Slashdot Mirror
Earthquake In China
Several readers sent in links on the earthquake that hit 10 hours ago near the Sichuan city of Chengdu in China. The Telegraph focuses on the citizen journalism that got word on the quake out on the Net instantly (the first report was via Twitter). Science magazine speculates that deaths from this event could exceed the 240,000 killed in the Tangshan quake in 1976, though the estimated death toll is below 10,000 at this writing. Hundreds of videos are up on YouTube, including this footage from a security camera — keep your eye on the goldfish.
The instant an event happens anywhere in the world you have hundreds of cameras on it. This is a very, very good thing. Reporters and ground crews are no longer necessary to capture footage, you can get it de novo, unfiltered, unbiased. Of course, this only happens in a sufficiency advanced nation that has ubiquitous means of recording and means of transmission.
Which is interesting because I could swear China had a Youtube block to prevent such uncontrolled proliferation of footage.
I shudder to think how many lives could have been saved if only they had spent less time on chinese fire drills and more time on chinese earthquake drills.
You remember "the stuff that matters" part?
Seriously.
-- Political fascism requires a Fuhrer.
I don't know if it's possible for the youtube link to get /.'ed but the shaking starts almost 5 minutes into the video and lasts for about 90 seconds. I have never been in an earthquake and certainly not sure how I'd feel about one that lasted so long.
In fact, nothing even fell over. This one at least has stuff falling about, and a clipped British voice giving hard facts.
is covering how technology and internet is changing the way we used to face those tragedies.
the faster the world knows about it, the faster help can be sent for the victims.
- Human knowledge belongs to the world
I think they just wanted an excuse to use the Quake game icon...
is that video. Here's a hint, it's called edit out the boring parts, or make note of where the action starts. Cliffs notes on the video are 4:40 or so of nothing happening, 40 seconds or so of people running out of a building, and the last minute and change of a goldfish bowl being sloshed. I can honestly say that if that video were the only exposure I had to a major event like that I'd have to wonder what all the fuss was about.
>aren't there any seismographs connected to the internet in china?
>that should have been faster than a human posting on twitter.
How about less than a minute? Compare the event and solution times on this page.
http://neic.usgs.gov/neis/eq_depot/2008/eq_080512_ryan/neic_ryan_cmt.html
They had to find a semi-worthwhile story to put up because they were running out of advertisements like the one here and this one. Interesting how this disaster gets a slashdot article, but the cyclone in Burma didn't, unless I missed something.
You know, it made me smile more, when I saw "Compare prices on Quake" in the related links.
hilarious
http://www.chinareviewnews.com/doc/1006/4/3/1/100643181.html?coluid=45&kindid=0&docid=100643181&mdate=0513002548
Early warning from toad migration on May 10.
Is it stuff that matters because it is a large scale disaster, or because someone upped some footage onto the internet?
/. story about the Myanmar Cyclone?
I think it must be the internet angle, otherwise there should be a
translated link:
http://www.google.com.tw/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.chinareviewnews.com%2Fdoc%2F1006%2F4%2F3%2F1%2F100643181.html%3Fcoluid%3D45%26kindid%3D0%26docid%3D100643181%26mdate%3D0513002548&hl=zh-TW&ie=UTF8&sl=zh-CN&tl=en
I always have a tough time getting my mind around the numbers bandied about in these human tragedies, but just imagine if 5,000 people died in the United States from something like this.
The 1989 quake that hit Northern California caused a lot of economic damage and freaked the hell out of people. It took years for the areas hit to fully recover from it. That incident killed 67 people.
I really do hope that the numbers turn out to be lower than expected. Major suckage.
Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
because it is a disaster that has been instantly covered visually by new generation gadgetry and posted up to net. behind a repressive regime that censors everything, to boot.
Read radical news here
Hey, guess what.
We just discovered that humans tend toward violence and oppression.
Wow.
Maybe someone should write about this.
Then we can study it.... maybe we could call it....
history.
And then we might learn from it.
But that would be too much work.
sigh.
Hundreds of thousands of toads the size of factories crushing vehicles? That makes the earthquake seem like a minor inconvenience...
Be wary of any facts that confirm your opinion.
As an man interested in earthquakes, I have been watching the aftershock pattern over there and I think that there might be a small chance (or large, depending on things) of an aftershock that is Mw7.0 at least. But it also appears that the stress in the crust in this area has moved east and west of the current epicenter.
The reason for the current massive damage due to this earthquake is because it did happen at only 10 km depth. If it had happened at 40 or 80 km depth, there would have been less damage as less energy from the earthquake would have reached the surface.
There are going to be many, many aftershocks in this area for the next two months or more. Most of them from mb4.5 up to Mw6.5. Creating more damage to already badly damaged houses in the nearby area.
Good list of aftershocks can be seen here, along with information on the main quake.
http://www.emsc-csem.org/index.php?page=current&sub=list
An earthquake hits China, tens or hundreds of thousands of people may have been killed. Response: idiotic jokes, complaints about this not being 'tech', ignorant nonsense about politics.
Planes hit a couple of tall buildings in New York, a few thousand people are killed. Response: wild cries of pain and anger, unbridled hatred against anything from the Middle East, America starts two wars of revenge.
Is there something about the proportions here that isn't quite right? I mean, after the 9/11 attack sympathy poured from all over the world, even Yasser Arafat expressed his outrage against the attackers. But the response of the Americans to a major disaster in China is one ridicule and cold, heartless arrogance hiding behind and thin excuse of 'but they are evil communists'. Is that really the best you guys can manage? You know, sometimes you really make it an uphill battle to love and respect America.
"did chinese have a heart when beating down tibet protesters just 2-3 weeks ago, and locking them in to prisons for life ?"
Stop judging a nation's people by it's government's actions and the world will make a lot more sense.
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
I was surprised that the US is willing to do more for the Burmese than they were their own citizens; although it came as no surprise that no one in the Bush administration seems to have realized the irony.
I'm going to have to agree that his methods aren't exactly going to win him popularity points, and it's overdone and unnecessary on what should be a more civil forum.
./er's, and it's something that (I hope) is insightful. A reminder that though we may personally be disconnected to these natural disasters (as would be the case for me for the tsunami of 2005 or the recent cyclone in Myanmar), not all of us are. And the comments that are made do come off as ignorant, insensitive, and hurtful.
But, as I've been 'all over' this article too, I feel like I should respond to your statement.
I've known people you can apply "Chinese nationalist fanboy" or "government apologist" label to. It's frightening. I don't think you quite realize the difference between a true "fanboy", as you say, and someone who just knows more (for instance, regarding Tibet). Our media here in the West is full of bias. But that's a discussion for another time.
But in my case, I feel that, knowing friends who have family in the region, I have a different perspective on this than would most
First, that was NOT the entire's US response to Katrina. It was the feds, not citizen's. Many of us sent in money and did help how we could. Home were opened, jobs created, etc. But your characterizations of the bush response is actually kind of wicked. I had not thought about it in that context, but you are right.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
You'd be accurate if you said "30 years" instead of "10 years".
The public agrees with its government's actions because they generally do. Is it so hard to accept the fact that sometimes these governments actually work for the people? Is it so hard to accept the possibility that Chinese leaders actually have a sense of responsibility and morality, and actually care about the people, instead of the vote-buying enterprise that dominates "democratic" politics?
It's ironic that in "democratic" countries governments with less than like 40% approval rating can still rule the country... and then instead of electing a better government these people bitch about "brainwashing" of other countries when an "evil" authoritarian government does a better job.
I'm not saying democracy is worse than authoritarian government... but people like you are essentially saying "you're evil!!! you can't be better than us!! it must be a trick!!". Pathetic.
Don't quote me on this.
its not a smartass remark. the realities didnt go away either. what has happened in tibet, has happened, and majority of chinese people have agreed with their government, as they always do.
furthermore, if i didnt have a heart, there is absolutely nothing barring or deterring anyone from announcing it, so just dont let me see you making such dud remarks about hearts again.
Read radical news here
Too much time on my hands I guess. Here's my personal translation:
According to sources, omens appeared before the earthquake in Mianzhu, Sichuan: large scale migrations of toads. When some citizens commented that these were bad omens, the local forestry department explained that this was a normal phenomenon.
According to reports by wccdaily, there are always indications before earthquakes, some animals react more strongly than humans. Large scale migrations of toads appeared in Sichuan Mianzhu city: hundreds of thousands of toads marched on a highway near a pharmacutical factory, and were rolled over by many passing vehicles, or crushed by pedestrians. The appearances of large numbers of toads led villagers to speculate that something bad will happen.
==Toads crossing roads in flocks, frightened pedestrians take alternate routes===
"Too many, too frightening, flocks and flocks, as if they were taking their families to a carnival" villager Zhou said, "At early dawn, I went to the market to buy something, and I didn't get far before I saw toads strolling on the streets, and I was too frightened to put my feet on the ground. So I decided to take another route. When I went back home at noon, I saw a few toads remaining, and because some cars passed by, a number of toads were already killed under their wheels.
The toads appeared near a pharmacutical facility. Mr. Liu who lived next to the facility said that he saw a black mass of toads crawling on the ground, "a lot of them had already been killed by cars and pedestrians at that time, lying bloodily on the floor. We never had such phenomenon here before."
==Was it a foreword for disaster? Forestry experts dismiss doubts==
Many villagers expressed worries, "Isn't this a bad omen for some natural disaster?", as the news spread people got unsettled and worried.
When the local forestry deparment received report and arrived at the scene, the head of the department said that large numbers of young toads grouping on shore to migrate is a normal phenomenon, unrelated to the natural disasters claimed by citizens, and the toads will not affect the living of people, their arrival would also reduce the number of mosquitoes and pests, so villagers need not worry.
De-yang Forestry workers said that these massive migrations are good signs, they show that Mianzhu's wildlife environment is getting better and better.
I knew we could control the weather.... But now we're taking orders for Quakes? /conspiracy theory
The "whites" were Europeans that came to the Americas,
primarily Spanish, French, British, Dutch, etc etc.
They did things like hand out small pox blankets.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smallpox_blanket#Biological_warfare
The Native Americans were many different tribes, and
they really did not have a large unification til around the
time of Custer.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Custer#Battle_of_the_Little_Bighorn
Some Native Americans tried to flee to canada after fighting
and were pursued all the way to Canada.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nez_Perce#Chief_Joseph.27s_surrender
Some fought brutal guerilla style war for many years
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geronimo
The skull and bones society stole his bones back in the day
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geronimo#Theft_of_remains
So that is who the "whites" are.
The whites are the ppl who signed many treaties, and did not
honor most of them.
Their were some instances when Native Americans who had family
members killed went on rampages as well thou.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_treaties#U.S._Native_American_treaties
There are still many tribes, several names known by very few.
My tribe:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen_Potawatomi_Nation
I credit my grandfather with my dim view of so called society.
He was one of the most brilliant men I ever personally knew.
My tour of duty in the US military working on RADAR showed
me that the killing of local indigenous ppl by profiteers
has been justified by said profiteers for a very long time.
It continues to this day...
google "32 trillion offshore needs IRS attention"
I grew up in China and am insulted by how people have such simplistic concepts of China and of the Chinese people. There are ignorant people everywhere. The only difference is that in China there are more people who are willing to see their government as something distinct from themselves; as something that doesn't necessarily have legitimacy. The greatest trick ever played on the American people is convincing them that the U.S. government is the way it is because they want it to be that way. (Read Democracy in America -- it's been true for 200 years.)
Is America the country where I'd rather be a citizen? Yes. Does America have flaws galore? Absolutely. But understand that the Chinese people are smart. They understand the flaws of their government. But they also understand that they have had unbelievable growth over the past 30 years, and that this ascendancy is going to cause some problems.
The problems that China faces are the same as those in America: people care more about whether they can buy the next cool thing. So long as they can, and the government keeps the economy growing so they can, they don't care what the government does. The same way we don't care what abuses our government commits so long as we get our cheap oil, food, clothes, etc. The only difference is that we have a different government system, so the abuses are done with (slightly) more caution.
What comes first, finding a teacher or becoming a student?
If you are looking at images of a Chinese man trying to pull his wife out of the rubble, or a mother searching for her baby, and all you can think of is what political system they have, then you need to get a life.
You ought to be embarrassed to think that way.
I don't think Chinese rescuers are thinking about chairman mao any more than US rescuers think about George Washington. I think they are more likely concerned with digging out as many wives, husbands and children so that husbands, wives and parents can have their loved ones back.
I don't see these images of destruction and desperate hoping a story of politics. Instead, I see incredible suffering, and I feel for them. I imagine how I would feel if it were my wife, or my son, smashed up inside my crushed house, if that earthquake happened to me. Thank god it didn't.
This is my sig.
Imagine having your legs pinned under 18 tons of concrete. You are laying in the dark under the rubble of a multi-story apartment complex. Next to you is the body of one of your children, below you is your other child, who is suffering yet refuses to die. As the rest of the world is in a warm bed or on a comfortable couch or sitting here being crass, drinking coffee and taking this in as some sort of sick Romanesque spectator sport.
Yet here you are under the rubble watching your last child suffer away and you are wishing and hoping that if you die maybe a higher power will be placated and spare your child. The pain isn't so bad anymore, except for the cries coming from under you in the rubble. The cries of people who had dreams that will likely never be realized. The cries of pain and anguish. You hope for some relief before the dark comes, but only rain water dripping down on you. The darkness comes the cries continue. The pain continues. You watch your child draw his last breath.
Those of you without sympathy for the suffering are the ones that need to be lined up and shot on sight.
Just 2 cents from a red blooded American!
Remember that scenario is happening now....
Just an American expressing condolences to the Chinese people for their terrible tragedy. I have a wife and son myself and all I can think of is those family members under the rubble and those waiting to dig out.
China is a pretty powerful country, but if there's anything China needs, I hope they ask just ask. Americans would be honored to help.
This is my sig.
Bread and circuses. The stuff works, and it has been refined over the course of many years. Maybe one day you tell people that they have to follow your rules so they can have life after death and the next day you dangle their credit score in front of them, but the process is the same.
Shut up, do your work, and you get to buy stuff.
"Sacrifice for the good of The State" - The State
IIRC the Northridge quake in 1994 only lasted about 17 seconds at the epicenter. I was about 100 miles away when it hit and the shaking went on for a good 30-45 seconds. Based on the immediate reports I got from friends over email and their estimates of the duration of shaking, I was able to pinpoint the epicenter somewhere in western Los Angeles long before the news services.
At the epicenter itself, the duration of the shaking generally corresponds to the length of fault that gives way. If only a few km slips, it's a short quake. If several thousand km slips (like happened in Chile 1960 and Alaska 1964) the shaking can go on for several minutes. The Alaska quake was 4 minutes at the epicenter, with several distant but affected communities reporting shaking for almost 10 minutes.
Also note that earthquake magnitude is a measure of energy released, while certain types of damage correspond more to the power (energy over time) of the quake. The Northridge quake was moderate in terms of magnitude, but its direction and focus generated enormous power in certain areas. One seismograph recorded accelerations over 1g, whereas the previous largest recorded acceleration during an earthquake was less than 0.25g (typically you only see about 0.5 - 0.1g).
I wouldn't normally reply to posts like yours... but then people might take you seriously.
And here I thought you'd be pointing out that English is not considered a Latin-based language (though there are many latin words, the structure and grammar was from an independent language).
Chinese is a very complex language, with subtle "grammar" rules which makes it hard to parse with an automaton.
Actually, I'd say it is nearly grammar-less. When translating, you must hear an entire sentence, understand the meaning, then translate the meaning. When I was learning some Chinese, I would ask questions about grammar and the response was "they'll understand what you mean." There are no tenses at all. "I drive ago" for "I have driven" or "I drive later" for "I will drive" would be the words used. There is only what we would consider the present tense, and time modifying words. If ever you hear someone who speaks Chinese have trouble with tenses, it's because even the idea of them doesn't exist in their native language. They aren't just learning a new language, they are learning a whole different way of thinking.
The simplification applies to Chinese characters only, basically establishing some kind of shorthand for writing complicated characters.
The simplification was to improve literacy. However, it has not achieved its goal. Taiwan almost exclusively uses Traditional (I think as a sign of independence from the mainland pushing Simplified). And those that are literate on the mainland that completed university will probably know both and use Simplified. But you still need to know Traditional because of its use in Taiwan and limited continued use on the mainland. Add to that the effect that handwritten Simplified is more confusing than handwritten Traditional, and the limited alphabet replacement is pretty useless and probably not achieving its stated goal of imcreasing literacy.
Cantonese and Mandarin are (among the many) spoken dialects, and have little to do with the written language.
Both spoken languages can be represented with the same printed characters, so they could be classified as a single language (with an "accent" that renders it indecipherable to those that aren't trained in that "accent"). The grammar rules are quite similar, helping one written language represent both, and with one written language representing two spoken languages, the combination could also be reasonably regarded as three separate languages, one unpronouncable and two unwritten. It's a unique linguistic situation that defies all traditional (European-based) descriptions. It would be about the same as if you decreed that French and Italian must be written the same, but that you still spoke it as you always have. We would think that impossible, and the Chinese did it and have made it work for quite a while.
Learn to love Alaska