Microsoft Plans Flickr Competitor

An anonymous reader writes "Judging by newly posted job calls, Microsoft is now working on a Flickr-like online photo service. ZDNet reports: '"This feature team is building a next-generation photo and video sharing service that will compete with Flickr, SmugMug and other photo web solutions today. This is a 'v1' opportunity," the ad said. And video will be a part of the effort, too: "This role will work across the new Windows Live division with teams like Spaces, SkyDrive, Messenger and Hotmail to construct a winning strategy for Microsoft in photo and video sharing." Evidently, Microsoft sees the effort as an online extension of its current desktop technology.' Gundeep Hora, at CoolTechZone, feels that such a service is unlikely to succeed, and lays out the numerous challenges the company will face upon entering the market."

Comments

Say what?

[ackthpt]

'Evidently, Microsoft sees the effort as an online extension of its current desktop technology.'

Is this this same strategy which has brought us massive code bloat at the cost of random number security?

One of these days, someone is going to come up with an April Fools 'Virtual Wombat Herding' and Microsoft will "innovate" their own incarnation as it will be seen as a vital extension of its current desktop technology and won't they look the silly buggers.

Re:Say what?

[caffeinemessiah]

Don't write off MS on this one just yet. There are some very talented people at MS Research who have been working on some really cool algorithms for photo manipulation: Phototours, Groupshot, Photosynth. If they manage to string it all together in a decent UI, it might be MS's best and most successful effort at something cool and useful.

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

Considering that so-called "flaw" in random number generation was bogus (it doesn't work on anything more recent than Windows 2000), it's a pretty bad example. You are essentially citing an article which was custom-created to simply grab headlines at the expense of the truth. Good job: lying to bash MS raises your Slashdot street cred.

However, I see nothing wrong with MS adding more value onto their Live service. If Google can keep coming up with more ways to add your confidential info to their NSA data mine, I see nothing wrong with MS adding ways for people who have hotmail accounts to do more stuff. Personally, I'd trust Microsoft with my private info far more than I'd ever trust Google.

But hey, keep MS-bashing. It will boost your karma with all the other rabidly insane and delusional MS haters around here.

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

There are some very talented people at MS Research who have been working on some really cool algorithms for photo manipulation: Phototours, Groupshot, Photosynth. Yes, keep your eye on the master of innovation where tomorrow's headline will read "Microsoft Plans <insert well known product here> Competitor!"

They've got fields of bugs and security issues to address, fix those or at the least make something new and refreshing that provides something we don't already have a solution to!

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

That's what I was thinking as well. The photosynth demo I believe was using Flickr photos to create the 3d images. However, remember also that MS has a stake in Facebook now too.

It's quite easy to see a potential integration between Facebook (through some app), MSN Messenger, Photosynth, and their Flickr competitor that could produce some interesting results.

Re:Say what?

[$RANDOMLUSER]

You forgot Windows Media Photo, which is more like how Microsoft likes to operate.

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

Can you, by chance, name any other successful, cool and useful, endeavours that Microsoft has produced over the years? They seem to be escaping me at the moment.

No. XBOX Live does not count.

Re:Say what?

[miffo.swe]

"There are some very talented people at MS Research who have been working on some really cool algorithms for photo manipulation: Phototours, Groupshot, Photosynth." This is offset by the number of not so talanted people in PR and SALES that adds useless features while making the ones good be buried deep down in a swamp of security issues because some PHB decided it should be as much tied into the desktop as possible. All while the talented people at MS Research scream in horror. MS Research is just props to give the impression that MS does innovate things, it has no effect at all over Microsofts products. Even if they innovated the best damn OS function in the world it still wouldnt be implemented in Windows until a competitior did it.

Re:Say what?

[Guido von Guido]

Where did all the talented people at Xerox PARC get Xerox? The issue here isn't that Microsoft doesn't have talented people (it does), or that Microsoft doesn't have some innovative research products going (they do). The issue is: can they get this to market successfully? Their track record with projects outside their core area of expertise is not so great.

We'll see, though.

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's quite easy to see a potential integration between Facebook (through some app), MSN Messenger, Photosynth, and their Flickr competitor that could produce some interesting results.

Interesting to who? Facebook is part of a soon to pop bouble al la 1999 - 2000 tech implosion. Thes "properties" are has-beens.

Re:Say what?

[ackthpt]

However, I see nothing wrong with MS adding more value onto their Live service.

The point you missed in your tirade is this: Microsoft is again off on another front to compete with products which do something not connected to any operating system, though provide services on the internet, core to a business. Microsoft should leave these to companies which focus on them, work with the companies and to function in ways Microsoft may consider beneficial, but leave the burden of the business to those companies. Microsoft is like some octopus which grows arms as it sees each need and has now become so cumbersome it can't take care of job number one, which is create an operating system.

Re:Say what?

[ackthpt]

Can you, by chance, name any other successful, cool and useful, endeavours that Microsoft has produced over the years? They seem to be escaping me at the moment

I'm hard pressed to, though I'm certain they have some somewhere. Typically Microsoft, as a corporate strategy, wait for something successful to emerge, then copy it. A company needs to grow, but Microsoft seem to see themselves as the end-all be-all, grow into markets which have only the most tenuous connection to their core products.

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

The point you missed in your tirade is this: Microsoft is again off on another front to compete with products which do something not connected to any operating system, though provide services on the internet, core to a business.

Again, I have to repeat... you are bashing Microsoft for the same thing you give a free pass to Google and Apple and Lunix for.

Google is an advertising company. Apple is a hardware company. Lunix is a tech toy tinkerer project. All of them are engaged in doing stuff outside of their core area. So why do you feel it's important to bag on MS, but praise the others for the exact same actions?

Oh, I already know the answer: because they are teh Mikkkr0$$$l0th, and dey r teh 3vil!!!111!!1 In other words, you are simply reading off the list of Slashdot talking points: no thinking required (and is, in fact, discouraged).

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree. MS should not be written off just yet. There is little doubt that, like Vista, the long incubation period will produce a clear market in winner that will thoroughly trounce the .Mac service from 2002. Go, Ballmer, go!

Re:Say what?

[moore.dustin]

Oh really?

MSN.com/Live does well - they pull around 20% of search results of site I manage. Their ISP venture is still alive and kicking too.

Your right though, it isn't like the Xbox has been a huge success... oh wait...

Re:Say what?

[BlueMerle]

Where did all the talented people at Xerox PARC get Xerox? The issue here isn't that Microsoft doesn't have talented people (it does), or that Microsoft doesn't have some innovative research products going (they do). The issue is: can they get this to market successfully? Their track record with projects outside their core area of expertise is not so great. We'll see, though.

That's a good analogy, and I think it all has to do with corporate culture. It wouldn't surprise me to find out that groups within MS had the lead on many current web 2.0 offerings but couldn't get it out the door. It's not that individuals don't get it, it's that the corporate culture there doesn't get it. If every idea has to be approved by multiple committees and multiple departments it all starts to look like strained peas.

They would almost be better off if they allowed small groups of developers to go to marked with some ideas and gave them a small piece of the pie. That would quickly weed out the crap, and the bad developers.

Re:Say what?

[rtyhurst]

The point you are missing is that Microsoft is a freaking octopus.

They do everything, and they do everything badly.

Numerous anti-trust suits, obscene backwards incompatibility issues, FUD... these are the freaks you'd like to have running a Flickr competitor?

Why?

Re:Say what?

[smooth wombat]

One of these days, someone is going to come up with an April Fools 'Virtual Wombat Herding' . . .

Hey! I resent that remark! Putting wombat and Microsoft in the same sentence is an insult to all the decent, fuzzy wombats of the world.

Re:Say what?

[Dragonslicer]

Can you, by chance, name any other successful, cool and useful, endeavours that Microsoft has produced over the years? Their hardware (keyboards, mice, Sidewinder gamepad) is usually pretty good. I really liked Freelancer, too. Personally, I like C# and .Net, though you can always debate exactly how much credit Microsoft should get for cloning Java and making a few improvements on it. I thought Windows Media Player (at least around versions 9 and 10) was decent enough, or at least not so bad that I went out and searched for other programs for the small amount of music I listened to on my computer.

Re:Say what?

[Plutonite]

How about Visual Studio 2005, the very best IDE for C++ development that I have ever used(after vim)? Anyway, GP was not talking about software methinks, Microsoft Research is a whole 'nother thing, and yes their people are very good. They produce quality academic papers all the time, and are mostly PhDs/experts in various areas of CS. I've turned down soft.eng jobs for MS, but a research position in those labs would be a privilege.

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

20% is piss poor considering they control the operating system (and thus the default search preferences) for 90+% of the systems on the internet.

Re:Say what?

[whoever57]

Your right though, it isn't like the Xbox has been a huge success..

Success? Measured how? Clearly not in terms of profit. One might wonder how much talent it takes to create a product which only sells due to billions of dollars of losses that the seller is prepared to accept.

And that should be "You're", not "Your".

Re:Say what?

[moore.dustin]

Measured by investment vs return for their stockholders. Posting a profit for the first time is a big step and was forecasted to do exactly this 2 years ago. It is a business model that spans many years and was launched knowing full well they would see losses for years. Microsoft entered the console gaming market and is doing very well by the looks of things. The XBox is a household brand and the Halo series has a stranglehold on the top title spot. Do you think the stockholders see the Xbox as a failure? Nope, they are banking on its long term success as it is already built into the stock price, making the Xbox a success.

Re:Say what?

[Anonymous Coward]

MS does far too much "me too" software these days. Maybe they should stick to what they do best, operating systems and office software... oh, wait...

Re:Say what?

[ackthpt]

An angry, irrational response from a Microsoft Fanboi. Why else post as AC?

Re:Say what?

[Macthorpe]

No. XBOX Live does not count. Why not? Because it proves you wrong?

Re:Say what?

[mabhatter654]

only because they have massive profit to sink into the ventures. This sounds like another Microsoft "me too" announcement... call us when it's ready, working and good!

Re:Say what?

[clifgriffin]

Yes, and the xbox will never be able to compete with Nintendo and Sony either.

Microsoft has shown itself to be very good at breaking into markets it wants to be in. It does not have a perfect success rate, but their money, people, and determination should not be discounted.

A photo sharing site is relatively simple in the grand scheme of things and I think that website like Flickr do not offer anything so special that it will be hard for Microsoft to meet and beat their offering.

The question is whether they can convince users to come on over. As a Flickr user myself, I'd have to say that I'd definitely be open to switching sites if a better offering existed. That is not a slam on Flickr. It's just reality.

Re:Say what?

[npsimons]

An angry, irrational response from a Microsoft Fanboi. Why else post as AC?

To post an angry irrational response from an Apple Fanboi?

Re:Say what?

[Achromatic1978]

Hilarious. I love Slashdot.

"Too many people are using Live Search. MS is abusing their monopoly! Wah!"

"Only x per cent are using Live Search. They should be able to do more, what with their monopoly. They suck! Hah!"

Clowns.

Re:Say what?

[ConceptJunkie]

There are many awesomely talented people at Microsoft _and_ MS research, but their management has over 30 years of experience in quashing any productivity, good ideas and real innovation from what they produce.

I worked at AOL for 15 months ending in 2006. There were some awesomely talented people at AOL too, and although most have left now, many still remain. You wouldn't know it because management was even more effective at completely destroying any good ideas, cancelling any project that was making progress or simply sabotaging good technology because of self-interest, prejudice, or just plain old spite. AOL's management has graven in stone that their products will only target the lowest of the lowest common denominator, and although they bandied the word "long tail" quite a bit, and even seemed to know what it meant, nothing ever came of it.

Microsoft likewise is unlikely to actually release anything that doesn't treat the customer with utter contempt and ham-fisted attempts to force lock-in to the morbidly bloated and slightly rotting corpus of Microsoft-only technology, despite all the brilliant innovations at MS research and the non-management techies. Their management is too consumed with a monomaniacal hatred of competition, coming straight from the multiple Y-chromosome evolutionary throwback running the company these days. Microsoft would rather self-destruct than succeed if it means having to compete fairly, and not annihilating, by any means, any company that would produce something better. Nothing else explains the big wad of "screw you" that is Vista.

That's not exaggerated a bit, is it?

Re:Say what?

[caffeinemessiah]

touche, and hence my hope that they SOMEHOW manage to bypass the BS -- there can never be *enough* well-translated research-based products in the market, even if its hoping for too much.

Re:Say what?

[fonik]

Windows Mobile 6 is pretty sweet. It's functional, pretty and almost never crashes. Feel free to reply with your horror stories, everybody.

Re:Say what?

[xhrit]

Freelancer was developed by Digital Anvil and bought by Microsoft.
Windows Media Player is built on technology that was developed by VXtreme, Inc and bought by Microsoft.
C# and .NET were built using recycled Visual J++ technology developed by Anders Hejlsberg after Microsoft gave him one million dollars to leave his position as Borland's lead developer.
Sidewinder gamepad was built using technology developed by EXOS, Inc and bought by Microsoft.

Who need innovation?

Re:Say what?

[tehcyder]

Can you, by chance, name any other successful, cool and useful, endeavours that Microsoft has produced over the years? They seem to be escaping me at the moment.

I remember they tried to get people interested in all that Windows and Office shit, but almost no-one bought their stuff.

Maybe they'll have better luck with the new paradigm of a proper Web 2.0 social networking mashup service cloud concept sort of thing.

It's a trap!

[Wellington Grey]

They just want to feed the machine!

-Grey

Re:It's a trap!

[jag7720]

They invented nothing... he even says... "technology gained by an acquisition" MS is nothing but a buyer...

Re:It's a trap!

[MisterSquid]

Whatever the origin of the technology demonstrated in the link you post, that is one of the most amazing demonstrations I've seen of semantic relationships gleaned from metadata. Blaise Aguera y Arcas implies Photosynth constructs these relationships through automation though there are likely dozens of humans who tweaked and corrected the information for his presentation. Even so, the demo is mind-blowing. Screw the mod who marked you troll.

Hey we're Microsoft

[Anonymous Coward]

We've never had an original idea of our own. See how we attack every possible market but can no longer even produce a decent OS.

come on MS....

[AmaDaden]

MS has yet to make one web app that gained any real steam. Do they really think they stand a chance of uprooting flicker? I thought they learned their lesson and deiced to just buy people who know what they are doing.

Re:come on MS....

[Anonymous Coward]

One word. Hotmail.

Re:come on MS....

[graphicsguy]

Hotmail.

Yuck!

Re:come on MS....

[miffo.swe]

Wich was extremely popular when Microsoft bought it and had a very large userbase. It took them many long and hard years to even get the most basic stuff off of *nix. Several trial ended in horror and they had to revert back to *nix more than once. Thats not a good example of a success.

Re:come on MS....

[pthor1231]

Hotmail was bought out by MS as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotmail#Development_history

Re:come on MS....

[CrazyTalk]

Except for, oh I don't know, Internet Explorer?

Re:come on MS....

[AmaDaden]

Technically, yes you can call IE a web app(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_application). However the common definition of web apps is a web page that has some kind of huge back end that can do something impressive, Like hotmail and flicker. IE is far more considered a web browser then a web app. Even if it was a web app it only got to where it was because it came with Windows. It did not have to earn being used. It only had to earn not being replaced. And now it's losing that battle too.

Re:come on MS....

[maxume]

Windows update is pretty popular.

Value proposition?

[realinvalidname]

Great, a Flickr/YouTube wannabe that only works on Windows and XBoxes. So who actually wants this?

Re:Value proposition?

[rilarios]

probably more than 80% of the people with computers, or more than 50 million XBOX users. So noone really.

Re:Value proposition?

[realinvalidname]

Yeah, but still, it looks like nothing more than a "me too" service, which works with fewer clients than its Ajax/Flash-based competitors. So again: who, other than Microsoft, gets any value out of this?

Re:Value proposition?

[pimpimpim]

Sorry, I tried installing silverlight, or whatever it is called, because a windows-fanatic friend of mine was making a website with it. Guess what, it didn't install on XP on my PC. Just an 'the OS or browser is not supported' error.

If they will make their apps based on directx 10 and vista and huge .net libraries and all that shizzle, it won't work on most of that 80% of PCs either.

Tired of MS

[Anonymous Coward]

I for one am getting very tired of Microsoft just trying to be everything to everbody. Just get over it and die already. Be happy that you are the largest "software" company and be done with it. I'd swear they are trying to be another branch of government. Focus on your products and leave people in totally other businesses alone.

Not flaming, just laughing...

[Otter]

Gundeep Hora, at CootTechZone...

I was disappointed to find that that's a typo -- it sounded like a great site: "Get off my Second Life lawn, you lousy kids!"

Oh yeah?

[Wellington Grey]

"We want to make it easy and fun to enjoy your photos and videos, whether that is on the PC in your office, the Media Center in your living room, the XBox in your entertainment center, or on your mobile device when you are out and about."

Oh yeah? What about my iPod, Bill?

-Grey

Re:Oh yeah?

[pak9rabid]

Oh yeah? What about my iPod, Bill?

Or my Ubuntu box, Steve (Ballmer)?

Re:Oh yeah?

[Anonymous Coward]

He said mobile device, didn't he? It'll doubtless have an RSS feed for tags/albums/whatever model it uses, you can pull that into iPhoto, and sync it to your iPod. Don't be stupid.

Re:Oh yeah?

[Anonymous Coward]

"We want to make it easy and fun to enjoy your photos and videos, whether that is on the PC in your office, the Media Center in your living room, the XBox in your entertainment center, or on your mobile device when you are out and about."

Oh yeah? What about my iPod, Bill?

You should be asking Steve, Grey. If your closed iPod/iTunes system supported open-standard UPnP (like WinAmp/MusicMatch/Yahoo does), then your iPod would be supported.

Re:Oh yeah?

[Anonymous Coward]

Or PS3, Wii, PSP?

Buzzword alert

[RandoX]

I'm always hesitant when I see phrases like "construct a winning strategy"... Cut the BS, what's going to make it better for me that what's out there already?

Re:Buzzword alert

[Anonymous Coward]

They're trying to synergise their Web 2.0 leveragability.

Re:Buzzword alert

[pak9rabid]

"construct a winning strategy

Sounds like someone's putting their MBA to good use.

Slightly off topic

[saibot834]

But Flickr just got its two billionth picture.

Anyone Notice something ....?

[Archangel Michael]

Has anyone noticed that MS has completely stop any semblance of innovation or improvement upon products, and is now instead chasing every single idea in Tech simultaneously?

Google, Yahoo, Linux, Apple .... the list is getting longer everyday. At some point, the death by a thousand cuts will occur. No single cut will have killed, only the combination of all of them.

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[Anonymous Coward]

Huh? Their new photo handling research is incredible! It's been linked here a bunch of times, with mostly positive spin and minimal excuses about how "innovative" its half-assed Linux clones are, which should tell you something about how jawdropping it is.

Now, you want to tell us what's so innovative about Yahoo, except for finding new ways to get their users imprisoned?

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[Archangel Michael]

When it only works with Windows, and probably only Vista when released ... then you'll understand. And you think that Yahoo's users are imprisoned?

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[Anonymous Coward]

MS never "stopped" because they never started to innovate in the first place. Ever since bill acquired someone else's operating system it has been a copycat scheme from the beginning.

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[the_B0fh]

Sssssh! I'm just buying my popcorn and watching the show. This is as much fun as watching the SIV and mortgage meltdowns.

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[jc42]

Has anyone noticed that MS has completely stop any semblance of innovation or improvement upon products, and is now instead chasing every single idea in Tech simultaneously?

So when has their approach been different from that?

From the very first release of the "IBM PC" running DOS, the IBM/Microsoft strategy has been to watch what the flock of independent developers and small companies develops, watch the reaction of "the Market", and when someone develops something that sells, either buy them out or (if the little guys have dreams of making it as an independent) write a quick-and-dirty knockoff and use the overwhelming IBM/MS marketing budget to take over. If you're the "market leader", you can do this; nobody else much can.

Of course, since Microsoft became the semi-independent actor they are now (while still having IBM as their one huge client and supporter), with control of the "market leader" OS, they can also use another strategy: Package their knockoff with the OS, in such a way that users find it difficult and confusing to use anything else. Then the competition is rapidly eliminated from their customers' machines, and they control the market for the product without the need to use their marketing budget. The wording of TFA implies that this is what they're planning.

In some circles, this is known as "doing a Netscape" on the competition, since it's the way that Microsoft drove Netscape out of business. It works for Microsoft. It probably won't work for you or me, because we don't control the market-leader OS.

Ya just gotta understand how our Capitalist system actually works (as opposed by how economic theology says it should work).

[That last comment should suffice to get me a "flamebait" rating, as the amateur economic theologists come out of the woodwork and fire up a flame war. ;-]

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[Rhapsody Scarlet]

Has anyone noticed that MS has completely stop any semblance of innovation or improvement upon products, and is now instead chasing every single idea in Tech simultaneously?

I don't think Microsoft ever really innovated all that much. It's just that in this new world of broadband internet, web feeds, and popularity sites, all of the ideas that Microsoft plagiarize are widely-known by the time they actually implement them.

The new thing is Microsoft's new strategy of frantically diversifying into every single niche they can find at once. Microsoft clearly aren't stupid. They know their current money-makers (primarily Windows and Office) are screwed in the long-run, so they're throwing everything at the wall and seeing what sticks. Unfortunately for Microsoft, nothing really seems to have worked so far.

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[Kadin2048]

The only interesting thing I've seen out of them lately is the photo-processing stuff discussed in the TED talk (link further up in the thread), and that was "innovation through acquisition" ... they can't even take credit. They bought it. (And I don't even think the actual inventor/developer was doing the TED talk; it was some Microsoft hack.)

Yahoo's not particularly innovative, either (the worst part about Flickr is that it's run by Yahoo...if only Google had bought it instead); I'm in no way defending them.

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[k2enemy]

In some circles, this is known as "doing a Netscape" on the competition, since it's the way that Microsoft drove Netscape out of business. It works for Microsoft. It probably won't work for you or me, because we don't control the market-leader OS.

Ya just gotta understand how our Capitalist system actually works (as opposed by how economic theology says it should work).

I'm not sure what you mean by "economic theology", but the same economic theory that promotes capitalism as an efficient system (under certain assumptions) also predicts exploitation of market power just as you describe. These models have been around for centuries and are taught in basic form in all introductory western economics courses. Hence the need for laws such as the Sherman Act in the United States that make exploitation of market power illegal. Whether or not the laws are enforced by the government is another matter, but your assertion that economic theory precludes this behavior is incorrect.

Re:Anyone Notice something ....?

[jc42]

... but your assertion that economic theory precludes this behavior is incorrect.

Note that I didn't say "economic theory", but rather "economic theology". I'm familiar with, for example, Adam Smith's warnings of the perversities that unbridled capitalism can produce, and also his warnings about the possible effects of government-sponsored monopolies (e.g., the Hudson Bay company's history in what's now mostly Canada).

But in fora like this, we regularly see discussions derailed by the crowd that believes fervently in laissez-faire capitalism, and tells us that the current abusive corporations have a "right" to do whatever they believe is necessary to maximise shareholder profit. I've read that sort of stuff several times here in the past week. Since this sort of belief system doesn't even bother with the minimal scientific methods that Adam Smith had available, I classify them as "theology".

Of course, there are people here with a more jaundiced view of it all, who understand that anyone left to act outside the law is a potential hazard to the rest of us.

So now where's my flame war? This seems a topic that's ideal for one. After all, our favorite corporate whipping boy is looking to "do a Netscape" on another perceived competitor. ;-)

Re: value proposition

[l2718]

It actually goes the other way around: if the user's pictures are trapped on a photo-sharing site that only works on Windows, then the user is forever locked to buying future copies of Windows. Any data you have on MS-specific apps is continuously held hostage to ensure you keep paying the Microsoft tax.

Who gives a crap

[jag7720]

Who gives a crap....

News at eleven

[[rvr]]

Microsoft Plans *.* Competitor

Re:News at eleven

[MrKaos]

s/\*\.\*/\*/

If it was *.* they would just be replacing there own stuff, I think they want more

Re:News at eleven

[Anonymous Coward]

s/there/their/

Who wants it?

[miffo.swe]

Why the need to tie everything down onto the desktop? Integrating stuff can be nice if it serves a purpouse. When integrating things just because it often gives a worse product than it could be. Why not spend the development effort on bringing out the best possible product regardless of how its presented? Right now it really feels like the end product is way down on the list, long after "do it in .net or get fired", "make it suck" and "for gods sake tie it down onto the desktop".

Re:Who wants it?

[johnny boy]

Because if it wasn't tied to the desktop, then we can do away with the desktop entirely.

Predictions

[Idaho]

- The first release will only work on IE 7/Windows.
- It will require/use windows media player rather than flash. Or, even better, use that Silver-somethingorother-thingamajig that nobody has installed or uses.
- There will be 30 seconds of banners/ads before each movie starts
- It will not allow embedding of movies on other sites
- The interface will overuse Ajaxy web 2.0 (TM) technology, slowing down the interface/browser
- DRM will somehow have to be involved, such that even if you could save the stream your browser is playing, the content would be useless. Adding new components to Windows to reach this goal is perfectly acceptable. It won't have to run on other OS'es anyway so that's just fine, right?
- Bonus points if necessary DRM/windows media player updates are forced to install through the famous windows "critical" update system.

Finally, it will be a "me too" version of existing websites, not adding any new or worthwhile features. (maybe you will be able to "squirt" movies to your Zune - oh wait, you don't have a Zune).

Re:Predictions

[wizardforce]

Bonus points if necessary DRM/windows media player updates are forced to install through the famous windows "critical" update system.

no, it will probably be touted as a new feature in windows7.

DRM will somehow have to be involved, such that even if you could save the stream your browser is playing, the content would be useless.

that's almost a given looking at Vista's support of DRM and the fact that the MPAA/RIAA seem to have some sort of deal with MS on the issue. In a few years if things keep up as they are, most people will learn to tolerate DRM's nonsense in their OS and it won't be too much trouble to incorporate it in this software's first release.

Re:Predictions

[blackmonday]

I'm no MS fan, but I predict you'll be wrong on all counts.

mLife?

[Anonymous Coward]

Seems to me like they are working on the complete iLife/mac.com for Windows?
Of course it needs a twist so that it is not just a copy.

Mod parent up

[ggvaidya]

It's a really nice idea: a lot of my friends shy away from Flickr because of its expansive, community-based idea of image storage and sharing - they want a private place to host family and personal photos. A lot of them already use Facebook and Picassa Web Albums extensively for exactly this reason. And remember: Yahoo! Photos shut down earlier this (last?) year. All those displaced people will be needing somewhere to go to for private photo hosting. A Yahoo! Photos-clone with support to public sharing of images, integrated with Live image search, the entire thing accessible by PhotoSynth (heck, forget the Yahoo! and the Live, just PhotoSynth by itself!) could be a huge draw, and Microsoft certainly has the money to undercut and outfeature anything Yahoo! and Flickr can throw up.

Personally, I'd love more competition in this field: it'd get us Flickrites more goodies from Flickr!

Huh?

[dwiget001]

Winning strategy *and* Microsoft?

Yeah, that's gonna work.

new MicroSoft stock symbol: COPY

[peter303]

speaks for self

I will tell you why you can write MS off

[SmallFurryCreature]

I followed the links you supplied and didn't have to look far at all before I ran into pages that were IE/Windows only. You want to take a guess at how many Flickr customers use an Apple?

Yes MS has a huge share of the desktop, in business it is near absolute, but that means all those millions of machines Apple keeps churning out HAVE TO END UP SOMEWHERE. In fact, I have strong personal evidence that Apples last longer, so that means there are a shitload of people out there on macs. This doesn't even count freaks like me on linux.

Does that matter? Yes, a sharing site, a social site, should just work. In Firefox, in Safari, in opera, on OSX on OS9 on Linux on BSD and yes even windows ALL all the way back to 98.

MS can't do this. Not because of a lack of skill, it just wouldn't occur to them. It simply ain't the way MS operates. They always will introduce some element that excludes large numbers of their own customers, let alone those on other OS'es or who don't use IE.

And that matters, because these sites are about sharing, not about worrying wether your viewer has the right browser/OS or indeed software installed.

Why do you think so many sites now use flash for their video player? Because it is the most reliable way of doing that, why do you think a lot of sites EVEN so still add a hard download link? Because the captures the last percentage of users.

The techies at MS may be capable, but somewhere in the Redmond beast there is someone with veto powers who ALWAYS injects something that kills it. Look at all their attemps with a universal login, they renamed it, redesigned it and it is still a dismall failure, because at no point did MS put the enduser first and not their own corporate interests.

The moment MS becomes capable (not in tech but in business decisions) to support other OS'es then its own, then MS will be succesfull on the web. Perhaps it is changing, silverlight might be a change and I did see a link to a .mov on photosynth. But the apps themselves are windows XP SP2 and Vista only (in fact one says XP only).

Check flickr, you won't be able to move for the mac lovers.

Re:I will tell you why you can write MS off

[Anonymous Coward]

... on OSX on OS9 on Linux on BSD ...
On, Comet! on, Cupid! on Dunder and Blixem!

Re:I will tell you why you can write MS off

[Anonymous Coward]

Microsoft Maps (which I love) used to work on the Mac, in Camino. Then they "upgraded" it so that it won't work. But you could still get in by changing the User Agent. Then they "upgraded" it again so the user agent won't work either. Bah. I've gone back to Google Maps.

Re:I will tell you why you can write MS off

[tehcyder]

Check flickr, you won't be able to move for the mac lovers.

You're saying that like it's a good thing.

R&D isn't MS's problem...

[lurker4hire]

... their problem is translating brilliant R&D (they've got the money to hire really bright people) into good products. Until, as an organization, they stop trying to make each of their individual products further the adoption of all of their other products they will continue to mangle and maim the fruits handed to them by their brilliant R&D.

xbox is a good example of what MS can do when

a) they're forced to compete
b) they focus on the product instead of the whole product family

l4h

Re:R&D isn't MS's problem...

[Dan Ost]

Is Microsoft actually making money on the XBox yet? Last I heard, they were still down several billion dollars.

We have yet to learn if Microsoft can turn a profit without being able to charge monopoly rent.

Why does every new product labeled 'competitor'?

[I'm Don Giovanni]

I've noticed that every time a new product/service is announced, the media's prime focus is that it's a "competitor" of some earlier product? It's like, who cares about what it actually does, let's just talk about the "competition', "horse race", etc.

Maybe a company releases a product/service just to make money, not to compete or kill something else. Hell, I have multilple gmail, yahoo, and hotmail email accounts; I don't think of them as competitors (even though they are), they are just services to me. Sometime I buy Coke, sometimes Pepsi. I don't give a damn about the competition between the two.

So here we have the story, "Microsoft Plans Flickr Competitor (or 'Clone' as TFA says)" rather than "Microsoft Plans Online Photo Service" as the headline. Because all we care about is the competition aspect. *yawn*

Washington State

[rice_burners_suck]

As with any story involving Lord Sauron of Redmond, I have only one thing to say:

Google is a better company than Microsoft.

/me ducks to avoid being hit by chair.

Guaranteeed To Suck

[curmudgeon99]

Well, we've been here before. Another Me-too offering from the boys in Redmond. Next I'll be expecting them to come out with a new buggy whip. Is there anything of merit that originated in Redmond? I seriously doubt it. They have produced crap in every area they touch. Zune, anyone?

Re:Guaranteeed To Suck

[kc2keo]

Agreed... About Zune... Saw a new fancy AD on TV that must of cost M$ lots of money. I for one will not buy a Zune. Although I am not the type to purchase MP3 Players, Palm pilots, or even a hands free cellphone set (Don't drive and talk on phone).

That's Enough, Mr. Balmer--Back in Your Cage

[curmudgeon99]

Can you say, Microsoft apologist?

the first challenge

[MrKaos]

such a service is unlikely to succeed, and lays out the numerous challenges the company will face upon entering the market.

That, presumably, it will only be running on M$ servers using M$ tools.

Re:the first challenge

[Anonymous Coward]

LOL M$!!!1!1!1 TATS SO FUNEY

v1 opportunity?

[dml6]

Do they mean 'v1' as in "version 1" or as in V1. Because you know, other empires had interests in 'v1' opportunities as well.
Seriously though, what will they include in this product that will make people want to switch away from the existing photo sharing sites? As a photographer I'm all for cool new features. But those features are worthless if they don't help me get things done better/quicker and the menu options for them keep moving around with each new release. What is the compelling reason to use their service, or are they playing a game of "Oh crap! Time to get caught up!"

After reading the summary

[peipas]

I'm still trying to figure out, will it include video?

It could be worse.

[Aleksej]

If this was a stupid Microsoftloving site, it would have been "Microsoft's new photosharing service brings revolution to the Web".

Unfortunately, this comment is too real to be eligible for "Funny".

I just can't keep up anymore

[edbob]

This wouldn't just be competing against Flickr, but also Zooomr, SmugMug, Photobucket, Picassaweb, WebShots, etc. This space seems very crowded already. How many pictures do people want on public display anyway?

Re:I just can't keep up anymore

[fonik]

Yeah, but unlike Zooomr, I'm pretty sure Microsoft won't just make a 1 to 1 copy of the Flickr html and tie it together with django and 10 kb of python.

There are some seriously good people working at Microsoft and they have a corporate policy of constantly reinventing the wheel. Usually this is a bad trait, but in this case it might work out for them.

Re:Why does every new product labeled 'competitor'

[kebes]

I agree that the media fixation with "a X competitor" or "a X killer" is annoying and silly. However, it's important to realize where this "must compete" attitude comes from: a (sometimes blinding) desire to make money. With respect to the stock market, it is often assumed that economic activity always falls into a pre-defined sector, and that since there are finite resources (in terms of customer spending power) within that sector, a company can only make money at the expense of another. Hence, for a new service to succeed, it must necessarily be drawing users away from some other service.

It doesn't take much thinking to see that this generalized concept is often false. In fact, many of the truly successful companies got to where they are by creating a new market, not beating out others in an established market. The Internet has seen many of these success stories (Google, eBay, etc.). In fact it can be a winning strategy (though arguably more difficult) to carve out a new niche of customers, rather than fighting over established markets (e.g. what Nintendo is doing with the Wii).

Maybe a company releases a product/service just to make money, not to compete or kill something else. Ideally, yes. In fact, many companies would deliver a far better user experience (and probably make more money) if they focused on ways to establish a significant user base that was happy with the product, rather than always desperately trying to increase marketshare.

But, this obsession with "winning the competition" runs deep. For instance, many people won't consider Mac or Linux "a success" until it has significant marketshare--even though the current users of those platforms are very happy with their user experience. And, arguably, one of the reasons that the customer experience can be so good in these smaller markets is because the focus has to be placed on quality instead of quantity.

Me Too !!!

[jo42]

I'm going to do an online photo and video hosting service as well. It will work with Linux, Mac OSX and Windows. You will be able to upload your content and share it with friends and family - actually anyone in the world if you want. Imagine that.

I'm going to use something called "Linux" running "Apache" using "HTTP" and "FTP" protocols to do this on something called "co-located servers".

Oh. Wait. I've been doing this since the mid-'90s. Drats. Foiled again...

Re:Me Too !!!

[uniquename72]

Can your kid sister or retarded cousin or ancient gramma use your system to share their pics?

If not, your post is off-topic.

proactive vs reactive

[pak9rabid]

You know, if Microsoft was a proactive company instead of a reactive one, they might actually be able to legitimately claim that they are innovators. I'd say 95% of the crap they produce is the result of a response to products already available on the market. If you're going to copy somebody else's product, then it needs to be an improved version of it....this is one big reason why I have no doubt in my mind that Linux will eventually overtake Microsoft in the OS market.

Re:proactive vs reactive

[zrq]

On the other hand ... Someone has already mentioned PhotoTours and GroupShot in an earlier post, and they really are quite cool. Do these qualify as proactive ?

My first thought was "Wow, can't wait until someone does an open source version of these that runs on Linux". But if someone did release an open source version of these, would that be reactive ?

I think we are all playing catch up with each other.

You can select friends and or family only...

[celardore]

I have a pro account on Flickr, which is nice. I use Flickr uploader and default them all to private (me only), then I sort through and adjust permissions. Some I make public, some I make family only, some friends only, and some are open to both friends & family.

The catch is that your friends & family have to register with yahoo.

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[Kadin2048]

The catch is that your friends & family have to register with yahoo.

That's kind of a massive, deal-breaking catch. IMO, it renders the feature absolutely useless. It's arrogant to demand that people register and get a stupid Yahoo account just to look at photos (would I do that? hell no; I'm not going to ask anyone else to).

A better system would work more like Google's Picasa system, which lets you make an "unlisted" album with a special URL, and email that URL out to anyone you want. As long as someone has the URL, they can view the album.

Such features have been a hot request item on Flickr for more than two years now, but the developers seem stubborn about not implementing them. I don't know if it's some deal they have with Yahoo, to try and get more people signed up with Yahoo accounts, or something else entirely, but they're shooting themselves in the foot, big time.

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree. I had a flickr account before they made everybody change over to Yahoo sign-ups. I did even once start trying to sign up for a Yahoo account once, but the login I wanted had gone and they wanted to know everything from my mother's maiden name to my inside-leg measurement. OK, I might be exaggerating a little, but it wasn't a quick, simple sign-up, so it turned out to be a quick, simple good-bye.

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[mattpalmer1086]

I also have a flickr account, but I don't really use it anymore. The procedure for resetting my password on my yahoo id was so extreme that I very nearly gave up - took me nearly an hour of constantly going through the same steps, being rejected by insanely hard captchas, form filling that kept prompting me for more information, and other annoyances.

I have designed security systems dealing with classified government records, and I know it really doesn't need to be as difficult as that. I appreciate it when companies take security seriously, but it has to be balanced by usability. For that reason alone, even though flickr itself is great, I don't really use it anymore, as I don't want to deal with talking friends and family through setting up a yahoo account and maintaining it. Before flickr were bought by yahoo, it was a no-brainer - a fabulous service.

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[Wanderer2]

The catch is that your friends & family have to register with yahoo.

Not completely true. You can give friends and family special "guest pass" urls that allow them to look at non-public photos of your choice without needing to register with flickr/Yahoo.

Linky

Of course, they can't comment etc. unless they register. They can only view.

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[Anonymous Coward]

Um, what? You can do exactly that on Flickr - it's called a Guest Pass:

http://www.flickr.com/help/guestpass/

So much for your little conspiracy theory that Flickr intentionally isn't implementing a wanted feature in order for Yahoo to gain more accounts.

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[fyngyrz]

That's ridiculous. My flickr account also required me to change over to a yahoo ID a while back; took a few minutes, and it was no trouble at all. Also, it is trivial to make private albums, photos, etc. I've used that capability from both sides, as an invited guest and as a provider of restricted material. It works fine and is no problem to use or manage. These accusations are just nonsensical FUD, motive unknown.

I have a lot of fun with my flickr account; I share pics with my family, with random strangers, people in groups that share various interests, I even manage some groups myself. There are things that could certainly be improved, but all in all, it is a useful, interesting service and really doesn't deserve to be knocked by a bunch of uninformed untruths.

Slashdot needs a "-1, FUD" mod. :-/

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[Kadin2048]

Um, what? You can do exactly that on Flickr - it's called a Guest Pass:

http://www.flickr.com/help/guestpass/

So much for your little conspiracy theory that Flickr intentionally isn't implementing a wanted feature in order for Yahoo to gain more accounts. That's new. Well, I guess it's better late than never.

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[Durf]

I don't know if it's some deal they have with Yahoo, to try and get more people signed up with Yahoo accounts . . .

You mean the deal where Yahoo bought Flickr and owns it now?

Re:You can select friends and or family only...

[ggvaidya]

Me too! :P

My attempts at converting any of my friends/family to Flickr have been horribly unsuccessfully, though, and I'm pretty sure that the permissions thing is part of the problem. The few friends who did sign up uploaded a few public photos and then left, suggesting they never figured out the public/private system at all. Having to set up a Yahoo account for Flickr was also a big hinderance.

The inherent, default privacy of uploading to either Yahoo Photos or Picassa (your photos are private by default, and shareable with friends) or Orkut or Facebook (your photos are, at worse, visible to everybody in your "network", which is generally people who might bump into you on the street anyway, and can be privacy-restricted to friends only) seems to be a big win for them, as opposed to Flickr, a website which shamelessly shows somebody's photograph on their front page when you log in (gasp!). Not that this is an inherently bad thing: sometimes photos are just for seeing what your friends are up to. Flickr really is aimed at the rank-amateur to professional-photographer range of interests, not at casual "smile for the camera!" type situations. You could make all your photos private as you go, but that takes out half of the fun of Flickr.

I _am_ a huge Flickr fan, a Flickr Pro account holder, and wouldn't dream of switching to Picassa or MS Flickr[tm] for the world, but I only know about five other people with active Flickr accounts who I didn't meet on Flickr before meeting them in meatspace. Of course, it could be something other than the above that's keeping them out, and I'd love to know what that is, but the above's my best guess at the moment.

Microsoft's Business Algorithm

[pak9rabid]

if ( competingProduct.marketExists() && competingProduct.isCopyable() ) ourProduct = dodgePatents(competingProduct);

Photosynch is HUGE

[rtilghman]

Watched the demo this year when it debuted and was blown away... the level of calcuation and potential avenues off that application are enormous. The scale is something completely beyond what's currently available, and the underlying tech is so expansive I don't think a company like Fickr could quickly compete with it.

rt

ofoto

[CrazyTalk]

Why does the author think everyone uses Flickr? I've been using Ofoto (now Kodak) for years and am happy with it.

God they're stupid

[rastoboy29]

Why these guys think they can _compete_ with anybody at this point is beyond me. 

because it has to be said ...

[ph4red]

Your album settings have changed, you must restart!

I just read the headline, and all I can say is...

[thebonafortuna]

...how about they plan an Apple/OSX competitor?

Oh, and I'm about as far from an Apply fan-boy as a person can get. I just tried Vista a few weekends ago for the first time...I had very little in the way of expectations, but figured it couldn't possibly be as bad as people we're making it out to be. After being asked no less than five times if I was sure I wanted to install iTunes, and four times whether I wanted to delete an unnecessary file from Program Files, I gave up. I don't know what to say anymore. All I know is, multi-tasking efficiently can't be easy with Windows Vista...

Flickr private photos can be shared with anyone

[bigtrike]

Just create a "guest pass," and they won't need to sign up: http://www.flickr.com/help/guestpass/

Licensing will kill them.

[random coward]

Microsoft wont succeed in this because of the licensing of all the copyrighted photos people send up to the server. Microsoft isn't capable of putting a Terms Of Service like Flikr's that frees people and restricts themselves. They will probably write the TOS that they have th exclusive licensing to your copyright(so you can't license to others) or even that uploading it gives them the copyright. This is what will kill them.

"This is a 'v 1' opportunity"??

[Chris Mattern]

Who in their right minds buys Version 1 of anything Microsoft?

Chris Mattern

Re:"This is a 'v 1' opportunity"??

[d3m0nCr4t]

Who in their right minds buys Version x.x of anything Microsoft? There, fixed that for ya.

I RTFA but

[treeves]

I failed to see where he laid out "numerous challenges" that Microsoft will face when entering this market. Mind you, I don't suspect they'll succeed here, but I don't have a long list of reasons why, and neither did this guy.

yeah

[m2943]

Now that Ballmer has f*cking killed Google, he is going to f*cking kill Flickr, right?

Re:yeah

[sharkey]

That's why the working title of this project is "Fluckr"

Re:yeah

[rock217]

HAH

Someone mod parent up!

How to beat Flickr...

[droopycom]

Just make it as good as Flickr is now and give unlimited upload for free... Thats the only thing I miss on Flickr

Why can't these fsckers innovate?

[davidsyes]

Instead of buying up and copying? They BETTER not be getting patents out of this. (yeh, go ahead, mod me troll/flamebait)

Yeah, but they have overlooked Photosynth

[benjymouse]

Microsoft sits on this rather impressive technology called Photosynth. I'm sure most of you have seen/tried the demo. If not, go there now (sorry guys, Windows only). MS has now optimized the algorithms sufficiently to allow home users to generate synths at their own machine. A "no comments" comment also hinted that MS is working on a video version of PhotoSynth. If they integrate PhotoSynth into a Flickr competitor they will have a *huge* appeal. It is all about appearance. This way you can allow guests to take virtual tours of your house, car, neighbourhood.

Re:Yeah, but they have overlooked Photosynth

[Jesus_666]

Now please for those of us who don't have access to a Windows box: What the hell does that site do? Synthesize photos? Is that something like algorithmic generation of pseudo-photos according to user-configurable settings?

Re:Yeah, but they have overlooked Photosynth

[benjymouse]

Photosynth analysez a set of pictures. It uses some sophisticated algorithms to identify interesting "features" which are largely insensitive to resolution, lighting conditions, color correction, sharpness etc. It the pushes all these features into an index from where it can match up the photos. Not only that, it can extrapolate the 3D position relative to eachother from where each photo was shot. Photosynth then builds a 3D space where the photos are represented as transient "frames". You can then navigate this world using the mouse/arrow keys. E.g. "turning left" will navigate to the photo closest to your left in the 3D space. You can walk in/out and turn up/down/left/right. Imagine having someone walking around you 360 and shooting, say, 12 photos. Photosynth can then take those photos, match them up and place them in the 3D position from where they were shot. Anyone viewing your "synth" can then take the "virtual tour" around you. Say you create a synth of your home. You may have a special chinese vase. Photosynth will be able to locate other synths which somewhere contains that same vase. Hell, maybe CIAs going to buy the lot and classify it. It has tremendous potential.

Is that something like a Zune? (nt)

[ODiV]

no text

Re:Is that something like a Zune? (nt)

[Jesus_666]

Yeah, except that there are actually people who bought it.

"construct a winning strategy" == NFI

[xixax]

"construct a winning strategy" -- "we don't have a strategy, but if we can contruct a winning strategy, the strategy will be better than Flickr's and we will win!"

or,

"use our desktop monopoly to steer people away from Flickr and make sure Flikr performs poorly and looks bad in IE7 if they somehow do manage to get through."

Xix.

HA!

[GuNgA-DiN]

and they can call it: ........ "Fuckr" !

after it deletes all of your photos it sues you for copyright infringement

then it uploads your photos to Microsoft Live

Microsoft, please FOCUS!!!!

[gsfprez]

before you start down this road, gawddamnit, i want my bag ass table! I don't want to wait 5-10 years for it - i want my 5-10 thousand dollar table now!

Tagging beta

[Anonymous Coward]

"internet, microsoft, antitrust, grabbylittlebastards, flop (tagging beta)"

Why doesn't Slashdot just rename the "tagging beta" to "instant zealotry beta", since that's basically all it's used for. Slashdot zealots get to put in their slant on stories in the form of clever little one-word quips. Hell, you don't even have to comment on the story any more. Very convenient.

What does this story have to do with "antitrust?"

Is "grabbylittlebastards" an appropriate tag for a story?

"flop"? Thanks for the prediction. Maybe you could have elaborated on your prediction by posting within the story, intead.

It's no surprise that Slashdot is a running joke these days.

Wrongo, MS!

[obeythefist]

They'd do much better with their older strategy, buying the competition.

All they have to do is dump a huge load of cash on YouTube and they'll be fine.

What do you mean, "Google ain't selling"?

Call it Embr...

[xactuary]

Trust me. It'll "flicker" for a while, and then burn out.

Smugmug

[Wolfier]

Its service is so good, if I were MS I would just buy it.

M$ is sure to win...

[gzipped_tar]

1 Hire cheap Chinese students to make the Simplified Chinese localization. (Note that they don't have to bother about the maintainence of the translation. They never do it.)
2 Do self-censorship with their product in China. Flickr is already dead in China for political reasons.
3 Bribe Chinese government. Reduce tax.
4 Cheap local server machine. Get.


And they wins the 1.3 billion People running pirate copies of Windoze.

Translation please

[remmelt]

> photo web solutions

Can we just call it a website please? I don't need my photos solved. I want them stored.

This kind of hot air speak works really well for people who don't know what they're doing, ie managers with no tech background making tech decisions, but it doesn't hold water for the real folk. Joe off the street won't think MS' site is more kick ass than Flickr because it's a "photo solution" instead of a website (if that's what Flickr calls its site.) Also, I'm a software engineer, I work with software engineers both high (tech manager) and low (html programmer) in the food chain, and never have they told me that they're working on a "solution" (heh, except if they've created a bug, right.) It's always a program or a website or whatever.

MS research apologising

[remmelt]

Yes, those ARE cool projects. But maybe it's time to stop apologising for Microsoft's failures by pointing at their research. Yes, they can and do hire really really smart people. Regrettably, these people aren't calling the shots. They code some cool code, which gets churned up by an insane management chain, cut, diced, sliced, rubbed, and finally ground out of existence. No products come from there. I have seen a lot of cool stuff from MS R&D, but nothing ever gets translated into a projects that is out on the street, now, for me to buy.

As was noted earlier in the comments, MS has its own interest, then it has the interest of their peers (like the music industry for example, that's why we have DRM) and somewhere way in the back is the customer that gets to buy the product.

For all its faults, this is the reason why open source rocks. It plays above table. Its clear where the priorities lie.

Re:MS research apologising

[zrq]

For all its faults, this is the reason why open source rocks. It plays above table. Its clear where the priorities lie.

Yep, I pretty much agree with that.

Schmotosynth

[remmelt]

I refer you to my earlier post.

http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=360481&cid=21360941

One question

[Ilgaz]

Will it work perfectly, bit to bit perfectly with ANY browser on ANY OS which was coded/maintained in 2007?

I think everyone knows the answer to this question and that answer is exactly why it will become another joke.

Gundeep is missing the boat

[Anonymous Coward]

Microsoft has a huge opportunity here. 1. Microsoft has an install base of 90%+, no? 2. Only savvy people know what flickr is or care. 3. Ease of use is king. Your mother isn't going to use flickr since she barely knows what a website is. In my mind they should be chasing Google/Picasa. Nothing beats ease of use like picking out a bunch of photos in Picasa and clicking "Web Album". A few more features and Picasaweb will be as full-featured as flickr, too... If flickr wants to play the game, they need desktop integration. Go google.