Gen Con Files For Chapter 11

Heartless Gamer writes to tell us that Gen Con LLC announced late last week that they have filed for Chapter 11. This move will not affect the still profitable Gen Con Indy event which will still happen August 14-17, 2008. "This action became necessary as a result of significant unforeseen expenses associated with attempts to expand its core business to encompass externally licensed events. [...] The protections afforded by Chapter 11 will allow Gen Con to further its efforts to address its liquidity needs, preserve value for its creditors and explore strategic alternatives for the business." Evan writes to add that this is the result of LucasFilm suing GenCon.

Comments

First Post

[Anonymous Coward]

Jeez...

Re:first post

[professional_troll]

You fuckers are so pathetic when you say you got first post and you're THIRD.

Sucked in you mother fucking, cock smoking, gun humping, tobacco chewing, christian, imbred, redneck little bitches

Re:first post

[Ex-MislTech]

Sucked in you mother fucking, cock smoking, gun humping, tobacco chewing, christian, imbred, redneck little bitches

When the KH-55/555 stealth cruise missiles levels the large cities
and you show up in the country with that attitude.

The people you consider an insult will be the only thing
between you and your role as worm food.

http://www.janes.com/extracts/extract/jsws/jsws0485.html

Part of me hopes you get a new attitude, the other half hopes
you turn into a roentgen receptor.

When the neo cons use the nuke bunker busters on Iran
here in a few weeks, the only place you will have to go is the
rural areas when the Russian bear bombers release
6 radar invisible missiles per plane.

See you in hell...

Ex-MislTech

First Psto!

[Anonymous Coward]

yay

first post

[Anonymous Coward]

All you fucking haters out there can suck my motherfucking dick.

And we still smoking.

What?

This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[Obiwan Kenobi]

Just FYI, this filing is a direct result of Lucasfilm suing Gen Con for a lot of deception regarding "Celebration IV" that occurred last year.

As taken from this story on TheForce.net, here is a summation of the charges:

1. Gen Con failed to uphold its legal obligations in terms of financial reporting, accounting and payments to Lucasfilm ($500,000 in damages)
2. Gen Con did not give auction proceeds to Make-A-Wish as they had agreed to do ($150,000 in damages)
3. Gen Con did not give Lucasfilm their share of the auction proceeds ($150,000 in damages)
4. Gen Con did this all unjustly ($150,000 in damages)"

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, that describes it completely. This thread is OVER!

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[poetmatt]

FYI,

Its a "to be determined 500k" meaning they don't know that it's accurate. I don't know what Gencon did/didn't do, but bankruptcy stays any legal matters....therefore, until they get out of bankruptcy (or judge allows the case to move forward), Gencon gets a get out of jail free (temporarily).

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[Otter]

2. Gen Con did not give auction proceeds to Make-A-Wish as they had agreed to do ($150,000 in damages)

If true, which may well not be the case, that's got to have a pretty big load of bad karma attached to it...

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[Jeff DeMaagd]

but bankruptcy stays any legal matters....therefore, until they get out of bankruptcy (or judge allows the case to move forward), Gencon gets a get out of jail free (temporarily).

Is that really true? That's pretty sucky of a delay tactic.

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[poetmatt]

Go look at groklaw for SCO's case. SCO did it intentionally, however, it's not a delay tactic. It's common bankruptcy law. Cases are put on hold unless there is a reason pleaded to the bankruptcy judge that the BK (bankruptcy) judge accepts to allow it to go forward...this in itself can be allowed at times to determine amounts owed.

However, note that all BK is allowed with the expectations to both a: get out of BK as fast as possible if possible, and b: if not possible, liquidate/pay off your creditors to the fullest of the assets that the bankrupt company has(the total liquidation kind of bankruptcy...whether that's 11 or 7, I forgot). Bankruptcy moves forward very quickly. If you stall, they can force you to appoint people to help you get back on your feet (and manage your money) well enough to get out of BK. This is not something about to be delayed multiple years. Additionally, once you hit BK, you cannot spend any money without court approval at all. So their finances are going to be open regardless of whether lucas is actually factual about the "we agreed to see their financials and they aren't showing us".

What's more likely is either a: Gencon's pulling a fast one or b: Gencon never read over a ton of legal fine print that fucked them over bigtime...there are ways to fight this in court, it's not common or easy. However, I don't get how Lucas is suing for anything with make a wish foundation. They don't represent them, and don't own them, so thats basically all bullshit. If Gencon gets a smart lawyer regardless of what they did, they'll have that dropped before it even comes to trial, as well as any false evidence.

IANAL but I read a lot on law, and study it (and bankruptcy books - family members are credit analysts) quite a bit.

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[Macgrrl]

So, superficially this looks like a case of Hollywood accounting:

• GenCon ran an auction
• The agreement was that the proceeds would be split between Lucasfilm and the Make-a-Wish Foundation
• Lucasflim is disatisfied with the statement of earnings from the auction and believe the proceeds were greater than reported by GenCon
• Lucasfilm is suing saying - "come on, we all know you made more than that - cough it up"

My questions would be: What split was LucasFilm expecting? What costs could be legitimately deducted (were all auction iems donated free of charge and were there overheads in operating the auction).

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[Afell001]

A friend of mine went through a nasty divorce a few years back, and his wife was able to hold up the divorce proceedings for nearly a year by filing for bankruptcy. This made it so that she was able to collect separate maintenance checks (half his paycheck, since she "conveniently" quit her job a couple months before she filed) as well as live in the house he was paying for and forcing him to move out. Since the house and mortgage was in both their names, it was also tied up in the bankruptcy, which left him in legal limbo when he tried to find another place to live (not many landlords will rent to someone whose house is tied up in bankruptcy and has several liens against it). Needless to say, he paid through the nose to finalize the divorce. She, on the other hand, took several trips to Vegas and at least one trip to the Bahamas with her new boyfriend, while he was living at my house eating PBJs and ramen, and working like a dog to keep his good credit from being completely destroyed. Yep, I know full well about this tactic. It's a nasty way to stave off any kind of court proceeding until it is resolved. My friend ended up paying half his income for a year and a half (roughly about $150,000) just because of it, and then spent most of the rest of his income paying for lawyers, child support and making payments on a house he couldn't live in. Be careful who you marry, is all I can say if you are looking for a moral to this story.

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[GaryPatterson]

Sure, sure, what else would Obi Wan Kenobi say? I call bias!

(kidding!)

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[poetmatt]

I hear you there. People don't realize how bad nuclear families are....if you have kids but are domestic, you don't sign on things together either. People live in this 1950's "lets get married and have a SO + kids together"...get tied down, get screwed. I'm sure maybe a girl one day will motivated me to get married but I'd certainly prefer a domestic partnership that is not legally bound or something...at least you have LESS to worry about like that, although not "nothing to worry about".

I don't know how divorce goes in bankruptcy but I am amazed that the stay was a year. I've heard of 2,3,5 months but from what I hear a year is rare. Of course that's what SCO is aiming for, no doubt.

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[MsGeek]

Gen Con didn't just screw Make A Wish, they screwed the fans at Celebration IV. To give an example: they produced an insufficient amount of certain collectables that were supposed to be sold there, and then allowed DEALERS to buy what little they had produced. If you wanted an embroidered C-IV patch, they were made of unobtainium at the event itself. And now, I checked on eBay, and guess what? Look up item # 150215899090 and you will see the upshot of that policy.

I am looking forward to C-V. The Los Angeles Convention Center was a great venue for this event, and hopefully it will return there. Hopefully Lucasfilm will have a more professional partner next time.

Re:This is a result of Lucasfilm litigation

[Moonpie Madness]

lawyers who abide these tactics are called "rambo" lawyers, and there is always two or three firms in every town that works this way. In fact, the next thing to do if you get divorced but want a fair deal and know your SO is going to be a jackass about it is to hire all the rambo attorneys, tell them your private info, and then drop them so they are barred from taking the case against you (since they have confidential information). The attorneys actually make a decent amount of money from these 'retainers'.

Another note, I don't know where you are, but in many places you can still be married without getting married if you domicile with someone for long enough. Common law marriage and all that.

best thing to do is try for a community property state and know your spouse well enough to know if there are real problems. Sadly, a lot of people get totally screwed.

Moral of the Story . . .

[arizwebfoot]

If you keep taking cookies out of the cookie jar today, there will soon be none for tomorrow.

If you forget to give your bigger brother his cookies, he beats the hell out of you and you have to file bankruptcy.


Democracy is two wolves and a lamb sitting down and voting on what's for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.

Re:Moral of the Story . . .

[Anonymous Coward]

IDIOT

Re:Moral of the Story . . .

[arizwebfoot]

If you want to Mod me a Troll, at least make it a flaming troll. You know with red hair, beady eyes, buck teeth, and nekked.

I thought it humorous.

Re:Moral of the Story . . .

[Anonymous Coward]

Liberty for who?

Re:Moral of the Story . . .

[alva_edison]

It's a quote from Benjamin Franklin (or very similar to one anyway)

d20

[Webs 101]

I guess Gen Con failed the saving throw.

Re:d20

[Shadow Wrought]

I guess Gen Con failed the saving throw.

Yep. Turns out they needed an unmodified 21 on a d20.

Re:d20

[gEvil (beta)]

from the missed-their-saving-throw dept.

I guess Gen Con failed the saving throw.

Yeah, we got the joke the first time.

Re:d20

[BarneyRabble]

They also failed a Wisdom and Intelligence Check. Must have been a lich sucking their spirit dry...(oh, wait they did that when they left Milwaukee...)

Re:d20

[Alascom]

d20 throws a +5 Funny at the GenCon... wow..

Re:d20

[operagost]

That's why I still play 2nd ed: 20 always succeeds! Stupid kids, get off my lawn!

Re:d20

[Shadow Wrought]

That's why I still play 2nd ed: 20 always succeeds!

Of course. But against lawyers you need to roll a 20 on a d12;-)

Anyone else hope

[Moryath]

that this might, JUST might, get them to move GenCon back to Milwaukee where it belongs?

I mean, seriously - they bitched and moaned about "not enough hotel space" being the prime factor when by moving it just one weekend later they WOULDN'T HAVE TO COMPETE FOR HOTEL SPACE WITH FUCKING WISCONSIN STATE FAIR.

Then the very next year at GenCon Indy - "not enough space in the dealers' room, we're growing out of all the hotel space we can find in Indy..." bah.

Move it back to Milwaukee where it belongs. I miss taking my buddies to The Safehouse.

Re:Anyone else hope

[the_fat_kid]

amen to that.
I've never even been to the Indy GenCon. I don't go to Indy.
Milwaukee is a hole, but I would go to another GenCon or two there.
I haven't used my safe house card in many moons.

Re:Anyone else hope

[Peter Mork]

As much as I love The Safehouse and its back door, you do realize that GenCon is called GenCon because it belongs in Lake Geneva, right? I fondly remember MECCA as much as the next guy, but to equate that location with GenCon denies the history of the event.

Re:Anyone else hope

[a42]

Gen Con belongs in Milwaukee? Bzzt.

I've been to 10 Gen Cons, 5 in Milwaukee and 5 in Indy. Indy wins in every respect. Better hotel access, better convention area, better restaurants. The businesses surrounding the convention center go way out of their way to make attendees feel welcome. (Yes, it's totally self serving, but the businesses in Milwaukee didn't bother.)

Oh yeah. And Indy doesn't roll up the streets at 5pm. It's nice to get be able to find something to eat and/or drink after a long day of gaming.

And The Safehouse? Never really cared for it. But I *do* miss the wax security guard at the MWECC.

Re:Anyone else hope

[catmistake]

Milwaukee? You mean Greyhawk.

Re:Anyone else hope

[isomeme]

Sometime around 1975, when I was about 13 years old, we were planning to visit my grandparents near Milwaukee one summer when I realized that the fabled GenCon would happen right in the middle of our visit. I managed to work out a ride to Lake Geneva for one day, a glorious day which still lives in my memory as THE GEEKIEST DAY EVAR. I won a copy of the SPI game StarForce in a raffle within moments of arriving, and it just got better from there.

So, yes: For some of us, Lake Geneva will always be the true home of GenCon.

Re:Anyone else hope

[Anonymous Coward]

You're an idiot.

Re:Anyone else hope

[Anonymous Coward]

As an Indianapolis resident, I'm pretty happy with the move. It's actually a pretty good location as far as accessibility, too. A close drive from Chicago, Columbus OH, St. Louis. And it is not a terrible drive from Wisconsin. And increasingly better amenities as far as entertainment goes.

That said, every gamer within driving distance should register for this year's GenCon Indy. It's a lot of fun and it doesn't require flying out to California or New York like every other convention these days.

Re:Anyone else hope

[kria]

Um, GenCon Indy is the thing that keeps the rest of GenCon's failures running. It's been hugely successful in Indy, and from what I understand the locals are much friendlier. I can't attest to friendlier, having never attended elsewhere, but I can definitely say they are friendly. Restaurants tuning tvs usually on sports channels to sci-fi channel and decorating with old hall banners, special pins over at Hard Rock, that kind of thing. I had heard that things were somewhat less amicable in the old location.

Re:Anyone else hope

[elrous0]

If by "Less amicable" you mean "hostile shithole," then yes.

They aint seen nuthin yet

[Recovering Hater]

Just wait until Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition flops.

Re:They aint seen nuthin yet

[NJVil]

Flop could be an understatement. Nobody I know is interested in 4th Edition despite all the Gleemax and related hype. The canceling of Dungeon magazine and Dragon magazines to pursue this online bastard child of Dungeons & Dragons and World of Warcraft has left a fair number of people with a bad taste in their mouths.

Re:They aint seen nuthin yet

[mlund]

Peter Adkison owns GenCon.

Hasbro owns Dungeons & Dragons.

Hasbro bought Peter Adkison out of Wizards of the Coast (who owned D&D) over half a decade ago.

Re:They aint seen nuthin yet

[taustin]

The canceling of Dungeon magazine and Dragon magazines to pursue this online bastard child of Dungeons & Dragons and World of Warcraft has left a fair number of people with a bad taste in their mouths.

If you don't like the taste of semen, you shouldn't be buying WotC products.

Re:They aint seen nuthin yet

[taustin]

D&D and GenCon are owned by entirely different companies, and have no business connection whatsoever any more.

Which means we get to watch two companies crash and burn instead of just one.

Re:They aint seen nuthin yet

[Anonymous Coward]

Really? Because in the 4 separate D&D groups I play with, everyone is pretty excited for it. Killing Dungeon and Dragon magazines pissed off a lot of people, but the game mechanics that they're changing for 4th Ed seem like pretty good moves.

Re:They aint seen nuthin yet

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, really. Our group plays WoW and we have also been playing D&D for almost 30 years. The problem is, as much as we like WoW, when we play D&D we don't want to be playing WoW.

I'm getting tired of every designer interview masturbating about how great WoW is and all these wonderful mechanics they've adopting. Fuck them. For every good change they've made in 4e they've made two shitty ones. Hell, I won't be surprised if modules in 4e are called "instances".

Gen Con

[Teflon_Jeff]

This has been seen coming for a while. GenCon SoCal failed a few years ago, and the mega-convention scene is becoming larger. GenCon doesn't quite have the exclusive draws it used to have. Let's hope we see a refocus on becoming a destination for all gamers.

Wills till?

[Tsar]

This move will not affect the still profitable Gen Con Indy event which wills till happen August 14-17, 2008.

Goo dnews! That is suchar elief! Thank sforp assing iton!

Re:Wills till?

[Anonymous Coward]

I bet you like assing iton. Take your Klingon talk somewhere else, tard!

What the hell is a Gen Con

[stratjakt]

Some sort of furry/anime/cosplay thing?

Don't tell me, I don't even want to know.

I'm sure society is much better off without it.

Why can't you people do that silly spaceman shit in private? The rest of society doesn't want to see you.

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[spun]

Silly troll. Gen Con is one of the oldest, biggest, and most prestigious gaming conventions in the world. You know, Dungeon's and Dragons? Video games? Oh, why do I even bother, you're just being insulting to get a rise out of people. Even if it was a furry/anime/cosplay thing, why do you care? No one is rubbing your face in it, making you watch. Do you hate America? You know, land of the free? Do you hate that people are free to do what they want? Would you like to tell everyone what they can and can't do? Why are you even on this site? Go back to freep or AOL or the foxnews forums or whatever dung-heap you crawled out of, Slashdot is not the place for the likes of you.

There, you got a rise out of me, are you happy now?

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[Anonymous Coward]

Haha - I'm not even the OP, but I am happy that they got a rise out of you.

And yes, I do sometimes hate America. I want people to be sad and miserable!

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[Anonymous Coward]

(Applause)

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[Anonymous Coward]

Gen Con is one of the oldest, biggest, and most prestigious gaming conventions in the world.

I'm not the OP either, but can't help thinking this is a use of "prestigious" that I've never seen before.

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[Anonymous Coward]

you shouldn't have bothered, if you look at his history he's a career troll always sitting at -1 with 5 pages of freaks. nothing to see here move along.

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[youthoftoday]

Dungeon's what?

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[spun]

Oh man, my finger slipped. You know, the apostrophe, it's so close to the... ah... Look over there! It's Bigfoot!

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[91degrees]

Dungeons and dragons? Wasn't that the game that pirated the idea from the movie "Monsters and Mazes"?

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[obeythefist]

And nobody is better than gamers at being petty and political when in large groups. I've been involved in the local science fiction convention crowd and I've never known a more incestuous, aloof, and petty bunch of people. Most visitors to the cons missed the point of about half of the events at the cons because they were all what amounts to pretty large circlejerks for the organisers. And yeah, some of them were furries. I'm not sure people like that should be trusted to run large events.

I'm going to jump up and say, yeah, as an Australian, I don't really like America. I'm more free than Americans, so I live in a land more free than the land of the free. Cute, huh? So, we got a four digit telling people on the "internet" that Slashdot is only for people who love America huh? That's a good one. If you were truly free, and truly believed in freedom, you'd respect other people's opinions a lot more than you do. And you sure as heck wouldn't stoop down so low from your 4 digit ivory tower to wrestle in the mud arguing on the internets.

Anyway, I digress. The Gen Con people messed up pretty bad. Colossally bad, I might say. From one of the linked articles:

1. Gen Con failed to uphold its legal obligations in terms of financial reporting, accounting and payments to Lucasfilm ($500,000 in damages)
2. Gen Con did not give auction proceeds to Make-A-Wish as they had agreed to do ($150,000 in damages)
3. Gen Con did not give Lucasfilm their share of the auction proceeds ($150,000 in damages)
4. Gen Con did this all unjustly ($150,000 in damages)

I don't want people who fleece the Make-A-Wish foundation, either through incompetence or malice, to be responsible for things I care about. People capable of that ineptitude are not "most prestigious". Nonetheless, the undeserving will always remain in positions of power. You don't always get what you want, but in a free country you should be entitled to try get it.

Re:What the hell is a Gen Con

[glwtta]

Heh, I admire the indignation, but you do realize that to the rest of society the Dungeons & Dragons and furry/anime/cosplay crowds are nigh indistinguishable?

(yes, I'm one of the people who would've appreciated a line in the summary about what the hell GenCon is)

Why am I not surprised?

[realmolo]

ALL "conventions", no matter what industry/hobby they are about, are run by thieves and liars. Seriously.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[VellonIssachar]

PAX would be the exception here.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not that they're (necessarily) run by those with criminal intent. Many conventions started out small and became much larger than their operators ever intended, and these are people with little business or financial know-how. It's a common sight to see conventions collapse due to unintentionally poor management in any field, really.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

How do you know? It's not like Tycho and Gabe run the thing personally. It's entirely possible that somewhere in the chain is a very corrupt person who will someday bring it all down for them.

It's not like GenCon was always a failure.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[mckinnsb]

I was *just* going to say that. From what I've heard, all the reports from PAX have been 100% positive.

I'd really hope on their part that this was a case of someone screwing Gen Con over, which resulted in LucasFilm not receiving their agreed-upon dues, and not the reverse. I don't know the details as to who ran the convention, but I'm sure many of you have been given an estimate- lets say , to renovate your kitchen- and when the smoke cleared, suddenly your bill was twice as large as you thought it would be. For some reason "Power Requirements, Cleaning Costs" pops into my head. It also could be the case, since Gen Con immediately filed Chapter 11, that they might know they are in the wrong, but just didn't have the money to write the check to Lucas Arts, and didn't want to take out a loan to pay them (winding up in more debt).

The lawsuit also seems to be more of a "principle" lawsuit than a "money grab" lawsuit. 150k for "unlawful behavior" is actually being pretty lenient on this scale- and especially when you are dealing with an extremely powerful company with one of the more valuable intellectual properties on the market.

I'm glad that the Gen Con indy convention is still going to go down, though. I'd like to think that not all conventions are run by thieves and liars, even if it is just my choice to be naive.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

Actually, I think they themselves claim to be charlatains. The very least unworthy :)

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Sitnalta]

Well how do you know all convention organizers are thieves and liars? Do you know them? Just because some conventions are questionably run doesn't mean all of them are. Every aspect of PAX isn't personally run by Gabe & Tycho, but they still call the shots. So if there was anything shady going on they would, and have, excise it immediately.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[byennie]

Really? Do you know the people who run GenCon?

GenCon is owned by Peter Adkison, the creator of Magic and former CEO of Wizards of the Coast. He's a gamer through and through and one of the most approachable guys on the planet of his stature. Peter made plenty off of WoTC's sale to Hasbro to do whatever he wanted - GenCon wasn't lining his pockets by any stretch of the imagination. This is the same man who responded to my unsolicited emails for help starting a gaming company. He answered any question I had, connected me with his personal contacts, and in return - just suggested that I pay it forward. I don't know anything about GenCon's legal issues, but I suspect neither do you.

I don't know the depth of their dealings. But unless you do, perhaps you should refrain from making generalizations. God forbid you ever achieve such a level of success and find people throwing stones at you. Reserving judgement isn't nearly as sensational, but it's often warranted.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

test

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Irish_Samurai]

I thought Richard Garfield created magic.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

The lawsuit also seems to be more of a "principle" lawsuit than a "money grab" lawsuit. 150k for "unlawful behavior" is actually being pretty lenient on this scale- and especially when you are dealing with an extremely powerful company with one of the more valuable intellectual properties on the market. I'd say it's more on the realistic side, probably precisely what has been agreed upon in the contract, quite unlike the 48 million for a pair of trousers lost at the dry cleaners, or 48 million for a $1500 notebook lost during repair.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[91degrees]

There are plenty of small non-profit conventions that aren't.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Fozzyuw]

ALL "conventions", no matter what industry/hobby they are about, are run by thieves[...]Seriously.

That's because it takes too long to level a Paladin.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Psychochild]

To be fair, you can only count Peter Adkison as one of the people who helped launch Magic: The Gathering. It was a large project, and the designer is Richard Garfield as another post indicated.

However, the rest of your post is spot-on. I had the pleasure of meeting Peter a few times, and he's a really approachable guy and a true gamer. I've had nothing but positive interactions with him.

I truly hope that the accusations mentioned in the Lucas lawsuit are without merit. However, if there is truth that they didn't donate to the charity as reported, I'd be very disappointed.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[vertinox]

I don't know of the situation either, but in most organizations the owner and those who actually do the running or often different due to delegation and management issues. It could be quite possible he wasn't involved in what transpired and even then one has to really wonder about the whole issue with the donation issue with the charity organization.

That said, it is unknown if his hired hands were thieves with or without his knowledge, but even if there was no malice there appears to be incompetence at some type of financial level to have to go Chapter 11.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

They both did. Perhaps you should have followed your own link.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[gizmoiscariot]

If you took the time to read the Wikipedia article, you would see that Peter was the head of Wizards of the Coast. Your correct in so much as Richard designed Magic. However, this comes down to who do you give credit to the success of Magic; the person who designed it, or one of the people who were responsible for giving it to the public.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Lehk228]

only a cocksucker with a marketing position would chose the latter.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

Do not believe that Adkinson is a good guy.

He is scum of the earth and the reason that D&D is in the state it is in now - ie in the hands of Hasbro.

He (Wizards) bought TSR to gain control of Gencon, and then manipulated it from being about Role-playing and generally all games, into being a big Magic Tournament.

Anyone else there @ Loughborough for Gencon UK the year the guy that ACTUALLY organised it (John Brown) resigned on stage due to the direction the company was going?

This was a guy who had built up a huge amount of good-will over the years, and had even started taking GenCon to continental Europe.

So not at all unhappy to see GenCon passing, it is a shadow of its former self (even if it IS bigger now than it was).

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

the person who designed it

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[byennie]

"creator" -- a poor choice of words on my part. It would be more accurate indeed to say that Peter brought Magic to market, and that Richard Garfield was the original inventor.

In any case, I think my points about Peter in general stand.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[byennie]

Peter did a whole lot more than just market Magic. If Garfield had something shrink wrapped and ready to go, he wouldn't have come to Wizards of the Coast in the first place.

That's why it's called a *partnership*. Flame all you want, but both sides need each other, and it's juvenile to suppose that anyone who can bring a product to fruition is some sort of soul-less marketing droid. What a miserable, woe is me attitude that is.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Stu Charlton]

However, this comes down to who do you give credit to the success of Magic; the person who designed it, or one of the people who were responsible for giving it to the public. Ahem.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[mlund]

Richard Garfield was the original Game Designer.

Wizards of the Coast, then run by Peter Adkinson, published the commercial game product.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Anonymous Coward]

Garfiield did invent M:TG. Adkinson was the head of the small company that mortgaged itself to the game. IMHO, both can take credit for the whole thing, because most good games fail at the production/promotion level.

Re:Why am I not surprised?

[Creepy]

I don't know Adkinson, so I can't comment on him personally. WotC was paid 325 million to sell to Hasbro - if I were a majority shareholder, I'd have a tough time turning that down.

You apparently missed how RPGs fell almost instantaneously about 2 years after Magic came out. My college gaming group with almost 100 members and 20 years of existence disbanded because all anyone ever wanted to do was play Magic and they could do that with pickup groups anytime. There's a reason its known as 'crack for gamers' and a reason GenCon has a heavy Magic playing base. Incidentally, I have not been to one since 2 years before Magic existed (and quit playing shortly after the first expansion), so that is hearsay from your comment.

I don't know anything about GenCon UK, but according to google he quit as head of the RPGA because WotC became hostile towards it in 1999, the same year Hasbro bought them. I can see that, having been in similar circumstances - I worked for a company purchased by EDS, a company I disliked when they made a bid and came to despise as an employee (no, I don't work for them anymore).

D&D is more popular than it has ever been, from what I've seen and heard. I haven't played it since second edition, but I have friends that do. Some of the recent rule changes were even put in place by a guy I have a lot of respect for, Jonathan Tweet (one of the designers of Ars Magica).

GenCon isn't passing - Chapter 11 is reorganization and removal of debt. Usually this happens when they can't pay their bills but are still profitable.

Google stole my ideas

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/02/18/google_lawsuit/

This was a triumph

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm making a note here... HUGE SUCCESS!

Re:This was a triumph

[Anonymous Coward]

It's for the good of all of us! Well, except those that are dead. :( I'm not even angry. I'm being so sincere right now.

If it's true

[rossz]

If what LucasFilm says of GenCon, then they need to be crushed. Stealing money from dying children? It would be very difficult to do something more scummy.

Re:If it's true

[drinkypoo]

I'm sure that perception is what LucasFilm is counting on. But is it true? Does anyone know anything about this?

Re:If it's true

[Libertarian001]

Interesting take and some blatant BS.

BS first...Reneging on a (n alleged) promise to donate to charity is not stealing. Putting your hand in the cookie jar and taking a wad of cash out without permission would be.

And the interesting part...So GenCon is expected donate their proceeds to charity while Lucas gets to keep his...

Re:If it's true

[Anonymous Coward]

Interesting take and some blatant BS.

BS first...Reneging on a (n alleged) promise to donate to charity is not stealing. Putting your hand in the cookie jar and taking a wad of cash out without permission would be.

And the interesting part...So GenCon is expected donate their proceeds to charity while Lucas gets to keep his...

Yeah, reneging on a promise to donate earnings to charity is not technially stealing...but it is every bit as immoral. And just as illegal.

No they didn't put their hand in the cookie jar, they basically held out a cookie to a dying child, then snatched it away at the last moment.

I can't see anywhere from the claims that indicate that Lucasfilm gets to keep anything. The original agreement appears that Lucasfilm would donate certain memorabilia to GenCon for auction, with the proceeds going to Make-a-Wish.

Gencon apparently chose to keep the money from that auction. Lucasfilm is appropriately pissed. They are asking for the money from the auction back, plus money to compensate for the items sold. Presumably if they are given this money, they will make the appropriate donation to make-a-wish.

It is unlikely in the extreme that any of the claims made in the suit are outright fabrications. Lucasfilm would have to have some entirely retarded lawyers to be lying about any of the items claimed as they are fairly easily checked.

Gencon on the other hand must have entirely retarded management to think they could get away with this...and pretty scummy to withhold promised funds from dying children. Even better, filing for Chapter 11 means they will probably never be force to provide the promised funds.

Re:If it's true

[Anonymous Coward]

Stealing money from dying children? It would be very difficult to do something more scummy.

You could always rape them before they die.

Or after.

Just throwing ideas out there...

Re:If it's true

[LordNimon]

Yeah, reneging on a promise to donate earnings to charity is not technially stealing...but it is every bit as immoral. And just as illegal.

No, it is not as immoral, and it is not as illegal. Stealing from someone is worse, legally and morally, than breaking a promise to give.

Also keep in mind that you don't know all the details. I'm sure LucasArts is trying to make GenCon look worse than they really are, so that they can win the lawsuit. The claims may not be outright fabrications, but they could easily be exaggerations. Perhaps GenCon is having accounting problems which prevent them from donating the money at the moment?

Will?

[Anonymous Coward]

Who is Will? Is his till now empty?

I really hope so.

[Viewsonic]

The Milwaukee GenCons were a thing of legend. It blew my mind when they were moving it. If I were a spiteful person, I might be happy about this news. But I'd rather they just come back home. Where they belong.

Re:I really hope so.

[elrous0]

When Milwaukee gets rid of the smell, they can have it back.

Re:I really hope so.

[genner]

Muahahaha.....Schadenfreude for everyone.

That what they get for leaving us.

Oblig:

[San-LC]

Gen Con LLC: You will not find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy.

Re:Oblig:

[Anonymous Coward]

regardless of the ends, Bigby's Crushing Litigation is a fearsome and evil magic.

Or at least give Saturday a price break

[HiggsBison]

In this economy (wake me up when I have a steady job) I can maybe go on Saturday, and I won't really have much advance notice. So a six hour drive each way, and they want half the full conference fee just for the privilege of going to the dealer area for one day...er, make that one afternoon. Fsck that!

Cue Martin Short nervously puffing on a cigarette.

[filthpickle]

while representine GenCon

"maybe the kids wanted to be robbed....maybe that was their wish..."

no idea why that image popped into my mind.

I guess ill add lucasfilms

[nurb432]

To my boycott list.

Re:I guess ill add lucasfilms

[Fulminata]

Why? GenCon has had ten months to uphold their part of a deal which included donating proceeds to charity. If they haven't done so by now, then I'd say that legal action was the appropriate course for Lucasfilm to take.

Just because I might like going to GenCon doesn't change that.

Re:I guess ill add lucasfilms

[nurb432]

Why? Well, for starters i don't believe in IP rights.

Re:I guess ill add lucasfilms

[Anonymous Coward]

Why? Well, for starters i don't believe in IP rights.

Er... what?

Lucasfilms shouldn't sue GenCon LLC for allegedly not turning over money specifically raised for certain causes at auction because you don't believe in IP rights?

Hell, $150k of it was supposedly auction money for MakeAWish.

"I'm sorry, little boy with terminal cancer. You don't get your wish because I don't believe in IP rights!" That's cold, dude. Also completely nonsensical. Someone got the auction money. If it was raised in a charity's name, it should have gone to the charity. That's nothing to do with IP.

Re:I guess ill add lucasfilms

[Isca]

ummm... for what? For tuning over their property to Gen Con to be auctioned off (with a big chunk going to charity)

This part of the lawsuit is pretty cut and dried. LucasFilms gives Gen Con LLC property, property is auctioned for $$, $$'s are not distributed as agreed before auction.

Re:I guess ill add lucasfilms

[IgnoramusMaximus]

I am not exactly known around here as a great believer in imaginary property either, but this has nothing whatsover to do with IP.

GenCon was given by LucasFilm some physical memorabilia, presumably various props from movie sets and the like, as a donation for Make-A-Wish, which GenCon was supposed to auction thus turning them into cash which then was supposed to be donated to the said charity. Instead, they auctioned the donated stuff and kept the money.

Gen Con LLC

[iminplaya]

Who?

I thought you Australians had a sense of humor

[spun]

Heh. You know, I've never been to one of those things? I love sci fi, fantasy, and gaming, but I wouldn't go to a convention. I can't stand fanatics of any stripe, and I don't like (all male) circle jerks.

You do get that I was making fun at tjstork's expense, right? Slashdot is not only for people who love America. I wasn't saying that at all. I respect other's opinions, IF that opinion is worthy of respect. I respect people's right to have and share an opinion, too, but if my opinion of their opinion is that their opinion sucks donkey balls, I'm going to share that too. And tjstork's opinion amounted to, "haha, what a bunch of dorks."

I love America, the concept. I'm pretty fond of the country. The people I can take or leave, and the government can go stuff itself in the wrong end of a sheep.

As for Gen Con, if the allegations are true, yeah, they screwed up. But back in the day, it wasn't just the most prestigious, it was the only gaming convention. You know, when it was in Gary Gygax's living room, and a few years after that.

Re:I thought you Australians had a sense of humor

[obeythefist]

I hear you! Unfortunately we learn very quickly that when an American is saying "Don't you love America?" it's usually a herald for much more frightening behaviors, so we do tend to take it very seriously!

I think perhaps the best way to celebrate games like Dungeons and Dragons is to get some friends together and go play it.

Re:I thought you Australians had a sense of humor

[Blackhalo]

It is not all guys, there are a lot of fat chicks too!

Re:I thought you Australians had a sense of humor

[An ominous Cow art]

One of the times I went to GenCon (1984 I think?), I met a very bright, interesting, attractive, non-fat girl. Until the day I die I'll regret losing touch with her. Sigh...

And apparently as punishment, the last time I went (1998?), somehow, of all the game tables in GenCon, I wound up at one with an ex-girlfriend and her boyfriend. Yeah, that was a good time... :-(

Now I'm all depressed.

Re:I thought you Australians had a sense of humor

[MBGMorden]

Don't know about GenCon, but at DragonCon there are a lot of non-fat very attractive chicks around too. I think a lot of them are just playing dress-up though rather than being true hot geek-girls (though a few are). A lot of girls love the thought of an early Halloween party which is essentially what DragonCon is for some people.

Indeed the selection of not-hot fat chicks is pretty significant too, but you take the good with the bad.

Fun event overall though, and the only one I still attend regularly (been for the last 4 years). Originally I went mostly for celebrity autographs (and was bored out of my mind the first year), but once you I started getting into the panels it's to the point where I have to go there with an itinerary planned out for the weekend of everything I want to hit up and still can't go to everything. It's a fun weekend for the cost.

Obligatory FAIL...

[readgs]

Gen Con FAIL! http://wwwfail.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gencon.com%2Fimages%2FCorporateLogo.jpg

What is Gen Con? Celebration IV?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm sure this story would be much more interesting with some context. Even TFA has none. Excellent obfuscation.

Perhaps some simple explanation of terms in the submitted story would be good.

I'm surprised the first comment isn't 'WTF is Gen Con?'

Who? What?

[carou]

Who are Gen Con? What is Gen Con indie? Why is Lucas suing them?

  Is it too much to ask for you to put a summary of the story in the summary?

Re:Who? What?

[elrous0]

Gen Con stands for "Generational Convention" (the principle that anyone over the age of 60 who wobbles around like an arthritic shouldn't do action films), "Indy" is the person who ignored this rule. And they're suing him because they just got a look at him stumbling around in the dailies and realized that no amount of stunt-double footage could make this NOT look silly.

This is what you get for messing with Wisconsin!

[haaz]

Ya know, me an' my buddy were just a sayin', ya know, whatever happen ta GenCon? An' he was like, oh, geez, well I tink they went southa here, ya know, not Chicaaago, but Indiaaana. An I was like, wha? Wha the heck dey go to Indiana fur? Oh geez. Nothin' down der but ... well, cornfields, an de Indy five huntert. Shucks. I dunno why da heck dey'd leave Wisconsin!

And in other news, my bid for the Milwaukee County Board may wrap up today on primary day. We'll see. :D