Slashdot Mirror
Google Revs Android, FCC Approves First Phone
Cycon writes "Google has announced, 'We're releasing a beta SDK. You can read about the new Android 0.9 SDK beta at the Android Developers' Site, or if you want to get straight to the bits, you can visit the download page.' A new Development Roadmap has also been released to help developers understand the direction the software is taking (as this is still only a Beta release). In addition, the FCC has approved the HTC Dream, and it is believed Google and T-Mobile will launch the phone in the US on November 10, since a confidentiality request attached to the application asks the FCC to keep details secret until that date."
Compare the iPhone's walled garden approach to this:
There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
I wonder if Google will still deny they are working on a phone.
Google is becoming more and more like a christmas tree, the main trunk of which seems to be interconnecting information about all the users they've got in their various services.
Pretty soon they'll know your current location, what you've been searching for all your life, who you've been talking to and what you had for breakfast, as well as the contents of your email and your various documents.
That much information in the hands of one party is asking for trouble, either because they'll have a breach sooner or later (hopefully later) or because they find new 'creative' uses for all that data about you.
MP3 Search Engine
Remember when MSFT was the one promoting openness, as compared to the evil Apple and IBM empires?
I wouldn't be surprised to see a repeat, but with Google in the role of the open system, ala Android. It'll be interesting to watch the clean, sleak and confined iPhone go against the more likely open and flexible Android.
If history is any indication, I think Google wins.
If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
Remember that Apple requested requested a lengthened period from the FCC for the iPhone, but they launched about 3 weeks before that date. A November date for Android doesn't preclude an earlier launch.
Compare the iPhone's walled garden approach to this...:
Anyone can grow a garden at home. Yet still may people seek to attend the carefully cultivated gardens of botanical centers around the globe, and gladly pay to do so...
It's excellent that we all of have a choice of both ways, as neither way is singularly the best for most nor would suit all users. But do not forget the choice you would not make, is a fine and valid choice for someone else.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
All Android needs to succeed is to not be the a**holes Apple is about SDK's and 3rd party apps. Do that and the world will be full of Android users saying to iPhone users: "Can your much more expensive phone to this yet?"
The made a big deal about the big buck$$$ iPhone displaying the I Am Rich jewel. I guess Apple didn't want competition for their own Apple I Buy Things When They're New And Expensive And Still Have Bugs logo on the phone.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
If they know all that, and know where to find it (what I've been searching for all my life) for me, they will then become the biggest success ever.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
What makes people think that the mobile network operators, who have resisted this sort of openness in their handsets before, will embrace it now? Nothing in the Android license requires them to do so.
Apple had to struggle to find a single carrier willing to allow the iPhone. Google showed up with six. You don't get six times as many carriers by promising them less control.
Choice is often overrated. A team of professional interface designers should make the choice for me instead of giving me tons of options to figure out.
Quite right. And with Linux, all you have to do is pick one of the major Linux desktop distributions and you get a consistent and fully integrated desktop with a complete set of desktop applications.
In contrast, most people buying a Mac end up having to fiddle around for hours choosing and installing the applications they need. And many people end up buying and installing one little Macintosh hack after another to work around the limitations and annoyances of the Mac interface.
So, if you want a no-hassles, consistent user interface that just works, go with a major Linux distribution, don't waste your time on the Mac.
You totally missed the point. I wasn't saying that Android's an appstore killer because of homebrew development.
I didn't miss your point. I pointed out, there are many points.
The difference is that the ecosystem of paid, professional developers for Android will be able to do things like:
* Add copy/paste functionality (if missing)
* Develop an unrestricted skype / SIP phone application.
* Develop apps that run in the background.
* Allow applications to be installed without the vendor's approval.
* etc, etc etc.
And all those are great - for some people. But are not needed - for some people.
After all you're already splitting hairs with end users on many points in your bullet list - does an end user care new IM notifications come from an external server? No. Do they really care if they can't get incredibly sucky VOIP over 3G and find WiFi instead to use Skype, those 1% of users that actually will seek out other ways to talk using voice on a PHONE? No. Do end users care what a developer must do to get an application? No, they see the applications before them. And developers can run anything they like on a phone without any restriction whatsoever for just $99.
There are some people that demand all those things, and many people who would consider they have them with an iPhone already, or at least the ones they care about.
The whole copy paste thing is so tired. It was debunked the first day someone used an iPhone. Would it be handy sometimes? Sure. But the device is perfectly usable without it because many data channels where you would normally use cut&paste are wired to funnel data as you desire (like emailing a web page link).
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
What makes people think that the mobile network operators, who have resisted this sort of openness in their handsets before, will embrace it now?
T-Mobile, Cingular, AT&T, and others have allowed unrestricted, fully programmable handsets on their networks for many years.
Apple's iPhone is a huge step backwards in terms of openness. Apple's misrepresentation of the facts is adding insult to injury.
Apple had to struggle to find a single carrier willing to allow the iPhone.
That's because the iPhone is locked down and controlled by Apple. If the iPhone were as open as Palm, Symbian, or Windows Mobile, every major carrier would be shipping it.
I mean, people have been unlocking the iPhone and using it on other carriers. The carriers didn't complain, Apple did.
You realize that there's been several security holes in the iPhone that give the attacker root access?
There will always be ways around security defenses. You can climb over a gate, yet people still install them. Why?
It's because it's foolish to do nothing and invite the worst.
Thankfully of course Android does do something in terms of app sandboxing. So the real question is have they struck the right balance by being more open to start with?
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
You mean other than not having to pay for access to an SDK and such?
The iPhone SDk is free to download. The Jailbreak headers are even freer in a way as you don't need to register for the (again free) ADC account used to access the official SDK.
So as the other poster questioned - what's the difference between an iPhone and an Android device if you have to hack both to do what you want? The iPhone wins for most development at that point since you have a nice compact UNIX system and can use C to develop which hackers generally are more used to than Java.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Although the emotional slashdot crowd will mod me down i have karma to burn so here goes rational arguments:
1. Comparing Android and Linux as successful open source models is not correct. Linux runs on CURRENT hardware. It is NOT an emulator on Windows or Mac OS X. Android does NOT run on current hardware. I have two phones: LG Viewty KU990: Flash driven OS, and a Motorola V3 Razr (not the itunes crap). Can i use the PC-connect cables to flash the current OS on both phones to run Android? NO...Can i dual-boot? NO...
2. Apple's iPhone is current and has millions of customers. Android is virtual==zero customers. Developers want to see their code run on phones, not on emulators. iPhone is present, and to sound the proverb: A bird in hand is worth two in the bush...
3. Does not have support of carriers who fear open source more than Google. Remember that Apple has a kill switch for every iPhone App, so that if the carrier complains Apple can pull the switch. Android is open source and no single kill switch. No carrier would allow random apps to take down their network (even if its not practicable). This is similar to why Linux is not yet mainstream in large organisations.
Yes, you guys can say it is an emulator and mimics calls to the "real" OS of the phone. The last thing a carrier wants is the phone receiver being overridden by some crude game written by a 13-year old who thinks it is "Hot". Corporates just don't think that way.
Android will always remain the esoteric maverick OS for phones which if actually installed on the phone would make your provider disconnect your phone from network.
"Doing what i can, with what i have." ~ Burt Gummer
but when in Europe?
John Bush Obama-McCain.
The whole copy paste thing is so tired. It was debunked the first day someone used an iPhone... the device is perfectly usable without it
Your own usage may not require copy & paste, but many other tasks are tedious and impractical, if not impossible without it.
I have an iPod Touch and it's great for many things, but the lack of copy & paste is the #1 reason the iPhone is (still) not on my radar this time round.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
Google has decided TO BAN ALL NATIVE APPLICATIONS for its Android phones, and only allow Java.
As a crypto developer, this means that my applications, which deal with complex CPU intensive cryptography that are not fully supported by any Java libraries, will never run on Android, even though I can port them to the iPhone, Windows Mobile, PalmOS, etc.
In addition, Android devices are only allowed to have low-resolution QVGA (240x320) resolution displays, which is half the screen resolution of the iPhone HVGA (320x480). Some Microsoft Windows Mobile phone even have full VGA (480x640) or WVGA (480x800) displays. This will also limit the usefulness and functionality of applications running on Android compared those other smart phones.
Did I read that right? Android 1.0 and Android 1.0 devices won't have bluetooth? That seems like kind of a big miss.
I'm using AppTrap (which is free) and Steermouse (which was $20 or so.)
Especially the mouse thing is just wrong. Acceleration settings are perfect for the touchpad, but for an external mouse (which is not Apple's, in my case) it's just annoyingly bad. I could not get used to it. Steermouse made the mouse usable again, nice and snappy but not overly sensitive.
The Open Handset Alliance, a group of more than 30 technology and mobile companies, is developing Android: the first complete, open, and free mobile platform. Member list
Given the list of players (US major carriers, everyone except AT&T, in handset vendors, LG, Motorola, and Samsung, your choices may well come down to Apple/AT&T or something running an Android UI from everyone else for anything above the most basic mobile phones.
The difference between Linux WMs and the Android UI is that it's very possible that your choice about Android may be buy an Android phone or pay several times as much for an iPhone with an AT&T plan. Or Nokia may continue to supprt Symbian. We'll see. All I can say is I hope Android phones don't suck.
IOW, the difference is that Android has much more backing within the specific context of the mobile phone vendor world than Linux does.
Tech Public Policy stuff
The Dream is said to be in compliance with Bluetooth 2.0 + EDR.
Tech Public Policy stuff
I was roaming around electronic shops in Singapore a few months back and I've seen hundredth of Chinese iphone copies. Some of them even added nice features like FM radio and TV tuners on top of an already 3G phone. Some of them look really decent from a physical point of view but in all of them the operating system and interface seemed clumsy and literally rushed out of the door when compared to a UIQ, Windows Mobile or Iphone.
It's not that difficult to put together a physical phone since most chipsets are fully integrated little marvel. Building an operating system and all the applications a user expects takes a while. Polishing them until they shine, ala apple, takes even longer.
Now I am just wondering what will happen, if Google keep its promises, when those manufacturers will get access to the Android system for free. I saw at least 5 or 6 iclones that I would gladly use if the system was decent. It could very well be a revolution.
Not giving one company too much information about me is the reason i don't use gmail (since I am constantly using google for searches).
Apple had to struggle to find a single carrier willing to allow the iPhone. Google showed up with six. You don't get six times as many carriers by promising them less control.
Apple had to struggle because they were asking some 200+$ per handset sold from the carrier, into their pockets. Sorry don't remember the exact figure, but it was here on slashdot a few months ago, so it must be true :-)
So a carrier had to estimate the iphone would mostly attract new customers (rather than customers who would use their services anyways) or it would not be profitable (relative to having the same costumer with another phone).
Come on, if it was your government collecting this information people would be getting extremely concerned. Private companies like Google are far less transparent about what they do and why. And they don't have to be, provided that they give the right assurances.
Mods - you know Google represent a possible, massive privacy issue. All search engines do, but Google goes a lot further. We all hope that they live up to their motto, but the parent post is a worthwhile caution.
I'm not sure why people are so down on Nokia. I purposely bought a Nokia phone this time because mine have always had good reception, customizable menus, and have worked well. (This model finally lets me back up my contacts via USB, too.)
I work in the cell phone industry and carried an HTC Touch for work for a while. It could do a lot more than my Nokia, but it was big and slow and the reception was poor. Too many "smart phones" are lousy at the "phone" part, and mediocre on the "smart."
You've clearly never used Office 2007.
Only three things are certain; death, taxes, and apocryphal quotations - Ben Franklin.
They use *Eclipse*? A dying horrible IDE, originally from IBM that is ugly in installation, configuring and use... and they dumping away the most successful NetBeans, where people are moving in a cluster way to?.. Well, I understand "our local team loves Eclipse at Google", well, but I do not understand still in general... That's pissing off lots of developers. Well, maybe for good.
The only question is: ...WTF?..
As one of the fools who stood in line for an shiny new iphone 3g, I would trade it in for a google phone in a heartbeat for just a few changes.
I don't need sleek and minimalist as features for my phone. I need software! And control!
For example:
Wondering why there are no call recorders for the iphone like there are with Palm, I wrote a couple developers.
One said they can't even get the SDK as there is a huge waiting list just for the honor of being a iphone dev.
The other has the SDK but says that Apple will not allow call recording.
I can't record calls with my children and grandparents because why? Because Apple says so. Jailbroken phones are not much better, as they still can't get the SDK to do what they want it to. (so far...best of luck y'all!)
Sounds like the iphone's biggest problem is Apple and their legal dept. (and their dev crew which is hobbled by management)
I expect the google phone to not have these issues. Google will either break it wide open or it will not be competitive and will fail to thrive.
Privacy concerns? Like the vast majority of us, I tend to value convenience more than privacy, all else equal. We could pay for things via money order I guess, but we all would usually rather pay via credit card and be tracked than suffer the hassle.
I would accept the "minority report" lifestyle if I got the benefits: track where I go in return for valuable location-based services.
Just let me opt-out, and never allow it to be forced on us by the state. Go live in a shack in the woods if you don't like progress.
Devilish details notwithstanding...
The iPhone SDk is free to download.
But it costs roughly $1,000 to run: $600 for a Mac mini, $200 to add RAM, a KVM switch, and other things to make your Mac mini usable, $100 to unlock your iPod Touch or iPhone, and $100 for shipping and taxes.
the (again free) ADC account used to access the official SDK
I tried to register for an ADC account using my personal Apple ID. I got stopped when the form refused to submit because "company" was blank. Was it trying to imply that I have to start a company and apply on its behalf in order to get an ADC account?
The iPhone wins for most development at that point since you have a nice compact UNIX system and can use C to develop which hackers generally are more used to than Java.
Android wins because you can run the JDK on your existing Windows or Linux hardware instead of having to buy a Mac.
You can register as an individual, you don't need to be a company. Although you could just make up a company name if you wanted to.
There is WAY TOO MUCH government involved in our lives. The FCC, EPA, IRS and so on. Its getting to the choking point.
when compared to a UIQ, Windows Mobile or Iphone.
Yeah because I don't have to reboot my windows phone ever. It always works perfectly. Same goes for the Iphone.
But it costs roughly $1,000 to run: $600 for a Mac mini, $200 to add RAM, a KVM switch, and other things to make your Mac mini usable, $100 to unlock your iPod Touch or iPhone, and $100 for shipping and taxes.
I was not aware Google was handing out free systems. Can you please direct me to mine?
After all, there are some people still with no computer at all. They would have to pay just as much to develop for Android.
Honestly, most developers these days have macs anyway (take a look around any technical conference) so to claim it's a vast extra cost most will have to bear is I think a rather silly argument. It's not like you get nothing else out of owning the Mac.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
After all, there are some people still with no computer at all.
I would imagine that there are more people with a PC running Windows or Linux who want to program for a phone than people with no computer at all who want to program for a phone.
They would have to pay just as much to develop for Android.
Even for someone buying a first computer or a replacement for a thoroughly obsolete computer, there are bargain-basement Windows and Linux PCs. There aren't bargain-basement Macs. There's even a $300 Linux/XP PC that looks like a Wii, which might be the direct counterpart to the Mac mini.
Honestly, most developers these days have macs anyway (take a look around any technical conference)
You mean other than WWDC or another Apple-specific con?
I would imagine that there are more people with a PC running Windows or Linux who want to program for a phone than people with no computer at all who want to program for a phone.
But how do you know of that percentage, that most of them do not already have macs?
Even for someone buying a first computer or a replacement for a thoroughly obsolete computer, there are bargain-basement Windows and Linux PCs. There aren't bargain-basement Macs.
Mac Mini. And if you'd ever run Eclipse, you'd realize that your garden variety bargain computer is simply not going to cut the mustard. XCode runs quite well on a Mac mini - I have done so.
You mean other than WWDC or another Apple-specific con?
Java, Rails, PHP, etc. etc. etc. Are you seriously that out of touch? Or do you only attend Microsoft specific conferences?
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley