailed thoughts about why Apple failed in the 90s and turned things around in the past 5 years but I'll post that on a seperate thread.
Windows sucked just as much at the time. It was just the marketing and the fact that it was overpriced. To be so much more expnsive, they really needed to offer something more. And they didn't at the time.
Maybe it isn't that he has no soul; maybe he just thinks it is more important to solve little problems like people starving in the streets and not being able to buy their medications before resources are expended on statues of politicians, "Piss Christ", and other random works of publicly supported art. I guess I can't really speak for him, but that is certainly how I feel. Every time I see public art, Christmas decorations, government-participation in parades, I grinch about it. I just can't see the government holding any legitimate position costing even one dollar in any non-critical activity, no matter if it is supposedly for the benefit of the citizens or not, until it has well and truly addressed all of the critical activities that it has been tasked with with regard to its base responsibilities.
I bought my first Mac (a PPC Mini) because a knowledgeable friend took the time to show me that her Mac worked better (a lot better!) than the two OS's I was running at the time: Windows XP and Red Hat linux. I was losing time screwing with things I didn't really have time to screw with just trying to get mundane business tasks accomplished. I'm buying my second Mac (an Intel MacBook) this week to replace my Windows laptop, which finally went nipples north. One reason I'm buying it is because the Mini lived up to the manufacturer's claims both in reliability and in functionality. I am looking forward to the MacBook and I expect to have a similar experience, despite being a pretty cynical person when you get right down to it.
Certainly it has nothing to do with "art." Do I appreciate how pretty the Mac interface is? Sure. But that wasn't a factor in going Mac. I was won over by the smooth integration of multiple languages in applications like OmniOutliner and 100% support for that by the OS; by the complete lack of need to mess with low level Unix issues; by the speed and fluidity and consistency of the interface; by the continual experience of having things "just work" (it may sound hackneyed and fanboyish, but that is the nature of the experience — OSX is as far from running windows as flying a plane on autopilot compares to hand-flying it.) It beats Windows in resistance to malware by orders of magnitude, and it beats Linux by never requiring me to screw with compiling some package or watching Gnome screw up repeatedly, losing my network connections.
There are lots of good reasons to go Mac, I could go on all day about things that I feel have worked out better for me with the Mac, no doubt boring some and annoying the rest. The bottom line hasn't anything to do with art, no matter how long I were to go on. It's simply (or maybe not so simply) a better product, and it won me over based on that. The applications I need are there, and that pretty much closes the case.
And as for your lauding tourism in Philadelphia... If you want to draw tourists, that's a task that it is primarily aimed at benefiting businesses. Therefore, those businesses that will benefit (and not all will) should be paying for it. Not the poor homeowners on the outskirts.
This is very similar to small town sports. The schools (hence, including the kid's parents and the old people in town) spend huge sums of money on everything from custom busses to playing fields. The kids play the same games they could have played in a field of grass, in jeans or shorts. The games begin, the visitors from the next town show up, and the local businesses see an upswing in sales. Those specific businesses ought to be paying for that, not the poor schlep of a homeowner.
These are areas where the government has been co-opted by interests that are not legitimate areas for it to focus, IMHO. Private support is the way to go for both art and sports above the level of casual social interaction or for exercise; and to that you can add parks, monuments, and any state-sponsored museums that might creep in here
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Not a lot of interest in English, either... I think "dont right" means "downright" in that impassioned screed, but I wouldn't swear to it. :/
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Your opinions aside (which you are certainly welcome to) this is an area you are simply wrong about. Life spans are increasing, especially in the last century or so. Some of the increase in average span comes from the steep drop in infant mortality, but there are real gains in the ages people are living to, and the quality of life they experience at those advanced ages. I think you need to do a little research here before you continue blaming suits and society for an effect that you have not accurately characterized.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
I'm also a longtime Mac user, and have spotted the occasional howler at RoughlyDrafted, but overall, I think he's been successful at packaging up history in an interesting way. It's a topic lots of us are interested in, so a little redundancy isn't a bad thing. I look forward to reading his new installments.
as a long-time Mac user i remember some fallout of the clones. if i remember right, Apple hired a lot of key engineers from the clone makers. one of those clone companies was making a sub-$1000 clone Macintosh that wasn't too bad. that had been unheard of until then. was it Umax? anyway, i had heard a rumor that some of those people were brought in to make the original iMac as (relatively) cheap as it was back then. the impact of the iMac was based on its design as much as its cost and decent computing power. if it had cost $3,000 it would have failed miserably. it was powerful enough that people upgraded their older beige Macs to them if they did not need the power/size of the G3 tower.
If tomorrow they made their OS X available to run on any Intel type processors they would take 50% of the computer market in one year.
You're dreaming. *IF* they could convince a major OEM to "prefer" OS X, they might be able to get close to that figure in 5 years.
That's assuming Microsoft did nothing in the interim.
I just don't understand why the site has to be so cheerleader'isk
To turn the question on it's head, there's probably a metric butt load of 'we discuss the latest neatest best ever thing from [Microsoft|Dell|HP|]'; why can't there be a site of the rest of us?
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
That is far and above the ugliest and most unreadable "news" site I have ever seen. I wrecked three keyboards typing that last sentence alone because I keep bleeding from my eyes onto my keys.
So the lunar program, which gave birth to many of the technologies we depend on today, was a waste of time? Isabella's jewels would have been better spent belaying the hunger of a few than funding Columbus? The English have long had a phrase to describe you, my friend: "penny wise and pound foolish".
What was once true, is no longer so
The move to PowerPC was Apple's big mistake. That was the point at which Apple market share dropped, and it never came back. Even today, Apple has much lower market share than it did the day the PowerPC machines were announced. The argument for going with the PowerPC was that IBM was going to make Macs. Yes, that was the whole point of the deal. Didn't happen, but that was Apple's big plan. And that bad move happened under Jobs.
In fact, when the PowerPC 601 came out, Motorola was shipping the 68060, which outperformed the early PowerPC chips. The 68000 line could have been developed further; there was nothing in the architecture that limited it. But when Apple dropped it, that was the end of the demand for high-end 68000 parts.
The PowerPC transition killed many existing apps. The engineering community dumped the Mac at the PowerPC transition; existing CAD applications like AutoCAD were not ported to PowerPC, and most of the printed circuit board design applications were dropped at that point, too. So Apple lost a whole market segment, and one willing to pay for big screens and good graphics.
Copeland was actually a good operating system. The problem was that applications had to be revised for it, and Microsoft didn't want to bother. Apple no longer had the clout with developers it had had back at the System 7 transition, where all apps had to be revised. But Apple hadn't realized internally that it could no longer order developers around; the developers had the option of going to Windows. So backwards compatibility had become more important.
Copeland (the original "MacOS 8") actually shipped to some developers. It was almost ready to go. Acquiring NeXT delayed the release of a new OS by several years; it took much longer to get NeXT code onto the Apple platform than Jobs said it would. But it saved Jobs' ass financially; he was heavily invested in NeXT, which was headed for bankruptcy.
As for design, one of the coolest Macs ever was the 20th Anniversary Mac, the first Mac with an LCD panel. In 1997, way ahead of everyone else. That was before Jobs took over and "Steved" the product, because it wasn't his.
The iMac clamshell looked like the Lear-Seigler ADM 3A from 1977, which was a very popular low-end terminal in its day. It wasn't an original concept.
Jobs' big contribution was to suck up to Gates and thus keep Microsoft Office on the Mac That's what saved Apple.
So that's what it looks like with the Reality Distortion Field turned off.
They tried something along those lines with the clones, and as the article states it was a complete disaster.
From what I gathered from various Apple history books, Apple management expected the clones to offer high-end models. When the clones made inexpensive low-end machines, each one was costing Apple $500 USD in revenue and/or profits from their current models. When Apple tried to change the rules of the game, the clones started screaming bloody murder and were shut down.
You weren't using X, you were most likely using CDE, which I also consider to be ugly.
Have you seen what's been done since then? Look up "Compiz" or "KDE", or just take a look at a screenshot of the KDE (minus Beryl due my having gotten it later) I run: http://www.kenji-miyamoto.com/hosting/Screenshot-C lean.png. The interface has never been X, only the basic graphic primitive: the interface used to be TWM, or CDE, but is now controlled by GNOME, KDE, XFce, and Enlightenment. Things have changed.
Mac OS X doesn't even have the lead when it comes to eyecandy anymore, thanks to Novell's Compiz or Quinn Storm's Beryl; they've added an innumerable amount of features to the experience, just look up some screenshots of it on Google Images.
That's a bunch of complete and total horseshit. Apple's hardware margins are the envy of the industry-- even in the darkest days of the late 90s, Apple still made a pretty penny on the boxes they sold. They just weren't selling very many. I can't find the article I read earlier this week, but I believe their revenue breakdown this quarter was 60% from computer sales and 40% from iPod sales.
Everyone else is killing themselves to cut expenses so their boxes can be a couple bucks cheaper than the next guy while still eking out some profit. That's why their hardware feels cheap and why their first-line tech support is outsourced to script monkeys sitting in call centers on the other side of the globe, and why their customer satisfaction ratings have taken a nosedive in recent years.
Apple is making insanely great products again, all systems are go, and their have a hammerlock on an emerging market. So while we don't need cheerleader articles, why is so hard for these people to accept that Apple is successful and it's not going to go out of business anyday now? When Vista hits the stores (and let's face it, it will probably sell extremely well) are we going to see a myriad of articles on the complete disater that was Windows Millennium, or, Hey, what about a pathetic thing called Bob? I don't $@#king think so.
Fiat Homos et Pereat Theos
I couldn't agree more about the classic Mac OS. Not only was it unstable (I typically experienced a total system lockup about once a day), but it also offered absolutely nothing for power users. And not only was that hardware to run it very expensive, it was also slow.
Apple's turnaround has come because they got a number of things right for a change. After about 10 years of of PC use with mixed windows and linux operating systems, I've come back to being a Mac owner. There are a number of reasons. The OS is very usable for all levels of user. They also managed to make USB a standard and switch to other standards (such as DVI and VGA), which makes owning a Mac more affordable because you can use peripherals which are cheaply available. They realized that people wanted computers which are pretty on the outside. OSX also allows the user base to port just about any standard unix application to run on a Mac. The Intel switch was another great move, now Macs are actually fast computers as well (unless you're running under Rosetta, and even then it's not terrible.
Microsoft is currently repeating a lot of Apple's failures in the 90s. They're trying to create products for markets which don't exist. They've let Windows become stagnant, the last revolutionary upgrade which brought vast improvements was Windows 2000. XP and Vista are nice updates, but just baby steps.
Your sentence isn't written using a latin alphabet it was written in English.
The above is essentially what you said.
X is a windowing protocol
TWM, Enlightenment... are Window Managers
Gnone, KDE are GUIS.
KDE for example used KWin as a window manager on top of X.
Wikipedia entry for more details .
No, he wasn't. He was using IRIX's proprietary desktop, which had nothing to do with CDE. The IRIX desktop was lightyears ahead of anything else coming out of the *nix camp at the time. Nice object-oriented file manager, excellent support for audio, video and 3D graphics and even its own widget toolkit.
And to say that you weren't using X, you were using CDE, is as silly as saying that you aren't using X, you're using GNOME.
My blog
Why yes, yes it did. It was even considered "edgy" because the Internet (capital I) was abbreviated with a lowercase letter!
The degree of the industry's plagiarism of Apple's style decisions can be measured by the fact that prior to the iMac introduction, anything vaguely Internet-related was tagged "e-" (for "electronic) -- e-commerce, e-mail, e-this, e-that. Almost immediately after the iMac exploded on the scene, the e- was quietly dropped and new Internet things were tagged "i" or "i-".
-- Old Man Kensey
No, I absolutely do consider such expenditures to be critical. I strongly feel that the government should support basic research, exploration, and highly specific technical endeavors like the space program and the pursuit of fusion power. I just failed to mention this specifically as I wasn't thinking along those lines when I posted, please accept my apology. Along with education, science and technology are the key driving forces that supply society with the wealth it needs to give range to the liberty and freedom people deserve.
Arts, religion, sports and entertainment, however, should only be supported by private donations, I firmly maintain. They are strictly non-critical social aspects, and they do very little to drive society upwards. Often I see them doing the exact opposite, in fact. "My team is better than your team" isn't something I see as helpful on any level, for instance, nor do I view the various doings of religion in a positive light except very, very rarely. I surely don't want to pay for religion, as the government presently forces me to by making me carry their share of the tax burden.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Perhaps it should be stated--once again--that Apple is essentially a hardware company. As many others have pointed out, when they control the hardware AND the software they have much better control over the entire experience. Once they let OS X be run on beige boxes people will start having bad experiences and Apple's reputation would suffer.
Not to mention that a hardware business model is inherently more defendable than a software one since you can't make quick digital copies of hardware.
http://www.rootstrikers.org/
The article's not even finished. The fragment quoted above is the end of the article, as posted, not the beginning.
Why the hell was this put on Slashdot's front page?
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
I understand where your ideas are coming from, but to say that science and technology are the only fields that deserve funding from the government, is simply naive. I don't plan on suddenly sculpting the next David, but art has value as well.
Do you think that art should not be taught in schools as well? Should there be no more literature classes? But then history would not be important either, since it's rather difficult to really understand historical events without understanding the art from the period.
I agree with you when you say that religion and sports should not be publicly funded. And I don't think they are. Even if your government does give money to a sports team, it's usually not with the intention of supporting that team, rather, it is intended to help its citizens by stimulating the economy.
ohhh irix.. teh seksi!! Yep - I'm basically guilty of the same thing as the previous poster.
Of course, my definition of a religion doesn't include any group that charges thousands of dollars for the privilege of learning its teachings, so Scientology wouldn't qualify.
What was once true, is no longer so
Thanks for calling me a young kid. I've been feeling like an old man for a while now, so that makes me smile.
I've used Macs since 1984 (although I was just drawing pictures then), and before that I played on the Vic20, Apple II's, the ST, the Amiga, an Apple IIGS.
I've managed million dolllar IT budgets for Microsoft enraptured dotcoms as they went under, and I followed NeXT while they whimpered out into irrelevance.
I was a developer through the move to Rhapsody and Mac OS X, and I'm a bit happy to see somebody with vision and a pulse injecting a challenge into the waters of IT.
Apple has also pushed POSIX (the same Linux/UNIX platform) into the mainstream, and helped Linux to challenge the NT monoculture.
So fogive me if I bubble enthusiastically about seeing a product I like be popularized by a fascinating company with interesting personalities and class and charm.
Also, if you are going to blow stink about my "inaccuracies," please lay them out instead of just making unfounded bullshit claims. I think you really are just bitter because you have nothing really interesting to say.
And for what its worth, I've written well over a hundred articles this year, and three have been posted to Slashdot in my lifetime. EVER. THREE EVER. So don't rain on my parade just because you have nothing to contribute to the world but your worthless trolling.
I agree that the FEDERAL government probably shouldn't be using funds for such things (though I happen to think that even that is okay in the Capitol), but I see no problem with local people deciding where their tax dollars go. If the people of Philly want to build a tower to the stars, let 'em. Philly was a much more livable city because of the public art projects - left to private interests, cities would be nothing but row after row of concrete and glass boxes. The rich folks would probably set up private parks like Gramercy park in New York, but everyone else would get a big ugly city.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
Wow, when I stereotype, can I nail it or what?
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
Oh, get off of that horse. I had a big, gas-guzzling SUV. I lived a block from work. I put gas in that thing maybe once a month. This guy with a Miata would give me the same line of crap about saving the earth. He commuted in 40 miles each way, each day. Who was using more Abu Ghraib gas? Maybe you are one of these people that washes their dishes in a thimble full of condensation water from under the fridge. Maybe you don't shower at all because it's bad for the earth. Maybe you don't buy cotton clothes and only shroud yourself in the skin of roadkill to save natural resources. I bet that isn't the case, though, and that there is more that YOU could do to decrease your footprint. There are many, many people using less natural resources than you - remember that the next time you criticize ME.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
No, I think art, and sports, are a perfectly valid part of the educational process. And I'm not against either one, either in-school or as commercial undertakings; What I am against is government funding of pursuit of the arts or the multiplying sports into stadium-level events at taxpayer expense. If you want to fund an artist, or a writer, by all means, do so. That gives them another option (besides the commercial one of selling the work product, I mean) and that's fine with me. Likewise, if you want to fund a sports team, go ahead, and more power to you. Just don't ask me to and expect me to be happy about it.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
My position is that just because the community at large prefers one particular thing, it can be entirely over the top to force others to go along. For instance, I do not support religion, quite the contrary; consequently I am extremely unhappy when the locals or the feds force me to carry their weight for them.
I think this is just one case of a generalization that it should not be "OK" for any tax authority to force you to support non-essential (short- or long-term) services. That, I think, is not the job of a government.
The job of the government seem to me to be supporting the physical infrastructure, protecting the citizens from disasters and predators that may arise from both within and without the borders, educating the populace in a comprehensive manner, and encouraging the development of science and technology, as these are the cornerstones upon which our society stands and indulges in such luxuries as art, sport, literature and so forth.
It's all just IMHO.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
CDE, Enlightenment and all those other environments run under X. X is the fundemental source of the problem, since from what I understand it's a horrible pain to write for.
I checked out your screen shot and it has one thing that makes me dislike it. It looks remarkably similar to Windows. KDE's interface waas in fact based on Windows, and although that makes it familiar to a lot of people, they also make me think that if I really wanted Windows, well I would use the real thing.
At least you will never confuse an Apple screen with a Windows screen, and - and this is very important - it's still very well designed.
D
There is much more to a nice interface than eye candy. Aqua is more about usability than it is about eye candy. All of the features of OS X, from the dialog sheets for opening and saving files, to Expose, to fast user switching, to Spaces and Time Machine in the Leopard demo, have a wonderful way of integrating eye candy with usability to create the ultimate user interface.
I was a longtime KDE user on FreeBSD before buying a Mac a few months ago. KDE is a very great desktop environment. However, I feel that its default themes and artwork are created by programmers who want eye candy for the sake of having eye candy instead of seasoned graphics artists and designers who know all of the theories and practices behind graphic communication with user interfaces. Look at the fonts and icon sizes of a typical KDE desktop, for example. Look at that of a OS X desktop, and compare. I'm not saying that KDE is a bad desktop (it's a very great desktop); I'm just saying that some more polish is needed for their themes. Eye candy for the sake of having eye candy hurts my eyes. Eye candy with a regard for graphic communication and UI makes for a very pleasing computing experience.
Never had a crash on os9. Ever.
OSX ? Perhaps twice in the last year. And i dont reboot for months so its not unexpected.
XP? crashes on a regular basis. Cant go a week without rebooting.
2000? Try a month and it wil be as slow as mud. Crashes, not as frequent but they happen.
98? Lets not even go there.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
LOL! No, but I must admit that my then-girlfriend-now-wife would sometimes drop me off on her way to the grocery store :) Actually, I think I did drive in a thunderstorm a few times.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
I agree with your sentiment, but there is a lot of wiggle room for when something is just for pleasure vs. benefiting the community. You can argue all night and day about whether a sports complex or arts center improves the community or not, or whether those dollar are better spent elsewhere. Thankfully, there is usually a free and open democratic process. Yeah, democracies often screw the minority... I think that we could improve this with some innovative voting systems where you express preferences instead of a "binary" vote, but now I'm digressing.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
Bill Gates $150M and committment to Office on the Mac.
Microsoft needed Apple not to fail because 5% marketshare was all the evidence Bill Gates needed as proof that Windows was not a monopoly. For $150M, Bill got the room he needed to breathe out from under Anti-Trust and seeded further MS product, even if he lost a window sale or two. It was his cost of staying in business, without the US Gov't breaking Microsoft into separate operating units.
Steve Jobs got serious credibility on the Street, with businesses really nervous about being stuck with Mac's going out of business. Bill G. stopped all that bleed, angst and hesitation in the sales pipeline for Apple Computer Inc.
Offtopic, but DON'T get a MacBook. The keyboards are hell, the machines have (in my experience as a tech) a lovely tendency to break, and from a purely subjective view I think they look terrible.
The MacBook Pro, on the other hand, is a pretty high-quality machine. I haven't had any problems with any of 'em.
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
During the early '90's, when OS 7 and OS 8 were crashing every 15 minutes, I had a couple of customers with 500+ Mac II's and III's that almost never crashed; they were running AUX. AUX was UNIX, and it still ran the Mac OS on top. At that time, a Mac III with a Radius monitor was the fastest AutoCAD system around.
IMO, the article (incomplete as it is) is right on about the weaknesses in Apple's strategy to gain market share. IMO, if they had contiued to expand in the UNIX area and done a better job of marketing AUX, they wouldn't have had to re-develop the idea for OSX. The Microsoft platform, with it's huge base of applications, is a great example of Kevin Kelly's proposition that "Value flows from Abundance" (Kevin Kelly, "New Rules for the New Economy", 1998). In short, Kelly claims that in the networked world, the more people you have using your product, the more valuable it becomes. His first examples are the telephone and fax machine: Both devices were in short demand until enough people had them so that owning one was a convenience rather than a curiosity. IMO, if Apple had done with AUX what they've done with OSX, the sheer utility of owning an Apple computer would have been enough to avoid some of the problms they had in the '90's.
"The mind works quicker than you think!"
Perhaps it should be stated--once again--that Apple is essentially a hardware company. As many others have pointed out, when they control the hardware AND the software they have much better control over the entire experience.
If this is the case, why are they selling essentially PCs these days? And why are there so many problems with this "we control the variables" experience -- the overheating, the cases cracking, the too-hot power supplies? I own a Macbook and while I like the computer and want to drink the kool-aid, I (and others) can't help but think it will die after a short life.
They're "designed" to be attractive, but they're not designed for any kind of durability or reliability, which makes me think they're just an expensive consumer electronics item with an all-too-obvious planned obsolesence.
Not to mention that a hardware business model is inherently more defendable than a software one since you can't make quick digital copies of hardware.
They could sell OS X for non-Apple hardware with hardware keys to limit copying.
Oh, you have no idea.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
I don't mind the digression in the least. I enjoy considering alternatives.
My favorite idea (thus far) is tax everyone equally, but let the taxpayer select which non-essential programs their funds go towards.
So you could elect to fund the stadium but not some antithetical-to-Yar program, I'd fund the homeless shelters and the clean-needles program but not religion or the stadium. At the end of the day, instead of the politicians deciding what gets funded out of their bright ideas, we would do the deciding. The not-so-popular ideas wouldn't get funded completely (or at all), and they'd either die on the vine, or at least proceed a lot more slowly.
Since everyone still has to pay full tax, some programs would be extremely well funded, which would accelerate them. Just as the public desires. Do this to all socially optional programs — religions, sports stadiums, monuments and support for the arts — while critical programs — education, science and technology, transport and communications infrastructure creation and maintenance — get 100% base funding plus whatever is left over from any person who doesn't allocate their funds to the optional projects. In this way, no tax dollars go unused, and no tax dollars go anywhere anyone doesn't want them for social options.
That was, of course, a bare-bones outline, but that's the core of the idea, anyway.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Weeeell, that's an interesting comment. I've heard the exact opposite. Pros run intolerably hot on the lap, and go to the shop more often. They've got a few more features I covet, and I can afford one, but I'd been leaning away, more towards a fully-fleshed out MacBook... 2 gigs and the big drive.
Hnmph. Well, more research is called for, I suppose. Thanks for commenting.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
Sure, I use gas/other natural resources when there is no other convenient option. For example, my apartment complex doesn't have recycle bins and I can not be bothered to litter my living room with bottles and then drive to recycle them. However, I don't flaunt my resource consumption as a status symbol. There is nothing a BMW can do that a Honda Civic can not (this may be different if you are in Germany and commute on Autobahn). There is a difference between going to war and drinking from a skull coffee mug.
Why did you need your big, gas-guzzling SUV anyway? It's not "prettier" than Civic. Since you didn't get married until later, I assume you didn't have a large number of children. Your girlfriend couldn't have needed so many groceries.
The 8086 was very similar to the 8085, so it was trivial to translate ASM code that ran on 8085 to 8086...
At the risk of appearing totally irrelevant to the 21st century, I must take a certain amount of exception to the statement above.
The 8086 with its segmented address architecture was ('is'?) the most seriously difficult microprocessor to program ever built. The only reason that it got put into the PC in the first place is due to the recommendation of Bill Gates, who was one of the world's best microprocessor programmers at the time.
I would venture to say that the decision to use the Intel 8086 instead of the far more advanced but more expensive Motorola 68000 set back microprocessor software development by about six years. It wasn't until the late 1980's with the release of fast dependable CPUs and storage, along with interactive programming languages like Borland Turbo Pascal and Turbo C, that PC software development went beyond having one guy who wrote most of the code for each major software application. That also limited the company to one major piece of application software for which they were known, i.e. Lotus for spreadsheets, Ashton-Tate for word processors.
Software for the PC would be more advanced today if the Intel 8086 were actually similar to the Intel 8085. But it's all water under the bridge now...
Apple failed to learn how to build real business relationship with large businesses. They have no experience at that, which is why they will suffer. University hardware support programs are terrible, basically amount to selling hardware and running for it. No relationship building capacity. What can you expect from iconoclastic california company?
Their products are excellent don't get me wrong, it is just that they learned how to download products onto customers, while having excellent technical support, they have no ability/capacity/experience to deal with large clients. Which will lead to their downfall, eventually.
2c.
I have looked over, what was posted and couldn't make out if someone seen, few glossed over the idea, and I would like to emphasize it. .NET and derivatives. (look at your favorite job board). So fine, their platform is superrior(i have a powerbook). However my professor and some other businesses had terrible dealings with apple, on business level. Professor worked at other university where apple had installed 2 large classrooms with early power pc computers and promptly proceeded to ignore the customers that suppose to become future developers and/or businessmen/leaders at large corporations, that possibly will order superrior apple hardware. Not so. No extra support beyond repairing hardware under warranty terms and having sales people calling about "more hardware", at a standard educational 15% discount.
Apple does not have capacity to maintain large clients. They are big on promises, small on delivery. They key word here, is company to company relationships. Now you can order a swath of Dell PC's and most likely you'll get preferrential treatment from them. No so with apple. They make a point of that as well. Most recently they had gall to come to university here and sell computers, telling how wonderful their OS is. Well it is. What university students stand to gain from learning Carbon and Cocoa. Pretty much nothing. Most UI design jobs are nowadays with
So, it is small they like, iPod is selling at least for a while. But that would take you only so far. When you fall on hard times, you fall onto your relationship net that you had built up over number of years.
So during their presentation at the university, they have ignored questions about the relationship and his experience at previous university, only ignored the questions and continued their sales pitch. Needless to say, there are no orders of powerbooks, iMacs or MacPros.
The feeling you get is that they eager to extract money from you and run. Questions like, "will there be deeper discounts if we fully commit to apple platform?" , was no, just standard discount. Write us a check please. I don't know much about business, but unless they alter the way they handle business clients, in the end apple will end up in the same ditch.
Until the last old person has every last med, surgery, and prosthetic device they need, every pothole in every road has been fixed, and public schools are turning out 99%+ graduates who actually know what they were taught, I can't see any legitimate reason for the government to be acting the role of funder / arbiter of optional activities. Note that this isn't born of a dislike of art; quite the contrary. It's just born of liking people, and liberty, a lot better.
While I agree with much of what you say, especially as regards liberty and small government, promoting tourism does have it's place. Those homeless and in need of medical assistance can benefit by tourism as it can create jobs and as more jobs are created employers will need to increase pay and/or benefits such as health insurance. What I am against though is governments giving big businesses financial aid in the form of eminent domain, guarantied loans, and tax breaks. Such projects need to stand on their own merits.
FalconShould there be a Law?
It wasn't the fancy colored iMacs, the iPod, OS X or any great products that Apple made. It was understanding that their failure was that M$ was locking them out of the market. The SOLUTION was to sell great products direct to the public. That's it. Period.
I agree with you when you say that religion and sports should not be publicly funded. And I don't think they are. Even if your government does give money to a sports team, it's usually not with the intention of supporting that team, rather, it is intended to help its citizens by stimulating the economy.
Rarely if ever will sports help an area's economy on a sustained basis. I may be wrong, as I've never heard of this happening, and if so then I challenge anyone who disagrees with providing evidence showing I'm wrong. The only example I know of that may work is from the Olympics in Athens in 2004, as all of the housing and such after the games were given away to many poor in a lottery style drawing. However it's still too early to know if it will help.
FalconShould there be a Law?
No, Apple failed in the 90s for one reason, in two words: Michael Spindler. If Spindler hadn't been replaced, there would be no iMac, iPod, iBook, MacBook etc. etc. We'd be using MP3 players from Creative Labs and plugging them in via parallel port or SCSI or Cardbus on our beige boxes. Running Windows 98SE version 9.9 or something. Spindler's vision was pasting a Power PC chip into an old LC475 motherboard and thunking four times every time data moved through the anemic bus. Just to be cheap. Garbage, sheer garbage.
Gil Amelio had Apple out of its rut and on its way back. Then he brought The Steve back in, and even though it meant his job was toast, in that moment he saved Apple.
Gotta give Amelio 'nuff respect because he doesn't get much. He was the unsung hero in the story of the revival of Apple. The Steve inspired the real audacious moves like the iMac and iBook, but the momentum from a near-stall? Amelio.
Knowledge is power. Knowledge shared is power multiplied.
When we tried to program we ran up against limitations associated with the programming languages available. They were good programming languages but they lacked the adequate documentation for us to make them really effective and useful. We contacted Apple. They bluntly told us that information was proprietary and we should hire Claris Works to write the software. That was it. We were out in the cold. No more Apples for me.
...
Apple is succeding now with IPod etc largely because many many people can play. If they wanted to take out Microsoft, it would be easy. All they have to do is take their basic superiority in graphics and etc and lock the doors open to developers. It will be a short time indeed before MS is on the ropes.
Have you ever used ADC, Apple Developer Connection? Though I haven't I've met some who have and they swear by it. I'm using now and have been using Windows almost exclusively for 8 years but when I get a new laptop hopefully within a few weeks I'll be getting a MacBook Pro. I'm just waiting for Apple to release one with the Merom Core 2 Duo cpu. When I do I'll be joining ADC as well.
FalconShould there be a Law?
Even more, Apple was being undercut by the clone manufacturers. While I'm still not sure opening up the market to the clones was a terrible idea, it is obvious that it hurt Apple bottom line in the 90s.
While I'd like to see Mac clones there's one thing not many think about, Apple isn't just a software company they are that and a hardware company While Mac OS updates are more expensive than they should be, at least that's what I've heard a number of Mac users say as I've been a Windows user for years, Apple makes a lot from hardware sales. When Apple allowed Mac clones they lost more in hardware sales than they make from licensing Mac OS. There may be a balance there somewhere, where they can make as much from an increase of the sale of the OS as they loose from a decrease in hardware sales but would clone makers be willing to pay for a license and would Apple retain the reliability of Macs?
FalconShould there be a Law?
Never had a crash on os9. Ever.
OSX ? Perhaps twice in the last year. And i dont reboot for months so its not unexpected.
XP? crashes on a regular basis. Cant go a week without rebooting.
2000? Try a month and it wil be as slow as mud. Crashes, not as frequent but they happen.
98? Lets not even go there.
I've never used MacOS 9 but I've used Macs since Apple first came out with them until the mid '90s. I had a Mac SE30 with MacOS 7 I bought used in '92 and didn't have any problems with it until the floppy drive died in 2000. Several months later I bought a used PowerMac 7300/200 with MacOS 8 and it worked until early this year. XP? The first tyme I ever used WinXP it froze while booting up. And I've gotten a number of BSODs from Win2000. The only Windows I haven't had much trouble with is NT 4. However the pc mine runs on has a DEC Alpha cpu and I haven't been able to install much software on it so it sits on the floor unused the last few years. Within the past month I've setup a home network I plan on connecting it to then I'll try to get an up to date Linux to install on it.
FalconShould there be a Law?
From what I gathered from various Apple history books, Apple management expected the clones to offer high-end models.
Nope, you got it ass-backwards. The cloners were supposed to take the low end of the market that Apple wasn't that interested in. Apple wanted to keep the high-margin, high end of the market to themselves.
The cloners didn't see it that way, and got into a pissing match with Apple over who could build the fastest boxes for the least money. There was at least a brief period where the fastest Mac you could buy was made by Power Computing, and Power Computing was not shy about advertising that fact. That was very bad for Apple, since their hardware sales were responsible for a much bigger chunk of their revenues than the OS licenses the cloners bought. If things kept going that way, Apple would've been in an irreversible death spiral a la Netscape: less revenue --> insufficient R&D funds --> inferior new products --> nobody buying your products --> repeat.
Enter Steve Jobs. He returned to the company around this time, saw what a mess the cloning program was causing, and acted quickly to end it. The cloners' licenses only covered Mac OS 7.x, so Jobs decided that what should really have been called Mac OS 7.7 was going to instead ship as Mac OS 8.0, which he then refused to license to the cloners-- extracting Apple from a bad situation via a technicality.
When allowing clones nearly killed the company the last time they tried it, is it really any wonder that they are so reluctant to try it again?
~Philly
That software isn't a problem. That software can be removed. What might be considered a problem is a webcam in every computer. Some companies don't like that.
I don't know about using webcams but employers are watching what thier employees are doing online with employer owned pcs, mostly because the possibility of lawsuits when inappropriate content is viewed and from employees using pcs for personal reasons and work suffering from it. If employers get more courious about what employees are doing they may want webcams to keep an eye on them. Personally I wouldn't want to work for any such employer but...
There is also application availability, many corporations need some obscure or custom app that's not available on OS X, and the cost of Parallels and the maintenance hassle of supporting something like that might not be worth it, that sort of arrangement would more than offset the ease of OS X maintenance.
I'm using Windows now but I plan on making my next computer a MacBook Pro and when I get it I'll get CrossOver Mac as well to run the Windows apps I'll want to run. The only one I can think of right now is XMLSpy, but if I can find an app like it for Macs then I'll try it first.
FalconShould there be a Law?
Today a $1000+ system starts to look expensive to the enterprise, but lots of home users will spend that sort of money, or more, on a variety of consumer electronics. This is a whole new market, but nobody really noticed its potential until a couple of years ago. Apple truly did see it earlier than many others (but certainly wasn't the first). They made this neat little bit of software that organised your music collection - the iPod was just an add on to that originally. Then they looked at photos, home videos, etc.
I wouldn't say the home market is a new one for Apple and Macs. Way back when, mid '80s, most people I knew who got a computer to use at home got a Mac, not more than 1/4 to 1/3 got a pc with DOS. Then graphic artists were getting them. Even now some graphic artists won't use anything else.
FalconShould there be a Law?
I thought Apple came back because of MS's ati-trust suit, which ended up with MS investing in Apple to spur "competition". They did make nice PCs and make a nice MP3 player and advertise the hell out of it.
But that was after they were "back"
Where Apple score is that they get the new stuff out first so it's hard to make a comparison.
If only this were true. I'm typing this on an HP PC but I plan on replacing it with a MacBook Pro, I'm just waiting for Apple to release one with the Merom Core 2 Duo. I've been waiting for weeks yet while Dell, HP, and others have laptops with the Core2 in them Apple hasn't even announced when they will release one. After several years and a few PCs with Windows driving me to switch, if I weren't set on getting a Mac instead of dealing with more trouble from Windows, Activation, and WGA I would of gotten a laptop with Windows by now. But I'm fed up with Windows, Gateway, and HP. So I'm hoping Apple releases the MacBook with the Core2 Duo within a few more weeks. If not I may break down, get a PC, and install Linux on it.
FalconShould there be a Law?
I couldn't agree more about the classic Mac OS. Not only was it unstable (I typically experienced a total system lockup about once a day), but it also offered absolutely nothing for power users. And not only was that hardware to run it very expensive, it was also slow.
I've had the opposite experience with Macs. I've bought two used Macs, the first was a Mac SE30 I got in 1992, and the second is a PowerMac 7300/200 I got in 2000. The SE30 lasted me from '92 to 2000 when the Floppy disk drive failed. I had no other problems with it, well other than it only had a 20MB HD, 720KB floppy, and no cd. The PowerMac lasted me until early this year, it doesn't seem to be booting up though I'm not sure what the problem is. However I'm typing this on the fourth PC running Windows I got since 1998. Counting all 4 PCs I've had to replace 3 hds, it seems the hd on the PC I'm using now is failing too, three ram modules, and two motherboards. Then on one of them, a laptop, the LCD cracked a couple of months after I got it and though I got an extended warranty with it it wasn't covered. With the OS, on three of them Windows crashed and had to be reinstalled a couple of tymes each, when they crashed I called tech support and they told me to reinstall Windows. Only one of the 4 PCs has not given me either hardware trouble or trouble with Windows, and that one is a DEC Alpha running NT4. Because it's CPU is an Alpha not an AMD or Intel though I haven't been able to install much software so I haven't used it much.
FalconShould there be a Law?
They could sell OS X for non-Apple hardware with hardware keys to limit copying.
Apple tried that, but they lost more from a reduction in hardware sales than they made in licensing the Mac OS. The only ways to solve this and still allow clones is to either limit what clone makers can do and set the prices they can sale at, raise the price of licenses, and/or reduce thier own hardware costs and therefore the price of Macs. Given that why would anyone become a potential clone maker? But the fact is is Apple is both a hardware and a software maker.
FalconShould there be a Law?
Similarly, there was an old American electronic company called 'Packard-Bell' that made good electronics in the past. Ain't here no more.
A more appropriate name was Packard Hell. They were the worst pc manufacturer I knew of. Now one manufacturer that was terrific was Zenith. That is if you got one that didn't have any problems in the first month. If there weren't then it'd last and last but if you had a problem in the first month then you'd always have a problem.
FalconShould there be a Law?
There have been many companies that have failed during the 90-ties... the greatest loss propably beeing Digital.
Yea, I've got a box with a DEC Alpha next to me. As I could hardly get any software installed I wish FX!32 had been developed more.
Tru64, propably the best UNIX in the world... too bad some jerks killed it.
I don't know about this, I didn't have Tru64 installed but I did NT4 and Redhat.
FalconShould there be a Law?
In most ways, the original Mac was no match for its competitors, not only the Intel/Microsoft PC, but also other 68k-based competitors like the Amiga.
I loved Amigas and if modern ones were still being made I'd get one. I recall years ago watching an Amiga running MacOS with a new Mac next to it and the Amiga ran faster. They also had the ability to run Windows so a person could conceivably run Amiga OS, MacOS and Windows all on the same machine. Commodor's marketing was terrible though,and I was hoping when Gateway bought the Amigas they'd revitalize it. Unfortunately they didn't.
FalconShould there be a Law?
If tomorrow they made their OS X available to run on any Intel type processors they would take 50% of the computer market in one year. Prove me wrong Apple, try it.
If Apple sold OSX for any computer Apple would see a big drop in hrdware sales. Apple did allow Mac clones but they lost more in reduced hardware sales than they made in sales of MacOS, Apple isn't only a software company they are also a hardware company. Here's a list of companies that made Mac clones.
FalconShould there be a Law?
I've been reading Slashdot for years and years. No one really talks about it but this site has an obvious agenda which is anti-Micro$oft. Do I care? No. Is it a big deal? No. I'll continue to read this site like I have for years because they cover great things in the technology industry but don't even tell me that this isn't true. It's so blatant to me.
I too have been reading slashdot for years and I frequently read critizisms like your's. If slashdot is so partisan why do I keep seeing these posts? Then again I also read them about Macs, and Linux as well.
FalconShould there be a Law?
Compiled in less than 3 minutes: will Stallmann kill the linux revolution (today?)
2006.10.16: Root Exploit For NVIDIA Closed-Source Linux Driver
2006.10.12: IceWeasel Why Closed Source Wins
2006.10.03: Weakness In Linux Kernel's Binary Format
Man, this is a site that, while obviously pro-linux, is not blind. But yeah, Windows sucks and Linux sucks. Only linux sucks far less.
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048
>> That the classic Mac OS was no good? It was certainly scads better than anything M$ was dribbling out.
> No it wasn't. Classic Mac OS lacked virtual memory, memory protection, multitasking, shared libraries and on the whole
> was way behind Windows technologically.
Not exactly... Windows 1.0 didn't have memory protection, and its virtual memory was software-based and on the whole not really superior to the Mac's "purgeable" resource mechanism. For multitasking, Switcher was available in 1985, but that was more like a TSR than true multitasking, and you needed a Fat Mac with 512k RAM to run multiple programs anyway.
Windows had DLLs before the Mac had Shared Libraries, but they were mostly a joke technologically, causing more problems than they solved. When the Mac finally introduced Shared Libraries, they were fairly sophisticated and transparent.
> Windows had gradually evolved to take advantage of improved hardware, and become a more 'modern' OS.
> Meanwhile, Mac OS had mostly stagnated, with only modest improvements in System 7
To be fair, System 7 was light-years ahead of the original Mac OS in terms of features, but after that Apple didn't quite seem to know what to do with it. Not that they weren't trying; they developed A/UX in this period, and started work on Pink/Taligent, which would have leapfrogged Windows if it had been successful.
The big problem with the original Mac OS was that it wasn't very forward-looking. Jobs insisted that the Mac would be self-contained and never need expansion, which was a recipe for stagnation. Fortunately he was gone by the time more sophisticated Mac models were introduced.
The 'mob of managers' architecture of Mac OS gave developers a lot of flexibility, but it also made it hard to advance because any time you changed something in the Toolbox ROM, any number of things at different levels could be affected by it.
> before OS X, the underlying OS was always a joke, and could never technically stand up to Windows
Mostly true, but remember that the Mac OS was much more complex than DOS/Windows at first. It was a Herculean effort to develop, and the result was effective not because it was more technically advanced, but because it DIDN"T MATTER if it was-- the user did not see the difference, and didn't care, because it just worked! Only when Apple tried to carry the Mac into the future did users suffer the growing pains that you describe.
Apple was so convinced of their superiority, they developed the OS through navel-gazing rather than looking outward to what other advances were being made in operating systems. Whenever a feature was suggested for improving the design of Mac OS, Apple shouted "Not Invented Here!" Microsoft at least was hiring OS experts and looking at what PCs would be capable of in the near future. And for all the advances Microsoft made, they still didn't have a decent file system until NTFS in 1993, and most users didn't benefit from it for years afterward.
Personally, I think Amiga was the benchmark Apple should have compared the Mac against. As soon as they saw what the Amiga could do, they should have said "okay, there's the bar-- anything we release from now on has to be AT LEAST as good as what the Amiga can do!"
First, a BMW is a lot different from a Honda Civic. Some people actually enjoy driving. The feel of a crisp shift, the ability to take a sharp curve, the push back in your seat when you hold the accelerator to the floor. I guess these people could buy 2 cars - one that is a daily commuter and one to take out on joyrides or to the track. But I fail to see how buying twice as many cars would help save natural resources. Second, when my wife needed a car I wholeheartedly recommended a Honda Civic or Toyota Corolla. She got a Civic. I'm tall, however, and don't fit in a Civic very comfortably. When I moved further away from work, I bought a Saturn that I also didn't really fit in, but it was CHEAP and it got 40 MPG!
:)
I had a couple of restrictions when I bought my Blazer. I don't fit in most compact cars very well. Volkswagens do let me put the seat back pretty far, and I did consider a Golf. I couldn't get one for 6 weeks or so, and my car was not up to another 6 weeks of commuting... it was pretty much dead. I tried to go up to the next size of sedan, but frankly I couldn't see myself in a Malibu - it was like a crappy version of an Accord. I pretty much had to buy my car from our friend who is a car dealer, so I was restricted from most of the Japanese brands except for Subaru. After spending the whole day at the dealer, I surprised myself by coming down to choosing between a Jeep Grand Cherokee and a 2-door Chevy Blazer. I ended up taking the small-ish (for a truck) Blazer. It turned out to be very handy - it was every bit as utilitarian as a station wagon, so I could throw my bike in the back or my boat stuff. The only station wagon available to me was the Passat Wagon, which was too expensive and not very fast. The Blazer had a nice big back seat, which is my biggest beef with the Civic. It could tow my boat (no borrowing someone's pickup!) It also was in two major accidents. In the first, my wife walked away just fine after a guy ran a red light and she t-boned him. In the second, I was rear-ended while traveling about 45 MPH on I-95, and we actually drove away (the Volvo did not). I know that the rollover risk is high for SUVs, but you can drive like a sissy and avoid that for the most part. Mostly, though, gas mileage was not high on my list. I lived close to work, what did I care how much millage it got - it wasn't a commuting car. The furthest that car ever had to commute was about 5 miles. Oh, and it was much, much "prettier" than a Civic!
But to answer your question, why did I need an SUV? I didn't. Most people don't need a 4-seat car so that they can commute by themselves to work each day. One just makes a tradeoff between efficiency, convenience, quality, and aesthetics.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
All I'm asking is why this has to be? Like I said earlier, I don't really care but why all the negativity?
It isn't that Slashdot has an anti-Microsoft bias - reality has an anti-Microsoft bias.
Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
I'd be much closer to your point of view if I really felt that the government would spend any funds removed fron non-criticial activities on those that were critical, rather than simply shifting them to another non-critical item. Given that there will always be some governemental activities that some deem "non-critical" and that people will disagree on which of these activities belong in which category, there willa lways be money spent on "non-critical" activities. I think that any dollars spent on art are relatively innocuous and so I support those decisions. After all, the government could be using them for more security (read abridgement of rights) or YACS (Yet Another Corporate Subsidy). Both of these potentially could have much greater negative consequences than giving a museum $10,000 to put on an exhibit that includes an Andre Serrano work (And oddly enough, you don't hear much about the other works displayed in the show, huh? Why is that?).
That is all.
This is a popular meme, but the evidence is that the $150 million settlement-disguised-as-investment wasn't critical. Apple wasn't hurting financially, they were flailing around technically. Steve's axe wasn't so much about saving money as giving Apple a direction... any direction.
I think that the idea has merit in smaller communities, but would get too bogged down in cities - and wouldn't work at all on the national level. You'd need an accountant to do your allocations for you each year :) Also, who gets to draw the line between what is and isn't "essential"? For instance, I'd argue that your clean needles program is "essential" because it is a public health concern. Also, picture a sizable minority (say, creationists) setting their school funding to 0% because evolution is taught. I don't really have an issue with allowing politician to stand-in for us on the political level, but I think we need to reform how those politicians are chosen to more accurately reflect the desires of the constituency. Things like Condorcet elections... we need more diversity in our government - the two-party system is not cutting it for me :) Interestingly, your tax approach is another way of accomplishing essentially the same thing. They are both preference-based, instead of plurality-based, ways of running government.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
Let me just say that every single computer I have seen owned by someone not actually involved in the computing industry in some capacity is riddled with spyware and/or virii.
Generally, the anti-* software is not updated, it is not run periodically because the computers are not kept on 24/7, and problems are allowed to fester until the only solution is to reformat the drive or buy a new computer.
If anti-malware software actually worked, the malware companies will go out of business. I don't think I need to tell you what's actually happening.
These things may seem simple to you, but you are a genuine security expert compared to the person on the street who has a computer. I hate to sound condescending to the average Joe, because the public is often more intelligent than they are given credit for, but in the case of protecting their computer, they're dumb as rocks.
D
They don't love Windows.
They love games.
What's wrong with a game console for those people? Gaming consoles cost about as much as a high-end graphics card and my impression is that they still work better than most PCs.
D
Well, so would I, but if it was optional, I'd opt in.
Nah. Education is critical. Imagine an uneducated populace. They'd do things like... I dunno... elect Bush? Uh-oh...
I have no bone to pick with this. I think the US political system is so corrupt, so twisted, so corporately biased, that there is literally no hope of getting it fixed. Which isn't to say I am unwilling to try, but it feels like I'm beating on a stone wall with a feather. The people are relatively content (I believe because they are relatively wealthy, if they are healthy), and that's no formula for a revolutionary change in the political system.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
The problem is, there is a much more limited supply of dollars than one might think. The US debt is at about $25,000.00 per *person* right now, and taxes collected mostly go towards servicing that debt. So by definition, there is no "extra" funding. I see that as indicating that money directed to art and parks is not money well spent. I see your point about reducing the amount available for bad ideas (and which I would be willing to stipulate constitute most of what congress comes up with) but still, at the end of the day, the infrastructure needs funding, as do many other basic governmental responsibilities.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
And after that, why I failed in the 90's, *sob*. Remember, whether you really failed or not, you at least have to have something adverse so you can look good when your amazing comeback kicks in a decade later and you write an book explaining how wonderful you and your company are.
What would Richard Feynman do, if he were here right now? He'd do some math and he'd follow through!
Well, it depends on your personality whether you will find this reassuring or alarming, but I think history has taught us that the good times will not go on forever. There will be another severe recession/depression/panic, and with it will come political change. Whether it is GOOD or BAD change is up in the air :)
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
How on earth did you manage that?! I take it you never ran IE, or Netscape, or ImageReady, or any other major application. MacOS crashed, plain and simple. I preferred it to Windows, but it sure as hell wasn't perfect.
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
The people who bought Perfomas were not "mac people." They were the Walmart crowd who bought what their kid's school had, who then would generally return them to Walmart when it crapped out or their kid realized he couldn't play Doom on it.
I know.. I serviced HUNDREDS of those crapboxes back then, and nary a one was a owned by a "mac guy". Those rarely failed.
Can you comment on how the MacBooks are vs. the iBooks? I love my little 12" G4. I'd hate to know that the newer models are a step backwards. Not in performance, mind you, but in build quality, battery life, screen quality, etc.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
Asking customers how they feel about manufacturers is certainly a useful exercise but it's hardly an objective measure of quality.
I agree, a better though not the best metric is whether they'd recommend the company to someone they know, and like.
FalconShould there be a Law?
"Microsoft got caught red-handed with code in"
That allegation was in-play... yes. Except Jobs doesn't play hardball day-to-day only to let his archrival walk away unharmed if Steve had Microsoft's red handed code in his possession. I didn't buy it then, Don't buy it now. It may have been true.
Steve got what he needed more than anything else in the World at that moment. It put him back in the driver's seat with credibility and license to cross-market his product into the Microsoft pie. Apple couldn't do that without Word, Excel, etc...
Bill G. had a big problem with anti-trust litigation. Apple was his best defence. His company needed for Apple to succeed more than risking copy-waste code blocks from Apple to keep one piece of software competitive.
We would need an insider to salt the truth on this one. Neither of us has the inside scoop.