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Chrome Helping Other Browsers Out, Says Opera CEO
Pablo Martinez-Almeida writes "Opera CEO Jon S. von Tetzchner confirms that new entrants in the browser market are raising awareness on the mainstream Internet community about the availability of alternatives to the ubiquitous Internet Explorer. 'How has the emergence of WebKit and Chrome changed the market for you?
JvT: The effect of Chrome so far has been 20 percent more downloads every day. It's fairly logical when you think about it, because the biggest hurdle we have is all those people that don't realize there's an alternative in the market. Now, with the launch of Chrome there's focus on the choice of browsers in the market.'
"How has the emergence of WebKit and Chrome changed the market for you"
When they can be bothered to release a linux version let me know then I might be able to give answer.
"Chrome Helping Other Browsers Out, Says Opera CEO"
scratch, scratch, scratch:
"Chrome Helping Obscure Browsers Out, Says Opera CEO"
if your market share is tiny, then yes, awareness of alternatives helps. but for the big guys: ie and firefox, chrome represents a smaller slice of the piechart
the truth though is that chrome just slows down coders responsible for cross browser testing and compatibility ;-P
its a nice browser though. its dom and javascript quirks seem very safari like. did google base chrome on safari code?
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
I think we're already to the point where many people are aware they have a choice of web browsers. I was watching the news the other night (obviously not MSNBC), and they had a large touch-screen display running a web-browser with multiple tabs - Firefox. They were using it to display charts and other information.
Also, various family members are aware of Firefox, but they have no idea what "chrome" is. So I'm not sure how Chrome is somehow more noticeable to the mainstream, especially since it doesn't add any of the bells-and-whistles type features that typical people notice (security and performance isn't exactly exciting to the average joe).
Better known as 318230.
I used Mozilla/SeaMonkey/Phoenix/Firefox for 9 years. I switched to Opera a few months ago and never looked back.
The 'advertisement banner' was a stigma for me, although now I realise Opera Software are THE innovators.
I realise it's not "open", but I look forward to any JS or rendering optimisations they may do to counter Chrome/FF3.1.
Options are beginning to look like a good thing. Striving to match a rival will only be good for the world (and those of us who develop for the web ftl or ftw).
There has been choice for years that many people have been aware of.
Most people who still use IE just don't care for the other choices.
Web developers care more than anyone. People who only go on the Internet to watch the odd youtube video and check their hotmail care the least.
thanks for the info ;-)
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
Just one example:
http://codedread.com/svg-support.php
i've offended a chrome zealot. less than 3 months after release. i didn't know rabid combative fan bases grew that fast
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
I also made the switch to Opera 4 months ago. I saw an article about Opera on Slashdot and decided to try it out. I found out it was the best browser and that it saves your bookmarks!
I keep trying to switch to Opera -- every couple of months or so I make a concerted effort. However, the lack of an easy-to-use extension system (and the presence of ads -- ads? I had forgotten the web had ads!) keep bringing me back to Firefox. I also can't seem to import certain certificates into Opera -- haven't really delved into the problem, so I don't know if there's a solution somewhere out tere.
More importantly, get me NoScript working on Opera, and I'm sold. (That's even more important that getting rid of ads!)
It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
I use per-site preferences instead of noscript when I use Opera. /.) I use the site-preferences to turn off Javascript for that domain.
At the moment I use it with Javascript turned on in the main preferences and then when I come to a site with completely intrusive ads (hello
I just right click and choose "Edit site preferences". It's great!
I just can't believe google haven't got gmail working with opera correctly yet, it's a bit buggy.
save the GNUs!
My browser of choice is Firefox. I have it setup just exactly the way I like it, and some of the tweaks are not available in Opera. If they were, I would use Opera. The other browsers I use/have tried other than FF and Opera are: Chrome, IE8 Beta, and Safari. I can say I loath IE8 and Safari, and Chrome has a lot of useless features that are sometimes annoying. Google has a lot of work to do if they even bother. Opera is fast, and feature rich, and has a very modern feel. Firefox is Firefox, I don't think I need to explain that to anybody on Slashdot.
Are you sure you're aware of Opera's full feature set?
Opera has both per-site Noscript and Noscript by default, it's up to you.
Right-click on a website, pick "Edit site preferences..." and uncheck "Enable Javascript" for the domain if you want. Or disable Javascript for the entire application, and check Enable Javascript for the sites you wish.
As for blocking ads, right-click on the site with ads and pick "Block content..." -- wildcards are supported. The only thing I miss there is a subscription like that in Adblock, but after having blocked the most common sites, I don't get ads nearly as much anymore.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
I don't see adds either.
Download the url filter:
http://www.fanboy.co.nz/adblock/opera/
and also get the CSS "element hide" file.
It's not AdBlock, but I don't see advertisements anymore. 5 minutes is a small price to pay :-)
what are you talking about? i havent seen ads in opera for years....
Do you turn off JavaScript for all of Slashdot, or just for the adserver domain? You see, that's my problem -- I'd like JavaScript to work for the top domain that I'm visiting (i.e., Slashdot), but not for scripts loaded from the adservers that are included in the HTML (Doubleclick, Tacoda.net, etc.). I like NoScript especially because it does this automatically, without the need for a huge whitelist/blacklist.
Seriously, if Opera builds-in something like this, I'm sold, since it's really the only plug-in I use in Firefox (besides Firebug, but that's for development and not for browsing :P).
It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
Is there an easy to use interface for managing what domains I have JavaScript blocked from? Or do you have to go to each site every time to manage?
And say I somehow go to doubleclick.net and disable JavaScript for that domain, does it only work when I actually navigate to that site, or does it work as well on sites like Slashdot when it has scripts brought in _from_ doubleclick.net?
It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
However, the lack of an easy-to-use extension system (and the presence of ads -- ads? I had forgotten the web had ads!) keep bringing me back to Firefox.
That is AFAIC the biggest downside to Opera. OTOH, there are plenty of tools to remove ads without using an extension. http://www.admuncher.com/ is what I've been using for years, even with Firefox (performs better than AdBlock IMHO).
It only takes one man to change the Wisdom of the Crowd to Tyranny of the Masses.
I used Mozilla/SeaMonkey/Phoenix/Firefox for 9 years.
You forgot Firebird.
too many browsers. update the ones that are already our there instead of spending money on a bunch of new ones.
Advertisement banner? Why are you still using Opera 8? :P
http://pinopsida.com
Does it allow fine grained per-script control? For example, it is common for java script files related to advertising domains to be linked separately into pages served from different top level domains. Noscript allows exclusions or inclusions for scripts loaded from a particular domain to be applied (doubleclick for example) no matter what site is attempting to load the scripts. No script also offers xss and cross site scripting sanitization. Personally, I like the addon concept employed by Firefox much more than the "one size fits all" approach of Internet Explorer and other browsers (yes, yes, I know about plugins, but Firefox has the greatest number of quality and interesting addons of any browser that I know of, there really is something for everyone). The addon concept allows core browser functionality to be concentrated on to the exclusion of extraneous features and enforces a more formal separation of concerns between core browser functions and functions provided by addons. IMHO, the addon approach is simply a superior design.
The advertising banner was annoying, but I had no problem paying the modest fee the asked for to remove it.
It's really just better at doing things the way I want them done than Firefox is (without hunting around for the proper extensions)
I really don't understand the rabid hatred of seeing ANY ads that some people have. I'll block flash ads or ads with animation if they get too distracting, but usually I just don't see them.
>>>all those people that don't realize there's an alternative in the market.
Yeah. So? Even when Netscape had 90% dominance, most people still chose Internet Exploder, thereby gradually erasing Netscape from existence. I don't think any browser's ever going to beat IE's advantage of being "there" on the desktop.
FOX NEWS.com should be BANNED from television and internet. Have the Congress take it over and give us Truespeak.
Per your first question, the best you can do AFAIK is go Tools->Preferences->Content->Manage Site Preferences. That will give you a list of all the sites that you have set preferences for. You can edit, add, or remove sites from the list. So if you enter "google.com" as a new one you can edit all the settings there without visiting the site.
Your second question is an interesting one, but I don't know the answer. I use a userjs file to handle blocking javascripts I don't want it to load. It blocks everything by default and when I tell it to allow something it remembers to allow it in the future. It remembers by setting a cookie though which is a crappy way to do it IMO.
1 (short ton / firkin) = 89.1432354 slugs / keg
CrossOver Chromium is exactly what you're looking for. It's not officially by Google, but ported by CodeWeavers, the WINE folks.
Before anyone gets their hopes up, let's reprint something from the FAQ re: crossover chromium
Q. Should I run CrossOver Chromium as my main browser?
A. Absolutely not! This is just a proof of concept, for fun, and to showcase what Wine can do. Chromium itself is just beginning. As the Chromium project progresses, they will be providing more compelling support for Mac OS and Linux, particularly with process security and memory management. Those future versions from Chromium will be better suited for daily use than this version.
Now perhaps you had some luck with it, but I found it to be little more than a decent proof of concept. The UI on Fedora 8 was pants, the option/settings pane was useless, and it couldn't deal with the Squid proxy I'm sitting behind. Just sayin'.
Reply to That ||
Seriously? Look, I understand the love for Opera (great browser), but it was seriously easier for you to bring out the wallet then it was to search for a few free extensions? :\
It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
Aye, your first answer was what I was looking for -- thanks!
However, I still think it doesn't work if the domains are from within another site (like Slashdot). I'm sure someone's created a userjs file somewhere for this (kinda like the one you have).
It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
I don't have a User JS file for this purpose or any User JS at all. Ads are still blocked on every site I go to when I decide to block them on one site. Well, that's if they come from the same domain. Some ad provider could still serve you ads through server123.biggerads.net if you've blocked ads from *.adprovider.com. I think I've seen DoubleClick do this among others.
Aye -- that's why NoScript (on Firefox) has the best solution, that I've seen. Simply block all other domains from serving ads or running JavaScript, except for the one you currently navigated to. Exceptions (CDN's used by developers, authentication servers) are rare and handled on a case-by-case basis.
It is by my will alone my thoughts acquire motion; it is by the juice of the coffee bean that the thoughts acquire speed
Yes, because even after cobbling together the proper mix of extensions, it still didn't do quite what I wanted, and half the extensions broke on the next update of firefox. Getting out my wallet only took a few seconds. I don't remember anymore how much the license was, but it was trivial for a quality piece of software.
Agreed. I switched when 9.2 came out and I realized that Opera wasn't the same Opera I had dismissed years ago.
Fast, stable, and an impressively awesome feature set. Opera's all element zooming and ease at switching from author to user mode makes browsing even sites with horrible UI's painless.
No, it doesn't.
It just has a site blacklist that requires you some extra bunch of clicks and navigation through dialogs
This is not like noscript neither in functionality nor in ease of use, notice noscript is not a blacklist, it is a whitelist... Not to mention it also does a lot more things like blocking plugins and preventing XSS giberish and other stuff. You can also allow javascript temporarily for a site, without disabling it again later...
Copyright infringement is "piracy" in the same way DRM is "consumer rape"
Opera has Noscript and Adblock built in. My assessment:
Opera > Noscript
You can whilelist sites, blacklist sites, or any combination thereof with Opera. The same goes with Java, Flash and other plugins.
Opera Adblock Plus
Opera's contect blocker user interface is not as good as Adblock Plus's.
I just don't trust a browser from people that like to force ads EVERWHERE. I doubt they'll ever allow an extention to block their ads either...which makes them as bad as that adware/pay for browser named Opera
For me as a Web developer, even if it doesn't get much market share, it's already provided a great service (although it sure would be good to see it get market share, it's a nice browser). It has helped me significantly already in debugging Safari issues. With the site that I am currently developing, which is fairly JS/Ajax intensive, all of our Safari bugs showed up in Chrome as well. Since Chrome actually has a debugger (and a fairly decent one at that), I was able to use it to diagnose and fix the Safari issues in a fraction of the time. Of course if Apple were to release a debugger for Safari or a third party were to develop one, that would lessen the need, but Chrome currently solves a significant issue from a developer standpoint.
Maybe Opera needs to get Gmail working correctly? Just sayin, it's a two way street in web development.
Apple Blocking Opera on the Iphone
http://www.osnews.com/comments/20455
(blocking legit apps on the iphone is one of the stupidest things Apple has done in a long time)
You will forget this sig before you next see it
Opera user since 6.0 I think. I waited from 6.0 to upgrade to 9.0 I think. Big difference. =)
The thing is that it's not open and it doesn't come with plugin support (even though a lot of stuff is built in to that 5MB installer) and it acts weird for me sometimes (it's a Qt app that had its own file selector and yet it uses GTK for files now?) but I love it. I think it's more of a I-love-Qt, the main thing I like being the "smooth-tabing". An actual MDI. Pretty sure this is a GTK/Qt thing; I've seen Konqueror in screenshots move its panels to have them cascade, but when I use GTK apps it can't seem to get any better than folder-style tabs.
I've always wondered how they did it, though...
I'm running 9.62. I just remember it came with a banner back in the 90s.
I switched at 9.5 - bookmark synchronisation (ala Google Browser Sync) clinched the deal!
Yeah it's turned off for all of slashdot. So I use the old-school comments system (which I prefer anyway).
You could manipulate the per site preferences list directly, and block sites like doubleclick.net or whatever, it's a bit tedious though. Blocking a whole domain does the trick for me though. I see how you could have issues with it.
save the GNUs!
Opera.. well.. I heard that it was faster. The user interface didn't seem so fugly any more. I downloaded it and was extremely happy with the overall setup, except:
a) Horrible security without noscript. Noscript has provided the much-needed bridge over the gap between total paranoia and relative trust; :). We know skype phones home, who knows about IE when run in chinese locales, but any web browser is also a primary target for Chinese (and need I say, Wash D.C.) monitoring agencies. Hello ECHELON!
b) Not open source
That's probably likely. I think they need to work on it together. It's a JavaScript problem.
Strange how it works fine on IE,Firefox,Safari etc.
The problem seems to be that you can log in to your account and then it just takes you straight back to the login page instead of taking you through to whatever Google application you're trying to log in to. The cookies get set correctly and everything so if you type in the URL again it usually works.
It would be nice to have Opera listed as a 'supported' browser for Google applications though. Mind you, the JavaScript performance on Mac is terrible with Opera.
save the GNUs!
Not sure if this helps. It's a simple way to block externally loaded JS files in opera. You create a folder to store your UserJS files in, and any .js files you put there get loaded and run when a page loads. The script below blocks external javascript.
It's what I remember, not being near my normal comp right now. The next step I did on my home comp is to show a text link at the bottom of the page for each external script showing the host it comes from and setting it so clicking a link allows that script on that domain, storing the choice as a cookie.
Also, if you notice the @exclude in the top, that tells it to ignore this userjs file on that host. You can put as many as you want and there are other options there too.
// ==UserScript==
// @exclude http://*youtube.com/*
// ==/UserScript==
opera.addEventListener('BeforeExternalScript', function(e){
var topLevelDomainName = function(domain){
if(!domain)return; if(/^(?:\d{1,3}\.){3}\d{1,3}$/.test(domain)) return domain;
var a = domain.split('.'); var l = a.length; return (l > 1) ? a[l - 2] : domain;
};
var a = document.createElement('a');
a.href = e.element.src;
if(topLevelDomainName(window.location.hostname) != topLevelDomainName(a.host)) {
e.preventDefault();
}
}, false);
1 (short ton / firkin) = 89.1432354 slugs / keg
I tried to switch to Chrome. I really did. What killed it for me was all the textarea display and video playback bugs.
You can also use the content blocker to block domains or resources completely.
You can disable JS for specific domains. Or disable it globally and only enable it for selected domains.
You can also use the content blocker to simply block doubleclick.net completely.
I know it sounds lame, but I really can't stand the logo.