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Apple's Smart Phone Depends on OS X Tie-Ins
anaesthetica writes "According to AppleInsider, Apple is not only working on a cellphone + mp3 player iPhone, but is working on a second model designed to be a smart phone, highly integrated with Mac OS and .Mac. The smart phone has gone through several iterations, as the notoriously demanding Mr. Jobs ordered the elite team working on the phone to redesign and re-engineer their prototypes. Capabilities are reported to include Front Row interface, syncing contacts and iCal with .Mac, "call ahead", iChat video conferencing integration, WiFi, and a slide-out keyboard. Too good to be true?"
The smart phone can't wipe my arse and spoon-feed me too?
No sir, I DON'T LIKE IT!
That's sooo Osama bin Laden.
.... appears to be taking a page out of the M$ playbook and tying the device tightly to the OS to drive OS X sales. One would hope that he is also smart enough to have the phone be usable to users of Windows & *INX without hopping though hoops to do it.
This is my opinion. To make sure you don't steal it, it's covered by the DMCA.
A phone I can plug a usb cable into and drop pictures/sounds/contract directly from my computer.
A nice easy interface to do this with.
Stop dollaring us to death when we want a picture or a ring tone that we create.
If it can have music as well, bonus.
IT would be neat if it used the same connection as the iPod
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
You aren't forced to use iTunes with atleast Windows. I use Winamp... It rocks your socks of!
Stop using verizon. My phone uses bluetooth (no cable involved) and windows treats it like a file system (IBM/Lenovo laptop) that I can browse and move stuff to/from the phone whenever I want. Mac OS X uses the bluetooth file transfer utility, and I think you have to do that if you're using a non-IBM/lenovo laptop as well (or an IBM/Lenovo laptop without their bluetooth stack). I use Cingular. Most GSM phones are the same. Verizon is the only one to cripple their bluetooth so badly, that I know of.
Unfortunately, at least in the US, the wireless providers have a stranglehold on phone manufacturers. If the providers don't like your phone because it cuts into their profits, they will neither offer it for sale nor allow it to be activated on their network. AFAIK, only GSM customers have choice due to SIM cards, but the top two providers in the US use CDMA technology (which doesn't use SIM cards or any equivalent).
If you reply, do so only to what I explicitly wrote. If I didn't write it, don't assume or infer it.
Wow, steve jobs comes into your house an dpoint a gun at your head to make you use iTunes with your iPod? Wow.
Don't tell him, but I use one of the many other tools available for putting items into your iPod.
SSHhhhhh...
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
It's not like the rumor is exactly new. There is the claim by a company that they received manufacturing orders from Apple, as well as other claims from the rumor-mill (e.g. Kevin Rose's claim that his friend at Apple has a 4GB and a 8GB phone).
.mac. It's not like I can actually afford the iPDA .. forcing me to pay a monthly subscription for owning a piece of hardware is too much.
I remember when buying my Macbook Pro there were all sorts of rumors not to buy one. That there would something to be shortly released that would supersede it (of course, at the time, the only thing that could be cooler was a iTablet). People claim that Apple enjoys these rumors, though I have to imagine to some extent it hurts their sales. Some speculate it is a good way for them to figure out what the public wants. Others that it is simply subterfuge to hide their real activity from their competitors.
I give this rumor *some* credence simply because it seems like the hardware is already there. It's not that large of a stretch of an imagination to think of a Nano being put together with a cell phone -- much like how many cell phone companies are putting ipod like devices with their cell phones. Which means the big question is whether Apple actually *wants* this. My suspicion is that easier access to the iTunes store is probably a large incentive to them.
Personally the iPhone isn't that appealing to me. If the only extra functionality I get from it is that it takes less space, I think I'll pass. However, as far as the iPDA -- that is something I'd want. The iPod already has a large HD (80GBs anyone?), a processor capable of playing music, games, doing calendaring, etc. Is it that big a of a stretch that it should be able to maybe do email? Maybe surf the web? Heck, if Opera can make a web browser for cell phones and DS, it's hard to see why not.
The big catch seems to be the input device. It's not clear how Apple feels about a stylus. However, things like the Blackberry seem to do well with just a keyboard and a scroll wheel. Sound familiar?
Also, please, really, PLEASE, if this does come true, don't make us subscribe to
A phone I can plug a usb cable into and drop pictures/sounds/contract directly from my computer.
I'm pretty sure my nokia 9300 does that. It has a very handy mmc slot too so I back up the system state and transfer it for safe keeping. I don't know if the nokia software is an "easy" interface, but it's okay. Runs the symbian OS and some j2me apps work well.
You can make your own ringtones too. Just transfer them as an mp3 onto the phone and you are good to go.
My understanding is this phone isn't very popular in the States. It's the best phone I've ever had and pretty hackable compared to some other phones.
http://www.maxineudall.com/2010/02/should-economists-be-sued-for-malpractice.html
Apple should indeed listen to you. You might have the answer as to why the iPod has been such a flop.
Fortunately, if you get one of the palm os powered treos (whatever you're opinion is of the Palm OS), it's totally hackable, even on Verizon. I've enabled bluetooth DUN on mine (verizon "locks" you out of that), and naturally, since it's a pda, ringtones are a piece of cake. The only thing I've not yet managed to unlock is the Network settings, so no wifi module for me (yet). At any rate, my Treo 650 has allowed me to be the free-est (as in speech) with my phone of any of the 8 years of Verizon phones I've had.
Now if they'd only lower the bloody price on their unlimited data plan....
The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. - Albert Einstein
In serching for the exact workding, the first google hit is the /. discussion here. It's funny to scroll throught he comments from the initial ipod release.
They have proven, with the iPod, that if they can fix the abyssmal ui seen on typical device, they don't need to be massively innovative in hardware - simply "good" is enough. I've got to say that when it comes to cell phones, someone who can make them "just work" has a really good shot at the market. If they can make it "just work" with outlooks calendar, contacts, and email, as well as be a good phone and media player, they're in for a wild ride.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
That's interesting about the DUN reactivation. I don't suppose you can do GPS over bluetooth and/or pair multiple devices simulataneously (laptop, headset, gps)?
I'm not for or against palm, as long as I can sync to something with a calendar and contact list.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
This is interesting, considering the Leopard release of iCalendar Server for OS X Server v. 10.5. Granted it talks about .mac integration now, but as long as it can sync with other iCalendar software (iCal Server, Google Calendar, Yahoo Calendar, etc.), the product becomes that much more impressive. That alone will be good news for current Mac users that want to have direct calendar updates without the hassle of syncing their calendar.
The other thing I liked was the mention of iChat Video Conferencing from the handset to a PC. That's something I have wanted with the Pocket PC for ages, and even various video phones. They have a camera, why couldn't they do video conferencing? With 3G wireless networks and phones that can take advantage of it, the technology is finally in place. That would make the iPhone worth it for me alone.
I had been trying to get cell-phone free for the past two years, and it looks like Apple is going to make that harder for me with this release.
I want an acceptable mobile browser (much like the proxied browser that the T-mobile Sidekick has). I don't want to have to scroll around the screen to see the entire thing and I don't want it formatted to look like ass. I certainly do not want WAP. I want to see the web page, as it was intended, on my device -- just smaller.
I want an adequate QWERTY keyboard. The Treo is not acceptable. The first few iterations of the T-mobile Sidekick SK -> SK2 were good. The new individual keys of the SK3 are not as good but remain superior to the Treo.
I want it to have wifi, GPRS and EDGE (or whatever advanced radio networking they have on other providers), as well as the ability to tether for free. I don't see why I should be paying higher rates because I have it hooked to a computer.
I want it to work with all OSs. I don't want to be tied to one or the other.
It should be available as a USB mass storage device and not require anything other than a USB cable.
The applications should be easy to use, understand, and modify to work regardless of provider.
It will remain a dream.
You do realize that third party developers can create applications for SmartPhones and PocketPC Phones that would allow a user to sync with a Mac, right? So the question is more.. why aren't third party developers doing this? I highly doubt you can blame Microsoft for that.
Oh, and just to note...
http://www.pocketmac.net/
You're welcome.
My Fav:
"I don't see many sales in the future of iPod.
~LoudMusic"
To be fair, I didn't think much of it at the time either.
Angleyne: You can't bend that girder - it's unbendable! Bender: Well I don't know anything about lifting, so that ju
I do believe you can do GPS syncing over bluetooth, IIRC there are a number of products out there that come with Palm software. As to pairing multiple devices simultaneously, I've honestly never tried - generally when I'm using the laptop, that's my mode of communication, and when I don't have my laptop I use my treo, and I've yet to find a bluetooth headset in my price range that I actually want. However, given Palm OS's less than great support for multitasking, it may not work flawlessly if it does at all.
:-P
Funny note about the DUN reactivation - apparently the way Verizon locked it out was by disabling the display of the DUN on/off toggle. Hilarious. So, reactivating it involves installing a Bluetooth.prc with that control enabled (see here for more details).
Did I mention I also got my phone to boot linux?
The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. - Albert Einstein
you can sync your ipod with outlook.
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The war on terror is a war for peace
Personally, I look forward to seeing the iPhone. I have a RAZR, and it leaves a lot to be desired. I suspect Apple could do a very good job designing a cell phone and making it functional.
...It's actually easier to return Windows than an OSX license for example...
Probably because OSX doesn't require any registration to install and use.
You're also free to make all of the mp3 players, or players that use your own DRM.
You can also listen to all the iTMS music you want on 5 machines and dozens of iPod variants.
Some won't be satisfied until Apple gives everything away for free.
First of all if Apple is going to make a smart phone they have a lot of cathing up to do with Motorola, Nokia, Samsung and other big mobile phone manufacturers. There are a lot of things that go into a mobile phone. It's not as simple as an mp3 player. For example what radio technologies will the phone support? GSM, CDMA, WCDMA, HSDPA...
With smart phones one of most important thing for me is 3rd party apps. A smart phone is not much of use if there are no apps for it. Other manufacturers already have operating system that they have been using for a long time and there are a lot apps for them. Maybe Apple will have midp support, which is OK, but not quite like running native applications.
i realize i am selling out the DIY ethic here, but......
those sync methods are sometimes unreliable. it seems to be oddly inconsistent even with the same devices. i have heard this from users i know to be above average with nrrdyness. some have a great time, some have lots of problems.
i have the Motorola E815 un-smartphone. i have had some luck with bluetooth sync of address book and ical. the problem is that when it doesn't work, the end result is often phone numbers going away or things being erased from my calendar. the kind of thing you not always notice at first. when i lose items it is generally when they are on the phone and not my Mac. my whole reason to sync the address book is so i have a backup in case i lose or upgrade the phone. randomly pruning some numbers kind of defeats that plan.
i appreciate all the work 3rd party developers are doing, but some stuff is risky. i hate typing this because i feel like it is the argument that M$ uses to bash *nix, but in this case there are so many devices that change so frequently that it generates sync issues (i guess?). i loved using BitPim on my old cell phone to extract pictures, upload graphics and ringtones and backup my phonebook. that never did anything destructive if it wasn't working. that is a darn great app.
You're correct. I make a BlueTooth connection to my (Cingular) Motorola RAZR and can drag and drop files between the devices. I downloaded an MP3 edit and take snippets of music to make ring tones (even via iTunes by burning the song(s) to CD, converting to MP3 and back to the phone -- Hello ST:TOS theme). And OS/X iSync recognize the phone and syncs my Calendar and Address Book (I set up a smart list in the address book to sync only those contacts I wanted on the phone).
Programmers in mirror are brighter than they appear
It got that monopoly by virtue of the fact that they control the DRM formats that can be played by their music play, which has an overwhelming share of the market.
What monopoly? This isn't like Windows, where you need to run Windows to run Windows applications. Every song I've bought from the iTunes music store is stored in DRM-free audio CDs (as Apple recommends!) and can be played on any music player in the world.
I'm not locked into iTunes, or the iPod. I don't even *like* the iPod. I gave my iPod to my daughter and I'm using iTunes because it just works better than the other music players I've used, and because Fairplay is "honor system" DRM... Apple doesn't try and stop me from feeding the output of iTunes into a recording program, or Garage Band, or anything else. I buy from the iTunes Music store because it just works. I also buy from eMusic.
I've had an MP3 playing phone, and after using it a while I decided that I've never had a sillier device. Take the two devices that I own that are hungriest for power, and run them off the same battery? I have enough trouble as it is with my phone being dead when I need it!
You really want an MP3 playing phone? Make me an offer on mine. But you don't get to return it when you discover what a bad idea it is.
Well if you look at what they did with iPods, they didn't release them for Windows initially. Instead they waited until the iPod had already become a success with Mac users, and then released both the iPod and iTunes for Windows.
I suspect if they had released a Windows iTunes+iPod at the very beginning, it might not have done as well as it did, released a year or so later, with a lot of traction. I expect they probably would have gotten a lot of flak for not having it work with WMP or whatever the dominant Windows music player software was in 2001. By holding off until later, they could not only sell the device, but sell a solution that was part of an entire application/product/service "stack": iTunes, the iPod, and the iTMS.
Apple's fan base within the Mac market provides them with a perfect test audience for their products, before they go on to release them to the rest of the world. I wouldn't be surprised if they released their phone as Mac-only initially, and then if it's a hit, made a PC version of the Mac's software so that PC users could get in on it. But that way they allow PC demand to build first, and then respond to it, rather than trying to create demand first.
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When they released the iPod there were already lots of MP3 players on the market, but that didn't seem to prevent them from making a success of it. There are lots of style-conscious people out there who will pay a premium for a cell phone with an Apple logo on it regardless of whether it has cutting edge technology or not.
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Apple will follow their usual model:
One axis with consumer (think MacBook, iMac, iPod nano)
One axis with prosumer (think MacBook Pro, MacPro, iPod video)
In all squares good, better, best
(Think MacBook White 2x1.83, White 2x2, Black 2x2)
(Think iPod Shuffle, iPod Nano, iPod Video)
Same for the phones,
iPhone small and inexpensive
iPhone nano/macbook
iPhone pro
My guess is that the mid version iPhone (nano/MacBook) will be first to be released and at a premium price (like $400 with no contract). After 4 months the iPhone (pro) will be released at a slightly higher premium price (like $500 with no contract) and the mid version iPhone (nano/MacBook) will be reduced to $250 and "one more thing" the youth low end model iPhone (small and inexpensive) will be released like the Nokia 3-series for $149 with no contract.
- - -
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It really whips the llama's ass!
you fundamentally misunderstand "monopoly". don't feel bad, it's a common mistake (especially 'round these parts).
.Mac-only) features unless their abusing a monopoly position by doing so (or is Apple somehow "wrong" for not making Safari, iChat, GarageBand, or Spotlight available for Windows?). Given no monopoly, there can be no such abuse.
it's useless to say that apple has a monopoly on iTunes Music Store sales, the same way it's stupid to say that Ford has a monopoly on Taurus sales. Ford doesn't have a monopoly on cars, which is the industry in which they compete; similarly, apple doesn't have a monopoly on digital music sales, which is the field in which iTMS competes. true, Apple has market dominance in a way that Ford does not, but market dominance does not equal a monopoly, by a long shot.
apple has no ability to lock anyone into anything related to phones. for starters, they've already licensed the ability to play iTMS tracks on someone else's phone. and, of course, there's still the fact that iTMS does not represent any form of monopoly. there's nothing wrong with them offering Mac-only (or
i'd agree that it's bad that it's illegal to try to work around the Fairplay DRM breakage, but that's entirely irrelevant to the rest of your post.
i speak for myself and those who like what i say.
"If it's tightly coupled with Mac OS, it will flop"
The iPod started on the Mac only. It was a (modest) success before the Windows version was ever introduced.
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AppleInsider also keeps saying that Apple is working on a Tablet Mac, which presumably is a TabletPC-esque convertible Macbook which uses Ink Services and handwriting recognition.
I work as a software engineer at Wacom Technologies. If Apple were going to make such a device, they would be using our hardware, and likely some of our software. They have not, so there is likely no such project. AppleInsider is posting items from their wishlist.
-- Hamster