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Real-World 3G Monthly Cost With Taxes and Fees?
Kristl writes "I have called AT&T and walked into several AT&T stores to ask 'How much will an AT&T phone plan cost per month with taxes and fees and everything?'. No one can answer this question. They are evasive and become testy when I push them on it. Their answer is they can't tell me what the government is going to charge me as the fees can vary month to month, but I've been an AT&T customer for several years, and my taxes and fees have not varied more than a dollar in all of that time.
So I question them: 'Can you just tell me what the taxes and fees will be for a 3G plan in California that has the basic calling plan, basic data plan, and the basic text plan?' I even do the math for them, that's $75. Okay AT&T, what are the taxes and fees on $75? Oh, they can't tell me that, as the taxes and fees can vary from month to month." There's more to this justified rant (below); real-world numbers in comments could help answer the questions that cell carriers seem content to sidestep as completely as possible.
"Okay ATT, can you tell me what the taxes and fees were on $75 plan last month? No.
Okay AT&T, cn you tell me what my taxes and fees were last month on my current $40 plan ... that only requires reading my bill right? Oh good! They can read! Yes they can tell me what the taxes and fees were on my $40 account last month.
Okay AT&T, we have progress ... can you now pull up a plan that has a $40 calling plan, a $30 3G data plan, and a $5 text plan? The answer? No, they can't do that, that would be an invasion of privacy.
So I ask, can they go through the motions of setting my account up for the iphone plan I described above and then tell me what the taxes and fees amount to? Oh, of course not!
This doesn't seem like it should be so hard. What is the conspiracy that ATT refuses to tell me what the my bill would cost per month were I to switch to a new plan?"
Okay AT&T, cn you tell me what my taxes and fees were last month on my current $40 plan ... that only requires reading my bill right? Oh good! They can read! Yes they can tell me what the taxes and fees were on my $40 account last month.
Okay AT&T, we have progress ... can you now pull up a plan that has a $40 calling plan, a $30 3G data plan, and a $5 text plan? The answer? No, they can't do that, that would be an invasion of privacy.
So I ask, can they go through the motions of setting my account up for the iphone plan I described above and then tell me what the taxes and fees amount to? Oh, of course not!
This doesn't seem like it should be so hard. What is the conspiracy that ATT refuses to tell me what the my bill would cost per month were I to switch to a new plan?"
Figuring out the taxes on a phone line is rather complimakated, difficult enough that providers have made mistakes on it in the past and had to refund overcharges or eat the difference in undercharges. I'm not surprised that the salespeople don't know, and I'd bet nobody on phone support will know either. This is a brand new service, and once customers start receiving their typical monthly bills you'll be able to find out.
Every state has a different way of taxing communications service. Florida is the worst of them all from what I've read. Take your current cell phone bill and estimate off the taxes currently on it. Some of the taxes and fees will be a fixed amount per line, others will be based on a percentage of the total bill (sales tax typically).
Also the way cell companies figure out how to tax you differs. Some (such as Sprint) base your taxes on the billing address, others (like Verizon Wireless) base your taxes on the area code your wireless number is located in.
What kind of taxes are we talking about here? I can't think of any other than VAT/sales tax and those are pretty straight-forward. Are there any other taxes for cell phones in the US which are directly charged to the consumer?
The taxes will probably be comparable to sales tax--a few bucks on a $40 plan, e.g. With a more expensive (e.g. data) plan it will of course be more, but if you're willing to shell out $60 or whatever for a data plan you should also be prepared to shell out $8 or whatever in taxes.
To get an approximation just google "XYZ plan taxes fees forum" and see what people say. For example:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?s=bace4f039998a970fb0736cb9659d8b2&p=4412192&postcount=11
Peace out.
The answer is: They honestly have no idea. They're trained to say what corporate tells them.
Training typically focuses on trying to sell you on gizmo features and plan upgrades. They simply ARE NOT given that sort of info and, in my experience, the people that work these jobs are not the type to go the extra mile to figure it out or in some cases don't want to say the wrong thing and have an angry customer come back and throw the phone at them (seen it happen over the most marginal shit.)
No sig for you!!
While this is a little off topic it does still deal with an AT&T 3G phone. iPhone Dev Team's PwnageTool 2.0 has been released to the public.
Are there any other taxes for cell phones in the US which are directly charged to the consumer?
Yes there are various excise taxes levied on cell phone bills. The federal government as well as state and local government each levy their own taxes on wireless communications. This is a slightly outdated listing of taxes by state. For the most part it is a "because we can" sort of tax courtesy of our elected officials.
My current mobile solution:
- Get the cheapest prepaid AT&T Phone
- Add $20/month unlimited data plan to prepaid phone
- Get unlocked Nokia N95-3
- Put prepaid phone's SIM card in N95
- Get fring or truphone for N95 to make calls
- Use email, IM, or twitter instead of SMS
http://www.mobile-weblog.com/50226711/att_offers_unlimited_prepaid_data.php
Different provider, different phone, different priced plan. But, I figured this will turn into a general discussion of taxes on mobile service.
I have a $30/month voice, $20/month data, and $5/month text plan. I'm billed in Garden Grove, CA.
Monthly Recurring Charges
Item Amount
FP BB BIS MC from 7/17/08 to 8/16/08 19.99
FP Nat'l Roaming from 7/17/08 to 8/16/08 -
FlexPay 300 MC from 7/17/08 to 8/16/08 29.99
Msg Bundle 400 MC from 7/17/08 to 8/16/08 4.99
Monthly Recurring Charges 54.97
Taxes, Fees and Surcharges
Item Amount
Government Fees and Taxes
Federal Universal Service Fund 0.77
State Sales Tax 3.88
City Utility Users Tax 3.23
Local Sales Tax 1.49
State 911 0.20
County 911 0.50
Regulatory Programs Fee* 0.86
Taxes, Fees and Surcharges 10.93
Total Charges 65.90
I recall reading a comment here, not long ago, stating that dealing with mobile providers in the US was like 'choosing between shit sandwiches'. This, unfortunately, seems to reiterate that this is the case.
Over here in the UK, things are a lot better. If you don't like customer service, you change network. Simple as. I switched from Tesco Mobile (poor customer service on O2's otherwise excellent network) to 3 earlier this year, and the process was quite painless. Am I right in saying that having mobiles on contract is more common in the USA which is what makes dealing with providers such a nightmare?
Those using pirated Tinysoft signatures(TM) are a real threat to society and should all be thrown in jail.
I work for AT&T. Maybe you are just asking the wrong questions. Every time I activate a new customer I give them a print out of exactly how their first months bill and normal monthly bills will break down. This print out is avalible through any AT&T vendor and is called a CSS (Customer Service Summary) This print out breaks down everything on you bill including rate plan, data, messaging, extra services ( insurance, roadside assistants ...) taxes and fees broken down by which entity is charging which fees and taxes. Any good sales person will present you with this at the time of the sale. If you not getting one maybe you should consider going to a different AT&T store. Just like everyone else that franchises their business you are going to have good agents and bad agents.
I'll admit my example may be pretty rare (and to be completely honest, I'm not sure if this plan is still offered) but my phone plan, with data and text is only $30 a month, with about another $4 in fees and taxes.
So for roughly $34 a month, I get:
-500 'anytime' minutes
-Unlimited text/pic/video
-Unlimited data
-Unlimited Sprint-to-Sprint calling
-Free nights start at 7pm
-Free nationwide roaming (i.e., no 'Local calling area')
As I hinted earlier, this was not an advertised plan, and did involve some work on my part, but my 45-60 minutes of work seems worth it seeing as most pay double or triple for similar plans, even within sprint.
Mt point is, while most advertised plans may be $100-$120, I see that much more like the sticker price on a new car, than say the price of a TV at walmart.
2^4 * 3 * 20929
Here's a sample from my ~$50 plan (Verizon).
Taxes & Surcharges $8.46
Made up of:
Verizon Wireless Surcharges and Other Charges & Credits $3.93
- Fed Universal Service Charge 1.13
- Regulatory Charge 0.07
- Administrative Charge 0.85
- Muni Telecomm Lic. Surchg 1.88
Taxes, Governmental Surcharges & Fees $4.53
- State 911 Surcharge 0.08
- Emergency Svc (Pcc) Charge 0.07
- State Universal Srvc Charge 0.27
- Local E911 Surcharge 0.61
- State Sales Tax 2.48
- Cnty Sales Tax 0.83
- City Sales Tax 0.19
My favorite fee is indicated. It translates as we charge you an arbitrary fee because we can.
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/additionalcharges/ I went on the AT&T website and found it in less than three minutes. Certainly not worth a diatribe on the front page of Slashdot.
My Verizon plan was $79.99 + $10 txt + $5 insurance. That's $94.99. With taxes, which varied, it would come out to ~$98 or 99. So, while the original OP exaggerated a bit (especially for the iPhone, which would cost ~$10 month less), it's not difficult to spend that much per month. I switched to the iPhone, and saved $5 month + $5 insurance (=$10). All this conversation about "OMFG THE IPHONE IS SOOOO EXPENSIVE" is really just a way to get visitors to the site - it applies to every single 3G phone out there, and (as I've shown) even more in some cases.
Here in Austin, elsewhere is Cricket Wireless. In Dallas, I think it's MetroPCS. Sure, the national carriers screw everyone over... but the smaller ones tend to be a little more up-front with their customers.
Is 93 dollars and change after taxes and fees.
Enjoy Every Sandwich
I actually went through those same steps with AT&T's dsl/cell/homephone plans. I asked a very simple question: how much would my monthly bill be assuming there are no surcharges? Here's a brief rundown of my conversation.
Happy Customer:So, i have these 3 plans, home phone for $9.95, cell service for $34.95, and internet service for $49.95 (numbers could be off), assuming i don't go over on minutes or anything extra like that, how much would that be with taxes and surcharges?
AT&T rep:about $20 a month, on average.
Happy Customer: Can you be more specific?
AT&T rep: I'm sorry sir, there simply isn't a way to calculate that in our system.
Happy Customer: Ok, well can you tell me what taxes are included and what percentage they are?
AT&T rep: It's all calculated with a formula in our system.
Happy Customer: Ok, can i have the formula?
AT&T rep: It's in our program, i can't access it. Honestly sir your only the second person in five years that has asked for that. I would only be able to tell you what taxes were on a previous bill.
Happy Customer: So let me get this straight, your saying that i would have to sign up for a contract with AT&T and sign a blank check for the first month before you would tell me how much it would be?
AT&T rep: Yes sir, is there anything else i can help you with today?
Happy Customer: Sure, get me the number for Verizon wireless and Time warner.
Oh, and just so you know? it took about 4 days of emailing and phone calls just to get them to admit it. Whenever the question came up i would get transfered to a different sales rep to repeat my question. Clever huh?
and where is elsewhere? Seriously, when they're all doing it where is elsewhere???
Virgin Mobile. NO extra fees. At all. Why they say 10$, they mean 10$. Just add sales tax.
I work for a ATT Call center as a rep, and ill tell you why, most of the reps just dont care, when someone asks me i just do a 2% tax and tell them thats the best i can do really, we really have no idea what the costs could be,
ATT CLM (Cancel Dept)
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The main difference that can make a cell phone much cheaper in Norway than here in the US, is that you don't pay for incoming calls. There's no "air time". You only pay for outgoing calls, just like with a land line phone.
Another big difference is that in Norway, you have close to 100% geographical coverage, and that's a country that's sparser populated than almost all US states, with lots of mountains and only a couple of percent arable land.
And, as you hinted at, it's common to buy phones and plans separately, with no long term bindings where you get a "free" phone designed to lock you to just one provider.
In all three cases, this is due to legislation. Funny thing is, the cell phone companies there still make money. There's more than 100% market penetration for cell phones in Scandinavia. "Everyone" has at least one cell phone, and some have several. So my guess is that what they make the money by selling more, not by squeezing more.
Because I know people are probably going to choke on a figure like that, people need to be aware that because the taxes are so high in a place like Norway, they have a lot more government-provided services, stuff that we have to pay out the wazoo for in the U.S. Heath care is an obvious one. Obviously, I suppose it's ultimately up to individuals whether or not they want government paying for stuff for them. My personal opinion is that here in America, unfortunately, companies and our government are so corrupt that it couldn't possibly work.
But the point is that even if your taxes are 50% in Norway but only 35% here, it's entirely possible that your disposable income—and by extension, your standard of living—could actually be better.
Incidentally, the richest people here in America don't actually pay 35%. The dirty little secret that rich people don't want you to know because you'd probably vote it out of existence is that the tax rate on the wealthy is closer to 15%, which is much lower than you or I likely pay. (What's your marginal income tax rate?) The reason is because wealthy people don't earn most of their money through income—you know, salary and wages. Income earned by the really wealthy comes from capital gains (i.e. stocks, bonds, and other investment devices), which is only taxed at 15%.
Um, no, sorry, not quite. The page you reference begins by saying that these may or may not be the fees you pay. Still doesn't answer the man's entirely reasonable question of "How much will my bill be?"
He put his boots up on the table and made a face. "The sig," he smirked. "You can waste your life in search of the sig."
This would be illegal in several jurisdictions. Just hope you never get caught doing that.
a handful of selfish greedy people are no match for millions of selfish, greedy people -u4ya
It's for the benefit of the sellers, rather than the buyers - that way VeryBigCompany can advertise their item at $9.99 across the country, rather than having a series of state/city adverts with the actual price.