First of the OLPCs Built

eldavojohn writes "An announcement came Sunday that the first ten prototypes of the Linux-powered OLPC XO-1 had been completed in China. From the article, 'Quanta, the Chinese computer maker that won the international bidding for the project earlier this year, will assemble 900 OLPC machines that will be used for destructive testing and distribution to our development partners.' Let's hope that these first prototypes do not warrant any design changes and that the testing goes well so that countries that expressed interest (Brazil, Libya, Nigeria, Argentina, and Thailand) can start distributing them soon."

Comments

Zonk..

[Anonymous Coward]

Can suck my cock. Fucking asshat.

Linux

[thejrwr]

Linux- Able to control the universe with just bash scripting!

Re:Linux

[brusk]

Bash scripting? Is that what they're calling the series of destructive tests?

Re:Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

Quit bashing linux!

Childrens laptop?

[BigBuckHunter]

I don't mean to rain on their parade, but how many of these things are actually going to land in the hands of children? Do they really think prople in Libya and Brazil can afford a $100 laptop, regardless of whether it is for their kids or themselves?

BBH

Re:Childrens laptop?

[jimstapleton]

they are supposed to be free, so it's probably government funded. Still, the conecpet is right, how many people will be taking these from the children?

Re:Childrens laptop?

[leuk_he]

libya has oil and is not a real poor country.

"These oil revenues and a small population give Libya one of the highest GDPs per person in Africa"

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

how many of these things are actually going to land in the hands of children?

What's an illiterate third world child going to do with a laptop anyway? A pencil, paper, and some basic schooling might be of more use.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[notthe9]

I think someone decided free laptop was easier than basic schooling.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Lumpy]

What's an illiterate third world child going to do with a laptop anyway?

trade it for food or medicine.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[artson]

"What's an illiterate third world child going to do with a laptop anyway?"

Post on slashdot and pose as a software engineer/rocket scientist.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[spisska]

First: It's not people buying them, it's governments.

Second: Not everyone outside of the US and Europe is starving in a mud hut. Both Libya and Brazil are modern, technical societies with substantial wealth. Both countries would certainly benefit from increased technical skills among their local populations.

Remeber that the OLPC is designed to replace textbooks in schools, and over the life of the machine will almost certainly provide a cost savings over printed books.

In addition, the project will foster local IT development as more and more people learn to use, repair, modify, and program for the machines. This will lead to free and/or locally produced software and a local IT service sector, keeping money in local economies rather than sending it to Redmond or to other Western software houses and consultancies.

From a development perspective, this is a cheap project with enormous potential -- it could eventually bring an even bigger fundamental change in developing societies than micro credit progams have.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[westlake]

libya has oil and is not a real poor country

but that raises the obvious question: csn the really poor countries afford OLPC?

Re:Childrens laptop?

[tomstdenis]

Believe it or not the OLPC people are not COMPLETE FUCKING MORONS

There are lockdown measures to avoid corrupt distribution. A black market wouldn't really work because a stolen OLPC laptop won't work. Not to mention that they're pretty much useless for most other tasks. A geek may want one for the neat factor or for an effective terminal. But you can't exactly play 3d shooters on them, or store gigabytes of movies or whatever (I doubt you could even play a divx on it).

The corrupt market would be to steal the boards and then try to sell them to schools. Which is exactly what they're aiming to stop.

As for the GP, yes, it's COUNTRIES that buy them, not students.

Tom

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Thaelon]

Or have it stolen by an adolescent or adult who will trade it for food, toys, weapons, drugs, sex, or money. Medicine my ass.

Let's be realistic. People are not nice.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[CastrTroy]

So why not have the US Government buy laptops for underprivileged kids? They are in need of computers just as much as people in other countries, if not more, to stay on par with their peers.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

Because that would be communism in the eyes of the average American. Besides, how will the rich get the warm fuzzy feeling from their trickling down wealth if the poor isn't totally wretched?

Re:Childrens laptop?

[glgraca]

The median income in Brazil is circa US$8,000 (PPP), but in the south and southeast, where most of the population is concentrated, it is actually US$10,000 to US$15,000. The problem is that in the Amazon and northeast it is closer to US$2,000. So yes, there are loads of people who can afford it, as there are loads of people currently buying US$500-US$1500 desktops.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[drinkypoo]

That would be a great idea, and I sincerely hope it happens. But it won't. Still, the best outcome would be if everyone in the world had a computer like this (or better if they can afford it) - the ability to communicate alone could change the world.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

May I remind you that Brazil is one of the richest countries in the world?
The problem is distribution, rich south and southeast, really poor northeast and north.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[jimstapleton]

The OLPC people aren't dumb, but you can expect the theives won't be either.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[spisska]

So why not have the US Government buy laptops for underprivileged kids? They are in need of computers just as much as people in other countries, if not more, to stay on par with their peers.

Because the US government doesn't have the authority to procure education materials for local schools. Education and school systems are the responsibility of State governments and local school boards.

There are schools in the US that have begun providing students with laptops, but these were decisions made by individual school administrations.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Incongruity]

one of the highest GDPs per person in Africa I don't mean to sound crass, but that ain't saying much. Moreover, it may be the perfect foothold for this new device and an excellent start to enabling a population to better access information and educational resources. If, as you claim, Lybia is one of the best-off countries in Africa -- the worst off continent in many measures, then here's the simple question: If it can't succeed in the best of the worst environments, then can it succeed anywhere?

Moreover, looking at the CIA's world factbook entry about Lybia, it seems there's a bit more to the story than you present:

Substantial revenues from the energy sector coupled with a small population give Libya one of the highest per capita GDPs in Africa, but little of this income flows down to the lower orders of society.

Looking a bit further, Lybia has a 30% unemployment rate -- that doesn't sound like a real economic success story to me nor does it argue that the large GDP per capita's value is really spread across the population in any sort of even manner.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[MightyYar]

The US is something like 10th in the world in education spending in terms of % of GDP. Because our GDP is so large, that puts us way out in front of anyone else in terms of spending on education. Throwing more money at schools - in the form of laptops or otherwise - will not solve our problems in education.

The rich are probably not as culpable in the plight of our urban poor as the "white flight" middle class. And then you have the equally-wretched rural poor... I'm sure a crappy laptop would solve their ills, too, right?

This laptop is not to help the uneducated. It is to help the educated but poor - the ones without access to computers, but who are educated enough not to sell them for meth. I think that most children of suitable education can find a computer in the US if they need to. If not, then maybe there is a place for a program such as this - but I'd be very skeptical.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[tomstdenis]

The point is to remove the worth.

It's a 300MHz x86 board with a gray-scale display (the colour is faked), 128M of ram, 512M of flash, no cdrom, no advanced GPU, very small keys, and the host OS is designed for small children. Perfect for reading, playing simple learning games, and browsing the web. Sucks for games, videos, music and the like.

I seriously doubt there will be a huge black market for adults to hack them and turn them into a standard Linux PC. Selling them as is to children won't be really productive either. I'm not saying people won't try. I just doubt it will be very successful.

Tom

Re:Childrens laptop?

[necronus]

Well said.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[travisd666]

High GDP per person doesn't imply that the high GDP is actually distributed per person. The wealth of the country is likely controlled by a small group of people, while the rest of the country could be very poor.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Aladrin]

The colour is faked?? Shove me some proof of that. All I see is:

http://www.desktoplinux.com/articles/AT5734583728. html
  Display -- 7.5-inch "dual-mode" 1200 x 900 pixel display

        * Mono display: High-resolution, reflective monochrome mode
        * Color display: Standard-resolution, quincunx-sampled, transmissive color mode

Doesn't sound very 'fake' to me... Just lower resolution.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

First: It's not people buying them, it's governments.

Second: Not everyone outside of the US and Europe is starving in a mud hut. Both Libya and Brazil are modern, technical societies with substantial wealth. Both countries would certainly benefit from increased technical skills among their local populations.

Remeber that the OLPC is designed to replace textbooks in schools, and over the life of the machine will almost certainly provide a cost savings over printed books.

In addition, the project will foster local IT development as more and more people learn to use, repair, modify, and program for the machines. This will lead to free and/or locally produced software and a local IT service sector, keeping money in local economies rather than sending it to Redmond or to other Western software houses and consultancies.

From a development perspective, this is a cheap project with enormous potential -- it could eventually bring an even bigger fundamental change in developing societies than micro credit progams have.

No it won't.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

The point is to remove the worth.

These devices will be stolen and you just have to deal with it when it happens. If they don't have value or worth and aren't worth stealing, then they aren't worth having in the first place. Removing the worth should not be an objective. Police and schools simply need to deal with stealing when it happens. Simply to deprive millions of students of as much functionality as can be squeezed out of the device, simply because we are paranoid about theft would be part of an alarming trend to sacrifice too much for security. The point is not to remove worth, but to make them so inexpensive as to be able to replace them easily.

The point is to separate cost and value, so that people are paying for the cost to manufacture and not the value it will bring to them. That is the difference between the profit motive and non-profit motive. Doing this for profit would mean that worth and value might be disabled to try and up sell to those who have the means.

How long would they last anyway? To expect an average 3 year lifespan seems reasonable, with an upper end of 5 or 6 years. Theft is simply one of the many things that could happen to these devices, along with dropping them, getting them wet and just plain wear and tear. Schools have had to deal with text books for years with many of the same problems.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[CastrTroy]

Who says this has to have anything to do with schools?

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

My, what a well-reasoned, thoughtful argument you present.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

Remeber that the OLPC is designed to replace textbooks in schools, and over the life of the machine will almost certainly provide a cost savings over printed books.

except for the fac that the professors that write textbooks are greedy bastards and will try to find a way to either keep the textbooks from being e form for these devices or add some kind of stupid DRM to time out the books.

Textbook's should only be allowed to have a copyright for 3 years and then forced into the Public domain in all forms.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[Anonymous Coward]

Second: Not everyone outside of the US and Europe is starving in a mud hut.

Look at Canada.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[DragonWriter]

Do they really think prople in Libya and Brazil can afford a $100 laptop, regardless of whether it is for their kids or themselves?

OLPC doesn't sell to individuals.

OLPC sells to government ministries of education. Several nations have already committed to large buys, I think Libya is the only one who has committed to enough to meet the goal of one laptop per schoolchild though, and Libya has apparently also been discussing the possibility of subsidizing purchases for poorer African nations.

Is it, at $100 per recipient, expensive for developing nations? Probably. Those that are willing to spend the money are willing to do so because they see it as an investment in education that will pay off in a combination of savings in other expenses and long-term economic performance.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[DragonWriter]

High GDP per person doesn't imply that the high GDP is actually distributed per person.

So? How the GDP is distributed would only matter to affordability if these were being sold to individuals. But they aren't, they are being sold to government ministries of education, who then distribute them free of charge to individuals.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[tomstdenis]

The colour is faked and isn't as crisp as a good LCD or CRT. it's good enough to entertain children but is definitely not something you wan't to work on if you have to look at pixels.

The mono mode is much better and made to make looking at text a pleasurable experience :-)

Tom

Re:Childrens laptop?

[DragonWriter]

I think someone decided free laptop was easier than basic schooling.

I think its rather clear that "someone" (i.e., the ministries of education that provide basic schooling in the countries that have elected to participated) decided that buying laptops was a useful and productive way to improve the provision of basic schooling.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[tomstdenis]

The goal is to make them very single purposed. That doesn't mean what it does has to be crappy just that it can't do a lot of things very well for cost and safety.

I wouldn't take "theft" as a light issue though. When these things get stolen in the field, it's usually because the person delivering them HAS BEEN MURDERED and the delivery looted. So making them "feature deprived" isn't just a function of being cheap.

Remember the idea is to bring information and interactiveness to children. I remember playing games on an Apple ][ when I was a kid. This thing definitely packs more punch than that. Sure it's not a multimedia godsend that we're used to, but if us 1st world kids can use a 6502 with a monochrome low res monitor, I think some 3rd world kid can make use of a 350MHz x86 processor and a high-res wide screen display...

Tom

Re:Childrens laptop?

[nathan s]

A screenshot of the fake color.

Looks pretty real to me. Perhaps you can clarify what you mean by 'faked'.

Re:Childrens laptop?

[tomstdenis]

It's not a traditional LCD. The colour elements, as I was explained by an OLPC staffer (hint: I'm writing their BIOS security code...), are not stacked, and that you didn't have three elements per pixel. The filtering is REQUIRED to make it look aesthetically pleasing.

I imagine if we had close ups of the REAL screen and not the simulator you'd see what I'm talking about.

Tom

Re:Childrens laptop?

[danpsmith]

"These oil revenues and a small population give Libya one of the highest GDPs per person in Africa"

One of the highest GDPs per person in Africa, isn't that like saying one of the coolest people on slashdot?

Re:Childrens laptop?

[break99]

Exactly, One Laptop Per Scammer

Re:Childrens laptop?

[evilviper]

So why not have the US Government buy laptops for underprivileged kids?

Because of school computer labs, libraries with internet access, etc. Even the poorest schools are able to afford textbooks for all their students (even if somewhat outdated) which is the main function of OLPC. And telephone coverage in the US is nearly total, eliminating the need for the wifi capabilities of OLPC.

Get over it, it wasn't designed for the 1st world.

It's worth noting...

[Otter]

Not that this project had any lack of vapor already, but it's worth noting that the Thai government that vaguely signed on to this project over the summer was overthrown in a military coup a few weeks later. We'll see how high a priority this is for the new guy.

Those of you who were hailing Khaddafi's deep commitment to freedom when he jumped aboard will be relieved to know that he's not going anywhere anytime soon, though...

Re:It's worth noting...

[Anonymous Coward]

the Thai government that vaguely signed on to this project over the summer was overthrown in a military coup a few weeks later.

OMG! I knew Microsoft were bad, but I didn't think they'd stoop so low as to overthrow a government to stop adoption of Linux!

Re:It's worth noting...

[wishmechaos]

I live in Argentina and I haven't heard a thing about the government buying a any OLPCs. At $100 a piece, you'd think the government would announce if it was going to spend a hundred millon dollars! But not a single mention in the papers, nada.

Re:It's worth noting...

[ccp]

I live in Argentina and I haven't heard a thing about the government buying any OLPCs.

Ditto. So my question is, does anybody have any insight about the real motives for the weird distribution scheme? The one million minimum order? And from governments?

Because if it is economy of scale it just doesn't make sense.
I'd bet that if they sold them for say, $250, they'd be selling one million every month. I myself would buy four on the spot. They are made-for-order for the business we're in.
And, since the cost is about $130, they could give one away for each one sold.

So, why aren't they doing the obvious thing? Any thoughts?

Cheers,
CC

But can it feed them?

[InsaneProcessor]

They have no food, no safe drinking water, no clean clothes, no medicine when they are sick, but they have the laptop computer which they cannot use for anything of value!

Keep up the good work. You too can have a project doomed to failure.

Re:But can it feed them?

[lokiomega]

You forgot no electricity. So they can't even use the laptop.

Re:But can it feed them?

[Shawn is an Asshole]

They have no food, no safe drinking water, no clean clothes, no medicine when they are sick, but they have the laptop computer which they cannot use for anything of value!

They can use the laptop for porn.

Re:But can it feed them?

[Opportunist]

The exit from poverty is education. Give a man a fish and he'll have food for a day. Teach him how to fish and he'll ruin your fishing economy.

Or something like that.

Re:But can it feed them?

[Timesprout]

The battery can be charged with a hand crank.

Re:But can it feed them?

[sanmarcos]

The OLPC will do good in countries like Argentina, Chile, where the GDP per capita are the highest in Latin America (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_America#Econom y). It actually makes sense for the project to be deployed widely in remote rural areas of such nations (Chile and Argentina already deploy computing centers in all schools in urban areas).

As far as other even less developed countries with actual armed/religious conflict, I see the OLPC being put into bad use (i.e trading), and never even reaching the children. Even if they do reach the children, what use is it to them when they have little food, or they are dying from some curable disease?.

Re:But can it feed them?

[DdJ]

Give a man a fish...

My favorite variation on this:

"Build a man a fire, and you'll keep him warm for one night. Set a man on fire, and you'll keep him warm for the rest of his life!"

Re:But can it feed them?

[Hoplite3]

I think corruption is a bigger problem. Without good governance, change is hard. How soon until one laptop per child becomes one warlord with all the laptops? He'll have to let some children use them (such is the nature of feudalism), but I can't see it being otherwise. Laptops aren't the same as education, anyway. It sounds like silicon snake-oil to me.

I should also say that the corruption is hardly just some internal matter for various African states. These leaders are aided and abbedded by rich nations across the world. Foreign meddling in the affairs of Africa has been intense and ongoing, but no one wants to talk about how they secure their oil rights, fishing rights, the use of their GM crops over local varieties, and so on. It's unpleasant.

Africa needs clean government to have a chance as much as it needs clean water. I can't see the laptop as part of the solution. You could argue that laptops make education easier, and that education drives economic growth. However, the prime examples of that (Japan, Korea, Singapore) all had stable governments and some measure of physical safety for citizens. In the absence of these things, what will stop the newly educated adults from leaving for the US, the EU, India, or China?

Re:But can it feed them?

[ajs318]

Or, if Microsoft had their way, teach a man to fish and you can sell him expensive, proprietary bait for life .....

Re:But can it feed them?

[carpeweb]

Mod parent up.

Also, no one seems to want to talk about the non-manufacturing costs of OLPC, either. Assuming you find a non-corrupt government as a participant, it seems to me that the entire distribution cost is being foisted on that government. I don't think that's trivial. What about training? I haven't been a big fan of the TCO school of thought, but that's because in the (US) corporate world, I've seen it used mainly as a justification of bigger IT budgets. But in this case, I think we do need to factor in lots of things that will make the cost much higher than $100.

Re:But can it feed them?

[DragonWriter]

As far as other even less developed countries with actual armed/religious conflict, I see the OLPC being put into bad use

Which of the countries that is involved in the project fits this description?

Re:But can it feed them?

[DragonWriter]

I think corruption is a bigger problem. Without good governance, change is hard. How soon until one laptop per child becomes one warlord with all the laptops?

Probably until, e.g., Brazil goes through a radical collapse and turns into Somalia.

Laptops aren't the same as education, anyway.

No one said they are. They are a tool for education, nothing more. OLPC doesn't pretend that laptops replace education, they suggest that investing in the laptops and associated infrastructure (like the satellite downlink station being developed specifically for rural villages to provide network access; free satellite time is also being donated) will be a cost effective investment in tools to improve the quality of education and the ability to deliver educational materials.

Africa needs clean government to have a chance as much as it needs clean water. I can't see the laptop as part of the solution.

I can't imagine many more powerful parts of the solution to bad government than a distributed medium for information sharing and storage that is widely distributed in the population.

You could argue that laptops make education easier, and that education drives economic growth.

You could, and you'd be right, but the laptops have the potential to affect bad government other than through economic development.

In the absence of these things, what will stop the newly educated adults from leaving for the US, the EU, India, or China?

The immigration policies of the target countries, for one thing; the fact that many of the OLPC countries already are offer as good or better economic opportunities for educated natives than they would have in India or China is also a factor, though.

Re:But can it feed them?

[the Gray Mouser]

I thought they ditched the hand crank?

Re:But can it feed them?

[Teancum]

Forget about the warlord who confiscates the laptops. How about the Education Minister's brother Abdul who decides to "accidentally" drop these computers into a shipping container headed for Amsterdam instead?

The corruption will start at the top, and there is no legal means to prevent these computers from being resold in 1st world countries. The only way to stop that sort of behaivor is to flood the world market so shipping them to 1st world countries will cost more than you can possibly sell them at. Even then minor corruption will still occur, but at least some of these education ministers will get these computers where they were supposed to go in the first place: the hands of kids eager to learn about the world.

Re:But can it feed them?

[charlie763]

Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Give a man the ability to communicate beyond his local community and access the sum of all human knowledge (the internet) and you see him do far more interesting things than catch fish.

Re:But can it feed them?

[azimir]

According to quite a few sources, although their Wiki sums it up well:
http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_myths#The_laptop_wi ll_be_really_clunky_with_a_hand_crank_on_the_side

The hand crank was there in early prototypes but the actual shipping units will use an off-board human-power system, connected to the power brick. Candidates include a foot-pedal charger similar to the Freecharge portable charger.

The crank was found to be both too fragile and too energy wasting. It has been replaced by a yoyo kind of system that is designed be used by pulling and a third party is working with a foot pedal kind of system.

black market

[__aajqwr7439]

Am I evil for looking forward to picking up my OLPC on the black market (or eBay)?

If I am, I blame the hand crank and high-res black-and-white screen mode for greasing my slide into the dark side...

DN

Re:black market

[notthe9]

Last I heard, rich, 1st-world type folks are supposed to be able to buy them for $200.

Re:black market

[chrismcdirty]

Last I heard, I thought it was $300, as in "buy one for yourself, buy two for children." But it's also proven to be more than $100 to make, so if the deal is still on, that price may go up.

Re:black market

[UbuntuDupe]

I hope this poster is right, that they market this to non-third-worlders at x2 or x3 of the price to cover a donation of one or two of them to a participating country. Get a cheap, versatile, low-power-consumption computer, and change a few kids lives forever. Sign me up! (And I'm on the more misanthropic side...)

Re:black market

[risk one]

Sorry to disappoint you, Anakin, but they ditched the handcrank about a year ago. The plastic body of the laptop couldn't take the repeated stress. It does have cute bunny-like wifi ears.

And there are plans to sell them commercially for three times the regular price, and pump the profit back into the charity program, so you won't have to buy the thing in eBay for $1000.

Re:black market

[__aajqwr7439]

Found this in the OLPCWiki:

Will OLPC spin-off a commercial subsidiary?
The idea is that a commercial subsidiary could manufacture and sell a variation of the OLPC in the developed world. These units would be marked up so that there would be a significant profit which can be plowed into providing more units in countries who cannot afford the full cost of one million machines.
The discussions around this have talked about a retail price of 3× the cost price of the units.

http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Our_market

Nice to know I'd be thinking of the children rather that stealing their laptops...

DN

Re:black market

[Half-pint HAL]

And there are plans to sell them commercially for three times the regular price, and pump the profit back into the charity program, so you won't have to buy the thing in eBay for $1000.

Wrong. There are no plans to sell these on the open market in any way whatsoever. Many people have suggested a one-for-two or one-for-three, but the people behind the project have consistently stated that this will not happen.

I'd like to get my hands on one, as I believe that as a low-power entry-level laptop it should form a worldwide developer's baseline, but I won't get my hands on one and I respect the reasons for that decision. I'm sure some hacker will make an emulator as a developer's kit soon enough anyway.

HAL.

Re:black market

[Vellmont]

Many people have suggested a one-for-two or one-for-three, but the people behind the project have consistently stated that this will not happen.

If that's true, it's the first dumb decision I've heard come out of this project. Bill Gates stated that the major cost of the laptop would be software. In the absence of open source developers, he's right. There's some ability to take software for existing high-lowered linux machines, but it certainly won't be as good without developers being able to run it on the actual machine.

Re:black market

[Half-pint HAL]

There's some ability to take software for existing high-lowered linux machines, but it certainly won't be as good without developers being able to run it on the actual machine.

A) How much software do they need?

B) Part of the point of the project is to create a new technologically-literate generation. If we write all the software for them, what incentive is there for them to build up their own coding skills?

C) The developed world is acculturated to a particular tradition of code and interface design which is -- at best -- suboptimal. If we write apps for them, they will come from that same tradition and we will acculturate them to our suboptimal model. If instead they develop their own computing tradition, we may see a newer, more efficient computing paradigm emerge from which we will all benefit. (Except perhaps large incumbent software providers -- you know who you are!)

HAL.

Re:black market

[Anonymous Coward]

Wrong.(Don't ya hate it when people correct you this way!)

From http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Our_market

Will OLPC spin-off a commercial subsidiary?

The idea is that a commercial subsidiary could manufacture and sell a variation of the OLPC in the developed world. These units would be marked up so that there would be a significant profit which can be plowed into providing more units in countries who cannot afford the full cost of one million machines.

The discussions around this have talked about a retail price of 3× the cost price of the units.

Re:black market

[carpeweb]

Even if there were plans to sell these commercially, the non-manufacturing costs (see my post, above) would probably require a much greater markup. Right now, they are "selling" them to single buyers in quantities of a million or more. Think about how much higher the per-unit costs will be for marketing and distribution if they sell them one at a time. Even ebay doesn't have zero selling costs, and ebay doesn't usually include free shipping.

Re:black market

[notthe9]

That sounds right; thanks for the correction. Point is, there are intended to be ways for people other than children in developing countries to get these through approved means.

Re:black market

[Vellmont]

A) How much software do they need?

I don't know how much they need, or even what that question really means (software isn't like apples where it's all the same and you order it by the pound). My guess is there's going to be requests for software to do Thing X, or if only Program Z had feature Y. That's no different than how people use software right now.

B) Part of the point of the project is to create a new technologically-literate generation. If we write all the software for them, what incentive is there for them to build up their own coding skills?

Simply a false premise. What incentive has there been in the past for programmers of a younger generation, since presumably the old generation has written all the software that the young generation wants? The idea that we shouldn't create software for other people because they won't want to make software for themselves makes about as much sense as saying that we shouldn't invent anything because it'll remove the incentive for other people to invent things. The need for software increases with the creation of new software, not decreases.

I also kind of doubt that this machine will have all the libraries needed for a development environment to produce new applications for this machine. Flash space costs money, and the budget for this thing is quite low. Maybe someone can create a development environment for it that'll fit on the flash, (but have more limited resourced). but wait.. that might require developers to actually have access to the laptop.

C) The developed world is acculturated to a particular tradition of code and interface design which is -- at best -- suboptimal. If we write apps for them, they will come from that same tradition and we will acculturate them to our suboptimal model.

If you truly believe that the software development world is poisoned, then I'd suggest learning from our mistakes rather than letting someone else start over from scratch and either make the same mistakes over, make the same mistakes we've already learned to not make, or make entirely different mistakes. Experience is always going to be better than no experience (all things being equal).

Re:black market

[Teancum]

BTW, the petition to purchase the laptop for $300 failed to get enough signatures, but there was a pretty large (> 15000 signatures) support base for the idea. And that was for people who were willing to make a stand on an insignificant and poorly advertised web page for something that may not even happen even if all the signatures came in that were needed.

The OLPC organizers have said that they will not sell this computer to private individuals. The $300 figure is just a number pulled out of the air and has no basis for reality.

Re:black market

[ccp]

Think about how much higher the per-unit costs will be for marketing and distribution if they sell them one at a time.

Let me guess...Near zero?

Put a web site, process credit cards, and I will gladly pay for shipping, and even throw a fiver for the tip.
And, if it's not enough and you want to make some extra change sell them for $200. At that price point, who cares?

Cheers,
CC

Re:black market

[carpeweb]

I will gladly pay for shipping

I wasn't asking who would pay; I was asking how much it would cost. My original point was that the governments who are buying these appear to be footing most or all of the costs except for direct manufacturing, hiding the obvious fact that the true cost of the OLPC is far higher than $100. I realize that some costs can be driven down on a per-unit basis with high volume, but even that can't eliminate shipping, customer support and other things that happen on a per-customer basis. Even if you personally only need shipping, the average customer needs a certain amount of marketing and after-market support, which is still part of the average cost.

Taking a SWAG at it, I'd say the true cost of the OLPC (delivered to the customer) is closer to $200 than it is to $100. That would mean a price of $300 to $400 to "rich" customers in order to subsidize the rest of the world (previous posts in this thread). At anywhere near that point, I'd just buy a Dell.

Re:black market

[ccp]

I realize that some costs can be driven down on a per-unit basis with high volume, but even that can't eliminate shipping, customer support and other things that happen on a per-customer basis. Even if you personally only need shipping, the average customer needs a certain amount of marketing and after-market support, which is still part of the average cost.

Well, let's put it this way: if the OLPC is willing to sell me 1K laptops at $100 every month, I'm buying them. I can sell that number with almost no overhead at $200/220. No sweat. And no marketing, just a web site. And no support, just a FAQ. At that price, nobody expects hand-holding. These babies will sell themselves.
I'm guessing earning about $30 net each, before taxes. Of course in your country things may be different.

Cheers,
CC

My Prediction for 2007

[ReidMaynard]

At least one terrorist video will reveal a OLPC in the background.

Re:My Prediction for 2007

[Anonymous Coward]

...and Evil Bert will be typing on it.

Again, Linux uses its monopoly position...

[Anonymous Coward]

Again, Linux uses its monopoly position in the free-OS market to stomp on Corporate America. Companies such as Microsoft cannot compete with the hippy OS because they have employees to pay, hardware to buy, and general overhead that any company has and cannot compete with Linux which is put together in a COMMUNIST style by a bunch of long-haired (Alex, RMS) free-thinkers.
This monopoly position must be dealt with to level the playing field so that American companies (not the Finnish) can pass more of their profits on to people like you and I who hold shares in their retirement portfolios.

TDz.

Re:Again, Linux uses its monopoly position...

[Anonymous Coward]

...and what is more important is:
Once the corporate profits trickle down to you & I (the little guy), we will be so overwhelmed with cash that we will give MORE money to the poor countries.
So it's a win-win situation. We (the people) must begin lobbying immediately to rid the world of this Finnish GNU/Linux monopoloy and allow market capitalism to flourish much like plants in the garden flourish once we get rid of the weeds.

Re:Again, Linux uses its monopoly position...

[CastrTroy]

Monopoly in the free OS business? I know you're trying to be funny, but have you forgotten about BSD?

Re:Again, Linux uses its monopoly position...

[rsborg]

Again, Linux uses its monopoly position in the free-OS market to stomp on Corporate America. Companies such as Microsoft cannot compete with the hippy OS because they have employees to pay, hardware to buy, and general overhead that any company has and cannot compete with Linux which is put together in a COMMUNIST style by a bunch of long-haired (Alex, RMS) free-thinkers.

LOL, I just imagined Stephen Colbert doing that monologue on his show. Nice :-)

Re:Again, Linux uses its monopoly position...

[the arbiter]

What is this "BSD" that you speak of? I suspect you're just making stuff up, trying to be funny. I've never heard of "BSD", and I'll bet no one else here has either.

Re:Again, Linux uses its monopoly position...

[kripkenstein]

Companies such as Microsoft cannot compete with the hippy OS

Damn it, Linux might be a lot of things, but it isn't fat.

Testing... Ooh Ooh Aah Ah !

[Anonymous Coward]

Destructive testing, eh?

Cue the samsonite throwing gorilla. http://www.frankwbaker.com/25grea14.jpg

http://www.packinglight.net/plight/assets/assets/i mages/AmeriILiteGorilla.jpg

Yay sweatshops!

[Anonymous Coward]

Congratulations to China for winning the bid on "one laptop per child.. per hour.. or they won't get their weekly three cents or a space on the filthy blanket" project.

Re:Yay sweatshops!

[Rob T Firefly]

Actually this is interesting.. do we know anything about the Chinese factory that's making these things? It'd be supremely ironic if we were bringing laptops to poor hopeless children that were made by other poor hopeless children, or something.

Re:Yay sweatshops!

[Zomad]

Quanta is a Taiwan company.

Re:Yay sweatshops!

[amerinese]

Yes, and not only that, but that Taiwan is NOT China is really important to its 23 million citizens. Taiwan is a democracy that has its own armies, controls its own borders, directly elects its own president, legislature... Sure, there are some reasons, unrelated to the fact that China constantly blares that it owns Taiwan and will p8wn Taiwan if Taiwan or anyone else says otherwise, but they are not good ones, and if there was ever a good guy--bad guy David vs. Goliath if you ever saw one situation, Taiwan is it. So please. Taiwan is NOT China. Quanta is a Taiwanese company that may happen to do a lot of business in China. Still, it is not the same thing and it's an important distinction to make.

Re:Yay sweatshops!

[pembo13]

Why? Poor people should not be given jobs?

What is OLPC.

[Anonymous Coward]

STOP THINKING THAT WE ALL KNOW WHAT EVERY STINKING ACRYNYM IS!

Lameness filter encountered. Post aborted!
Reason: Don't use so many caps. It's like YELLING.

Well it is because I want to Yell!!

Re:What is OLPC.

[Anonymous Coward]

Also stop thinking I all can spell acrynym.

My Prediction for 2008

[Opportunist]

Certain computer companies using this as an excuse to push a law through congress that outlaws the distribution of OLPC computers and declares countries that participate in the OLPC project as terrorist states.

One laptop per child test plan

[davidwr]

1) give computer to child
2) come back in a week

If computer survives AND the kid didn't get bored with it, the test passes.

---
It's lame but laugh anyways.

worse than that

[Anonymous Coward]

At least one terrorist video will reveal a OLPC in the background.

CPUs used to be under export restrictions so they would not be used as munitions.
Someone's probably already got design plans to use one of these with a cheap SiRF chip for GPS and various other things, to blow people up.
If they can't get GPS they'll get Galileo. If they can't get Galileo, they'll get whatever the Chinese are cooking up.
Think of it, an open-source, ruggedized platform for terrorism, which aid organizations may even subsidize to deliver into their hands.
I'm looking at you, Libya.

Re:worse than that

[meadowsp]

So perhaps you should go hide under your bed and pray to big daddy bush to keep you safe.

Nigeria!!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Just what the internet needs. Another million Nigerians with computers and $5M dollars waiting to be transferred out of the country as soon as they have my bank account details.

Re:Nigeria!!!

[the arbiter]

You got TR'ed for that, and I'd make an argument that you shouldn't have been, becuase it's friggin' true. It's gonna be real interesting what happens when the Third World hits the interweb en masse.

Re:Nigeria!!!

[carpeweb]

I agree; where's the love, man?

Seems like putting the cart before the horse to me

[LWATCDR]

What about the software stack?
The software could be developed and tested using conventional computers without the expense of building these laptops.
What I fear is that these laptops will be underpowered for the software stack. Just seems kind of silly to not have a good low resource software stack done before spending the money on the hardware.

Let them have computers!

[Anonymous Coward]

The problems in these countries are many, but few of them are computer related. Having been to many war torn 3rd world nations I can tell you that having computers is the least of their worries. To those of you that think this is a good idea, all I have to say is that a similarly out of touch rich person once said, "Let them eat cake!"

Evilman

ok, I'm biting... about this illiteracy...

[CptnHarlock]

So you have been to a lot of third world countries? Oh, you haven't? Every time this project is mentioned experts of your caliber start spewing their 0.02$ around. Interestingly, that's approximately how much those expert views are worth. Combined.

I've been to a few third world countries. One of them is Thailand (they are among the ones interested in the OLPC). I bet you'll see more poverty and illiteracy in New York than i Bangkok. Can you please get it through your brick wall that _any_ countrys population is not homogenous? Some people may have no use of a OLPC laptop while others will. Just as in the west. Another country i've visited where I stayed with the locals is Gambia. It's a pretty poor country but most of the young ones I met spoke 3-5 languages.Virtually everyone spoke English and French, then their tribal language and one or more of the other bigger tribal languages. How many languages do you speak? How many can you write?

Poverty != stupidity. Poor country != everyone being hungry and illiterate. People in poor countries are often much more motivated to study because they know it's a way out of poverty.

Hmmm... Why do I bother feeding trolls.... :| .. I dunno... But at least I'm also doing something instead of just complaining. I've left one laptop in Gambia and one in Chile before. I'll be on a round the world trip in about a month and a half (hopefully) and I'm packing lots of older laptops to give away. Guess what kind of OS they'll be running. That's my OLPC(ountry ;P).

Cheers...

Re:ok, I'm biting... about this illiteracy...

[c_forq]

you'll see more poverty and illiteracy in New York than i[n] Bangkok.

Your problem is the use of Bangkok. I too have been to Thailand, and if you make the trip out to Surat Thani, Chumphon, or Ayutthaya you would learn that Bangkok is not typical of Thailand, and the people in Bangkok live far different lives then those in the country. When you were in the area you should also have visited Laos, and get away from the capital province of Viangchan (Vientiane) and the tourist village of Louang Prabang, and check out the one room school shacks in the villages. If you go to the countryside you don't find the people motivated to study as you say, you may find some that want to go to the capital city and work, but most are fine working at and eventually taking over the family rice field/fishery/cotton looms. The large cities are a whole different world, and in the cities you get the people motivated to get an education and buy a BMW.

Re:ok, I'm biting... about this illiteracy...

[spisska]

Hear, hear.

Some figures:
Country, literacy rate in percent (world ranking)

Kazakhstan, 99.5 (29)
Ukraine, 99.4 (32)
Tonga, 98.9 (36)
Mongolia, 97.8 (47)
Argentina, 97.2 (53)
United States, 97 (55)
Thailand, 92.6 (72)
Zimbabwe, 90 (85)
Brazil, 88.4 (90)
Namibia, 85 (103)
Libya, 81.7 (111)

Source
Discussion of Source accuracy
UNDP Human Development Index Report, 2005 [pdf]

Re:ok, I'm biting... about this illiteracy...

[CptnHarlock]

Your problem is the use of Bangkok. I too have been to Thailand, and if you make the trip out to Surat Thani, Chumphon, or Ayutthaya you would learn that Bangkok is not typical of Thailand, and the people in Bangkok live far different lives then those in the country.

I was actually in Surat Thani also, remided me of Bulgaria.. :) .. And also to Chiang Mai where my brother lives. And me using Bangkok as an example was to show exactly that you can't take a single person/area/town to represent an entire country. Did you miss this: [snip] _any_ countrys population is not homogenous? Some people may have no use of a OLPC laptop while others will. [snip]? It seems to me that we kind of agree.. Still waiting for gp to answer... not holding my breath though..

Cheers...

Re:ok, I'm biting... about this illiteracy...

[tolan-b]

Well I'm glad you responded to the trolls personally. It's refreshing to see this common fallacy put down.

Re:ok, I'm biting... about this illiteracy...

[kfg]

And for Americans who want a taste of the third world without "leaving home," there's always Arkansas. Kinda reminds me of Mississippi.

KFG

Re:ok, I'm biting... about this illiteracy...

[Anonymous Coward]

Country, literacy rate in percent (world ranking)

Kazakhstan, 99.5 (29)

that is lie , make by kazakhstan ministry of information

in Kazkastan ,women not allowed to read books . but literacy rate high for men and donkeys .

i send to spread good information abot kazaksatn .

- borat

(PS i like sex. wawaweewa!)

Do they work?

[NineNine]

Prototypes are nice... but do they actually work? I'm very skeptical that this thing can be produced at this price. I'll believe it when a factory is cranking out a few thousand a day, AND THEY WORK. Until then, it's nothing but vapor and PR.

Translation:

[jfz]

"Let's hope that these first prototypes do not warrant any design changes and that the testing goes well so that countries that expressed interest (Brazil, Libya, Nigeria, Argentina, and Thailand) can start distributing them soon." Translation: Lets hope that these units are flawless(which hardly ever happens) and are swiftly distributed to a reputable re-seller on ebay so I can get my hands on one.

Re:Seems like putting the cart before the horse to

[Anonymous Coward]

Enough already with the "software stack". Why the fuck is software
on a laptop "stacked". Admit it, you heard some random geek say it
and it sounded really cool, Eh? Eh?

Destructive testing?

[Grendel Drago]

Destructive testing? DESTRUCTIVE TESTING? WOOOO!!!

Lameness filter encountered. Post aborted!
Reason: Don't use so many caps. It's like YELLING.

Re:Seems like putting the cart before the horse to

[Anonymous Coward]

Uh, get the software images from http://olpc.download.redhat.com/olpc/streams/devel opment/. They are developed on modern hardware. You can run the images from a livecd, a usb memory card or qemu on a host system but the best test would be on the hardware itself. There is need to optimize and make sure the correct drivers get loaded and that the drivers work. You don't just put software on any old hardware platform and it just works. A lot of engineering goes into it.

Re:Seems like putting the cart before the horse to

[B1LL_GAT3Z]

Just to clarify (I'm a developer working for the OLPC) that we've had developer boards for months-and-months now, using them to test the software on. These particular computers are simply more complete. But yeah, speed has been a major factor all along.

Reply: Childrens' laptop, food, shelter ...?

[OldHawk777]

Sometimes, some folks on /. are as clueless as a Washington DC politician. Well UFI "Do they really think" that you should not feed 1,000 hungry people because someone will steal the food, or there is not enough to feed the 10,000 hungry in need, or ... more (politician type) excesses for not doing what should and needs to be done AFAP (As Fast As Possible). "RC:" Do it they will Benefit, only the afraid bray like jackasses with nay!

Something great is being done by damn good [AKA: Right Stuff ... Best of Best] people in humanity. The US, EU, UN and most other governments have had their heads up their ass with special interest (plutocrats, dictators, corporatist, religious ...) politics. Yale, Harvard, Princeton, Berkley, CalTech, Georgia Tech ... and many EU universities are not failures, but they appear to be disgracefully lacking in ... "What have y'all done for humanity today" policy/agenda.

I do not know what MIT feeds professors and students up in Massachusetts USA, but I wish all our politicians were raised on bellyfuls of that MIT stuff. Rick Stallman, Nick Negroponte, Phill Zimmerman ... and many others are doing wonderful things for humanity and US with little recognition and no significant support from any of the US, EU, UN ... Butt-Head leaders.

Efforts like the ones (FSF/GPL, OLPC, PGP/PKI ... OKI/OCW ...) from MIT are supported more by philanthropy and individual donations then corporations and governments. Well again the people of the world are proving themselves far superior to the white-color-trash dejure/fiat leaders of today. USA democrats and republican politicians are still unaware that it ain't all about the gucken war, USA Citizens (except the mostly illiterate) are not that superficial.

I did not use Linus Torvalds and Linux above, because I was using MIT for my rant. NOTE Though: Linus Torvalds, Linux, and the whole global OSS community including money/property donors/contributors is proof that MIT does not stand alone is providing to humanity many things that are greatly needed in all parts of our global community.

The USA & International organizations and leaders (Nobel Prizes, Papal Blessings, Presidential Medals ...) should annually award significant recognition to many folks and organizations that truly serve the public good. Governments should fund (not control) Open Projects at all levels (OSS, GPL, Open Content, Open Standards+Research+Development+IPR+Government+.... We need to financially support all these things for long-term survival, development, and for human ideals, honor, and ethics.

Re:Bender sez

[Lord Bitman]

That's not Ironic! It's just mean!

Human Development Index

[genooma]

Every time a OLPC history is published on slashdot we get a a series of "omg! people outside the US or EU live in mud huts and do nothing but starve all day long!!!11" comments.

I will simply point you to the human development index map: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:HDImap2006.png

Notice how the only country of the list of buyers (if you can locate them in the map, that is) under YELLOW is Nigeria.
And how Argentina is actually in GREEN.
That will be all, thank you.

Re:Human Development Index

[genooma]

Here is another, more detailed map: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:HDImap_current. png

But a computer

[everphilski]

...provides neither stick nor fishing line. Seriously. A good almanack could have provided the educational content of the $150 computer for $5 or less.

Built in China, bought by Brazil and India

[monkeyboythom]

So are they going to outsource their IT and helpdesk support to that 3rd world country, the US?

Phase 1 complete then

[dgym]

All you have to do for phase 2 is kill all but 10 children.

mod parent up ffs

[Anonymous Coward]

most interesting post in thread.

Re:Seems like putting the cart before the horse to

[LWATCDR]

I looked at the software available.
Where are the educational programs?
I see nothing that teaches reading or basic math skills?
Squeak/EToys is nice but I saw no traditional educational programs. I have to love the idea of giving kid VIM. That will help kids. They will all want to be farmers after that.
You could deliver content from the web but who will develop it? Does the Sugar browser support rich Internet sites like Google maps and yahoo maps?

Honestly I would love to see more educational software for Linux. Where is the School management package for the OLPC? You know the one for the teachers and school administrators?
Where is the authoring software for the teachers so they can design lessons for the OLPC?

I think what is missing from the project is teachers.
Has anyone tried to bring in some elementary and secondary educators and ask them what they would want from the OLPC?
I am afraid that the OLPC is at the "If you build it they will come" stage.
The OLPC is missing authoring tools for teachers. Something that will let them build lesson plans that the Children can then download onto the OLPC.

Imagine if a child could study any subject they wanted for at least part of the day using the OLPC. They could pick a class and download the textbook and class material for any subject that interests them.
The key here is teachers and the supporting software. VIM will not cut it.

computers vs. books

[norminator]

A good almanack could have provided the educational content of the $150 computer for $5 or less.

That's a good point... I'm sure all the people in the world working with poverty-stricken third-world nations have never thought about providing books!

Sarcasm aside, $5 books aren't known for being chock full of useful information, reliable information, or a wide variety of information. Also, once a book is printed, the content can't be changed, updated, or corrected.

The OLPC program is intended to provide an alternative to schoolbooks. Schoolbooks are expensive, heavy, and are quickly outdated. The OLPC program has a potentially better solution. The networking features can provide access to new information, local, regional, and world news. They also provide a means of communication between students and between students and teachers. All of these things can be very useful for an education in non-computer topics, but students who want to learn about computers will automatically have a computer in their hands to learn about programming, IT, and other computer related topics.

If you want to help solve world problems, bring good ideas to the table, not disparaging remarks.

how many books fit in a gig?

[openright]

As a gig of flash is pretty cheap, one of the big uses of this should be to bring libraries of information to people at no cost.

There is much information on math, medicine, science, computer science that is 'available for free', 'open source', or 'creative commons' that could be freely included in such "personal libraries".

"Third world" inside the USA

[feranick]

Being in several grades school around the country (and not in rich areas), I realized that there are plenty of "third world" type of realities in middle America. Underfunded schools, unmotivated students in depressed areas, many of them with huge literacy problems (reading deficiencies). From experience I can tell that what those kids need is motivation, something that they can get excited. So, why not deploying the OLPC in these communities/schools? It seems that people here are talking of the US as a very homogeneous country. They are not. Very poor areas exist, and kids there are no different (unfortunately) with their pairs in Brazil.

Re:"Third world" inside the USA

[Anonymous Coward]

"Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney has submitted a bill to the legislature to deliver $100 laptops to all children in the state." -- Wikipedia

So at least one state is thinking about it. I think it would be pretty hard to implement on a national level in the U.S.

Re:"Third world" inside the USA

[Teancum]

Considering that Massachusetts Governor Mit Romney has explicitly requested to purchase these computers for use by inner-city youth of Boston as well as for other lower-income families and school districts of Massachusetts, I don't see how anybody else could have much more pull to try and get them sold within America.

Of your sentiment in general, I think you are completely correct that they ought to be sold within the USA. And there is no logical reason other than an attempt by the parts suppliers of the OLPC to segrigate the world markets. Time will only tell when these things start to be sold on eBay or other on-line auction sites, much less a major "grey market" penetration by Chinese companies... even other companies who see the actual product and are willing to make knock-offs for about the same price.

The real question is if the OLPC organizers will take advantage of the demand in 1st world countries, or if they will ignore it and lose a valuable source of support and perhaps even funding to help subsidize significant efforts in 3rd world countries.

BTW, re: Brazil

I spent some time living there (mainly in Sao Paulo) and while the "middle class" of Brazil certainly are not hurting economically to the extent of say Ethiopia or Sudan, what is considered middle class in Brazil would be considered poverty conditions in the USA. The poor of the poor in Brazil are truly destitute and litterally struggle day to day to even get basic needs like clothing and food. The migrants from the Brazilian northeast to the industrial south live in slums that are simply beyond belief of people who have never left the geographical boundaries of the USA. Such living conditions simply do not exist within the USA.

I did missionary work within those slums, and there are some people who really are trying to get out of those conditions, but it is a major struggle that is often thwarted even by government regulations and corruption. The one thing I remember the most is the smell of raw sewage that seemed to penetrate everything in those neighborhoods, as the smell of sewage even today brings back memories of the work I did there.

I've also spent time with homeless people of urban America, and frankly they don't hold a candle to the problems in 3rd world countries. Oh, there are unfortunate circumstances and accidents that would make your heart bleed with sympathy, but a bright and resourceful homeless person in America doesn't need to stay homeless for that long. And there are plenty of social safty nets to help out if you are willing to take advantage of them.

Re:"Third world" inside the USA

[feranick]

Interesting considerations. However when I mentioned the conditions in some parts of the US, I was not referring to the "homeless". I was talking about thousands of kids which do not have access to an education which is expected in a civilized country. Proper science and language labs, small classes, prepared teachers. I am talking about schools where social science teachers are forced to teach physics for example. I am talking about areas where the primary goal at school is not to get involved with drugs, gangs and so on. Those kids may have an home. They just don't have an healthy environment where to grow and to receive proper them motivation. I welcome the state of Massachusetts's decision. However I hope they will select specific targets for the deployment of the OLPC. Not all kids need those, specifically those that are already benefiting from all the goodies of healthy schools. For this reason I would rather see deployment in difficult school district, instead of to "every kid in the state"...

Does this make sense for a first-world country?

[olau]

I was just thinking, why doesn't this make sense for a rich country in Europe, like Denmark? Or any other developed nation. We currently don't seem to have the will to equip each child in the public schools with a computer, but if the price is right...

What other technologies could really help people?

[WillAdams]

Okay, setting aside worthiness or difficulties of the OLPC project[1], what other technological device could really help people in such straits then?

A while ago, I suggested a modular ``Safety core'' which would be a 10 x 10 foot cube which would contain solar cells, a water purifier, a pedal-powered generator, lights, radio, hydroponic garden (to at least provide for vitamin C needs), sleeping facilities a composting toilet and sink and water fountain and a pantry w/ say a 6 week supply of food staples and an assortment of seeds and gardening tools --- drop one off per family in a disaster area and one could be certain that each family would have food, shelter and security --- the question is, could they be produced affordably enough to make it feasible?

Or, how about a smaller cube which was just a hydroponic garden which could also generate electricity and condense water from the air?

Or perhaps Heifer International has the right idea?
http://www.heifer.org/

William
1 - I think it's a worthy idea so long as it doesn't detract from funds for immunization and basic medical care &c.

But, really, we're all wondering...

[bynary]

can it run Doom?

Meanwhile, competitor Linutop is already shipping

[Quietti]

Lovely hardware, more flexibility with the peripherals and a more recent Geode LX core: Linutop. Free Software -based, of course. It even uses LinuxBIOS. Me wanna!

LIBYA?

[Don Giovanni]

Hello?!?!?!?!!?

Anyone else notice?

I am getting sick of these posts

[EvanTaylor]

Not every damned country in the world needs rice and water because thousands are dying of starvation every day.

And what the hell is giving only food or water purification going to do but make countries dependent on foreign aid.  This is a great project because it helps self-sustained development for countries with limited capital.

I am currently in Kumasi, Ghana, setting computer networks and teaching desktop computing and will be teaching people how to setup linux and other free tools.  OLPC is extremely interesting to me as it may be a viable way to get computing to be affordable in more schools here.

Yes you can buy a pentium 3 computer for about 200 dollars here (monitor, keyboard, etc).  Ok, now power it, electricity is more expensive here, the power is unstable and kills our hard drives constantly (ok we bought some power stabilizers, oh that also means we have to hire an electrician, which isn't cheap).  Ok, now get legal software, anti-virus, the internet (Our 128K ISDN over radio costs approx $600 a month), networking equipment, cabling, and the expertise to set all of this stuff up.

The OLPC is PRECISELY what I would like to setup at this school (http://www.jwms.org), because mesh networking makes a lot of things simpler.  Even with the donated bay networks 100mb switches, hundereds of feet of networking cable, and 70 odd computers, it still would have probably been cheaper/easier to deploy OLPC systems despite all of that equipment being "free."  We already had a $1000 USD a month electricity bill before I came here and that was with 5 working computers.  By the time I'm done just getting the lab setup it will end up being at least 2.5 times as much.

And this is an exceptionally well off school for a nation that is very well developed (Better k-8 education here than anything I saw growing up in Boston), that has access to capital, and a linux/windows/mac guru nephew from the states who will volunteer himself for IT projects.  I think I can safely say that a OLPC based setup (including their satelite link central server setup) would cost less than 1/5th of what our "free" donated PCs and networking equipment (which need massive amounts of support) within 1 year, and less and less as time goes on.

Re:I am getting sick of these posts

[Anonymous Coward]

But what these developing nations really need, if the parent is anything to judge by, is some proportional fonts. Believe it or not, here at the dawn of the 21st Century there are still nations on this Earth forced to make do with fixed-width.
I, for one, am happy to make a contribution. Here are some proportional characters. OK, they're only Western alphabet, but since when has aid been about anything other than gratifying the donor? Enjoy!
abcdef ghijkl mnopqrstuvwxyz 1234567890

Re:I am getting sick of these posts

[EvanTaylor]

Ok, point taken... havent posted in so long I didnt notice..

Re:What other technologies could really help peopl

[westlake]

setting aside worthiness or difficulties of the OLPC project[1], what other technological device could really help people in such straits then?

Every year, more than two million children die of diarrhea and other sicknesses caused by dirty water and a lack of "access to sanitation." That is the common euphemism for the reality that more than a third of the world's people -- 2.6 billion -- have no decent place to go to the bathroom, while more than a billion get water for drinking, washing and cooking from sources polluted by human and animal feces.Toilets Underused to Fight Disease

Don't think so

[yoprst]

Thanks to zakat terrorists can afford descent notebooks...

Giving laptops to the poor?

[Sneakernets]

Let's give some of these to the really needy: College students