IE Dropping, Now Near 70% In Europe

Kevin Spiritus lets us know that XiTi Monitor, a French Web survey institute, has published its browser barometer for July, and Internet Explorer continues to lose ground. "The ascension of Firefox continues... Nearly 28% average use rate in Europe in the beginning of July 2007, with a progression in the totality of the 32 European countries studied. Firefox doesn't loose ground in any of the countries."

Comments

How is this not a dupe?

[Anonymous Coward]

Putting the same story in the related stories box does not un-dupe this news.

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[Anonymous Coward]

How about calling it a super dupe? Because last week was Firefox Now Serious Threat to IE in Europe which cites the same study.

If this story is a 'super dupe,' that would make kdawson a super duper guy.

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[iamdrscience]

No, no, the story that was posted earlier this week was about this study. This story is the study. Even though they have the exact same data, they're entirely different: This one has graphs!

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[The_DoubleU]

This is not a dupe.
The previous story was about Firefox gaining market share.
This story is about IE "loosing" ground.

Completely different.

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[tsa]

IE looses the ground to bury FF in?

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[somegeekynick]

This one has graphs! You mean like this?

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[somegeekynick]

That didn't go quite well. I meant to link this.

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[cayenne8]

TFA blurb: "Firefox doesn't loose ground in any of the countries."

Good Lord people...at least if you post it front page get it right!!!

It is lose not loose....

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[bgfay]

Oh come on, let's not loose site of the things that defiantly matter here. We can play fast and lose with the little facts so much as we get the big ones write everyday. I wonder if alot of people woulda even noticed the affect of a little mispelling like that.

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[Spacezilla]

its a lot not alot stupid

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[cp.tar]

While we're at it, I think I should link this graph, just in case.

Re:How is this not a dupe?

[bgfay]

its a lot not alot stupid Yeah, I knew that. It was pretty much the point.

It doesn't loose any ground?

[antifoidulus]

Damn pheonixes, not doing the digging I paid them to do!

Re:It doesn't loose any ground?

[Aladrin]

Nono, I think they mean to say that Firefox doesn't fight dirty and throw dirt (loose ground) at the opponents.

Re:It doesn't loose any ground?

[n0rr1s]

Hehe.

But if you're going to make fun of spelling (something that I wholeheartedly encourage), it helps to check your own.

Phoenixes.

Re:It doesn't loose any ground?

[dhakbar]

Pheonixes? Is that like phonics? Or did you mean phoenixes?

Re:It doesn't loose any ground?

[The13thMonkey]

I think he meant pheo^H^Hoenii

Any more data?

[InvisblePinkUnicorn]

Is there any more data on how browser usage breaks down by country worldwide, or by other demographics?

Re:Any more data?

[Eightyford]

Is there any more data on how browser usage breaks down by country worldwide, or by other demographics?

Yep!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_web_br owsers

Re:Any more data?

[Frogbert]

Wow the use of Firefox by Elephants has doubled over the past month!

Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[garcia]

Yeah, we know. From that blurb:

"Mozilla's Firefox web browser has made dramatic gains on Microsoft's Internet Explorer throughout Europe in the past year with a marked upturn in FF use compared to IE over the past four months, according to French web monitoring service XiTiMonitor. A study of nearly 96,000 websites carried out during the week of July 2 to July 8 found that FF had 27.8% market share across Eastern and Western Europe, IE had 66.5%, with other browsers including Safari and Opera making up the remaining 5.7%. In some key European markets FF has already reached parity and is threatening to overtake IE as the market leading browser."

From the current blurb:

Kevin Spiritus lets us know that XiTi Monitor, a French Web survey institute, has published its browser barometer for July, and Internet Explorer continues to lose ground. "The ascension of Firefox continues... Nearly 28% average use rate in Europe in the beginning of July 2007, with a progression in the totality of the 32 European countries studied. Firefox doesn't loose ground in any of the countries."

I realize we have the Firehose now but are people who read Slashdot daily using it properly? We don't need two stories in a short time frame (4 days) about the same topic.

Re:Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[morgan_greywolf]

I realize we have the Firehose now but are people who read Slashdot daily using it properly? We don't need two stories in a short time frame (4 days) about the same topic.

And exactly how did you get a 4-digit UID? ;)

Re:Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[UglyTool]

I realize we have the Firehose now but are people who read Slashdot daily using it properly? We don't need two stories in a short time frame (4 days) about the same topic.

And exactly how did you get a 4-digit UID? ;)

eBay. Same place I got mine.

Re:Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[just_another_sean]

Here, I fixed your comment for you...

Dupe!

j/k :-)

Re:Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[A_Non_Moose]

We don't need two stories in a short time frame (4 days) about the same topic.

I guess we do if we lose first story before the second one is loosed upon us.

I guess ./ editor is just that in the loosest (or would that be losest?) sense of the term.

Now, where is that link to "annoying internet terms"?

Re:Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[IllForgetMyNickSoonA]

Now, I hate to be the first to tell you this, but... yout UID is 6-digit, they framed you on the eBay!

Re:Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[cp.tar]

What do you mean, framed? He only paid for 4 digits, and got 6. That's, like, 50% free.

At least that's what everyone tells me...

Re:Pound it into our heads why don't ya?

[Anonymous Coward]

On a related note, firefox gained ground while IE lost ground in Europe.

This is also not a dupe, but rather an editorial comment combining the previous two stories.

Note to editors

[greenguy]

The convention with statistics is to say "near" when rounding up, not down. A more common way of expressing 72% in round figures would be "fewer than 3 in 4" or simply "fewer than 75% of Europeans."

Re:Note to editors

[LighterShadeOfBlack]

You're correct but so are they. IE is only at 66.5%, remember there are other browsers besides IE and Firefox!

Methodology

[EveryNickIsTaken]

From TFA:

Methodology: Firefox's use rate corresponds to the totality of Firefox visits during the period in relation to the entirety of visits, all browsers taken together. They don't explain what "visits" means. Does it mean visits to *their* site? Did they poll a random number of site owners? I'm sorry, but unless they can provide some supporting information, then these statistics are meaningless.

Re:Methodology

[Eightyford]

They don't explain what "visits" means. Does it mean visits to *their* site? Did they poll a random number of site owners? I'm sorry, but unless they can provide some supporting information, then these statistics are meaningless.

I don't think they're meaningless. Inaccurate maybe. I can see how users of Firefox would visit certain sites more often than users of other browsers, and that could skew the numbers.

Re:Methodology

[EveryNickIsTaken]

Such as slashdot.org, linux.org, and sailormoonanime.com?

Re:Methodology

[john83]

From TFA:

Methodology: Firefox's use rate corresponds to the totality of Firefox visits during the period in relation to the entirety of visits, all browsers taken together. They don't explain what "visits" means. Does it mean visits to *their* site? Did they poll a random number of site owners? I'm sorry, but unless they can provide some supporting information, then these statistics are meaningless. From TFA: "Perimeter of 95,827 websites".

Re:Methodology

[jorgevillalobos]

Here's a post that partly explains the methodology followed to come up with this numbers: http://standblog.org/blog/post/2007/07/17/Firefox- market-share-update. Excerpt:

I have met with the Xiti team a few months ago to get a better understanding of what they measure. Basically, they have what they call markers (actually small images) on literally millions of Websites, mostly in Western Europe. This means they get billions of hits every month, and then analyse which browser engine were used to display these images.

Re:Methodology

[ShinmaWa]

Basically, they have what they call markers (actually small images) on literally millions of Websites What they call "markers", the rest of the world calls web bugs.

A lot of personal proxies (such as Privoxy) filter out crap like this. The kind of user that would use a product like Privoxy is also the kind of user that would tend to use Firefox. Makes me wonder if the Firefox numbers might not actually be a little higher overall.

Re:Methodology

[RxScram]

Dang, sailormoonanime.com is a cybersquatter link...

hmmmm... a new 4 step?

Step 1- Post link to slashdot about formerly non-existent website, preferably involving large numbers of hot anime chicks.
Step 2- Purchase rights to URL named in step 1
Step 3- Advertising, or ???
Step 4- PROFIT!

Re:Methodology

[quarx]

yes visit means visit to my site, sure Firefox is gaining, in this site http://www.mapjack.com/ Firefox's share is 70%, IE is just 20%

I'm Loosing My Mind!

[asphaltjesus]

/. needs to put the grammar nazis to better use.

firefox getting bloated

[wwmedia]

i was one of the first people in my university to use firefox a few years ago, since then i seen a steady rise of people using it but since last march the trend reversed, for example myself went back to IE7 because the fonts look alot nicer on my laptop and memory usage is very important for me, 4 tabs open in IE7 and firefox + both minimised > ie7 using 4MB! firefox is using 60MB! wtf? and dont get me started on the google toolbar.. i see people going back to IE7 now or opera anyways since this is /. i prob will be modded down, but oh well, this is the truth and i hope mozilla do something about performance (and no rooting around configuration options is not cool) as i like firefox and use it for development and testing

Re:firefox getting bloated

[Horn]

If you care that much about 60 megs of ram for an app that you're using, its time to get more ram.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[morgan_greywolf]

, 4 tabs open in IE7 and firefox + both minimised > ie7 using 4MB! firefox is using 60MB! wtf?

The about:config setting you're looking for is config.trim_on_minimize. Set this true.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[professionalfurryele]

Font appearance is a personal taste issue, although I cant tell the difference. How are you measuring RAM usage? Because it isn't the amount of RAM in the task manager you want to worry about. What you need to find out is what do the applications do when the system is low on resources. If firefox is a good little application and surrenders that RAM when the system needs it, then it doesn't matter if it is 'using' it at other times.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[canUbeleiveIT]

For the low, low price of just $38.99 I can solve all of your browser problems.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[Red Flayer]

The about:config setting you're looking for is config.trim_on_minimize. Set this true.

I think this raises a point, though, in relation to browser share. The majority of users do not want to have to tweak anything. If they need to change Firefox configs in order to match performance under IE7, most would instead go back to IE7.[1]

Personally, I don't think browser share is the ultimate measure of how good a browser Firefox is. The only reason why I think it's important that FF and other browsers eat away at the IE7 share is so that more websites are developed according to standards.

[1] This is amusing, to me. The not-wanting-to-have-to-tweak-anything mentality used to be associated with Apple, not PCs (yes, more on the hardware side, but still). Now it's associated with MS products.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[Anonymous Coward]

I think he meant that web pages are getting more bloated, not firefox. :-)

Re:firefox getting bloated

[morgan_greywolf]

I think this raises a point, though, in relation to browser share. The majority of users do not want to have to tweak anything. If they need to change Firefox configs in order to match performance under IE7, most would instead go back to IE7.[1]

As far as that goes, any software developer knows that when it comes to performance, you can maximize for size or speed, but not both. In this case, FF chose to optimize for speed, rather than size, but left a config option for those who would rather they had taken the opposite stance. I see no problem with this, given that memory is cheap (and getting cheaper). Anyone worried about a browser taking 60MB of RAM doesn't have enough memory; however, if they can't afford more memory for whatever reason, they still can decide to reduce FF's minimized size in memory.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[quacking duck]

I've found on my work PC (Win XP, 3 GB RAM) that once Firefox goes past 250 MB of memory it starts choking when switching tabs or navigating pages. The trick of minimizing Firefox appears to free up memory at first, but soon after restoring the window it's past 200 MB and choking again.

The last time this happened I quit my other memory-hogging processes (dev environment, GIMP, etc), it didn't help. Restarting Firefox did--thankfully all my dozen or so tabs were restored.

At no time were all processes taking up close to 3 GB of RAM, i.e. low on resources. For whatever reason, Firefox on my machine just doesn't work well after being open several days straight and moderate usage.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[WIAKywbfatw]

Just a suggestion, but you might want to try Opera. It's smaller and faster than its rivals.

But, as others have pointed out, MSIE is known for not reporting memory usage correctly, so it's very hard to make like for like memory usage comparisons based solely on the numbers reported by Task Manager.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[RulerOf]

I happen to completely agree.

I've iterated myself before many times, a couple on slashdot, and, having tried both browsers, I very fully prefer and endorse IE7, and yes, I'm also a nerd.

These days, I don't really bother getting into arguments about it because I've found that most people who prefer Firefox tend to be fanboys. It's like arguing PC vs. Mac, or Windows vs. Linux. IE vs. Firefox will just be another age-old argument that absolutely no one will ever win.

In the end, it comes down to preference, cause arguments like RAM usage and such can really be mitigated the same way those other examples can be: Money. If you want a Mac, you'll shell out the cash for one. If you want to save some money, learn how to use Linux. If you want to run a more resource intensive browser, get some more RAM.

Really, slashdotters, quit the vicious fanboy modding and recognize this for what it is: a software dick-measuring contest.

Re:firefox getting bloated

[Anonymous Coward]

>use it for development and testing
Well, if you're developing a web-based spelling and grammar checker, it needs a LOT of work.

Lose vs Loose

[athloi]

loose ground

This is a hard one for non-native English speakers, because "lose" is pronounced so bizarrely it sounds like it needs two Os. However, "loose" is how we describe poor security, and "lose" is what happens when I try to play one of these newfangled video games. FYI, FWIW.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Anonymous Coward]

i don't know how poor security would apply to my friend's mum who sleeps around but she is pretty loose.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[lawpoop]

I just tried pronouncing these myself:

Lose sounds like 'Luuze' while

Loose sounds like 'Luce'.

Weird.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Nimey]

This is a hard one for non-native English speakers

And a lot of native speakers as well.

Personally I don't understand that, since I read books a lot and am an excellent speller.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Chrisq]

It probably applies to your friend's dad's chastity belt supplier

Re:Lose vs Loose

[mwvdlee]

Pose
Nose
Dose
Hose
Rose
Lose

Yup... something's off.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[teh_chrizzle]

This is a hard one for non-native English speakers, because "lose" is pronounced so bizarrely it sounds like it needs two Os.

i think "lose" should be spelled with two O's and a Z just like it sounds... like booze.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[vigmeister]

While I am technically a non-native speaker being an Indian (Disclaimer: I did not derkejeeerrbs), english was the first language I learnt. I have noticed that people who speak british english tend to accept anomalies in english more than american english speakers. To be honest, I never thought of how strange the pronunciation of 'lose' was until I tried to find more examples and all I could think of was words like rose,hose,dose,chose etc... It is indeed an odd pronunciation, but it never seemed strange. Maybe it is because we are used to spelling words weirdly since there has not been a comparable effort to have pronunciations and spellings correspond in BE like there has been in AE. In fact, one of my biggest pet peeves in english is that I squirm every time I see 'floatation'. I know it is a valid spelling of the word and that it makes logical sense, but 'flotation' just seems more natural to me (this spelling is correct as well). 'Aluminum' bothers me too (both the pronunciation and the spelling). The spelling makes me uncomfortable because it seems 'too short'.

As an aside, A friend of mine who has a real problem with spelling once asked me how to spell 'pose' and I convinced him it was 'poas' although he doubted me at first. Luckily for me, I told him that 'pose' was pronounced 'poose' and meant something entirely different from 'poas' and that the latter usage was British which is why spell-check complained about it.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[DogDude]

That's great, but Slashdot is an Engligh-speaking web site geared towards Americans.

Even still Slashdot supposedly has "Editors" (I think at this point they're just some lazy guys who are cruising on the dot-bomb money they made and couldn't give a shit about Slashdot). The job of an editor is to fix grammar mistakes, and even improve readability of the text they are supposed to be reviewing. To have constant typos and errors in the headline of a very widely read website is unacceptable. But then, Sourceforge Inc. (previously OSDN, VA Linux, etc.) is a pretty badly run company (http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=LNUX&annual) that is only in the black because they're selling off pieces of their business that they have already run into the ground.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[GeckoX]

Gotta love english, dose doesn't fit either fwiw.
Doze is pronounced the same as pose, nose etc.
Dose is pronounced like close, but only if you mean close as in near. Close as in 'close up shop' is like doze.

What a mess ;)

English isn't so much a set of rules as it is a set of exceptions.

My biggest english hangup is with archive...having been taught phonetically I always say ar-CHive, like 'chive', when it should be pronounced as arkive. I know this, I always think this when I say it, but it always comes out like chive.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[gstoddart]

This is a hard one for non-native English speakers

I've given up on worrying about what non-native speakers do to English. Over the years of knowing many non-native speakers, I've figured out the ways in which English makes no sense to them, and the way in which they make odd-sounding conjugations etc are perfectly reasonable in terms of how their own language works and how they were taught English (mostly). They're usually following a perfectly reasonable rule -- as a friend points out, his English is way better than my Vietnamese. :-P

Trying to explain or account for all of the bizarre exceptions and oddities in English gets pointless after a while. Once you get over that, it's far easier to actually communicate with them and get on with it. The oddities don't seem quite so jarring, and, sometimes sound rather cool and expressive in ways we wouldn't expect; sometimes they'll express something in a way which, while completely grammatically incorrect, couldn't be expressed as well in 'proper' English.

(As a matter of fact, you can get some insight into their sentence structure by listening to how they don't quite get ours correct, which makes it easier to follow some of the odder constructs. These are usually driven by the more arcane rules of English which I never had to consciously think about growing up but which are almost impossible to explain.)

Now, the native speakers, however, still get held accountable for how badly they speak/write it. There's an awful lot of native speakers who can't use English, and that's far less forgivable than someone who is on their second (third, fourth, whatever) language.

Cheers

Re:Lose vs Loose

[DragonWriter]

Lose sounds like 'Luuze' while

Loose sounds like 'Luce'.

It seems to me that "Loose" sounds like "Loose"—if you take most words in English that end with "-oose" as a guide, e.g., "moose", "goose", or "caboose".

OTOH, "lose" sounds like "Loose"—if you take "choose" as a model of how the "-oose" should sound.

I think the better statement is that "English spelling is only loosely connected to pronunciation".

Re:Lose vs Loose

[chris_mahan]

I personally tripped (many years ago) on schedule. (get it? Tripped on schedule.)

Anyway: I was taught: Chedoole, but in youessay, you have to say skeduel. (youessay == USA)

pps: is USA jarjar-talk? I shudder...

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Maxo-Texas]

Well, you can consider other words where S sounds like Z.

For "hose" which is frequently mispronounced "Ho's" but is apparently pronounced "Who's".

Hmmm. Or not.

Hose
Nose - When at the landfill, no nose is good news.

Lose

English makes no sense.

I'm oppoosed to loose myself but I recall that Mark Twain "I don't give a damn for a man that can only spell a word one way."

My preference iz that wee wud fix speling to match sound and reemoove al ov the excepshions.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Mattintosh]

Allow me to translate into non-baby-talk.

In English English (the Queen's, I guess), they say the word "schedule" as shed-jule.
In American English (or the highway, bitches), we say the same word as sked-jule.

It's not enough of a difference to make the word difficult to understand in everyday speech, but just enough difference to make everyone in earshot of the "foreign" way giggle when they hear it. Especially us "dumb" Americans, since we like to make fun of anything that sounds different (including each other, and anyone from Boston, the "deep south", or Minnesota can vouch for this).

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Wannabe Code Monkey]

This is a hard one for non-native English speakers, because "lose" is pronounced so bizarrely it sounds like it needs two Os.

i think "lose" should be spelled with two O's and a Z just like it sounds... like booze.

Something that may help you remember how to spell the-verb-that's-the-opposite-of-win, is to look at its past tense spelling: 'lost'. One 'o' in 'lost', therefore one 'o' in 'lose'.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Khelder]

Oh, and here I was feeling relieved that Firefox did not set free any ground to rampage across the countryside, destroying houses, pillaging, etc. (You know, as ground is wont to do.) I think Firefox's popularity might suffer if it did that.

Now I'm worried again.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[teh_chrizzle]

you can use "booze" as a verb (i.e. "boozing it up"... a person who boozes is said to be a "boozer") so what is it's past tense? "boozed" or "bost"? i would wager it is "boozed" therefore, the past tense of "looze" would be "loozed".

Re:Lose vs Loose

[RiffRafff]

'Aluminum' bothers me too (both the pronunciation and the spelling). The spelling makes me uncomfortable because it seems 'too short'.

But that's what Davy wanted to call it.

"Refrigerator-freezer" seems "too long," too, but I don't call it a refrigideezer (although George Carlin does).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium#Spelling

Re:Lose vs Loose

[vigmeister]

But that's what Davy wanted to call it.
"Refrigerator-freezer" seems "too long," too, but I don't call it a refrigideezer (although George Carlin does).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium#Spelling 'refrigideezer' is not a word while 'Aluminium' is the IUPAC spelling and is widely used in scientific literature outside America. There is a huge difference between the two situations. Moreover, I am not against the use of 'Aluminum'. I have accepted that a lot of people call it that and do not object to its use in any way. I personally prefer the use of 'Aluminium' since I like it better.

Cheers!

Re:Lose vs Loose

[AdamWeeden]

Me fail English? That's unpossible!

Re:Lose vs Loose

[Aristotelis]

Actually, it's the "native" English speakers who make this mistake more often. Especially Americans. Unless Americans qualify as non-native speakers, in which case you are correct.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[chris_mahan]

But wait, I'm French, so I fart in your general direction. Prruuiitt.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[The One and Only]

I think "booze" should be spelled "boos"--"boobs" without the second "b".

Re:Lose vs Loose

[thethibs]

Lose, choose, chews—loose, spruce, deuce. Except for urban graffiti, English is not a phonetically spelled language.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[thethibs]

having been taught phonetically

Ah. One of the victims of the great liberal experiment with education (I tend to think of it as legalized child abuse).

I have to apologize on behalf of my generation. I'm not one of those responsible, but I should have seen it happening and done something to stop it.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[HaveNoMouth]

'Aluminum' bothers me too (both the pronunciation and the spelling). The spelling makes me uncomfortable because it seems 'too short'.

Yes, well, polythene bugs me because it seems 'too short.' Both sides of the pond have played the shortening game.

"On his honor, and with an effusive flavor, he admitted that the correct spelling was 'color'."

Re:Lose vs Loose

[vigmeister]

Again, I am not saying one spelling is 'better'. I am just expressing my preferences. We had a MatSci course where our prof considered the spelling of one-word answers for marking. She did not know what 'polyethene' (which I prefer - because it is sensible) was. Later in the course, I was asking her a questions and she had no clue as to what ethyne was either. This is something that I can't digest in that when there are alternate spellings (that are popular), you can prefer one, but not ignore the existence of the other since it interferes with communication. And if you prefer polyethylene, I don't see a problem with that as long as you know that polyethene/polythene are alternate names.

Re:Lose vs Loose

[teh_chrizzle]

I think "booze" should be spelled "boos"--"boobs" without the second "b".

i spell that with an EW, like LEWT.

Europe

[smith6174]

In Europe people are smarter and do things better. Deal with it.

Re:Europe

[Jedi Alec]

Smarter than everyone else or just smarter than Americans? Because if it's the latter it'd be a lot like debating on the internet.

Re:Europe

[Anonymous Coward]

In America, lose and loose are 2 different words.

Re:Europe

[Anonymous Coward]

Truly, the heart of human of science, knowledge, and colonialism. No nation of mud-people produces people of caliber equal to or greater than Europe does.

Re:Europe

[dwarfsoft]

Debating on the Internet is like running in the special olympics ... something about loose ?

Actually, TFA says IE is UNDER 70%

[phozz bare]

Apparently the most important detail was missed in the summary.

..and what does "loose ground" mean, anyway? Some kind of freak geological phenomenon?

Re:Actually, TFA says IE is UNDER 70%

[pagaboy]

It should read "Firefox doesn't loosen ground". It was put in the article to stop anyone confusing a web browser with a spade. Simple typo.

Dupe

[RedShoeRider]

http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/07/15/124020 4 C'mon. Firefox handily beating up on IE is one of those tidbits that most of us store in the back of our brains. You'd think that the editors would keep a nugget like that in their brain as well, and when they see this 4 days later they'd think "Gee, I remember reading something like that". Maybe they thought they saw it on Digg.

May I be the first to say...

[Anonymous Coward]

GOODBYE to our erstwhile Exploring overlord?

Another poor dupe

[CajunArson]

1. This story is a dupe
2. Yay firefox... but honestly is it all that important? How about discussing ways we can actually get firefox to perform better? Now that's a conversation actually worth having, but it might involve thinking instead of rabid fanboyism & MS hatred, so don't expect to see it on Slashdot.
3. For the last freakin' time: Your mom is loose, you are just a loser can you finally get it right!!??!?!?!!

Re:Another poor dupe

[archen]

Heh, I've started to tire over the percentage statistics myself but after seeing this headline I feel a bit better. Just yesterday my company had an issue with accessing some vendor's website for various things - it just stopped working after they updated stuff. Turns out whatever update they did broke support in Firefox. They then state that they cannot be bothered to handle web browsers such as Firefox, and that we should use Internet Explorer or Safari.

Safari? I'm not watching the internet stats like a hawk but when has Safari ever broken the 5% barrier!? Every gain may force sites to support firefox. The more support for Firefox, the more pressure on Microsoft to actually fix IE and support standards.

Re:Another poor dupe

[suv4x4]

How about discussing ways we can actually get firefox to perform better?

The only solution would be some sort magical free CPU cycles over-unity processor. Steorn is working on it.

For the last freakin' time: Your mom is loose, you are just a loser can you finally get it right!!??!?!?!!

Your evil :(

Re:Another poor dupe

[init100]

How about discussing ways we can actually get firefox to perform better?

We can make it perform better by using adblocking extensions as well as NoScript and a handful of other addons. They (i.e. Mozilla) are working on making Firefox itself perform better, and they are progressing quite well. I have installed Gran Paradiso (Firefox 3 Alpha) in Windows on my home desktop, and it can give IE7 a run for its money, performance-wise.

loose any ground

[DogDude]

So then, is Firefox the name of a new roto-tiller? I'm confused.

To be fair, the Europeans do have rotten taste

[jollyreaper]

Witness the popularity of Jerry Lewis and David Hasselhoff.

Re:To be fair, the Europeans do have rotten taste

[iamdrscience]

Witness the popularity of Jerry Lewis and David Hasselhoff.

Dude, don't hassle the Hoff, okay?

Re:To be fair, the Europeans do have rotten taste

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't Jew the Ler, either!

Switching is fun.

I'm going to play with my Prune Face and Dick Tracy figurines.

"I'm Dick Tracy, take that Prune Face!"
"Now I'm Prune Face, take that Dick Tracy!"
"Now I'm Prune Tracy, take that Dick..."

Re:To be fair, the Europeans do have rotten taste

[jollyreaper]

Witness the popularity of Jerry Lewis and David Hasselhoff. Dude, don't hassle the Hoff, okay? Only if he stops singing. And take back the Beckams while you're at it.

Re:To be fair, the Europeans do have rotten taste

[simong]

Dude, Michael Bolton? Carrot Top? You septics don't even know what taste *is*.

Re:To be fair, the Europeans do have rotten taste

[mike2R]

Only if he stops singing. And take back the Beckams while you're at it.

Not a fucking chance mate, cheers!

Re:To be fair, the Europeans do have rotten taste

[EastCoastSurfer]

Posh is welcome in the states anytime...

continuing trend

[dcskier]

It's great to have the actual numbers but I don't find this too surprising given that linux adoption rates are also higher in Europe and Asia than here in Amurika. The whole open source and country independent software movement culturally fits better with left leaning Europe. I'd only think this trend would continue with Firefox as well as other open source alternatives in Europe.

Loose ground

[kbolino]

Well, I hope Firefox doesn't loose too much ground. It gets nasty when the mud starts flying.

Re:Loose ground

[obergfellja]

I wish people would RTFA. It states that Firefox didn't lose ground but IE did. and I hope to god that you are really referring to IE with the nastiness. In fact Firefox, between March's dates and July's dates has gained 3.7%. I don't mean to be hating on anyone, but please, for god-sake, RTFA and make sure you get your facts right.

Re:Loose ground

[dm0527]

Well, I hope Firefox doesn't loose too much ground. It gets nasty when the mud starts flying.

I wish people would RTFA. It states that Firefox didn't lose ground but IE did. and I hope to god that you are really referring to IE with the nastiness. In fact Firefox, between March's dates and July's dates has gained 3.7%. I don't mean to be hating on anyone, but please, for god-sake, RTFA and make sure you get your facts right.

Uh...reread parent and think to yourself what he or she was trying to say. "loose" ground...mud... (hint: look up the definition of "loose"). Perhaps you should understand the intent of a post prior to verbally jumping up and down on it.

It is to be expected

[Temposs]

One key to this trend is to note that Microsoft is not natively European. This means that Microsoft will naturally have less control over there than they do in the US. There is also less brand loyalty to a company based in the US as the reputation of the US takes a dive. I'm not sure, but it seems like a good portion of the world population internationally would like to stick it to the US any way they can, and sticking it to Microsoft could be seen as one way to accomplish that.

Since Mozilla is open source, it will have less of this perception of being bound to one country or another.

Re:It is to be expected

[Anonymous Coward]

I guess that's also the reason why McDonald's sales in France, of all European countries, grew by than 8% last year.

Re:It is to be expected

[echnaton192]

Nonsense. mozilla.org is based in the US.

But Firefox

- did never had those big holes in itself like MSIE 0.0 - 6.0 had.
- did never try to force you to use one search engine like MSIE 3.0 - 6.0 did
- does not patch it's holes once in a month even if exploits already exists. It patches them within hours, even if the problem lies within Windows
- doesn't show up hundreds of thousands of spy- share- and crippleware when you search for extensions
- doesn't overhaul the whole OS just to install a new browser
- doesn't lose it's settings like MSIE after (re-) installing the OS. Please try to backup your passwords, history, bookmarks, skin, the addons, all those little settings from MSIE 6 and move it to MSIE 7. Or from XP to Vista. Or even from one XP to another XP.

Some people here simply don't like the feeling that MS owns everything, while MS did not care for security nor privacy for ages. And they tell their friends to try Firefox. And they try out Firefox. And of course their friends like it. And they tell their friends....

My boss, for example, was very skeptical. But he tried Firefox's tabs and liked it (I am working at a web-support-line for a big investment company and we have to have 6 - 15 Windows open simultaneously, which is a pain in the butt if you don't have tabs), while MS still used one window per page. He started to use Firefox, but was still joking. But he started to use it at home for some strange reasons, like the better handling.

And then he learned that Firefox actually is more secure. When a problem appeared on the web concerning Firefox, it got fixed. Instantly. Still joking about Firefox.

And then he tried out the extensions and fell for them. Began to love Firefox. His biggest concern right now is losing his local administrator privileges and losing Firefox as well as he just became a bigger boss. Get the picture?

And speaking of Firefox as an cross-platform-browser and testing HTML-pages with this browser: Why argue with the OSS-multiplier who complains he doesn't want to use this shitty MS-crap? Or with the rich guy using Apple (hello customer with money to spare :), when you simply have to develop for *one more* browser besides MSIE to cover *every major OS on the market*?

Just my to (Euro-) cents.

Deja Vu all over again...

[nweaver]

And here I thought it was Sunday the 15th.

Come on ./ editors. The dupes are getting really annoying.

Re:Deja Vu all over again...

[iamdrscience]

Come on ./ editors. The dupes are getting really annoying.

Yeah, for the past ten years they've been fine, but just this week it's started to piss me off too.

Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[Opportunist]

Don't get me wrong, I love FF. This message (and all my previous ones) was written using FF. Still, with this trend I'll have to move away from it. Sadly, unhappily, but necessarily.

The reason is simple: Security. Yes, the security holes of FF aren't as blatant as those in IE (who ins his sane mind ties a browser with complete ActiveX support? I mean, be sensible!), but they exist and behold, they get used now. It's no longer "just a POC", FF exploits are becoming more and more important in malware business, especially since the advent of MPack and similar malware spreading suits.

It's not the best kind of security, trying to be secure from malware by using software that is uninteresting for untargeted malware spraying, because few people use it. But, well, it's one that at least kinda works against the everyday threats.

The question is, where to?

Re:Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[Gr8Apes]

Just load NoScript, Adblock, and Flashblock and be on your way.

Re:Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[TihSon]

Konqueror.

Re:Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[Opportunist]

My weapon of choice has been Privoxy. Pretty much what you suggest rolled into one, but without the need to disable JS altogether. So far, it's been quite able to block anything that offers a threat to FF.

Question is just how long. If there's a market, it will become interesting.

Re:Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[TheVelvetFlamebait]

Opera is pretty good if you don't mind a hideous, cluttered GUI that refuses to conform to the style set by the window manager. It doesn't take too much RAM and is very feature-rich.

BTW, the parent is NOT a flamebait and deserves to modded up, even if he is a little paranoid.

Re:Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[Gr8Apes]

I used something like Privoxy if not that product outright. The nice thing about the 3 I've mentioned is that you can selectively enable JS, Flash, and, gasp, ads with a simple right click, and still limit them to specific sites thus avoiding WebBugs of various sorts.

I'm not worried about threats to FF. I prefer to browse without all that bandwasting garbage that makes the desired content difficult to read. (JS Popups are expecially annoying).

Re:Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[Opportunist]

Funny enough, Privoxy is quite "intelligent" when it comes to blocking. I didn't have time to go through its source yet, but my guess is that it does a combination of URL based filtering (anything with "ad" in its name has a hard time coming through) along with behaviour based filtering. It's surprisingly accurate when it comes to determining whether the incoming traffic is something you want or something that bugs you. It only fails when sites behave like advertisers (i.e. when a page tries to open a popup from an unrelated server or similar), but in general, I'd give it my recommendation.

And so far, it's been very successful at blocking iframe and script exploits malware suits like MPack use to get their malware through.

Re:Time to switch browser, for security purposes

[Gr8Apes]

Now I remember why I stopped using it, it has issues with content from third party caching sites or split web sites (www.somesite.com vs images.somesite.com or site.akami.net e.g.) or used to. It mattered because a specific site I rendered a lot did both of those.

loose != lose

[PhotoGuy]

Come on editors, this is grade 3 stuff.

loose = adjective; "It is loose, like sleeve of wizard"
lose = verb; opposite of win/gain. "My sister wished she didn't lose her virginity to Bilo"

Re:loose != lose

[Aladrin]

Yeah, too bad that's not exactly right.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/loose

A small sample:

verb (used with object)
20. to let loose; free from bonds or restraint.
21. to release, as from constraint, obligation, or penalty.

Over-generalising isn't going to help them remember. It'll only confuse them more when they encounter a less common usage, and think they've got it backwards again.

Re:loose != lose

[gzerphey]

So wait... now even the grammar Nazis have grammar Nazis?

Re:loose != lose

[Belacgod]

It's the grammar Waffen SS!

Re:loose != lose

[a.d.trick]

Even there, 'loose' is not the word they want. Loose in that sense is still a different word. If you take that definition, the sentance would have approximate meaning (in modern langauge) of "Internet Explorer continues to liberate dirt." which seems to be a fancy way of calling IE a plow.

Re:loose != lose

[Aladrin]

My object is not to prove the submitter correct (they aren't, under any stretch of the imagination) but to show this reply as woefully narrow in vision.

Re:loose != lose

[Aladrin]

Grammar Nazis make no distinction. ;)

FF at 63% for Windows power users

[Eric Pierce]

I show FF users at ~63% for a website I maintain for a OSS/Windows power user app.

http://virtuawin.sourceforge.net/website_stats.php

EP

Re:FF at 63% for Windows power users

[phonewebcam]

Yes, a similar figure at http://www.phonewebcam.com/ but with that being (obviously) geared to cellphone users you'll start to see mobile browser market share eat into these figures too.

Re:FF at 63% for Windows power users

[obergfellja]

when i had my site up (earlier this year) i recieved 49% Firefox, 47% IE, and what left left for Safari and Konqueror.

Re:FF at 63% for Windows power users

[CmdrGravy]

My site shows FF at around 27% and various versions of IE at around 65% which is a definite change from a year or so ago when FF was hovering at around 12%

BBspot

[MrMonty]

What, no link to the pertinent article on BBspot?

Just to help you remember...

[Anonymous Coward]

The word loose can be used to describe one's butthole after having practiced anal intercourse.

Before:
(__x__) (this is a tight butthole)

After:
(__O__) (this is a loose butthole)

What the Hell?

[asphaltjesus]

...but since last march the trend reversed

Maybe you really aren't a Microsoft shill, but you sure sound like one.

4 tabs open in IE7 and firefox + both minimised > ie7 using 4MB! firefox is using 60MB! wtf?

This is a logical fallacy of some crazy kind. Is IE a standalone application that's reporting its *actual* memory use? Very doubtful.

How about the dog-slowedness of rendering in IE7? Wait. don't tell me it's rocket-fast for you right?
http://www.google.com/search?q=ie7+slow&ie=utf-8&o e=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client =firefox-a

Re:What the Hell?

[sl33p3r]

http://www.google.com/search?q=firefox+slow&ie=utf -8&o%20e=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official &client%20=firefox-a
Just changed one word in your url. Is this proving anything?

Wow, is Mozilla going to "stay the course"?

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, it seems that Firefox only has a 28% approval rating. Guess who else only has (at most) a 28% approval rating? GWB!!!

George W Bush = Firefox.

Stay the course, guys. Victory against Microsoft is just around the corner.

Re:Wow, is Mozilla going to "stay the course"?

[nbert]

We are talking Europe here, so you'd have to move the decimal point at least 2 digits to the left regarding GWB...

Re:Wow, is Mozilla going to "stay the course"?

[1336]

Cute, but that's kind of like saying a balloon released from the ground is the same as a bowling ball released from near the top of a 100 story skyscraper as they pass each other at the 28th floor :)

Re:Wow, is Mozilla going to "stay the course"?

[sakasune]

I was going to say something to the effect that GWB is going down while FF is going up, but you're take on it is so much more elegant. If only I had mod points.
Soon the bowling ball will be out of office...

numbers

[Ryan Monster]

Is this statistic from the same people who calculated the European HD-DVD market share?

But Spooz Toolz is up 170%

[Anonymous Coward]

http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=SPZI.PK

May be "poor security to you..."

[Joce640k]

....but to me "loose" is an easy girl!

Re:May be "poor security to you..."

[EggyToast]

That means she has poor security and lets anything in.

Re:May be "poor security to you..."

[Mattintosh]

It could also be a description of her lack of snugness after she has let everything in.

Ok, ok, we get it

[Klaidas]

As much as like that firefox's share is increasing (CSS rendering...), we get it! How slow is this news day? Enough! + or - one two percents, who cares.

And?

[realdodgeman]

Firefox doesn't loose ground in any of the countries."

Why should it?

The ascension of firefox vulnerabilities

[Anonymous Coward]

Continues at a rapid pace as well. It seems everytime I run it lately its downloading an update for something.

Stop Bickering, Stop Posting

[goldglovecb]

To me, as a web engineer in the BI-industry, I get really tired of these browser stories in general. I especially grow tired of Firefox vs. IE stories. Not only are they often presented out of context, but they glamorize a one browser over another. When I read these stories, it almost always seems slanted towards Firefox promotion. For example, if you rearrange the headline to say "Firefox up to 28% market share", the gains it makes don't seem as impressive as the loss IE takes, if it is even accurate. That aside, who really cares what browser others use? Web developers. So, to the development community, what is the "stuff that matters" and what is just childish bickering? FF market share doesn't alleviate the fact developers still have to deal with the inconsistencies between browsers. Even if FF had 90% of the market, we'd still have to accomodate te other 10%. Believing 100% FF adoption is possible to alleviate these burdens by posting slanted stories is naive.

I would much rather see stories about progress towards a standard browser engine, something that will display code the same way no matter which browser you use. Let non-critical user features fuel the browser war. I won't hold my breath for that, but in the meantime it'd be nice to see these trivial (at least to me) stories drop off.

Re:Stop Bickering, Stop Posting

[Doctor Crumb]

As a web developer, the only browser share stat I care about is the decline of IE6. I can develop a website that works in safari, opera, firefox, and IE7 without pain or suffering. I then have to take 10 times as long to get it to work in IE6. Hoping for "standard browser engine" is stupid because we already *have* standards that all of the other major browsers are obeying; all we need to do is get rid of the non-standards-conformant browser that currently has ~40% market share. This is why any decline in IE, especially IE6, is stuff that matters to me.

Re:Stop Bickering, Stop Posting

[echnaton192]

Good luck. The last banks here in a big, developed european country just abandoned OS/2 a few weeks ago, using Netscape 4.61 (no joking!) and switched to.... tataaa.... Windows XP with MSIE 6 :(

In some cases, it-nerds sticking to stone-age hard- and software because it's been "approved" should simply get their own, personal stoning. They said "Jehova" a hundred times, ladies, I mean guys.

You even get e-mails from those guys complaining the customer-game on your website (not the site for the business-partners) does not support flash 5 when flash 9 (!) is already out.

killkillkillkillkillkill

On the topic of Crapware...

[john g the 4th]

Reading the post, I noticed a contradiction... "no crapware" and "it comes with Windows Vista Basic Home"

Re:On the topic of Crapware...

[Anonymous Coward]

You probably meant to reply to a different story.

Since I see this sort of mishap quite often, I have to ask, was this your mistake or are you sure you clicked 'reply' in the right story - in which case this might be some obscure Slashcode bug?

Issues of popularity and minority

[Anonymous Coward]

Europe. Popularity. Anyone remember the Amiga?

Follow your own advice

[Foerstner]

Firefox's market share may be of primary interest to web developers, but it's also relevant to the general OSS and Mac user communities as well.

Why? Because IE isn't just another browser. It's a Windows-only browser with proprietary features (ActiveX, etc.) that promotes lock-in. So lots of people care about IE's market share, and lots of people, for all sorts of selfish resons, want IE to fail.

Don't like it? Fine, follow your own advice and STFU already.

Re:Follow your own advice

[goldglovecb]

I agree with Dr. Crumb. Perhaps "standard browser engine" was a poor choice of words to describe my point, which was more in the vein that browser vendors don't promote standard releases. Of course we have standards, one only need look at the W3C. While browser vendors are getting better about supporting such standards, there are still inconsistencies between which version of a standard is supported across multiple browsers. It's a pipe dream to think every vendor will agree to release versions that support new standards in unison, mostly because they're all trying to beat their competition to the market. Again, I won't hold my breath.

Whether intentional or not, I believe Dr. Crumb highlights a point too. How much market share FF has is irrelevant to the usage statistics within IE. That's one good example of why I feel stories like these are slanted. They just don't hit the real concerns, rather they encourage the "selfish reasons" mentioned above by taking formulated results out of context.

Just to clarify, my comments were not targeted at the readers of /., rather the quality of stories being posted. If I want to see how the OSS community compares to the proprietary market, I'd rather see a comprehensive story about the controversy in commercial OSS or what percentage of a Fortune 1K company is OSS vs. Proprietary apps. FF is just too small to base an opinion on, yet stories about it pop up all the time.

Why isn't the headline "Firefox rising"?

[turly]

Just wondering...

Surprisingly, not really

[Stevecrox]

I'm sure I'll get bashed but have you seen the amount of software that also tries to install Firefox with itself from Adobe Acrobat to Divx all have Firefox set to default install themselves. Applications that in no way using a internet browser now have firefox in the installers, why is this? I'm glad we will be getting more browser competition but are firefox's methods any better than Microsofts?

Re:Surprisingly, not really

[Bert64]

Better maybe not, but necessary yes...
If everyone else plays dirty, you have to aswell, otherwise you lose.
If we get to a position where browsers are standards compliant, and compete on product quality... It benefits everyone in the end.

70% as a limit?

[Rytis]

I have read in a book on strategic thinking that once QWERTY (as opposed to Dvorak) would decline to 70% of overall usage, Dvorak would finally overtake it. Maybe it's the same thing here with Firefox.

Missing S

[6Yankee]

IE is, indeed, droppings.

Because of cleaner and more productive experience

[giorgosts]

Stats from a major technical site in Greece, one with the biggest traffic in the country, www.adslgr.com http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/2701/browserandop eratingsystzd0.png Firefox 56%, IE6 15.5%, IE7 12.5%, Opera 5%. (Interestingly enough, XP 78%, Vista 8%, Linux 6.5%, Apple 1.5%)

What is this IE of which you speak?

[WillAffleckUW]

Is it something like Opera?

Stats from the US

[Anonymous Coward]

Here are some stats from a major US company for the month of June. This data was gathered from over 800MM page views. AC for obvious reasons.

1 Microsoft Internet Explorer 6.0 44.20%
2 Microsoft Internet Explorer 7.0 31.40%
3 Mozilla Firefox 2.0 12.10%
4 Mozilla Firefox 1.5.0.1 3.10%
5 Safari 2.0.4 3.00%
6 Microsoft Internet Explorer 6.0 (AOL) 1.60%
7 Microsoft MSN Explorer 9.0 0.70%
8 Safari 1.3.2 0.50%
9 Mozilla Firefox 1.5.0 0.40%
10 Mozilla Firefox 1.0.7 0.30%
11 Microsoft Internet Explorer 5.5 0.20%
12 Mozilla Firefox 1.0 0.20%
13 Safari (unknown version) 0.20%
14 Netscape Navigator 3.0 0.20%
15 Netscape Navigator 7.2 0.20%
16 Netscape Navigator 8.1 0.20%
17 Mozilla (Gecko) 1.8 0.10%
18 Microsoft MSN Explorer 6.1 0.10%
19 Mozilla Firefox 1.0.6 0.10%
20 Safari 2.0.3 0.10%
21 Mozilla Firefox 1.0.4 0.10%
22 Microsoft Internet Explorer 5.01 0.10%
23 Microsoft Internet Explorer 5.0 0.10%

IE dropping and IIS rising

[jocknerd]

The end is near.

Re:IE dropping and IIS rising

[flyingfsck]

"The end is near"

Hmm, in geological time yes, give or take a few million years...

Losing ground?

[internetcommie]

Those who throw dirt, lose ground. I think that means M$?

Throw a party

[suv4x4]

Enjoy this while it lasts, before you know it Microsoft will come and kick Firefox in the nuts. The stats you see are result of more than 7 years IE abandonment.

I'm not even commenting on which browser is better, that's not of significance*.

PS: I'm a Firefox user and web developer.

Here's Looking to IE8

[PingPongBoy]

66.6 - some may say that is as it should be, but as some regard IE as the de facto standard after all these years, it is quite a good thing for some downward pressure on the market share since that would urge Microsoft to make IE less complaint-worthy. I use IE, as it is almost good enough for what I'm doing and I'm so used to it. However, this news is making me think quite seriously of trying Firefox although I believe the web sites that I favor have been designed to have to work in IE.

My biggest complaint, from my usage requirements, is that IE will flake out if tabs are opened closed opened closed opened closed about 7+ times. I'm reluctant to open more than 4 IE processes with 4 tabs each. My procedure is to never close a tab and instead drag links from one IE window to another. There seems to be an artificial limit on the number of tabs one can have per process, the number of processes, and the number of times a tab can be closed before the process has to be restarted.

IE7 has been a big stability improvement over IE6 for me, so let's hope IE8 is even better. The trend of software seems to have taken a most bizarre turn. Options have become either removed or hidden, and everything is moved around so much on the front end that you spend so much time fiddling around you forget what was ever there before. It's probably a gimmick to make you look for the next version to think you are getting something better but all you get is what used to be around.

So let's standardize the interface to all components and documents in order for open source software to be programmable for everything. That way, if I don't like a certain version of software for a certain task I can use a different version. Marketers are forcing us to continually upgrade and in too many cases it's a needless expense. Increases in the population of programmers should have provided more new features and easier compatibility instead of confusion and anxiety.

Re:Here's Looking to IE8

[echnaton192]

What is the big deal? Firefox brings its own settings and doesn't effect your system as every file is put to the firefox-directory or its profile. Simply try it. It won't bite :)

And of course you could keep MSIE as your main browser. It's not as if you were changing your mailclient or something. Like you could use notepad AND word ;)

MSIE sucks, Firefox is nice, it's as simple as that.

Try out the free add ons.

http://www.mozilla.com/

Both browsers have problems

[wertarbyte]

While I prefer Firefox myself, I got into trouble with both IE and Firefox. As a hobby project, I run a website about my university cafeteria: You can retrieve the menu there in various forms, including a web page, RSS feeds, and a CSV interface. For this interface, I created a firefox extension using XUL. If you want to try it, be warned: XUL documentation is either non existing, or outdated. developing consisted mainly of trial and error (and of course skimming other extension, which probably did the same).

On the other hand, IE has massive trouble displaying the page: While Konqueror, Mozilla, Firefox, Safari all do fine, every version of IE does something wrong - and never the same thing: Check Browsershots.org for the horror gallery (and yes, the site is XHTML and CSS compliant).

/. perspective on Lose vs Loose

[BForrester]

Loose is how we describe women who give native and/or non-native English speakers a hard one.

Go Firefox!

[jfalkner]

Firefox (http://www.mozilla.org) is one of the primary reasons that IE is dropping. I wish more folks in the U.S. would try it out. Many popular websites such as gmail.com work on Firefox but don't quite work as expected on IE, especially the new IE.

Choice...

[l0rd.47hl0n]

Microsoft take note. See what happens when users are given a choice?

My web stats for June

[Intron]

No. Hits 304's KBytes sent Browser
1 19280 42.65% 1051 13.35% 322071 Mozilla/5.*
2 15609 34.53% 4831 61.37% 172549 MSIE 6.*
3 6316 13.97% 1734 22.03% 61428 MSIE 7.*
4 930 2.06% 0 0.00% 47572 msnbot/1.*
5 431 0.95% 117 1.49% 1689 Mozilla/4.*
6 402 0.89% 0 0.00% 143 Baiduspider
7 326 0.72% 0 0.00% 2159 libwww-perl/5.*
8 313 0.69% 70 0.89% 1635 Opera/9.*
9 226 0.50% 22 0.28% 1581 MSIE 5.*
10 134 0.30% 0 0.00% 1842 Speedy Spider

This is bad news. Once MSIE drops below 50%, all of the malware will be targeting Firefox.

Slovenia first?

[attackiko]

The results are incorrect. Slovenia can't be on the list - they haven't even discovered dentistry

Re:Slovenia first?

[messner_007]

The results are incorrect. Slovenia can't be on the list - they haven't even discovered dentistry ...

I don't know where are you from. But if your dentists are using lasers, then there is a big posibility that they come from Slovenia.

http://www.fotona.si/medical/index.asp
http://www.fotona.si/about_fotona.asp

Where are you from ? If you healtcare sucks, then you can come to us - to Slovenia. We will make you smile like Claudia Shiffer:
http://www.bkstudio.si/index.php?option=com_conten t&task=view&id=148&Itemid=197

Still MS demands IE for a lot of their services

[fluor2]

I am an "IT professional" and every time I visit Microsoft.com for various purposes, I have to use IE, since their ActiveX stuff and other stuff. E.g. downloading from msdn and similar.

For all other purposes I happily use Firefox. It feels like pain every time I have to start IE.

Re:Still MS demands IE for a lot of their services

[echnaton192]

Tried this?
http://ietab.mozdev.org/

My numbers from april

[Pegasus]

Here's a link to my previous comment on this topic. Not much has changed and I still see such large numbers as propaganda.

Re:My numbers from april

[giorgosts]

Slower than opera it may be, but due to the various blocking filters used, it provides a cleaner and more productive Internet experience. Although if widely used, website revenue will drop, cause no-one will view the various adds and banners.

Firebug

[Anonymous Coward]

I know this is about Firefox usage, but the number reason developers should use Firefox more often is
Firebug. From the website:

Firebug integrates with Firefox to put a wealth of web development tools at your fingertips while you browse. You can edit, debug, and monitor CSS, HTML, and JavaScript live in any web page.

Slovenia first

[messner_007]

Slovenia is the country, where people are using a smart browser ..

We are number one ;))))

http://www.slovenia.info/?lng=2

But! IE is NOT dead !

[freaker_TuC]

Netcraft didn't confirm it yet