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First Look At Latest Ion-Infused Asus Eee PC
MojoKid writes "Atom-based netbooks have come a long way since they were first introduced. 7 and 8-inch netbooks are no longer the norm, and availability of 12-inch netbooks is on the rise. The newest member of the Asus Eee PC lineup is the Eee PC 1201N, and it really stands out in the crowd of netbook in terms of specifications. The machine features a 12.1" HD display, new dual-core Atom 330 CPU, 2GB of DDR2 RAM, Windows 7 Home Premium, an HDMI output and NVIDIA's Ion chipset with integrated GPU. HotHardware was able to demo the system's ability to handle more advanced benchmarks, thanks in part to the Ion GPU. It's also the first netbook they tested that could actually play older 3D titles respectably. You won't get Crysis running but lighter duty titles can be played back nicely if you tone the details down and lower the resolution. The 1201N also played back 720p and 1080p content without stuttering, and the dual-core CPU allowed enough headroom to multitask while videos were playing."
The point of a netbook is size and weight, not speed. More power is nice, but the creep up towards 12" screens is annoying.
if the answer isn't violence, neither is your silence / freedom of expression doesn't make it alright
Boy, I can't wait for the 17" netbooks with lots of ram, ssd and fast CPUs. A good video card would be nice, too. Why won't someone make this?
If I'm going for a portable as big as 12", it better have something better than the Atom, Ion notwithstanding. 12" is basically a laptop IMO.
This author takes full ownership and responsibility for the unpopular opinions outlined above.
But meh manufacturing. I think that's what a lot of these lower end notebooks are missing these days. I feel like everytime I pick one up I have to worry about the hinges cracking. Is there any reason why hardware companies like Asus can't use an aluminum body? When I first heard Apple was switching to it, I was ecstatic - aluminum and glass over plastic? Finally a laptop hat has some heft to it. Seriously though, it can't be a cost issue here, the market price for aluminum is $1.1475/lb today. Why don't more manufacturers use it?
is the claimed 5-hour battery life. Not bad, on par with many full-size laptops and notebooks, though personally one thing that would make a smaller, less-powerful device like this appeal to me would be a longer battery life than standard laptops.
It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Einstein
12" is still easily tossable in a messenger bag. Pretty much every size laptop is going to get a slightly different market segment with different needs, and 12" and fairly powerful is precisely what I'm looking to buy in the near-ish future. It's not like Asus has stopped making the 10" netbooks, so where's the annoying?
What else would you do with a Eee PC?
Think of how much more intelligent you could make that thing with a dual-core Processor and 2GB of DDR2 RAM!
Insert your own joke here, but please, no new overlords.
The biggest benefit I see of the Ion is for small form factor desktops to support VDPAU (an API for hardware offloading of video decoding). Majority of the recent small form factor systems (e.g. Dell Studio Hybrid) I've looked into use the Intel 4500 which does support XvMC, but at least in Linux VDPAU is much more usable (larger list of supported codecs, etc.). I moderate the Boxee Linux forum, and I'm seeing a lot of posters using Ion based HTPC's.
Sadly, PS/2 was yet another victim of USB, which doesn't care what you plug into it, the electrical slut.
Price (MSRP): $499.99
I say yes. More than $300 means 'a lot of money' and that means I'd better be getting a full-blown computer for my purchase dollars. This needs to include some kind of optical drive. That's what I say, what say you?
at lightning speed!
because obviously since they are "Netbooks" all they are good for is running (as in accessing) remotely run applications through some stupid Web 2.0 interface filled with needless graphics and effects. ohh shiny!
Happy to see the 2GB of RAM (even more would be better), but agree that I really don't care about a 12" screen and more powerful processor.
Now if they would just go back to their true *netbook* roots and also offer a Linux + SSD version!! That was a killer combination.
I will stick with my Linux EEE 1000 for now. Better value than the MS-Win version (for me), uncrashable "hard drive", great battery life, nice form factor, decent keyboard, reasonably fast, respectable screen. About the only two annoying things are the right shift key in the wrong place (which really kills me when using vi) and the battery light starting to blink at something like 75% power left (obviously a boo boo).
11-19 FPS at 800x600 is not respectable.
This netbook has the same screen size, ram, and CPU perforcement as my four year old laptop.
Has my old laptop become a netbook?
I was impressed by the build quality of their new T91MT touch-screen tablet, and it was definitely an all-around improvement on the older version of that model (the T91, which came with Windows XP and didn't have multitouch). I just wish they offered a handheld touch-screen computer in a screen size slightly larger than 8.9 inches. If they could release this one with a touch screen that swiveled around to lay down flat on top of the keyboard, that'd be perfect! We need such devices to deploy our software product on, and Gibabyte makes a 10-inch one, but even with the nearly full-sized keyboard, it was nowhere near as compelling a user experience as the ASUS.
Laptops are for people who... Travel!
*Suspensful orchestral music, can't be transcribed to text due to copyright*
It runs ubuntu 9.10 now. I have it loaded with cross compilers for the openmoko and atmel. As well as java (on an SD card) and gcc, etc. I get a ton of work done commuting by tram. (yay for distrubuted version control). The laptop takes one half a small laptop case. It is light enough to carry around on the weekend.
I have taken it on two holidays. Tasmania and New Zealand. When away I back up our two digital cameras to a Sony video camera with a 30G hard disk. The eeepc is ideal for moving files around between different USB devices. It is also great for watching movies stashed on the video camera.
http://michaelsmith.id.au
I agree. It is turning back into a laptop at this point.
But I think they are headed in the right direction as far as my own needs go.
I simply want an HDMI/VGA capable, networkable device to throw the web onto my television without stuttering. So far, it doesn't exist.
This sounds like it is pretty close, if not there already.
God dammit, I want to sit on my fucking couch again.
I'm kind of a beast, so having the larger display and keyboard for my club-like fingers is handy. For me, the distinction between a 12" netbook and a 13" laptop has more to do with battery life. I have the 12" Asus that was the precursor the one in this article, and I get roughly the same battery life out of it that I do my smartphone, which means I can use it consistently all day long without needing to plug it in. Charge up overnight, and keep on going the next day. And since it's roughly the width and length of a piece of paper, weighing less than three pounds, it's perfect for when I'm on the road traveling or working.
I think a regular old PC would do what you want. Any recent Nvidia card will get you vdpau.
9" was the sweet spot for me.
My netbook has the feel of a book, which is something I feel comfortable carrying.
I don't know if Asus are still making 9" models, but they have dried up completely in the UK.
Dell does. They now call the mini 9/inspiron 910 the vostro a90.
What is up with the names?! Ion infused?? Definition of Infused: An infusion is the outcome of steeping plants with a desired flavour in water or oil. Defenition of an Ion: An ion is an atom or molecule where the total number of electrons is not equal to the total number of protons. Right...
So, saying they get their ions from a sensible source, such as salt, and use a plant with salt on it, such as seaweed, then what we actually have is a laptop that has been dipped in seaweed oil? No wonder people don't trust major companies any more... all this sounds very fishy.
Penguins can be fascists too
Yeah, my question is, at 12" does it still make sense to call it a netbook? It seems to me that the "netbook" classification meant that it was very small (max 10"), had a very small amount of storage and no optical drive, so that it was really only good for things like internet browsing, chat, and email. If you take a netbook, make it more bigger, more powerful, and you add a bunch of storage, it becomes a notebook computer.
"I think a regular old PC would do what you want. Any recent Nvidia card will get you vdpau."
I already have one. I just don't want another one in my living room. I also want to retain the portability so that I can simply hook up to someone else's TV as well (Grandma's...Her vision ain't so hot, so she has a bigass TV. I want to be able to surf with her without buying her a PC).
Sounds like you want an Aspire Revo. ( see http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Acer+-+AspireRevo+Nettop+with+Intel%26%23174%3B+Atom%26%23153%3B+Processor/9535434.p?id=1218120545008&skuId=9535434 ) costs $200, ION graphics, 1 gig of RAM, HDMI support, and a 160 gig HDD. I also think its got an E-SATA port on the front of it which is a nice addition. According to reviews its easy to crack open and upgrade the RAM. While the Atom CPU might be on a bit of the sluggish side, I think this might be what you are looking for if you don't want a laptop.
Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
Only good for chat and email?
I use one for work. If I want cpu power I ssh into a server no laptop comes close to a 4 quad Xeons.
99% of laptop purchasers should have bought a desktop and the cheapest netbook they could find. They would have spent the same amount of money and got a better experience.
yep. my main is 12", so >=10" does not a netbook make.
Well, I agree that this is a bit on the big side. I use a smaller than standard bag and really appreciate the smaller footprint of a 10.1" netbook.
I have been waiting to see the dual core atom +ion graphics netbooks come out. I want small, lightweight, long battery life, and the ability to watch web-based videos.
12 inches is too big for a netbook. 10 inches is pushing it as it is. Why do they think they can slap the term "netbook" on anything small and under powered as far as the typical laptop goes? Does anyone remember the Toshiba Libretto? I still have mine and THAT is the ultimate _netbook_. I thought PHYSICAL SIZE was what made a netbook a netbook! 12 inches is NOT a netbook.
That is EXACTLY what I want.
Too bad it is made by Acer. Their past history of totally fucking over customers when their cheap Mobos die prevents me from doing business with them. Ever.
I've got a 12" Mac PowerBook G4 final revision. It plays everything but BluRay, has a modem (you won't believe how often I need it), ethernet, bluetooth, WiFi, DVD burner, it's the ultimate connectivity machine. The wedding photographer's friend. And because it has a portrait style monitor and not that wretched landscape, it's a lot easier to read the newspapers.
I know why landscape rectangular is sold, it has fewer square inches the farther away from square it gets. I'll pay for a portrait monitor, really I will.
Microsoft demands a crippled CPU for a cheap deal on Win7 license, but it's only making Win7 look bad. The basic version of Win7 sux rox, the Aero version is pretty nifty.
It's like bragging about having the largest sub-compact car.
I have a 12,1 computer, bought it two years ago, it's notthing new, it's not a netbook it's a LAPTOP.
I thought the whole point of the "netbook" fad was portability... I guess now everyone's so hooked on the new name they don't give a shit anymore. If it quacks like a duck it's a duck not a fucking goose.
The point of a netbook is size and weight, not speed. More power is nice, but the creep up towards 12" screens is annoying.
Especially with the price creep up to $500. A 12", $500 portable computer is a laptop or notebook, not a netbook. A netbook costs less than $400 and has a 10" or less screen. You can fiddle with one or the other of these and still have a netbook (just barely). But once you change both you are competing against traditional notebook computers, not netbooks.
The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
I disagree. For my needs, 12" would be the sweet spot. It's big enough to actually use and feel viable without being full-size. I recall that the HP DV2 was a 12" laptop, and it felt awesome. It's just too bad it only had a single-core processor.
"He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
So netbooks are essentially moving into the low end notebook space and pushing out the cheap notebooks while leaving the small netbook space empty...
I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
I use one for work. If I want cpu power I ssh into a server no laptop comes close to a 4 quad Xeons.
And this server is going to help the average person play The Sims 3, how? Or make Photoshop render faster? Or help Windows Movie Maker make the movie faster?
The average person plays at least a few games or has a task that a netbook isn't going to do well. They just aren't made for those tasks.
99% of laptop purchasers should have bought a desktop and the cheapest netbook they could find
I thought the same thing, however I was proven "wrong". When my grandparents wanted a cheap computer (they basically live off of social security) I suggested the EEE 901 for $200, they already had a desktop and they really only used the computer for e-mail or internet. They said that the 9 inch screen wouldn't bother them. I loaded up Ubuntu and made the fonts -huge- for them. But for some odd reason they viewed it as "too slow" (don't know how, it was certainly faster than their low-end celeron running Windows 2K....) and the keyboard was "too small" (yet they still managed to text just fine on their phones...).
Also, laptops are cheap. my current laptop I got for $300, not on sale. Its not exactly outdated either, its got a Celeron 900 at 2.2 Ghz, a 15 inch screen, 2 gigs of RAM and a 160 gig HDD. Yeah, its got integrated graphics, yeah if I spent $150 extra I could have gotten a better machine, but as a student its a perfect laptop, Ubuntu runs flawlessly on it and everything works.
The cheapest netbook is $200, and the cheapest desktop is $200, which is $400, which doesn't save any money over my $300 laptop.
Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.
Well, others make similar things, too...
Never underestimate the bandwidth of a 747 filled with CD-ROMs.
Dell and HP netbooks suck. They put the right/left mouse buttons beside the touchpad instead of below it. Makes it a lot more uncomfortable.
agreed, these netbooks need to stay in the 9-11" range and stay under $300. otherwise, what's the point, I'd just buy a REAL notebook computer. Small. Light. something you toss in a backpack or keep in your car trunk. I don't want to worry about it. Also, why aren't we seeing USB 3.0 yet? Bluetooth, WiFi 802.11n, >0.3mp cameras, more than 3 measly USB ports, 2GB RAM, SDHC & Memory Stick Pro slot (like Dell has), all mandatory. And I'm sick of the 600 resolution. 1024x768 should be minimum, but I'd like to see 1440x900 as the min.
I have a dell mini 9 in front of me right now, the two mouse buttons are below the touchpad.
I do not know about the hp ones.
Games and photoshop would be better served by a desktop. Doing image work on a TN screen is just a bad idea period. The cheapest desktop is not well suited for that either.
The most interesting benchmark in the article is the effect that the Ion GPU has. There's another netbook review that is linked in the article to an $800 machine with a beefier CPU, the ASUS CLUV. That machine is unable to play 1080p video clips without stuttering.
Yet this beast of a netbook can do it easily, using no more than 50% CPU in windows media player. That ION GPU must be doing a heck of a lot of the calculations in order to make this possible.
Only problem : not all video codecs are accelerated this well. Do any players/codecs out there let you watch the usual x264 video clips that pirates put up on the net with Ion GPU acceleration? Historically, Windows Media Player generally doesn't natively play anything but WMV and old codec files.
Those 1080p movie trailers that Apple likes to release will play just fine, however.
The biggest problem with the machine is that it still uses a mechanical hard drive. It would be a heck of a lot faster and more responsive if it had a clean bare-bones install of Win 7 and an SSD. (no, not Linux...Linux might boot and run faster but it takes more time to tinker with it and fight to get things to run than you save, unless you are a Linux expert)
Problem is, you gotta pay for the cost of that useless 5400 rpm drive when you buy this thing. Maybe you could pick up an external enclosure off newegg along with an SSD, and put the mechanical drive to use as a backup disk. Put in an OCZ vertex SSD, and make this machine scream.
The 2GB ram limitation is also a problem, though...For long term use, you really want at least 4-8 GB....
I agree. "Netbook" had a defined market. It was an ultra-portable that could do basic computing, cheaply.
Now companies are just sticking an Atom in what used to be termed a "subnotebook" and calling it a netbook. There was already a market for these, don't blur the line!
To me, the only thing I want them to add to a netbook is battery life. Keep the ultra-low-end CPU. Keep the 512 MB of RAM. Keep the stripped-down Linux. Keep the 8-9" screen. Just add progressively more power-saving hardware, and, if miniaturization of other components allows, increase the battery while keeping the weight down.
Basically, as long as it can play standard def Flash video, I don't care about the specs. Give me an Eee PC 1000HD with an SSD running Ubuntu Netbook remix or Chrome OS; that's what a netbook should be.
My current netbook is an HP Mini 1000 with 16 GB SSD running HP's "Mi" Linux. The only thing I don't like about it is the battery life. If I need more power on the go, I don't want to compromise with slightly more powerful Atom, or a slightly more powerful GPU, or a 160 GB hard drive; I want a full high-power laptop, with a quad-core, good GPU, and 500 GB hard drive.
Yes, there is middle ground, but don't make a system that is really a 'low-end laptop', and call it a netbook. Especially when you're charging a price premium for it. This new Eee has lower battery life, worse processor, worse GPU, smaller HD, and the same weight as many mid-range laptops, for more money!
Another non-functioning site was "uncertainty.microsoft.com."
The purpose of that site was not known.
It will waste more battery power and more prone to problems when being moved about. If I want an hard drive, I'll get a full blown laptop.
I don’t think the manufacturers can help themselves when it comes to out doing one another with features, etc. The marketing droids promise the moon, sun, and stars if only ours was “better”!
We have 2.
MSI and ACER units. They serve a purpose, but only for my teenage kids, and even that is waning since they got Blackberries.
Personally, my own 8830WE covers day to day stuff, so that a net book would be redundant.
Meetings or work require my XPS M1730 (yeah, I know, but so what) and I just don’t see any need for a net book, upgraded or not.
I'm currently using that same machine you have as an (interim) HTPC machine. Swapped Win 7 64 bit to 32 bit (due to the low memory), upgraded to the latest drivers and Flash 10.1 Handles 1080p MKV's just fine, as well as 720P YouTube (1080 drops some frames on fast movement). The only problem is that Hulu apparently isn't taking advantage of the new Flash beta, and still seems to run 100% on the CPU rather than offloading to the GPU like YouTube now does. So for Hulu it can only handle the standard def video. 480P Hulu is fine windowed, but scaled to 720p or 1080p, it drops frames really bad.
Every heard of RDP? You even have accelerated graphics and dual monitor support these days. With device pass-through is a very viable option. Of course I went one further for the owner of the company I work for. We've got XenDesktop Express, good for 10 virtual machines running on a dual processor quad core server and he has all the photoshop and Sims power he needs. Even had 1080p video and associated formats for HD audio. That's a bit overkill for the average consumer. He'll have 5 thin clients through-out his house see that he can enjoy fan-less high speed computing at 5 different locations, some will be wired, some will be serviced with 802.11n.
RDP works here and now for the average consumer running Windows 7 though. I do this all the time on my much more limited budget. Virtual desktops are definitely the future though.
HP makes the mini with a pci-e mini hardware acceleration card built in. It only works with some particular software, but it meets all your requirements, including manufacturer point of origin.
moox. for a new generation.
You have been able to get 12" laptops for years, apple used to make 12" ibooks and powerbooks, the idea of a netbook is that its smaller and cheaper... Pretty soon the small cheap ones will be phased out and we'll be back where we were a few years ago.
http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
At least where I'm concerned. I bought a netbook because it was a sub $400 dollar laptop that had several hours of battery life. I always felt that the main purpose of a netbook was to provide an inexpensive, highly portable/ultra long battery life to counter mobile wifi use...as that leads into the main purpose...being connected and doing stuff on the net. Tradeoff being, of course, lower end graphics processing and lower power processors to boost that battery charge life. 12 inches, 10 inches, 9 inches, 8 inches...that's just a personal preference that kinda sorta plays into the portability part. At some point you've got a small laptop, at another point you have a big handheld. I have a smartphone...I don't need a slightly bigger one to complement the one I use now. The netbook sits nicely between the 17" desktop replacement and the big handheld categories.
Perhaps, but then this looks stupidly fun to drive.
The Goal: A long simple life filled with many complex toys.
Ah, hell. Slashdot stripped out my greater than symbol: Battery life and price > screen size and weight. Darn it, thought I could pull that off.
Games [...] would be better served by a desktop.
Which is also the reason to buy a PS3 over a PSP or a Wii over a DS. Yet handheld video game devices still sell, and as I understand it, the leap from Intel GMA to NVIDIA Ion is like the jump from DS to PSP.
The average person plays at least a few games
There are three well-known places to get games on Windows: freeware, Steam, and retail optical discs. Freeware games are limited in scope to small bites: what a hobbyist can make in spare time or what a company feels like giving away as a loss leader. Retail discs don't fit in a netbook, and even if you do manage to copy the installer over the network using another PC's optical drive, the copy deterrence methods in most retail games requires a battery-sucking internal optical drive on the machine that runs the game, or at least a battery-sucking USB optical drive. So if you want to use your netbook to play commercial games, you need Steam.
$500 and as big and heavy as a regular laptop, but less power. Sounds like a winner to me!
Somewhere, somehow they seem to have lost the idea what makes a netbook different.
For a moment, I was actually excited enough about this leap in netbook technology to start considering how I would load Battlefield 2, and S.T.A.L.K.E.R. Shadow of Chernobyl without an optical drive. Then I saw how much it costs! If someone is so in love with the idea of a keyboard bigger than their Blackberry\s, but much smaller than their laptops, can live without an optical drive of any kind, and has no problem giving up the average 2 inches vertical, and 3.5 inches viewing space just to own one of these, I wish I knew them personally so I could insult their intelligence directly! IMHO, netbooks provide no advantage that would justify spending $799 on one.
-Oz
I have a Dell Latitude D830 that has the buttons below the touchpad. Other family members with more recent Dells also have the same layout. Could it be HP laptops you're thinking of?
SSC
It's always a balance. This one almost hits my sweet spot. I had an 7" 800x480 netbook but the screen's resolution was too low to handle a surprisingly large number of standard dialogue boxes. My 8.9" 1024x600 display is better but still cuts off some boxes. Also, the keyboard is a smidge smaller than standard. Just that teeny little bit of extra width would make it so much better for typing. I think an 11" 1366x768 display would be perfect. It would require a case that's ever so slightly wider, making room for full size keys and 99.44% of dialogue boxes are designed to fit in 768 lines of vertical space. For me, that would be the ideal combination of input and output. And the dual-core atom processor is an important addition. I've got a few things that push the single-core Atom to its limits. It would be nice to have a little headroom. It'd also be nice to be able to play HD media in its native resolution without stuttering. Say, hook up to a flat panel in the hotel room and watch that copy of Heroes (or whatever it is the kids watch these days) I grabbed off the Tivo.
I think this size machine fills a critical gap between current netbooks and the $1500-2500 subnotebooks. Shaving an inch off the display size and getting it under 3 pounds would get me to consider digging out my wallet.
Yeah, getting a netbook with windows is a pretty stupid move.
True, but nowadays, stores near me no longer carry Linux netbooks. And unless you're buying the same model that someone else you know owns, buying any mobile device through mail order is a pretty stupid move. What if it turns out that you can't stand the keyboard? The screen?
It has great battery life (well it did for its time), a 12" screen (well, 12" 4:3 is slightly larger than 12" wide), and can be had for around $500
Bottles.
Well, since everyone and their sister's cat is using these boxes for their HTPCs we will see soon enough.
I have a Revo and 2 Asrocks myself. Will they last longer than my mini with a bad NIC or the one that sometimes decides not to boot?
Time will tell.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
12" is still easily tossable in a messenger bag.
I don't think that matters much when it comes to declaring one computer or another to be a "netbook". A 12-inch screen is still blurring the line between netbook and notebook. I've got a Dell Vostro 1320, and it has a 13.3" screen. That's not that different. Why is my laptop considered a notebook computer, while a 12" screen makes another computer a netbook?
Let q be a radix > 1. I am in ur base-q, killing 10 d00ds.
I use them to install large software suites, upgrade/change the OS
On my netbook, these are handled by Synaptic and Update Manager respectively. But another problem with installing large software suites is that software suites not designed specifically for netbooks, typically assume a large screen: at least 768px tall.
and watch DVD's.
MAFIAA or indie?
Adding [optical drives] to netbooks, however, should lead to smaller sizes of optical drives.
An optical drive is no smaller than the disc that fits inside it, and most CDs and DVDs are 12 cm in diameter. Or do you think optical drive makers will start making GameCube-style drives that take only 8 cm discs and software publishers will start distributing "netbook editions" on 8 cm discs?
You shouldn't have to have so much power just to browse the web or write documents and such.
I know web site authors "shouldn't" use SWF, but in the real world, they do.
I thought I wanted a netbook, but I was somewhat concerned I wouldn't be happy with it. I eventually decided to get a small "real" laptop, and I've been thrilled with it. 4.5 lbs, 13" display, 7 hours of battery life. It was more expensive, of course, but at $1200 it was far cheaper than my last laptop (7 lbs, 15" display, 2 hours of battery life on a good day, $1600).
I'm glad I got my EEE PP 900 ha before the 8.9 inch models were killed off.
My person rule is "if it gets bigger than 10 inches, it aint a netbook and I might as well spring for a full featured/powered notebook."
I'm also glad I skipped the rehash that is Windows 7. "Now you can squander 10+ gigs of your small hard drive for this bloated new OS that features DirectX 10, even though you can't use DX10."
Too costly for a system that was designed to be inexpensive. If you look at the videos on hothardware about the ion platform you'll note that it is very inexpensive. 12" display is large but that's not the cost factor.
They need to reduce the cost by $300 before I'll consider buying it.
You can lead a man with reason but you can't make him think.
I mean it's really only good for doing stuff over the Internet, web applications, etc (hence the name "netbook"). SSH fits into that.
Internet stuff as opposed to playing high-end 3D games, running performance-hungry apps, or storing lots of data. The first netbooks only held a few GB of data.
They also don't sell it anymore. What was your point?
Starbucks, Harbuckle of Breath.
They are all laptops. A netbook and a notebook are all laptops. Netbook is a marketing term.
You can lead a man with reason but you can't make him think.
Plus, I can play Quakelive and DDO on my HP Mini-1000 N270 with integrated Intel graphics. So I dunno why they even bothered with the bit about now you can play "older" 3d games.
Wake me up when it's shipped with Linux pre-installed.
Windows 7 will have it running like a 286 in no time.
Thomas A. Knight
Author of The Time Weaver
I have a laptop and I've only used my optical drive to load software. How do people normally get around that with netbooks that come without optical drives?
Dell and HP netbooks suck. They put the right/left mouse buttons beside the touchpad instead of below it. Makes it a lot more uncomfortable.
I've no idea about Dell ones, but it's definitely not true for all HP netbooks. The ones that are "consumer targeted" do that indeed, and I agree that it's very inconvenient. But HP Mini 5101 doesn't do it (and is positioned as "business netbook"), and is otherwise awesome, especially if you get the higher-res model.
Depends on resolution.
If it is that bullshit 1024x600 resolution as all the other netbooks, it's a 12" netbook. If they magically figured out a way to put a higher resolution display in one of these machines, it's "something I will actually buy". Netbooks are fun to play with in the store, but until they manage to get a higher vertical resolution than 600 pixels (what is this, 1989?) I'm going to have to pass, maybe buy another laptop instead (and maybe buy nothing instead - have enough laptops as it is.)
Glonoinha the MebiByte Slayer
800x480 is the resolution of my Nokia 770. I spent this afternoon sitting in a warm (well, compared to my house, anyway) cafe in the marina and wrote a couple of articles on it with a bluetooth keyboard (it runs vim nicely). For me, there is not much difference between a 15" and 7" display on a machine - both require me to carry them in a bag. The jump comes when the machine is small enough to fit into an inside jacket pocket. The 770 + keyboard fits, but isn't particularly comfortable. If a machine is small enough to fit into a pocket then I can take it to the pub and do a bit of work if my friends are late. If it just requires a smaller bag, it doesn't gain me anything. I can imagine that the situation would be different for women, if they habitually carry a handbag and can slip a machine with a 7" display into it but not anything bigger, but for me the 770 is about as big as it can be before jumping from the 'can carry in coat pocket' to 'can carry if I take a bag' category.
This is one of the big reasons why the Palm Pilot did better than the Newton commercially. The Newton was better in every respect except one: you could fit the Palm into a jacket pocket (that was one of the original design requirements).
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
You missed the part about portability. I'd have to haul a bunch of other stuff around as well(keyboard, mouse, cords, etc.). The Acer mentioned above still requires an external keyboard/mouse.
I am looking for a device that covers my needs and only requires a single cord(HDMI/VGA) to interface with the TV.
I have found numerous devices that fit the bill, except for the video output ports. Everything I have found so far lacks video output. My daughter has a HP Netbook, but it requires a PROPRIETARY cable, something I refuse to encourage with my dollars.
I suspect that the reason I cannot find a reasonable solution is because of collusion on the part of various manufacturers to keep us all buying multiple platforms for video. Such a solution as I am looking for would preclude a lot of products. The HP I just mentioned would seem to support that.
Fuck 'em all. I am not going to pay for half-assed solution to my needs. I'll just do without until someone that cares makes what I want.
For that other activity you mention, am I right in guessing that your couch measures 78 by 60 inches and comes with head-to-toe continuous-coil steel springs, 200-thread-count satin sheets, and a down comforter?
What kind of network do you need to do this kind of thing streaming 1080p?
I've got 13.1 inches in my lap right now, and it's just about the right size for me. Where I have been disappointed with netbooks to-date has been their pixel counts 1366x768 is what I would call "sufficient" for doing "real work" - I'd rather get 1080 rows...
The other thing netbooks rock at is battery life and low operating temperatures, I take my eee places ordinary notebooks just wouldn't go due to heat and longevity issues.
...decided to get a small "real" laptop, and I've been thrilled with it. 4.5 lbs, 13" display, 7 hours of battery life.
Make and model? I'd love to find a 13" screen with 7 hours of battery. I have an Acer One D150, 10.1" screen, and it gets ~5 hours of battery. I like my netbook, but I have huge hands and could go with something slightly larger. My experience with larger screens is they have a much worse battery life, so I'd really like to hear about what you are using. Thanks!
I've been looking for something to replace my ageing PowerBook 12" for a long time. Mainly the fact that Linux ran like crap on most laptops prevented me from replacing it before. I thought about a 12" thinkpad, but at the time Linux still didn't run worth a darn on the thing and didn't like the use of a nub instead of a trackpad[1].
I discovered the Lenovo S12 and decided to buy it. The S12 is a bit pricey for a netbook, meaning it's over $400. But not too bad. Sure I could buy an el cheapo 15" semi-portable "laptop" for that price, but it wouldn't have near the utility to me. It has pretty good battery life, about 4-5 hours, depending on use. It doesn't have a ton of horsepower, but its portability and usability are quite good. It's very light, has a wonderful screen, and a full-size keyboard. It's still called a netbook because it doesn't have a screaming hot core 2 duo processor. But frankly it doesn't need one. I can easily add a SSD to my lenovo (spare Mini PCI-e slot) and spin the hard drive down 90% of the time, which could extend battery life. Obviously a large screen back light will drain some. But everything is a trade-off.
It's pretty eerie to have a Linux laptop that consistently sleeps and wakes up. The Gnome stuff in Fedora 12 impressed me as well. The Network Manager handled wireless, wired, and VPN in a very nice, OSX-ish way. Put Windows XP to shame, that's for sure.
I think netbooks are redefining the subnotebook space, which is what this really is. If you ridicule the 12" netbook, odds are you either a) actually need a real laptop or b) you've never tried a 12" netbook.
[1] Linux gurus always claim that Linux runs well on thinkpads, but their idea of run well was different than mine. No sleep, terrible battery life, etc. That's mostly changed now it appears.
But this one goes to 12.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
Fuck 'em all. I am not going to pay for half-assed solution to my needs. I'll just do without until someone that cares makes what I want.
I think the problem is that PC makers have tried to make things for you on several occasions and you've turned your nose up at them and bad mouthed them on the internets. That's probably why they've stopped trying.
Imagine what would happen if you went to Dolly Mae's diner and Dolly had deep fried a bunch of things (fruit, salads and so on) which you then refused to pay for. If you came in again she'd refuse to serve you.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
What model do you have? (I'm looking for something that fits your description)
ampersand gt semicolon!
EEE is the best brand Asus have. It us inevitable the high end EEEs will encroach into notebook territory - i.e more expensive, more horse power and bigger.
echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
I have a 15" Macbook Pro, which makes me way ahead of my time.
-- Cheers!
My dad and brother have the dell and they are both on the side. I saw an HP one in Costco and it was the same. I thought it would be for all models.
Although 12" might be too much for a netbook, I believe those machines fill a nice little niche in the ultraportable notebook range, which used to be dominated by Sony Vaios that cost at least three times more.
My cellphone ringtone is a ring tone.
I'm sorry that your main laptop is so ridiculously tiny. I'm far from being a person with big hands, but those keyboards are way too damn cramped to use.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
yep. my main is 12", so >=10" does not a netbook make.
Spot on... if the form factor of the netbook is much larger than my moleskin then I cant carry them both in the same hand and will have to start encumbering myself with bags and crap. 9" is ideal, 10" is acceptable... 12" is approaching the size of my huge arse slate... just not readily portable unaided and regular notebooks already well serve this portion of the marketplace.
just my $0.02
err!
jak.
Going back to twelve inches was inevitable. It was all about price points and artificially inflated profit margins. You had the weirdness of 15 inch notebooks being significantly cheaper than smaller "road warrior" (what a load of marketing crap to feed the egos idiot executives so they would pay the inflated prices) ultra portable notebooks. You couldn't very well have netbooks come in at the twelve inch size range and bugger up the PR and ego infested world of high profit ultra portable note books.
Nothing of course lasts for ever. So netbooks are now likely to settle of a few screen sizes say 12, 10 and 8. The size would largely be driven by age, with older people going for the larger screens and younger people going for smaller screens, so eye ball capability ie. screen real estate and of course font size is the decider.
The differences between sizes will be largely screen size, keyboard size and storage capacity (simply more space available) as performance capability will be much the same across all sizes (with PR=B$ variations for price differentiation and profit enhancement).
Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
I assume you want to play HD, as most the Atom based devices will happily play SD video. it sounds like you want an Acer Revo. It's been around for a while.
I love the Atom 330 processor. If you want a cheap media center PC, go Mini-ITX, unless of course you want mega HD/blu-ray/confounded new age this and that. About 6 months ago I bought one of those Intel D945GCLF2 boards with the Atom 330 practically soldered on to the board. Couldn't be happier at the $84 price tag on Newegg. Yea its not a blazing fast machine, and yea its only got s-video, but it works great on my old CRT television with a stunning resolution of 640x480. Full screen movies, streaming video from websites, and just about anything else works fantastically. It's a fun DOSbox computer as well. Nothing like playing Oregon Trail, Concentration, Commander Keen, and BioMenace on my 32" Trinitron. Between the case, RAM and motherboard, I spent about $150 or so. Other components were laying around the house. Great bargain and highly recommended. Would love to see the 330 on a netbook.
*plays the Apogee theme song music*
I'm sorry that your main laptop is so ridiculously tiny. I'm far from being a person with big hands, but those keyboards are way too damn cramped to use.
That's what docking stations with a keyboard, mouse and a couple of 30" screens, are for.
Buy from a local reseller that services their stuff. They get paid for warrantied repairs, so they'll actually want to fix your broken mobos.
I'm posting this from my (new) HP Mini 311, and I can assure you, my left/right mouse buttons are below the touchpad.
You didn't say anything about portability in your original post. I thought you were looking for a cheap media PC with HDMI... If you're looking for a netbook/notebook with an HDMI port, then I don't know why you're not finding any -- they are everywhere. Samsung N510, Dell Mini 10, Lenovo S12, Asus N10... Probably every netbook maker has an HDMI model out.
Never underestimate the bandwidth of a 747 filled with CD-ROMs.
but for me the 770 is about as big as it can be before jumping from the 'can carry in coat pocket' to 'can carry if I take a bag' category.
You could always get a "man" purse...
http://poponthepop.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/manpurse-manpurse.jpg (No wonder the Patriots suck this year: their QB is pussy-whipped!)
"I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
Don't know what your problems have been. I have two Acer laptops in this very room that have been running for 4-5 years, with only one problem on one of them. I used the DVD burner heavily on one of them and had to replace it. But other than that, they have both run like champs for quite some time.
I have an HP Mini 110 & it has the buttons on the sides, but after a few minutes of getting used to it it hasn't really bothered me. I generally tap on the touchpad for left click anyways, & I use a lot of keyboard shortcuts. Maybe it's just me.
How much does your old laptop weigh? How thick is it? Does it have an optical drive?
One of my old Averatec laptops from 2004 is still running very nicely, thanks very much. It's got a 12" diagonal screen, weighs less than 2 Kg, and is around 2cm thick when closed, and that includes its optical drive. Thanks for asking.
Da Blog
That's what docking stations with a keyboard, mouse and a couple of 30" screens, are for.
Which entirely defeats the point of having a laptop....
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
Yeah, I have to agree with some people below, the 12" screen is the max I would want with a netbook, 10" minimum, since getting smaller is really hard to type with, at least for me. I play around with a 10" Asus right now and it fits my needs perfectly, though sometimes I miss the bigger screen for my desktop, but I don't need much more.
Well get out your checkbook, because the first page of TFA says it's 1366x768 resolution.
My kids' computer was only 1024x768 until recently and I have to say, 1024 is no longer wide enough. 768 is only marginally tall enough, since some inconsiderate app developers are making simple dialog boxes taller than that.
I saw a Mini-Note 2133 (Via C7) which had the buttons on the left and right.
Luckily HP's bigger laptops don't. Just saw a 15.4 inch AMD one that had them in the right place.
Really? I've seen lots of Acer computers die, but it was always the HDDs.
I'm told that they have a lower failure rate than many other manufacturers. A recent article on /. said they were below HP and some other companies, though obviously behind Asus and Dell.
Previous 3 posts:
If you do a search for "Acer no keyboard/mouse" you'll find lots of forum posts about a range of their laptop models that had Mobos go bad (no mouse, USB or keyboard function) that basically bricked them.
Acer ran people in circles, sending them mobos that had been returned by other people with the same problem (one guy got his OWN sent back to him, and they claimed it was NEW. It even came back in the wrapping he put it in), basically jerking them around until the warranty ran out, then simply claimed it was no longer covered...as the warranty had expired.
Only reason I know this is because I tried to fix one. They are not fixable. That is why Acer fucked everyone. Even the NEW boards they sent out soon failed, so they had two choices. Refunds, or fuck the customers. Which do you think they chose?
My daughter has a HP Netbook, but it requires a PROPRIETARY cable, something I refuse to encourage with my dollars.
That's true for the older HP1000, but the HP110 that replaced it does have a VGA connector.
Browsers shouldn't have a back button!! It's all about going forward...
Let's keep the definition simple: if it has an Atom CPU it is a netbook, when it has a standard Core CPU it is a laptop. So far, this holds....
Browsers shouldn't have a back button!! It's all about going forward...
Typing this with my big hands on my 12" PowerBook with full-sized keys. Hands not cramped.
That's why my Fujitsu P7010-D was/is such a fun laptop: only 10.5 inch wide-screen, but with a 1280 x 768 resolution. That's way more pixels/inch than normal. I have one dead pixel, constant blue on, and I just don't notice it. Simply because the pixel is so small.
This laptop is 4-5 years old, with a Pentium-M probably still faster than an Atom, has a 3-5 hour battery life and a built-in CDRW/DVD. Yes, it is a bit heavier than a netbook, but the size is the same as your typical 10" netbook.
The only BIG BIG difference is of course that at the time those machines went for prices over 2000 dollar. Compare that with what you pay now for your 10 inch netbook. Those extra pixels didn't come cheap....
Browsers shouldn't have a back button!! It's all about going forward...
No. Your 12" G4 iBook is slow as balls, which makes it an ancient notebook rather than a notebook.
i forget
I have a client who purchased one of these units and they're great. I've also had clients who have purchased Acer netbooks and loved them. You might give the company another chance.
12" is fine, at 1280x800, after a day or two of use. But then I don't use all 10 fingers and don't miss a numeric keypad.
The keys are the same size as my old 15". The difference being that my pinky fingers used to rest on the plastic siding - now they float in mid air. I have no adjustment problems going back to a 'desktop' PS/2 or USB keyboard.
By constrast, we have 10.4" tablets at work, whose keys are much more cramped.
There's a HUGE difference between business and consumer laptop lines.
Just sayin' as a former lead HP repair tech.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
Today's laptop is equivalent to the workstation behemoths of the late 90s.
In other words, perfect enough to use for development of anything BUT games, and perfect enough to use for most anything else.
Even I have a little powerful laptop hooked to a huge monitor and external keyboard/mouse. In California, not having a space heater for a computer is a good thing.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
The point of a netbook is size and weight, not speed. More power is nice, but the creep up towards 12" screens is annoying.
Original EEE had ideal blend of size, weight and low cost. Seems to have been forgotten since they started putting Windows on everything
Beowulf. *cough*
Camping on quad since 1996.
Hmmm, the 12" machine (X41 Tablet) I'm typing on right now has one of the best keyboards I've ever used... full-sized and everything too ;)
Now if only it had a (W)SXGA(+) display, it would be the perfect laptop...
The Acer Aspire One has the touchpad buttons besides the touchpad. I never used the touchpad so extensively before I bought one of those babies and I have to say that I don't feel that to be at all uncomfortable. Could it be possible that you are just so used to have the buttons below the touchpad that anything that goes against your habit is superficially seen by you as uncomfortable?
Moreover, you can always use touchpad taps to simulate mouse clicks.
Not a netbook at all then but rather an overpriced, underpowered sub notebook. If you're going to get something that size, might as well go for a Lenovo Thinkpad x200s which at least will last longer than the warranty and IME, have a longer battery life whilst still giving you a Core 2 Duo CPU. Still, I'm sure the unwashed masses will buy them by the bucketload.
I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
9" was the sweet spot for me.
For me the sweet spot is a 10 inch with a decent screen resoloution, the extra inch of size is barely noticeable and yet it allows a much more capable machine. Unforuntately the vast majority of 10 inch models have a screen resoloution no better than the 9 inch models.
I don't know if Asus are still making 9" models, but they have dried up completely in the UK.
they are becoming rare but they haven't dissapeared just yet, for example dabs have a disney rebranded one.
http://www.dabs.com/products/asus-dinsey-mk90h-blu017x-1gb-xph-6CHG.html?refs=408510000
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
768 is only marginally tall enough, since some inconsiderate app developers are making simple dialog boxes taller than that.
Can we have some names?
I've found a lot of apps have dialogs too big for a 600 pixel high screen but I don't think i've seen one yet that goes over on a 768 pixel high screen.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
Yes they do, any netbook with an Nvidia ION such as the HP Mini 311 will have HDMI output and will happily play 1080p video without stuttering.
most of the 12 inch "netbooks" i've seen have a 1366x768 resolution (marketed as "HD"). This one is no exception.
you can even get 1366x768 in a 10 inch though the prices are stretching the definition of a netbook (e.g. the mini 5101 with HD screen is currently £410 inc VAT ands the vaio w is currently £380 inc VAT) though they've come down a bit since I bought mine.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
Agreed, the keyboard on my X40 is near perfect and I've never used anything nearly as good. 12" also means more flexiblity, I could never use one of those gigantic 15.4" things.. whenever I see them, i think of mobile phones from the 80s.
Large screens for stationary computing, small for on the go/relaxing in umpteen different positions on the couch and so on.
Then get the AsRock version, it's pretty much Asus and it's getting raving reviews all over. And has an optical drive.
I can't agree there, the original EEE had a screen that didn't even fill it's lid and had a horribly low resolution. The 900 series fixed that and is still IMO a good choice if you can live with the limited mass storage and the 600 pixels vertical resolution. Pity that it seems to be disappearing :(.
What really disappointed me was when they want to 10 inch they didn't increase the screen resolution. Eventually a couple of 10 inch "netbooks" with 1366x768 screens showed up (sony do one as do HP, I saw one announced by asus recently but I haven't actually seen it on the market yet) but they command a huge price premium (nearly 2x the price) over ordinary 10 inch netbooks.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
I don't see the point with an ION netbook. A netbook is a highly portable version of a laptop which means smaller, lighter, excellent battery life and very cheap. The thing you can carry around in a bag without thinking about it because it is no hassle to carry and it doesn't really matter if it gets stolen/dropped anyway.
"Netbooks" are now just bad laptops. Compared to a low-end laptop they have the same price, similar weight, similar dimensions... Usually I can buy a slightly better spec low-end laptop for cheaper! These over-spec netbooks do not fit the purpose, they are desktop/laptop replacements, not secondary machines.
I'd take a £250 netbook with a 9" screen, 32gb SSD and just enough horsepower for basic web and spreadsheets over a £400 netbook-come-laptop. Even if you were giving them away (well OK, unless I could ebay the £400 one for more than £250).
Where ION does interest me is nettops and HTPC - though the latter seem to be getting less interesting generally due to some good boxes coming out that fit all the requirements plus have the advantages that come with being wholly designed for the task. For nettops the advantage is clearer since it's a desktop replacement, which has what the hardware has become.
I'm writing this on an HP Mini 5101 (10"), and that has them in the right place too.
Still a bit crap though; it's hard to press both buttons at once (i.e. middle-click). I wish they'd put a multitouch pad in; if Asus can afford to do multitouch in a $200 netbook then HP should certainly have been able to do it in a $400 one.
What's your point? Roadsters and SUVs are all automobiles. SUV is a marketing term. But that doesn't mean that it's not descriptive of a very specific type of automobile. If a vehicle is advertised as an SUV then I expect it to hold more than two people and I expect it to cope with off-road driving.
Likewise, if a notebook is advertised as a netbook then I expect it to be very light, very small, and to be designed for maximum battery life rather than maximum power. This was true of 9" models, and only slightly less true of 10" models. But 11" models were pushing it, and 12" is getting silly.
I have a HP5101 netbook here, mouse buttons are below trackpad. Some reviews bashed the extremely smooth trackpad, but IMO it's excellent.
fucktard is a tenderhearted description
Strictly speaking, you're right of course, but the general understanding is that a netbook should be a laptop that's very lightweight and small compared to what is a 'standard' laptop. This feature creep means that that gap is slowly closing, which kind of defeats the point of selling the things as a 'netbook'.
What a depressingly stupid machine.
The point is that by moving to a 12" screen, Asus is not really selling a "netbook" any more, but has merely rebadged "subnotebooks" or "ultraportables" as netbooks. Old wine in new bottles. If five years ago manufacturers could bring out small notebooks with optical drives in under 2 Kg, then where has five years of "progress" got us?
Da Blog
It's a Macbook Pro. At the risk of sounding like a fanboy, so far I love it. It has useful command line access like Linux, but with much better GUI polish. I still use Linux for my desktop machine at home, and this is the first Apple machine I've bought, though I did use them a lot in college back in the System 7 days.
When I was looking to replace my previous laptop, I didn't want to buy Windows again, and I wasn't happy with the Linux laptop offerings, so I thought I'd try Apple this time around.
As far as I'm concerned, this is the pinnacle of netbooks:
http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?sku_id=0665000FS10128254&catid=27003&logon=&langid=EN&dm=DEBUG
Intel Atom, 9" 1024x600 matte screen, 2lbs, thin, runs Linux perfectly, decent battery life, perfect keyboard, $200.
That's a netbook. 12", dual-core, 3+lbs, $500 isn't a netbook, that's a decent 12" laptop without an optical drive.
The thing is, you can pick up much better used 12" 3+lb laptops for $500. Heck, I'm typing this on an HP 2710p tablet I picked up on ebay. It is a 12", dual-core, can take 8GB of RAM, and is a TABLET and it cost me as much as this Asus "netbook" after taxes.
The only reason you need dual-core ION and a big screen on a netbook is because Windows demands it. My HP netbook (linked above) runs like a dog in Windows by the time you add virus scanners and all of the associated baggage. However, Ubuntu 9.10 NBR runs brilliantly. I upgraded the RAM to 2GB and put it back down to 1GB and haven't missed it.
Sadly, with the onslaught of Windows 7, it appears as though the nascent netbook market, which began with affordable computers running Linux on small SSDs, is in the process of dying. Such is life. Pick up your 2lb 9" Linux wonder while supplies last.
How about one of Asus Eee Box'es then ?
I am personally waiting for one like EB1501 but with bluray and a media center remote.
If you don't mind Asrock then there is ION 330HT-BD but it's not vesa mountable.
hth
According to World Wide Words, "Sir Humphry made a bit of a mess of naming this new element, at first spelling it alumium (this was in 1807) then changing it to aluminum, and finally settling on aluminium in 1812. His classically educated scientific colleagues preferred aluminium right from the start, because it had more of a classical ring, and chimed harmoniously with many other elements whose names ended in –ium, like potassium, sodium, and magnesium, all of which had been named by Davy."
What's the benefit of having your mac made from a single slab of aluminium? Does it make it much stronger? is it cheaper to construct that way than by bolting or welding a few pieces together? Just curious.
"Machined from a single slab of aluminium" sounds like it might be a> stronger b> more wasteful c> higher show-off value.
Love to know if you or others can offer more info.
Dell especially, since most of their models (retail offerings at least) have the memory soldered to the mobo.
Thank you for helping us help you help us all.
I had that same experience with HP.
There is no forgiving that...
I have one of these Revos myself and really like it. Ditched Vista straight away to make room for Debian; and it's now acting as my little quiet server.
I haven't really bothered with video and such yet (no proper TV for that) but from what I'd seen the Revo with the Atom 230 might not be powerful enough for a lot of high-res video, but the Revo with the Atom 330 probably is.
Maybe the ASRock Ion 330 might be a better option for you?
I concur. Why have a huge box when you can have a little portable machine that is barely slower than a desktop? After over 20 years of strictly owning desktops, I bought a notebook and can't imagine why I never did earlier. Cost was certainly a factor, but now notebooks are damned cheap with lots of sub $1000 machines with decent specs. I went cheap and got an Acer Aspire 14" and the size and weight are pretty nice. 3gb RAM, 2ghz dual core athlon turion with cores from the latest phenom and hypertransport 3 for like $500 and a nvidia 9100m that will at least play some decent 3d games really kind of made it a nice machine. No crappy intel gma here. At this point the only thing I wish it had was a discrete video card, but seing as how the 9100M is at least pretty equivalent to an 8400GS, its a whole lot better the aging radeon 9250 PCI I used for years was. Don't think it will play oblivion all that well, but any games up to 2005-2006 run pretty good. Not bad for an integrated chipset. After 6 months this machine has been super stable, though virtualbox doesn't seem to play when I try to use both cores in a VM, but I'm suspecting it is how my bios implements AMD-V though, and probably not anything with the virtualbox code, though it is one of the things they keep tweaking for stability looking at the changelogs Turning off IO APIC seems to make things nice and stable.
zosxavius photography
I know people who played WoW on G4 ibooks....I'd be scared to try that on my 1st gen atom netbook (let alone the first netbooks that used some bastardized celeron chip)
Bottles.
My friend had a machine with the exact problems that you just describe. I couldn't for the life of me figure out why his keyboard died and then the usb ports started flaking out and I immediately knew it was the usb controller. I gave him an external keyboard, but the machine became super unstable after that and finally totally died probably a month later. It looked like his hard drive was starting to die as well. I bought an acer since his machine seemed so reliable and then that happened. Hopefully they fixed their manufacturing process. My model is a couple of years newer and has been trouble free for about 6 months now. If I get 2 years out of it I think I'd be happy. It was reasonably cheap. I'd imagine that if you got the run around on a warranty you could take the manufacturer to small claims court if you could make a good case. There would be an excellent chance that they would never show up in court and you would get default judgement. Nothing wrong with using the law to your advantage.
zosxavius photography
My Aspire One (D150) has the buttons on a rocker below the touchpad.
I actually have a Thinkpad SL500 (which is a 16:10 15.4" machine) as a desktop replacement machine, and it's not half bad for around the house... having 1680x1050 resolution on a laptop is great for heavy multitasking and getting actual work done.
Granted, those used to be more expensive than a regular laptop, not less, and be targeted (at least in the US) at business travelers, but apart from the fact that technological advancement and commoditization has driven down prices, and all of a sudden average people are interested in small laptops, I really don't understand what the difference is from a netbook.
There's at least 10 years of precedent for this terminology to describe what is now being called a netbook.
But heck, now netbooks can have 12" and 14" in screens. 12 was absolutely the cutoff for an ultraportable or subnotebook.
I'm starting to think that netbook just means, "mass market laptop with shitty component quality". Compare this POS to even a Macbook Air, or any of the ultraportables from 5 and 10 years ago.
Yay consumerism. The triumph of mass market shit. Don't get me wrong, I like prices coming down and democratization of technology, but this low quality netbook fad has become way too damn manipulative. Technology journalists need to get off the corporate teet and inform today's consumers just what is happening here.
the creep up towards 12" screens is annoying
May be annoying but if there's a market for it...
Personally, I wouldn't buy any netbook with a screen smaller than 10', larger than 11', or heavier than 2.5lbs. The ideal is IMO 8.5x11.0.5, =4h battery life.
Which entirely defeats the point of having a laptop....
Huh ? It's *exactly* the point of having a laptop - so you can pick up whatever you're doing and take it with you when you need to, without being crippled by a tiny screen and cramped keyboard most of the time.
The HP Mini 311's have Ions so I don't know what they mean by 'firs' netbook which could play older 3D titles respectably.
Meh. I just tap to click, and I have the bottom corner of my touchpad set to right click. I barely use the buttons on my 701.
There was also the 900HA and 900HD which are a smidge thicker than the 900 or 901, but had a spinning hard drive if one wanted more mass storage space. It could also be easily swapped out with another drive or 2.5" SSD if desired. In my opinion the 9" chassis is the ultimate in portability as it easily fits into a full backpack. I like my 701 for this reason (though do wish I had 1024x600 resolution of a 9" screen in the same chassis size)
Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer told an audience of financial analysts that the company's attempts to cut prices of Windows to induce demand in emerging markets had failed over the previous year, and that the solution to the company's woes will be to increase the price of computers.
"The theory was wrong," Ballmer said, explaining that there wasn't enough new demand to make up for the drop in profits. "You'll see us address the theory. We're going to readjust those prices north [using Windows 7]."
Microsoft worked to eradicate Linux netbooks by pushing its PC partners to license Windows XP for next to nothing. This did nothing for Vista, but did result in the company being able to advertise that the new netbook category was still dominated by Windows. Moving forward, the capacity of netbooks to run Windows 7, which will not be offered for free, has been a major issue for Microsoft and its PC partners.
Reporting on the event, Peter Burrows of BusinessWeek wrote, "the company's goal is to raise PC prices in the next year. That's due both to expected popularity of a new class of higher-end and higher-priced netbooks, a new pricing strategy around Windows 7 that the company hopes will result in far more upgrades to premium SKUs, and a reversal of a strategy in the last year to cut prices to spur demand in emerging countries."
(http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/07/31/microsoft_plans_to_use_windows_7_to_raise_netbook_prices.html)
"I think many of you (Wall Street analysts) think we have problems we don't have in the Windows business," Ballmer said. "And I think we've got -- built some great strengths and, yet, I want people to understand kind of how revenue and kind of success in the marketplace, what does it look like if we're strong in the marketplace, what does revenue look like."
Ballmer, unlike some Microsoft execs, wasn't afraid to say the word "netbook." In fact, he told FAM attendees that netbooks are synonymous with MIDs (Mobile Internet Devices).
Ballmer disputed the notion that netbooks are killing Microsoft's Windows client revenue base. He showed a slide he admitted the rest of his team had warned him was overly complex (and I have to say I agree) to try to show why netbooks aren't going to keep chipping away at Windows' margins.
Ballmer told analysts there would be a new class of "ultra-thin" PCs" -- or high-end netbooks -coming this year that would combine the light weight of netbooks with high-power and high-performance of traditional PCs.
"When I talk to many of our customers, they say 'I love the Netbook but can I get one with a bigger screen?'" Ballmer said.
Those new ultra-thin PCs, the first of which will be coming later this year and, presumably running Windows 7, won't be as cheap as $299 or $399 netbooks, Ballmer admitted, but they will combine netbooks' portability, with some unnamed but higher-sounding prices that will make shareholders, analysts and Microsoft happy. (We'll see how happy they make customers who are spoiled by current netbook prices.)
"Our license tells you what a Netbook is. Our license says it has to have a super small screen, which means it probably has a super small keyboard and it has to have a certain processor and blah, blah, blah, blah," Ballmer said. But "we want people to be able to get the advantages of light-weight performance and be able to spend more money, with us, with Intel, with HP, with Dell and with many, many others. So the shifting dynamics here will continue to evolve."
(http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=3562)
100megabit is required for 1080p but realistically you can get away with 24megabit. I like to have a lot of head-room though.
There was also the HP mini 2140 which was about the size of an EEEPC 900 but had shoehorned in a 10 inch screen and a proper HDD. Unfortunately they never released the HD screen option for it in the UK and due to problems with a supplier I missed my opportunity to grey import one.
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
No kidding. I'm not sure what they're going to call these bigger and more expensive netbooks, but I just wanted a small, cheap, basic computer--not something that's going to take up my whole lap.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Being machined from a single slab of aluminum lets you:
1) simplify the assembly (less pieces to put together, less screws to strip/break, less chinese workers needed, and it's easier on the worker too)
2) making the case thinner with the same strength (you know how when you try to screw together pieces of metal of plastic, there's space consumed for a bolt/nut? If the screw loosens, then you lose strength and can potentially snap off the piece in the hole.)
3) better thermal dissipation (Consider this: is a heatsink made of a solid block better or worse than several blocks screwed together?)
These are the reasons I can think of, there could be more. When Apple first started advertising the unibody enclosures, I too was like "uh, why should I care?"