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OpenSUSE 11.0 Released
Nate D writes "It's here: a new major release of Novell's community-supported distro is now available, and can be downloaded from the mirrors. Linux Format has a hands-on look at the new installer, SLAB menu and Compiz Fusion, and weighs up whether the distro can fight competition from Ubuntu and Fedora. Is this the start of a new era for SUSE?"
I will not use it on my box. I will not use it with a fox.
My blog
Indemnify me, baby.
Ooh yeah, just like that.
Folks, please download it via BitTorrent:
http://download.opensuse.org/distribution/11.0/iso/torrent/openSUSE-11.0-DVD-i386.torrent
I think most of the downloads are being done selfishly via HTTP or FTP, as I've been in the swarm for almost 1h and the speeds are quite low, there are only 60 peers.
Don't drink the Microsoft kool-aid. Novell has continually stated that the deal had nothing to do with patent protection for "Microsoft IP in Linux" - only Microsoft has been pushing that fud. Funny how, if this was such a deal, Microsoft hasn't revealed their supposed IP.
Kevin Smith on Prince
http://www.thecodingstudio.com/opensource/linux/screenshots/index.php?linux_distribution_sm=openSUSE%2011.0
The only way SUSE will start a new era is if they dump Microsoft as a partner.
I've used all three (U, F, & S) and keep going back to SuSE because of the SuSEfirewall2 configuration feature. It gives you one straightforward (fairly) easy to understand text config file that governs how the iptables rules get set up.
The Yast system manager is pretty good too, especially the software management section, but then again Ubuntu's Synaptic and apt-get from Debian totally rocks too! I'd love to have OpenSuSE with both Yast and Synaptic together, but I'm too lazy to try to install the Debian tools into SuSE so I'll just use whatever software manager that comes with whatever distro I'm presently using.
Oops, run kid
mov ax,4c00h
int 21h
When I tried SuSe, I remember I was forced to install everything, totaling about 8 CD's of data, without the possibility to skip everything but the basics, and just get the bits and parts you needed later online, like a Debian netinstall. Is this still the case? If so, my answer to the question about a new Ubuntu or Fedora, I would clearly say no.
It's all fun & games until someone loses the game.
Shame the review didn't use KDE, as that's the good point about SUSE as far as I am concerned.
You can clear your yum directories (been a while since we ran fc distro). I'd stick with fedora and if the bleeding edge gets too much think about moving to debian.
At the risk of being labeled a troll, I typically tell colleagues who ask about the Microsoft deal that Apple has numerous patent and other technology licensing agreements with Microsoft, and yet we don't see a groundswell of people on Slashdot calling Apple on the carpet for their Microsoft agreements.
:-)
:-(. Please be nice!)
In response, I've heard that the difference is that Apple doesn't pretend to be fully open-source whereas Novell does to an extent, though Apple does have an open-source kernel and other bits in addition to a proprietary system. Similarly, Novell's SuSE (not openSuSE) is a product that users typically need to pay for. From a high-level view, this looks like both companies offer a proprietary system as well as an open-source subset of that proprietary system.
As a result -- at least, from that simplification of the issue -- I think that anti-SuSE people on Slashdot are treating Novell unfairly versus Apple. I'm not a fan of the Microsoft deal, either, but I do like openSuSE on technical and, especially, usability grounds, and that is why I both advocate for and use it both at home and at work.
Now I'm off to download the latest version
(there goes my karma, though
What does Microsoft do with a Linux distributor at first place? Especially after the stock board of that distributor was filled with Chapter 11 rumours until they ink the deal? Did you see their CTO Blog? Does that guy have any other job than cloning MS trojan technologies to Linuxland? I have even seen they tried to port .NET to Apple iPhone and guy cheering about it. WTF has Apple iPhone have anything to do with Linux, Novell or more importantly, .NET?!
One basic question. Is Mono and Moonlight a selected by default option or not?
I would use original XP or Vista rather than a thing which is made by their cloning partners. At least they are original.
OpenSUSE 11 is very similar to Fedora 9 in that respect. If you want free I would recommend Debian or Ubuntu 6.06 LTS. If you've got $50 laying around I would strongly recommend SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop 10 SP2 as it is the most stable and feature rich desktop distro IMHO, especially if you are running it along side Windows workstations or servers.
"All those moments, will be lost in time...like tears in rain..."
I thought, unless your doing something stupid on a desktop or running a server chances are a linux box doesnt need a firewall (all your software is from a trusted source thats pointing out, and theres very little pointing outwards anyway)?
IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
I wish I could mod you up. You, sir, have obviously stated some very crucial information regarding how fanboyism works. Congratulations!
http://stoploudness.org/
Apple's users doesn't like Microsoft OS but some good things from Microsoft such as Office package is chart topper on Amazon Top 10 software list. Don't get fooled by Slashdot comments, see the actual download numbers on general user profile sites.
Microsoft and Apple relations have nothing to do with Novell and Microsoft partnership. For example, Apple sees the web developers and others insist on using Verdana etc. fonts. They PAY to Microsoft to get those fonts while Microsoft pays them for Truetype which is an Apple invention. Or you can see Microsoft being responsible for thousands of Apple G5 Workstation sales thanks to XBox 360 SDK and their media guys. It is a healthy relationship with well planned borders.
Novell on other hand was almost on verge of crashing financially before dealing with Microsoft and does things which are never fit to Linux in any sense. Setting up a relationship with the company who spends billions for their own wannabe Java (.NET) to make sure companies stay with their own buggy, badly architecture OS and hiring its clone author as CTO allowing him to post "XBox 360 is great", "MS OOXML is great" type junk doesn't help their image at all.
I downloaded the last beta download (ie not release code) and the experience was quite shocking.
I run 10.3 on my 2GB Thinkpad T60p and its rock solid. Now I tried 11 and it was like going from XP to Vista. Slow as anything and it kept crashing badly, on a machine that is Suse certified.
I may download and try the new version but a work to the wise, make sure your backups are good.
However if you are wanting to have a mess around with Xen, its now built right in, so its not all bad.
http://www.writeitfor.us - Writing IT for the IT generation.
openSUSE doesn't have an evaluation period. Thus, there is no need to be forced to install anything else other than, perhaps, the next version of openSUSE after your installed version is eventually end-of-lifed.
I tried the beta a few weeks ago, and while I realize that a beta is a beta, and therefore subject to bugs, I have a hard time understanding why my no-frills Logitech USB mouse, which works with every other distribution of Linux or version of Windows that I've used in the past 5 years, would not work with the Open Suse beta.
That, and the network manager kept prompting me for my WEP key repeatedly, even when I had the hard switch for my wireless turned off.
And I couldn't stand the graphical package manager.
And I think the "slab" menu is a pain in the butt.
Troll? He speaks the truth
The newest Kubuntu (with KDE4) was way too bloated for my poor, old laptop. I've been looking around for something more lightweight since. I'm kind of leaning toward Mepis, but am not quite sure yet. When it comes to a 1.2ghz CPU and only 512mb of RAM, things get sticky. Add-in the fact that there's also all of these weird, proprietary onboard components and things become an utter pain.
"He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
What evaluation period? OpenSuSE is the community version - you must be confusing it with an evaluation of SLED or SLES. You can use openSuSE forever if you want (they'll only provide free patches for about 2 years though). I've been using the RC of openSuSE 11 and think it's an improvement on 10.3, but probably just an incremental improvement (unless you like KDE4). I've tried some other distros (fedora, ubuntu etc) but keep coming back to SuSE - it just feels more cohesive and I actually like the YaST tool (even though it is somewhat slow and bloated, it's a single point of administration).
You're a temporary arrangement of matter sliding towards oblivion in a cold, uncaring universe
Have you considered trying it without KDE4? Unless I missed something when installing mine, it comes with 3.5 as standard.
If you're interested in running a non-KDE desktop, have you considered Xubuntu? It's the Ubuntu variant with the lighter-weight Xfce desktop. I run it on a 600Mhz Pentium III laptop with 128MB of RAM, and it works quite well (be sure to grab the "alternate install" disk if you're running with as little RAM as I am).
I had no issues with the non-standard desktop components on my laptop working out-of-the-box, but of course YMMV here. Wireless, sound, etc.
If Xfce is not light enough, you can always install fluxbox, wmaker, etc, all available from the offical apt repositories.
So yes - perhaps all features are available for all distros. But not all are actually implemented/moved to another distro. Most corporate users like the way YAST (packet manager) is working, and they also enjoy some of the built-in features for central management and integration with infrastructure products widely used in Enterprises.
Simply put: SUSE has more focus on Enterprise needs, and less focus on whistles and bells (in GUI and elsewhere). An even though many of these features COULD be moved/ported to other distros, they are not. For the simple reasons that users of these distros are not needing or requesting them.
On the other hand distros like Ubuntu has a much nicer appeal to consumer-type end-users. It looks more familiar to them , than SUSE and has a more appealing look'n'feel.
- Jesper
My security clearance is so high I have to kill myself if I remember I have it...
Between their patent problems and GPL incompatibility Sun can keep them. In fact we can write that on Sun's tombstone. Here lies a really cool OS that had ZFS and dtrace.
"All those moments, will be lost in time...like tears in rain..."
As I pointed out, Novell is more than a linux distributor.
I *do* believe that Mono and Moonlight, in their current guise, are trojans, and that Miguel de Icaza should be given the boot, asap, but that's another story. Novell has done a lot of the heavy lifting for the community, including the SCO crap. OpenSUSE is a good product; it should be judged on its' merits, and not on any FID from Microsoft. After all, Microsoft is claiming that *ALL* linux distros "may violate Microsoft IP". Of course, since they use the weasel-word "may", anyone with 2 brain cells would immediately recognize the fud, but PHBs don't seem to be able to afford the grey matter necessary.
Kevin Smith on Prince
I would use original XP or Vista rather than a thing which is made by their cloning partners. At least they are original.
It is sad that you come to such a conclusion without at least evaluating the technical potential of these projects, and perhaps Novells reasons for engaging in them. It sounds almost like you are on a personal crusade against commercial vendors who are in the cross-platform / portability business.
Novell has made it its core business to connect technologies which are for different reasons not already connected. And in most of these cases, the products they connect are either all commercial or a mixture of (F)OSS and classic closed-source commercial software.
While you may disagree with their goals, and be almost religiously in opposition of them, I think they do more good than bad. They ultimately ensure that the customer/consumer has a wider choice in products and technologies, and they are IMHO they key to breaking the monopolistic world domination which certain vendors enjoy.
I frankly don't see why Novells projects (for example Mono and Moonlight) are "bad" while similar cross-platform initiatives (such as WINE and SAMBA) are "good". I think the end user should have the widest range of products to choose from, and any company or community who is engaged in projects which enhance portability and interconnectivity are "good". Especially when they release them under open source licenses - like Novell does.
- Jesper
My security clearance is so high I have to kill myself if I remember I have it...
Where Redhat tried to block CentOS, Novell actively helps people to make their own openSUSE and SUSE based distribution.
Also openSUSE make a clear difference between OSS and things that are NON-OSS. It is then up to the user to decide wether you want to install it or not.
Novell has opend a lot of their code already. Indeed not yet everything. However they are working on that as well.
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
I can't speak for everyone, but I couldn't care less if Apple uses MS patented or copyrighted code in their OS. I mind a whole hell of a lot if Novell accidentally managed to sneak some in, polluting my Ubuntu kernel with legal issues that I have no desire to be involved with.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
I just downloaded the 10.3 SuSe because I'm running a Suse 9.x that I've had for years. I didn't wait for 11.0 because I don't want a buggy system for use at work. I may get 11.x where x > 0 someday. The only reason I'm upgrading is because I never downloaded the FULL 9.x CDs, and they seem to have shut off the Yast servers for 9.x SuSes - there are a few things that I want to install that require packages that I don't want to install myself but instead want to *have installed* by Yast. I only downloaded a 1 CD image and have been using Yast to get packages as needed. I downloaded the 10.3 DVD though which I'll be using for 10.3 I'd be suprised if it made you install EVERYTHING in one go.
...
While you may disagree with their goals, and be almost religiously in opposition of them, I think they do more good than bad. They ultimately ensure that the customer/consumer has a wider choice in products and technologies, and they are IMHO they key to breaking the monopolistic world domination which certain vendors enjoy.
I honestly don't understand why some people believe Novells projects (for example Mono and Moonlight) are "bad" while similar cross-platform initiatives (such as WINE and SAMBA) are "good". I also don't understand why people see IBM's investments in Open Source projects as "good" while Novells are "bad".
In a free market, the users and customers benefit from having the widest range of products to choose from. Any company or community who is engaged in software projects which enhance portability and interconnectivity are "good" the way I see it. Especially when they release them under open source licenses - like Novell does.
Given the allready widespread use of
- Jesper
My security clearance is so high I have to kill myself if I remember I have it...
Or, if you're comfortable i Red Hat-land, CentOS.
-- Linux user #369862
I'd say you could give Zenwalk a try (Slack + XFCE). I think it's the best you can get without sacrificing looks and user-friendliness for performance.
Wow! The www.en.opensuse.org website is down! There are so many people downloading it, it crashed there site! I can't wait to start my download!
Could you please back up your claims of Red Hat trying to stop CentOS with some facts? And in related news, Red Hat is opening Red Hat Network. :)
http://www.linuxworld.com/news/2008/061808-red-hat-network-to-be.html
-- Linux user #369862
your boss says "let's try a Linux distro for a while", please, don't suggest OpenSuSE A good recommendation in a corporate setting is always based on a good business case. I would be happy to evaluate your arguments for not choosing SUSE for a company, if they are solid and based on rational arguments.
Untill then I will most certainly recommend SUSE if the business case supports it. And in some cases it will - no questions asked. Novell makes great cross-platform products, so if a company needs, say, a cluster of servers capable of running both J2EE and
Or perhaps we could imagine a company wanting to convert their outdated XP clients with Linux clients in order to postpone hardware upgrades (which would be needed in order to migrate to Vista). Perhaps the ability to show webpages with Silverlight elements was an important criteria? What about browsers capable of showing PDF documents, MS Word documents, Flash content, etc? All these are cross-platform initiatives, and I honestly believe that Linux won't make in into the corporate environment without these.
I don't understand why some people think Novell and their projects (for example Mono and Moonlight) are "bad" while other cross-platform initiatives (such as WINE and SAMBA) are "good". I also fail to see why the same people often argue that IBM's investments in Open Source projects are "good" while Novells are "bad". The discussion about Microsoft/Linux/Novell needs to be elevated to a level where it is based on the same standard you would demand in other more scientific debates. Drop the emotional and irrational arguments. Give me facts and examples from real life.
Users and customers benefit from a free market. It gives them the widest range of products to choose from. Any community or company who is engaged in software projects which enhance portability and interconnectivity are "good" as far as I am concerned. Even more so when they are releases them under open source licenses - like MONO and Moonlight.
- Jesper
My security clearance is so high I have to kill myself if I remember I have it...
Sorry, that argument doesn't fly. The installer asks if you want Gnome 2.22, KDE 3.5.9, or KDE 4.0.4, right? You get to pick, it's not like you're locked into using KDE 4.
So...install KDE3? You have to go out of your way to download KDE4.
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
I completely agree. The M$/Novell technical agreement is much less of a big deal than the community makes it out to be. So what if they have a patent agreement? It wasn't selling out since it never concerned the kernel, just the utilities used in Linux. That, and M$ has yet to prove any patent violations concerning Linux, which has always led me to believe that it touched more on the directory services issues.
Oh, for the days when sig's didn't have to be cute...hey, wait a sec.
My T22 (P3 900, 256, WiFi) runs openSUSE 10.3 with either KDE 3 or Joe's Window Manager that I discovered by trying out DamnSmallLinux.
Basically all I use my laptop for is running NX to my home machine, so a light fast small desktop is the best solution.
On the compatibility side, I do have to run ndiswrapper to make my Linksys PCMCIA WiFi work, but once it is in, KNetworkManager takes care of all the complicated stuff.
Do not meddle in the affairs of geeks for they are subtle and quick to anger
I'm vaguely running xubuntu on a 600 MHz Celery with 64MB RAM. It can just about handle a firefox window with 3 or 4 tabs, or mythTV (photos), or Azureus at a real pinch.
My point being that it doesn't even need 128MB, although I wouldn't recommend that you try to make it work full time on 64.
</more data points>
FGD 135
I was just like you , but when I used Ubuntu I found that there is no need for Yast when everything works just fine without touching any configuration utilities. But I might go back to SuSE when they stop using Mono in their system utilities , especially the ones in the startup !
The CLR is a better framework than anything else out there, and whining about that because Microsoft came up with it is completely retarded. If Java didn't suck, I'd use that--but it does, and
Knee-jerk fear of Mono being used to enforce patents later is ignorant of the legal system; Microsoft has promised that they will not engage in legal action against those reimplementing the
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
For a Linux lover but amateur, I loved it for it's simplicity and ease of installation.
We figured out a long time ago that it's easier to elect seven judges than to elect 132 legislators.
Oh. One other thing.
Why would Mono be bad when Samba and WINE are good?
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
preditor@<mybox>:~> uname -a
Linux <mybox> 2.6.25.7-PReDiToR #1 Thu Jun 19 04:44:46 BST 2008 i686 athlon i386 GNU/Linux
Don't like the openSUSE kernel? Don't use it.
Just like that.
Do not meddle in the affairs of geeks for they are subtle and quick to anger
And people complain about Microsoft's Linux FUD, but they're cool with Novell FUD? That's funny.
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
Get a clue before you start whining about OMG TEH MICROSOFTS. I understand that you have a retarded knee-jerk hatred of Microsoft. Carrying that over to Novell (who, might I add, went to bat against SCO--or have you already forgotten that?) because they support Mono, a tool for interoperability that doesn't suck nearly as much as Java, is amazingly retarded.
Novell's business is making systems talk to each other. They don't really care if those systems are closed-source, because people still use them.
You could just as easily look at it the other way: use Mono and there are fewer reasons to have Windows around, because the majority of
I don't understand why Mono is TEH EVIL but WINE and Samba are OK. It makes no fucking sense. Is it because people like Miguel--gasp!--don't view Microsoft as enemies? Because they--GASP!--are willing to work with other people, regardless of what you as a FOSStard think?
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
I'm a KDE 3.5 user. I don't have any faith that Seigo and the rest of the KDE devs, who have apparently gone entirely incompetent between KDE3 and KDE4, will pull off anything useful.
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
Does Microsoft sell the technology that apple licenses directly? On a recent sales call for SLES, the Microsoft guy did all the talking, and in the quote we received was directly from Microsoft...not Novell or another reseller. The guy who was on the line from Novell hardly said anything.
Personally, I don't really care about Novell's Microsoft deal either way, because their product offerings were inferior to begin with.
1. openSUSE doesn't need a new era, it is doing just fine.
2. The Microsoft pact hasn't alienated any of the community that matters. There are fundamentalists that gripe and whine and spit about every intellectual property issue that they *perceive* reduces openness. And there are people who write code. There isn't much overlap at all between the coder and the fundamentalist - so there whining and spitting should just be takes as the meaningless noise that it is.
3. Yast is *extremely* modular and not in the least bit monolithic - one just has to look at the Yast packages to know that. It even has multiple front-ends. This makes as much charge as the people who accuse Evolution of being monolithic (it a highly modular app that consists mostly of cooperating components). Another Yast plus is that it works and coverts almost all configuration issues right down to certificate management. That makes SuSE / openSUSE the only distro with a comprehensive management tool.
Using "Common Sense" is being either to arrogant or to ignorant to ask people who know more about something than you.
The agreement between Apple and MS is between two private, proprietary companies.
The difference is that Microsoft has openly been sabre rattling and spreading FUD that they will sue Linux users over intellectual property that is supposedly protected in SuSE due to this agreement. By entering into the agreement, Novell has (rightly or wrongly) lent credibility to these claims. This hurts community as a whole.
That's a big distinction.
- --
"I Hate Quotes" -- Samuel L. Clemens
Probably because most people (slash-shitters excepted) don't consider MS a "taint".
Would you care to explain WHY? I mean, really explain. With rational arguments - not emotional, religious or similar irrational explanations.
Because Microsoft has had a long history of fighting against Open Source using every tactics possble. Their agreement with Novell makes Novell not trustworthy in that context. I'm not saying Novell makes bad products or SuSE sucks, but simply there is a suspicious agreement between a company that produces Open Source Software and a different one which always fought against OSS.
So, let me get this straight: You are seriously trying to make Novell evil by proxy? And by proxy only? That is not a rational argument in my book. Sorry :-)
Just for example, would you vote a politician who gets money from the opposite party?
I fail to see the relevance of that analogy. Microsoft and Novell are both software companies. Theyy both sell commercial software. And they made a deal where Novell got a truckload of cash while making Microsoft use and distribute their software. And in addition they got insight in certain closed source products which aided their efforts in making Windows/Linux cross-platform solutions (their core business). In any other non-fanatical, non-religious and more sensible context, that would be considered a rational business decision.
I think the answer to your question is: I will vote for the politician who doesn't lie and who gets the job done. So far Novell seems to fit that description. They have done nothing so far to make me believe that they are not trustworthy. And making a business deal with Microsoft is not in itself "untrustworthy". You are the one trying to display that single action as "untrustworthy" and I don't see any rational arguments to support it.
Probably because WINE doesn't try to make you embrace a closed source technology made in Redmond. There are excellent but Windows only apps out there and WINE provides a bridge to fill the gap (yes I know there are Wine APIs, still you aren't encouraged to use them to write Linux apps).
There are excellent .NET-only apps out there, and I welcome the ability to run them off a Linux cluster. I also welcome any initiative which enables me to choose my server OS/platform independently from my business application. And that is precisely what MONO does. MONO is for .NET servers what WINE is for desktop computers. I am a little surprised you don't see a basis for comparison.
Samba does the same network-wise.
Mono, on the other hand, makes you rely on a Windows technology that will always have more support on the windows platform.
Samba is a (great) product which ties Windows clients together with Linux servers. But it also enables users to keep Windows on their client computers, and continue to use Microsoft technologies and protocols for their server-related needs. It "embraces", as you call it, microsoft protocols and methods. Just as WINE "embraces" the Win32 API btw. In both cases their goal is to ensure interoperability between to competing platforms. Hopefully increasing overall competition in the process. And both the Win32 API and all the Microsoft-based network protocols available in SAMBA will always have more support on the Windows platform.
This makes both SAMBA and WINE bad, by your own definition.
Well, I happen top be one of those people who got to talk before some 50 IBM execs in 1997 or so, when they wanted to know more about it, so each of us (IBM contacted my local Linux Users Group) chose an argument then talked in front of them. Let me tell you one thing: while I was uncomfortable sourrounded by so many suits and security measures (armed guards, no photos, etc.) and some of them still weren't allowed to install Linux on their laptop when we offered to help (and they were execs!), which shows how bad the IBM
My security clearance is so high I have to kill myself if I remember I have it...
Well, the Linux NFS is so sucky from what I have read), that Samba is quite useful.
I use wine to run keygens for bootlegged aps. They usually run.
Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
At the risk of being labeled a troll, I typically tell colleagues who ask about the Microsoft deal that Apple has numerous patent and other technology licensing agreements with Microsoft, and yet we don't see a groundswell of people on Slashdot calling Apple on the carpet for their Microsoft agreements.
OSX is a proprietary OS that runs on top of a BSD foundation and the fact that it uses OSS parts is irrelevant. Apple can do what it wants with those parts with our blessing. Apple is using them the way they were intended to be used.
The Apple patent agreements are nothing more than regular old patent agreements between corporations.
SuSE is GPL. The contentious Novell-Microsoft patent deal was a blatant attempt to do an end run around the GPL with a 'belt-and-suspenders' FUD attack.
There is NO comparison between them.
I tried ubuntu, kubuntu and xubuntu and really wanted to like them, but I found it trickier to do some of the network configuration that is really easy with YaST. e.g. I couldn't find how to set up a system-wide proxy without creating a bash_profile to set the variables.
There were some other minor issues as well, not show-stoppers, but I've just got very used to the SuSE distributions (I've been using them since version 7 and use SLES for running oracle at work).
I was most impressed by the xubuntu desktop (uses xfce), but it had some reliability issues after running for a few days. When the next version of Ubuntu comes around, I'll give it another go and see if I can get used to it.
You're a temporary arrangement of matter sliding towards oblivion in a cold, uncaring universe
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
I agree, Mandriva gets a lot right. But for some reason, I haven't been able to get 2008 to play unencrypted AAC files. Loaded all the codecs, but I probably have to upgrade Xine itself. I know I got it to work on 2007, just don't know what of all the things I tried did the trick.
And that's the nasty truth. The distros that preconfigure all the multimedia beat the ones that don't. And to do that, they have to be non U.S. (patents) and non-ideological (non-free stuff). Or they have to cut pre-load deals with OEM's that allow them to install non-free stuff for a pittance without 'redistributing' it.
Is there a solution to this?
Posted from my Android phone. Oh, I can change this? There, that's better...
They only make the "promise not to sue" to people who don't do commercial development. In other words, non-competitors. f*ck that.
Kevin Smith on Prince
Never said samba was any good - I don't use it. As for wine, the c code I'm writing at work today is targeted to the linux and bsd platforms (like always), and the rest (web stuff), I still develop under linux. For me, the only useful wine is something that comes in a bottle.
As for the CLR, why? I have neither need nor desire for "managed code." If I wanted that, I could use java - at least it's mature, open-source, and has good support on my platform of choice.
Kevin Smith on Prince
Package management is my biggest issue with OpenSuSE.
They started with YaST in the 9.x series. Then for a while, APT4RPM was the thing everyone used. Then the APT repositories disappeared and I had to switch to Yum, though the web site recommended switching to SMART. Now the official package manager is something I can't even remember the name of because nobody else uses it... *looks it up* Zypper.
I mean, WTF? Five different package managers in a couple of years, and they haven't done the intelligent thing and switched to a proven system that actually works? I mean, I understand why RedHat use RPM--they shat it out, so they feel obliged to keep using it. But why does SuSE keep using it, and why do they keep switching the front end?
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
How is it even possible to prove someone "evil" with just logic?
If you can read this, I forgot to post anonymously.
The linux kernel... rock solid. But with compiz, gnome, and wine, ... sometimes I end up rebooting because I'm not familiar enough with what to kill and restart.
And then there were none.
They done that in 10.3 already. No more zmd crap luckily, and 11 is nice!
What's purple and commutes? An Abelian grape.
Maybe the floundering of a single, free, desktop 'Linux' rising to the top for consumers and corporate to choose is due to the fact that you CAN play with either Fedora/SUSE/Ubuntu 2-3 times a year but never stick with one long enough to do anything useful? Comments on this page explains a LOT about what is dividing Linux as a community.
A few tips. I work on a college campus, and I get stuck with XP and Vista reinstalls all the time. You may or may not be aware of some/a lot/all of these, but I'll take that risk if it could save you a few minutes. (It's loads of fun fixing exchange students' machines. They're all by "weird" manufacturers like NEC and I don't speak Japanese!)
Not much you can do with a crappy sysprep'd recovery disc. But, once the install is finished, run PC Decrappifier on the box. It'll yank out all the trialware/garbage bloat that comes with most PCs. It is a lot faster than having to manually remove all of them from Add/Remove programs.
(Remember to curse HP-Compaq and Dell for these programs, not Microsoft. Invoke not Crom's name on the wrong party.)
Keep Windows XP SP3, Vista SP1, IE7, Office 2003 SP3, and the Office 2007 patches on a flash drive. Find out what drivers the computer is going to need while Windows is installing and download them on another machine. This'll save you a few hours of Windows Update. Keep them stored somewhere, sorted by manufacturer and model so you'll never have to find them again. (For a while.)
If you are working on a fairly common model of computer, consider making an image from it. If you get a similar model again, it'll take minutes and not hours to fix it.
I can't speak for ways to reduce the XP install time, and I haven't installed a Linux distro recently. But in my experience, it's 30 minutes to install XP, and another 30 to install office, patches (from disk), and to register it on our network.
Good luck!
DATABASE WOW WOW
But Java is an irritating language to use and has poor native-code bindings in many cases. C# is a pleasant language to use and has good, portable interfaces to native code (giving many benefits of native code with other benefits of managed code).
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
Tis a shame tho' - ZFS and dtrace are nice...
Just seen this review:
opensuse 11.0 review at downloadsquad
We saw the same fiasco before that with java. Microsoft introduced an incompatible version, then, when they lost in court, introduced c# as a java competitor, rather than support existing standards.
We see this sort of behaviour all the time, most recently with the OLPC, and also with MSOOXML vs ODF.
The performance of managed code sucks - and it always will.
Kevin Smith on Prince
Haven't found one yet. Why would anyone want code written by marketdroids running on their machine?
If they can't get the their concept, let alone the information I seek in plain HTML, they probably do not have anything useful on the site, like say pricing.
There is no right to feel safe thru security vaudeville at the expense of everyone's freedom, privacy and tax money.
Anti-Linux FUD is terrible and awful, but screaming FUD about Microsoft is okay by you, apparently. We saw the same fiasco before that with java. Microsoft introduced an incompatible version, then, when they lost in court, introduced c# as a java competitor, rather than support existing standards. Microsoft came out with a better product than Sun did (J++ was arguably better in a lot of ways, and C#/.NET definitely beats Java all hollow.) The Java "standards" sucked then and continue to suck now.
Why support bad standards? We see this sort of behaviour all the time, most recently with the OLPC, and also with MSOOXML vs ODF. Oh, please. The OLPC has bigger problems than OMG MICROSOFT TAINTING THE FREE SOFTWARE PURITY. And frankly, OOXML is a better standard than ODF, too. With OOXML, however, their methods for ramming it through ISO were not good, and I don't support the standard because of it--they didn't do any such thing with
Use what works best for the job. C/C++ has a place.
I don't tell you not to use your tools of choice or that the developers of your tools of choice should be fired for running a project that--gasp!--you don't believe in. Or do Miguel de Icaza, Novell, and I not have the freedom to work on projects we think are valuable? (The code is free, but not the developers!)
So sit down and shut the fuck up.
"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
So maybe you shouldn't use beta software in a critical role if you care about stability? Nobody's making you use compiz.
No idea how wine could cause you to reboot, since it just runs non-critical applications, but I don't use it.
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Yes if it's not specific to the topic. You must be new here :)
Use the support forums of the distribution of your choice. Slashdot is to discuss metaphysical matters like whether Novel is EVIL, whether Saint Stallman would prevail over flying chairs, whether the Penguin would achieve world domination, whether the Daemon has died, and so on...
Don't quote me on this.
A good package browser, corporate/enterprise-friendly administration tools, security systems and automated deployment mechanisms are all things that corporate users will evaluate.
While other distros may have a more polished and "Vista-like" GUI, SUSE is known to be more enterprise-oriented, because Novells core business is enterprise-grade infrastructure and enterprise-grade cross-platform tools.
- Jesper
My security clearance is so high I have to kill myself if I remember I have it...
Or did you maybee miss a letter, and it should have been DROPPing? In which case an IT forum might not be the right place for that discussion...?
- Jesper
My security clearance is so high I have to kill myself if I remember I have it...
SuSEs firewall isn't a firewall, is a piece of software emulating a firewall. A firewall should run on embedded hardware between the desktop computer and the Internet. Does a Linux system even need a firewall. All you have to do is disable all Internet facing services apart from port 80 that is. With the current use of Web 2 and RPC over HTML type services, this renders the use of a firewall dilute.
davecb5620@gmail.com
Those who ignore history aren't only doomed to repeat it, they'll end up looking like MS shills on slashdot.
Read what I wrote. Microsoft had disbanded the IE dev. team, saying that "people have no interest in tabbed browsing, etc., and that the future was in net-based apps, not browser-based ones."
It only took a few secs to come up with a link, and there are plenty more where that came from, so stop with the "rewriting MS history" bullshit, please. Every move microsoft has made was to try to move people onto a different platform that they could control. C#, and also .NET, were supposed to be the tools to do that, and get people away from java and web-based apps, neither of which have a platform lockin. Both attempts are miserable failures. Java now runs on over a billion devices, and .NET is a piece of crap, and will be replaced within the next 5 years by the "next great thing", while people will still be using java and browser-based apps.
You're free to do whatever you want, including working on .net or mono, but be prepared to make yet another shift within the next 5 years. In the meantime, people who are working with "the old standbys" c, c++, and (now) java, will just be increasing their experience level and ubiquitousness.
No, performance is NOT irrelevant. Unless, of course, the app you're writing is trivial.
Kevin Smith on Prince
Should have used preview for the first post of the day ..
http://www.netmag.co.uk/zine/discover-interview/dean-hachamovitch
Kevin Smith on Prince
It's true that both Novell and Apple have patent agreements with MS. There's a big difference between them, though. Which company called press conferences and trumpeted it to the world as if it were a good thing and sang the praises of the interoperability that would surely follow and how it would solve all the world's problems? Exactly.
Vector should do too, its supposed to be a user friendly version of slack too
I know full well that tobacco is bad for you, so I smoke weed with crack
A lot of the time you can hit "CTRL-ALT-backspace" to restart your GUI.
/etc/init.d you will find a list of services. Google them (or read the documen ... wait, this is Slashdot <grin>) and not only will you gain confidence, but you can maximise your uptime to show off with.
If you take a look in
Do not meddle in the affairs of geeks for they are subtle and quick to anger
Seconding the Zenwalk recommendation. It does alright with 64 to 128mb of RAM.
Read what I wrote. Microsoft had disbanded the IE dev. team, saying that "people have no interest in tabbed browsing, etc., and that the future was in net-based apps, not browser-based ones." [netmag.co.uk]
(in fact, the Internet Explorer team was disbanded shortly after the release of IE6)
It only took a few secs to come up with a link, and there are plenty more where that came from, so stop with the "rewriting MS history" bullshit, please.
Of course they stopped with the IE team. That has absolutely nothing to do with(And Java and C# are a lot closer than the Java tards want to admit, making switching between the two easy, though unpleasant; the biggest difference between the two languages is that Anders Hejlsberg actually put some thought into what a developer wants to do with a programming language--C# provides a number of facilities that make using the language pleasant, rather than a chore as in C++ or Java.
No, performance is NOT irrelevant. Unless, of course, the app you're writing is trivial. For the vast majority of applications, performance of decently-written managed code is good enough, and so in those cases it is as close to irrelevant as it gets (yes, a retard programmer can cause performance issues, but that's doable in any language). Would I try to write a full-3D-up-the-ass game in"You can either have software quality or you can have pointer arithmetic, but you cannot have both at the same time."
Not true - they fact was that they were eager to get people off of browsers as a deployment platform because developers were no longer locked in to MS, and alternate browsers (read STANDARDS_COMPATIBLE) were already taking away market share. They saw the future - where people no longer needed windows for browsing the net or email; and no longer needed msoffice, and it scared them shitless.
Now we're at that "future" - where the #1 selling machines over $1k are Apples, the bottom-feeders are selling pcs with linux, and where a retail copy of the os costs more than a basic box. Not a good place to be in, and every lock-in attempt so far has failed. .NET, C#, MSOOXML.
Look at the internet -
The only reason I stayed on Microsoft products foras long as I did was because of Borland. When they started tanking, I started looking to other platforms ... it wasn't like there was anything in Microsofts' stable of products that inspired me at the time. Their c++ compiler was notorious for being way behind the standards, as well as having poor performance.
They wanted to lock in "net services", "soa", etc. - they were predicting that ALL browsers would be obsolete within 5 years, and they actually got some traction at the time (*grumble* in-house apps for financial institutions *grumble*), but in the end they failed to kill off the browser as a delivery platform.
As for "binary compatibility" - what are you going to do in 5 years, when the "patent pledges" terminate? You'll have investged all that time in code that you can't leverage ...
I'm betting by then we'll see some new developments - not just cross-compilers, but full-fledged cross-language compilers. For example, the ability to take java code, translate it into c/c++, and have it run natively. There were already "application binary compilers" years ago that could take a binary program, run it, dynamically translate all the calls from all the execution paths into source code, optimize it, then compile it. Pity nobody's done anything about it in a couple of decades because of copyright/disassembly issues - we could have all these apps written in whatever language you wanted, then have native code versions for the platform of your choice.
Not *that* would be exciting!
Kevin Smith on Prince
Absolutely! But this beta software is part of the Ubuntu standard distribution. My home desktop is not exactly mission critical, but it's important to my experience with linux. And knowing about the problem, I still choose to use it. It's good stuff. But my comment stands.
The only reason I reboot is to clear wine state or if the desktop is too sunk to let me CTRL-ALT_BACKSPACE. I find once wine dies on one of my favorite apps, restarting wine doesn't always let the app run.
And then there were none.