Slashdot Mirror
Spore Hands-On Preview
cardjoe writes "The release date for Spore has just been announced and what better way to celebrate than to check out the latest build of the game? That's just what bit-tech.net did, spending hours with the full version of the game. The article covers all the different editors and stages in the game as well as providing a brief on the pollinated content and how it may well introduce an entire new genre to PC gaming — that of the Massively Online Singleplayer. The article is in-depth and has a whole load of brand new screenshots too, showing the various stages that the player will go through as they play the game and move their creature from single cells to galaxy-hopping space freaks."
This will make VG Cats happy.
The simple truth is that interstellar distances will not fit into the human imagination
- Douglas Adams
...until I have created a race of suicidal paper clips, and have them wage war on all the fruit-producing fauna in the universe.
Too many smacktards.
maybe its Massively Singleplayer Online
Anyone else having problems with the link in TFA? I had to edit it slight...
Only a game that gives you that much control over life can satisfy my ego.
... if third parties are getting to try it, it's not vapour anymore, right?
"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
Can I make my spore avoid the whole Microsoft debacle during their evolution?
Seven Days with Ubuntu Unity
Everything I read about this game makes it seem like this is either going to be the greatest game ever released or the most disappointing.
The thing that fascinates me the most is that the progression through the game's stages seems in some ways to mirror the evolution of video games themselves, from simple Atari games to the modern day. Or to look at it another way, the idea of having an arc throughout the game in both the objectives and the style of gameplay itself sounds amazing.
http://nerdcartoons.com/
I think that actually means it's *your* loss.
Shut the fuck up until you've invested your own time in developing (and FINSHING) an open source game of this magnitude.
Linux is only free if your time is worthless.
-Don
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
As much as I hate the wait, I'm now faced with a similar dilemma to when Sims 2 arrived. Once again my rig is too underpowered to muster the polygons needed so the one good thing about waiting til September is that it gives me time to get the needed upgrades. This game is going to be a revolutionary piece of digital artistry. Z.o.m.g.Can't.Wait.
Compare the installation time of a Linux distro with a full set of applications at once to installing Windows, antivirus, anti-spyware/adware, an office suite, a web browser, an e-mail program, and an image editor one at a time.
I'm not trying to flame here, but I've found myself spending a lot more time finding websites to download packages, buying/finding install CDs, and trying to make applications from different third parties interoperate well than fixing problems under Linux. Distributing an OS with useful software seems to work better for me, especially since getting certain Linux utilities to work on Windows (such as ZSH) can be a real pain.
slashdotted already
what they would call a game based on ID
Spore: Hands-on Preview
Author: Joe Martin
Platforms: PC, Nintendo DS, Mobile, Mac
Publisher: Electronic Arts
Spore. Games don't come any more ambitious than Spore and although the premise of the now in-famously delayed game and magnum opus of Will Wright is fairly simple, the actual realisation of that concept has proven incredibly difficult.
The idea behind Spore is this; you are God, the Alpha, Omega and Almighty. You are omniscient, omnipresent and capable of creating a rock so big you can't possibly lift it. Then you can lift it. You're God and that type of feat is your bread and butter.
Specifically, you are the God of a particular species that you will design, craft, sculpt and guide through from primordial ooze to inevitable extinction.
You start off small, designing a single cell and guiding it through the cesspool in which all life must begin. As time passes you use evolution as the tool by which you will shape the destiny of your creature for better or worse. A mouth here, a leg there, and a twist to the torso - you slowly create the creature you want. You can do that. You are God.
From there, the game expands ever outwards and you will move from guiding a single cell or creature to encouraging a small tribe, then a city. In the climax to this universe in a box you'll be aiding your civilisation in spreading to other stars and planets.
Such game concepts are truly the things of dreams - open, sandbox worlds with almost limitless possibilities and completely open setting. The game says to you; "Here are the tools, now do as you wish."
Unfortunately, with such an impossibly complex design even getting the basics of the gameplay right can be a daunting task in and of itself and, even with the full might of Electronic Arts behind him, Will Wright has struggled to get Spore working. The game, which he has reportedly been planning for the last decade at least, has suffered numerous delays. At the start of this year we gave it an honourable mention as a game which we thought would definitely turn out to be vapourware.
Now though, it looks like we may have to admit that we were wrong. Not only has EA confirmed that Spore will be out in time for the holidays, but the game is now in a fully playable state. All that is left to do is polish up a few glitches, test it and load it with content before release.
How do we know that, I hear you ask. Simple; we've played it--nearly all of it.
There are five stages or levels to Spore and we've played them all on the PC, as well as playing on the DS and Mobile versions of the game - though the latter failed to make as much of an impression, to be frank.
The first level is a basic arcade type game where players guide their single cell about its existence, helping it eat other creatures and grow. When it has grown enough it jumps into the Creature Stage, where players zoom their view out and manage the more complex needs of their creation. Survival skills must be complemented by socialisation skills as players enable their creature to build a tribe.
In Tribe stage the game zooms out once more and players are no longer controlling a single alien. In this stage it's more like The Sims as you monitor the needs of a small tribe as they carve out a niche in the alien landscape. The penultimate stage of the game is the Civilisation Stage where it transitions from The Sims into Sim City and you'll be controlling whole cities in cultures.
The last stage is the Space Stage where you hop off your polluted little rock and find new playgrounds to party in.
Share and share alike
Before we delve deeply into the well of never-ending gameplay that Spore claims to offer, we should talk about the Pollination System that Spore uses to keep the game full of brand new content at all times. Pollinated content is something that Electronic Arts and
I just wish they would have made it cross-platform or Linux compatible.
As a die-hard Linux user, I wouldn't mind paying retail for a copy of this game, based on what I've seen of it. I give money to developers for their work on other apps I use, why wouldn't I do the same for a game? I understand that it took years for them to develop, and they need to make money for what they've done. I don't need the source to play it.
Game Devs don't have/need to give us their work for free, IMO, but if they'd make it to where *anyone* could use the games they write, they'd sell more, and I for one would sure appreciate it.
"...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
So far, the only thing about this game that I'm disappointed with is the visual style.
I liked it so much better in the early stages, like the 2005 GDC video. It was really beautiful then. Now it just looks too cartoony.
Technoli
Wasn't this game around more than twenty-five years ago? I mean, I remember clearly that you'd--
Oh, wait... I guess there were some minor differences.
Whoops.
W
-------------------
This is my SIG. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
But the FPS and RTS genres (which are the examples Will Wright used) are the same age. At least, Wolfenstein 3D and Dune II was both released in 1992 (a great year for gaming).
There is absolutely no way to justify the millions of dollars EA would have lost if they delayed the release of Spore for another year, just to port it to Linux, so that they could sell a few hundred more copies of it.
If you really want to play Spore, then you probably can find a Windows or Mac to play it on. If you really can't find a Windows or Mac or game console to play Spore on, then you have much bigger problems, and probably should not be wasting your time playing games, because you should be working on solving your bigger problems instead.
If you've decided never to touch a Windows or Mac box, then that's your decision you made with your eyes wide open, and one of the consequences is that there are many pieces of software you will never be able to use, like Spore. If you made that decision yourself without being forced into it, then you made your own bed and now you must sleep in it, so shut up and stop complaining. If you're disappointed or surprised about the consequences of your own decision to boycot Windows and Mac, then you obviously made the wrong decision, so don't blame EA for not supporting you. You have no right to complain about the consequences of your own decision not to use Windows or Mac.
-Don
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
if we were all "spores" in someone's "game"
There was a playable demo at the 2006 e3. Vaporware is software that doesn't exist outside the marketing department, not just software that has not yet been released.
I can understand standing up for what you believe in, but I think you are going a bit overboard here...last time I checked, closed source hasn't stopped some games from developing INSANELY huge communities...or have you already forgotten about user-made stuff for things like doom, quake, etc. The roller coaster tycoon series and the elder scroll series come to mind as well...
Get off your high horse. You don't have the source code to many websites (slashdot included) and yet you don't seem to have a problem "using" them.
Living With a Nerd
How long after the release date do you think it will take for people to make an exact duplicate of the Mos Eisley Cantina? 3 hrs?
I'm sure it will be fun for a while, but it seems overhyped. Nothing in the game is ground breaking, every aspect of it has been done in other games already, its more about the combination of game play elements and scale that sets it apart I guess. Wright is a fantastic designer so I'm sure it will be great, but the best game ever made, no way.
The social networking elements in Spore do look truly stunning and already there's a wealth of content available from the testers and developers - everything from flying toilets to animals that look like letters
Stop right there pal, you had me sold on "flying toilet"!
I look forward to exploring new worlds and encountering other players' utterly ridiculous creatures. Of course, I'll be disappointed if someone doesn't create creatures/civilizations based on every internet meme ever (oh how I'll enjoy destroying the LOLcats with my spaceship's death ray).
Oh yeah, Spore's Wikipedia article mentions how the galaxy will feature active planetary nebulas, black holes, rotating spiral arms, etc. After acquiring a spaceship, I fully plan on plotting a course to the black hole's event horizon. I wonder how the game will model that experience...
Spore: Hands-on Preview
Platforms: PC, Nintendo DS, Mobile, Mac
Publisher: Electronic Arts
Spore. Games don't come any more ambitious than Spore and although the premise of the now in-famously delayed game and magnum opus of Will Wright is fairly simple, the actual realisation of that concept has proven incredibly difficult.
The idea behind Spore is this; you are God, the Alpha, Omega and Almighty. You are omniscient, omnipresent and capable of creating a rock so big you can't possibly lift it. Then you can lift it. You're God and that type of feat is your bread and butter.
Specifically, you are the God of a particular species that you will design, craft, sculpt and guide through from primordial ooze to inevitable extinction.
You start off small, designing a single cell and guiding it through the cesspool in which all life must begin. As time passes you use evolution as the tool by which you will shape the destiny of your creature for better or worse. A mouth here, a leg there, and a twist to the torso - you slowly create the creature you want. You can do that. You are God.
Image: Spore is perhaps the most ambitious game ever
From there, the game expands ever outwards and you will move from guiding a single cell or creature to encouraging a small tribe, then a city. In the climax to this universe in a box you'll be aiding your civilisation in spreading to other stars and planets.
Such game concepts are truly the things of dreams - open, sandbox worlds with almost limitless possibilities and completely open setting. The game says to you; "Here are the tools, now do as you wish."
Unfortunately, with such an impossibly complex design even getting the basics of the gameplay right can be a daunting task in and of itself and, even with the full might of Electronic Arts behind him, Will Wright has struggled to get Spore working. The game, which he has reportedly been planning for the last decade at least, has suffered numerous delays. At the start of this year we gave it an honourable mention as a game which we thought would definitely turn out to be vapourware.
Now though, it looks like we may have to admit that we were wrong. Not only has EA confirmed that Spore will be out in time for the holidays, but the game is now in a fully playable state. All that is left to do is polish up a few glitches, test it and load it with content before release.
Image: The Cell Stage is where the full game begins
How do we know that, I hear you ask. Simple; we've played it--nearly all of it.
There are five stages or levels to Spore and we've played them all on the PC, as well as playing on the DS and Mobile versions of the game - though the latter failed to make as much of an impression, to be frank.
The first level is a basic arcade type game where players guide their single cell about its existence, helping it eat other creatures and grow. When it has grown enough it jumps into the Creature Stage, where players zoom their view out and manage the more complex needs of their creation. Survival skills must be complemented by socialisation skills as players enable their creature to build a tribe.
In Tribe stage the game zooms out once more and players are no longer controlling a single alien. In this stage it's more like The Sims as you monitor the needs of a small tribe as they carve out a niche in the alien landscape. The penultimate stage of the game is the Civilisation Stage where it transitions from The Sims into Sim City and you'll be controlling whole cities in cultures.
The last stage is the Space Stage where you hop off your polluted little rock and find new playgrounds to party in.
Share and share alike
Before we delve deeply into the well of never-ending gameplay that Spore claims to offer, we should talk about the Pollination System th
It seems like a large part of the design process for the game consisted of of trying a lot of ideas, and selecting the one that worked as a base of future experiments. And that description could be extended to previous generations of games, each generation consisting of thousands of games, most fails in the marketplace, and those that survives form the basis for the next generation of games.
That is may main irritation as a professional designer of the whole "intelligent design" pseudo debate. Any intelligent designer is aware that evolution is the most important design tool, especially for complex systems.
After your race has risen from the primordial slime, competed with other critters, evolved to sapience, built cities, and achieved spaceflight and reached the center of the galaxy, you can submit proof of age and $45 to receive a key to open up a new level . . .
SimGalaxy Interspecies Brothel
Just remember . . . one race's intimate lubricant could be another's caustic death sauce.
Take a chill pill, bro. I wonder if you work for them, based on the handle. I'm surprised at the anger that came out of your misconstruing what it was that I wrote... You might need a re-read.
Though apparently you took it that way, my post was not criticism, it was observation. I'm just saying it would be nice if game companies would make their products cross-platform, including *nix users in the mix.
If they started out doing that from the beginning of development, they would have games at the end which they could sell to everyone, *without* needing to port them to different architectures.
There's lots more than a few hundred Linux users out there now, too. And more every day. Emerging market, and all that.
"...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
But the game trailer on the official site http://www.spore.com/screenshots.php?movieID=7&play=hi has got to be the lamest game trailer I have ever seen.
YHBT HAND.
:-( Why respond to that worthless comment?
Don't feed trolls.
http://slashcode.com/
When I used Linux I used to wish more games were released for LInux but then I realized that it isn't that big of a deal to boot into Windows to pay the types of games that I tend to enjoy. Really, what's a 3 minute reboot (or whatever it is) to play a fullscreen game for a few hours? Once you're in, the OS it happens to be running on is pretty much irrelevant.
That said, I sure am glad EVE Online came out with a client for Linux and Mac because it means I don't have to reboot just to login and update my skill training. Though I suppose just providing that functionality through the web site would be enough.
-matthew
"THERE IS NO JUSTICE, THERE IS ONLY ME." -Death
Ummmmm, Slachcode?
My user number is prime. Is yours?
Didn't even know that was there...then I retract the slashdot portion of my statement, but it still stands. You can't sit there and honestly tell me that you only use websites that you have the full code to.
Living With a Nerd
[...]
In the climax to this universe in a box you'll be aiding your civilisation in spreading to other stars and planets. But what does God need with a starship?
If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
Yes, but is your stapler Fire-engine red? ... or just red?
If fire-engine red, you win
If "standard" red, I'm betting on the paper clips.
Or you might get some 'spore' on your hands.
And I'm sure the folks at EA will just LOVE supporting every permutation of every Linux distribution out there or listening to the loud BAWWWWWW noise when they only support 3 major distros.
Yes, I worked for Maxis and EA, with Will Wright on The Sims, and also on porting SimCity to various platforms.
I developed a commercial game (SimCity) for Unix, and promoted and distributed it over the internet 16 years ago, and there is still no viable market for games on Linux. Look what happened to Loki. And look at the sad shape of the modern Linux desktop: Lots of easy eye candy and useless transparency, but absolutely no crucial usability nor simple consistency.
I have done a lot of cross platform development and porting (I also ported The Sims Online server to Linux, and I'm currently developing TomTom Home on Mac and Windows using xulrunner and XPCOM), so I'm painfully aware of how much harder it is and longer it takes than developing for one or a few platforms. It's not easy, it's not fast, and it doesn't come for free.
I've also put a lot of time and effort into writing code, proposals, and working with people at EA and other companies, to convince them to make some of their existing products open source, many years after their release, like Micropolis (SimCity). But I never made the argument that it was worth their development effort for an initial release of a game to support the Linux desktop.
Developing cross platform code and porting games to Linux is not nearly as easy as you make it out to be. It took me many years of work to port SimCity to all the different flavors of Unix, Linux, OLPC, and other X-Windows platforms like Quarterdeck DESQview/X, NCD X terminals, Windows, Mac, etc.
Don't act like nobody at EA ever heard of Linux, and it's up to you to evangelize to them about it and make them see the light, and support it as if it were a mainstream desktop platform. They run it on their servers, and many people at EA use Linux all the time, are experts at it, and understand its problems and limitations.
Trying to argue that EA should release mainstream games on Linux will get you absolutely nowhere. It wastes their time, makes you look like an idiot, and they will never take you seriously again. And representing the Linux community as a bunch of greedy crybabies who just want everything right now and for free, reduces the chances that they will eventually release other games as open source or port them to Linux later.
-Don
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
In Spore you play as GOD but the process is evolution?? How can this be when evolution is merely a random unguided biological process that makes the idea of God unnecessary, irrelevant, and archaic?
This thing looks so cool I might just go out and buy a computer to play it on. I hear you can get on the webbernet and play on the video games with those.
No really. I really might have to buy a windows PC to play the game on... because I don't have one. I only have Linux workstations. I'm not joking... stop laughing...
[signature]
Why does the reviewer constantly refer to his creature as an alien? The whole point is that it evolved on the planet.
"It's Dot Com!"
Thanks for all your hard work, Don, nice resume you've got there.
:)
But you obviously still don't understand what I wrote.
Plain as day, I wrote that I WILL PAY RETAIL, and DON'T NEED THE SOURCE, and that I think that you and your fellow EA devs *deserve* to earn whatever money your product of work can produce.
From my OP: "I wouldn't mind paying retail for a copy of this game, based on what I've seen of it. I give money to developers for their work on other apps I use, why wouldn't I do the same for a game? I understand that it took years for them to develop, and they need to make money for what they've done. I don't need the source to play it."
I'm all good with that! Not a problem at all. I hope you are getting rich, actually - because I understand that good coding isn't something that just anyone can do.
That makes me neither a "crybaby" nor "greedy". Quite the opposite, I'd think.
Despite your insinuation, neither did I attempt to "evangelize" anyone to use Linux. I just stated that that is what I use (yep, my own choice, made in the full knowledge of what that entails), and have, for 9 years, closing in on 10, on a daily basis as my own source of income. And that I personally would like it (WILL like it, the day is coming) when companies such as yours begin releasing games for the Linux platform.
That, my friend, is just an expressed personal desire, nothing more, and certainly nothing to ream me out over, or to get so upset about. IMO, of course.
Best of luck to you.
"...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
Every time I see something about Spore, my mind twists it into Spoor.
Must have watched too many nature shows on TV.
"He's lost in a 'floyd hole"
I'm guessing there's your answer.
It wasn't Linux that killed Loki.
Read the story about loki's downfall here: http://www.linux.com/feature/22324
Spore is coming to all the consoles, including the xbox360 and the ps3, as well as the wii. You don't even need to own a computer to play spore. You might have wait a little bit longer is all, depending on where they are in development for the console versions. I'm guessing they are shooting for a close to simultaneous release.
I'm sorry, I didn't mean that you yourself were a greedy crybaby. I appreciate your attitude, and that you're willing to pay for products that take time and money to produce. It's the grandparent article that you were indirectly replying to that I was insinuating about:
Now that's a whiny crybaby, who bitches about how hard it is for poor old him, because of the decision he chose to made of his own free will, then he throws out a bunch of ridiculous claims about how superior Spore would be if only it had been developed on Linux. More secure, elegant, and efficient, ehe? It's people who bull shit like that out of their ass who give Linux and Open Source Software a bad name.
-Don
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
Thank you for doing this. I decided to get a TomTom because I had heard that they had the best Mac software out there. I have my gripes, but at least I don't feel like a second-class citizen like with some software.
OOOH! LOL - and agreed. :)
"...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
I don't get it. All that story talks about is a long period in which Loki basically had no money, and finally went bankrupt, as often happens to businesses which have no money. It does not address the question of why they had no money, and the answer to that one is basically, "because they made games for Linux, which nobody buys." You seemed to think that this article contradicts this position, but I just don't see it. Can you elaborate?
With the declining quality of games released these days, I think I would make the following prediction: Spore will be the greatest game ever released, and it will be the last good game of any kind ever released. Flame if you like, but in a few years you'll know I am right.
If Spore delivers what it promises, shouldn't we be able to use it to create Duke Nukem Forever?
... and then they built the supercollider.
It wasn't a much fun as good old SimCity 2000 was, but that wasn't the fault of the port.
What was annoying, though, is that being a commercial binary compiled for one specific kernel/glibc version, it now no longer runs on a decently modern Linux. That's a problem that Windows doesn't have so much, with its pretty good binary back-compatibility. It's also a problem that open-source games on Linux don't have either, because they get recompiled. In fact, I have DOS games that run better under Dosbox and Windows games that run better under Wine/Cedega than late-90s ported-specially-for-Linux games now do.
So commercial ports on Linux are in a bit of a technical bind, really - more than an economic one, I think. Linux is fundamentally a closed-binary-hostile environment because it makes no promises of enduring binary compatibility, except under specific retro emulation environments.
You are not a brain: http://books.google.com/books?id=2oV61CeDx-YC
Does anyone remember the fuss around Black & White? That was a huge, open god sim that promised so much... Is Spore the next B&W? Don't get me wrong, I'll torrent it along with everyone else when it comes out, but I'm not getting my hopes up.
It gripped her hand gently. 'Regret is for humans,' it said.
Wow. Is the real Don Hopkins? Got to say I was a fan until this post.
Sure the guy you responded to is crazy asking you to open source your game, but the first part(asking for it to run on Linux) was reasonable. I've been happily running Enemy Territory Quake Wars(closed source of course) on my fedora box, and would probably have bought Spore if there was a Linux port.
"Linux is only free if your time is worthless." - The Microsoft meme, repeated by Don Hopkins. Not cool.
Oh well, thanks for sim city.
"If they have both, tell them we use Linux. And if they have that, tell them the computers are down." -Dave Chapelle
Can't speak for the other guy, but in the last year I bought Enemy Territory Quake Wars, and UT 3(still waiting for the promised Linux port). That's only a hundred bucks on computer games, but I'd buy more if there were more Linux ports.
"If they have both, tell them we use Linux. And if they have that, tell them the computers are down." -Dave Chapelle
The Orz were masterpieces of mindf**k. Happy chirping little guys who were actually the manifestations of some hideous Lovecraftian thing from *below*.
There is absolutely no way to justify the millions of dollars EA would have lost if they delayed the release of Spore for another year, just to port it to Linux, so that they could sell a few hundred more copies of it.
Then don't delay it, do a port of the binaries, and create an installer to use the data from the windows discs after it ships.
And will it really take another year even though it's cross-platform enough to run on Windows and Mac?
Id Software usually puts the Linux binaries of there games out just a few weeks after the Windows version goes live.
"If they have both, tell them we use Linux. And if they have that, tell them the computers are down." -Dave Chapelle
Just remember . . . one race's intimate lubricant could be another's caustic BBQ sauce.
That's better. Remember: if nothing died, it's a snack not a meal.
My Suburban burns less gasoline than your Prius.
Spore is not what everyone is lead to believe it is. It is a game with somewhat procedural art, sound, and animation, but not procedural _gameplay_. Spore will be enjoying amazing sales from the point when it hits retail to the point where people will get to see all the pregenerated content and realize that they're staring at the next-generation Black & White. Once that happens, sales will fall, but Will Wright will have enough money buy a castle where he will move out with Peter Molyneux after they get married.
- some Office 2007 applications have a new Word Art gallery/feature whereas others have the same one used since Word 95
- the classic font installation dialog in XP that looks like it came straight out of Windows 3.1
- Office 2007 has completely differently designed properties dialogs for different objects (tables/images)
- applications designed for Windows are often "skinnable" with no respect for usability or consistency (this isn't so much of a problem with Linux desktop environments)
- the classic Windows 2000 look (without Aero and all the other nonsense) in Vista isn't consistent between applications (I think it is the command prompt window that doesn't theme properly?)
- Windows application developers often like to use their own ActiveX GUI controls and widgets in place of operating system defaults
- too many nag question popups with Windows (cancel/allow, are you sure?, etc)
- cluttered interfaces in Windows applications with too many unnecessary options (that should automatically be detected or placed out of view because they're never used)
- Windows installers and wizards requiring you to click 'next' 30 times to perform a single task
-
Linux desktop environments such as Gnome are amongst the MOST usable in existence. Please take time to reconsider your previous stance carefully.
I can understand standing up for what you believe in, but I think you are going a bit overboard here...last time I checked, closed source hasn't stopped some games from developing INSANELY huge communities...or have you already forgotten about user-made stuff for things like doom, quake, etc. The roller coaster tycoon series and the elder scroll series come to mind as well...
Half the games you refference are open source...
It isn't hard for EA to port Spore to Linux with Wine. I'd pay for that to be honest, because it seems EA can't get its head out of its ass and use SDL, no no they have to use the inferior D3D9 platform...
Now that's a whiny crybaby,
No, I'm sorry to inform you, but that was a troll.
The enemies of Democracy are
I know there's a Windows version too, but since it's shipping full versions for the Mac, I was thinking of ditching the Win version and just using my Wii to play Spore creatures designed on my Mac Mini.
Or is that hard to do?
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Like Goofy, or Donald Duck, or Mickey and Minnie Mouse?
...
And then use the solid printer to "print" the resulting 3D creatures?
Remember, the only reason copyright is longer than 25 years in the USA is that Disney wanted it that way
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
As I understand cross-pollination, other peoples' creatures will show up in my world. This is really cool, but how do they solve the problem of someone's giant-oozing-penis race winding up on some 6 year old's computer? Surely the don't plan to hand-moderate all content?
Think the Mass Effect hysteria was bad?
I'm currently developing TomTom Home on Mac
What's the deal with the lack of breadcrumb/tracklog support on TomToms. I almost bought one for my car until I read that. I managed to get almost my entire Honeymoon (about 30 days) on a handheld Garmin Etrex Legend and there's no way I'm giving that up.
Trying to argue that EA should release mainstream games on Linux will get you absolutely nowhere.
How about if they just helped the WINE community to get their games running decently on WINE. Surely that's just a win win situation with minimal effort.
A lot of their games are probably most of the way there. I recently installed FIFA 08 under WINE on Ubuntu and it almost worked perfectly. Two problems: gamepads wouldn't work correctly and the ball was grey. If they could help the WINE developers solve those problems, you'd have a fully functional "port" with minimal effort.
If EA put a little logo on their boxes i.e. "Works on WINE" I'd buy more games for sure.
I really hope that this'll run via WINE. Then I could teach my spores how to evolve with each kernel upgrade.
Everything iD has open sourced was opened WELL after the games had run their course in retail. Them being open had nothing to do with their success.
You mean SDL+OpenGL instead of DirectX. That's a pretty subjective debate, and I have a good feeling neither you nor I are qualified to make any sort of worthwhile statement about it. I would love to see more companies go the open source, cross platform route instead of using MS's stuff, but I'm sure they have their reasons. It'd be interesting to hear them.
It probably isn't too hard to get Spore running under Wine. I like that idea, i think it'd be something great for companies to work towards.
"Upon attaching the waterblock to my penis, I began to notice that I know nothing about computers." -- JRockway
Borg lawyers.
Is the mac version native to mac, or is it just one of those releases with wine packaged with it? I ask because I remember a game that was going to be released for mac that was just windows version with wine, but I can't remember what game that was.
When I first read about this game years ago, I though it would be some kind of natural selection/evolution simulator
with some kind of artificial DNA that would mutate and mix with other DNA, resulting in all kinds of
creatures. But from what I've read here, it seems that it's more like a creature editor with various games around it.
No underlying model for evolution at all.
A bit disappointing, but then, my expectation were silly: it's a game, not a lab!
Still, I would like to have an evolutionary lab with stunning graphics....
assignment != equality != identity
Have I missed the system requirements for this game. My computer can barely handle HL2ep2 and dies on Bioshock... so I really hope this isn't as graphically intense. From what I've seen it doesn't look like it- no reflective water or smoke effects or what ever... but I'd like to know in advance if I need a new graphics card.
That is because Id uses standards such as OpenGL. Microsoft created this myth that cross platform development is hard. If you use open standards and write your software correctly, all you should only need a recomplie for a new OS, but if you tie your program to proprietary libraries, you have to manually port everything.
For general applications, there is nothing stopping programmers from writing cross platform apps, except Microsoft. This is how they stayed so big: generating incompatiblity. Fooling programmers into using MS Windows only libraries. That is how they ruined Java.
Complaining about how bad Windows is DOES NOT MAKE LINUX ANY EASIER TO USE. When I criticize Linux, that does not mean I'm endorsing Windows or the Mac. Get over it.
There are so many mediocre choices of Linux desktop environments and user interfaces, and they are all so different and incompatible, that there is absolutely no consistency, and you end up with a bunch of antagonistic applications opened on the same screen that all disagree about cut and paste, drag and drop, mouse tracking, menus, keyboard shortcuts, internationalization, accessibility, interprocess communication, defaults, configuration, color management, etc. How you could possibly claim that the Linux desktop has any kind of consistency is beyond me. Maybe you just read about Linux on slashdot but don't actually use it yourself?
From The X-Windows Disaster, which I wrote 16 years ago, but shamefully STILL applies to Linux desktops:
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
Supporting WINE is a great idea, which I agree with! EA is paying Transgaming to port Spore to the Mac with Cider, which is based on WINE.
There are some silly people who argue that WINE and similar technologies are evil because it is an easy way out that prevents companies from doing native Linux ports of games. But harsh reality is that those ports would have never happened in the first place without WINE, because companies don't have years of spare have time to waste and wads of money to flush down the toilet -- not even a Linux-friendly company like Loki, who couldn't be bothered to pay their employees for all the time they put in because of their unswerving faith in the goodness of Linux. Most companies already weren't doing native Linux ports of games, before WINE was ever an issue. The few companies that were foolhardy enough to try publishing games on Unix (like DUX, who I worked for in the early 90's), or Linux (like Loki, who entered the market years later), didn't make nearly enough money to pay for all the work and expenses and licensing fees.
Those shrill arguments against WINE only make sense in a universe that we do not live in, where Windows is not important, and big public companies take huge risks and spend large amounts of money even though there will be no return on investments just because they love Linux, and everyone has a free flying pink pony who can sing, and whose farts smell like raspberry cream sherbet.
The existence of WINE is very very low on the long list of reasons companies don't natively port games to Linux. High on the list is the fact that there is a MUCH bigger and viable market for Mac applications that Linux desktop applications, so development effort goes towards that instead. Technologies like Cider solve the porting problem quite well (although they require development and bug fixing, since Windows is a moving target, and games can be very quirky and system dependent). It costs money to develop products like Cedega and Cider, and it makes sense for a company like EA to license it instead of putting their own effort into adapting open source software like WINE, since EA requires Transgaming's support and development effort, and they're using it to publish a proprietary game that presumably they're going to make money off of.
It's much better to have Windows games and other applications that run on Linux with WINE or Cedega, and Mac with Cider, than not having those Windows games and applications running on Linux and Mac at all.
-Don
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
Sorry to break it to you, kiddo, but cross platform development IS hard, and has always been hard long before Microsoft ever existed.
You obviously have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, if you think that's all there is to cross platform programming.
And for your information: Sun ruined Java, not Microsoft.
-Don
Take a look and feel free: http://www.PieMenu.com
Good luck with the game Don. All the people I know are now are shifting or have already shifted to Linux, with a couple going to OS X. Valve won't do Linux native but they do try and ensure their games work with WINE, which is why when I get time I will buy the Orange Box. The pleasure I get out of Linux outweighs not being able to play the occasional game, and I'm sure in a year or two WINE will be hacked enough to run Spore by which point I'll be able to pick it up for 10 bucks. If it gets good reviews I'll keep an eye out for it here:
http://appdb.winehq.org/appbrowse.php?iCatId=2
Phillip.
Property for sale in Nice, France
Are you this condescending to everyone? You're angry because you were trolled at the start of this thread, we get it. No reason to be a prick about it.
Sure cross platform development is hard, but you guys are already doing it between windows, mac, and consoles. Adding Linux to that doesn't need to get in the way of your bread and butter, especially not at launch.
And for your information: Sun ruined Java, not Microsoft.
And for your information Java hasn't been ruined. It's alive and well in phones, blu-rays, business appications, web applications and plenty of other places.
Microsoft did indeed try to ruin it with proprietary extensions in their 1.14 JVM, and it ended up costing them a 2 Billion dollar settlement.
"If they have both, tell them we use Linux. And if they have that, tell them the computers are down." -Dave Chapelle
if they delayed the release of Spore for another year
Who said anything about delaying the initial release? Even id software releases their Linux binaries a while after the game hits stores.
EA is paying Transgaming to port Spore to the Mac with Cider,
What port? If you're using Cider, then you're not actually porting it, aren't you?
I had been looking for a name for my race. Now I have one. Thanks.
Help poke pirates in the eyepatch, arr.
Oh look, the Loki argument again. And as misfounded as ever, of course.
First of all, Loki was destined to fail from day one because it had a broken business model. Nobody wants to buy 9 month old games at full price, even if it means being able to run it on the OS of their choice. The only way you can actually "sell" a Linux port is if it's produced by the original developer (that includes using a sub-contractor, such as Ryan Gordon), and (this is very important) compatible with the original Windows disc. Which is what id, Epic, etc. already does, in case you hadn't noticed.
Another important point: back in the Loki days (which is now ancient history in terms of computing), Linux had insufficient graphics support. It simply wasn't ready for games. But times have changed, and all major graphic vendors release Linux drivers now. Linux IS ready for games now.
Basically all I'm saying is: You say Linux is worth porting to, fine. I respect your opinion. But PLEASE stop hitting the fucking dead horse that is Loki. It is NOT a relevant point, and it never was.
Basically someone who is a die hard Microsoft Fanboi who posts anon.
I would also pay full retail price + a couple of extra pounds/dollars for whatever extra dev work went into making an Ubuntu port.
Your true colours are really shining through in your comments as you stereotype a community of users willing to give you cash as trolls.