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Latest "Green" Power Generation — Your Feet
gbjbaanb writes "Remember those ideas that suggested hooking gym machines to the power grid? Well, the Times is reporting that something like this to harness free energy is about to become a reality — the footfall of trudging shoppers is to become the latest source of emission-free energy.
'Engineers who have modelled the effects of the technology at Victoria Underground station in central London have calculated that the 34,000 travellers passing through every hour could power 6,500 lightbulbs. ... The plans for heel-strike generation follow successful trials last year at a bridge in the Midlands where generators converted energy from trains passing above into electricity powering a flood detector.'
Possibly the most important thing for the readership is at the end:
'There could also be a range of domestic uses, for example powering iPods by plugging them into batteries placed in the owners' heels, using technology which is already available.' Obviously you'd have to get up and walk around, but, as they say, it's the thought that counts."
As well as no free energy.
They have been using this with cattle to pump water for some time now.
Humans can't power much continuously. At full tilt on an efficient machine a PRO biker can light a 100 watt bulb. The average luser working out, not worth the bother.
All the equipment, moving parts, maintained, used to capture human power won't reach the point of break even on any of this stuff. (If you pay your maintenance guy at least.)
They'd be better off CLOSING the stinking gyms and making people work out outside and not DRIVE there than capturing that power.
Green is not complicated, often, it is SIMPLE.
The Nokia n95 GPS with voice guided navigation, wireless via bluetooth headphones, that calmly lowers the MP3 volume ...well that GPS is great for getting me out on my bicycle, and off into unexplored territories. I just love it. Except when it dies because it sucks too much juice, which is most of the time. (so I have learned to carry spares)
Hey, it is great to be using the GPS/MP3/bluetooth/GSm functions, but I shut them all down to save energy for priority GPS tracking using the Sports Tracker web service, on known courses: Nokia SportsTracker Web Services. But even that lone power-misered GPS application died after a handful of hours when I really wanted data from a special ride recently!
I understand power is the main drawback to cycling GPS units; this technology can't come into place fast enough IMHO. Google maps and GPS is enough to get me out moving fast when the weather is good. That presents a real challenge to GPS power usage for cycling use. Having to stop and re-orient according to paper maps suckz, so I stick with known cycling routes when I get time to ride.
You can't be ahead of the curve, if you're stuck in a loop.
First footfall.
Using humans to generate electricity is not a green source. Humans generate methane, a green house gas, from their fuel (food).
successful trials last year at a bridge in the Midlands where generators converted energy from trains passing above into electricity powering a flood detector.
Hmm, that sounds like a rather small return from an enormous amount of momentum.
How much, in terms of emissions, did this "emission free" device require when it was built? Perhaps more than 6,500 light bulbs worth of pollution?
If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
...Obviously you'd have to get up and walk around, but, as they say, it's the thought that counts."GREAT ! If it's the thought that counts why do I have to get up and walk around??..I could only imagine that I'm walking around and watch those batteries juice up....
What is best in life? To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you and to hear the lamentations of their women.
I'm pretty sure my feet are producing harmful emissions right now...
Five minute break, everyone. Do a few laps around the office.
This seems like a really awesome idea! I just wish they had provided some more details about the actual underlying technology. Is this something like a miniaturized version of the cow-generator we saw forever ago? Or is it just a tiny generator with an insanely strong spring and a high gearing ratio, designed to provide about as much resistance as you'd expect from a solid object?
This sounds as practical as trying to harness the 'incredible power' of our stomach acid for energy generation. I'm sure we could power a lot of lightbulbs in a lot of ways - but I think there are better options than relying on extracted energy from human movement. It's like relying on whale and pig fat as a major power source - it just doesn't scale past a small market segment.
What we want is to use something more scalable, like algae-based oils, using arid and other unfarmable land, and not using fresh water sources for production. That, plus increases in solar power efficiency are much more direct ways of gathering usable energy, which could scale far beyond our current needs in a sustainable way. That way, we raise the standard of living of people by increasing energy production, rather than make them stick battery chargers on their feet.
Ultimately, food and fresh water will be bigger concerns going forward - and I don't think we'll be able to grow sustainable crops in our shoes with any toys either.
Ryan Fenton
Thats because I made a conscious choice to live in the city. I can walk to almost anywhere I need to, and on those rare occasions that I can't, there is always the bus. Plus I get the additional benefit of lowered chance of cardiovascular disease and others so I'm not going to weigh down the health system like the lazy people out in the suburbs. They drive everywhere with their gigantic SUV's, polluting the environment and turning into big lumps of fat.
can now get a job working to keep the train stations power bill down.
Monstar L
Or dance, if you follow the iPod commercials...
It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
Most western and industrialized nations people need all the extra exercise they can get. (I said most, not all, some people actually stay in shape, most do not, go ahead, look around you) I think the artificial urban power sucking islands could use around a few million of these generators, help to walk off some of that lard and get some practical benefit from it. I already see those ridiculous belching buses that they praise as mass transit stopping every couple hundred of feet. Egads people can't even walk beyond that? Then they go sit on their asses all day long at some office. Jeebus, how wuss can you get? "OMG it feels like walking on sand! I might get the swooning vapors!"
why most articles nowdays have an apple quote inside even when the subject is not about any apple product?. power your iPods, is an iPhone like to refer to mobile devices, is like an appletv, TileStack is perfect for the iPhone. How much apple pays the editors, or is only fanboyism?.
Insightful post on the true question of energy generation. There's already enough renewable energy sources available now and at a lower cost. The costs of "foot-powered" electricity don't scale well and only provide power during "peak traffic" times in highly congested locations..
:wq
I wouldn't mind spending some time during the work day pedaling along. It probably wouldn't generate tons of energy, but it might be useful.
The only way this is going to be "emission free" is if people don't exhale.
My son's pc is on an old Singer Sewing Table, complete with the forged Iron foot pump affair that used to run the sewing machine.
At the moment all he does is operate the flywheel while he plays (a little noisy, but better for his legs then just sitting static for ages). I want to set it up with a generator so we can use it to power something, or store the charge in a battery.
Not perhaps the most efficient means of power generation, but a teensy bit cool.
A learning experience is one of those things that say, 'You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.' - D. Adams
Getting all nerded up and talking about "there is no free energy" only covers it partly, specificly the bad part.
In 'reality' though there are certain bonusses to a soft walking surface.
1. You get more traction and reduce slipping of feet (which is a problem on hard surfaces with grains of sand on it).
2. Damage from falling is reduced.
3. A soft surface is easier on the joints, which is important for everyone, though especially elderly and disabled people.
Try finding one of those new fancy playgrounds with a semi-soft rubbery-like surface and walk on it. Much more comfortable to walk on compared to concrete.
If you quote this signature there'll be 72 copies of Windows ME waiting for you in Heaven.
If I don't wash them, they do turn green. Does that count?
Table-ized A.I.
'34,000 travellers passing through every hour could power 6,500 lightbulbs' - for how long? Probably for one minute, although they seem to be trying to imply a day.
Am I the only one who, reading the title, immediately thought of The Flintstones?
.. The plans for heel-strike generation follow successful trials last year at a bridge in the Midlands where generators converted energy from trains passing above into electricity powering a flood detector.'
That couldn't possibly be more efficient than just plugging the flood detector into the same source that powers the trains.
not to belittle the effort of the people who implement such systems. though when you come right down to it and think about it, this is the equivalent of 'grasping at straw's' when it comes to power generation. especially when you think about all the energy that needs to be expended just to get a person there to generate it.
If we could build a device to pick up all the negative waves around here, the amount of energy collected would cause the Sun to snuff out a septillionth of a second later.
Its a cool idea, even if its not 100% practical. Throwing around the standard "there's no free lunch" response doesn't prove your smart, it just proves you're an asshole.
didn't we have exactly that topic at least once (if not twice) a few years back? This sounds awfully familiar, including the comments.
.. that the person would be there anyway. You have to think about this idea as recovering wasted energy, rather than generating new energy because all those people are walking about anyway.
Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
Because you have to get the oil which powers the source from your sworn enemies.
Reality is defined by the maddest person in the room
Wow, you didnt even read through the summary, let alone rtfa....
Take a door in a public place. There's a hydraulic mechanism to make sure it doesn't slam shut. There's a bit of a resistance when you open a door. Think of how many times doors in public places open & close on a given day. Sure, it may not be much per 1 door open/shut, but imagine a shopping mall or office with hundreds of doors.
Take the hydraulic damper and turn it into a generator. Chain together all the doors and have it provide power peak power hours(when the public will be using them). Make them compatible(ie mount-wise) with existing dampers & retrofit them everywhere.
Slap a generator on those revolving doors too. Imagine the power it could make in a busy downtown area.
Dang, I should patent this before.........
Given than a human muscular efficiency is considerably less than most combustion-based engines, and considering the energetic cost of producing then delivering the food in the first place is itself steep, I expect the net energy gain to be gruesomely negative. Most corn-based biofuel plants in the US fail to "get even" right now: this is an even worse bet.
Yet another hilariously small energy source tapped at great expense. I am sure that if we tapped many of these small energy sources, that it might amount to something. I am also sure that it would be horribly cost-ineffective relative to alternatives.
Humans exhale CO2. We have to replace our fuel. Our food is trucked / shipped in from around the world. I've heard walking to the store produces an equivalent amount of green house gases as driving a car.
As that will make it harder for people to walk, and they will have to expend more energy... that means greater sales in the food court. Woohoo!
Oh, you're not stuck, you're just unable to let go of the onion rings.
While touted at free energy, it actually comes from all the people. I doubt all this foot traffic will generate significant energy without
people noticing/complaining. Walking 30 meters will be just a little
harder... all to make $.01 of electricity. I'm skeptical.
is all these exercise machines America uses is to plug in to the wall and transfer the energy we expend at the gym and home to be put to use rather than wasted in heat and friction.
cold fusion, and magical Tesla power transmission. Ok, I'm just kidding, but I couldn't resist.
|the footfall of trudging shoppers is to become the latest source of "emission-free" energy
I don't know if you have ever caught a whiff of some toe jam, but i would not call it "emission-free"
Well the release of humans' methane, however, happens at much more predictable and organized locations, when compared to livestocks. So the collection and recycling should be easy. Now if only I have a permit and £500,000 to build a special lavatory at Victoria Underground...
It would be nice and all, but if all these people are helping generate the power, how is it being used/sold/distributed? Do they get a discount of tickets/merchandise? Is it required that the power gets freely distributed in some manner? If they are making money off of it (as they no doubt will want to, even if it's only to conserve their own electric bills), I want to be compensated in some fashion.
I will shred my adversaries. Pull their eyes out just enough to turn them towards their mewing, mutilated faces. Illyria
The urinals at my gym boast being energy efficient due to being flush-free. While indulging in these facilities, I couldn't help but think "why not attach all the machines in the building to a stored power supply?"
Granted, this would only be practical for busy gyms, but when we are at the point of gas being over $4.00/gal and energy prices following... doesn't every bit help?
Something witty.
for example powering iPods by plugging them into batteries placed in the owners' heels
I have a better idea. How about we put the batteries in the shoes instead?
I'd really rather not have a Sony Battery surgically implanted in my foot.
Results 1 - 10 of about 289 from slashdot.org for battery fire Sony. (0.08 seconds)
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- - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
This was brought up in the media last year from the folks at MIT: http://archive.uwire.com/2007/09/11/mit-students-take-step-toward-cleaner-greener-urban-energy/ In fact, I could have sworn I saw the story run here on Slashdot. Can't we just reference the arguments from then so we don't have to rehash them?
...get everybody to walk in lockstep to synchronize the pumping action? With random footfalls you'd have to have a LOT of smallish pumping cells with a lot of valves to keep it all flowing properly.
TFA: "It works by using the pressure of feet on the floor to compress pads underneath, driving fluid through mini-turbines that then generate electricity, which is stored in a battery."
"It's time to take life by the cans." ~ Bender ("Bendin' in the Wind", ep. 3-13)
It seems that stepping on a tile with pads which push fluid through turbines would have kind of a gel effect or feeling to the people walking on them. This could reduce the impact on the joints and perhaps the fatigue of walking around.
tag should read "!emissionfree"
Just curious if the weight of the individuals walking on this surface makes any difference to the energy created. If so , then I foresee targeted placement such as walkways close to fast food joints, bakeries or donut shops.
Here's something I've been wondering ever since I found out my body could generate peaks of 400 Watts at the gym. Is human energy really green?
My analogy to the broken window fallacy is based on the fact that this fallacy relies on what we see (the store owner buying services from the glazier) versus what we don't see (the store owner not investing that money for better purposes). Note that the logic also holds for alternative energies such as electric cars (which electricity comes from coal power) or ethanol which has to be processed/transported in a polluting way. So how green is human power? Considered that what powers us is food, we have to look at how much energy is involved in the making (making that cow live, eat and die involves making its food, transportation, etc..), the transformation and the transportation (a lot of the food you eat has travelled thousands of miles). Also it's important to note that just because it's necessary for us to eat food anyways, it doesn't make our energy free. You'll need more food if you produce 100 Watts for 30 minutes (say, if you're jogging) than if you just lay there.
Unfortunately I'm not qualified to estimate how polluting human power actually is, but I'm sure it's far less greener and more expensive than most people would assume. I think it's just yet another of these "feel good" measures that are actually not that good at all. When will we realise that there's no problem that can't be fixed by throwing a few trillion dollars into nuclear power and r&d?
You just got troll'd!
Does any-one know the location of the bridge in the midlands referenced in the article ? I would like to visit it.
Instead of trying to squeeze the maximum out of our environment, be it "renewable" or other, we should dare to state the real problem: too many people. There are so many of us that even such ludicrous ideas as using the trembling of our footsteps as a viable way to produce energy are taken seriously by some.
I common speaking, people don't draw the distinction between something like the "energy" coffee provides you, and the real bulk energy that comes from eating food.
This article falls in the same boat. Powering small devices or a small subsystem on a bridge from cars is one thing, lighting up your city from pedestrian power is another.
Most buildings are designed to minimize the amount of energy required to travel through them. Putting energy harvesting devices is like putting speed bumps in the place.
If they really wanted, they could save more overall simply adding a few more suburban parking lots. Or adding a few more entrances on existing ones.
Hasan
You're entirely wrong, I suspect.
The floor moves up and down regardless. Different surfaces will move different amounts based on the type of surface. If you stand on a bamboo pole floor, for instance, you can expect it to flex a lot. If you stand on a concrete floor, it will flex only a tiny amount. It still flexes, though, still moves; that's what causes concrete to crack over time.
Now, for strong surfaces this movement might translate to a very low-level vibration - unnoticeable to you. But it's absence will be unnoticeable to, so there is really no harm in taking out the energy of the vibration and using it for something else.
Your fallacy is thinking that you are going to now need to put in more energy into the system, rather than having a system that takes some of your 'waste' energy and moves it somewhere else instead. In this case, yes, there is no free lunch. But, then, you're already paying for lunch and not eating it.
[Ego]out
Especially given the lard in your arse.
Hell, people pay money to waste energy and, oh, what was it called, oh, yes, exercise.
Given you're going to have to walk anyway and the extra energy from YOUR walking is minimal (times 34,000 people adds up, though), how much do you think you'll eat extra to solve this craving for more food?
About bugger all?
Are you trying to say that they could get more free energy by powering the trains with exercycles?
"Okay, all aboard... Now pedel. Pedal. Push. Push. One and two and one and a two and pick up the pace now, one two three four."
Correct Horse Battery Staple: 72 bits of entropy. Enter "Correct H" into google. When it generates the phrase, that's
Maybe a set of Odor Eaters in every pair of shoes ;^)
And who'll be footing the bill?