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Every Satellite Tracked In Realtime Via Google Earth

Matt Amato writes "With the recent discussion of the ISS having to dodge some space junk, many people's attention has once again focused on the amount of stuff in orbit around our planet. What many people don't know is that USSTRATCOM tracks and publishes a list of over 13,000 objects that they currently monitor, including active/retired satellites and debris. This data is meaningless to most people, but thanks to Analytical Graphics, it has now been made accessible free of charge to anyone with a copy of Google Earth. By grabbing the KMZ, you can not only view all objects tracked in real-time, but you can also click on them to get more information on the specific satellite, including viewing its orbit trajectory. It's an excellent educational tool for the space-curious. Disclaimer: I not only work for Analytical Graphics, but I'm the one that wrote this tool as a demo."

196 comments

  1. Confused by MyLongNickName · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The title says "every", the summary says 13,000 objects. Is this really complete, or are there objects that are not tracked (or at least not disclosed)?

    --
    See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
    1. Re:Confused by Rob+T+Firefly · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I would think it highly likely that there are certain objects in space that the United States Strategic Command would prefer not to talk about.

    2. Re:Confused by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 4, Informative

      That doesn't mean that a lot of them are not easily tracked even by amateur astronomers. It is tricky to make something that can see you, but you not be able to see it.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    3. Re:Confused by hoofinasia · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Of course, whenever the seller / developer presents software, the language gets a tad stronger. "Every" might not be "all."

      However, given the recent interest in commercialized space travel / exploration, it would be in the USStratCom (US Strategic Command)'s best interest to keep X-Prize's rockets off their damn satellites. So I'm guessing the list is pretty comprehensive.

    4. Re:Confused by AndrewNeo · · Score: 5, Funny

      Paint it black?

    5. Re:Confused by Vectronic · · Score: 1

      Says the guy who has thousands of people reading his comment, and only sees the ones who comment on it.

    6. Re:Confused by oneiros27 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Besides the conspiracy side of things, there are number of objects that are just simply too small to track. So when satellites have been shot down, or an astronaut drops a bolt, it's out there, but it might not be tracked. The last number I heard was 110k objects over 1cm ... and that number's 8 years old.

      --
      Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
    7. Re:Confused by Gordonjcp · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Every military satellite launched, not just by the US but by *anyone* can be tracked. Even gpredict has keps for US military stuff. You can track it, you can often see it with the naked eye, and you certainly can receive signals from them. Decoding the signals is harder, but with fairly modest equipment you can certainly hear that they are there.

    8. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think it is necessarily that tricky. The key is minimizing the reflection of sunlight. Theoretically you could make a 'stealth' spacecraft if you were able to develop extremely non-reflective surface coverings. I'm not sure how useful this would be since this method wouldn't necessarily stop you from seeing the satellites by radar. Much of the current stealth technology would be useless on these satellites because they are high enough up that scattered radio waves would be picked up by some station. You would have to make a radar absorbing covering to the level that even radar telescopes couldn't detect (you know, the same telescopes that are able to use radio waves to map Ceres and Venus with a 1/r^4 loss in intensity). The best thing you can do to make a stealth satellite is to give it a lot of rocket fuel to make plane changes.

    9. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Nothing is 100% black, so it would still be visible. Besides, it would become too hot.

    10. Re:Confused by Lincolnshire+Poacher · · Score: 1

      There are many objects omitted by the released elements. You may recall a spat in August 2007 wherein the French authorities threatened to release elements for what were assumed to be classified US assets.

      Also the StratCom elements are subject to an end-user license that prohibits dissemination of the data or any analysis based thereupon. Many amateur observers therefore refrain from using the elements:

      http://www.space-track.org/perl/user_agreement.pl

      Ted Molczan and the guys on the SeeSat list do an amazing job of tracking these sats.

    11. Re:Confused by v1 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      they're usually given away by the glint of sun off their solar panels. you can find information on most of the "secret" satellites with google, they've pretty much all been located by the amateur astronomy community. Some even have pictures of them. Probably really gets some NSA types blood boiling.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    12. Re:Confused by tumbleweedsi · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Alas any material designed to absorb radiation would absorb too much energy and probably be damaged. It would also be detectable because it would be a 'hole in space' or a region of space with a sharp dip in background electromagnetic radiation.

      --
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    13. Re:Confused by kohaku · · Score: 1

      Well when they /do/ paint it black, and it's still detectable, I imagine their train of thought will go something like this:
      It's like, how much more black could this be? and the answer is none. None more black.

    14. Re:Confused by zappepcs · · Score: 1

      In the tech industry (marketing aside) terminology is very important. In this case (I'm guessing) it is possible that since he wrote the utility, ALL might mean ALL that he can get data for. This is technically correct, if slightly out of context, despite the source data only being available for 13000-ish object.

      That said, 13,000 is a lot to track yet ALL objects being tracked would be more reassuring. After all, mini black holes at the LHC, rogue military space junk, Syria offering peace with Israel. Surely we live in the end times? Just kidding there....

      Military satellites should be in the data. If amateur astrologists can track them, so can the Russians and Chinese. Might as well give out the data for them, you don't have to say what their purpose is. FFS, one of them might be dedicated to finding waldo^H^H^H^H^H^H Osama?

      Thinking about that, why haven't they found him with satellites? Maybe those spy satellites aren't so good?

    15. Re:Confused by maglor_83 · · Score: 1

      Get John Carmack onto it. He'll make it more black.

    16. Re:Confused by n1ckml007 · · Score: 1

      Didn't the Rolling Stones sing about that?

    17. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      We can safely say that there are objects that are not disclosed. The French have detected 20-30 of them (http://www.space.com/spacenews/archive07/graves_0611.html). My understanding is that the catalog is actually a legal document in the sense that if the catalog associates an observed object with a known e.g. satellite, then that asociation is taken as fact in international courts. As a result, I expect that objects are not released unless there is a clear association.

    18. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Amateur astologists? So if SkySpy14 is in Taurus at quarter past one today does that mean I'll stub my toe a week on Tuesday?

    19. Re:Confused by albyrne5 · · Score: 1

      That's a quote or paraphrase, right?

      But I can't jig my memory! HELPS!

    20. Re:Confused by somersault · · Score: 2, Funny

      Nothing is 100% black

      What about black holes? They just need to get the LHD guys to make them some strangelet paint.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    21. Re:Confused by zappepcs · · Score: 1

      No, but I wouldn't plan any trips to the middle east if I were you.

    22. Re:Confused by barzok · · Score: 2

      Can you really "drop" a bolt in orbit?

    23. Re:Confused by Darth_brooks · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You can't make it any more black. You just can't. You look at this, and I ask you, how much more black can it get? The answer is none. None more black.

      --
      There are some people that if they don't know, you can't tell 'em.
    24. Re:Confused by Lincolnshire+Poacher · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Plus, they have to be lofted in public view and there is an entire art to determining their missions based on their project patches:

      http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1033/1

    25. Re:Confused by somersault · · Score: 1

      Oops, I meant LHC. Though miners know a lot about black holes too.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    26. Re:Confused by Pugwash69 · · Score: 3, Funny

      If there's any black holes in orbit, we have more important problems than a little debris.

      --
      Pro Coffee Drinker
    27. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The infamous Bugblatter Beast of Traal does something similar to that. Maybe the US should put some money toward research in this direction.

    28. Re:Confused by Hankenstein · · Score: 1
    29. Re:Confused by Architect_sasyr · · Score: 2, Informative

      So... some sort of shielding to prevent reflection making it down onto earth and some servo controllers to rotate said shielding to ensure no light reflection would be a bad idea then?

      Just strikes me as a very virus vs anti-virus type argument, they keep building them, amateurs keep detecting them - somewhere along the line some genius is going to work it out...

      Right? They do have genius' there... oh god...

      --
      Me failed English...
      FreeBSD over Linux. If my comments seem odd, this may explain...
    30. Re:Confused by Jason+Levine · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Of course you can. Remember, orbiting is the state of constantly falling towards an object (in this case Earth), but always missing the ground. So the bolt is dropped, falls, and misses the ground over and over. At least until it hits into something else, shoots out into space (unlikely), and/or lowers orbit enough to burn up in the atmosphere.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    31. Re:Confused by jank1887 · · Score: 3, Funny

      we should put a black hole in orbit to take care of the debris. we can name it Hoover.

    32. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      There is software out there for amateur astronomers to easily track these satellites. Do a google search for "SatelliteTracker". Its a free program and easy to use.

      The trick is, you can only view satellites when the angle of the sun is just right to reflect off its panels - sunrise or sunset.

    33. Re:Confused by somersault · · Score: 1

      And then when he gets big enough we can use him as a second moon!

      --
      which is totally what she said
    34. Re:Confused by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 0, Redundant

      nope we wouldn't. a black hole with the mass of a satellite wouldn't need to worry us at all

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    35. Re:Confused by jep77 · · Score: 1

      with little white dots.

    36. Re:Confused by MyLongNickName · · Score: 1

      What if that black hole got pulled into the earth by a collision?

      --
      See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
    37. Re:Confused by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 1

      why wouldn't you be able to? astronauts are not infallible.

      As for it staying in orbit, well given that when its droped it has the same angular momentum as the astronaut, it will probably stay in orbit for a while.

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    38. Re:Confused by fabs64 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It's a solid object. As it stands that assures that it will either absorb, reflect or diffract all electromagnetic radiation that hits it with a wavelength less than its size. All three of those things are detectable.

      At the moment it's more of a drm(hiders) vs hackers(finders) situation.

    39. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do they sell black hole paint?

    40. Re:Confused by MrNaz · · Score: 2, Funny

      Radar tech: Sir, I'm tracking an object that appears to be roughly eight inches long, orbiting roughly where you'd expect an object to be if it were jettisoned from the ISS.

      Ex-ISS senior staffer: I don't want to talk about it.

      Radar tech: Sir, but according to these readings, it appears to have a bulbous end and is made of silicone rubber...

      Ex-ISS senior staffer: Dammit Dennis I said I don't want to talk about it!

      --
      I hate printers.
    41. Re:Confused by adam.dorsey · · Score: 4, Informative

      Then there would be a black hole with the mass of a sattelite on/inside/passing straight through the Earth. Can you stand beside a satellite without being "sucked in" by gravity? It's the same mass, just in a really small space. Its gravity gets no stronger as a black hole than the gravity as a satellite.

      --
      You are still innocent until proven guilty. What's changed is what they do to innocent people. - notnAP, #26891325
    42. Re:Confused by jank1887 · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's no moon...

    43. Re:Confused by MyLongNickName · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Okay, but as it sucks in the atmosphere, wouldn't it get more massive? And would it not continue to pull in more and more mass as time went on? Or am I missing something?

      --
      See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
    44. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That isn't logical at all. Is it, now?

    45. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So the bolt is dropped, falls, and misses the ground over and over.

      Well, if they guy would just stop dropping it over and over, we wouldn't have to worry about it in the first place. ;)

    46. Re:Confused by somersault · · Score: 2, Funny

      They don't usually sell it, they just give it gratis to anyone with a good enough idea for a practical joke involving said paint.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    47. Re:Confused by Zenaku · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I am not a physicist, and am speculating. But I imagine that a black hole of such a small mass would have an event horizon so small that it could fall all the way through the earth without even striking the nucleus of a single atom. It wouldn't "pull in" much of anything -- besides having very little mass itself, at scales that small the strong, weak, and electromagnetic forces between atoms are all far more significant than gravity.

      Basically, it would only gain mass when through happenstance a subatomic particle happened to cross its event horizon, and while that would mean that eventually the black hole would grow large enough to matter, the infrequency of it gaining any mass and the insignificance of the mass gained each time would mean that it will still be imperceptible to us long after the sun burns out or goes nova.

      --
      If fate makes you a motorcycle, you become a motorcycle.
    48. Re:Confused by Zenaku · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Oh, and this is all ignoring the possibility that a black hole that small would simply dissipate via Hawking radiation within a second of coming into being.

      --
      If fate makes you a motorcycle, you become a motorcycle.
    49. Re:Confused by afabbro · · Score: 1

      Every military satellite launched, not just by the US but by *anyone* can be tracked. Even gpredict has keps for US military stuff. You can track it, you can often see it with the naked eye, and you certainly can receive signals from them. Decoding the signals is harder

      "Harder" like "cracking RSA on your home PC" hard :-)

      --
      Advice: on VPS providers
    50. Re:Confused by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 1

      Naw, the NSA/NRO types don't get boiling blood over it. There simply is no way to hide a launch and orbit so they just have to accept the realities of what it takes to orbit one of these boxes.

      Besides, they make cool patches and team logos for the missions and programs, which is more than a public company like Apple allows, so they aren't *that* paranoid about it.

    51. Re:Confused by thePig · · Score: 1

      Since we cannot anyways see the satellite in the morning, I wonder whether we can find an object if it absorbs the EM - since it will look like the background in the night?

      --
      rajmohan_h@yahoo.com
    52. Re:Confused by RaceProUK · · Score: 1

      What, send Mick Jagger up with a few thousand tins of Humbrol?

      --
      No colour or religion ever stopped the bullet from a gun
    53. Re:Confused by RegularFry · · Score: 1

      That's the assumption, but just imagine if it wasn't :-)

      I wonder how easy it is for them to switch encryption algos on the older birds?

      --
      Reality is the ultimate Rorschach.
    54. Re:Confused by mrdoogee · · Score: 1

      But how will we get a towel that big up into space?

    55. Re:Confused by confused+one · · Score: 2, Informative

      It has more to do with what can be tracked. Objects too small to track with ground based radar, smaller than about an inch across, aren't tracked because we simply can not see them.

    56. Re:Confused by marcansoft · · Score: 1

      Actually, no we don't. A black hole weighing as much as a satellite would for all intents and purposes be equivalent to a satellite up there, as far as gravity goes. Except if you hit it you get sucked in, but if you hit a satellite you're in trouble too.

    57. Re:Confused by dontmakemethink · · Score: 1

      The title says "every", the summary says 13,000 objects. Is this really complete, or are there objects that are not tracked (or at least not disclosed)?

      If it were 100% complete, Google would be revealing to terrorists when spy satellites are over their training camps.

      So I give your question a relatively firm "NO".

      --

      War as we knew it was obsolete
      Nothing could beat complete denial
      - Emily Haines
    58. Re:Confused by meringuoid · · Score: 1
      I wonder how easy it is for them to switch encryption algos on the older birds?

      Assuming that your cryptosystem has been broken, how do you even authenticate to the satellite that you are who you say you are?

      --
      Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
    59. Re:Confused by Knara · · Score: 1

      Ahh, there's the giggle I needed this morning.

    60. Re:Confused by v1 · · Score: 1

      Got a URL for those cool patches?

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    61. Re:Confused by DragonWriter · · Score: 1

      Since we cannot anyways see the satellite in the morning, I wonder whether we can find an object if it absorbs the EM - since it will look like the background in the night?

      There are things that provide or reflect EM radiation from beyond the orbit of satellites in the sky at night; the most obvious being the moon and stars.

    62. Re:Confused by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 1

      http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1033/1

      It was posted in this story further down, so here it is redundantly.

    63. Re:Confused by Knara · · Score: 1

      A reasonably smart person with an easily obtainable magnifying tool and access to the internet probably already knows the trajectory of those satellites and when to hide "stuff"

      You can't hide a whole camp, though. The whole idea is another example of hiding stuff / limiting stuff by using the rationally weak excuse of "terrorism".

    64. Re:Confused by againjj · · Score: 1

      This reminded me of a previous slashdot article, which talked about spy satellites with undisclosed orbits. There is an amateur astronomer group that tracks them (and others).

    65. Re:Confused by lifejunkie · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You have a set of one time use authentication keys on the satellite. The first x bytes of your new firmware image must match the current key or you ignore the image and go silent for a known amount of time.

    66. Re:Confused by isomeme · · Score: 1

      It would.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a skull.
    67. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Probably really gets some NSA types blood boiling."

      Nope, they just care about the collected information.

      It's the NRO that probably objects to this more.

    68. Re:Confused by QuantumTheologian · · Score: 2, Informative

      Actually, black holes as small as you're describing would evaporate very quickly due to Hawking radiation. I suspect that any black hole up to the job of clearing out space debris would present serious dangers to the atmosphere, but I haven't done any calculations. Hand-waving justification: to effectively clear things, it would have to have enough mass to 'accelerate' (I know this term is incorrect from a strictly GR standpoint) objects toward it, in which case the tidal forces would be significant.

    69. Re:Confused by DMUTPeregrine · · Score: 2, Funny

      Clearly not. Moons don't dress up in women's underwear.

      --
      Not a sentence!
    70. Re:Confused by kenj0418 · · Score: 1

      > It is tricky to make something that can see you, but you not be able to see it.

      Try wrapping a towel around your head. That way.... oh, nevermind.

    71. Re:Confused by Digital+End · · Score: 4, Informative

      A black hole small enough to 'orbit' earth would be to small to maintain itself.

      Mass trys NOT to collapse into a black hole... that's why things that aren't big enough (like our sun) won't be black holes. You have to get FREAKISHLY high amounts of mass and insane amounts of gravity to get a baby black hole. It wouldn't orbit earth, we'd orbiit the black hole.

      The mass is try to strech back out like a squashed sponge, the gravity tries to squash it. Normally the mass wins because gravity is a very very weak force... it takes a huge mass to create a real black hole... the stuff the LHC is planning are black holes because the mass is compressed enough to count them as black holes, not because they are huge gravity wells. They squash 2 atoms or whatever (probably smaller then atoms) together, and for a billionth of a billionth of a second, it's squashed enough to call a black hole, and then matter expands back out (like 2 rubber balls hitting eachother and then bouncing back). What is interesting is how they bounce off of eachother and what that tells them.

      Also, this is why we laugh at people who think man made black holes from the LHC will kill us all... they really have no idea what they are talking about. Once we start taking masses the size of jupitor and the sun and running them thru the LHC, I'd be worried. I'd also be confused as to how we fit them in the LHC...

      tl;dr - Gravity is very weak, matter wants to have room to strech out. It takes a lot of matter to make a black hole, more then our sun. There are not tiny black holes that last more then theoretical times because they can't stay squashed.

      --
      Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master.
    72. Re:Confused by Zenaku · · Score: 1

      Listen, I know this. Your post is informative and explains things well, and so I apologize if I'm being overly reactive -- I'm just a tad annoyed, because I know very well that a black hole that small cannot exist for more than a fraction of a second, and you are the fourth person to reply pointing that out.

      The first person was me myself, in response to my own post.

      --
      If fate makes you a motorcycle, you become a motorcycle.
    73. Re:Confused by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 1

      That EM it is absorbing has to go somewhere, and that somewhere is often heat.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    74. Re:Confused by syousef · · Score: 1

      Here's a service that's been doing satellite tracking for years:

      http://www.heavens-above.com/

      You pick your location and it'll give you a list of satellites. Not as flashy as this new Google Earth plugin, but if you're interested in satellite spotting, it's probably the way to go.

      --
      These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
    75. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't want to create an account...hence the imposed handle.

      Here is how we track the "unknowns"
      http://www.coastalbend.edu/acdem/math/sats/

    76. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Clementine is still listed as being in orbit. It ain't; in solar orbit since 2000.

    77. Re:Confused by NotBornYesterday · · Score: 2, Funny

      Too much LDS back in the '60s? ;)

      --
      I prefer rogues to imbeciles because they sometimes take a rest.
    78. Re:Confused by 32771 · · Score: 1

      How about Megamaid then?

      --
      Je me souviens.
    79. Re:Confused by somersault · · Score: 1

      Thankyou for having the first good explanation I've seen as to why the LHC won't kill us all :) Though that means I'll have to take the long road to find out if there is an afterlife, and I'm getting pretty fed up with this one.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    80. Re:Confused by UltraAyla · · Score: 1

      I think the idea is that a black hole that small is likely a black hole in name only and doesn't "suck" in much of anything at all.

    81. Re:Confused by darthdavid · · Score: 2, Funny

      Are you saying that his Holy Mormon Underpants TM cut off the blood to his brain?

    82. Re:Confused by NotBornYesterday · · Score: 2, Funny

      Heh heh heh ... I didn't even consider that meaning of LDS. I was trying a Star Trek riff.

      --
      I prefer rogues to imbeciles because they sometimes take a rest.
    83. Re:Confused by Dan541 · · Score: 1

      It wouldn't be our problem for very long.

      --
      An SQL query goes to a bar, walks up to a table and asks, "Mind if I join you?"
    84. Re:Confused by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If they're secret how do you know that the real good ones have been found?

    85. Re:Confused by Workaphobia · · Score: 1

      Black holes emit radiation. They are not black.

      --
      Evidently, the key to understanding recursion is to begin by understanding recursion. The rest is easy.
    86. Re:Confused by Urkki · · Score: 1

      Well, a black hole with a mass of a satellite evaporating as Hawking radiation would be a pretty bad... That much mass converting into gamma rays in a second would probably fry half of the Earth.

      Didn't do the math though, could be wrong.

    87. Re:Confused by somersault · · Score: 1

      Black as in, lack of visible light (unless they emit light too, but I thought it was heat they emitted?).

      --
      which is totally what she said
    88. Re:Confused by cortana · · Score: 1

      Out of interest, how can you detect absorption?

    89. Re:Confused by fabs64 · · Score: 1

      Fly something over the top that emits EM or echoes EM you send to it, look for the gap. Or just rely on the fact that there's a lot of already existing background EM coming at us from space.

      I think I remember a story about using this kind of technique to identify very well cloaked spy drones a few years ago actually.

    90. Re:Confused by Workaphobia · · Score: 1

      Konqueror and the new comment system do not play nicely. Whenever I try to continue editing after a preview it drops all the previous text and I have to retype my entire reply. This time I thought I'd outwit it by copying the text before I clicked continue, but no, it decided to not populate the clipboard until after it deleted the text that I wanted to save. Sigh.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_body
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawking_radiation

      In particular, note:

      Hawking showed that quantum effects allow black holes to emit exact black body radiation, which is the average thermal radiation emitted by an idealized thermal source known as a black body. The radiation is as if it is emitted by a black body with a temperature that is inversely proportional to the black hole's mass.

      So a small enough hole would indeed be non-black.

      --
      Evidently, the key to understanding recursion is to begin by understanding recursion. The rest is easy.
  2. AGI in Exton, PA by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 5, Funny

    From what I hear, it's a pretty nice company to work for. Too nice in fact. The guy who was my Best Man at my wedding works there. You guys really need to let him out more. He likes it too much, and his family and friends miss him.

    --
    Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    1. Re:AGI in Exton, PA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Interesting way to phrase that. "The guy who was my Best Man"

      Now usually the Best Man is a close friend, So I am guessing you gys had a falling out.

      I know, he slept with your wife.

      And sorry but it was fun.

    2. Re:AGI in Exton, PA by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 1

      Well, as I am not currently being married, he was the best man at my wedding.

      I can't very well say, 'He is the best man at my wedding'. The tenses get all screwed up.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
  3. Re:Very nice. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nige, well done.

    How do I search for a specific satellite?

  4. Err, not just Google Earth. by apathy+maybe · · Score: 5, Informative

    According to the Wikipedia article on Keyhole Markup Language, the following apps can read and understand it:

            * ArcGIS Explorer
            * Feature Manipulation Engine (FME)
            * Flickr
            * Google Earth
            * Google Maps
            * Google Mobile
            * Live Search Maps
            * Microsoft Virtual Earth
            * Map My Ancestors
            * Mapufacture
            * Marble (KDE)
            * OpenLayers
            * Platial
            * RouteBuddy for Mac
            * WikiMapia
            * World Wind
            * Yahoo Pipes
            * SuperMap iServer (SuperMap IS) .NET and Java
            * OpenLAPI, an LGPL implementation of the Location API for Java ME

    So, for those of you who don't have, or don't want to use, or can't use Google Earth, there are plenty of other options available.

    But yes, it's pretty cool what you can do hey.

    --
    I wank in the shower.
    1. Re:Err, not just Google Earth. by brunes69 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Most of those products are limited to the surface. Google Earth is one of the only ones that also has a space view and a Z axis. So, this particular KML would be of limited usefulness to most of them. For example even Google maps, I have no idea what it would do with this KML.

    2. Re:Err, not just Google Earth. by Mycroft_514 · · Score: 1

      Don't forget STSplus, for those still stuck in the DOS age.

      And it has features for those wanting to track the Space Shuttle live.

      And can looks like the big board at Mission control, or has a rotating earth - user choice.

    3. Re:Err, not just Google Earth. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Two more things:

      1. This is a KMZ file (a compressed kml filetype); not really a big deal, but I think a few of those listed don't have .kmz support.

      2. It uses 'network links', a relatively newer feature of KML that points the viewing client somewhere else, via a URI, to grab the kml features (thus allowing for a lot of the nifty things it does).

    4. Re:Err, not just Google Earth. by DingerX · · Score: 1

      Cool. So if I wire it to Flickr, will it spit out the raw image feed from a given KH-12?

  5. StarOrbit, formally StarDock. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "KMZ, you can not only view all objects tracked in real-time, but you can also click on them to get more information on the specific satellite, including viewing it's orbit trajectory. It's an excellent educational tool for the space-curious. "

    Import this into the Iron Engine and you'll have a real education.

  6. xplanet? by Speare · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It seems like every couple months, Google Earth gains another feature that's been working for months or years in the X Planet program. Day/Night artwork, Satellite ephemeris, etc. I'm still waiting for cloud layer updates and I don't think there's a solar or lunar locator on it yet. The interactive nature of Google Earth is nicer than the command-line static image output of X Planet. The author of X Planet had a private script that would take three 120-degree views of radar-measured cloud data from various weather services and stitch them into a single spherical projection to be used in the graphics. He'd update it every 3 hours or so, and host the stitched version. I'm sure Google could arrange a similar process and host the image data in such a way as not to hammer the original servers nor the X Planet server.

    --
    [ .sig file not found ]
    1. Re:xplanet? by hab136 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Since it's not the first result in Google (or the second, or even the first page):

      http://xplanet.sourceforge.net/

      Indeed, it seems it only makes a static picture, versus being a data exploration tool like Google Earth.

    2. Re:xplanet? by Tangent128 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Err... it already does that- under "Weather", there are checkboxes for cloud cover (worldwide) and radar (limited to U.S & Europe).

      I'm looking at Hanna, Ike, that splotch that may become something, and Josephine right now, and can see Gustav's remains in Canada. Pretty cool.

    3. Re:xplanet? by Jeffrey+Baker · · Score: 1

      Not to mention that satellite ephemeris have been a working feature of XEphem for 15 years.

    4. Re:xplanet? by pmarcondes · · Score: 1

      There used to be a script somewhere that you could use to update you view from time to time. I used to do that, including satellite trajectories. The picture was the placed into the root window. My laptop still has it. It's nice.

  7. Pics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can someone please post a pic of what this looks like in Google Earth with the satellites?

    1. Re:Pics by Overzeetop · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Have you seen Wall-E? It's not that bad. Yet.

      --
      Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
  8. Very Nice job. by jasenj1 · · Score: 0, Redundant

    Very nice.

  9. And also.... by AnswerIs42 · · Score: 4, Interesting
    You can use WWJava and JSatTrack

    And NASA's J-Track

    There is also a plug-in for WorldWind.net.. but that is only 400 objects.. though it could be easily tweaked to show the 13,000 list as well I am sure.

    1. Re:And also.... by Sporkinum · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I have been using J-Track for several years. Not as pretty, but gets the job done.

      --
      "He's lost in a 'floyd hole"
  10. Since the Reagan era by mbone · · Score: 1

    Since the Reagan era, we don't reveal all of the orbits of everything we launch. It's not, of course, like the Russians don't know the orbits of these other satellites, but they are not in our lists.

    And, any observation net can only track objects down to a certain size, probably in the few ounce range for 13,000 objects.

    1. Re:Since the Reagan era by bbn · · Score: 1

      Which means that USA is publishing a list of which objects to watch.

      Anything big, but not on the US list -> its a spy satelite. Better cover everything up when it passes overhead.

      Sometimes policies like this are just stupid.

    2. Re:Since the Reagan era by dwye · · Score: 1

      > Sometimes policies like this are just stupid.

      Or diabolically clever. Anything big, but not on the list -> US wants you to THINK that it is a spy satellite, whatever it really is. Imagine the terrorists in their camp, taking cover from every communications satellite, while the real recon birds have fired rockets to new orbits and are using their side-looking cameras to catch them when they come out from their hideouts. And who BUT terrorists would hide from suspected spy satellites?

      The 13th Warrior had a line roughly like "Anyone can calculate strength; now he has to calculate what he doesn't know." to describe faking one's weaknesses. In this case, that the policy is *just* stupid.

    3. Re:Since the Reagan era by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe most of the interesting stuff is dead already but not putting it on the list would seem to me to make it easier for people to direct attention to the interesting things by process of elimination. Putting interesting projects on the list and mearly masking their purpose might be better but I suppose orbits (especially constantly modified orbits) give away too so who knows. It just seems to me to be extraordinarily easy to find objects of any real size floating around above our planet for anyone who cares to look.

  11. j-track 3d by KatTran · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The subject sums it up, but I'm getting a little pissed at technology that is developed at NASA (World Wind) is just getting co-opted by Google (Google Earth) with no respect paid to the initial innovators.

    J-Track 3D has been around for years doing this exact same function of plotting satellite trajectories including ground trace and additional information if you click on the satellite.

    Just because you do it using Google doesn't mean that it's new, cool, innovative or news worthy.

    http://science.nasa.gov/Realtime/jtrack/3d/JTrack3d.html

    There is also J-Track which on Windows, with its "active desktop" feature, can be set as your background/wallpaper to always be tracking weather and satellites.

    1. Re:j-track 3d by Gewalt · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Just because you do it using Google doesn't mean that it's new, cool, innovative or news worthy.

      People were doing it with telescopes and pen and paper long before JTRACK3D, just because JTRACK3D did it via software doesn't mean that it's new, cool, innovative or news worthy.

      Oh wait, yes, yes it does. And this new revolution of actively sharing data cross platform with any app that wants it is also new, cool, innovative and newsworthy.

      --
      Modding Trolls +1 inciteful since 1999
    2. Re:j-track 3d by dargaud · · Score: 1

      Why isn't the space station listed in there ?

      --
      Non-Linux Penguins ?
    3. Re:j-track 3d by Suddenly_Dead · · Score: 4, Informative

      The subject sums it up, but I'm getting a little pissed at technology that is developed at NASA (World Wind) is just getting co-opted by Google (Google Earth) with no respect paid to the initial innovators.

      Google Earth originated with Keyhole, Inc. (who was bought by Google), not NASA. Keyhole's Earth Viewer (which is now Google Earth) seems to have been first released in 2001; Worldwind's first release was in 2004.

    4. Re:j-track 3d by hesaigo999ca · · Score: 1

      Thats one of the objects in the elements list which is a nono to look at or even talk about.

    5. Re:j-track 3d by schlick · · Score: 1

      The subject sums it up, but I'm getting a little pissed at technology that is developed at NASA (World Wind) is just getting co-opted by Google (Google Earth) with no respect paid to the initial innovators.

      Um well, Google isn't doing anything here accept providing a platform to display data. The data is collected by USSTRATCOM and compiled into KML by Analytical Graphics. I know it is fashionable not to RTFA, but at least read the damn summary.

      --
      "It's because they're stupid, that's why. That's why everybody does everything." -Homer Simpson
    6. Re:j-track 3d by AnswerIs42 · · Score: 1

      I think the original point is.. they were done before: "Google Did It" or someone made a KML to do it. People have a mindset that if "Google didn't do it, it must never had been done before".

    7. Re:j-track 3d by Colonel+Korn · · Score: 1

      Starry Night, too, and it's a nice, very complete companion for amateur astronomers.

      --
      "I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
    8. Re:j-track 3d by the_crowbar · · Score: 1

      I am currently taking an astronomy class at college and our text came with a copy of Starry Night Enthusiast software. The installer only works for Windows/Mac, but the software is java/opengl. Maybe one of these days I could try to load it under Linux. Anyway, it is rather neat software. I am just starting to explore it and some of the views it produces are incredible. Here is the website: http://www.starrynight.com/

      --
      Have you read the Moderator Guidelines
    9. Re:j-track 3d by Suddenly_Dead · · Score: 1

      I think the original point is.. they were done before: "Google Did It" or someone made a KML to do it. People have a mindset that if "Google didn't do it, it must never had been done before".

      Well, I was specifically responding to paragraph 1, which seemed to indicate that Google Earth is somehow stealing Worldwind's glory. The rest of that post is pretty relevant though; this KML certainly isn't novel.

    10. Re:j-track 3d by Twisp · · Score: 0

      Just because you do it using Google doesn't mean that it's new, cool, innovative or news worthy.

      No, it means that a lot of people who are unaware of more esoteric sources will now know about it, which makes it newsworthy.

    11. Re:j-track 3d by paul_nz · · Score: 1

      Indeed - hell I remember using OrbiTrack way back in 1995, driving into the middle of nowhere with an old powerbook 100 and hoping the lead-acid battery wouldn't die until the ISS came over! Good times.....

    12. Re:j-track 3d by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Of course, there are several Free (capital F) equivalents. I'd rather use Cartes or KStars than Starry Night given the choice, even ignoring the whole free software aspect.

      Cartes du Ciel
      KStars
      Stellarium

  12. Spy Satellites by Mechanik · · Score: 4, Interesting

    So how long before this can be used to determine when spy satellites are/are not overhead and able to observe you? I would assume that with some basic armchair assumptions about the FOV and zoom capabilities of the satellites' cameras, one could project a cone onto a model representing the surface of the earth and determine the viewable area to each satellite (the existence of which and orbits of which are generally known by satellite buffs).

    I've long wondered if something like this is already available to foreign intelligence operatives... it's long been said that say the Russians know exactly when US spy satellites are due to be overhead, and change their behaviour and camouflage anything they don't want seen in time for when the satellites pass overhead.

    It raises some interesting issues with respect to national security, the war on drugs/terror/etc. However, given it's all based on public knowledge and you can't exactly outlaw math, I fail to see what the government could do about it.

    1. Re:Spy Satellites by ledow · · Score: 4, Informative

      I think you'll find that your information is a little out of date and mainly applies to older military satellites.

      Anything "critical" wold be done with a better satellite or a cloud of smaller satellites that are impossible to "avoid". For instance, GPS demands that at least four satellites are in view at all times from every part of the globe to get an accurate fix. Satellites which are, on the whole, run, controlled or have interests from the US Government. I'm not saying that the GPS system is for primarily military "spying" purposes, but it shows that even the public satellite orbits are enough to basically see anything, anywhere, given the most basic of manoeuvring capability.

      What makes you think that all of the "unheard of" satellites are any different, or in fewer numbers, or not able to move to look at anything interesting within a reasonable timeframe? It would be quite pointless, after all, to launch a modern multi-billion dollar military satellite if all that was required was public information / academic data gathered from worldwide telescopes to render them completely useless.

      Even easier would be to, oh, I don't know, do things at night (yes, IR-capable satellites exist but it makes things harder straight away)? Or do things in large warehouses with a roof?

    2. Re:Spy Satellites by Mechanik · · Score: 2, Insightful
      You have a point perhaps with most of what you wrote (admittedly I am not up on the latest and greatest of US spy satellite tech), but there are a few issues with the below:

      Even easier would be to, oh, I don't know, do things at night (yes, IR-capable satellites exist but it makes things harder straight away)? Or do things in large warehouses with a roof?

      Some things are just difficult to hide in this manner, not to mention expensive. Yes, there is a history of say, the Soviets building nuclear submarines in caves and whatnot to avoid overhead surveillance, but the bigger something is, the harder it is to hide in such a way that you can keep working on it while it's hidden. It's going to look a bit odd when all those cement trucks that are pouring the foundation for an ICBM site keep going into a supposedly finished warehouse in the middle of Buttfuck, Siberia where there's nothing around for 100 miles. The intelligence analysts are still going to know you're up to something.

      Construction in the dark is a pain in the ass as well. You'd have to light everything so that the workers can see what the hell they are doing, so in effect much of it would be visible anyway. Outfitting every worker with night vision goggles is not typically cost effective I would think.

    3. Re:Spy Satellites by nedlohs · · Score: 5, Informative

      GPS satellites orbit at around 20200km., Spy satellites (of the take pictures variety - some other types are in geosynchronous orbit, SBIRS and Rhyolite for example) orbit at around 200km (sometime under 100km, sometimes 600km - there's the obvious detail/area trade off).

      GSP just requires line of sight. Spy satellite cameras point in some direction.

      Claiming there is any relationship at all between having 4 GPS sats in view at any time and what spy satellites are capable of is ridiculous.

    4. Re:Spy Satellites by Darth_brooks · · Score: 1

      It raises some interesting issues with respect to national security, the war on drugs/terror/etc. However, given it's all based on public knowledge and you can't exactly outlaw math, I fail to see what the government could do about it.

      pssst. Most drones can loiter between 24-48 hours over a given area, and send realtime data back to wherever it needs to go.

      I'm sure there's some cool stuff that can be done with satellites that can't be done with drones, But when it comes to taking pictures of who is where? I'll take a few drones at 50,000ft with good cameras (that can watch an area uninterrupted for days / weeks) over a satellite with an awesome camera that's 400 miles away.

      --
      There are some people that if they don't know, you can't tell 'em.
    5. Re:Spy Satellites by Mechanik · · Score: 1

      I'm sure there's some cool stuff that can be done with satellites that can't be done with drones, But when it comes to taking pictures of who is where? I'll take a few drones at 50,000ft with good cameras (that can watch an area uninterrupted for days / weeks) over a satellite with an awesome camera that's 400 miles away.

      Interesting thought. I assume though that keeping drones up constantly is probably not cost effective. Satellites, while expensive to build and send into orbit, are cheap once they're up there, as they have few moving parts and are largely solar powered. Drones have to keep returning to base for fuel and require more maintenance. There have been some interesting experiments with long flight time solar powered drones and blimps, but I think most of these have either not allowed for any significant extra payload (the drones), or have been ineffective due to winds (the blimps).

    6. Re:Spy Satellites by hesaigo999ca · · Score: 1

      I know at all times when the satellites can't track me....when I am under a bridge,
      else all bets are off. Think about it, unless they have thermal sensors that can track you from that far, then we are all screwed.

    7. Re:Spy Satellites by Darth_brooks · · Score: 1

      I think you should take a look at how successful the global hawk program has been, and just look into the return we've gotten on drones in general.

      The KH-12's run about a billion dollars a piece, and the launches cost $400 million a piece, per wikipedia. The Global Hawks cost $123 million a piece (again, per wikipedia). Which has would be more useful in providing up to the minute information about someplace halfway around the world?

      (of course, the flip side to that argument is that you're not going to fly half a dozen Global Hawks over Beijing or Moscow anytime in the near future.)

      Yes, drones need to be refueled and maintained. But since you can have a whole squadron of them in place, that offsets a lot of the negatives. Lose one? Launch another. Need to watch an area for a month straight 24/7? Put one on station and relieve it every 24 hours with another drone. Now, try and refuel or maintain a spy sat. Better yet, try getting two live vantage points from a spy sat. Or upgrading a camera. Or added a different sensor package. Drones define two things that the intelligence community loves to hear: Flexibility and cost effectiveness.

      --
      There are some people that if they don't know, you can't tell 'em.
    8. Re:Spy Satellites by digitalchinky · · Score: 2, Interesting

      There are so many overhead assets that all the responses above are accurate. In this day and age if you want something to stay hidden, you keep it under wraps. Not just any kind of wraps though. Floating above are devices that can look at pretty much any part of the spectrum, along with active systems such as synthetic aperture RADAR. RADAR is quite cool, it can even peek through various layers and see what's underneath to a limited extent.

      Here are some RADAR images.
      http://www.fas.org/irp/imint/radar.htm

      There is a lot of interesting stuff on fas.org that would have (and probably still would) see me thrown in jail were I to ever make such info accessible on line. I'm not sure how they get away with it.

      --
      Ex 3 letter agency drone.

    9. Re:Spy Satellites by RegularFry · · Score: 1

      GPS satellites orbit at around 20200km

      Hm... that would make for one heck of a long baseline array...

      --
      Reality is the ultimate Rorschach.
    10. Re:Spy Satellites by Mechanik · · Score: 1

      Yes, drones need to be refueled and maintained. But since you can have a whole squadron of them in place, that offsets a lot of the negatives. Lose one? Launch another. Need to watch an area for a month straight 24/7? Put one on station and relieve it every 24 hours with another drone. Now, try and refuel or maintain a spy sat. Better yet, try getting two live vantage points from a spy sat. Or upgrading a camera. Or added a different sensor package. Drones define two things that the intelligence community loves to hear: Flexibility and cost effectiveness.

      Agreed... let the tool fit the job. I don't think drones nor satellites are going anywhere any time soon. They both have their strengths and weaknesses.

    11. Re:Spy Satellites by camperdave · · Score: 1

      No, it's not so ridiculous. GPS works pretty much everywhere, pretty much all of the time because there are 4 or more satellites "visible" pretty much everywhere, pretty much all of the time. Reciprocity works both ways. If you can "see" the satellite, the satellite can "see" you. The point he was making is that if you had a cluster of spy satellites similar in size to the GPS cluster, then pretty much every point on the planet could be under surveillance pretty much all of the time.

      --
      When our name is on the back of your car, we're behind you all the way!
    12. Re:Spy Satellites by nedlohs · · Score: 1

      Except it wouldn't be "similar in size". It would be orders of magnitude larger.

      You need *way* less when they are 20000km high than when they are 200km high. You need *way* less when all you need is radio line of site than when you need to be where the camera is pointing.

      I'm sure they have a huge number of them and can cover basically anywhere at a moments notice - but it isn't anything like GPS...

    13. Re:Spy Satellites by ceoyoyo · · Score: 1

      Everybody who cares has long known very well when spy sats are overhead. Sometimes you can avoid them, sometimes you can't. If you're making a drug run from Columbia to Florida in a boat one of the radar sats is going to see you doing it.

    14. Re:Spy Satellites by Dr+La · · Score: 1

      This already is available. Just use a free tracking software program like Orbitron (www.stoff.pl) and download a timely version of the element set of classified satellites here: http://www.io.com/~mmccants/tles/index.html And rest assured that the Russians, Chinese, etc., don't need this element set because they already have it from their own tracking networks.

      --
      Ceterum censeo Carthaginem delendam esse
  13. EULA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    Does Google then own the satellites, like they state in their EULA?

  14. Directions: To here - From here? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    Thanks Google Earth, I just planned my next vacation.

  15. 'Nod' tag by Spatial · · Score: 5, Interesting

    What? I don't get it. Should we call in the GDI, or is this yet another useless meme tag?

    1. Re:'Nod' tag by orkim · · Score: 1

      Ya, wtf?

      Since I always so everything I read I'm getting very dizzy at the moment from the excessive nodding in agreement.

      Did I miss something? Where did this come from?

    2. Re:'Nod' tag by Danny+Rathjens · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Just someone abusing the system, obviously. Too bad I can't use my mod points on the tags. :)
      Maybe we should make it so that the masses can cancel a stupid tag by using the negated tag, e.g. if there are several "nod" tags and several people make "!nod" tags it would be a wash and neither displayed.

  16. I worked for AGI for almost 5 years by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Great company, great people, great products!

  17. The blue, infinite sky... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... and when you watch a bright night sky, populated just by stars and planets.. .. or a clear blue sky at midday, thinking about space, and the infinite....

    Well.. think again. Somebody's ruined it already.

    --
    As a foreigner (from Mars, infact), I thought Earth's orbit we ought to use as landfill, actually. Are you saying there's people living there??

    --
    Very nice graphical swarm of debris/bees running around Earth. Good job!

    Only issue I have with KMZ: there is so many, so fascinating, but no good search engine or cool, complete catalougue of them... Wait, let me call the copyrights office, quick!

  18. I can see my house from here! by SystematicPsycho · · Score: 1

    Remember the days when you had to pay to get a picture of your house taken? Was that a rip? Or does google have enough money around to be able to offer the entire earth (almost) as a free service?

    --
    Analytic & algebraic topology of locally Euclidean meterization of infinitely differentiable Riemmanian manifold
  19. Misleading? by blantonl · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think the story might be a little misleading.

    I suspect that not every object's info is made available, rather only the objects that USSTRATCOM deems appropriate for public consumption. Spy Sats, classified objects, and other items that they classify as not appropriate certainly doesn't show up in this KML.

    Or do they? ;-)

    --
    Lindsay Blanton
    RadioReference.com
    1. Re:Misleading? by confused+one · · Score: 1

      At one point the French were claiming that there were numerous satellites, which they had identified, which were not on the USSTRATCOM list. Of course, the US said that they knew nothing about them and that the French must have "mis-identified" the objects in question. You draw your own conclusions...

    2. Re:Misleading? by TubeSteak · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I suspect that not every object's info is made available, rather only the objects that USSTRATCOM deems appropriate for public consumption. Spy Sats, classified objects, and other items that they classify as not appropriate certainly doesn't show up in this KML.

      Or do they? ;-)

      They don't.
      Last year the French "negotiated" with the USA to remove "secret" French satellites from the list.
      And by "negotiated" I mean "threatened to reveal unpublished USA satellites".
      http://www.space.com/news/060707_graves_web.html

      That isn't to say the satellites aren't trackable, they just aren't published publicly by any governments AFAIK.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    3. Re:Misleading? by Capt+James+McCarthy · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but wouldn't you just have to locate the blank spots in the sky and start to track that?

      --
      There are no loopholes. It's either legal or it's not.
  20. Did someone think about clean up? by kai6novice · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I think some companies should just go clean up all the retired/inactive/disfunctional satellites or junk and recycle it! ;)

  21. Spy sattelite can shoot pictures at unusual angles by DrYak · · Score: 1

    I would assume that with some basic armchair assumptions about the FOV and zoom capabilities of the satellites' cameras

    Well the problem is that more modern satellite have supposedly more complicated Cassegrain assemblies making them able to shoot pictures at weird angles.

    So although amateurs satellite watcher could very well help establish a precise map of all "über-secret"(*) military satellites *are* - inferring which part of the world are indeed visible and looked at is going to be slightly more complicated.

    But civilian applications (knowing which of the official satellite is looking where) could be more easily done (since I haven't heard any of them to be designed to shoot picture at weird angles - and even then their characteristics could be obtained), thus helping privacy paranoid to hide their cat and exhibitionists to inflict their nude sunbaths to innocent Google Maps users.

    ---

    (*) - übergeheim for german geeks...

    --
    "Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
  22. Not as fantastic as it seems by Ancient_Hacker · · Score: 1, Insightful

    I know, it's a wow kind of thing.

    But if you think about it a bit, an orbital path can be described by a very few numbers-- the angles to the equator and to Greenwich, and the minor and major radii. All else can be computed on the fly by about 8 lines of code.

    1. Re:Not as fantastic as it seems by spaceyhackerlady · · Score: 2, Informative

      The usual format is NASA 2-line format. People (including me) have been using it to track satellites for years.

      The orbital models have been refined over the years. The latest version I've seen is this one.

      ...laura

    2. Re:Not as fantastic as it seems by Jubedgy · · Score: 1

      In fact, you need to six variables (state vectors, classical orbital elements, etc...) to define an orbit. The standard distribution format is the two line element (TLE).

      --
      Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis hebes
  23. You had to see this coming... by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 2, Funny

    I not only work for Analytical Graphics, but I'm the one that wrote this tool as a demo.

    Domo arigato Mr. Amato.

    --
    It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
  24. What we should do... by PortHaven · · Score: 1, Funny

    We should place in front of the ISS a thin, strong lightweight netting.

    It could have a number of mass objects (weights) with thrusters to keep them apart. The net would span a few miles catching large debris. Clearing the path for the ISS.

    When full, the netting would be closed. And towed to a lower orbit. And eventually burn up in the atmosphere.

    1. Re:What we should do... by HasselhoffThePaladin · · Score: 0

      That's just a LEO snowplow. And, not to mention the fact that most space debris is on the order of a few centimeters traveling around 7 km/s (in that orbital regime). We're going to need a finer net...and one that would be able to stand up to an impact with a metal bolt blown off of a Chinese weather satellite without simply slicing up the netting. I think I've made my point, but how much do you think a 5km x 5km centimeter mesh net would weight and cost?

    2. Re:What we should do... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You obviously haven't thought this through. Objects intercepting the ISS can't be in the same orbit, and moving slower. You can't just put a big cow-catcher on the "front" of the ISS and ignore the objects flying at it from every other direction. I would imagine the biggest threat would be something at a sharp tangent to the ISS, it's orbit is low enough that anything with a similar orbit would have a massive relative velocity.
      sidenote: I wonder how many objects actually have an opposite orbit to ISS, east to west?

    3. Re:What we should do... by PortHaven · · Score: 1

      Well...

      Cost is irrelevant, Congress just prints more money anyways.

      Weight...that is by far much more an issue. Especially as in a few years we will not even be capable of launching a 200lb man into space.

      Hmm...

      The really best solution. Is to bring a small asteroid and place it in orbit. It'll clear up debris.

    4. Re:What we should do... by PortHaven · · Score: 1

      Well, my inclination was that the vast majority of "debris" is non-accelerated and in a declining orbit.

      So I figure a screen covering the front and upward arcs would catch most threats.

      That said...

      We really do not have a light enough, strong enough material at this time for such a system.

      But I still think the ISS would benefit from an umbrella.

  25. Everything is relative by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe the tagger is a non-obese diabetic mouse that has escaped from an animal intelligence boosting lab.

  26. Wow. by arcsimm · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It was certainly a shocker when Google Earth loaded up the satellite data. I knew there was a lot of crap up there, but damn!

    If I could make one suggestion, though, should you continue to develop this: Different icons for different classes of satellite? For instance, a greyed-out icon for inactive satellites, a booster for rocket leftovers, a chunk of rock for space debris, etc... I spent about a minute wondering why there were so many weather satellites over the US until I realized that most of them were just orbiting debris.

    Awesome use of Google Earth, though!

  27. Where's ComSatNeal? by davidwr · · Score: 1

    I can't seem to find it.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  28. My God.. by akunkel · · Score: 0

    Its full of crap!

  29. I Recommend Freefall from Advanced Analytic by Nano2Sol · · Score: 1

    Also available in real time and which has been around a long time is Freefall from Advanced Analytic. It provides a lot more information and options and can also be used as your screensaver.

  30. That's a disclosure, not a disclaimer by gujo-odori · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Go ahead and mod me OT, but it's Friday and I'm just pissed off to be the last person in the universe who knows the difference between a disclosure statement and a disclaimer.

    "This is a cool new toy/tool/product I'm posting on Slashdot, and by the way, I not only work at the company that produces it, I wrote it" is a disclosure.

    A disclaimer typically contains language such as "Not responsible for damages resulting from use, or inability to use, this product. Not even if it burns your house, steals your car, drinks your liquor from your old fruit jar, *and* steps on your blue suede shoes."

    Disclosure statements are meant to inform the reader of, for example, a potential conflict of interest, and shield the discloser from potential liability (whether legal or just in terms of face) should the disclosure not be made.

    Disclaimers are basically just weasel words intended to deny having any liability for, say, the quality or lack thereof, or some product. Or put another way, disclosure is taking responsibility (to some extent, at least, and not always), whereas disclaimers are solely intended to worm out of responsibility that the you probably have, at least morally if not legally. And maybe legally. Not all disclaimers will stand up in court. I wouldn't be surprised if most won't.

  31. Apostrophe's... by Dan+Parker · · Score: 3, Funny

    ...and they're use's.

  32. Who needs shadows... by KoshClassic · · Score: 2, Funny

    Patriot Games showed us that women can be identified in spy satellite photos from their, ahem, curves.

    --
    Understanding is a three edged sword. - Ambassador Kosh Naranek, Babylon 5
  33. Really Scary by DougF · · Score: 0

    I installed it and clicked off all objects except debris from the Chinese shootdown. That, my friends, is one massive debris cloud... Interesting how many parts are over the Antarctic...maybe that's just where that section of the cloud is passing through.

    --
    Impetuous! Homeric!
  34. How much more black could this be? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    None more black.

  35. I just loaded the KMZ by Xupa · · Score: 1

    and it is awesome. Everyone should see this.

  36. Oh come on!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This time it's SOOOOO obvious:

    In sovjet russia, satellites track you!

  37. Heavens-Above.com by Papatoast · · Score: 0

    Been using them for years to do sat watching.

    --
    We were somewhere around Barstow on the edge of the desert when the drugs began to take hold. - HST
  38. Every Satellite Tracked by GPS+Tracking · · Score: 1

    Wow, this is very informative!

    --
    Work smarter, not harder, with gps tracking
  39. No obvious clustering of comm satellites? by dpbsmith · · Score: 1

    I expected to be able to zoom out and see a conspicuous ring of communications satellites in geosynchronous orbit, but I didn't see what I expected. Am I missing something obvious? Or doesn't the zoom zoom out far enough?

    1. Re:No obvious clustering of comm satellites? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It appears that zoom does not zoom out far enough, that's just a pity.

      Perhaps someone can do a quick hack and increase the FOV value or whatever controls the zoom in/out so we can see all those other geosync birds :)

  40. Thank you slashdot by Verdatum · · Score: 1

    I just gotta say, I love it when I can guess what goofy tags an article is gonna have just by reading the first sentence. PLANETES is a phenomenal show; a must-see for any astronautics/space geek; whether you consider yourself an anime fan or not. The premise of dealing with the serious problem of space debris is brilliant. Most important to me, it is one of the few space dramas that actually strives to get all the physics right; no sound in space, conservation of momentum, etc. I haven't seen anything that has come close to it since Kubrick's 2001.

  41. Black via nanorods... by WallaceAndGromit · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Your comment made me think about this article posted a while ago about a material with the lowest reflectivity ever measured....

    "the researchers deposited silica nanorods at an angle of precisely 45 degrees on top of a thin film of aluminum nitride, which is a semiconducting material used in advanced light-emitting diodes (LEDs). From the side, the films look much like the cross section of a piece of lawn turf with the blades slightly flattened."

    --
    Name: Mr. Anon E Mouse; SSN: 555-55-5555
  42. Additional Info by dukeofurl01 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I don't know a whole lot about satellites, and this is nice, however what would be really useful information, and this info may or may not be available, would be when you click on a satellite, what the satellite does, as well as the country of origin, declination, etc. I would kind of like to know who owns the satellite, not just what country that company is in. I kind of feel like that is giving the wrong answer in that field.

  43. "can't outlaw math" what about chemistry? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's only a matter of time before competence itself is deemed "terrorism".

    http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/12/182243

    What happens when you combine searches that you don't even know about:
    http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/08/1446256
    the right to no-warrant search all e-maill:
    http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/09/0239246
    Warrantless GPS tracking (via beacons):
    http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/13/2218209
    Considering any citizen who may capture evidence of abuse of authority to be a "threat"
    http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/15/1233238
    or
    "The Fox affiliate in the Twin Cities reports on a photographer who was handcuffed and detained for taking photos of police near the Minneapolis Police Department's special operations center. The police officer in the video admits that people are "absolutely" allowed to shoot photos on public property. "
    http://www.photoattorney.com/2008/08/photography-not-allowed-14.html
    (PhotoAttorney.com is fighting for your rights to record what is, including crimes committed against you by authority: if you accommodate robbery of rights by authority, you are responsible for your, and your children's helplessly being crushed-KNOW whats going on, ACT to pressure the robbers to limit them)
    As of October, FBI's SOP is Warrantless Investigation:
    http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/22/2054229
    (note these are all from just the last couple of weeks, to understand how big the war for control of all rights, is)
    Testing for Mad Cow disease (a Real Live Actual threat against our security+survival) blocked by gov't
    http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/30/238223
    Protesting treated as terrorism, terrorized by police, without warrant or charges:
    http://politics.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/31/2140252
    See a trend here??
    Neighbors do the spying, become part of our western "stasi":
    http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/09/01/1144246
    Gov't claims no one can share what the law is, because of copyright law
    (remember "secret laws" in the soviet bloc? arrested and never found out why they were disappeared?
    Never knowing why you are in jail? Never knowing what you were charged/convicted on?
    How about our "security certificates", which do the exact same thing?
    here's the "law is copyrighted: no share" story)
    http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/09/03/181251
    France's electronic prison world:
    http://developers.slashdot.org/developers/08/09/05/0059220.shtml
    and how to track all individuals from satellites based on gait:
    http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/09/05/1157243.shtml

    If you are naive enough to consider weaponry (electronic leverage is just another kind of leverage, steel was a previous leverage) to be something that isn't ALWAYS abused by authority, whenever it can, until the citizenry fights for rights enough to mitigate that, then your soul's going to not enjoy the rest of eternity, looks like.

    What authority does with resources is shown also in what it DOESN'T do.

    NON-prosecution of re

  44. Disclaimer? by swordfishBob · · Score: 2, Informative

    "Disclaimer: I not only work for Analytical Graphics, but I'm the one that wrote this tool as a demo."
    That's not a disclaimer, that's a disclosure.
    A disclaimer would be saying "I am not responsible" or "my employer may not agree with me".

    --
    -- All your bass are below two Hz
  45. Hmm, I wonder if we will suddenly see by LM741N · · Score: 1

    some satellites disappear, being shot down or put into an irregular orbit, as t.hey "didn't exist" to begin with?

  46. NASA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nasa's J-trac web app has been doing this for years.

  47. A suggestion by Muad'Dave · · Score: 1

    Excellent tool, thanks! A suggestion, though. Break the monolithic satellite list into several checkboxed categories. For instance, I use Amateur Radio satellites on occasion, and it would be nice to have a selection for just active amateur radio sats. Similarly, I often observe visible sats at dusk, so a list of those would be nice. A list for weather sats, debris only, comm sats, etc would be nice.

    BTW, you can get directions to a satellite's subpoint on the globe - that's funny.

    --
    Tiller's Rule: Never use a word in written form that you've only heard and never read. You will end up looking foolish.
  48. Just one word: by grolaw · · Score: 1

    WOW!

  49. Finding a particular satellite by letsdolaunch · · Score: 1

    Is there any way (using this sat tracking tool in Google Earth) to do a search for a particular satellite, and have Google Earth pan to that satellite's current position over Earth? I tried doing that using the "Fly To" search tool in Google Earth, but it did not work.