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Programming Jobs Abroad For a US Citizen?
An anonymous reader writes "I am a American citizen with a masters in Computer Science from a 3rd tier college and 4 years of work experience under my belt. I would like to work somewhere abroad in Europe for a couple years before I get too settled in life but have no clue where to start. I only speak English but would love to learn a second language. What sort of opportunities are there for American citizens to work abroad? What countries offer the best opportunity to balance a challenging work environment with enough vacation to explore the rest of Europe in my free time? Any hassles I should know about?"
code writes you... ?
Many foreigners come to the United States for the reasons you have listed here.
I was not aware US colleges had some sort of official tier. Who defines these tiers? What are the criteria?
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
"I am a American citizen "
Are you sure you speak English?
I live in Canada, but I'm being sponsored to work in the US, so I will more than likely be working on the US side in the next month or 2.
However, if you wish to work in Canada or the UK, you can try these job boards.
http://www.jobshark.ca/caeng/index.cfm
http://www.jobserve.com/
Now as for balancing pleasure with business, gee, I could always make a joke about working in a country where the "siesta" is mandatory :P but the truth is, I don't know. All I know is that in Canada, you could always challenge yourself to learn French. For me, being bilingual it obviously works well. But the truth is, if you had to learn a new language, I would suspect the following languages would be beneficial: spanish, mandarin, japanese, russian, german.
I think that you will be delighted to find that many EU companies have adopted English as their work language. This is especially true in Switzerland and Germany. Of course the UK, Ireland and (I know it isn't in Europe) Australia are good picks, too. Germany or Switzerland would afford you the chance to pick up another language, which is a really wonderful experience (I studied Russian for years, worked in Germany so learned some German, and worked in Geneva so ended up with a little bit of French too -- it is life changing). You can find web sites with jobs listed, monster.de for example...but in the local language so you might need to bablefish the sites. Last but not least, US-based international companies are a great route to doing this (this is the path I took). Search for the HR pages on web sites of major international corporations and you are sure to find job listings around the world. Apply and be sure your cover letter expresses your excitement about overseas work. Best of luck! Rick.
You mean "they're" and "there".
I see what you did they're.
Stop bringing the fucking election into everything! Just stop it!
For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
Actually most countries, even the strictest on immigration, have work visa programs specifically for skilled positions that are difficult to fill locally. In Switzerland, for example (a notoriously tough place to get the right to stay permanently), you can get a Permis-B to work for 18 months with very little hassle at all, with the sponsorship of your employer, as long as you have skills. MS in Computer Science from a US University makes this a perfectly simple matter of paperwork and about $3000 in legal expenses (that the company will pay).
If by "productive members of society" you mean "parasite MBAs," then please, by all means, they're welcome to get the hell out. Let them go wreck some other country's economy for a while.
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
... except my primary concern was learning the language, and then finding work. Specifically, I wanted to live in Japan, so I ended up going to a language school full time there for a year and a half, and then after that finding work. If your primary concern is just living and working abroad, and language secondary, I would think that would be possible in many places in Europe. If language is important to you though, I would strongly recommend that you first study the language in the country you've chosen, and then find work. This is because 1. It's much easier to study when you don't have to work at the same time. 2. It will make you a more attractive hire. 3. Since you'll have put significant effort into learning the language (as opposed to just doing it in your free time while working), it will become a skill that will stay with you and that you can draw upon in the future.
So that didn't really answer the questions you were asking, but I thought it was something that was important to address....
I submit to you that with your programming skills, you could gain valuable experience imparting knowledge and working in the developing world. One thing I'd like to advise you on, is to have a very open mind in case you decide to go to Africa. Africa is not what CNN, ABC, CBS and FOX show the American public. It's much more lively and socially better than USA in some cases.
I was in for a shock when on my very first visit to Africa, I met a country (Uganda) with pretty modest infrastructure compared to what I had in mind. I had to get used to the food though. I met Americans who decided years ago to call Africa home.
There are tonnes of dollars from the American government going to Africa through agencies like CARE, USAID, Americares, UNICEFUSA and many others.
So be open and brave man and consider Africa.
France just loves Americans who only speak English. Maybe you can find something there.
And get some of that sweet in-sourced work from the US.
I suspect it's largely because of the World Wars that the US currently has such a bad odor in Europe. Europeans know very well what happens when a large, prosperous country with a strong military starts thinking it has a natural right to dominate the world.
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
None whatsoever, as a general rule. All countries (and EU) protect their labor market and do not allow foreigners to just come and work.
You do need to get a job offer and get the paperwork done ahead of time, but there are no significant problems for high-tech workers to get work permits in European nations: the process is generally quick and pretty painless.
Obama doesn't have a fucking prayer.
What is a "fucking prayer"? A prayer that gets you laid?
Something like Geekcorp would be a great place to look for opportunities.
Well as a person who now lives and works abroad I can say it something that everyone should do.
It has many benefits. Least of which is cash.
First off and most importantly it opens your eyes to the greater culture of the planet. Being someone from the "new" world this is even more important. As North America suffers from a homoginised culture. Less so Canada.
Secondly the experience both for work and personal. Work wise your experience in different cultures working can only help you back at home. Secondly the experience you gain personally will enhance your life and alter your life priorities.
Now for the tough part the how too.
First off do your research in an area you wish to live. What is the cost of living etc. Secondly start to look at the job market in the region. Google will be your friend here.
For example: Rent in Sydney Aus in the city runs you about $400-$600au a week. That's about $350-$500us. Which for most american's is gigantic cash.
At this time several markets are suffering from a downturn in IT. So be careful. This is a particularily sensitive time for employment. Many regions of the world have laws that prefer citizens over foreign people. Others require lengthy and costly Visa and certification procedures. Also some countries foreign workers are not governed by labor laws no matter what they do. So you may not have the protections the locals do. So again this is a point of research.
If you are going to a non English speaking country. Make sure you have someone translate you CV/resume before you go. And then again when you get there. Make sure they understand the subject matter in the CV/resume. Otherwise you may end up looking like a professional gopher cage cleaner.
Some countries have issues with American's. So be careful. For example a job in Egypt for an American could have personal safety issues. ( I picked a country and random. )
Moving countries is hard work but well worth it. I have been doing it for almost 20 years. So don't be afraid. If your mind is set on it, you can do it.
I could ramble on for hours. But I'll leave it at this.
incorrect with "they're" and correct with "there"
"they are probably are not as many opportunities"
not so much
"there probably are not as many opportunities"
better
If you want to work in Europe, speaking English with an opportunity to learn another language, your options are the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Sweden & Norway & Nokia (oops, I mean Finland)
All of these countries have high tech sectors that their own populations can't sustain & import foreign workers (from all over the place) who use English as a working lingua fraca.
All the countries I listed above allow working Holiday visas for 1-2 years for many western countries (not sure about the US, sorry) for workers under the age of 31.
If you can't get such a visa, consider the same countries, but apply for jobs online, making it clear that you need a visa / sponsorship / whatever.
Good luck!
There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
" What sort of opportunities are there for American citizens to work abroad?"
Lots of opportunities with this outfit:
[URL]http://www.marines.com/page/usmc.jsp[/URL]
"Any hassles I should know about?"
Nothing we can't train you for son.
On a more serious note, if you are under 29 there is a class of working VISA available in many countries that allows you to work there for up to 12 months with few restrictions.
There are very strong English language masters programs available in engineering schools and universities in Sweden and Finland (also this one), and presumably the rest of Scandinavia as well.
You haven't lived till you've biked over a frozen lake or read a book in perfect daylight at 2AM. Some schools have industries right next to campus to tap the student labor force and nearly all the universities have ample jobs for masters students right there on campus. This is also the perfect choice to allow you to maximize your vacation opportunities - Cheap student rates and lengthy school breaks. A university is also the ideal environment in which to study the language, both in a formal setting and with the students that are much more used to dealing with foreigners on a daily basis than the rest of the population.
That said, there's plenty of sysadmin jobs abroad under the employ of the US government, if you're willing to give up on coding at work for a while. See usajobs.gov and careers.state.gov. Simplifies dealing with visas and such.
And how does one submit these "fucking prayers"?
Without knowing too much details about the alternatives it seems to me that Sweden would fit your bill nicely for the following reasons:
* Large IT-sector which regularly accepts English-speaking foreign labor in their workforce with no demands for knowing any Swedish.
* English is the second language and is spoken more or less fluently among most of the population (especially the younger one), more so than in Germany, France or Finland.
* Safe, generally non-violent place with all kinds of security nets if things would go wrong, like (almost) free hospitals.
* 25 days of vacation per year guaranteed by law. Most people have 4 weeks of continuous vacation during the summer which is a great time to travel around the rest of Europe.
Only thing speaking against Sweden as far as I can see is that it might not be exotic enough for your taste since it both culturally and geographically is quite close to your neighbor in north, Canada.
Yes, obama will force upper middle class workers to flee from America to Europe, to enjoy their world renowned reputation for low taxes and small governments.
I've been wondering exactly the same thing as yourself, and here are some of the conclusions I've come to.
First of all, language. I would guess that the other employees at almost any job you would want would speak English, so that's not a problem. However, it would be nice to speak with the locals, too. Here's a measure of English ability. The summary is that the best English speaking countries are UK, Ireland, Holland, Denmark, and Sweden. I'll add Germany to the list because I've known several people who've gone there and said they had no problems. English is ok in tourist destinations anywhere. For example, you don't need to know French to live in Paris, but the rest of France would be tough. Of course, being an American, learning Spanish would be very helpful, so you might want to put Spain on your list, just to force yourself to improve, but English/non-Spanish speakers I know said Spain was difficult.
Second, actually getting a job can be difficult. I have been looking around to see if I could maybe get a job somewhere like Sweden (where most of my ancestors were from), but it looks like the Northern European countries have very strict labor laws for other Europeans, and so it's even harder for a non-European to get a job and a visa. It's much easier for them to come here, than us to go there, unfortunately, even though a skilled worker can make more here. However, as I understand, most countries are quite open to educational opportunities. There are probably quite a few programs that are affiliated with your school. For example, studying abroad and postdocs are probably the most common. You might consider Fulbright scholarships. Here's a list of contacts that someone at my school told me about:
***
BUNAC (British Universities North American Club) up to 6 months work visa in the UK, and varying times for work in Australia, New Zealand, and Ireland http://www.bunac.com/ Note that the 4 month Irish work visa and 6 month UK work visa can be combined for 10 months split between the two countries.
CIEE (Center for International Educational Exchange) a number of countries and length of work visa varies: http://www.ciee.org/
Alliance Abroad has a number of internship, teaching and volunteer opportunities abroad http://www.allianceabroad.com/
Spend a Year In New Zealand http://www.immigration.govt.nz/ or go to http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/stream/work/workingholiday/workopportunities/ for working holiday information.
For summer up to year long technical placements IAESTE is the best (and I believe the only) group that arranges such opportunities for students or graduating seniors. Go to http://www.iaeste.org/
***
As far as getting a job goes, think about who you might work for. If it's a multinational company (the most likely people to hire you), ask yourself why they'd hire you to work in a more expensive country, with more labor restrictions, when they can hire a local with probably roughly equivalent skills. Some of the things I've been reading say that this route can be done, but to do it, you'd join a multinational company here in the US, and after a couple years request a transfer. One obvious possibility, as an American, is to go as an employee of the Government (e.g. the Foreign Service).
You might also consider broadening your scope a bit to include other English speaking countries -- you'd probably do ok in most Commonwealth countries (e.g. Australia, New Zealand, South Africa)... I've seen lots of ads about working in New Zealand.
In summary.... it's really hard, unless you can do it via academia
Most people in Belgium, and especially in Brussels, speak English quite well. And due to the language issues with the 2 Belgians communities (Walloon/French and Flemish), they end up speaking English together if one doesn't speak the other's language. A lot of nationalities are working in Brussels, we have a lot of agencies from the European Union and a lot of US companies have a local office in Brussels. Google for "expat brussels" will give you a lot of links for specialised websites. And don't forget beers and chocolate! ;-)
Continuing the outside-Europe-theme, Australia and New Zealand could be worth considering. New Zealand has the lowest unemployment in the OECD and is there's plenty of demand for IT people. In Australia the demand is even greater. Tax is roughly on a par with the UK (maybe slightly better in Australia, slightly worse in NZ).
You could also try asking US firms - particularly in the finance sector big US financials will tend to have EMEA (London, Paris, Frankfurt, etc) and APAC (Sydney, Melbourne, Auckland - plus Tokyo, Singapore, etc) offices, with significant regional IT needs. Speak to someone locally about work globally, and you'll have good contacts when/if you return to the US.
This is where the serious fun begins.
Given your experience and educational background, companies like Infosys, Wipro and hundreds of other IT companies in Bangalore/Hyderabad would be easy to get into. Moreover, since you're a US citizen, you may not face problems in getting a work visa in Europe. And most of these big IT services companies send engineers on long-term assignments to US, Europe. Having said that, if Europe is your priority, get it in black-and-white at the time of joining.
As an aside, if I were you, I would love to have some India experience under my belt--from a long term career growth perspective. Sooner or later, you will end up partnering with Bangalore folks for your IT projects. Many US companies are realizing that and getting mid/senior management to spend time in India (for software operations) and China (for hardware/manufacturing operations) to know the culture, processes, etc.
To where?
Almost any other place in the world have higher taxes than the US, so unless the taxes goes over 50% in total you can forget that argument.
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
According to my German wife, there is a fair amount of opportunity in Germany (she cited Berlin specifically). Well, that was a couple years ago. But, it's still worth checking out.
Also, apparently you can get by fairly well with English only in the larger cities. So, that should help you acclimate.
You also might want to consider other English speaking countries such as New Zealand. Wikipedia actually has a list of countries that have English as an official language. So, you might want to check that out.
As a last note, I'd shy away from the UK as the violence there is getting bad enough that there are reports of people leaving because of it. Not to mention all the Orwellian BS.
Hope that helps. Good luck.
Anyway, whichever country you choose, I wish you a great time!
:-).
ps. for anyone that goes to Holland for a longer time, you might want to read The Undutchables to prevent any culture shock
This may not be a bad idea actually. Salaries in India can actually be pretty high, up to 2/3rds of what US workers are making. India is not the bargain it once was for outsourcing. If you can find a good job there in a specific area of technical expertise or in a leadership role for a US organization you can do well. And in India, my understanding is that tech workers speak English on the job as it is considered the language of business.
It's also a pretty foreigner-friendly environment so the transition when moving is very easy to handle.
Nah... Just expect the usual irony over the cup of coffee in the morning along with the usual jokes about American coffee...
Unless you want to work in countries that has been battered by the US recently like Serbia the worst thing you probably have to stand are comments about the US in general.
If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
It's easy to practice Dutch. Just ride your bicycle into the countryside and get lost. I guarantee that the person of whom you ask directions will not speak English. Or French. Or German. Not only that, although they will understand your Dutch, you won't be able to understand the response because it will be in some non-standard dialect. :)
A buddy who went outside the US to an unnamed country (not in Europe) found that he was getting much lower pay for a standard Java developer job there. Plus, he noticed that places he was interviewing at, people were coming in to work rather formally dressed. He also noticed that most people would be very friendly, but wouldn't really socialize after work, and things 'died down' very quickly during the week. Of course, that is just one data point, but basically points to checking out all aspects of 'life', outside of just your day-to-day job. One of the easier transitions to make will be to join a company with offices in the US and elsewhere, and then transfer within that company to another country. Once grounded, you can choose to stay, return, or move. If you are willing to chuck up your job, you will probably have the most luck if you can actually go to the country you want to be in and meet face-to-face with companies. That, of course, is rather difficult, unless you have a support network. And paperwork. Bon Voyage! There is so much you can learn by immersing yourself in a different culture!
Come to India... Urban India speaks English with varying levels of competence. and being a white person will draw excellent salaries as well (I'm serious). Though it will not be in the 100K range. But then cost of living is much cheaper in most parts...
If it were a dictatorship then maybe you'd be right, but the American voters put Bush in charge. Or at least the ~25% of them that voted for him and ~50% that didn't bother to vote at all put him in charge. And subsequently that 75% is definitely culpable for everything that America has done in the past 8 years.
Last time I checked they had at least the rule of law, unlike some, err, other countries.
First of all, Europe used to love America.
I grew up in the 90s. People over here had "America" stickers on their skateboards, wore baseball caps from US teams, had 49ers jackets, listened to Michael Jackson and every kid wanted to grow up to be like Chuck Norris. People actually bought US cars, and most sports gear was from US brands.
A lot of people spent their holidays in the US, and many planned to move there after finishing school. Having friends in the US automatically made you the cool kid.
Second, Europe doesn't hate America now; certainly not as much as the Americans seem to hate the French.
We obviously don't love the United States as much as we used to, but most Europeans are perfectly capable of distinguishing between a government and the people. We realize that a lot of Americans are unhappy with what their government is doing. We realize that you suffer more from your government's actions than we do (it doesn't exactly hurt us if your government takes away your freedoms). Our American Style Pizza is still called American Style Pizza and was never renamed to Freedom Pizza or something like this.
You are very welcome over here. There's no animosity.
As for the article's original question, programmers are always sought after in Europe. I know a few Americans how have moved over here (ironically, the opposite of what I thought would happen even a decade ago), and they seem to be happy with their choice (although sadly, they could not come with us when we went on holidays in Cuba - what the hell is up with that???).
Typical European who has no idea how the US government works. George Bush is only one part. Learn the facts then come back to a US based website to debate.
Typical American, validates every preconceptions Europeans have of you with three poorly written sentences :-)
Seriously though, there's really no question that not re-electing Bush would have stopped some of the madness.
Before 9/11 Europeans just called us "fat and ugly", now they can call us "warmongerer's". Which is Ironic considering that the worse humanitarian disaster in the history of humanity was caused exclusively by Europeans (WWI and WWII).
While there is truth in that, I also think that is quite a statement coming from an Anonymous Coward from the only country on earth who ever used the atomic bomb. Twice. On civilian targets. WWII was dirty beyond imagination from both sides - and that includes the USA.
I guess I can shed some light on the situation in Switzerland.
There are four spoken languages here: German, Italian, French and Romanic. Typically, reasonably large companies in Switzerland have offices in at least two language areas, typically German and French or German and Italian. While the Swiss have their own version of German (which Germans don't understand when they first hear it), they will usually use the official version when talking to non-Swiss. So you can easily learn German, French and Italian in Switzerland.
All working-age Swiss speak English. There are some older people who may never have learned English, but you can easily get by even if you only know English.
I have a few American friends who live and work in Switzerland (Google has an office here, so there's tons of American Google programmers over here :-), and they seem to love it, so I guess I would recommend Switzerland. Also, we're always hiring good programmers :-)
When looking for programming jobs, I would start out in Zurich; there's a lot of software companies in Zurich.
I think admin.ch should have information on how to apply for jobs and such.
"Every single American living there hates the country with a passion and is counting the days until they can leave again."
That's ok: Many people in the Netherlands hate the US for booking foreigners like criminals at the border, the human rights situation (worse than China), the way politicians are openly bought and sold (with political power via campaign contributions) and most of all their hubris.
Then again, a humble person who is willing to learn our culture is likely to find this a pleasant country where nothing is hidden from you -- our national curse seems to be that we're too blunt.
No it would not have.
Yes it would have!
See, that's not a particularly useful response, now is it?
I hate Bush as much as the next guy but to blame everything on him shows how inept you are when it comes to the US government and how it functions.
Again with the ad hominems; I thought we were over that. I realize how the US government works. The president is basically the head of the executive branch of the US government, and he's the boss of the US army.
You know, we do get US news stations and papers and even Internets over here. We're also interested in these things. In fact, I would bet that many Europeans are better informed about how your government works than Americans are.
Let me finish by saying that I do not "blame everything on him." I specifically said that not re-electing him "would have stopped some of the madness." Emphasis on "some."
To where?
Almost any other place in the world have higher taxes than the US, so unless the taxes goes over 50% in total you can forget that argument.
Singapore is a good option, as long as you don't mind living in a big, mildly fascist industrial park.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
I think you're half right and half wrong. Speaking as one of probably only a handful of English speaking foreigners who holds down an IT job in Japan outside of Tokyo, it's a tough place to get into. A lot of people who claim the Japanese are hard on foreigners have a huge chip on their shoulder and far too often mistake legitimate job rejection for racism. Put yourself in a Japanese employer's shoes - you're interviewing 5 candidates, 4 of whom are native Japanese speakers and 1 who can barely string together a basic conversation. Who is going to be the easier to work with. Given that the interview process is often more about finding reasons to reject than reasons to employ (in any culture), it's a no brainer that the foreigner is going to have a very tough time unless they've studied the language to a pretty high level.
That said, in my experience if there are jobs that do benefit from having a foreigner in the position (which sadly are very very few), companies will often bend over backwards to assist you overcome the language barrier, which the Japanese themselves recognize as a huge problem.
If you're willing to put up with the unbearable heat and stifling humidity of Tokyo or perhaps Osaka, there are opportunities there with both Japanese and foreign firms. I personally know an IT recruiter/headhunter there who specializes in foreign recruits, and he must have opportunities because he keeps hitting me up with questions about whether I'm looking for anything.
Videogames are an extremely unlikely route in though. Visit any web forum relating to employment in Japan and you'll see a queue a mile long of foreigners wanting to find out how to get into either a) manga art or b) videogames programming in Japan. And this doesn't even touch on the fact that a large number of Japanese kids grow up wanting to to do the same, so it's a fiercely difficult industry to get into even for homegrown talent.
Just as an aside, I will pick you up on one point. Contrary to popular belief, most developed countries have more or less caught up with Japan now cellphone wise. It's true that in the past Japan was well ahead of everything else, but more recently the handsets that are coming out, particularly in Europe, have pretty similar feature sets to what's available over here.
While you are living in this fictional world where Republicans are "fiscal conservatives", and Democrats "tax and spend", I think I'll take a look at real evidence to the contrary.
Bah! I'm a slider and I thought I finally found my way home, but I guess this really isn't my Earth.
I should have known. The black guy running for President and the little MILF hottie running for VP should've given it away. We only run old white men vs. older white men.
By the way, you guys didn't elect Dean, right? Holy shit, was that a f*ck-up, I can't even begin to tell you. I'm sure you guys had it better these past few years than we did. You found the WMD stash in that little bunker, right?
'a';DROP TABLE users; SELECT * FROM DATA WHERE name LIKE '%'... if you're reading this, it didn't work.
But, if I was the one going to another country, I'd want to speak the language first, if only to not promote a few choice stereotypes about Americans... (I speak Spanish more or less fluently, and I know enough Japanese to find the bathroom. Maybe.)
Hmmm... India is like Europe. Except for a few northern states, every state has it's own language. (Indian currency carries 17 languages. :) ) How many can/will you learn :)
Hello original submitter - I have no idea if you'll read this or not, since it's probably destined to be buried right at the bottom of your view, well below MANY pointless discussions about things completely offtopic.
The company I work for, in Germany, is currently looking for a programmer type working closely with me (also a programmer). The job is about 25% actual coding, 50% helping other programmers with our own specific API and 25% other stuff (including various kinds of planning meetings, lots of travel around Europe and occasional travel outside of Europe (Japan being the most common, but US from time to time also)).
We're looking for someone with good C# knowledge, since that's what our API is based around, however strong Java and web-based skills is also a very big plus for something else we'll be doing quite soon.
I've actually already passed on one slashdotter's resume (a guy from Chicago) to my boss, and we have NO problem looking outside of Germany (we're required to look within Germany first, but the response has been less than stellar so far, so once we've finished looking inside Germany, we'll open it up to anyone, anywhere). I myself also do not come from Europe originally, so I myself am pretty good evidence we'll hire from anywhere if we need to. English is the defacto standard language for business in our company since we're the European HQ of a large multi-national. German is good to learn for "day to day life" here, but it's definitely not required for work.
If you're interested, please send me an email - my slashdot username minus the last 3 characters at Google's mail provider.
(if the other slashdotter who I have already talked to about this job reads this - don't worry, we haven't forgotten you or thrown away your resume - you're still in the running as well)
My book about LSD and Self-Discovery
Also on facebook as: DroppingAcidDaleBewan
Heavily accented english should suffice?
- Raynet --> .
Come to Slovakia, we love Americans to come here. We have a nice Hostel for you to stay in too.
Australian running a company that does C# / C++ / Java / SQL / Python / Mathematica
I believe your biggest issue (except perhaps legal hoops to jump through) is the language.
One obvious choice would be UK or Ireland, where everybody speaks english already.
I live in Denmark, a small ( 6 million citizen) country with our own language. HOWEVER all north American exchange students I met on my graduate studies where impressed with the general level of English in Denmark. According to them it is a non-issue. I strongly suspect it will be the same in Sweden/Norway - at least in the urban areas.
I have also a big faith in the English skills of the Dutch, as I have traveled there multiple times and yet to meet any problems with not speaking the language.
Southern Europe (France, Italy, Span etc.) is a whole different situation, I was recently on week in Spain and was amazed by the lack of English. Almost nobody I meet outside the (IT-)conference spoke English in any usable degree. I have had the same trouble in Belgium (even in the capital) so I believe any French speaking countries might also be difficult.
I have no real idea of knowing how well the german-speaking countries speak English, as I am also fluent in German. I would believe that especially the German parts of Switzerland would be fine too.
To sum up, I believe any smaller western/north-western European country would be suitable. Watch out for the bigger ones as they are probably solely focused on their own language.
New Zealand has the lowest unemployment in the OECD...
New Zealand unemployment rate: 3.4%
Iceland unemployment rate: ~1%.
There's a couple of hundred thousand Americans working there, and new vacancies being created every week.
Quidquid Latine dictum sit, altum videtur (anything said in Latin sounds important)
DO COME! I repeat: DO COME TO WORK IN EU!
Sure, the wages here are less than in the USA but do not only consider that part, I mean what's the use of money? To have a good life would be my answer. You can have a good life in Europe not having a USA salary... And also, you can learn a lot from Europe (don't get me wrong, this is not a pride-statement: I meant "from Europe as well as from any part of the world: no less no more but still a lot to learn from"). Your wish to travel in Europe, to visit the countries is a very good idea IMHO: it can only open your mind. I'd also suggest not to stop there (and i hope and think you won't: when you start traveling, it gets in your blood and you can't stop it!)
Here are a few other hints...
First of all, you won't have trouble in finding a computer-science job in Europe (as in many parts of the world), I "searched" a job in France and Spain (searching meaning putting my resume in monster and infojobs and waiting for offers) and had no problems in finding one. With an American masters in computer-science and 4 years of experience... just pick a job.
Now, if you want to visit all Europe you won't have any problem: there are a lot of low-cost airlines (ryanair is the most famous but there are dozens of other companies), there are train-tickets valid in all Europe (EuRail: http://www.eurail.com/). That's quite cheap (I come back from a 2-weeks journey over Europe that cost me around $1000...). As for the vacations, I think Europeans countries generally have a minimum vacation days greater than US (> 5 weeks in France, 4 weeks in Spain, ...). You'll be able to travel!
The language might be a problem in some countries. In Spain and France at least, not many people speak English (I'm not speaking of the job environment but of the daily-life) but well... I know American people here in Madrid that didn't know Spanish at all when coming here and they live fine. Moreover if you want to learn the language of the country you're leaving in that's better! If you want to speak English in the street, I'd suggest you go to Germany, Netherlands and northern countries. If you want to learn a language you can use after your Europe experience (if you don't chose to stay :-)), Spanish would be an obvious great choice... As for the wages/price of life, generally the northern you get, the bigger the figures are.
There, fixed that for posterity.
http://www.colorado.edu/AmStudies/lewis/2010/atomicdec.htm
As for the questioner, you're welcome, just remember the World Domination(tm) patent has expired.
(NL)
btw, most likely, your investments are worth MORE today than they were 7 years ago
7 years ago, I was a college student. I had no investments.
your house is worth almost 2x as much as it was in 2000
Didn't have a house then, either. I bought my house during the time before the bubble burst, where house prices were skyrocketing because banks were giving sub-prime loans to people who had no hope of being able to pay the loan off without foreclosing. As I'm sure you know, the increase in demand caused a huge run-up in housing prices
recent economic troubles (and consequently blame the bush administration) but I haven't seen either a link between Bush policies
The Republicans are largely anti-regulation, and while they could have regulated the sub-prime mortgage industry during the period where they controlled most of the federal government, they chose not to. They were responsible for the lack of regulatory oversight of the trading of sub-prime mortgage-backed securities. Had there been proper government regulation in place, we would have at least mitigated, if not entirely avoided the sub-prime mortgage crisis that has been a driving force for our economic downturn.
ZuluPad, the wiki notepad on crack
Almost any other place in the world have higher taxes than the US
Only if you use Bush/Neocon/GOP math. That is, if you only consider taxes a negative and do not weigh the value of what is received in return, then the US looks like a good deal.
If you develop a major illness, you will not necessarily think that it is such a good deal.
(If you would prefer not to have millions of people killed in your name, you may also not consider it such a good deal, but that's a separate conversation.)
"Not an actor, but he plays one on TV."
I lived and worked in Europe for a year, and then Australia for 7 years and it was the best time of my life. I even started our family overseas.
In a customer service/professional service type job, we had plenty of opportunity to travel all over, some places job related, and some not. London was a great jumping off point to the rest of Europe.
Things to be aware of:
When your return with a wealth of international experience, be prepared to deal with ignorant dweebs in HR departments who discount the value of that experience. You might also notice that your friends are now directors or VP's in companies and you're not.
I ended up starting my own consulting business. Some years are great, and others not but I wouldn't trade my world travel experience for anything.
Finally, save, save save. You'll need a stack of cash when you return. We returned with no house, no car, no job, family of four. So what did we do? We started two companies. I'd say 150K-200K to buy a house, a car or two, and start your own consulting business and subsidize living expenses for the first year.
For those who are still in college: Take a year between Junior and Senior and travel to find yourself. You'll be a better person and learn to appreciate what a great Land of Unlimited Opportunity the USA is (words from a German friend of mine).
Flame bait: With nearly 10 years of total world travel experience, I'm convinced that some parts of the world only hate us because they want to be us (or have what we have worked hard for) and they can't or won't for whatever reason. Help Keep America Beautiful.
I'm a U.S. citizen working in Canada right now. Canada and the U.S. have a tax treaty to recognize taxes taken out of wages in the other country. The U.S. tries to tax all of its citizens' income regardless of source, so if the country you work in does not have such a treaty you will end up being taxed by both countries. Even for Canada, it turns out the treaty doesn't cover certain things like investment income, so that could be double-taxed. Be sure to speak with a qualified tax attorney so you can avoid any pitfalls like this.
Thanks - the stats I were looking at lumped all/most of Europe together on 6.9%.
Incidentally, a more recent figure is 3.8% for NZ - and Denmark, the Netherlands and (South?) Korea [1] all beat NZ (and presumably Iceland too). I believe NZ has been more affected by the current economic crisis that many other OECD countries, as it's very reliant on trade and tourism. Not sure how this affects IT (as I'm not currently job-hunting) but I'd guess that businesses may be scaling back recruitment.
[1] North Korea isn't an OECD member, and I'd imagine that the unemployment rate in North Korea is in negative figures and everyone is gloriously happy in their jobs ;-)
This is where the serious fun begins.
I agree that WWII was general not a model case of avoiding noncombatant casualties, but I will point out a few facts:
1. When the USAAC and RAF firebombed Dresden, they caused more casualties than in both Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
2. The Japanese used WMDs (as currently defined as Nuclear, Biological, and Chemical weapons) first; estimates of casualties from their attacks on Chinese cities using plague are in the 50k to 100k range.
3. The U.S. previously avoided using WMD on Iwo Jima, which it was not necessary to cancel (the Navy's plans to gas it and bypass were vetoed by the President).
4. Invading Japan would've made Iraq (and Iran) look like a picnic; estimated U.S. casualties to establish an initial beachhead on the Home Islands were in excess of a quarter million; Japanese civilian and military casualty figures were estimated at several times higher. The persistent effects of nuclear weapons were not well understood for decades after - the U.S. was still doing "training exercises" with troops in close proximity to nuclear weapons into the 1960s.
So yes, the U.S. is only nation to use nuclear weapons in combat, but the use in WWII is still "permissible" under current U.S. and international (including French) WMD policy (which considers all NBC weapons to be equal, as we "official" don't have any of those).
Just my $0.02.
P.S.: Yes, I'm going to vote for Obama.