Next Nintendo Handheld To Be Powered By NVIDIA's Tegra Chipset

Vigile writes "When you sell over 100 million handheld gaming systems, everyone wants to be involved in your success; just ask Nintendo. As a company with many different obstacles in its path, NVIDIA could definitely use the boost in revenues that would come from partnering with a company like Nintendo on a handheld system, and it looks like the Tegra processor will make that happen. The NVIDIA Tegra processor is an SoC that runs a set of ARM cores, a GeForce-based graphics core and an HD video processor capable of 1080p output that would definitely give the current Nintendo DS/DSi systems a performance boost in line with the Sony PSP. The 'Nintendo TS,' as it has been dubbed, will apparently be ready for a late winter 2010 release and should put a spark in the mobile gaming market and give Nintendo's developers the power to bring higher quality games to the platform."

Comments

Zelda!

[Anonymous Coward]

Hell yea next Zelda DS game in 1080p!

Re:Zelda!

[hattig]

More likely two screens of 480x320 to 640x480, with 4xAA and decent filtering.

Unless they're dumping the dual-screen concept, but it's worked well so far.

Re:Zelda!

[Anonymous Coward]

Nokia internet tablets have 800x480 resolution, which would be nice for games, as long as the screen isn't too small.

Re:Zelda!

[VGPowerlord]

Hey, the next Zelda DS game is only a month away; much too soon for a system a year out! :P

Re:Zelda!

[Anonymous Coward]

TS, not DS.
Three screens, woohoo!

But my only worry now is battery life.
Are we to expect to see the Nintendo logo then power off?
Are we to even SEE the logo? It'll be like turning it on, light flashes and off.
Damn you Nintendo~, DAMN YOU~

Re:Zelda!

[noundi]

TS, not DS.
Three screens, woohoo!

But my only worry now is battery life.
Are we to expect to see the Nintendo logo then power off?
Are we to even SEE the logo? It'll be like turning it on, light flashes and off.
Damn you Nintendo~, DAMN YOU~

Regarding your power consumption concerns.

Re:Zelda!

[Toonol]

Which is MORE than enough for a handheld. There's no reason to pack in 1600x1080 resolution into a screen that's four inches across.

On a handheld, priorities are different than a home console. In addition to the obvious (like low power consumption), I would think resolution would pale in importance to other things like offloading physics or better compression or procedural generation of textures, to counteract the restricted processor/memory.

Re:Zelda!

[Anonymous Coward]

Wow, teenage angst in action!

Re:Zelda!

[DeKO]

Hey, the next Zelda DS game is only a month away;

Yeah, it's not like they ever delayed a Zelda game before... oh wait!

Re:Zelda!

[MemoryDragon]

Please forgive me of having played Occarina of time in 1200p with an emulator ;-)

Re:Zelda!

[jwilcox154]

Buzzz.. WRONG!

Chuck : Pretendo is planning on their next home console to only support 640x480 so why will this be any different? It is a fact that Microsoft and Sony give you 1080 while pretendo will always give you piss as in piss on you. Pretendo has never given a fuck about their developers. Of course you shitdot sheeple will continue to lock to Pretendo even if they repackage their crappy NES. Gene tell us what this fucktard will receive?

Gene : A razor, so he not have to search for a razor when he slits his fucking wrists. All of his fucktarded fudgepacking shitdot sheeple butt buddies will receive one as well. Back to you chuck.

Chuck : Only one other thing needs to be said to these fucktards Gene.

Gene : I know what it is.

Chuck and Gene : GO AHEAD! FUCKING FLAME AWAY OR WASTE YOUR GODDAMNED MOD POINTS FUCKTARED SHITDOT SHEEPLE!

Actually, the Nintendo system that is slate for a 2011 release will support 1080p as well as 480p.
http://gizmodo.com/5364077/next-generation-wii-coming-with-hd-graphics-and-new-controller-in-2011

Re:Zelda!

[VGPowerlord]

Hey, the next Zelda DS game is only a month away;

Yeah, it's not like they ever delayed a Zelda game before... oh wait!

Whoops, it's two months away, not one.

Anyway, last time they delayed a Zelda game, it was much farther out, and ended up getting ported to their new system with new (and pointless) controls*. Besides, Nintendo finally nailed down concrete North American and Europeans release dates, rather than the nebulous Q4 2009 date, just a week or two ago.

*The GameCube version of Twilight Princess is superior to the Wii version in every way except it lacks Widescreen. Or so I've heard; My aunt has had my GC copy since before I got an HDTV.

TS?

[sleeponthemic]

I'll wait for the screener.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

photo

[Anonymous Coward]

alleged picture of the new Nintendo TS here
http://www.nintendo-master.com/fichiers/N-1185275150.jpg

Re:photo

[mrdoogee]

Gawd that's ugly. Why not integrate the buttons into the main body. It seriously looks like a maxi pad. I hope this is just the rumor mill at work.

Re:photo

[Archaemic]

Disregard the "Copyright Shogmaster 2007" and you still get a hoax that doesn't look believable.

Re:photo

[Anonymous Coward]

Gawd that's ugly

I wish that I had mod points today so that I could punish you for misspelling a three letter word.

Re:photo

[surferx0]

Gawd that's ugly. Why not integrate the buttons into the main body. It seriously looks like a maxi pad. I hope this is just the rumor mill at work.

While probably not a reliable concept picture of the new device, the reason for the buttons being separated from the screen body is because this is supposed to show us slide/twist design where the screen can be turned to portrait mode for DS games and then turned to landscape mode and slid upwards like a typical cell phone design for TS games.

Although for that design to work the buttons would have to be nearly flush to the device to not interfere with the sliding screen. While that's fine for the ABXY buttons, a flush D-pad would be kind of ridiculous. Again, probably not real.

Re:photo

[BigHungryJoe]

are those wings on the sides for ultra-absorbency during "heavy flow" days?

Re:photo

[KDR_11k]

That and the screen would be exposed to scratches when the device is not in use.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[tepples]

...And will we be able to play SuperTux?

Not on the TS. Nintendo doesn't associate with amateurs or semiprofessionals. Seriously. If you want to run Linux on a gaming PDA, get a Pandora once it comes out.

That was fast

[FlyingBishop]

Nvidia's getting out of the chipset market so fast they're actually releasing new products already.

Re:That was fast

[TheRaven64]

Uh, what? Tegra was announced over a year ago and has been shipping for a while in the Zune.

Re:That was fast

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

Nvidia is, in fact, suspending development of further X86 chipsets(since AMD now includes ATI, and Intel is playing hardball with QPI), although they are continuing production of current ones. Tegra is a totally different product line.

So when can we expect 1080p on the Wii?

[tomhudson]

That's the *real* question. 1080p makes a bigger difference when hooked up to a big-screen TV than it will in a tiny hand-held.

Re:So when can we expect 1080p on the Wii?

[Necroloth]

and then how quick can the homebrewers get it to not only play dvd's but upscale it to 1080p :)

Re:So when can we expect 1080p on the Wii?

[relguj9]

That's the *real* question. 1080p makes a bigger difference when hooked up to a big-screen TV than it will in a tiny hand-held.

haha, kind of sad when their handheld will have better graphics than their console

Re:So when can we expect 1080p on the Wii?

[Anonymous Coward]

Ouputing 1080p and RENDERing 1080p are two very different things. Just ask the 360 or the ps3 . . . both of which upscale almost all of their games from a lower resolution.

Re:So when can we expect 1080p on the Wii?

[eharvill]

Wouldn't it be nice if the new hand held had a "mini-hdmi" connector so you could hook it up to a big screen?

Re:So when can we expect 1080p on the Wii?

[BikeHelmet]

The Wii will never have 1080p. For one thing, this SoC looks to be more powerful. O_o

Cell

[mbrod]

Would be nice if they also made this a GSM unlocked cell phone. So one could use it as a pre-pay cell phone as well.

Re:Cell

[Shikaku]

Because EVERY mobile device needs to be a cell phone, PDA, Alarm Clock, web browser, video game console, computer, hooker, and able to play blackjack. Just add a kitchen sink and it will be the perfect handheld, where playing 1080p on a tiny screen will make you want to throw up in a kitchen sink, so just add one on it!

Re:Cell

[Anonymous Coward]

I only have 4 pockets, and one of them is for my wallet and 2 of them is for my set of TI calculators. I can't fit both a handheld console and a phone in the remaining pocket! (I'm wearing my little sister's jeans)

Re:Cell

[wed128]

Well then it looks like you need to get a holster for those calculators, so you can quick-draw them, bucco

Re:Cell

[Anonymous Coward]

I'd rather they just have a little expansion bay inside if they ever decide to upgrade it.
Why aren't people sticking with expansion bays? You can get a lot of money from them instead of wasting so much money on features people might not even want to use.

Take the DS as an example.
With a slight increase in the height of one of the cases, the whole width of the device could be split up in to slots which could be used for expansions.
In these slots, there could be:
wireless hardware
webcam hardware, a section could be left hanging out at the bottom
cellular hardware
memory expansion, the memory cards could be placed in the side of the card, then the card is slide inside and all is done.

I'd die for hardware designed like this.

Re:Cell

[Anonymous Coward]

I only have 4 pockets, and one of them is for my wallet and 2 of them is for my set of TI calculators. I can't fit both a handheld console and a phone in the remaining pocket! (I'm wearing my little sister's jeans)

You're lying. Women's clothing never has pockets, as evidenced by the fact that any time a woman needs to retrieve an item she carries with her she has to spend at least a minute fishing through her purse for it. I'm convinced that clothing that appears to have pockets, such as jeans must have superficial pockets that are sewn shut.

All of this follows from the First Law of Women's Clothing: All women's clothing must minimize the convenience and comfort of its wearer.

Re:Cell

[sexconker]

I've never met a hooker who didn't know at least the basics of blackjack.

Re:Cell

[Turken]

So, what you're saying is that you want Nintendo to buy out Bug Labs and repackage their modular hand-held device into a shiny new casing?

The thing is though, that your dream hardware is a nightmare for developers and publishers since having that many add-ons and expansions would severely fragment the user base. Then you're back to the whole chicken-and-egg dilemma that gaming consoles have faced for years. Who's going to make a game that uses add-on X, if there's no guarantee that a significant number of system users have that add-on, and why should users go out and buy said add-on if there aren't enough games to make it worthwhile?

Re:Cell

[ProppaT]

Well, look at it this way. A cell phone, at its core, is very basic. A PDA is more complicated, but only really requires a stylus. A web browser requires very little besides a stylus. A phone just requires the camera components and a viewfinder of sorts. An MP3 player just requires a basic interface and a headphone jack. Combination devices such as the iPhone and Android phones have been very successful because each function is very basic.

No all-in-one device has ever successfully integrated games. You can argue til your blue in the face that the iPhone has, but it's a terrible platform for anything but point and click adventures, card games, and Monkey ball. The reason devices fail is that gaming is the single most complex task an all-in-one device needs to cover.

For me, if Nintendo made a phone version of the DS, I'd be all over it. I'd know gaming was adequately taken care of. The rest of the functions I might want are basic and simple to integrate and, in fact, the only one the DS hasn't already touched is the cell phone portion (and I believe there's hacked skype type programs you can use if you want to get nit picky).

I do agree, I hate it when extra functions are thrown onto a device just to say it can do more than one thing. I almost always prefer devices that do one thing and one thing perfectly; however, there's really no reason why a DS shouldn't be able to do any other funciton you'd want it to perfectly.

Re:Cell

[Anonymous Coward]

Hello, I am John Titor Jr. I come in peace with the Apple iPod Yocto, sold standard with a telepathic control knob and a holographic projector.

And here are the specs on my shiny new orb: (nobody uses box-shaped hardware anymore)
Personal Analogue Assistant (all digital is so 30's, we today use the brains of mutated test subjects from WWIII)
Calc.exe 17.5012 (don't worry, it's TI-83 compatible and made by TI's developers, MS bought Texas Instruments 40 years ago when the Z80 stopped being produced)
Alarm Clock
Heart Rate Monitor
Toothbrush
Nail Clippers
Stool Analyzer
Pepper Spray
Insulin and Glucose Monitor (for the diabetics)
Medicine Dispenser
Scissors
25 piece Knife Set
Time Machine (I believe this was first included with Mac OS X Leopard, but this version also allows physical time travel)
Human Teleportation Device (never have another traffic jam)
Holographic Interweb 4.0 Browser with Microsoft-Apple-Nintendo-Sony-Google(R) Übersearch
Microsoft-Apple-Nintendo-Sony-Google(R) Singularity ENT (Extremely New Technology, still BSODs, or more like Blue Coma of Death, do not use when driving)
Microsoft-Apple-Nintendo-Sony-Google(R) Virtual OmniBoy 65536 (65536-bit tech with 800 Giganeuron bio-brain and dedicated 512 YB holographic storage, pretty puny, but OK for a pocket device; allows up to 1 trillion players from anywhere in the galaxy to play at once)
Virtual Galaxy of Warcraft, Mobile Edition (it has other 3DVR games too, but who needs 'em)
Virtual Neo-Vegas Ultimate (GoW is great, but wow, you should see the hookers and blackjack in this game)
Still no kitchen sink, but it does come with a nanobot-powered self-sterilizing vacuum for removing fluids like spit or throw up, which is split into component chemicals to power a biomass generator and feed the wetware, and a water spigot that works by removing moisture from the air at a maximum of 3 gallons/minute (close enough, though, eh?).

Oh yeah, I wrote this message to send a warning, not to brag about my awesome 1337^1337 iStuff. Though their software be über-slick, fear Microsoft-Apple-Nintendo-Sony-Google(R). The CEO is a cybernetically-enhanced clone of Bill Gates, and the entire board is made up of B.A.L.L.M.E.R. robots, their meetings littered with cries of "Developers" and throwings of chairs. Their corporate motto is "A thousand nations of the Software Empire descend upon you!" Some fear that they are beginning to sell crushed human remains as "environmentally friendly" food products.

Alas, my captcha, verily, I kid thee not and so swear upon my life and the lives of all the Galaxy's Earthsent children, is "despair." How apropos.

Re:Cell

[Shikaku]

Yes all those features are really nice...

But does it run linux?

Wondering about other specs

[the_scoots]

I wonder if they'll "upgrade" it like the PSP so you can get to repurchase your older games through DLC?

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Again]

I wonder if they'll "upgrade" it like the PSP so you can get to repurchase your older games through DLC?

I am guessing that they are watching people's reaction to Sony's decision to drop physical media and depending on the reaction, make their decision.

I don't think that Nintendo will go that route. Think of the Wii. They have old games for sale on the Virtual Console and they could have put Gamecube games on there too but instead they chose to fully* support old Gamecube games.

I am not sure if I want to give up physical media just yet. I would like to be able to bring all my games around with me without having to carry a bunch of cases. For me to switch completely to digital game distribution I would like the following

1. Loan / borrow / trade games with friends
2. Not be forced to rebuy all my games when I lose / break my gaming console
3. The game should be cheaper because there is "no" shipping cost, no store taking their cut and no physical material being produced
4. I want an instruction booklet dammit! I RTM and I don't care what anyone says but I want an instruction booklet. A digital one will do just fine.

Oh and profit too but I'm not sure how.

*fully meaning all games except PSO :(

Re:Wondering about other specs

[mrdoogee]

The manufacturing cost for the DS flash carts is undoubtedly much lower than UMD was... I'd assume that unless the market just falls in love with the PSPgo (It won't), Nintendo will play it safe and keep some form of physical media.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[tepples]

WiiWare breaks your demands 1 and 2 but satisfies 3 and 4. For example, Tetris for DS was $30, but Tetris for Wii is $12. WiiWare games are about the same size in megabytes (and presumably budget) as DS games, yet WiiWare is much cheaper to buy. And all downloaded Wii channels have an Operations Guide: press the home button at the game's title screen.

The big problem that I can see with the Nintendo Points stores is that unlike Apple's App Store, they're for day-job developers only, not part-time developers.

*fully meaning all games except PSO

Wii also dropped support for any game that relied on the Game Boy Player accessory, such as the entire library of games for Game Boy, Game Boy Color, and Game Boy Advance (minus GBA Video and a few tilt-sensor and camera games).

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Anonymous Coward]

Wrong on one point. You can still use the tilt games, you just have to tilt the whole 'Cube. Which is nice because you get the added effect of looking insane.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Fozzyuw]

1. Loan / borrow / trade games with friends
2. Not be forced to rebuy all my games when I lose / break my gaming console
3. The game should be cheaper because there is "no" shipping cost, no store taking their cut and no physical material being produced
4. I want an instruction booklet dammit! I RTM and I don't care what anyone says but I want an instruction booklet. A digital one will do just fine.

Unfortunately point #1 will not likely every happen with digital media due to the drawbacks for companies doing this.

However, point #2 is already here. Services like Steam allows you to download your games to new systems. There's some rules here and there and it suffers from the "all eggs in one basket" scenario, if Steam shuts down do you loose your media? Thought more companies with subscriptions and accounts, such as World of Warcraft, allow you to download the client directly from your account. It knows what client you should get based on your account activations.

Point #3 (and #4) is a bit of a misconception. It's true there's cost savings involved for the company. But when you spend $10 million on making a game, $60,000 on the box art and $0.02 per box carton doesn't really effect the price of the game. Likewise, shipping costs are insignificant to the cost of the final product.

And in the end, it's still about economics. The price is set to what people are willing to pay for (and the company is able to make a profit from). If people are still willing to pay $50-$60 for digital media, the company will sell it at that price. They will simply see better profit margins for it. And as you said, you still want a booklet, so it looks like they didn't really save any money on the box art anyways, since they're designing all the art, with-or-without a box, as part of game concepts and advertisements or digital booklets.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Yvan256]

ROM != flash.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[mrdoogee]

I stand corrected.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[sexconker]

1 - Never
2 - Maybe, if you call customer service and bitch.
3 - LOL
4 - You'll get a crappy web page or PDF with more health and safety warnings and "how to press the power button" information than actual game-relevant content.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[LordVader717]

Depends on how strict you consider the "read-only" part, but whatever is in the DS cards, it sure isn't mask-ROM or fuse-ROM. It's some type of block-addressable solid state memory, so it's likely very similar to flash.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Yvan256]

ROM = Read-Only Memory, so anything that can't be written or erased qualifies. The access method doesn't change a thing.

Why would Nintendo store the game data in flash memory anyway? That would just help potential hacks to rewrite carts with other games.

But there's also the fact that most Nintendo DS carts do also have built-in flash too, in order to save games in progress. I guess the carts could be called hybrid ROM/Flash.

Wether or not it's cheaper to make than UMD, well, I'm not sure about that either. UMD is optical, so the cost even with the caddy would still be extremely low, especially since there's probably only one caddy model to manufacture. And since a regular, full-size CD-R costs mere pennies to make, a smaller, non-writable disc is probably pennies too.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Again]

4 - You'll get a crappy web page or PDF with more health and safety warnings and "how to press the power button" information than actual game-relevant content.

And I will read that crappy web page in hope of getting useful information. I have a well developed skill of skimming and I can skim an instruction booklet taking note of the important information very quickly. Much quicker then the stupid tutorial most games these days make you play at the beginning. And the tutorial totally breaks the feel of the game right from the beginning.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Again]

2 - Maybe, if you call customer service and bitch.

Oh, and I am very good at calling customer services and bitching. I spent a summer once working at a call centre and I know how effective someone bitching can be.

There are two steps to bitching. State very clearly what you want. Just say what you want and ask them to give it to you. If they care why you want it then they will ask. If that doesn't work, ask to speak to the manager. Again, state what it is that you want them to do for you. If this doesn't work, then again, try to escalate to someone with more authority. Cry if you need to.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[Toonol]

I am guessing that they are watching people's reaction to Sony's decision to drop physical media and depending on the reaction, make their decision.

I would phrase that in past tense. The reaction to the PSPGo is already pretty clear, and you can bet the Nintendo will not repeat that mistake. They may very well drop physical media, but they will not handle it like Sony did.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[tepples]

you just have to tilt the whole 'Cube. Which is nice because you get the added effect of looking insane.

And stressing the case fans, which is why Nintendo recommends against it.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[j0nb0y]

Of course! That's what Nintendo fans want.

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/9/15/

"I can't wait to buy Zelda again."
"Which one?"
"All of them. Over and over."

I'm a huge Nintendo fanboy, and I don't dare count how many copies of Zelda and Metroid I've purchased over the years.

Re:Wondering about other specs

[LordVader717]

ROM = Read-Only Memory, so anything that can't be written or erased qualifies.

Flash is EEPROM or "Electrically Erasable Programmable Read Only Memory". The term ROM was used to distinguish from volatile RAM, but it isn't strict.

Flash memory is used to describe EEPROM which is block-addressable, instead of byte-addressable. That would be the case with DS cards.

Why would Nintendo store the game data in flash memory anyway?

They use whatever's cost effective. And that certainly isn't mask-rom or fuse-rom.

That would just help potential hacks to rewrite carts with other games.

Replacing memory is easy, getting code to run isn't. They could just solder in their own ROM chip if it were that simple.

But there's also the fact that most Nintendo DS carts do also have built-in flash too, in order to save games in progress. I guess the carts could be called hybrid ROM/Flash.

The types of write-permission doesn't change the underlying technology.

Re:Flashcards

[tomhudson]

Who cares, I'm waiting to pirate the games. Fuck you nintendo.

me@slashdot > --gamemode
SLASHGAME: YOU ARE STANDING IN A FIELD
SLASHGAME: LOOK NORTH
SLASHGAME: YOU SEE AN ANONYMOUS COWARD
SLASHGAME: WALK NORTH
SLASHGAME: THE ANONYMOUS COWARD GREETS YOU BY SAYING "FUCK YOU NINTENDO"
SLASHGAME: INVENTORY
SLASHGAME: YOU HAVE 2 COOKIES
SLASHGAME: QUERY COOKIES
SLASHGAME: COOKIE #1 IS COOKIE WITH POWER OF SU
SLASHGAME: COOKIE #2 IS COOKIE OF APPLE POWER
SLASHGAME: DROP COOKIE WITH POWER OF SU
SLASHGAME: YOU DROP THE COOKIE WITH POWER OF SU
SLASHGAME: ANONYMOUS COWARD PICKS UP COOKIE WITH POWER OF SU
SLASHGAME: IN SOVIET UNION, COOKIE EATS ANONYMOUS COWARD
SLASHGAME: EXIT
me@slashdot >

The street doesn't believe it

[afidel]

On a day where most of the microchip stocks are up on good Intel earnings NVDA is down.

Re:The street doesn't believe it

[PhrostyMcByte]

I hope this TS is real -- a true hardware upgrade is exactly what these portable systems need. The iPhone 3GS is a great deal more powerful than the PSPs and DS. I wonder how worried Sony is, considering their new PSP Go doesn't have any hardware capability upgrades (other than Bluetooth).

Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

Portable game systems are now competing with cell phones. Nintendo needs to realize that for their next portable game system or it will be limited to elementary and middle school kids. Beyond that age, they want a PDA / cell phone.

Granted, there are some big limitations to a cell phone as a gaming platform. The DS and DSi are much cheaper than the iPhone or even the iPod touch, and they have better control inputs. But that may change with future phones, especially Android phones.

The next DS also needs to be open to developers. That is a huge market that Nintendo missed. I know kids who have hacked DS's because they not only get games, but they get a scheduler, dictionary, and Wikipedia. Had Nintendo sold basic PDA functionality then the DS would have widened it's market. It is amazing how big the homebrew community is. I doubt that the homebrew community will spend the effort to reverse-engineer the next Nintendo hand-held when they could buy a cheap, open cell phone for the same price.

We are really seeing hand-held device convergence. I know people who don't carry a watch any longer because they have a cell phone. Nintendo needs to widen their thinking.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Aladrin]

Right, because nobody over the age of 12 owns a DS...

Wait, no. That's not right. I have one, and so does my: Mother, father, sister, both nephews... That's just off the top of my head, and only people actually related to me by blood. My youngest niece owns one, too, but she's actually under 12, so...

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[richy freeway]

I doubt that the homebrew community will spend the effort to reverse-engineer the next Nintendo hand-held when they could buy a cheap, open cell phone for the same price.

I think you're REALLY underestimating the homebrew communities. They'll hack it just because they can.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[nlawalker]

Convergence is great, but if Nintendo turned their next portable game system into a phone, they would substantially reduce their potential market share by excluding all the people who already have a phone and don't want to switch to another one, or who just want the game system and don't want to pay for the phone components. Plus, Nintendo has proven that they can hold their own against giants from other industries who have attempted to move in on their space by sticking to what they know: games. Having to cooperate with mobile phone providers, subscription plans and the like is not in Nintendo's genes.

Many here may disagree with their stance on online/social gaming, their underpowered console as compared to their competitors, or their focus on expanding the market with ideas like motion control or promotion of casual gaming as opposed to catering to video game enthusiasts, but the last couple years of sales numbers have shown that Nintendo knows what they are doing and is perfectly comfortable continuing down that path.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Connie_Lingus]

+1 Absolutely Correct

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[HaZardman27]

Nintendo needs to widen their thinking.

I think the DSi proves that they have already begun to do so. If any of the three big game companies (Nintendo, Sony & Microsoft) have proven that they can reach the casual/mainstream audience, it's Nintendo. All they really have left to do is cut out their idiotic fear of the internet.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[mrdoogee]

Totally agree.

Also, exclusivity deals. Apple and AT&t, for instance. It wasn't Apple that wanted to be stuck with one carrier, but the US phone market more or less dictates it. I'd hate to have to miss out on Nintendo's newest handheld for 18 mos/3 years because they have a exclusive deal with Sprint, or Verizon, ect...

Keep the phone hardware off it.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Abcd1234]

Portable game systems are now competing with cell phones. Nintendo needs to realize that for their next portable game system or it will be limited to elementary and middle school kids. Beyond that age, they want a PDA / cell phone.

Uhh... no, we don't.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Anonymous Coward]

Portable game systems are now competing with cell phones. Nintendo needs to realize that for their next portable game system or it will be limited to elementary and middle school kids. Beyond that age, they want a PDA / cell phone.

Granted, there are some big limitations to a cell phone as a gaming platform. The DS and DSi are much cheaper than the iPhone or even the iPod touch, and they have better control inputs. But that may change with future phones, especially Android phones.

The next DS also needs to be open to developers. That is a huge market that Nintendo missed. I know kids who have hacked DS's because they not only get games, but they get a scheduler, dictionary, and Wikipedia. Had Nintendo sold basic PDA functionality then the DS would have widened it's market. It is amazing how big the homebrew community is. I doubt that the homebrew community will spend the effort to reverse-engineer the next Nintendo hand-held when they could buy a cheap, open cell phone for the same price.

We are really seeing hand-held device convergence. I know people who don't carry a watch any longer because they have a cell phone. Nintendo needs to widen their thinking.

Portable game systems are now competing with cell phones. Nintendo needs to realize that for their next portable game system or it will be limited to elementary and middle school kids. Beyond that age, they want a PDA / cell phone.

Granted, there are some big limitations to a cell phone as a gaming platform. The DS and DSi are much cheaper than the iPhone or even the iPod touch, and they have better control inputs. But that may change with future phones, especially Android phones.

The next DS also needs to be open to developers. That is a huge market that Nintendo missed. I know kids who have hacked DS's because they not only get games, but they get a scheduler, dictionary, and Wikipedia. Had Nintendo sold basic PDA functionality then the DS would have widened it's market. It is amazing how big the homebrew community is. I doubt that the homebrew community will spend the effort to reverse-engineer the next Nintendo hand-held when they could buy a cheap, open cell phone for the same price.

We are really seeing hand-held device convergence. I know people who don't carry a watch any longer because they have a cell phone. Nintendo needs to widen their thinking.

portable gaming units are not competing with phones. That is the same thing that was said with the computer and the consoles when the computer gaming industry took off....still waiting for that to come to fruition....hard core gamers are hardcore gamers. they will always want a platform that is specific to gaming and gaming alone. there will be some folks that move away from handhelds, but the industry doesn't have to worry about that being a major issue for quite some time. look at the figures before you judge the data.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[LWATCDR]

Unless game compatable Cells come down I don't see it.
Nintendo has a great software and customer base.
Of course it is possible that if the carriers all select LTE and it is everywhere, and the carriers become dumb pipes, then we could see a new age of devices.
You buy your LTE account and then pick a device. Then pick a VOIP company and your set.
Imagine the devices we could see and the servies. Prices would fall and service would improve.
Just not going to happen.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Anonymous Coward]

Please stop trying to turn everything into a cell phone. I don't want my game system to also be a cell phone. I don't want to have to upgrade my game system in order to upgrade my cell phone, or buy multiple cell phones because I want both a DS and a PSP.

And most importantly I don't want to have to pay a monthly bill to play video games.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

I didn't say that, or anything like it. You put words in my mouth then argued against them. It would be silly of me to say that since I am 33 and I own a Nintendo DS and I write software for it. I have one because my immediate circle of friends own them.

What I said is that the next generation of devices won't appeal to the older crowd unless they have PDA capabilities.

I used to know a dozen 30-somethings with DSs -- every one had a mod chip. That was about 3 years ago. Now, at least half of those same people have iPhones, and don't touch their DSs. I'm predicting that this trend will continue.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

I am part of that homebrew community. I get it. But you must understand the level of effort that goes into it, and the reward.

Hacking the DS was special because the hardware was great, and cheap: you could do 10 times as much with it as Nintendo was actually doing. That makes it really cool. But the DS is no longer unique. What takes considerable effort and reverse-engineering on the DS, can now be done trivially with modern devices.

You are right that somebody will hack it - probably just to be able to copy games, but it won't be the same since those developers can spend less effort for greater effect on another platform.

And if Nintendo opens the platform, the entire point becomes moot.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

What happens when, in the future, a cell phone is a 50 cent piece of hardware that can be embedded into a wristwatch? Will people not buy that wristwatch just because it has a cell phone in it?

I don't like carrying multiple devices. So I hacked my DS and made it a PDA, browser, etc. But then I had to carry a phone. And much like many people, I said the heck with carrying around the DS/PDA since my phone did all that and more.

I agree that convergence could result in some overlap in purpose. But I don't think anyone will refuse to buy a device just because it includes a feature they won't use. And I suspect that in the future you won't have a choice. Either that: or we will carry around a dumb LCD display, and we will buy tiny little modules for it like a cell phone and a gaming system. That's gives you the best of both worlds - convergence, without carrying around redundant devices or paying for what you don't need.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[sexconker]

Portable game systems are now competing with cell phones.

No, they aren't.
They really, really, aren't.
Despite the attempt to shoehorn gaming into phones over the last decade and Apple's graphs about the app store.

Some people really do not understand two basic concepts:

1: People who buy games prefer to play them on a dedicated gaming device. People who buy phones prefer to use them as phones, and now PDAs, media players, etc. But without standardized hardware, platforms, and form factors, games will not take off on phones.

2: 400,000 DS games were sold last week. At an average price of $35.

We are really seeing hand-held device convergence. I know people who don't carry a watch any longer because they have a cell phone. Nintendo needs to widen their thinking.

Until people are routinely deciding between game x on DS/PSP or game y on their phone, the markets are completely separate. The economies of the respective markets in relation to games is clear cut.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[sexconker]

Many here may disagree with ... their focus on expanding the market with ideas like motion control...

Haven't you heard? MS and Sony both unveiled motion controls, so now they're cool.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

.still waiting for that to come to fruition.

Really? I know people who bought Sony Playstations to use as a DVD player. And PS3s as a blu-ray player. And XBOXs to stream Tivo. Who decide between buying a game for their PC, or for their console. So that day came and went about 5 years ago. Some people even browse the web or do social networking on their consoles.

.hard core gamers are hardcore gamers. they will always want a platform that is specific to gaming and gaming alone.

The people I just described are the new generation of hardcore gamers. 20-somethings who buy the latest game that just came out. The ones who spend hours a day getting their Halo rankings higher.

They don't care if the platform is specific to gaming or not, so long as gaming isn't compromised in some way. The iPhone isn't a gaming device because it has no controller. But that doesn't mean that a device with a controller could not also have a phone in it. Or be a PDA. The current DS is exactly that, but only thanks to the homebrew community.

look at the figures before you judge the data.

I have looked at all the figures which you have shown me. Why do people post things like that without even providing a link?

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Ogive17]

I just got back from a trip to Japan, many people there use the DS as a PDA. I've seen them used as a learning supplement devices as well.

I'm not sure if these different uses were spearheaded by Nintendo or the developers, but in Japan they seem to use the DS for everything you mentioned in your post.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

Yeah, price is probably the biggest reason that what I'm describing may not happen for another generation or so. But I suspect that if Nintendo decided, tomorrow, to make the DSi a cell phone, that it would not severely impact the price. It already has wireless capabilities, a touch screen, a camera, and a decent enough processor to decrypt WPA.

I'd love to know: Would it add $10? $50? $100? That still wouldn't double the price of the item - but for many people, it would more than double the usefulness.

My guess is that at some point in the future, adding cellular support will be akin to adding USB support. It will be a little chip that somebody buys and can put into a device. And when THAT day comes, you'll find cell phones in things you never imagined. And those devices will suddenly become a lot smarter, and we will wonder what we ever did without it.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

I don't want my game system to also be a cell phone.

Fair enough. But if it had one optionally - what harm would it do?

. I don't want to have to upgrade my game system in order to upgrade my cell phone,

Why would you have to do so?

or buy multiple cell phones because I want both a DS and a PSP.

How would that be a problem? If they both had cell phones, then you would activate one of them as a cell phone but not the other. Then you would carry around two devices. If they were not cell phones, then you would carry around 3 devices: the DS, the PSP, and the cell phone. And odds are, the cell phone probably also has games on it too. That sounds like a pain in the butt to me. Literally, since that would require some big pants. :-)

I think I am starting to understand the responses I'm getting. People seem to assume that if you put a cell phone in something, that you must activate it! Rethink that assumption.

The only real disadvantage to this would be price. And I'm betting that since they already have wireless networking, camera, touch screens, 3D graphics, and removable storage - that a cellular chip won't overtly increase the cost.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Dudeman_Jones]

Portable game systems are now competing with cell phones

No, they aren't. Go read an NPD sales chart and try to claim that the DS has seen any loss of market share to the iPhone. And by the way, who are you to declare that handheld systems only interest 8th graders? Last I checked I'm 22, I still like my Game Boy Advance, and I want to get a PSP.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Dudeman_Jones]

You may be a part of the homebrew community, but you don't seem to understand that one simple fact about it.

Why do they hack devices? The same reason the first man climbed Mount Everest. Because it was there. And once one person opens a crack you can be sure that others will help force it wider.

On one final note though, if Nintendo were to create a sanctioned Homebrew Channel it would probably be the smartest move they would have made in the last 5 years.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Anonymous Coward]

Elementary school kids often have cell phones too. There are even special models designed to only allow access to numbers in a phone book or disable text messaging. I haven't seen one that lets you limit the number of text messages that can be sent though. that would be too useful for customers and affect the carrier's profits.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Duradin]

What harm would it do?

Nintendo would have to support the damn thing. If they didn't get an exclusive deal they'd have to deal with random people having random problems on random carriers. Even if they did get an exclusive carrier they'd still have to deal with random people having random problems on a certain carrier. I'd rather have Nintendo sticking to games.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[LWATCDR]

"It will be a little chip that somebody buys and can put into a device. "
It is pretty much that way now. The problem is that the device must pass FCC testing and then get picked up by a carrier.
And then you have to have the software for it.
I just don't know if a $200 Nintendo cell phone would sell when you can get an iPhone for $99.
Maybe but I just don't think that Nintendo wants to make a bad cell phone that is also a good DS or a good cell phone that is a bad DS.
Trying to make a Good Cell phone that is a Good DS may not be possible.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[nlawalker]

What happens when, in the future, a cell phone is a 50 cent piece of hardware that can be embedded into a wristwatch?

When that happens, and when it can be sold no-strings-attached without some kind of contract or network/service lock-in, then it wouldn't be a limiting factor. I guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

I don't think anyone will refuse to buy a device just because it includes a feature they won't use.

If that was true the iPod touch wouldn't exist, and everyone would just have iPhones. Again, we can chat again when a cell phone is a 50 cent piece of hardware that doesn't have any strings attached, but that's a long ways off, if it ever happens. Same for GPS, etc. etc. Sure, we can now put a calculator in everything, but not everything is as simple as a calculator (and not just for hardware reasons).

we will carry around a dumb LCD display, and we will buy tiny little modules for it like a cell phone and a gaming system. That's gives you the best of both worlds - convergence, without carrying around redundant devices or paying for what you don't need.

I like this idea, but it still has it's limitations. What are the features of the LCD? Does it have multi-touch? What kind of buttons? How many colors? How many modules can it accept? Can the modules talk to each other? To the network? How are the modules licensed and sold? Perhaps most importantly: who will make it, and how will they drive these decisions?

Convergence will always suffer from these kinds of problems. Anywhere you share a platform, you share limitations.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

Some clarifications here:

The problem is that the device must pass FCC testing and then get picked up by a carrier.

The FCC process won't stop companies like Nintendo: they have to do that anyway. The chip manufacturers have the hard work. Also, cell phones do not need to be "picked-up" by a carrier.

I just don't know if a $200 Nintendo cell phone would sell when you can get an iPhone for $99.

Why not? It does today, even without the cell phone feature.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

I've heard that in Japan they do sell software to do this. Outside of Japan it is all homebrew. But while Nintendo has one hand creating very limited PDA software exclusive to Japan, their other hand is preventing such software from being released outside of Japan. I find that strange.

Now that I reflect, this same thing happened with the original NES. They started to turn it into a computer, but only in Japan, and only at the end of the product's life cycle.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

who are you to declare that handheld systems only interest 8th graders?

I never said that. I'm 33, and I have a DS, my immediate circle of friends all have the Nintendo DS + a mod chip.

Go read an NPD sales chart and try to claim that the DS has seen any loss of market share to the iPhone.

True, but look at the DSi charts. Also, look at the game sales. Those people who bought a DS 3 years ago aren't buying a DSi. That group I referenced earlier? They haven't touched those DS's in years. They moved on to iPhones and Android phones. The DS is too limiting.

Next, look at the developer community. Some of those homebrew DS developers became iPhone developers, and will probably become Android developers. Especially the good ones. A few of them just gave up on the DS and stopped releasing updates because it was such a hassle.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[hkmwbz]

A lot of people own a DS because it's the perfect casual gaming device. However, phone capabilities are quickly catching up with dedicated portable gaming systems. The DS was right for its time. Now phones will take over as the casual gaming devices of choice.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[KDR_11k]

The flashcarters aren't exactly a worthwhile market anyway.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[LWATCDR]

Well to get it cheap in the US you must get a carrier to pick it up. With out subsidy I think it would be closer to $300 or $400. Passing FCC adds cost and you are right that it wouldn't be a problem for a big company like Nintendo but I was thinking of small developers with a good idea.
In the US for a phone to be a hit it must be picked up by a carrier. If you want it on the biggest carrier than it must support CDMA and currently must be approved by the carrier.
Nintendo will not produce a cell phone without a launch partner.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[MobyDisk]

With out subsidy I think it would be closer to $300 or $400

Whoaaa!!! I think that's a bit steep. There are cell phones out that that are $20 with no contract. $40 gets you a camera and Bluetooth.

If Nintendo wants to target a $200 price point, and they decide to add a cell phone option to it -- the maximum cost is $220.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[LWATCDR]

Take a look at what an Iphone, N95, or Palm Pre cost off contract.
A next gen Gameboy phone would probably be just as expensive.
But
A. I don't work for Nintendo so I don't get to set pricing.
and
B. I don't think it will happen.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Toonol]

I agree. I think Apple has far more to fear from Nintendo than Nintendo does from Apple.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[LordVader717]

I think you're vastly overestimating the homebrew market and the savviness of consumers. But most customers of DS flash-cards are challenged by copying pirated games over, let alone use homebrew software.

The cell-phone market is no different. The kids are impressed by bells and whistles. Give them a handful of internet sites they can surf and they won't worry about the locked down handset or the limited internet access.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[node 3]

I agree. I think Apple has far more to fear from Nintendo than Nintendo does from Apple.

How so?

Apple has very little to fear from Nintendo. There's no way a DS Phone would take off, and even if it did, it's not going to decimate the iPhone market.

Conversely, Nintendo doesn't have anything to fear currently with regards to their Wii market, but their DS market is very much vulnerable to the iPhone/iPod touch. I'm not saying the DS is going away any time soon, but that it could very well dry up as people decide that with their iPhone/iPod they don't really need a dedicated gaming device.

Certainly, there would be people who would choose the opposite route were Nintento to release a phone, but I'm highly confident that significantly more people would choose the Apple option over the Nintendo option.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Dudeman_Jones]

Except that noone seriously considers the iPhone a serious gaming device, especially not the gaming community. Just because Apple wants it to be one doesn't make it one.

And to be honest, I think it's far more plausible that Nintendo would get Skype onto the DSi than the iPhone ever becoming a legitimate threat to Nintendo's portable marketshare.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Anonymous Coward]

YES, WE CAN!

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Aladrin]

Only if they massively improve battery life. I can't afford to let my gaming kill my phone battery, and I don't want my talking to kill my gaming battery.

For me, and many other people, the 2 devices are best left separate.

(And let's not even get into the logistics of making a good phone interface and gaming interface co-exist.)

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[node 3]

Except that noone seriously considers the iPhone a serious gaming device, especially not the gaming community.

Which is an exceptionally meaningless statement. All that matters is if it sates most people's need for games. And this is something it does *very* well.

Just because Apple wants it to be one doesn't make it one.

No, but the exceptional success of games on the App Store *does* make it one. You can go on all you want about lack of a control pad, but that comes across more as trying to justify a prejudiced conclusion than coming up with an argument that matches reality, *especially* when there is such a large number of people who are completely satisfied using an iPhone/iPod as their primary portable gaming device.

And to be honest, I think it's far more plausible that Nintendo would get Skype onto the DSi than the iPhone ever becoming a legitimate threat to Nintendo's portable marketshare.

Skype on the DSi will have *zero* effect on the iPhone. On the other hand, choosing to use the iPhone as one's portable gaming system *will* adversely affect Nintendo's market share.

Make no mistake, there are a *lot* of people who have an iPhone today who might otherwise have bought a DS, but now have absolutely no desire to buy one. There is pretty much no one with a DS that no longer want an iPhone. This will remain true even with Skype on a DS, or even a full-fledged DS Phone.

That's reality. That's how things actually are. Just because you don't think an iPhone is a gaming device, or you just don't like the iPhone, or whatever... None of that alters reality.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[hkmwbz]

Battery life isn't really much of a concern to most people. You can basically charge the phone at any time. It will improve, of course. As for interfaces, they only need to be good enough.

Re:Open it, and make it a phone

[Dudeman_Jones]

1.) I never stated that the Skype on the DSi would have an impact on the iPhone.

2.) As far as the success of gaming on the iPhone, last I heard it's quickly become a haven of shovelware.

Yes the iPhone is a powerful all-in-one portable device. Yes I can see the benefits of that. No I don't think that makes it the golden bullet portable gaming revolution that the Wall Street Journal would like to think it is, because the fact remains that the people in the gaming industry who get paid to make the type of games that actually turn significant profits don't see it that way. I'm sorry, they don't! Want proof? Name three game development companies that make iPhone versions of their main franchises in-house. Off the top of my head, I can only think of two; ID Software who last I heard had plans for Quake on the iPhone, and Pop-Cap Games, who only make the snack-size time wasters that thrive on the iPhone anyway. Damn near every other game developer licenses out their properties to a third-party, who in turn tend to make lackluster mobile versions of these franchises that are quickly forgotten in a week. Does that mean that the iPhone can never compete in the handheld market? No, it doesn't. Does that mean that cell phones can never join in the handheld market? No, it doesn't. It does mean however that they aren't anywhere close to being actually competitive.

You want the gaming community to take the iPhone seriously, you are going to need to show a game that's more worthwhile than the 5 minutes you fiddle with Lemonade Tycoon at the bus stop. The iPhone NEEDS a game with the same type of impact and gameplay quality as something like Mario Kart, Final Fantasy Tactics, Sonic the Hedgehog, so on and so on. iPhone games are still in the Peggle era right now. You want to compete with the handheld gaming industry, as opposed to the shovelware festival that is the iPhone app store, then you need to be holding yourself to the same standards as Nintendo, Sony, and those developers who make the grade A titles that define the experiences for the DS and the PSP.

Simply having a ton of snack-size freeware games doesn't cut it.

To Be Powered By NVIDIA's Tegra Chipset

[Eideteker]

And, you know, batteries.

Re:To Be Powered By NVIDIA's Tegra Chipset

[Coren22]

You didn't read the spec sheet on the Tegra? It has a built in fusion reactor. You really should keep up with the times... ;)

Re:To Be Powered By NVIDIA's Tegra Chipset

[Theoboley]

my initial thought was, this thing is either going run so hot that it'll melt the plastic casing/burst into flames..etc or if they manage to cool it well, it'll be like holding onto an old school game gear x 10 size wise.

Re:To Be Powered By NVIDIA's Tegra Chipset

[Anonymous Coward]

Question is, how many batteries and for how long... especially with a multicore ARM solution...

Zune HD ports anyone?

[kantos]

With the same processor as the Zune HD, I wonder if anyone will port casual games from one to the other? I don't think they would port anything large but at least in theory it could happen....

Re:Zune HD ports anyone?

[bertoelcon]

I doubt it due to major differences in controls or other hardware.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[HaZardman27]

If it ever ends up coming out.

Zune HD has the Tegra

[bertoelcon]

The Zune HD has a Tegra too. NVIDIA wasn't gonna die until the Zune HD got discontinued or got a different chipset.

Re:Zune HD has the Tegra

[Red Flayer]

The Zune HD has a Tegra too. NVIDIA wasn't gonna die until the Zune HD got discontinued or got a different chipset.

MS could have stockpiled the chips, right? A one-off batch of a million chips in a warehouse somewhere would last them for, what, 30 years of Zune sales?

I keed, I keed. But seriously...

Re:Zune HD has the Tegra

[bertoelcon]

That's highly possible but they at least had to pay for them and if NVIDIA went out while products where still being made with their chips then those products would have their own futures questioned. The Zune has been iffy enough as it is to get the half a percent of market share it has now.

Re:Zune HD has the Tegra

[LWATCDR]

Yea I am sure that Zune sales will keep nVidia alive...
Actually the ZuneHD is a better media player than the iPod Touch.
The problem is that the Touch is a better platform than the ZuneHD.
The ZuneHD lacks an appliacation store and the software that is available for it really is nothing to write home about.
Too bad since the hardware is better than the iPodTouch.

Re:Zune HD has the Tegra

[bertoelcon]

Yea I am sure that Zune sales will keep nVidia alive...

Not alone but Microsoft might keep it alive enough.

Actually the ZuneHD is a better media player than the iPod Touch. The problem is that the Touch is a better platform than the ZuneHD.

I'll agree to that.

The ZuneHD lacks an appliacation store and the software that is available for it really is nothing to write home about.

None != Shitty. It has an app store it just sucks hard, and You can still get them installed the old way in Visual Studio with XNA too.

Too bad since the hardware is better than the iPodTouch.

Re:Zune HD has the Tegra

[LWATCDR]

"None != Shitty. It has an app store it just sucks hard, and You can still get them installed the old way in Visual Studio with XNA too."
To me an app store is a place where third party developers can sell their software.
The ZuneHD "app store" from what I hear only has ad supported software and is not open third party developers.
It sounds more like the "stores" where you can buy silly games for your feature phone than a true app store.
But I could be mistaken since I don't have a ZuneHD I have only heard about them and seen reviews.
If they got netflix on it and dropped the doc price to $50 It could be a great addition to your media center.

Blades, motor

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

It would be great if it came with a motor and hooked up to a set of blades, it would be really useful as a stick blender and possibly a desk fan. Just make sure you have the plastic blades hooked up for that mode.

Re:Blades, motor

[Anonymous Coward]

It would be even better if it came with booze and hookers! ... in fact.. forget the mhmm what where we talking about?

So the next DS will

[Anonymous Coward]

have more graphics power than the current Wii?

Re:So the next DS will

[AvitarX]

not too shocking.

The DS is about 1/6 the volume of Wii (if not more in first generation).

4 years provides approximately time to get chips to 1/4 their original size, and not needing any of the larger ports on the Wii could help.

Re:So the next DS will

[kalirion]

Higher resolution doesn't necessarily more graphics power. The original NES and the Playstation 2 had the same resolution....

That said, I really don't see the need for 1080p on a handheld screen - that's like 4320p on a 23" screen, or something like that.

Re:So the next DS will

[WeatherServo9]

Higher resolution doesn't necessarily more graphics power. The original NES and the Playstation 2 had the same resolution....

Actually, they didn't. The NES had a resolution of 256x240 and output at 240p. PS2 was variable; apparently it's internal resolution was 256 x 224 up to 1280 x 1024(I doubt much used the highest available; most games would have been around 640x480 I believe) and it could output in 240p/480i/480p NTSC or 576i/50Hz and 480i/60Hz PAL.

Re:So the next DS will

[CronoCloud]

720p/1080i too, though I know of only one game that does 1080i, Gran Turismo 4. And yes, it can do 1280x1024, but only over sync-on-green VGA, and you're limited to 16-bit color at that resolution IIRC.

Re:So the next DS will

[LordVader717]

Yeah, but it's not really surprising. The original GBA's specs leaked in 1996 and were better than the Super Nintendo, but no-one would believe it. When the PSP was released it came very close to the then-current PS2, but no-one thought it possible when they announced the system. Even playing Mario 64 on the DS seemed outlandish at the time.

Re:So the next DS will

[BikeHelmet]

Higher resolution doesn't necessarily more graphics power.

Right - but in this case it also has more graphics power. And more CPU power. And probably lots more memory.

Maybe we'll get lucky and Nintendo will bundle an actual OS with it, so game updates and patches can be made easily available?

Re:So the next DS will

[Anonymous Coward]

The current one already has more fun games than the Wii.

For the love of the FSM: NO CELL PHONE!

[Anonymous Coward]

UGH. Please, Nintendo... Please let your handheld gaming system be a handheld gaming system. Unlike most people, I have enjoyed my days without a cell phone. No GPS chip tracking my movements and no pesky little device designed to break in just a few years...... I've had my DS longer than any cell phone I've ever owned. If I wanted to a cell phone that played cartridge games or ROM's or anything for that matter, I would buy one. I am perfectly happy spending $129.99 on a portable system that I can carry into the courthouse, take on an airplane, play in a doctor's wating room, or generally use any place where cell phones are typically prohibited.

Re:For the love of the FSM: NO CELL PHONE!

[MobyDisk]

The most insightful reply yet is from an AC. :-)

I grieve with you, as I was one of the last to get a smart phone. But I think society will change to accept it. Those arbitrary rules about not bringing a cell phone into this place or that place will go away when cell phones can be embedded into a watch or a piece of jewelry, or when everything has a cell phone in it.

You are right that we need to deal with privacy issues though.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[Anonymous Coward]

I run linux on my DS. It's not exactly awesome to use, but hey, it's for fun :) http://www.dslinux.org/

Re:But will it run Linux?

[TheRaven64]

Probably not. Currently the only supported OS for Tegra is Wince. If you want something else, you probably need an NDA to get the specs required for the drivers. If it is Linux, it will be locked-down like a TiVo so it's not particularly relevant that it's Linux, but most likely it will be something custom which provides minimal hardware abstraction and nothing else.

Re:Flashcards

[Red Flayer]

Ok, very funny. Snorting embarrassingly funny.

But I have to know... it's killing me...

What does the cookie with the power of apple do?

Re:Flashcards

[jgtg32a]

Distorts reality

Re:Flashcards

[Anonymous Coward]

What he said:

Who cares, I'm waiting to pirate the games. Fuck you nintendo.

What he meant to say:

I HATE YOU SO MUCH I'M GOING TO KEEP PLAYING YOUR SHITTY GAMES.

Re:Flashcards

[gbarules2999]

Wizard needs food...badly! Can I have the other cookie?

Re:But will it run Linux?

[ak3ldama]

If it ever ends up coming out.

Their status page looks pretty close. This thing actually sounds very cool, a sort of netbook (plus gaming hand held!) that a linux geek would be able to settle for. The type of thing that still works to lounge around in bed on a winter morning and just cruise the net. Thanks to gp for mentioning this as I had not heard of it, yet had considered getting the previous GP2X in the past. Does anyone have an idea of the cost of this thing?

Re:Flashcards

[mrdoogee]

75% of what a normal cookie does, at 2x the price!

BAZINGA!

I keed of course... I even posted this from my MacBook.

Re:Flashcards

[Red Flayer]

No offense, but lame response. I was hoping someone more clever than me (or perhaps just more sufficiently into their caffeine regimen for the day) could write a humorous response in the form of the original joke.

Well, seems like I'm disappointed, so I'll just have to do it myself:

me@slashdot > --gamemode
SLASHGAME: YOU ARE STANDING IN A FIELD
SLASHGAME: LOOK SOUTH
SLASHGAME: YOU SEE AN ANONYMOUS COWARD
SLASHGAME: WALK SOUTH
SLASHGAME: THE ANONYMOUS COWARD GREETS YOU BY SAYING "FUCK YOU NINTENDO"
SLASHGAME: INVENTORY
SLASHGAME: YOU HAVE 2 COOKIES
SLASHGAME: QUERY COOKIES
SLASHGAME: COOKIE #1 IS COOKIE WITH POWER OF SU
SLASHGAME: COOKIE #2 IS COOKIE OF APPLE POWER
SLASHGAME: DROP COOKIE OF APPLE POWER
SLASHGAME: YOU DROP THE COOKIE OF APPLE POWER
SLASHGAME: ANONYMOUS COWARD PICKS UP COOKIE OF APPLE POWER
SLASHGAME: ANONYMOUS COWARD GROWS AN IRONIC MULLET.
SLASHGAME: ANONYMOUS COWARD BUYS NEW SUNGLASSES FROM A STREET VENDOR.
SLASHGAME: ANONYMOUS COWARD BUYS VINTAGE DUDS FOR MORE THAN THE PRICE OF NEW DUDS, WHILE PRETENDING HE INHERITED THEM FROM A DEAD UNCLE. NO REALLY. I'VE SEEN THIS HAPPEN. THOUGH MAYBE HE JUST PRETENDS HE GOT THEM AT THE SALVATION ARMY.
SLASHGAME: ANONYMOUS COWARD EFFECTS AN AFFECTED ATTITUDE
SLASHGAME: HIPSTER ANONYMOUS COWARD GREETS YOU BY SAYING "FUCK MICROSOFT. I AM BETTER THAN YOU. ALL HAIL HE OF THE IMPECCABLE STYLE AND SAVAGE SAVVY, STEVE JOBS"
SLASHGAME: EXIT
me@slashdot >

There. I feel better now, in a slightly slimey sort of way. I just wish my humor gland was operating a little better these days. I'm just not feeling the creativity and cleverness anymore. And now I'm just blabbing to overcome the lameness filter.

What this means for Nintendo DSi owners

[strstr]

So, Nintendo just released the Nintendo DSi and there hasn't been a single game designed to use it's hardware on the market, and Nintendo is already on the path to replace it next year. This might piss all the guys that bought DSi thinking it would be the next-generation Nintendo portable platform only to be as unsupported as the Sega CD or 32x. Developers won't like this either...

Re:What this means for Nintendo DSi owners

[tepples]

So, Nintendo just released the Nintendo DSi and there hasn't been a single game designed to use it's hardware on the market

One of the cooking games for DS has DSi-specific features, and that's what hackers are using to break the DSi security.

Re:What this means for Nintendo DSi owners

[Yvan256]

Indeed, IMHO one of the reason SEGA lost sales is the constant release of new consoles and the few titles that required them.

The DSi is only a few months old for the north american market, the Nintendo TS should be at least 2-3 years away.

Unless Nintendo are scared of Sony's PSP Go, for some strange reason...

Re:What this means for Nintendo DSi owners

[sexconker]

I'd take any date with a barrel of salt.

The DSi does have a few games that make use of the hardware, and more are on the way.

Expect lots of full-fledged DSi-only games mid next year after Nintendo sells a billion DSis during the holidays.

Re:What this means for Nintendo DSi owners

[acohen1]

You'll see a few games with DSi features released in the US for holidays this season.

Re:What this means for Nintendo DSi owners

[LordVader717]

The most interesting DSi games have been over the download store, which seems like a good way of separating the market from standard DS games to avoid confusion.

Yeah right

[Anonymous Coward]

I call BS. The DSi just came out not too long ago, people have barely had time to update or even see many custom titles, and you're talking about a new DS by the end of 2010? No way.

I think someone's spreading rumors trying to keep Nvidia's stock price up, considering what a slam in the news they've been taking lately as their company continues to crumble.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[tepples]

I run linux on my DS

Only because the DS has no official firmware update mechanism. On the other hand, the Wii, the DSi, and (presumably) the TS can update their firmware to break homebrew. Firmware updates come on all new games.

I'm not sure I'm happy

[obarthelemy]

The beauty of the Nintendo stuff up to now has been that the limited CPU+graphics power forced devs to focus on gameplay. I really hope eye candy won't distract them from making fun, as opposed to beautiful or over-graphic'ed, games.

Re:I'm not sure I'm happy

[default luser]

I could certainly see some improvement with a larger, higher-resolution screen. The screen on the DS is so small that you can't make-out small details. This really killed my enjoyment of Professor Layton - style games, because the details needed to solve puzzles are often hidden in a single pixel.

To be honest, I really haven't been that satisfied with any of these "fun" games. My most recent disappointment: Scribblenauts. The game is captivating for about 2 hours, but then you get tired of it: the physics engine is clunky, and I'm constantly trying to anticipate what direction my objects or player character will go shooting off to when I touch the screen. The word engine is nice, initially - but it gets old fast because a lot of the objects are extremely limited in what you can do with them (e.g. you can only dig holes DOWN with a steam shovel. Apparently, digging through a wall is impossible. I was also disappointed when I couldn't entice a mole to dig through the ground, nor could I figure out how to get the drill to DRILL through anything. Also, when I tried to use the physics engine to my advantage, and try launching my player across the screen, I was constantly disappointed because he never got far off the ground).

So, you find what works, and continue to use the same objects, because the puzzles are all basically the same. And meanwhile, you get no bonus points because you've reached the edge of your creativity.

I've been disappointed with the DS game library overall. The only fun I've had is with remakes like Dragon Quest IV and Chrono Trigger - most of the "new" games are crapware or half-assed playtested releases with serious issues. If the games can at least look good, that would give me a little more immersive experience, despite the issues these games come with.

Re:I'm not sure I'm happy

[ookaze]

Eye candy won't distract Nintendo from anything.
The OP is just completely wrong:

The 'Nintendo TS,' as it has been dubbed, will apparently be ready for a late winter 2010 release and should put a spark in the mobile gaming market and give Nintendo's developers the power to bring higher quality games to the platform.

Seems like some people still have learned nothing from this generation of consoles (handheld and home).
Power won't bring any quality in games, games do not improve in quality because your hardware is more powerful.
If anything, power hinders console developers ability to make quality games, as the budget for the game doesn't improve like the hardware's power, and they are tempted to have higher quality graphics, which takes away money and talent needed to make quality games.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[tixxit]

It hasn't been released yet? I almost put in for a pre-order over a year ago (with the anticipation that they would've been shipped within a month or 2). Definitely glad I didn't, or I would've been out a hunk of cash for nothing. What happened to the 4000 people who pre-ordered one?

Higher quality games

[Anonymous Coward]

Love how higher quality graphics means "higher quality games."

Not another phone bill

[tepples]

Portable game systems are now competing with cell phones. Nintendo needs to realize that for their next portable game system or it will be limited to elementary and middle school kids. Beyond that age, they want a PDA / cell phone.

Cell phones have a monthly fee, and in the North American region, the kind of data transfer needed for Nintendo WFC play and TSWare downloads won't fit into a bargain-basement $10/mo prepaid plan. PDAs look better for this market, and Nintendo is slowly heading that way (see Opera for DSi), but a real PDA needs the breadth of applications developed by part-time developers, not just day-job developers. With Wii Menu 4.2 that deletes the Homebrew Channel,* Nintendo is showing that it wants to shun part-timers from its platforms.

I doubt that the homebrew community will spend the effort to reverse-engineer the next Nintendo hand-held when they could buy a cheap, open cell phone for the same price.

For one thing, a cell phone is another phone bill. For another, lots of places ban cell phones and don't trust people to put their devices in "flight mode".

* It's been worked around, but that's beside the point, which is Nintendo's intent.

Re:Not another phone bill

[MobyDisk]

I hope I don't get flamed for nitpicking, but cell phones don't have a monthly fee. Cell phone service does. If Nintendo added cell phone capability, that doesn't mean that every 7-year-old has to activate it.

Wait, you mean...

[default luser]

For once I can play a 3D game on a Nintendo portable and not be limited to 2000 polygons in a scene, and not be limited to shitty point-sample for texture filtering?

Hurray, we can finally have REAL 3D games on the DS, instead of crappy-looking 2D/3D hybrids!

The power consumption is also quite reasonable (Zune HD can do 8.5 hours video playback, and that stresses the GPU core and OLED screen), so it sounds plausible for Nintendo to sign-on.

Re:Wait, you mean...

[ludomancer]

I'm sorry, but were you just complaining about poor 3D on a handheld?? Were you born before 2002?

Take some shit for granted why don't you...

1080P on a portable machine screen

[Theoboley]

Yes, the clarity may be there, but on such a small screen, is it really worth it?

The difference between 720P and 1080P on my 32" TV is insignificant, Imagine on a 5" screen...

Re:1080P on a portable machine screen

[HalAtWork]

I doubt the screen will be 1080p, but perhaps it can output to a TV. This way, the system could be a living room system as well as a handheld.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[mrchaotica]

I run SuperTux (among other things) on my Wii. Although the latest firmware update does try to break homebrew (and fail, by the way), the updates have never been automatic or mandatory.

Never

[mrchaotica]

The Wii will never have 1080p; Nintendo will make you buy the next console for that.

Re:Never

[Carewolf]

The Wii will never have 1080p; Nintendo will make you buy the next console for that.

The Wiii?

Re:But will it run Linux?

[Narishma]

It's been "pretty close" for a year now...

Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[ChaosDiscord]

"...and give Nintendo's developers the power to bring higher quality games to the platform."

Any developer that thinks the thing stopping them from delivering higher quality games is more powerful graphics hardware has no hope of delivering high quality games.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Khashishi]

More powerful hardware gives the developer more options.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[ChaosDiscord]

I've always thought it was a shame that Rembrandt didn't have access to Photoshop; it would have enabled him to make higher quality art. And the quality of Bach's work really suffered since he lacked access to synthesizers and theremins. And I guess Casablanca is pretty good, but clearly its quality suffered for lacking the options of widescreen, color, and 3d.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[evilWurst]

Perhaps think of it this way instead: there are additional visual cues that become possible with additional graphical oomph, which might be employed for more creative user interface options. PC games have shied away from trying this because developers can't count on the players having the same hardware - most graphics chips sold are still the weak built-in intel ones, IIRC. MS and Sony have staked their reputation this generation on big budget eye candy, so they haven't really hit their peak of using the new power in interesting ways either.

But Nintendo? They just might do it. They played around with touchpads and dual screens and motion sensors when the other big players sneered in derision, and they made it work. Give them high resolution and a pile of pixel shaders and we'll see games where things like the presence/absence/color of lighting, or the physical textures of objects, or the faint ripple of heat radiation in the distance, might have actual gameplay significance. It could be a flop or it could be interesting, but I'd rather let Nintendo try it and see. We may actually get games out of it that are more immersive, instead of the current bunch that wash everything out with bloom.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Anonymous Coward]

Thank you for repeating Slashdot cliche #37475.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Anonymous Coward]

So... complaining about gameplay being neglected in favor of graphics is instant +5 insightful, even when applied to the one major developer that is dominating the market with two consoles and many, many first-party games that heavily deemphasize graphics?

This was an insightful criticism once. Not today, and not applied to Nintendo of all people.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[brkello]

So, you are saying the 8-bit Nintendo is all we ever needed. That's the argument you are making and it is stupid. A more capable system allow for better graphics that can give a more immersive environment as well as having improved AI or capabilities. Every retard knows that better graphics != a better game. But it seems counter intuitive to people on here that increasing the hardware specs can give a developer more options to create a deeper game.

Any artist can make great art with the tools of their time. But you seem to argue against improving those tools...that the tools we have now are good enough. Could you really have Half-Life or Mass Effect or Bioshock on an 8-bit Nintendo? Maybe, but it would not be as fun because it would be so limited. It would be like telling Mozart that all he could use is a tuba and a triangle.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

More powerful hardware gives the developer more options.

I think this last round of consoles proved that that philosophy has reached the point of diminishing returns.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Anonymous Coward]

It may sound like a good argument until you take a look at 3D on the DS. It looks like crap. I stopped playing Final Fantasy after about 5 minutes because I could not stand the 12 polygon characters. (Not to mention the shock I had when they introduced the main character as male.) 3D does not age well and I for one look forward to having hand-held games that can render a game from this millennium.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Anonymous Coward]

I thought he was just saying that the best artists are the ones who are able to produce something amazing with just the tuba and the triangle. Giving them more could make it better, but the truly good ones would be able to do it with less.

And on the other side of the coin, really bad ones can eke out barely acceptable things due to having so much to work with

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Anonymous Coward]

I for one would love to have heard what Bach might have composed if given access to synths and a sampler.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[ookaze]

So, you are saying the 8-bit Nintendo is all we ever needed. That's the argument you are making and it is stupid.

No, actually that's YOUR stupid argument.
He is saying that 8-bit Nintendo game were still quality games, and you're saying they can't be.
That's a very stupid argument to make, when the 8-bit Nintendo games still sell well on Virtual Console on the Wii.

A more capable system allow for better graphics that can give a more immersive environment as well as having improved AI or capabilities.

Yes, but a less powerful system allows for exactly the same things.

Every retard knows that better graphics != a better game. But it seems counter intuitive to people on here that increasing the hardware specs can give a developer more options to create a deeper game.

Experience has shown that the counter intuitive thing is the correct one.
What you're saying is true in a vacuum, but in real life, there's a thing called money that prevents you from reaching your utopia.

Any artist can make great art with the tools of their time. But you seem to argue against improving those tools...that the tools we have now are good enough. Could you really have Half-Life or Mass Effect or Bioshock on an 8-bit Nintendo? Maybe, but it would not be as fun because it would be so limited. It would be like telling Mozart that all he could use is a tuba and a triangle.

So much BS. How do you know it would not be as fun because it would be so limited?
Artists always manage to manage past the limitations of their tools, that's creativity. Because you're unable of being creative enough to bypass the tools' limitations doesn't mean nobody can.
That's this mindset that made Sony, MS, and nearly everyone in the game industry dismiss Nintendo as irrelevant this generation, only to be destroyed. The game industry is not technology industry: having less powerful hardware doesn't prevent you to succeed, at all.
Seems like lots of people still have not understood that the game industry is not a technology industry: it's entertainment.
The same entertainment industry where it doesn't matter if your movie is in mono, black and white, or other "limited" technology, if the content is better. That's why the Nintendo DS is cleaning it up, despite being "limited".
Thus why the OP is plain wrong in thinking that more power will bring more quality.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Tejin]

Bach's work was great, but think of what he could have done if he had access to the high quality instruments of our time. Better instruments makes music more enjoyable to listen to, just as better graphics make games better to play.

Instrument quality is not the most important aspect of music, just as graphics aren't the most important part of games, but they add to the experience.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[Anonymous Coward]

So, you are saying the 8-bit Nintendo is all we ever needed. That's the argument you are making and it is stupid. A more capable system allow for better graphics that can give a more immersive environment as well as having improved AI or capabilities. Every retard knows that better graphics != a better game. But it seems counter intuitive to people on here that increasing the hardware specs can give a developer more options to create a deeper game.

Any artist can make great art with the tools of their time. But you seem to argue against improving those tools...that the tools we have now are good enough. Could you really have Half-Life or Mass Effect or Bioshock on an 8-bit Nintendo? Maybe, but it would not be as fun because it would be so limited. It would be like telling Mozart that all he could use is a tuba and a triangle.

The difference between these two situations, the improved tools (graphics) generation of games and the 8bit (low tech) games lays in the production. The tools of today require many more people to effectively utilize their abilities than those of the 8bit generation. Look at cave story (freeware single producer game) compared to say.... any of the many movie games today. Less technology allows more artistic expression where as more technology requires a greater hive mind to produce the final game. This limits individuality and makes it more difficult to really see something different that may not produce the required Rate of Return that the lower tech games. No one is going to buy an 8 bit style game for a 3D system, unless it is a remix of already known classics.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[brkello]

No where did I state that 8-bit games could not be quality. I am saying that the old Nintendo would not allow you to make some of the great current gen games.

Yes, but a less powerful system allows for exactly the same things. So the 8 bit nintendo is capable as much immersion as the 360? Bull shit.

Your argument is arguing against the progress of technology. The Wii is selling so well right now...why should we ever update it? If artists were good they could cram every type of new game under the sun in there, right? Forget better AI or better facial emotion portrayals. They should go back to all being 8 bit...artists these days suck?

The Wii didn't do better because it has worse graphics. It did better because it had a new controller scheme and was priced much lower than its competitors. Games that can be played on the PS3 and 360 have to be stripped down to be on the Wii...so often games on other consoles pass porting for the Wii.

In any case, I could argue all day on how you are wrong and arguing against a point I never made. But my point is this...great games don't have to have great graphics, but certain games can't be made if technology does not progress. It isn't because the artists suck or people aren't creative, it is just a fact. Arguing against the progress of technology on a tech site strikes me as about the most moronic thing you could be doing.

Re:Graphics and quality are largely unrelated.

[brkello]

This is true of any industry. We had great storytellers in the past. It was only one person and they could let their creativity shine. Now we have movies which takes hundreds if not thousands of people to make. Are movies less artistic than storytelling? I'd argue no...that it depends on the storyteller/movie. Final Fantasy 7 took more developers that any 8-bit Nintendo game did. Was it less artistic? I'd argue no...that no previous game had an emotional impact on me as much as that game at that time. So I disagree with you. Less technology makes it easier for individuals to express themselves. More technology means more people which means less personal individuality, but there is the individuality of the game companies and developers with other companies. Games are just as good now as they were then...despite the technology.

Rumors, damn it. RUMORS!

[Tarlus]

Slashdot:
"Next Nintendo Handheld To Be Powered By NVIDIA's Tegra Chipset"

The Actual Article:
"NVIDIA Tegra rumored to be included in new Nintendo handheld"

RTFA and be a little less misleading, Slashdot.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[Narishma]

Oh and it costs $330.

Re:Flashcards

[Anonymous Coward]

Much offense, but that was as lame as hell.

Will it still have 2 screens?

[Zaphod-AVA]

Will it still have two screens?

I've always hated the DS form factor. Two screens is terrible, I want one widescreen aspect ratio display. I like the hardware for the PSP Go, too bad they shot themselves in the foot about the card slot.

Re:Will it still have 2 screens?

[Khashishi]

3 screens, baby. It's that natural progression of things.
DS = Dual Screen
TS = Triple Screen
I say they should just skip quad screen and jump directly to quint/penta screen, just to be 2 steps ahead of the competition. Because more is better.

Re:Will it still have 2 screens?

[Anonymous Coward]

Two screens is terrible, I want one widescreen aspect ratio display. I like the hardware for the PSP Go

How does it feel to be some completely, terribly alone?

Re:Will it still have 2 screens?

[SleazyRidr]

Fuck everything! We're doing five screens!

Re:Will it still have 2 screens?

[AmberBlackCat]

You know the #1 thing I hate about touchscreens? It's fingerprints. With two screens, you can use one as a touchscreen and watch the widescreen movie on the other with no fingerprints.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[butalearner]

Its $330, and I believe there are still a few available from the first run due to cancellations. The status is pretty much up to date except the CE/FCC testing is scheduled for today. The case moulds are expected very soon (mid-October, delayed from late September due to Chinese holidays). Finally some exciting stuff for the people that have had their order in for a year! I really want one (that's why I follow it so closely), but can't justify the purchase just yet. Maybe the second batch in 2010.

How many more DS's will there be?

[Anonymous Coward]

I mean seriously, how long ago did the DSi come out? Like less than a year? And they are already talking about a new system? Do they honestly expect people to continually drop $150+ on a new handheld every two years? Nintendo needs to slow down and come up with something INNOVATIVE. DS vs DSi? I didn't see anything that made me want to spend an additional $170 for it. The camera isn't that good and the save issues shoot itself in the foot.

Be patient Nintendo.... Create something wicked cool for us gamers and stop adding a few features to an existing product. My God man, your starting to look like Microsoft!

Re:Flashcards

[mrdoogee]

Troll? Aww. Not cool.

Mod down parent!

[Dudeman_Jones]

First of all, there hasn't been any announcement as to the existence of a next-gen handheld, let alone its components. Secondly, this story is stemming from a rumor that the Tegra chip might be in the currently non-existent handheld.

Wait, TS?

[Codex_of_Wisdom]

If DS supposedly stood for "Double Screen" does TS stand for "TRIPLE Screen"? That's a scary thought...

Re:Wait, TS?

[Codex_of_Wisdom]

Actually, I thought about it. It probably stands for "Touch Screen"

Re:Wait, TS?

[orsty3001]

or The Single, meaning single screen. Or maybe TS means The S***.

Re:Flashcards

[tomhudson]

Well done!

Re:But will it run Linux?

[HaZardman27]

I've been following it for about a year now, and they've come "pretty close" to releasing it a few times. I'll believe it when the first batch gets shipped.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[Duradin]

Some of us dropped out after the bank fiasco.

Bank transfers may be cheap and easy in Europe but are neither here in the states and all the alternatives looked about as legit as going into a smoky backroom and handing Guido a wad of cash to be delivered for you.

What really sucked was having the exchange rate eat $70. So instead of waiting the year+, I purchased an iPod touch.

The unknowns

[AlpineR]

It's a shame that [unknown caveman] didn't have permanent paints or we would marvel at his landscapes from the last ice age. [Unknown Middle Ages musician] is really underrated just because there was no technology to record his performances. [Grainy, degrading silent film] had a wonderful story, brilliant actors, and a moving soundtrack; but it's hard to appreciate it with the blurred faces and death of the organist.

HIgher resolution alone won't make most games better. But the ability to maintain a higher framerate, more complex 3D models, and richer textures really could improve some existing Wii games and make some currently impractical ideas enjoyable.

Every ones into one chip CPU/graphics now.

[physburn]

Intels Larabee, AMD Fusion both supposed to be out in 2010. Guess Nvdia couldn't be left behind. Without a x86 licence, they've been forced to use ARM. ARM might not be a bad move, it uses a lot less per per cycle than the x86 chips, and there is quite a bit of code for it. For handholds ARM/Tegra might make sense. Still a Larabee or Fusion system is bound to beat it software, possibly performance, and definitely in amount of software. Nintendo probably deliberately want a closed custom system through, has they sell developer licences for games, so they can sell systems at loss leader prices.

---

Nintendo Games @ Feed Distiller

Do Not Want

[KDR_11k]

I'll say BOOOOOO to this. The DS is the last system where developers don't have the bias that 2D is somehow out of style and will actually put significant resources behind a 2D game, if the DS was upgraded so much that it could do current or last gen home console graphics that'd likely be the end of 2D gaming on it and the beginning of more and more repetitive 3D games that we've got enough of on the home consoles.

Re:Do Not Want

[kramerd]

I'll say BOOOOOO to this. The DS is the last system where developers don't have the bias that 2D is somehow out of style and will actually put significant resources behind a 2D game,

Unless you count the wii, the PS2, or flash.

Re:Do Not Want

[KDR_11k]

I'll give you flash but 2D is treated as a niche thing on the Wii and PS2.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[KDR_11k]

The first 90% of the work take 90% of the time, the remaining 10% of the work take the other 90% of the time.

Re:Flashcards

[Junior J. Junior III]

slashgame: cookie #1 is cookie with power of su

slashgame: cookie #2 is cookie of apple power

slashgame: drop cookie with power of su

slashgame: you drop the cookie with power of su

slashgame: anonymous coward picks up cookie with power of su

slashgame: in soviet union, cookie eats anonymous coward

slashgame: exit

me@slashdot >

Why would anyone browse /. as AC but leave cookies enabled? Silly, silly mortals...

In the United States

[tepples]

cell phones don't have a monthly fee. Cell phone service does.

In the United States and Canada, handsets are either A. sold tied to a 24-month service commitment or B. sold for use with a prepaid plan with most of the non-phone functions crippled.

Re:But will it run Linux?

[tepples]

Although the latest firmware update does try to break homebrew (and fail, by the way)

I speak not to Nintendo's competence (or, rather, lack thereof) but to Nintendo's intent to keep part-time developers off its platforms.

the updates have never been automatic or mandatory.

They are if you want to play new games. Wii Sports Resort, for one, needs at least 4.1 to work right.

Re:Flashcards

[Machtyn]

And puts a permanent smug look on the consumer's face.

/smile, it's funny

Retail sales?

[nurb432]

So can i buy a box of loose chips so we can build a cheap cluster?

Re:Flashcards

[Anonymous Coward]

75% of what a normal cookie does, at 2x the price!

BAZINGA!

But its very suave and stylish...

awww yyeeeaaahhh

[Anonymous Coward]

ditch the dual screens, or at least put them closer together.

but ideally just forget the two screens, use one big, quality screen and if devs want to break it up, so be it.

give it wifi and make a proper super smash brothers.

port goldeneye to it.

do this, because i cant believe it: the psp actually looks good now. i want the new mgs!!

Re:But will it run Linux?

[DaVince21]

Their status page looks pretty close.

Again?

Re:Flashcards

[Hurricane78]

So your statement is: "That thing is a load of crap, and everyone is stupid for buying it. Except that of course I have one, so that can't be."

What about the other, more likely, alternative... that you were just as stupid, but can't admit it because then you'd have to hate yourself. ^^

arm is strong

[Anonymous Coward]

Wise move using arm cores to fit into the portable market. Arm was designed for power efficiency.

Just compare the iphone's battery life to a laptop or a psp.The pandora console which was kind of popular in home brew circles used an arm based processor with 3d capability that could run from 8 to 10 hours on one battery while playing games. That's more than twice what a psp could do in one sitting.

Re:Flashcards

[Adovid]

Apple along with Acron formed a subsidy called Arm (acorn risk machine) back in the 80s. Acron is no longer around but ARM which is now called ARM unlimited still is. It is the company responsible for the ARM core and it's licensing. A core which has improved over time always with power efficiency in mind and which Nvidia is now using in tegra. The cookie with the power of apple is the arm processor because apple is associated to arm's origins indirectly. It's power is efficiency and growing performance which is becoming more comparable to the cpus of desktop computers. Only problem is window's won't run native on this architecture. And if you don't believe it you will be eaten by a Grue!