IOC Orders Blogger To Take Down Video

An anonymous reader writes "The International Olympic Committee has ordered a blogger to remove a video from his website showing the death of Georgian luger Nodar Kumaritashvili. The IOC asserts that it owns all the rights to all images taken at the games, and only licensed broadcasters can use them. However, the blogger, Stephen Pate, points to a Canadian law that allows copyrighted images to be used in newsworthy cases."

Comments

Nothing new

[digitalunity]

The IOC has taken an extreme protectionist stance on all its content for many years. It doesn't matter if it's fair use or not, the IOC will object on principle.

The Olympics are big money.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Except to NBC

Re:Nothing new

[LostCluster]

Yep, and the "Olympic Movement" is given special rights under US Laws that give their trademarks such as the five-ring-design even stronger protection than a typical trademark. Basically, they're claiming they need NBCU/CBC/FoxTel/your-local-Olympic-broadcaster's money to put on the games, and therefore they need super-copyright. They have it now, it'll take an act of Congress to get rid of it.

Re:Nothing new

[Tiger4]

Except to NBC

Losing money by the tens of millions in a selfless act of colossal commercial miscalculation.

Re:Nothing new

[religious freak]

If my son/father/whatever had his head broken in a million pieces (or whatever happened, I didn't see the vid), I sure would appreciate a powerful organization working to take it down.

Yeah, IOC is usually ridiculous in their claims and I almost always have an opinion against them, but in this case, I think someone's life should probably be worth a little more than goreporn. Why does such a video need to be hosted and why should someone have the right to make money off of the death of another person? If I were the family, I'd be pissed too.

Take the vid down, FFS

Re:Nothing new

[interkin3tic]

The IOC has taken an extreme protectionist stance on all its content for many years. It doesn't matter if it's fair use or not, the IOC will object on principle.

The Olympics are big money.

I think this actually IS a new low for the IOC. They're going to profit from the images taken at the games, that's normal.

Ordering a blogger to take down video would be pretty low and stupid as is: as if someone is going to watch someone's blog instead of the games on NBC or whatever. That's absurd. A blogger is no competition.

What takes this to a whole new level is that it's the death of a competitor.... so... THE IOC IS HOPING TO PROFIT FROM THE VIDEO OF THIS ATHELETE DYING?!?

Jesus.

Were it not the IOC I would assume this was done in the name of taste. People shouldn't be watching videos of a tragic event like this. But it being the IOC, and seeing as they just claimed Lindsey Vonn's name (or exclusive rights to use it in advertising... whatever...), I have to think that this is -at best- an attempt to set a precedent that absolutely all video from the olympics are absolutely the IOCs property, and can't be shown anywhere. More likely, they're going to try to sell the video to news organizations and want a fucking monopoly.

Re:Nothing new

[Sir_Lewk]

If we started making exceptions to freedom of speech/press every time somebody got offended, then we would be left with nothing.

Re:Nothing new

[headkase]

Not proud of it but I've seen it. In this case there isn't anything gore at all, he comes to a complete stop: immediately. The problem is that today it is this video, tomorrow it may be something less clear cut. As every persons definition of "good" and "bad" is different you have to take the good with the bad. Agree or not with this particular case the proper thing to do is lump it under censorship as the law for newsworthy items is pretty clear and deal with that as an issue. You're not going to like everything - that is the point.

Re:Nothing new

[Adrian Lopez]

I shudder to think what the IOC might be able to get away with should ACTA become law. It's a shame how far we've strayed from its original purpose. Copyright was never supposed to enable this kind of abuse.

Re:Nothing new

[Hatta]

What takes this to a whole new level is that it's the death of a competitor.... so... THE IOC IS HOPING TO PROFIT FROM THE VIDEO OF THIS ATHELETE DYING?!?

I think that's not quite what's happening here. I think the IOC is afraid that the more the video is watched, the more negative associations people will have with the Olympics, and the fewer viewers they'll get. They're hoping to lose as little as possible after this tragedy.

They're still (predictably) overreaching here though.

Re:Nothing new

[LostCluster]

The IOC released this video to the major news sources after the accident happened, then NBC announced the day after that they'll not be showing it again in the remainder of their coverage, and other sources had their limited rights expire. Without the IOC being so nice and sharing the video, it would have been seen by a lot fewer people.

Re:Nothing new

[Dhalka226]

More than likely they hope to bury it. It's not exactly a shining-star moment in the Olympics. I'm sure they'd prefer people forgot about it and moved on.

Re:Nothing new

[headkase]

Darn it, forgot to close a bold tag after "censorship" and of course I don't preview. Forgive me.

Re:Nothing new

[blai]

> I sure would appreciate a powerful organization working to take it down.

Why do you care?
Why are you free enough to care?

Re:Nothing new

[NeutronCowboy]

Because it shames the IOC's claim that it was only the luger's fault that he died. if you watch the video, you see that a basic miscalculation (misjudging the sled's speed when correcting the trajectory) caused him to an inside wall. After that came about 1 second of flying through the air, and hitting a metal pole with his head and upper back. It was pretty much game over after he hit the inside wall. There was absolutely nothing he or anybody else could have done once he overadjusted the trajectory of his sled.

That's the tragedy, and that's why it needs to stay up: the course was designed with deadly obstacles a minor mistake away. If the downhill was held by running the skiers around large, unprotected metal poles, people would be in an uproar - and justifiably so.

Sometimes, deadly videos are important to illustrate the deadly consequence of other people's actions.

Re:Nothing new

[Opportunist]

Do you think they want to cut it out to "protect the family of the deceased"? They care about the reputation of their precious cash cow. And that ain't the athletes. They're just the necessary evil to milk the whole deal.

Re:Nothing new

[maxume]

I saw it on the NBC nightly news the day that it happened. The national news.

I was somewhat horrified.

Re:Nothing new

[The Archon V2.0]

I think that's not quite what's happening here. I think the IOC is afraid that the more the video is watched, the more negative associations people will have with the Olympics, and the fewer viewers they'll get. They're hoping to lose as little as possible after this tragedy.

So rather than hoping to make money off the death of an athlete, they're hoping the death of an athlete doesn't damage their profits? I fail to see that much difference between those two possibilities.

Re:Nothing new

[bdwlangm]

They played video of him dying repeatedly on CTV here in Canada, I'm sure the American networks had it too. They linked video from their webpage. Is the IOC doing anything about that? I tend to think they should all stop showing it out of respect, but really the IOC aren't doing the right thing, they're just protecting the value of official Olympic coverage.

Re:Nothing new

[fredjh]

Maybe if they'd listen to the viewers complaining Olympics after Olympics that we want less human interest stories and more events. Events are going on there ALL DAY. The downhill skiers aren't waiting for the Hockey game to be over; they have TONS of actual events they could be showing non-stop during their relatively few hours of Olympics broadcasts. If it means that we're not just watching Americans, fine! I know people living here from all over the world, we want to see everything, whether an American is involved or not.

Re:Nothing new

[digitalunity]

Not to lunge off topic or anything but I think you dramatically miscalculate his airtime. He was airborne for no longer than .3-.4 seconds.

I'm not nitpicking as this difference in airtime is significant when it comes to reaction time and his ability to deflect his trajectory. At that speed, putting his arms in front of himself would have done little, but had he been going slower he could have sacrificed his arms to protect his head or torso. They say the average persons reaction time is a half second or so, but in the video he doesn't even get his hands in front of his head. He likely knew he was going to hit the column mere milliseconds before he died.

Re:Nothing new

[Obfuscant]

I think the IOC is afraid that the more the video is watched, the more negative associations people will have with the Olympics, and the fewer viewers they'll get.

You've got to be kidding. The only reason to watch the luge or bobsled is to see what happens when something going really, really fast slides off the edge of the ice.

I mean, they run one at a time, so there's no competition except the clock. They all follow pretty much the same path down the same course. The only real difference is how well they start and ... IF they finish.

If NASCAR races was just to see how fast someone could drive and give the trophy to the fastest, they wouldn't be 500 miles long and the cars wouldn't all run at the same time. And nobody would watch. Same for knickers-clad fanbois sledding downhill.

They're still (predictably) overreaching here though.

They're doing one (or both) of two things. They're protecting their intellectual property by objecting to ALL infringing uses of that property so it doesn't look like selective enforcement, or they're protecting their hinies from lawsuits from the family of the luger by limiting the display of the death in public.

Re:Nothing new

[Dunbal]

It's not exactly a shining-star moment in the Olympics. I'm sure they'd prefer people forgot about it and moved on.

      Yes it's much easier to pay lawyers to try to shut everyone up than actually fix a dangerous track that has injured several other athletes.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

Yes I agree, but he could offer to take it down out of concern for the families privacy rather than because the IOC has asked him to. Take the Moral high road and keep your freedom of speech at the same time. why not, you lose little. Blog about it by all means but the goreporn value is pretty nil anyway.

Re:Nothing new

[NeutronCowboy]

Good point. I took the airtime from memory. I'm not even sure he could have put his arms in front of him if he tried - he hit pole the with his back side. So even going slower would have made only a negligible impact on his ability to brace himself somehow... The only thing that could have saved him was if he had been going slow enough to not flip over the barrier. And that wouldn't have been even close to an Olympic competition speed.

Re:Nothing new

[wealthychef]

He likely knew he was going to hit the column mere milliseconds before he died.

Actually, thankfully in this case, conscious awareness is even slower than reaction time. He never knew what hit him, I would think.

Re:Nothing new

[Obfuscant]

Yes it's much easier to pay lawyers to try to shut everyone up than actually fix a dangerous track that has injured several other athletes.

Except they did change the track, whether it fixed all the possible problems or not, nobody knows. But even so, imagine a luge track with no danger at all. Yawn. What else is on the telly, Madge?

Re:Nothing new

[Dunbal]

Yep, and the "Olympic Movement" is given special rights under US Laws

      It used to be that hosting olympic events was a money-maker for the cities involved. However recently data shows that towns that host Olympics are actually losing out. I don't agree with "special privileges" for anyone, but it's understandable to see how they can happen where there is a source of income for the state. But when the state is trying to "protect" something that is actually costing tax payer dollars, it's time to repeal laws (or repeal the damned state).

Re:Nothing new

[MichaelSmith]

Content from the events cost $$$ so the TV networks pad the coverage out with cheap human interest crap and trolling. Its been this way for decades. We all hate it and it not getting any better.

Re:Nothing new

[wealthychef]

So rather than hoping to make money off the death of an athlete, they're hoping the death of an athlete doesn't damage their profits? I fail to see that much difference between those two possibilities.

It's the difference between hiring a hit man and hushing up a family suicide.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

That's because your livelyhood doesn't depend upon the reactions of viewers to negative content. I see their point and remember that someone's cash cow is giving a lot of people their milk and bread.

Re:Nothing new

[MichaelSmith]

Yeah but at my local water slide you can't come off in that way because its a long pipe. People go in one and and hopefully come out the other end but you can't sell TV coverage of that. Maybe they should experiment with cameras inside a tube or channel.

Re:Nothing new

[mcsqueak]

Events are going on there ALL DAY. The downhill skiers aren't waiting for the Hockey game to be over; they have TONS of actual events they could be showing non-stop during their relatively few hours of Olympics broadcasts.

Indeed. They really should have 3-4 channels that show nothing BUT Olympics during the two week span of the games, that way you could actually see all the events you want to see, plus they would probably still have time for "human interest" stories (gag) between events.

I don't have a DVR, and I don't plan my schedule around TV viewing, so I've missed a lot of games I would have liked to have seen. I was lucky to have happened to be sitting in front of the TV with the Olympics on when Lindsay Vonn had her gold medal run last week. That was great. But then look at how they botched the Canada/USA hockey coverage yesterday to show "ice dancing" or whatever instead. Seriously, folks?

As pointed out elsewhere, the NBC Olympic coverage has not kept up with how people want to consume media these days.

Re:Nothing new

[Dunbal]

So I take it you watch car/motorcycle races just for the crashes, too?

Re:Nothing new

[ChinggisK]

Agreed, censorship argument aside, he's an ass for putting it up in the first place. Sounds like he's using an 'omg freedom of speech!' argument as an excuse for being a douche. And so far most of /. seems to be buying it... I was hoping for better here, honestly.

Re:Nothing new

[blackraven14250]

DVR? That wouldn't help at all. NBC has been time delaying tons of events, and doesn't list different events separately in their programming. It's a giant 3 to 6 hour block of "Winter Olympics", with no distinction on events shown.

Re:Nothing new

[blackraven14250]

He did, however, know he was in deep shit.

Re:Nothing new

[twidarkling]

Yep, and the "Olympic Movement" is given special rights under US Laws

Except he's citing a Canadian law. If he's based in Canada, then he's probably got a home-run case.

If he's *not* in Canada, dude's fucked. Just because the games are taking place here doesn't mean he'd be covered under Canadian copyright laws. Unfortunately, tfa didn't say, that I saw, and I can't be assed to look it up.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Excuse me, but over here in my opinion, I want my (Mature enough to see it) children to see this video and hear that sickening CLANG so they will think twice about doing something fast and reckless.
My stomach turned over twice watching this man die, but it can not be undone. And furthermore, why do they have fucking steel I beams bordering this track? Shouldn't
a luge track be surrounded by marshmallows, giant pillows, air bags, etc......

Re:Nothing new

[mcsqueak]

I don't see a reason why they couldn't have some sort of plexiglass or other clear covering that comes up higher, so if someone is ejected from their sled they hit the plexiglass and fall back into the run, rather than hitting something (like a pole) outside of it.

Also, it is very tragic that he died, but this is also a good time to realize that sports like this are inherently dangerous and sometimes this is the outcome, no matter what precautions are taken (say the pole had been padded, who knows if he would have lived, been paralyzed, or still died). I think the athletes are more accepting of this outcome than their families. I cycle a LOT during the summer, and I hate to think what would happen if my front tire were to fail while going down a hill at 35 MPH, for example. It doesn't stop me from participating in a sport that I love though, and I imagine with pro athletes it's probably the same.

Re:Nothing new

[Frosty Piss]

Watch all the geeks hyperventilate as they pant out "Streisand Effect... Blaw, blaw, blaw..." like the IOC gives a shit. It's about money, folks, the IOC couldn't care less about "how it makes them look". And really, very few people will even be aware of this guy, even with your precious "Streisand Effect". The truth is, "The Games" are (today) a joke.

Re:Nothing new

[mysidia]

They have it now, it'll take an act of Congress to get rid of it.

Or an act of the courts protecting the constitutional rights of the people.

Re:Nothing new

[mcsqueak]

DVR? That wouldn't help at all. NBC has been time delaying tons of events, and doesn't list different events separately in their programming. It's a giant 3 to 6 hour block of "Winter Olympics", with no distinction on events shown.

You know, you're right... it does show up in Comcast's channel screen as just a single block of "Winter Olympics" for several hours. That is pretty tricky/evil...

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/5360646/Nodar_Kumaritashvili_Luge_Crash_2010_Vancouver_Olympics_FULL_VID

Re:Nothing new

[thesupraman]

Funny enough we currently have 4 channels of winter olympics running.

Talk to your broadcaster, they have the option.

Re:Nothing new

[interkin3tic]

If we started making exceptions to freedom of speech/press every time somebody got offended, then we would be left with nothing.

I think there's a pretty clear line between "not showing someone getting killed" and "not showing anything offensive to anyone."

It's my opinion however that "not showing someone dying" should not be enforced by law, enforced by corporate interests, and especially not barred by copyright law used as a weapon by corporate interests. Blogger showing it was bad, IOC was even worse.

Re:Nothing new

[multisync]

Indeed. They really should have 3-4 channels that show nothing BUT Olympics during the two week span of the games, that way you could actually see all the events you want to see, plus they would probably still have time for "human interest" stories (gag) between events.

That's the way it is in Canada for these games, but interest is huge because we're the host country. There are at least four networks (including NBC) showing non-stop coverage here, and I've heard some of the "specialty channels" are carrying some events as well. But I don't know if there is enough interest outside of the host country to justify the kind of coverage you are calling for.

This list notes that NBC, Universal Sports, Telemundo, USA Network, CNBC, MSNBC are carrying at least some coverage in the US.

I don't know what kind of ratings NBC is getting for these games; I know it was a concern prior to the games starting, as they paid a record amount for the rights. The US is leading in meddles, so maybe interest is higher than anticipated.

Re:Nothing new

[Obfuscant]

Whoever modded my comment flaimbait doesn't understand the difference between "real life" and real flamebait.

Yes, when I watch cars going around in a circle for hours and hours, I'm waiting to see the crash. That's what most people are doing. There is no other reason. Like I said, if we were looking to reward the fastest guy, we'd run them one at a time and use a stopwatch. Much safer. (They DO that during the time trials. Notice how the time trials rarely make it to the telly? The only time I've ever seen time trials broadcast is years ago right before Indianapolis, and that was close to Indy and during the otherwise boring holiday weekend.)

If we were looking for the best driver, we'd run them one at a time so he wouldn't be forced into choosing the worst path just to keep hitting someone else. So just why DO we run them all at the same time, on the same course, for hours upon end, if we aren't looking for the times when they crash?

That's human nature. "Predictable" doesn't glue eyes to the telly. If every stone thrown during a curling match went exactly where it was intended, eyes would glaze over by the end of the first end and nobody would watch that, either.

Re:Nothing new

[techno-vampire]

Take the Moral high road

If that blogger had given a damn about the moral high road, he wouldn't have posted the video in the first place. Please note that the day it happened, NBC announced that they would not be airing the footage again and that the man's father has said that he doesn't want to watch it. The only reason to post it was so that ghouls could get their vicarious thrills over and over again by watching a man DIE.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

You have to keep in mind that the Canadian lugers had been practicing on the course for two years prior to the games, without serious incident. While it's not fair to place blame solely on the shoulders of the luger in this case, it also isn't fair to suggest that the course was designed to be a deathtrap or "designed with deadly obstacles a minor mistake away". The course was designed to be fast and challenging, though some argue it was perhaps too fast.

The guy make a mistake, and it cost him his life, and that's tragic. The course was designed maybe 10kph faster than the norm, which may have magnified the impact of his mistake. Though based on the general negative raction the other lugers had to moving down the starting position, I'd say any claim that the incident happened solely because the course was expressly designed to be a death trap are more than slightly exagerrated. Lugers like challenging and they like fast even more. they absolutely love a combination of fast and challenging, otherwise they woudn't be hurling themselves down a track at 140+ kph, would they?

And the skiing example? I reckon you didn't catch the womens' alpine downhill last week, where a huge portion of the skiiers whiped out, including Anja Paerson (most decorated aline skiier, all time) botching her landing and rolling something like 200 meters to the finish. She got up on her own eventually, others had to be airlifted out. Nobody argued that the course was designed to be a death trap. The skiiers may have commented that it was a tough course, but not one, especially not the ones who didn't make it all the way down, so much as suggested that it was meant to be dangerous. They knew going in that it was a tough, technical course.

The risk of injury (or worse) is something you're well aware of and accept in any sport than involves moving downhill at breakneck speed while requiring hairpin maneuvering. You might as well argue that the luge, bobsleigh, skelleton and alpine skiing as sports, are "with deadly obstacles a minor mistake away" since they all involve hurling oneself down at breakneck speeds, while requiring pinpoint accuracy in maneuvering. The athletes were well aware of what the sport entails and the risks involved were when they signed up. Let's throw in the ski jump as well, $deity knows you can break your neck vaulting yourself 90-100+ meters at high speed. And hell. the figure skating system should be redesigned as well, after that poor Candaian girl got kicked sqaure in the face by her partner.

This isn't about "covering up" their "shame". It's about tastelessness. A news articl would have sufficed, and picture of the aftermath would have been plenty. but a video of someone hitting a pillar at 150KpH? It's certainly more attention grabbing, I'll give 'em that.

Re:Nothing new

[BikeHelmet]

As pointed out elsewhere, the NBC Olympic coverage has not kept up with how people want to consume media these days.

But pirates rejoice, because EZTV's coverage has been perfect. :P

Re:Nothing new

[pauly99]

I find the stories to be inspiring but am constantly turning between NBC, USA, MSNBC, and CNBC to watch something other that commercials.

Re:Nothing new

[Surt]

Because, you know, having a fascination with death, the end of us all, the foundation of every major religion, makes you evil.

Re:Nothing new

[techno-vampire]

I'm sure the American networks had it too.

NBC only showed it two or three times. Then, they announced that they wouldn't be showing it again. It's a shame that CTV didn't follow their lead in this.

Re:Nothing new

[haruharaharu]

Yes I agree, but he could offer to take it down out of concern for the families privacy rather than because the IOC has asked him to. Take the Moral high road and keep your freedom of speech at the same time. why not, you lose little. Blog about it by all means but the goreporn value is pretty nil anyway.

What privacy? The dude died during the olympics - this isn't a private matter. And if you need to take something down, then you don't have free speech. Sure, it's poor taste, but it's also news.

Re:Nothing new

[MichaelSmith]

I cycle a LOT during the summer, and I hate to think what would happen if my front tire were to fail while going down a hill at 35 MPH, for example

Yeah though the difference between luge and bike riding is that luge riders don't really do a lot of it, which may be the problem. My guess is they would clock up an hour in total of time on the sled in a season. I cycled for an hour a day when I was commuting, and that was just routine. The injury rate among people who only cycle an hour a year is probably quite high, from heart attacks alone.

I stopped commuting in July last year when I broke my right arm in a crash. Then I got back on the bike for two weeks and had an epileptic seizure (my first in 25 years) and thats really scary because it could happen at any time. Don't worry about tires or brake cables going. What if your brain stops working? Anyway, gotta get back on the bike...

Re:Nothing new

[AuMatar]

My guess is more that they want to hide the footage- to stop anyone from showing it, because it could harm their image.

Re:Nothing new

[jayveekay]

The luge course has walls along its length to keep the lugers within the confines of the track. The height of the walls is higher at some points of the track. I would guess that the baseline wall height is 4-5 feet. At the point where the Georgian luger went over the wall there was 2-3 foot high extension. The Georgian luger cleared this extension just barely, allowing him to exit the relative safety of the track. [Once a luger traveling at high speed leaves the confines of the track the result is uncontrollable and quite likely catastrophic for both the luger and anyone he hits.]

The next day the walls along that portion were raised substantially higher.

My question is: How does a luge course designer determine how high the walls should be in order to ensure that lugers are kept contained to the track? Is it based on "gut feel" or some mathematical analysis?

Re:Nothing new

[jandrese]

Yeah, the cities "lose money", but it seems to me that a lot of that is due to the city moving up civil works projects that were otherwise on the back burner just because they want to put on the best face for the Olympics. Plus, at the very least you tend to get a bunch of Olympic level venues that the locals get to use after the games are over. Heck, Rio is even reusing the housing in the Olympic village as low cost housing for the poor. Low cost housing is something that they would have lost money on anyway.

Re:Nothing new

[sunking2]

I know they were figured to lose a ton of money, but to be honest the US is doing exceedingly well this time around and generating a bit of buzz. Keep in mind that a lot of what they will get paid by sponsors is tied to viewership ratings. I suspect it won't nearly be close to the $200M loss they were talking about a week before the game.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

And it's more more fun to ignore how pissed off the athletes were that the starting positions were moved down. OH EM GEE lugers like fast and challenging! Who'd have thunk it!

Re:Nothing new

[compro01]

Pillows or air bags would need to be of incredible size and compressibility to be at all useful. Lugers can hit over 80MPH and are practically buck naked aside from a helmet. Keeping people alive though that kind of sudden deceleration force is iffy even with a rigid steel cage, restraints, and crumple zones.

I doubt that not having the beam there would have made any difference.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

> The US is leading in meddles

Certainly. Iraq... Afghanistan... hard for anyone else to compete!

Re:Nothing new

[golden age villain]

Even curling?

Re:Nothing new

[cenc]

I have 3 channels on direct TV in south America dedicated to just the olympics, plus a channel with interactive guide with result, events, medal standing by country. Not sure if other parts of the world are getting that.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

People think a laws are the answer and that he should stand up for freedom. But this is case of the Olympics using a bazooka to swat a mosquito.

The Olympics should have contact him privately ask him to take down the video on behalf of the family. If he refused to comply, use your broadcasting powers to shame him as nothing more than a scummy sensational journalist.

Instead now it's about rights and very public. The man has no public goodwill to lose and the Olympics are losing what little they have. Also lawyers = $$$.

We don't need new laws, or talk about freedom of speech. We need people to be more effective at communicating their needs.

Idiots

Re:Nothing new

[golden age villain]

I think it's more a matter of decency than freedom of speech.

Re:Nothing new

[Idiomatick]

Thats stupid. Copyright law has nothing to do with not offending dead people's parents. And Canadian law is VERY clear that news can't be copyrighted. Case closed.

Re:Nothing new

[bertoelcon]

But pirates rejoice, because EZTV's coverage has been perfect. :P

I actually was wondering how they are getting such good coverage when the ones who paid for rights are not.

Re:Nothing new

[Amouth]

Except they didn't stop NBC from replaying it for days after the event.

I didn't see it happen live instead i first saw it in the crap hour of commenter's right before the opening ceremonies..

Sorry - on the moral road yea don't post it - on the other moral road - use it to show how news and the IOC have zero shame or respect for people but only for cash.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

but in this case, I think someone's life should probably be worth a little more than goreporn.

It is people such as yourself who claim that the features of these videos are probably only worth the goreporn that their deaths produced and "a little more." You then use your grotesque worldview to force everyone to not be able to document facts, profit from documentary efforts, and keep documents. Please do not allow your narrow, and frankly obscene, opinions of life deny the rights of others to fully express life.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Open, unfettered access to the video will also help new generations of Lugers as designers and engineers will learn from this and design better safety systems. So it is definitely important for this to be available.

Re:Nothing new

[wvmarle]

So big money that in Hong Kong in the evening news (at least on ATV, I don't know about the other free-to-air channel TVB) they can only show some still images of the action. Truly sad. As a result I am barely aware that these Olympics are being held. Quite some evenings, when there are no medals for China, the whole Olympics are completely ignored and the sports news is all about golf and British football. So yes it may be big money but no taking it completely from the TV news is not good advertising. It's over-the-top greed that comes back to haunt them.

Note I am not exactly a sports fan but Olympics has cool stuff that's good to watch for anyone and simply a great event.

Re:Nothing new

[Idiomatick]

Sure, but codifying it in law is a horrible idea. It wasn't the parents that complained, it is the IOC; fuck them.

Re:Nothing new

[quacking duck]

No amount of padding in front of the beams would've made a difference, going from 140+ km/h to zero in a fraction of a second.

What they needed was a higher wall to deflect any crashing luger downward so they'd stay on the luge track itself.

Which, incidentally, is what the Olympic organizers did immediately after. While at the same time claiming the death wasn't caused by the track, but driver error. That just disgusted me; yeah, it may have been driver error, and it was a freak accident how he hit the inner wall just so to launch out of the track, but the track was not blameless no matter what the organizers say.

Re:Nothing new

[thePowerOfGrayskull]

Sometimes, deadly videos are important to illustrate the deadly consequence of other people's actions. --

Other times, as in this case, they're great for driving up hit counts and ad revenue. I don't disagree, but let's not get so lost in high ideals that we forget the reality of how the video was being used (I checked - njnnetwork does host clickthrough ad content). In that context, this usage of a DMCA takedown makes sense and is completely appropriate.

If you're using it to report news or even give commentary on news, fine. If you're using it to give commentary and make some money off of it along the way, that's rather crossing the line.

Re:Nothing new

[multisync]

Oops. Floydian slip.

Re:Nothing new

[indiechild]

I think it's outrageous that courses are designed with such an obvious lack of safety precautions. If the wall had been higher, he wouldn't have slammed into the pillars. In every other industry such a lack of OHS would be damning, yet it's acceptable here for some reason.

Re:Nothing new

[__aasqbs9791]

They have it now, it'll take an act of Congress to get rid of it.

Or an act of the courts protecting the constitutional rights of the people.

Hahahahahaha!!!! I'll have to remember that one the next time I need a good laugh. Have you ever considered doing stand up? Since we lost GC, somethings been missing in the world.

Re:Nothing new

[g1zmo]

The US is leading in meddles, so maybe interest is higher than anticipated.

Yes, we're some of the best meddlers around!

Re:Nothing new

[Jah-Wren Ryel]

I think there's a pretty clear line between "not showing someone getting killed" and "not showing anything offensive to anyone."

I don't. You might argue that there is a scale on one end is grandma baking apple pie and the other end is something like a snuff film.
But the death of an athlete on the field at the olympics is nearly as important as the death of Neda Agha-Soltan, maybe even moreso depending on your perspective.

My point being (a) its real grey to begin with, nowhere near a clear line and (b) the circumstances of a death affect the offensiveness of its publication.

Re:Nothing new

[GIL_Dude]

What exactly were you hoping for? Agreement that censorship is good? I think most agree that it may be in poor taste, but should be allowed as censorship is worse than poor taste. Wasn't there a famous quote that covers this:

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Evelyn_Beatrice_Hall. I think most folks here are of the opinion that blocking material that may be objectionable to some is much worse than allowing it to stand on its own.

Re:Nothing new

[elvesrus]

Not just their design, but ANY 5 interlocking rings: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympic_symbols#Intellectual_property

Almost makes you wonder when they're going to sue the state of Washington or the U.S. National Park Service. http://www.nps.gov/olym/index.htm

Re:Nothing new

[scdeimos]

He's a Canadian citizen reporting on a Canadian sporting event, his domain is registered to a Charlottetown, CA address via a Canadian name register. So far he's got a good case to give the big FU to the IOC (which I wholly support).

Unfortunately it looks as though his site is hosted in Chesterfield, USA (according to cqcounter's visual traceroute), so the IOC may be able to leverage a shut down at the hosting provider. Sometimes it's unfortunate that the Internet is international.

Re:Nothing new

[PopeRatzo]

You've got it exactly right, fredjh.

Seriously, they need to just show one event after the other. None of the backstory. None of the human interest bullshit. They think that just because most of the skaters are gay and the snowboarders are high that everybody who watches it is going to be more interested in a soap opera than exciting sports action.

It's actually quite insulting and condescending of the networks to assume that to get women or gays to watch sports they have to show this kind of fluff. Actually, a couple of the most gonzo sports geeks I know are queer and last night when I was watching USA whip Canada in hockey at the neighborhood sports bar, I distinctly heard them jeering at all the human drama crap.

Interestingly, this couple I'm describing were mocking the hell out of the male figure skaters for their slightly less than manly attire. You know that when you're dressed so gay that even gay people make fun of you, you're way out there.

Re:Nothing new

[DerekLyons]

Yes I agree, but he could offer to take it down out of concern for the families privacy rather than because the IOC has asked him to.

Ah yes, what a wonderful solution - take it down because you were ordered to and then lie about it .
 

Take the Moral high road and keep your freedom of speech at the same time.

Except - you've done neither. You've lost the moral high ground because you've lied. You've lost your freedom of speech because you've bowed down to an organization that trumps your nations laws.

Re:Nothing new

[timmarhy]

luge by it's very nature is dangerous. these athletes know the risks, they have the option of not competing if they think it's too dangerous.

Re:Nothing new

[Endo13]

No it hasn't. Quite a few of the events on there are from NBC (presumably recorded somewhere in the US) and are not complete.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

I like the human interest "crap".

Otherwise it would be just a bunch of strangers moving around on screen. At least this way we know the motivations behind the athletes. For example I would not have known that one Canadian skier was motivated by his brother's Down Syndrome to push even when he's in pain.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Please note that the day it happened, NBC announced that they would not be airing the footage again and that the man's father has said that he doesn't want to watch it

Hmmm that's funny. NBC spent most of the day replaying the damn video. And when they quit replaying it, they still kept showing still images of him halfway wrapped around the pillar. And have continued to do so days after the event.
The wants & wishes of the family mean nothing here. Do you really think that the Kennedy family gets warm fuzzy feelings every time they see JFK's head explode?

It's easy for you to call other people "ghouls" as if there is a small section of society that delights in death while the rest of us hate the thought of it. Meanwhile every time there is an auto wreck traffic backs up for miles as people rubberneck, wanting to see the carnage. The fact of the matter is that humans are obsessed with death, we have a morbid fascination with it that prevents us from looking away, and in fact draws us in closer when it happens. Those who feel no such fascination are actually an extreme minority... and more than likely are simply lying to themselves.

My wife hasn't seen the video, she was working that day, and she didn't bother looking for it online. But you're saying that she should not be able to see it herself, although millions upon millions of other people already saw it, because... it will make the parents feel bad?

The moral highroad in this case IS to post the video. To do otherwise would violate the duty of the press to report news. The duty of the media is to spread information, not to restrict it, & it is not their duty to coddle those who might be offended by such news.

Re:Nothing new

[wealthychef]

I like to think he only had time to hope for the best. If I were him I'd be thinking hmm I wonder where I'll land? Then I'd be dead.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

Hosting Olympics has NEVER been a money-maker. Montreal is still paying-off their Olympic-related debt and that was all the was back in 1976. Almost no city has "made money" since then. Atlanta made money, but then people complained it was too commercialized (companies hung ads along stadium walls).

So you just can't win - either you lose money (and go into debt), or you make money and then you get criticized for it.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

I would take it down (for the family's sake)...

And then immediately replace it with another video of a different luger (perhaps one that crashed but survived). I will not cave-in to demands that I limit my free speech rights, otherwise companies could use copyright to censor uncomfortable things. Like Toyota claiming copyright over a video of one of their cars going off a cliff. Or Marlboro claiming copyright over an advertisement of an actor who later died from smoking-related cancer. Or Microsoft claiming copyright to make me remove a Vista ad that claimed it would work on only 256 megabytes (got to cover that up).

Or a school claiming copyright over a vid which reveals they were spying on kids via laptops.
Copyright claims can be abused to censor the news to eliminate negative publicity.
And right now, I think that's what the IOC's ultimate goal is.

Re:Nothing new

[supernova_hq]

If I recall correctly, Candian copyright law states that you can copyright a photo. However you cannot copyright an audio recording (though the speach/lyrics if written can be copyrighted). So I guess you'd be able to copyright the visual part of the video, but not the audio track (assuming no words/music was scripted, etc).

As for the video itself, it seems to have fallen off the face of the internet (or been well hidden). I don't think showing it for "gore factors" is appropriate, however I do feel that it is important to preserve this footage for educational purposes such as engineering, physics, etc. However since we obviously can't have it both ways, I support having the video available, assuming proper warning are put in place (shock sites would fall OUTSIDE this category!)

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

You are correct, but the losses are more about the economy than the games, or how they are presented. Advertisers are pulling back.

For example FOX Broadcast lost millions of dollars in 2009, however FX actually increased revenue (due to cable subscriptions). Likewise NBC is probably making money off their MSNBC, CNBC, and USA cable coverage, but losing money on their advertising-supported NBC and NBC Sports channels.

If the economy was still booming, and advertisers still buying, NBC would be as profitable this time as they were in Winter 2006.

Re:Nothing new

[ScrewMaster]

The International Olympic Committee has ordered a blogger to remove a video

I agree, but where did the IOC get the legal authority to order someone in another country to do anything whatsoever? You want me to take down my blog? Fine. Hire some local attorneys and take me to court in a proper venue.

Personally, I think the Olympics have lost whatever it was that once made them worth something, and they should simply be discontinued and that blood-sucking IOC disbanded. They're politicized, commercialized crap that dilutes and demeans the efforts of the remarkable athletes who we should be watching. The IOC makes me sick, and the cheapass TV networks in this country don't help.

Re:Nothing new

[danking]

Vancouver was supposed to do that with a portion of the village to go as low-cost housing but last I heard the new plan is to sell it as expensive condo's.

Re:Nothing new

[ChinggisK]

Of course I wasn't hoping for a pro-censorship argument. I guess what I was hoping for was agreement that the guy should take it down on his own and not be a jerk. It never should've been up in the first place, whether the IOC should or shouldn't order him to take it down is beside the point.

Re:Nothing new

[Sir_Lewk]

You cannot mandate morality. It is something that must be voluntary. This blogger could do the right thing and take down the video, but making him take down the video is not the right thing.

I don't care much about whether he keeps the video up or not, what I care about is other people trying to make him take it down.

Re:Nothing new

[pete6677]

You also watch Oprah, right?

Re:Nothing new

[evil_aar0n]

Lose a tire at 35? I've done that. Lost all - literally, not figuratively - of the skin on my chest. Still have scars from it, though it happened 30+ years ago. Skin makes a terrible brake pad. Keep the rubber side down, as they say. :-)

Re:Nothing new

[Sir_Lewk]

I am not making an argument about the morality of the blogger, only the ramifications of abusing the law to stop him.

Re:Nothing new

[pete6677]

The IOC is one of the most greedy organizations in the world. Profit is all they care about, not amateur athletics. How many of the members make huge salaries, and for doing what? The host city pays ALL the construction costs for the games. The sponsors and broadcasters pay ALL the cost of the games themselves. What does the IOC do other than take kickbacks from potential host cities? Keep the Olympics, disband the IOC and start over.

Re:Nothing new

[skine]

It if weren't for those meddling Americans...

Re:Nothing new

[LordKronos]

Oh god, not the "the poles shouldn't have been there" argument again. The guy was traveling at 90 MPH, for crying out loud. At that speed, his trajectory could have easily carried him 50 meters. If those poles weren't there he would have hit the whatever object was in the next 50 meters. And you are looking at a very specific case. The track wasn't designed with his specific accident in mind. If you want to say it was unsafe because he hit an object, then you better realize that at 90MPH, with the optimal launch angle an object can travel airborne for 250 meters before landing (and that's based on a flat surface...if it were launch from a higher portion of the track it could go even further). So do you want them to design a course with nothing to hit for 250 meters from any point on the course?

Face it...90MPH is just impossible to protect against worst case scenarios like this.

Re:Nothing new

[tomhudson]

Vancouver was supposed to do that with a portion of the village to go as low-cost housing but last I heard the new plan is to sell it as expensive condo's.

It's all up in the air again because the venue is bankrupt and goes on the auction block in a week.

WILMINGTON, Del. - Whistler Blackcomb won't go on the block in a foreclosure auction on Friday as scheduled, winning a one-week reprieve from creditors, a source with direct knowledge of the talks said on Thursday.

Creditors of Intrawest Holdings, which owns stakes in Whistler Blackcomb resort, the site of downhill events during the Vancouver Olympics, agreed to delay the auction from Friday until Feb. 26, two days before the end of the Olympics.

The agreement delays the auction until after the marquee men's combined downhill event at Whistler, which will feature American Bode Miller. That event is scheduled to end on Feb. 22.

Intrawest and its owner, U.S. private equity equity firm Fortress Investment Group LLC FIG.N, have been haggling with creditors over refinancing the $1.7 billion of debt Fortress took on in buying Intrawest in 2006.

Intrawest holdings also include Squaw Valley in California and Steamboat and Winter Park in Colorado, and it has sold off other resorts in recent months as it reorganizes its finances.

Olympic officials have dismissed talk of a foreclosure as nothing more than a minor distraction and they are not worried that Intrawest's financial situation will disrupt Olympic events at Whistler.

"For the athletes it would be a non-issue. It would be an esoteric business issue beyond anything they would think about (on the hill)," said Chris Rudge, secretary general of the Canadian Olympic Committee.

Vancouver Games Organizers say it was unlikely any of the parties involved in the financial discussion would try to disrupt the Olympics or the Paralympics in March, because that would only reduce Whistler's potential value.

Games organizers have an agreement to compensate Whistler for any business lost because of the Games, which utilize only a small portion of the resort. The amount of compensation has yet to be determined.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't remember CTV showing it at all. I got a message from my sister in the Athletes village where it was shown live on tv. I turned on the TVs at the office on to CTV, Sportsnet, TSN, CBC and Global maybe 10-15 minutes after it happened, and I never saw it on TV. I didn't see it until it shortly appeared on Youtube. If anything CTV and their family of channels really tried to ignore it, as they were trying to build up the Opening Ceremonies that night.
 
From what I have heard CTV did not release the footage to the other Canadian channel, where as NBC did release it in the USA.

Re:Nothing new

[Brian Gordon]

Nobody's posted the video link, so I'm top-posting.

This is the specific video he was ordered to take down.

Re:Nothing new

[Idiomatick]

Online coverage atleast the Canadian side of things works DVR style. They even have an instant replay button and labeling parts of the video with different notable events. With a nice 'go to live' button. The net neutrality shit SUCKS ie I can't view the American version or w/e but the setup isn't horrible. (Yeah I know, MS has bought the Olympics, embedding silverlight and bing search but w/e)

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

Yet another reason the IOC wants this video "silenced". They don't want people seeing it and asking inconvenient questions like, "Why wasn't there a wall between the track and the steel beams?" So they silence the criticism by removing the evidence.

Also if you've seen the SAFER barrier in NASCAR, then you know it is possible to create cushioning to *absorb* the energy, rather than do nothing and blame the driver.

Re:Nothing new

[skine]

I would most people watching the Olympics are interested in seeing the best athletes in the world competing against each other. Yes, back-stories can be interesting, but they don't need to be over-the-top 10 minute segments slathered in sappy music. There's usually enough downtime to simply mention "This athlete is inspired by his brother who has Down's Syndrome," similar to how they mentioned "This athlete has made a great comeback from breaking both of her ankles before the games in Salt Lake City." This only took a few seconds between runs, but gets the same point across.

Basically, it would be better if they simply mentioned athlete backgrounds, inserted some information on the scoring/background/etc of the sport without being condescending, and really focused on showing spectacular athletic achievement.

Re:Nothing new

[d34dluk3]

People shouldn't be watching videos of a tragic event like this.

I agreed with the rest of what you said, but please take your self-righteous opinions about what people "should" be watching and shove them up the bodily orifice of your choice.

Re:Nothing new

[Machtyn]

I like the human interest stories as well. But I don't want the sappy music and the long drawn out family history. I would like to know, in 2 minutes or less, where they are from, how old they are, any challenge they had to overcome, and their history in the sport. Heck, I only really care about their history in the sport and who their main rival is.

When I have to listen to 15-30 seconds of sappy music and intro speech before I even know who the "sports" caster is talking about, I've already moved on to another channel or walked away from the tv.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>If that blogger had given a damn about the moral high road, he wouldn't have posted the video in the first place

Here: http://www.fatalfailblog.com/

I'm not posting this because I'm a "ghoul" but because I think it's educational. When I first saw how twisted/dismantled these humans were, simply because of a car crash, it got me to thinking that I don't really need to drive 85 to get to work. 60-65 mph will still get me there in a decent amount of time, and if I impact anything, there will be about 50% less kinetic energy to rip apart my body.

Re:Nothing new

[tomhudson]

In that context, this usage of a DMCA takedown makes sense and is completely appropriate.

Sorry, but a DMCA takedown notice doesn't make sense. The site is Canadian (so no DMCA, lack of jurisdiction), and the use of the video conforms to Canadian copyright laws wrt news.

DMCA notices only affect 5% of the worlds' population.

Re:Nothing new

[compro01]

Also if you've seen the SAFER barrier in NASCAR, then you know it is possible to create cushioning to *absorb* the energy, rather than do nothing and blame the driver.

The barrier is only part of the whole system and would be nearly useless without the rest. You've also got a steel cage, crumple zones, multi-belt restraints, neck reinforcement, etc.

Once that guy left the track, no amount of barriers or cushioning would have helped at all.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Sorry, not totally true. I wanted to see the accident for myself in order to judge some of what the Olympic committee was saying vs what others were saying about the track. I felt that the wall could have been done better and that the track would have been better built with those damned support beams on the INSIDE of the turn. I also tracked down a Discovery special that talked a great deal about the preparations for the Winter games to include some very insightful interview about the construction of that track in particular. they discussed the extreme elevation drop, the expected high speeds, how they cooled the track to keep it iced, and how it was constructed mostly in a factory vs on the mountain. They were quite proud of the track! Viewing the video it was a little more obvious to me why they placed the support beams for the roof in the position they did and I think that turn was even shown from the inside of the turn outside of the venue, in hindsight I still think it was poorly designed. That they limited practice times was also a mistake IMO. A perfect run would have been no problem but little margin for error was left in that design and this was a mistake - not everyone is perfect 100% of the time obviously. Had I not gotten to see that video and better understand what was going on at the time of the accident I would simply have had to take the word of a bunch of talking heads and the Olympic Committee, frankly I preferred to make my own judgment. I didn't watch this for pleasure as you assert, I'm no ghoul, but I did want to better understand what occurred from an engineering perspective. Learning from the mistakes of others is never a bad thing....

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

I found this on the floor when you left </b>. Do you need it?

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>but in the video he doesn't even get his hands in front of his head

Since he hit the steel beam with the back of his head, and human arms don't bend backwards like that, the suggestion you offer would not be possible. The man was doomed, and even if he had superhuman reflexes, there's nothing he could have done to stop his head from slamming against that steel beam.

Of course you would have known this yourself, but since the IOC is censoring the video, there was no way to double-check it prior to posting, so all you had to go on was fuzzy memory. Pretty soon (2-3 years) we'll forget the death was caused by poor safety design (steel beams along track), and the IOC will have accomplished its goal to cover its ass. (Yes that's a slam against censorship.)

Re:Nothing new

[roju]

You claim that the audience doesn't want human interest stories, but I'm not sure I believe it. I'd like to see some A-B tests of coverage styles.

Re:Nothing new

[MichaelSmith]

Its only top posting if you turn off the threaded view.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

Good point.

A friend and coworker had dinner with us Friday evening..... and then died the next day while rock-climbing. According to WBAL news he was climbing without a rope. On one hand I couldn't believe the news ...... on the other hand, knowing that it had just rained that morning, I decided he was incredibly stupid to climb over slippery rocks.

It's one thing to enjoy a sport, but something else entirely to be dumb.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>Though based on the general negative raction the other lugers had to moving down the starting position...

Did you just make that up? I heard the lugers say the exact opposite ("This course is waaay too fast," and "Are they using us like test dummies? It's ridiculous."). Plus many, many of them crashed during training. It was only a matter of time until one of them died.

Re:Nothing new

[NeutronCowboy]

I'm a downhill skier myself. I'm well aware of the risks in skiing, and am amazed at the crashes that these athletes walk away from. However, there's a very specific reason why there are no trees on the course, and why there's netting all around. People crash, and these things are designed to minimize catastrophic injuries if something does go wrong. Finally, skiers have far more control over speed and direction than the lugers.

And yet, you won't find large metal beams around a corner of a downhill course - or anywhere that isn't protected by netting or foam.

Yes, Canadian lugers practiced without any deaths. But if you look at the track, what happened to the Georgian luger was a guaranteed event once the sled hit the inside edge. Just because no one else had died before doesn't mean that the track was designed in a fashion that minimized risks. Just shaving the inside of the track to make it impossible for the sled to just rid up and over would have drastically reduced the speed.

As for your examples of what else should be redesigned - again, there's a difference between designing something to be more dangerous than necessary and changing the sport. Raising the wall, putting padding on, cutting the inside corner - none of that would have reduced the speed or the difficulty of the course. All the other examples you provided change the sport. Understand the difference.

This isn't about "covering up" their "shame". It's about tastelessness. A news articl would have sufficed, and picture of the aftermath would have been plenty. but a video of someone hitting a pillar at 150KpH? It's certainly more attention grabbing, I'll give 'em that.

Really? The video is the only thing that demonstrates conclusively what happened. Everything else is hear say and assumption. I'm glad the video exists, because it allows me to cross-check claims and understand assertions.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

And then (according to some religious beliefs), you'd wake-up in hell. Boy church is a depressing place.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

Probably trial-and-error, using experience from previous tracks. The problem is that this track was about 10mph faster, and therefore needed higher walls, but the designers didn't provide them.

This is similar to how the Titanic and Britannic had rudders that were sized too small. They would have been fine for older ships, but these new ships were much larger, and designers forgot to account for the difference.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>And the skiing example? I reckon you didn't catch the womens' alpine downhill last week, where a huge portion of the skiiers whiped out
>>>

That's because the downhill skiing course isn't lined with steel beams that the athletes can hit and be turned into squash. If a skier did happen to die last week, it would be due to their own mistake, not because an engineer put a human-crushing steel beam in the way.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>If those poles weren't there he would have hit the whatever object was in the next 50 meters.

Yes. The soft cushioning of the human audience. In which case he would have survived, and then we'd be discussing how lucky he was and that nobody got hurt (other than minor injuries), instead of his funeral.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

In Canada we can join go to CTV's site and watch the footage from any event (from qualifying to finals) with a 1 minute delay.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

So a skiier making a mistake and getting killed by falling in a ditch or hitting a tree is entirely their fault, while a luger making a mistake and flying into a pillar is the track's fault?

Yeah, that's brilliant reasoning there.

You're going down a track at 150kph, there's very little margin for error, everyone knows this going in, they all go down anyway. They know it's fast, they know it's dangerous, they accept that. There's the age-old in-joke that people who do this sort of thing are born with a few loose screws (except people who do skeleton, they're just batshit insane).

Talk to anyone who does skeleton, you'll be in for a reality check.

Re:Nothing new

[wealthychef]

Wait? Why am I in hell? God hates a bad luge performance?

Re:Nothing new

[RealGrouchy]

Seriously. The day after the incident, photos of the crash were in all major papers. And now the IOC is essentially blaming the family's anguish on a blogger.

- RG>

Re:Nothing new

[emrwriter]

Except for the school, which is a public, gov't agency, and thus has no copyright powers. Anything produced by the school or its employees is automagically public domain.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Isn't the motivation to get a gold medal? Seems pretty obvious.

Unless there was a major story, I wouldn't want any special interest stories in the World Cup. Or the NBA Finals. Or during boxing matches. I just want to see the damn game/fight.

Re:Nothing new

[multisync]

I've found the vancouver2010.com website to be excellent, too. The schedule & results page is updated as the events happen, so you can follow along and see where everyone stands at a glance.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

It was designed as every other track. *Additional* barrier were put in place afterward. This accident may end up changing the required designs for all future course making these types of accidents less likely.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deaths_in_Sports

for list of deaths in sport. Take a look at bobsleigh.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazimierz_Kay-Skrzypeski
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lud%C4%9Bk_%C4%8Cajka

etc. etc. etc...

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

That's the point of the GP isn't it? That this image was offensive to you but you still recognize the importance of free speech. If anything offensive to anyone was just removed we'd have nothing.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Wow, he almost played the NBC chimes on those supports. How apropos.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

You're new here, aren't you?

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

People shouldn't be watching videos of a tragic event like this.

You only get to decide what you watch.

Re:Nothing new

[tkrotchko]

"There is no other reason"

That's simply not true. It's the difference between driving and racing. Even if they made all the cars out of nerf balls, and put foam padding around, the drivers competing against each other that makes it compelling to watch. Racing isn't really a contest to see who can drive fastest, it's a contest to see who can come in 1st place.

There's a rather large distinction between driving and competing. The essence of sport is a direct competition to see who's better. If you don't have that element, it's far less compelling. It's why people enjoy short track skating. It's not about who skates the fastest, it's about who has the will to win.

Re:Nothing new

[TheSHAD0W]

And this is the actual video file; shift-click to download.

Can you say, Streisand effect?

I knew you could...

Re:Nothing new

[sl149q]

The Athletes Village owned by and located in downtown Vancouver has nothing to do with Whistler Mountain...

And Whistler Mountain is a going concern... that is being sold be Intrawest who own it and many other places. Intrawest is going bankrupt because of bad investment decisions they made. Whistler Mountain will continue to make money for whoever buys it.

They probably delayed the auction (of Whistler) to after the games to optimize the value for the creditors (of Intrawest.)

It's also possible that Vanoc could have run a profitable set of games if the security costs had gone from the original couple of hundred million to the current (almost) billion... Which makes security about the highest value item in the entire Vanoc budget.

Re:Nothing new

[sl149q]

All one of them.... There is one engineering firm in the world doing them right now... And it is likely they have seen the video. It's not like sliding tracks are popping up in suburbs all over the world.

Re:Nothing new

[bitrex]

The Olympics generally attracts a larger share of female 18-49 viewers than most sporting events, therefore many advertisers produce advertisements that cater to that demographic. In turn, the network plays its part in the symbiotic relationship by showing Olympic programming that will attract as much of that demographic as possible. The Canada/US hockey coverage was preempted simply because prime-time ice dancing draws that demographic's eyeballs and prime-time ice hockey does not - I don't think there was anything "botched" in the way it was covered, at least from NBC's point of view.

Re:Nothing new

[sl149q]

And other lugers complained vehemently when the course was shortened (men using the womens start, women using the juniors start.)

It was an accident. And weird things can happen when you fall off things at those speeds.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

I've watched slow motion replays of JFK getting shot as part of my grade school education. Am I scarred for life?

Censors need to get off my lawn.

Re:Nothing new

[mdielmann]

I'm trying to imagine how one would make, say, ski jumping safer. Soft fluffy snow on the ground? Because I can see dozens of ways to get yourself killed flying through the air for a couple hundred meters at upwards of 100 km/h.
Or we could assume that at a certain level of the game, you'd better know what you're doing or you're going to get hurt.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

LOL as if you're any less dead if you hit a pillar at 140kph than if you hit it at 150kph?

Re:Nothing new

[Kymermosst]

Which is precisely why nobody should be surprised by this event.

He died doing what he wanted to be doing, it was his choice to put himself into that situation.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

If your relative died and news outlets wanted to cover the story, you would be FOR censoring them?

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

I like the human interest "crap".

Otherwise it would be just a bunch of strangers moving around on screen. At least this way we know the motivations behind the athletes. For example I would not have known that one Canadian skier was motivated by his brother's Down Syndrome to push even when he's in pain.

Maybe a Lifetime Olympian backstory channel may be in order.

Re:Nothing new

[sincewhen]

Blogger showing it was bad, IOC was even worse.

I don't think it was intentional, but that last sentence of yours makes an interesting statement.
Why was it OK for the IOC to release this footage, and allow the television networks to broadcast it, yet this blogger can't use it?
Viewed this way, the IOC had no respect for the deceased or his family, so why should the blogger be held to a higher standard?

Re:Nothing new

[sincewhen]

Yet, as I pointed out in a reply somewhere above, the IOC didn't stop the TV networks from showing it.

Re:Nothing new

[advocate_one]

It used to be that hosting olympic events was a money-maker for the cities involved. However recently data shows that towns that host Olympics are actually losing out. I don't agree with "special privileges" for anyone, but it's understandable to see how they can happen where there is a source of income for the state.

yes, the cities that host end up in hock for years afterwards, but, and this is a big but, the politicians in charge and their close buddies make out like gangbusters on all the contracts for work...

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Please write km/h, not "kph". kph is an american-invented abomination.

Re:Nothing new

[Inda]

No.

I was shown the Bradford City stadium fire on video last week. 56 people died on Saturday 11 May 1985. You could see burning dead people. You could see people burning who were about to die.

It was shown to me as part of a safety training excercise. Things like this should not be forgotten or hushed-up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradford_City_stadium_fire

Go and hunt for the video.

Re:Nothing new

[zmollusc]

What would help is distance. Have clear open space so the energy can be dissipated over a longer time.

Re:Nothing new

[MartinSchou]

You have to keep in mind that the Canadian lugers had been practicing on the course for two years prior to the games, without serious incident.

Perhaps, just perhaps, the fact that they had two years to practice on it, gave them plenty of time to run through the course a lot slower to build up knowledge of the track, compared to the non-Canadians who had one or two shots at figuring out just how to get through the course.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

the end of us all, the foundation of every major religion,

Except Christianity, which is based on the premise that the ends justify the means?

Or maybe I shouldn't be getting my theology from Slashdot ...

Re:Nothing new

[lena_10326]

When a plane crashes people die so given your argument we should never replay those types of videos as well. We should never replay Challenger videos. We should never replay race crash videos. We should never replay any war videos.

The video is newsworthy so transparency in reporting is called for. It is better to openly show these things instead of covering them up and denying the public knowledge of what occurred. Denying access to the information leads down the road toward enabling corporations and governments with the power to cover up their deadly mistakes.

Re:Nothing new

[hitmark]

fat cats patting each others on the back, news at 11...

Re:Nothing new

[imakemusic]

No, God hates people that go into metal bars - they're usually hell's angels...

Re:Nothing new

[geminidomino]

He's a Canadian citizen reporting on a Canadian sporting event, his domain is registered to a Charlottetown, CA address via a Canadian name register. So far he's got a good case to give the big FU to the IOC (which I wholly support).

You support the IOC, or giving the IOC a big FU?

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

Anonymous Coward wrote:

So a skiier making a mistake and getting killed by falling in a ditch or hitting a tree is entirely their fault, while a luger making a mistake and flying into a pillar is the track's fault?

Yeah, that's brilliant reasoning there.

STRAWMAN ARGUMENT (pisspoor debating tactic). I never said that. Please don't put words into my mouth that I did not say, Anonymous Coward. ----- What I said is that the designers of the ski course did not put-in steel beams, or leave in trees, or other killer objects, for the skiers to hit. The designers of the luge course should have been just as intelligent, but they were delinquent.

Re:Nothing new

[Skapare]

No course should have any greater opportunity for "death by mistake" than is already commonplace. THIS course was far more dangerous than typical. The IOC knew that and FAILED to act initially. Then tragedy! Then they finally acted to make some improvements. Then they tried to do a coverup.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>other lugers complained vehemently when the course was shortened

Source please. I did not hear any of them say that. I think you made it up.

Re:Nothing new

[geminidomino]

No, God hates people that go into metal bars - they're usually hell's angels...

Ok, just so you know, I actually *groaned* at that one.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>Once that guy left the track, no amount of barriers or cushioning would have helped at all.

I disagree. The wooden wall they put-up now, would have deflected him away from the steel beams, and back onto the track. He'd still probably have a broken arm or leg, but that's better than a crushed head.

And even if the wall was not there, putting the steel beams on the *inside* of the surve instead of the outside would have meant he'd never hit them. Instead he'd have skidded across the ground and into the nearby audience. Not a fun experience, but motorcyclists have survived 80mph crashes and the luger would have survived too.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>You also watch Oprah, right?

Sometimes. Got a problem with that? (cocks gun)

"no sir"

That's what I thought.

Re:Nothing new

[paeanblack]

TV networks pad the coverage out with cheap human interest crap

Then make the human interest crap part of the games.

Seriously. Make it an event. Stand all of these athletes up, have them tell their sappiest, most heartwrenching story, and give the best one a gold fucking medal. They are all trying to outdo each other anyway, so let's make this competition legit.

The medal-count weenies will love it too. The conspiracy-theorists get another judged sport to bitch about. The wannabes can sit at home telling everyone how they could do it better.

Everybody wins!

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>But I don't want the sappy music and the long drawn out family history

Well... ...you have to remember the Olympics largest demographic is female. (Yes I'm serious - check out the Nielsen Ratings.) So they don't really care about our minority male voice. NBC wants to please their largest audience, and the females like the sap.

Re:Nothing new

[commodore64_love]

>>>Except for the school, which is a public, gov't agency, and thus has no copyright powers.

The Oregon government and New York government (and probably others have well) have claimed copyright over their documents, and sent takedown notices to website owners who published them online.

So what I'm saying is - you're wrong. ;-)

Re:Nothing new

[imakemusic]

Glad to see I'm not losing my edge!

Re:Nothing new

[Five Bucks!]

USA didn't 'whip' Canada. Ryan Miller is just a very good goalie... 93% save percentage while Brodeur didn't do as hot with 82%.

We'll see in the finals.

Re:Nothing new

[DriedClexler]

It's the difference between hiring a hit man and hushing up a family suicide using threats from a hit man. Which is to say, no difference at all.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

But if they admit that the track design contributed to his death, they'd have to pay out tons of money they could otherwise pocket.

It's all about the revenue

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

The last host city that made a profit, that I'm aware of, is Atlanta (Anyone know about Sidney?). They did really well also, something like $10M. Profits have steeply declined in the current decade. I don't know if that's attributable to higher costs, like security, or poor management.

Re:Nothing new

[Lumpy]

It dont matter, I really hope this blogger has a lot of cash because this is a case that needs to be tested.

Copyright law says anything I film with MY camera is my property. I own copyright to it. If I am at a event and I film something it's mine NOT the event organizers.

This really needs to be tested, a LOT of photographers and videographers would love to have the scumbag tactics of many events trying to blanket claim copyright on everything within a geographic boundary.

The Olympics have been nothing but a greed fest for the past 30 years.

Re:Nothing new

[LordKronos]

Or we'd be discussing how 2 people died as 2 skulls cracked together at 90MPH, and how unsafe it was that the spectators were put at risk.

Re:Nothing new

[Lumpy]

And if the world of ATSC, they COULD have every NBC affiliate showing the main event in HD and the other 3 side-channels showing lesser events so you can switch between them.

but no, I get the shitty weather radar on one, a never ending run of crap on the other and the third simply shows the station ID all the time.

Re:Nothing new

[Magnus Pym]

And you believe all that?

All these backstories are carefully crafted PR creations, targeted for maximum emotional impact and consequent sponsorship dollars.

Magnus

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Thanks.

It's not particularly gruesome, as some overly-dramatic posters (who most likely haven't watched it) act like it is. That being said, it's a rather scary moment of realizing just how much energy there is behind a person moving down that track, how barely in control that energy is, and how quickly it can flip from in control to out of control. Scary, and a new reason to respect the athletes that learn to do it.

My condolences to the family and friends of the racer. It's good that the video gets out there so that the IOC can be reprimanded and shunned for their failure to adequately provide for the athletes' safety, and so that young racers planning to join the event can have a solid understanding of exactly what they're getting in to before they start.

Re:Nothing new

[gnapster]

Thank you! A link to the controversial blog post is the main reason why I clicked 'Read More...' from the front page. I don't understand why they didn't put in in the summary.

Re:Nothing new

[PopeRatzo]

I like the human interest "crap".

That's because you're a fag.

And not fag in the "gay" sense. Just fag in the "fag" sense.

Re:Nothing new

[PopeRatzo]

That wasn't your gun you were cocking, son, that was a blow dryer.

Now don't you have to run? I think Bravo is going to re-broadcast a Liza Minelli special. Shoo!

Re:Nothing new

[PopeRatzo]

Well... ...you have to remember the Olympics largest demographic is female.

So you assume that because females are watching that means they don't really want to see exciting sports, but would rather watch stories about how the downhill skier's mom has aspergers?

and the females like the sap.

Why you sexist prick... No wonder you have to pay for sex... with candy.

Re:Nothing new

[quacking duck]

Or we could assume that at a certain level of the game, you'd better know what you're doing or you're going to get hurt.

Granted people in the sport must accept the risks that come with hurtling yourself down an ice track at 140+ km/h, but several experienced lugers had expressed concerns about this particular track. These are people who know what they're doing, rookies don't get to go to the Olympics.

Re:Nothing new

[Malc]

We do have more than one channel showing Olympic content. Sometimes as many as four or five channels. I just discovered it when pressing the red button whilst watching BBC HD - there's a multi-sport option that shows about four other secondary video streams and allows you to pick which one to watch. It's pretty cool. Of course, you have to be in the UK and watching via Freesat (dunno about Freeview). The time zone isn't very sociable for these games :)

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

"But when the state is trying to "protect" something that is actually costing tax payer dollars, it's time to repeal laws (or repeal the damned state)."

You mean like stadiums?

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Footage of 9/11 jumpers, the Hindenburg crash, holocaust footage comes to mind. The idea that death is some enshrined taboo that everyone can agree on is laughable.

Re:Nothing new

[rwv]

look at how they botched the Canada/USA hockey coverage yesterday to show "ice dancing" or whatever instead

The hockey game was on MSNBC. This was a rare time when flipping back and forth from NBC to the sister channel during commercials worked well. Usually the only secondary option is CNBC which stands for Curling NBC, I think.

Re:Nothing new

[mcgrew]

Hello, Ms. Barbara Olympics!

Re:Nothing new

[dasunt]

More than likely they hope to bury it. It's not exactly a shining-star moment in the Olympics. I'm sure they'd prefer people forgot about it and moved on.

I've heard a theory that compared this crash to crashes in motorcycle racing: Due to the additional safety equipment motorcycle racers wear, as well as courses designed so they can slide or roll when they wipe out, motorcycle racers tend to survive crashes. While in the Olympic event, the course was poorly designed from the aspect of safety, and the support beam that the athlete hit shouldn't have been there.

Perhaps the Olympic committee doesn't want people questioning what they have done for safety of participating athletes.

Re:Nothing new

[hduff]

Content from the events cost $$$ so the TV networks pad the coverage out with cheap human interest crap and trolling. Its been this way for decades. We all hate it and it will never change given the current economic model for broadcast coverage of the Olympic Games.

Modified for clarity.

I feel your pain.

Our choices include:

Record the broadcast and fast-forward through the offensive coverage.

Attend the games and watch what you want.

Purchase the broadcast rights and broadcast only what you see fit.

Complain until the owners of the broadcast rights see it your way.

These are listed in order of increasing probability of not ever happening.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Honestly, your opinion is the one I expected to see here, and I have unfortunately not been disappointed.

This isn't about the content. This is about his right to post it.

And I, for one, am VERY sick of people who say things like "I'm in support of free speech, but..."

Either you're in favor of free speech, or you're in favor of censorship. One is the path to freedom, the other is the path to totalitarianism. There is no middle ground on this.

Re:Nothing new

[wealthychef]

There is a difference between a threat and an action.

Re:Nothing new

[mgessner]

It's the major reason I don't bother with the Olympics. I'll get the headlines later, at least until the IOC starts charging for them. Then I just won't give a damn.

Re:Nothing new

[tomhudson]

The real estate market in downtown Vancouver was bubbled up by the Olympics, and is now cratering. Just look at the abandoned projects. The bankruptcy of Intrawest just adds to the growing "gee, I guess overpriced real estate CAN go down" trend.

Canadian markets usually lag the US by several years. The housing bubble has already started to burst in Vancouver, as well as parts of other major cities. Case in point - my former landlord (I rented a house from him a few years ago) just got repossessed, and the bank is unable to unload the place despite a 30% mark-down. And I know someone else who just sent their keys to the bank last month.

Whistler "is a going concern." Going, going, GONE!

They probably delayed the auction (of Whistler) to after the games to optimize the value for the creditors (of Intrawest.)

Drink much kool-aid? They are in a much better position to squeeze the organizers for extra ca$h NOW by foreclosing immediately. However, they then also become legally entangled in things that happen on the property, such as athletes who get killed because of a defective track design. Otherwise, they would have already foreclosed.

Everyone knew the books were cooked on the games being profitable. It was not going to happen. It wasn't just security costs. The games are a bad joke. Get rid of them, or have BC expropriate Whistler and run the permanent International Annual Winter Games, and tell the IOC to go piss up a rope. Montreal did it with the International Jazz Fest, the International Comedy Festival, the International Fireworks Festival ... why can't Vancouver do it with the International Winter Games?

Really - the IOC is not a charity - they're in it for the bux. So why can't BC, after all the money spent on roads, etc?

Re:Nothing new

[SecurityGuy]

There's nothing to be not proud of. I saw it. Not because I wanted to, but because immediately after it happened, it was a lead story with video on cnn.com.

Re:Nothing new

[CraftyJack]

Miller faced 45 shots on goal, and Brodeur faced 22. That's an impressive performance out of Miller, and a disappointing one out of Brodeur.

Re:Nothing new

[swillden]

Salt Lake City managed to both make money (not a lot, but enough to maintain the Olympic facilities almost indefinitely with no taxpayer contribution) and avoid the stigma of excessive commercialization, so it can be done. It's hard, though.

Re:Nothing new

[swillden]

>>>Once that guy left the track, no amount of barriers or cushioning would have helped at all.

I disagree. The wooden wall they put-up now, would have...

...kept him on the track, so that the "once he left the track" case wouldn't happen, because once he left the track, no amount of cushioning would have helped at all.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

I used to eat aspergers but it gave me gas. Loved it with cheese though, that was the best.

Re:Nothing new

[fredjh]

I didn't say "no" human interest stories, I said "less."

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

So when the twin towers were destroyed... we shouldn't be watching that footage?

How about footage from the war in Afghanistan... lots of dead and dying people being shown in the news?

Haiti....?

Gets pretty gray all of a sudden doesn't it? Honestly, I don't like watching such footage myself, but I find the thought of censorship of such footage much more distasteful (and scary).

Re:Nothing new

[tangelogee]

...so he's a cigarette?

Re:Nothing new

[thePowerOfGrayskull]

My bad, I had assumed njnnetwork had a connection to njn.net --- which is actually why it surprised me to find ad content on the site, since njn.net is public radio... clearly I should've dug further, yet I still would have made a post expressing the same overall sentiment.

The DMCA does not apply, but the blogger didn't have the right to republish the material. I am not familiar with Canadian law, but I am assuming that there's a provision similar to that aspect of DMCA...

Re:Nothing new

[Actually, I do RTFA]

However recently data shows that towns that host Olympics are actually losing out.

Every Olympics since at least 1996, this fact has been rediscovered.

But when the state is trying to "protect" something that is actually costing tax payer dollars, it's time to repeal laws

The state has a valid reason to protect money-losers... police protection seems like an obvious example where the state loses money and I don't want every idiot to declare themselves sherriff. The question is, are both of those costs worth it. If the Olympics really did prevent even one war, as they claim to help prevent, it would be money well spent. But I'm not sure how I feel about such an intense level of athletic competition being underwritten by the government. Even more annoying are the subsidies given to professional sports in America.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Miller had a good game, as did many USA players. Pronger, Neids, Brodeur all shat the bed.

More excuses please. Boo fucking hoo mister floppyhead. It'll end up just like the WJCs and Crosby will go running home to cry to Mario.

Re:Nothing new

[Darksun]

They did botch the hockey game coverage...had Women's Curling in HD, Ice Dancing(blek) in HD, someone told me later it was on msnbc, which is not HD in my city...wtf?

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, because putting my fingers in my ears and saying "LA LA LA, DANGEROUS SPORTS ARE NOT DANGEROUS" is SURELY a heathier way to go about it.

Re:Nothing new

[tomhudson]

The DMCA does not apply, but the blogger didn't have the right to republish the material. I am not familiar with Canadian law, but I am assuming that there's a provision similar to that aspect of DMCA...

I'll assume that you haven't had your morning dose of caffeine yet :-)

Don't take my word for it - after all, who am I? Here's the actual text of the appropriate section of the Canadian Copyright Act, taken from the Justice Department website:

Exceptions
Fair Dealing

Research or private study
29. Fair dealing for the purpose of research or private study does not infringe copyright.
R.S., 1985, c. C-42, s. 29; R.S., 1985, c. 10 (4th Supp.), s. 7; 1994, c. 47, s. 61; 1997, c. 24, s. 18.

Criticism or review

29.1 Fair dealing for the purpose of criticism or review does not infringe copyright if the following are mentioned:
(a) the source; and
(b) if given in the source, the name of the
(i) author, in the case of a work,
(ii) performer, in the case of a performer's performance,
(iii) maker, in the case of a sound recording, or
(iv) broadcaster, in the case of a communication signal.
1997, c. 24, s. 18.

News reporting
29.2 Fair dealing for the purpose of news reporting does not infringe copyright if the following are mentioned:
(a) the source; and
(b) if given in the source, the name of the
(i) author, in the case of a work,
(ii) performer, in the case of a performer's performance,
(iii) maker, in the case of a sound recording, or
(iv) broadcaster, in the case of a communication signal.
1997, c. 24, s. 18.

I hope this clarifies things.

Articles on the site that deal with this are clearly news: http://www.njnnetwork.com/?p=33411, http://www.njnnetwork.com/?p=33242,

Also, the IOCs "reasons" are bogus: "One is to protect the IOC's exclusive rights and those of the official broadcasters. The other is the IOC feels it's disrespectful to the Kumaritashvili family."

The IOCs rights are protected solely by copyright - and while the copyright protection protects the entertainment value, it cannot be used to censor news, as the copyright law clearly allows the reporting, using 3rd-party copyright material, provided it is credited to the rights-holder. This is a public-interest issue, and the IOC is trying the "jailhouse copyright" that is so popular, and so mis-informed, in the US.

"jailhouse copyright": People (including crooked politicians, pedophiles, etc) think that they can "protect" or hide, their name by claiming copyright to their name and all information connected to it. It doesn't work that way, but it sure sounds good to someone sitting in the pokey looking for ways to keep their name out of the news. They send notices to the news media, and the news media publishes their name anyway, because copyright simply doesn't work that way.

Re:Nothing new

[Bigjeff5]

That's just because your cable company sucks, on my DVR I get a description with all the events in the block well before the events take place (of course it changes if an event is delayed).

Re:Nothing new

[Bigjeff5]

God, it's bad enough that we have all these non-olympic events like curling, figure skating, "ice dancing", and hocky (just to name a few), but now you want to add frickin commentator sports?

It's madness man, MADNESS!!

Re:Nothing new

[tomhudson]

Oops - forgot to mention the reason why the "disrespectful to the family" claim is also crocodile tears on the part of the IOC - but Letterman said it better. They blamed the guy. Then they changed both the course and the starting position. And they still blamed the guy. Someone should put the course back the way it was and strap these "spokespeople" to a luge and say "if you crash and get killed, is it your fault?"

The non-Canadian competitors were not given the same access to the run as the Canadian competitors. If everyone had had equal access, it's more likely that alarms would have been raised sooner, and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

The way the whole thing has been handled by the IOC is pretty disgusting. Then again, they're in it for the money.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

5-3? Yeah, you got whipped. You're a poorer loser than Crosby. At least no one has to shake your snot-covered hand. And good luck against Russia, most likely Canada's last game of these Olympics. Yeah, you're going to get whipped. Again.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

If only, if only, if only.

If only they cut down every tree on the hill and made it completely dead flat, people wouldn't be injured while skiing.

If only the Tour De France took place only on a large, flat, straight pad, there would be less crashes.

If only high diving were from 3 feet above the water, there would be no injuries.

If only during any racing-type event, they put a limit of 10km/h on all athletes and removed and banned anyone going faster, there wouldn't be any collisions or 'minor mistakes causing death'.

If only in football, people had to walk at 5km/h tops and wear 2 foot thick foam over their entire body, there wouldn't be any football injuries.

If only all of the mountains were sheared off to be a height of 20 feet above main ground level, people wouldn't die mountain climbing. They should take the top 90% of Mount Everest and dump it in the ocean!

Hint: SPORTS ARE DANGEROUS. I know it, they know it, everyone except those like yourself know it. News flash, accidents happen. Trying to ultra-safety everything is impossible. Some people do the sport FOR THE THRILL CREATED BY THE DANGER. They know the risks. Don't go pushing to safetyassify everything, because not being... y'know... DOING THE SPORT, you're only pushing to ruin it for everyone who does.

Note: Posting anonymously only because I'm at work. Username is Kabuthunk, for those thinking I'm too cowardly to stand behind my opinion.

Re:Nothing new

[Bigjeff5]

And neither ice dancing nor hockey belong in the olympics anyway, damnit.

What's next, olympic ice sculpture?

Re:Nothing new

[Bigjeff5]

What do you mean? The time zone is perfect, best Olympics ever! Well, except for the fact that the first week was a complete disaster, but the time zone is perfect at least!

Seriously, you Europeans only think about Europe, well we've got 860 million people within three hours time difference of these olympics, so you guys can just suck it.

(I'm teasing, of course, don't get your panties in a wad)

Re:Nothing new

[MozeeToby]

Because having more than one car on the road drastically changes the nature of the competition. No drafting, no passing, no jockeying for position... I don't even watch racing and I can tell you it would be a totally different event. Watch a rally race sometime (which would be a more accurate representation of only one car on the track at a time) and then watch NASCAR and ask yourself if you think the best NASCAR driver would also be the best rally driver and vice verse.

Re:Nothing new

[hodet]

Amazing how every winning athlete has bounced back from drug addiction or some other horrific accident or near death to overcome all and stand on the podium. Equally annoying to me are the commercials on CTV "yes I am Canadian". Can there not be one commercial without a majestic snow covered mountain in the background or somebody enjoying a bonfire out in the wilderness. Good grief, I like camping too but this is not all we do while chugging enormous quantities of beer.

Oh and lol at the Liza Minelli thing below. Well done.

Re:Nothing new

[smellsofbikes]

Yep, and the "Olympic Movement" is given special rights under US Laws

It used to be that hosting olympic events was a money-maker for the cities involved. However recently data shows that towns that host Olympics are actually losing out. I don't agree with "special privileges" for anyone, but it's understandable to see how they can happen where there is a source of income for the state. But when the state is trying to "protect" something that is actually costing tax payer dollars, it's time to repeal laws (or repeal the damned state).

FWIW, when Colorado won the competition to host the 1976 Winter Olympics and then turned it down we did so because of the cost. It became obvious that it was an enormous money-loser for the state and almost everyone in the state except for a very few people who stood to get rich, so we voted to tell the Olympics to go somewhere else. It's not clear to me that it's *ever* been a money-maker for the cities involved, just for the few rich people who stand to get richer yet.

Of course, it's the same thing with levying sales taxes to build a football stadium, which pours money into the pockets of the team owners, and we stupidly voted for that. Maybe the Olympics was enough more money that it crossed some sort of threshhold, or maybe football's just more popular here.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

And in the case of Dany Heatley from Team Canada...he rebounded for being a negligent fuck and killing someone. Oh who am I kidding? He doesn't give a shit.

Re:Nothing new

[blackraven14250]

You're likely in a different market, where the main NBC broadcast is being tagged by a different affiliate closer to your cable CO.

Re:Nothing new

[thePowerOfGrayskull]

Thanks for the references - and indeed, I still haven't had a chance to find my caffeine for the day. (My caffeine stream is dangerously close to allowing some blood in.)

I'm not concerned so much about the "disrespectful" aspect -- taking it off of the international evening news broadcasts covered that to a more-than-reasonable extent. But where I'm running into issue is the monetization of it - specifically, posting it to a site which would increase ad impressions.

Given that there was legitimate criticism being raised, and that overall it fit into usage exemption category you posted -- that doesn't seem to take into account the fact that a third party is going to profit from the increased number of hits and ad revenue as a result of posting content that they don't own the rights to. I don't dispute that they have the right to post it - but there's no provision in the law for when that line of "newsworthy" crosses into "revenue-driving".

From a moral perspective, I would say it depends on intent. His site had ads anyway, and he just posted controversial, news-worthy content with commentary. This could have been innocent, or it could been done with the foreknowledge that posting this specific content would drive up ad impressions.

Re:Nothing new

[Bigjeff5]

"This athlete is inspired by his brother who has Down's Syndrome,"

I'm sorry, I have to stick up for that guy and everybody else who has Cerebral Palsey.

First off, it's not Down's Syndrom, or anything like Down's Syndrom. The guy is not mentally handicapped at all. It affects muscular control, not cognative ability. The reason he talks funny and acts funny is because he cannot control his muscles properly. In case you're too stupid to understand the way the body works, muscles are what control arm movements, leg movements, head and neck, vocal chords, and anything else that moves. In other words, if you can't control your muscles, you are going to act and talk funny. The guy was not supposed to be able to walk at all, and yet he does, and even skiis when he can. His story, like the few others I've known who have Cerebral Palsey, is truly inspiring.

As for the rest of your comment, I couldn't agree more. Short blurbs for circumstances truly inspiring, sure, but spending 20 minutes on it is too much. For heaven's sake they even had a long Michael Phelps interview the other day! Why? Well he's a fan of the Olympics, of course! Dumbasses. NBC's coverage sucks, they cut out half of all the best sports in prime time, yet show curling non-stop on their lesser channels. WTF?

I've got issues with the IOC too, like allowing sports like curling, hockey, and figure skating - especially fucking ice dancing - into the Olympics in the first place. What the hell is Olympic about any of those? The Olympics is all about FEATS, feats of strength, feats of speed, feats of agility. Any team sport where you aren't acting as a single unit (a la bobsledding style) or any sport requiring style points is either broken or doesn't belong at all.

They can have their own championships, and I have great respect for the skill required (I actually find curling fascinating, been watching it a lot), but they are not Olympic and shouldn't be in the games.

That's my opinion anyway.

Re:Nothing new

[skine]

Sorry, I didn't see the segment, only relpied to GP.

Re:Nothing new

[Bigjeff5]

You've never actually followed a supreme court case, have you?

They are actually kind of famous for fucking over congress and presidents.

The nice thing about SC justices, is that though they may be nominated by presidents and approved by congress, once they are in they are in for life. They have absolutely zero political pressure from anybody, they can do whatever they like. This sounds dangerous, but given the legal background it takes to get to that level, these people usually care more about whether a law is legit or not (they can have differing philosophies about that) than whatever a particular group actually wants.

This leads to a lot of long standing laws being simply struck down, and the whole legal structure changes. They even reverse themselves when they are wrong, just look at the history of slavery in the US. One SCOTUS said it was perfectly constitutional, another said it was not. That second judgement stands until a slavery case is heard before the SCOTUS again. And that, of course, is the balance of the SCOTUS's awesome powers. They can only strike down a law in a case that has worked its way through the court system completely before landing before them. They don't get to just pick whatever issue they feel like, except to pick among the pool of cases that have made it to their level.

Re:Nothing new

[techno-vampire]

Had I not gotten to see that video and better understand what was going on at the time of the accident I would simply have had to take the word of a bunch of talking heads and the Olympic Committee, frankly I preferred to make my own judgment.

And if the video had stopped when he left the track, leaving out the impact, would it have made a difference? Wanting to know how the accident happened is one thng; wanting to see him killed, over and over, is what I'm referring to as "ghoulish."

Re:Nothing new

[techno-vampire]

Go and hunt for the video.

For you it was a training video. I'm not involved in any such program, so I don't feel the need to see it. I don't know why you think I want this hushed up or forgotten, I just don't think that showing the video over and over served any useful purpose.

Re:Nothing new

[tomhudson]

That's just it. Nobody "owns the exclusive rights" to news.

Almost all print, radio, tv and online media run ads. It's one of the flaws in the system - we really need to get away from both ad-based and subscriber-based models, and if that means also getting rid of 98% of the Internet, I don't see the problem. Google alone hosts millions of ad-spam pages through their domain-parking service that "helps monetize" those sites, but adds nothing to the discussion.

Personally, since all news is local to SOMEONE, I'm looking forward to the day when citizen journalism takes over. Remember - it doesn't take everyone doing it - just the top 1% f the population who have the skills.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

And maybe next we can put those marshmallows and pillows next to all the freeways and all the sidewalks and on the front of all cars and strollers and then we can make sure that there are no sharp objects that anybody can get hold of to maybe accidentally cut themselves. This post isn't insightful it's pathetic. If you want your children to think twice about doing anything dangerous then maybe education rather than voyeurism is in order. Personally I don't care if you show your fetus this footage but please don't try to sanitize the world from dangerous things simply because they are dangerous. It's a dangerous sport and there are construction details that we are perhaps not privy to that made it necessary to put that beam there.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

I grant you that. But having put it up the moral high ground moves slightly to a reason to remove it. Thank you.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

Not evil, just sick and twisted. I have a concern about death and a curiosity, but a fascination would be a little creepy thank you very much.

Re:Nothing new

[random coward]

Yeah; but Salt Lake City only managed that because their committee ended up being run by that "Rethuglican" Mitt Romney. Before he took over they were so far behind schedule it looked like they wouldn't even make it happen at all.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

There is a difference between reporting and exploiting. Repeated showing of something that you admit presents a morbid draw is mere exploitation it does not require that you present graphic aids to report this.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

And your feelings about this are irrelevant because you failed to post your name. Your feelings are irrelevant anyway as you have no decision making authority nor ability to punish these people beyond not giving them ratings.

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

And during my training for nuclear, biological and chemical warfare defense I was shown films as well. Perhaps that is the perfect venue. Not on a blog. Why should we who have no real reason to look at this morbid piece of goreporn bother to take your advice?

Re:Nothing new

[Hurricane78]

The IOC has taken an extreme protectionist stance on all its content for many years.

(Error in logic highlighted.)

1. The death of a person is certainly not ownable by anyone.
2. Ideas/information are by definition not ownable by anyone, since they are no physical objects and don’t adhere to the rules of meatspace.

The IOC is nothing else than a criminal bully, trying to push its own sick reality upon weak people who buy into it.

Re:Nothing new

[Hurricane78]

No, he can still move elsewhere. In fact he can move to my server if he pays the traffic. :)

Re:Nothing new

[swillden]

Not really. Romney took the credit, but he took over an organization that was already in very good shape. In any case, what does it matter who did it? The point is that it can be done.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Had I not already moderated multiple postings in this thread I WOULD have posted my name. However to do so would have undone my moderation and I didn't want that.

As to no authority - I don't need authority to punish in order to learn. If the only feelings that mattered were the folks who could take direct action then nothing would ever get done - the court of public opinion is a strong one as the school district that involved in the webcam case is finding out right now. If you're so clueless as to only pay attention to those things you can directly change then you obviously live a very restricted and shallow life. I mean really, why even pick up a newspaper or read a story on this web site? Can you directly change anything? Punish anyone? Your reasoning isn't sound...

Re:Nothing new

[scdeimos]

Given the tone of my response, especially the concluding statement, I would have thought it obvious. But for you... I wholly support a big FU to the IOC.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

The video I watched stopped moments before impact and was likely what was aired on NBC, I didn't visit this guy's web site to see what his particular video looked like having already seen the video before. Your assumption that I or anyone else watched his death "over and over" is specious. Simply because that was possible doesn't mean it was done or that any pleasure was taken in it. What little I saw of the impact made it pretty clear that placing support beams where they did on the outside of a turn was a poor design choice. Further back, protected better by even a plywood wall, or even a taller bit of ice with a lip less easily climbed might have saved this man's life. These guys take to the track nearly naked, the biggest safety measure is the track itself it seems.

I am sure a great deal of modeling is done when they create these tracks, I find it very hard to believe that such modeling wouldn't have shown that this kind of injury was very possible. I doubt that making a track 100% safe could be done but the way this man was thrown off after having made a mistake much further up the track ought to send a clear message to the designers that they could have done more - that much I firmly believe after having watched the video. Sadly it took a death before steps were taken, I cannot help but wonder if other portions of the track also lack this foresight...

Re:Nothing new

[techno-vampire]

The video I watched stopped moments before impact and was likely what was aired on NBC,

The video I had the misfortune to watch on NBC showed the impact. And, my argument wasn't that people did watch it over and over on the idiot's blog, but that he was making it possible.

Re:Nothing new

[geminidomino]

Cranky today?

Re:Nothing new

[sbeckstead]

The "Court of Public Opinion" Is a vigilante and needs to be clubbed into submission frequently.

Re:Nothing new

[bikk]

I cant wait for the olympics. Just the whole thing gets me pumped up for 2 weeks. www.hairsalonslexingtonkyspecialofers.com

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, let's just trust the "authorities" to handle it right? Sorry, I was brought up to question authority and to think for myself. Suit yourself, you won't change anyone's mind if that's the best you can come up with.

Re:Nothing new

[Anonymous Coward]

Guns make it possible to kill others but I'd still argue we should be able to own them. If you'd prefer please substitute kitchen knifes or screwdrivers for guns.

Just because something "bad" could possibly maybe be done because someone does or owns something doesn't mean it should be shut down or taken away. We'd all be living in segregated rubber cells if we followed that line of thinking to it's end.

Someone might have watched the video over and over. So what?

Think of the children?

Re:Nothing new

[Malc]

Seriously, you yanks only think about America. We've got about 1,700 million people within about three hours difference, so clearly you guys have your heads stuck up your arses.

(I'm teasing, of course, don't get your knickers in a twist)

Oh, I can make dumb posts too, so we do have something in common.

Re:Nothing new

[digitalunity]

While I agree with your sentiment, the IOC had contractual exclusivity to copyright for all video and audio images produced by cameras owned by licensees.

Now if someone was redistributing a video of the lugers unfortunate demise taken on a cell phone or other non-IOC related person, they wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

Respect the law.

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh good. I'm sure that now that they know the law, they will leave the blogger alone, out of respect for the law.

All images, of all things, in all places,

[Tiger4]

all the time, everywhere. We are the IOC.
We are the Voice of Control.
You will respect our Authoritay.

Re:All images, of all things, in all places,

[Opportunist]

Well, IOC, for all I care you can keep it.

Could you keep it far away so at least the TV channels ain't clogged with your crap and I could actually watch something interesting.

I want my Streisand effect NOW!

[sakdoctor]

Link to video please.

Re:I want my Streisand effect NOW!

[Anonymous Coward]

Link to video please.

IF ever there was a need for goatse site.

Re:I want my Streisand effect NOW!

[choongiri]

From the site in TFA:

http://www.njnvideo.com/njn/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/luge_accident2.flv

From another source:

http://s3.amazonaws.com/lazyjock/117509.flv

Re:I want my Streisand effect NOW!

[nemesisrocks]

From another source:

http://s3.amazonaws.com/lazyjock/117509.flv

Using Amazon S3 is pretty good way to ensure that when this gets modded +5, it's still available.

I'd hate to be the guy who's paying the bill on that bucket...

Re:I want my Streisand effect NOW!

[Anonymous Coward]

Just for a warning on that site, they redirect to fake virus warnings, but it still shows the video and some pictures.It's.... pretty sick. I think I could have gone without watching that.

Mirror please!

[Locke2005]

Queue "Streisand Effect" in 3... 2... 1...

Re:Mirror please!

[Locke2005]

Sorry... I've been writing software for 25 years, and my fingers pretty much automatically spell it "queue"... what's really sad is that somebody on slashdot has corrected me for this same exact mistake before! But hey... without spelling Nazis, how are we going to learn?

Re:Mirror please!

[adonoman]

No, he meant queue. We're all busy spreading the latest iPhone jailbreak exploit right now. They'll have to wait in line for their turn to be Streisanded like everyone else.

Re:Mirror please!

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe there are multiple videos lined up and waiting to be "Streisand Effect" ed.

Re:Mirror please!

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.njnvideo.com/njn/?p=995

Re:Mirror please!

[sakdoctor]

Spelling has been a remarkably unimportant part of my education.

I can just mash the keyboard, and either Google "Did you mean", or spelling nazis correct it.

Re:Mirror please!

[beakerMeep]

Queue the spelling Nazis?

Re:Mirror please!

[LordLucless]

The queues that you write in your software probably are spelled "queue": that is, a sequential list of items, generally typified by a first-in, first-out progression. Example: I queued for hours = I lined up for hours.

But cue, from the context you used it in, is a signal indicating that a particular action should be performed. Example: cue the lights = turn the lights on.

Homophones (words that sound the same but have different spellings/meanings) are one of the (many) banes of the English language. Homonyms (same spelling with different meaning) are even worse. For instance, "cue" could either have the definition above, or refer to a stick used to poke balls around a pool table.

Re:Mirror please!

[mysidia]

while ( 1 )
{
if ( (q=&streisand_effect_queue)->length == 0)
continue;
implement(q->head);
q->pop();
}

Re:Mirror please!

[mysidia]

Example usages: I waited all day in the bus cue, but 9:30 bus never came.

Whereas... Queue played by John de Lancie is a character in Star Trek, who appears in Star Trek: The Next Generation, the all-knowing, all-powerful Queue.

Also, Cue implementations are commonly based on insertion order as in first-in, first-out (FIFO) cues or last-in, first-out queues (LIFO cues are also known as stacks).

Re:Mirror please!

[mysidia]

Indeed... the video professor story of Dec 2, 2009 is still being processed, and Tiger woods is up next.

There's somewhat of a backlog. It's just that big corporations still stupidly believe they can suppress negative factual information easily if they just get enough lawyers involved....

Re:Mirror please!

[haruharaharu]

You don't spell it queue - that's a totally different thing. It's cue. Just because it's pronounced the same doesn't make it the same word.

Re:Mirror please!

[Anonymous Coward]

You talk faggy!

Re:Mirror please!

[Anonymous Coward]

From the spelling Jews? At least if the spelling Nazis weren't around, they'd have a chance to teach us.

Re:Mirror please!

[Anonymous Coward]

Whereas... Queue played by John de Lancie is a character in Star Trek, who appears in Star Trek: The Next Generation, the all-knowing, all-powerful Queue.

He was just Q not Queue.

Re:Mirror please!

[MiniMike]

Sorry... I've been writing software for 25 years,

Then shouldn't it have been:

Cue "Streissand Effect" in 2... 1... 0...

If wishing made it so...

[Anonymous Brave Guy]

I'm quite sure the IOC (and other major sports promoters) would like the copyright on every image taken, but I've never understood what their legal basis for making such a claim would be. Do they require that everyone attending sign an agreement assigning all rights in any recordings they make to the IOC, or something along those lines?

Re:If wishing made it so...

[LostCluster]

Do they require that everyone attending sign an agreement assigning all rights in any recordings they make to the IOC, or something along those lines?

Haven't read the back of a sports ticket lately? Every sports league claims copyright over their event, and the right to use your image while you're there. You'll find your Bluetooth not working because 2.4 GhZ unlicensed band devices are being jammed... and if you talk on the phone too long you'll find an usher making sure you're talking about something other than the game.

Looks like we've got the "1984" baseball season about to start...

Re:If wishing made it so...

[Lehk228]

deliberately causing interference is illegal even in an unlicensed spectrum.

The IOC is above THE LAW!

[ipquickly]

Madam Justice Lauri Ann Fenlon ruled that the women ski jumpers were indeed discriminated against by the International Olympic Committee's decision to keep them off the 2010 Olympic calendar, but added that the Switzerland-based IOC was beyond the reach of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

from CTV.

That's one reason I'm not watching them.

Re:The IOC is above THE LAW!

[Knara]

Well, you may (perhaps justifiably) object to their discriminatory stance, but they're hardly "above the law". You're essentially claiming that any court in any country should be able to have jurisdiction over any company in any other country. I'll pass on that one, thanks.

Re:The IOC is above THE LAW!

[BitterOak]

Madam Justice Lauri Ann Fenlon ruled that the women ski jumpers were indeed discriminated against by the International Olympic Committee's decision to keep them off the 2010 Olympic calendar, but added that the Switzerland-based IOC was beyond the reach of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

from CTV.

That's one reason I'm not watching them.

The problem is the want to use the law, specifically copyright law, to force the blogger to take down the video. That means the IOC would have to take the case to court, so this wouldn't be a case about the application of the law to the IOC, but rather to the blogger.

Re:The IOC is above THE LAW!

[mysidia]

They're doing business in Canada however.

Are you saying it's OK if a company sends bandits to burglarize your houses, enslave your women, and steal your children?

Can't do anything about it, they're based in switzerland, even though the games are being held in Canada, nanananana....

Re:The IOC is above THE LAW!

[Anonymous Coward]

Madam Justice Lauri Ann Fenlon ruled that the women ski jumpers were indeed discriminated against by the International Olympic Committee's decision to keep them off the 2010 Olympic calendar, but added that the Switzerland-based IOC was beyond the reach of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

from CTV.

That's one reason I'm not watching them.

Well that's a stupid fucking reason. They decided to keep them off the 2010 games because they're getting rid of the event, but the men's version is Grandfathered in so they can't dump it yet. That's not fucking discrimination. Discrimination is allowing the women to compete against other women, if you really want a 100% non-discriminating Olympics then suck it up and try going head-to-head with the men & see where that gets ya.

Re:The IOC is above THE LAW!

[Mashiki]

Let me just say good luck for the IOC on that. He's in Canada, his use according to our laws is acceptable. They can suck on frozen ice for people care. CA>CL>SL that's it, if they want to fight it they can move their headquarters here. Even then they're paddling shit up a creek.

Malware warning. Do not follow.

[Adrian Lopez]

The linked website is a source of malware. Do not follow the above link.

Re:Malware warning. Do not follow.

[Anonymous Coward]

Simba laughs in the face of danger. Now you can too!

Google Chrome on Ubuntu. The most secure browser on earth with the power of Linux, for human beings. ..and lions in Africa.

As if you couldn't tell from the name.

Re:Malware warning. Do not follow.

[CreamyG31337]

Like what? I don't believe you. CTV is reputable enough.

Mod down

[sakdoctor]

Warning GNAA link.

Locality blocks...

[LostCluster]

If this guy wanted to use the Canadian law exemption, he should have also put in a block (which is available to the big guys like the NBC and MLB) that made sure his stream was only available in Canada. He'd have no liability there, but he's breaking copyright law in the USA because he's not NBC, and every other territory where there's an official broadcaster. Remember, if you're positing on the web and not targeting a specific part of the world, you better be ready to comply with laws all over the world.

Re:Locality blocks...

[Yvan256]

Remember, if you're positing on the web and not targeting a specific part of the world, you better be ready to comply with laws all over the world.

If you comply with laws from all over the world then you can't post anything online.

Re:Locality blocks...

[sakdoctor]

Remember, if you're a copyright holder, you'd better be prepared to suck it down. The internet is a global network, and the law varies all over the world.

Fixed it for you.

Re:Locality blocks...

[Dunbal]

If this guy wanted to use the Canadian law exemption, he should have also put in a block (which is available to the big guys like the NBC and MLB) that made sure his stream was only available in Canada. He'd have no liability there, but he's breaking copyright law in the USA

      I'm sorry to hear that your map only contains Canada and the USA, however I must point out that there are quite a few more countries in the world and the draconian US copyright laws don't apply in them.

Re:Locality blocks...

[Opportunist]

The difference is that the internet is not a broadcasting medium. It's not up to the sender to push his message to the receiver. It's the receiver who has to actively request the information. The difference is the same as with physical goods. If I send merchandize to a country where I may not send it to, I'm breaking the law, even if said goods are legal in my country. Contrary, if you come to my country, take the goods and transport it at your request to your country where these goods are illegal, you're breaking the law. Basically a sign telling people "you're in violation of international copyright if you view this from any location but X" should suffice.

Yes, I'm aware that often the law does not follow this logic. Not because it made sense in some sort of way, only because it's easier to deal with one sender instead of thousands of recepients.

Re:Locality blocks...

[Anonymous Coward]

...yet.

Re:Locality blocks...

[GasparGMSwordsman]

If this guy wanted to use the Canadian law exemption, he should have also put in a block (which is available to the big guys like the NBC and MLB) that made sure his stream was only available in Canada. He'd have no liability there, but he's breaking copyright law in the USA because he's not NBC, and every other territory where there's an official broadcaster. Remember, if you're positing on the web and not targeting a specific part of the world, you better be ready to comply with laws all over the world.

Under your logic, you could be tried and punished for any speech offensive to other countries, say Iran or North Korea. You better hurry and make sure everything you have ever posted online is blocked from everywhere that it might be illegal!

Re:Locality blocks...

[fishthegeek]

Being Canadian he is under no obligation to enforce or even care about the laws in the U.S. or OZ for that matter. While I find it a little distasteful it's his right and if the blogger wants to put it up there then more power to him.

Re:Locality blocks...

[LostCluster]

Just being an American is cause to be arrested in Iran or North Korea... they'll gladly trump up some spy charges for you.

Re:Locality blocks...

[Anonymous Coward]

As opposed to the US where they just chuck you in Gitmo if they dont like you and dont charge you at all eh?

Re:Locality blocks...

[Anonymous Coward]

he's breaking copyright law in the USA because he's not NBC

In the US he would have a constitutional fair use right to post the video as a critical and relevant part of a news report.

Re:Locality blocks...

[shutdown -p now]

Remember, if you're positing on the web and not targeting a specific part of the world, you better be ready to comply with laws all over the world.

I presume you're making sure that you comply with blasphemy laws of both Iran and Saudi Arabia when you compose your /. posts?

The guy lives in Canada. Whatever U.S. thinks about it, he shouldn't care less about it, and has all rights to tell anyone from across the border to GTFO - unless he wants to visit U.S. in the future.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Canadian Copyright Law

[arthurpaliden]

Isn't it just great.

Not only do we get to make copies of our own stuff, even if it means bypassing DRM, but we get fair use too.

Re:Canadian Copyright Law

[twidarkling]

Fair Dealing, not Fair Use. Different concepts, different results. You'd not believe the people who push for fair use to be adopted in Canada.

You know who? Lobby groups funded by the US copyright holders. That tells me about everything I need to know about adopting Fair Use in Canada.

Re:Canadian Copyright Law

[Anonymous Coward]

for now...

it's == copyright's

[Adrian Lopez]

I meant to say "it's a shame how far we've strayed from copyright's original purpose."

Re:it's == copyright's

[sodul]

"it's a shame how far we've strayed from IOC's original purpose."

works too sadly

Important point

[rueger]

The IOC is above Canadian law. They are allowed to ignore Canadian human rights laws, can force venues to rescind non-smoking regulations, and are able to take over lands, streets and buildings at will.

Anyone who has worked within the VANOC orbit knows that VANOC and the IOC believe that all others must bow down before them.

Re:Important point

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh come on, don't bring VANOC into this, let them have their fun - they will all be out of jobs in a week.

Re:Important point

[PFAK]

Pretty much, I've been documenting on and off for the past while the various (negative) things that have been happening with the games. It's a shame really.

My (somewhat) compiled list is available at http://peterkieser.com/vancouver-2010/

Re:Important point

[Anonymous Coward]

The Olympics are above the law, thanks to their well publicized over the years taking and giving of brown envelopes, don't pretend that's now stopped. Let's look at what they plan for the next summer Olympics in 2012.....

Londoner's that NEVER wanted the event and are being forced to pay for it in massive increases in local taxes, are being told they cannot protest against the Olympics or they will be arrested, and can have their home raided by the police. Is that the ancient Greek ideal of sport?

The Olympics is nothing but an orgy of corruption. Even the athletes happy to steal from taxpayers so they can have multi-billion cost venues that nobody will use after four weeks.

Thanks to a friend who pointed me to this video clip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNzNN7jkGB4

Here is the link!

[Anonymous Coward]

Luger Dies

my 2 cents

[Nyder]

Um, they don't seem to make those tracks safe at all if someone crashes.

Hopefully it's a matter of taste

[nickrout]

If many sites have taken the video down I hope that is a matter of good taste rather than bullying by the IOC. What public interest is there in seeing someone die a painful death? We must remember that just because members of the public are interested, that doesn't make release or dissemination "in the public interest".

Re:Hopefully it's a matter of taste

[Areyoukiddingme]

It's in the interest of Olympic athletes to keep it online so everyone can see that the track was badly designed. They built one of the fastest luge tracks ever and just assumed that nobody would ever jump the wall. They were tragically wrong, and it was avoidable. Wrapping the steel pole he collided with in foam would probably have been sufficient to save his life, though he wouldn't have escaped without injury. Installing a higher section of non-iced wall, possibly made of clear plastic, would have prevented him from colliding with the pole at all. He might have been able to finish the track, and his time would have been abysmal for making the mistake he made that took him off the ice, but at least he would have lived.

But you don't have to take my word for it, because the video is online and you can watch what happens and judge for yourself.

Alternatively, if you don't care what happens to Olympic athletes, the video is online, so you don't have to see it if you don't specifically follow a link.

Re:Hopefully it's a matter of taste

[drinkypoo]

What public interest is there in seeing someone die a painful death?

To determine if the IOC was lying when they said the death was entirely the luger's fault. And in fact, they were; they did nothing whatsoever to protect an athlete who made an error in that spot. They apparently wrapped those poles with pads (among making several other changes) immediately after the accident occurred... well, also after they claimed that it wasn't their fault. The action and the statement are at odds, and this video proves why. It is very much in the public's interest to find out what kind of criminals their government has been consorting with.

Re:Hopefully it's a matter of taste

[Anonymous Coward]

I have to disagree with foam on the pole. I don't think any covering on it could have saved his life, lugers are moving incredibly fast.

Obviously building a better wall would have helped, though.

Re:Hopefully it's a matter of taste

[selven]

With the video being out there, it helps prevent the IOC from creating their own BS story about how the accident was the athlete's fault since we have some evidence to work with.

An anonymous reader writes??

[The nickname 'Ryan']

An anonymous reader writes "The International Olympic Committee has ordered a blogger to remove a video from his website showing the death of Georgian luger Nodar Kumaritashvili. The IOC asserts that it owns all the rights to all images taken at the games, and only licensed broadcasters can use them. However, the blogger, Stephen Pate, points to a Canadian law that allows copyrighted images to be used in newsworthy cases." ???An anonymous reader writes??? ???An anonymous writer writes???

Time-sensitive value.

[geekmux]

The IOC has taken an extreme protectionist stance on all its content for many years. It doesn't matter if it's fair use or not, the IOC will object on principle.

The Olympics are big money.

Ah, correction. The Olympics are big money at the relevant time, which pretty much means live broadcast, or about a week after.

After that, you can pretty much find all those copyrighted high-dollar value images and video for rent at your local library.

And to be honest, the IOC should start realizing that they could use all the publicity they can get these days. Night after night of figure skating doesn't bode well for the younger generation with an attention span of about 37 seconds.

Its wrong to have pillars that close to the track.

[jobst]

It is wrong to have pillars that close to the track and Stephen Plate shows this to the rest of the world.
Period!
No discussion!
It is absolute stupid the way the track was designed and that is the flaw. The guy would not have died if its was not for the pillars.
You could compare that to have trees around a racing circuit directly beside the track and no run off area ...
Bugger off IOC and let the rest of the world see what is wrong so it can be prevented next time.

I'd like to ask you

[ElusiveJoe]

People shouldn't be watching videos of a tragic event like this.

Who are you, and why are you deciding what should I watch?

Re:I'd like to ask you

[interkin3tic]

Who are you, and why are you deciding what should I watch?

I'm not the IOC, nor am I trying to prevent you from watching it, so calm down, don't get your tinfoil undies in a knot. I'm just saying it's pretty tasteless to gawk at a tragedy like that. I'm also not trying to claim a moral superiority here. I was tempted to watch it myself, and I have seen other videos that were similarly tasteless. So go ahead, you'd be no worse than I am, but I do think it is tasteless, just my opinion.

Re:I'd like to ask you

[Anonymous Coward]

You were trying to impose your sense of taste upon others, merely by how you framed your argument, even if it wasn't your actual intention to do so.

In the earlier post you said "People shouldn't be watching videos of a tragic event like this." which is annoying to some since it imposes your view of things upon everyone else (the "People".)

Then, in the above post, you said "I do think it is tasteless, just my opinion." which is totally reasonable to most since it merely reflects your own opinion and expresses no intent of pushing said opinion upon anyone else.

Do you see the difference?

You are of course free to express yourself in any way you like, within the bounds of the law (where you live), and this post of mine is not an attempt to impose my view of things on you, which would have been quite contradictory. I simply think that you might get more acceptance if you put forth your message slightly differently, is all. Feel free to ignore me! :-)

Re:I'd like to ask you

[interkin3tic]

Do you see the difference?

Yes: phrasing. One was an offhand statement of opinion phrased in such a way that it could be taken as a call for censorship

I'd argue that we probably shouldn't assume someone, especially on slashdot, is advocating censorship if the statement could be taken another way and such a statement would be a complete tangent, unless that person is an elected official. For the record, I'm not.

IOC CYA

[coaxial]

The IOC hours after the deadly crash immediately said (before an legitimate investigation could even begin, let alone finish) that it was the luger's fault, and that there was nothing wrong with the course, even though there were numerous complaints about the course prior to the crash. So even though the IOC said there was nothing wrong with the course, and that it was luger-error, they immediately wrapped the posts with pads, built taller walls throughout the the course, and then started the lugers lower down on the course, in order to slow them down.

I'm sorry, but you don't get to say, "The course is fine," and then also get to change it immediately after a crash.

I love to watch the Olympic athletes compete, but the IOC has been a bunch of corrupt bastards for decades.

Re:IOC CYA

[Anonymous Coward]

I love to watch the Olympic athletes compete, but the IOC has been a bunch of corrupt bastards for decades.

I just can't watch the Olympics anymore. The constant stream of awful actions by the IOC just ruin the whole experience. I even imagine I can hear the contempt in the announcers' voices.

Re:IOC CYA

[pavon]

I'm sorry, but you don't get to say, "The course is fine," and then also get to change it immediately after a crash.

This isn't exactly the same, but we've been getting this line at work and frankly I think it is bunk. Anytime we make an improvement to our process or design, the customer's Quality Assurance folks come and act as though that proves that we were doing things poorly to begin with, and that all our prior product needs to be recertified, even though our testing and performance already exceeds customer requirements. The thing is that nothing is ever perfect. There is always room for improvement, and just because something does improve doesn't mean that it was inadequate to begin with. On the otherhand sometimes the customer has come with complaints, and we have made improvements to mollify them, even though we thought the changes were completely unnecessary. That doesn't mean that they were right, it just means that we don't get to base all our decisions on technical reasons.

The fact that someone died, and the fact that many people have already noticed that this track is not as safe as others, is good evidence that the track wasn't adequate. But the fact that they chose to improve it for whatever reason is not.

Re:IOC CYA

[Anonymous Coward]

"It's fine" and "we better do something so the bleaters shut the fuck up" aren't mutually exclusive.

Re:IOC CYA

[LordKronos]

It's the Olympic version of "security theater" that we get at the airport. It doesn't accomplish anything but shut up the people who are saying "aren't you going to do something about it?"

Wrapping the posts in padding? That better be some good fucking padding if it's going to save a guy traveling 90MPH colliding with a solid object. I mean, come on....automobiles have airbags and a 4+ foot crumple zone at the front to decelerate the occupants, but even then they're pretty damn fatal in a 90MPH collision.

streisand's log, stardate...

[drinkypoo]

While we're at it, could we please have a round-up of the olympics screw-ups to date? It's hard to find such a thing between the official coverage and the unofficial coverage of the allegedly greatest olympics screw-ups of all time. It might be "too soon" to include this luge track fail (uncovered steel poles? they don't even allow those in NASCAR, where you get a crash cage and a magical carbon fiber bumper!) in those lists, but I think it qualifies. What else goes on this year's list?

maybe legal but...

[nadaou]

It is arguably legal spread to this video / snuff films, but it is in truly terrible taste. My guess is that the IOC is more concerned with protecting the traumatized family and friends of the victim, and due to the disproportionate way laws are structured copyright is the best legal tool they have to throw at it. That is not to say that they are not total jerks and hyper-protective of their monopoly on Olympic images, but in this case you must give the benefit of the doubt that copyright is of secondary concern to stopping genuine cruelty.

"just because you can, doesn't mean you should"
(aka "grow up")

Re:maybe legal but...

[martas]

you must be blind to think that they give a rat's ass about the family here. they just don't want the olympics to get associated with imagery like that. it's PR, plain and simple.

Re:maybe legal but...

[Low Ranked Craig]

My guess is that the IOC is bring the typical copyright nazis they always are, and that their behavior over the past 20 years does not earn them the benefit of the doubt, or anything else for that matter. The Olympics no longer holds any interest for me, it's just another professional sporting event where the players with the most money typically win, and the cities that pay off the IOC members get rewarded. Thank Dog I have another 150 channels that aren't NBC...

Re:maybe legal but...

[Falconhell]

I just dont buy the protect the family thing.

There is nothing forcing them to find and watch this video. If the IOC had shut the fuck up,
the family would have been unlikely to even know this site existed.

Re:maybe legal but...

[spire3661]

Get over your yourself. We all grew from his tragedy, there is nothing wrong with seeing it. If you dont like, TURN AWAY. The internet is not a broadcaster, you have to CHOOSE to see stuff.

Re:maybe legal but...

[realsilly]

I bet you watched the video of the woman in Iran who was shot during the protests? Did you see it on YouTube, or watch it on the News? Did you ever see a holocaust documentary? Those are all about innocent people dying? I bet you didn't even take the time to read the blog. You probably have no freaking clue if it pays homage or not. Yet you feel morally justified to tell everyone else to grow up? Pot meet kettle...

Classic response...

[orsty3001]

Make me!

It has nothing to do with that

[dreamchaser]

It's got nothing to do with that and everything to do with the IOC immediately declaring after the accident that it was the luger's fault because they are afraid of a lawsuit.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

and in other news..

[Anonymous Coward]

with equal probability of happening, blogger orders IOC to suck a fat one.

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[Obfuscant]

It is wrong to have pillars that close to the track and Stephen Plate shows this to the rest of the world. Period! No discussion!

And yet, here we are discussing it. I think it is fine for pillars to be that close, on a track for a sport that is participated in voluntarily and with full knowledge that those pillars are there. All it would have taken is for the lugers to say "we aren't going down that course with those pillars there", if it were so clear that the pillars shouldn't have been there.

It is absolute stupid the way the track was designed and that is the flaw. The guy would not have died if its was not for the pillars.

The guy would not have died if he didn't get on a tiny little sled and push himself down the start of an icy half-tube where the only exit other than the far end was off the side and into hard metal objects.

Lugers can still die if they take a wall too high and capsize, smashing their heads into the solid ice track.

If you want to remove all means of death in the sport of luge, you might as well not luge at all. In fact, you won't be luging. You'll have to have a solid tube filled with soft water (instead of the open ice-caked half-tube). That's the "thrill ride" at a water park. How exciting. And someone could still drown if they aren't careful.

You could compare that to have trees around a racing circuit directly beside the track and no run off area ...

How about solid concrete walls at most car race tracks?

Bugger off IOC and let the rest of the world see what is wrong so it can be prevented next time.

Next on NBC, the 2046 winter olympics. At 8PM, the US and Canada face off for the snowball fights, followed by the mackeral slapping contest between Great Britain and France. At 11PM, Greece and Latvia compete in 'walk around the block', and then Bolivia and Japan face off in a rematch of the famous 2042 "fill the slurpee cup as full as you can without spilling" contest. Stay tuned...

my response to IOC

[eagl]

I plan on copyrighting reporting on the sun, pointing a camera at it, and then charging anyone who ventures outdoors during daylight hours for the privledge of "reporting" on the sun.

I might go so far as to claim exclusive rights on distribution of the entire visible light spectrum, just to cover all my bases.

As for the original post, I thought most countries had verbage in their copyright laws that allowed anyone to report "news", no matter where it happened to occur. Maybe I should start up a disaster relief company and claim exclusive rights to report on anyone who dies while my company is responding to the disaster?

Re:my response to IOC

[hyades1]

It isn't "news" anymore when it is no longer current or of significant informative value. I suspect if this guy persists, he'll find out the hard way about the difference between displaying an image for the amusement of perverts and displaying the same image because it does, in fact, have real news value.

Re:my response to IOC

[Anonymous Coward]

Why do stupid arguments like this come up every time copyright is mentioned around here? It's fucking stupid and it has no logical place here. It sounds like something a 4 year old would say.

Re:my response to IOC

[Obfuscant]

I plan on copyrighting reporting on the sun, pointing a camera at it, and then charging anyone who ventures outdoors during daylight hours for the privledge of "reporting" on the sun.

This assumes that the sun would not exist were it not for you, so that you could actually copyright the sun and all audio-visual representations thereof.

I guess I'll know for sure tomorrow, because it's night time here now. If the sun doesn't come up tomorrow, I'll know I violated the DRM you put on it...

The fact that the sun came up three weeks ago isn't news anymore, just like the fact that someone rammed themselves into a pole on the luge course two weeks ago isn't. The "news" value of the video is gone; it is solely the gruesome nature that remains as a draw.

Re:my response to IOC

[TubeSteak]

The "news" value of the video is gone; it is solely the gruesome nature that remains as a draw.

Lol wut?
The mere fact that we're discussing this shows that the "news" value of the video is not gone.

I'd even go out on a limb and assert that, in general, the newsworthiness of something doesn't decay over time. In this case, not only will people be talking about the crash for years, it's going to get brought up during the next Winter Olympics and the one after that, etc.

Re:my response to IOC

[MartinSchou]

The fact that the sun came up three weeks ago isn't news anymore, just like the fact that someone rammed themselves into a pole on the luge course two weeks ago isn't. The "news" value of the video is gone; it is solely the gruesome nature that remains as a draw.

Excellent. We can now burn all copies of the moon landings, the JFK assassination, Ronald Regan being shot, the Berlin Wall being torn down, the Tiananmen Square protests, the Tehran protests, the September 11th attacks, the July 7th bombings ...

None of them are news any more.

I think I will puke.

[Daevad]

The notion that the IOC owns the copyright to all images from the games is just plain wrong. Every video and every photo taken by every visitor to the games? I feel like power puking all over the faces of the IOC board.

And if the games cannot be made financially viable without all the network TV money, super copyright and bizarre broadcasting, then maybe they shouldn't be held at all. I for one would not miss them one bit.

Re:I think I will puke.

[LeadSongDog]

Every video and every photo taken by every visitor to the games?

Sadly, I don't even have to read the back of a ticket to know there's a condition of sale there.~~~~

Re:IANAL, but...

[martas]

you're taking the bar tomorrow, and you're posting comments on slashdot? what the hell is wrong with you?

I'd better go now, I have a midterm tomorrow.

Re:IANAL, but...

[Obfuscant]

These complaints, on the other hand, are probative and possibly admissible to show that the IOC had notice, among other things.

The real question is, how many lugers said "I will not go down that course because it is unsafe?"

As far as I know, all the people who participate in luge are adults, able to reason for themselves, not mentally incompetent in the eyes of the court, and willing to participate in a sport where people have been killed because they made simple mistakes.

I also know that every one of the lugers had the opportunity to see the track in full and make practice slow-speed runs to determine for themselves the risks, and then decide if the risks were worth the returns. Not only the actual participants, but their coaches as well.

The fact that not a single one of them refused to participate would seem to be admissible to show that the risks were considered, by the presumed premiere experts in the field, to be acceptable and therefore reasonable.

Yes, of course, it's sad someone died. Blaming the people who let him make his own decision to participate is wrong.

I guess respect for the dead doesn't count as much

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm going to take a neutral stance and neither agree or disagree with what the IOC did.

However, IMO, the blogger I think should be ashamed of himself- this video should be buried and forgotten. Not because of IOC coverups. Not because the IOC says one thing and the video another. That's not for us to decide- that's what the legal system can assess. But because it's simple humane respect for the dead.

Someone died on that track. Yes, Died. And yet the one thing everyone seems to want to do, is to save and replay the last few (and worst) moments of the poor guy's life over, and over again, without a single thought on how others, particularly is family and friends, might think about it.

Remember the accident. Investigate how it happened. Scorn the IOC, if you think they didn't take the appropriate safety steps. but for god's sake- leave the poor guy alone.

The video

[tomhudson]

And the Canadians got LOTS of practice runs while the course was closed to the rest of the world. Not fair at all, and the lack of adequate practice time on a course that others have said is "stupid fast" was definitely a contributing factor to the death.

http://www.njnnetwork.com/?p=33411Here's the site (and the video) in question. Don't just watch it - listen to it! You can HEAR him bouncing off the metal columns.

http://www.njnnetwork.com/?p=33242Letterman had it right.

They do this but stand by while usa & can nbc

[Joe The Dragon]

They do this but stand by while usa vs can nbc joke go on why was that on MSNBC THAT FEW get in HD while THEY Could on put it on USA HD, CNBC HD or NBC HD?

Direct tv does not have MSNBC HD, Comcast Chicago city of and Chicago land does not have it, rcn Chicago does not have it, wow cable does not have. IF you wanted it ad fee then put it on USA HD as that is like 100% HD on all systems.

Re:I guess respect for the dead doesn't count as m

[Anonymous Coward]

Right, because afterall, those who don't remember the past are not going to repeat it. Buried, forgotten and we go on our merry way, everything's fine here folks, nothing to see here. Please move on.

You're not making a coherent argument

[Anonymous Coward]

What's the non-emotional reason for not showing the video? I haven't seen anything except "Oh, gee, that's in poor taste", which is not anything more than an appeal to emotion.

I was hoping for better here, honestly.

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[bitrex]

Next on NBC, the 2046 winter olympics. At 8PM, the US and Canada face off for the snowball fights, followed by the mackeral slapping contest between Great Britain and France. At 11PM, Greece and Latvia compete in 'walk around the block', and then Bolivia and Japan face off in a rematch of the famous 2042 "fill the slurpee cup as full as you can without spilling" contest. Stay tuned...

For curling!

IOC to Stephen Pate.

[Anonymous Coward]

Mr. Pate, tear...down...this...vid!!!!

revoke special privileges

[pydev]

The Olympics received special privileges (including special trademark protection) because they were intended to serve humanitarian purposes: improve understanding between the peoples of the world. These days, they serve that function in about the same way Coca Cola and Nike do. There is no reason anymore to grant special privileges to the Olympics. And if we want to return to the Olympic ideals, rather than giving them special commercial privileges, they should be required to be a lot more non-commercial and open than they are.

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[Engeekneer]

It is wrong to have pillars that close to the track and Stephen Plate shows this to the rest of the world. Period! No discussion!

And yet, here we are discussing it. I think it is fine for pillars to be that close, on a track for a sport that is participated in voluntarily and with full knowledge that those pillars are there. All it would have taken is for the lugers to say "we aren't going down that course with those pillars there", if it were so clear that the pillars shouldn't have been there.

Of course the athletes can choose not to participate. However, most athletes have been training for years for this event, so the threshold for not participating is really high, even if they had a pool of sharks with friggin lasers at the bottom. Just because you don't have to participate, doesn't mean that the security measures can be inadequate. Simply raising the walls doesn't make the sport equivalent to kitten hugging

Live channels on the Internet

[bradley13]

Two points:

• The IOC should broadcast every single event live on the Internet. Especially in the summer Olympics, there are so many things going on simultaneously that you only gets bits and bobs of any single event. Less popular disciplines often get no television coverage at all - even though there are cameras and announcers at the events.
• Secondly, they could and should make all recordings of all past events available for viewing via the Internet.

The IOC could still get their advertising revenues, and even direct-charge viewers. These seem like blindingly obvious ideas.

Why haven't they done this yet?

Re:Live channels on the Internet

[nabsltd]

The IOC could still get their advertising revenues, and even direct-charge viewers. These seem like blindingly obvious ideas.

Why haven't they done this yet?

Because NBC handed them a truckload of money for "exclusive rights".

Basically, instead working a little harder and trying to make the experience better for the viewers, the IOC took the easy way out and said "let NBC handle it...we've got our money".

Then, NBC is an idiot and believes that if they time delay events and keep all viewing to the NBC prime time hours, they'll make the most money. Again, it's the easy way, because setting up lots of streaming and trying to make money off it can be tricky. After all, it's not like NBC has billions of dollars to spend to hire the right people who can do the job.

It is copyrighted because IOC wants to sell it

[woodengod]

Like for commercials, for example http://www.totalprosports.com/2010/02/19/too-soon-for-this-olympic-luge-advertisement/

5% pulled out somewhere were the sun doesn't ... ?

[freaker_TuC]

Look to the EUCD, the DMCA equivalent, start again by using real stats instead of pulling those 5% where the sun doesn't shine.

We all got our problems with the copyright nazi and it's not getting better.

The entire world should become afraid of what will become of copyrights and trademarks; since it'll be only an exclusive part of people who'll get full access to the ring. People assume these things will blow over but they won't. The Internet is becoming more broken by the day because of the legislation of tomorrow. Be warned .. Assumption is the worst f*ckup of mother nature.

(never thought I'd be pulling the sunshine thing on slashdot lol)

Olympic fascism

[dugeen]

Given the Olympics' long association with both literal fascism (Samaranch) and metaphorical fascism (allowing the Chinese secret police to beat up protestors on the streets of London in 2008, the clearances prior to 2012, the massive surveillance scheme planned for 2012), why does this story surprise anyone?

(Ahem)

[bbbaldie]

That's O-lympics, buster, capital O! Message from the IOC: get the above post edited or deleted or FACE DER CONSEKVENCES!!!

Re:(Ahem)

[haruharaharu]

Last I checked, none of the IOC were the sort of people I'd allow inside my home; I really couldn't care what they think.

Missing tag for the story

[piotru]

I may be lacking the English word fitting IOC's handling of the matter.
A person has died.
What kind of ruthlessness was necessary to assert rights over the video of the tragic accident?

Re:I guess respect for the dead doesn't count as m

[realsilly]

Respect for the dead is very Noble, but don't you think that the information found on videos such as that serve a purpose that help prevent such tragedies later? I respect death, it is, after all what we will all face at the end of our lives. This particular individual knew he was on TV, he knew that his sport is dangerous, and I would not be at all surprised if all olympians have to sign waivers granting privledges to video them. If that would be the case, then that tape should live forever. Have you ever watch a documentary in which someone died? How is this any different. We have videos of war zones, are you ok with that because they are an enemy dying? Would not that be a double standard?

Again I respect death, but nor am I afraid of it.

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[Anonymous Coward]

followed by the mackeral slapping contest between Great Britain and France

Do they slap eachother's mackerals? Or do you have to stick to your own?

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[Anonymous Coward]

followed by the mackeral slapping contest between Great Britain and France

Now THAT is a sport!

Re:5% pulled out somewhere were the sun doesn't ..

[tomhudson]

Look to the EUCD, the DMCA equivalent, start again by using real stats instead of pulling those 5% where the sun doesn't shine.

I guess you didn't bother reading the article. The EUCD is European. The site in question is in Prince Edward Island, Canada.. Neither the DMCA nor the EUCD have anything to do with it, for lack of jurisdiction.

... or you could look at the site itself, which quotes the appropriate section of the Canadian Copyright Act.

And since when is the US not only 5% of the worlds' population, as I wrote?

(never thought I'd be pulling the sunshine thing on slashdot lol)

I think you need more practice, sunshine :-) That's what Troll Tuesday is for.

IOC=MONEY MONEY

[zcold]

Go Canada! Yes, sad news, but news is news, and I thank god I live in a place where news can be shared without being silenced. Besides, the IOC is only after money in any case. I have no respect for them, only the athletes and the spirit of the games. Don't get me started on the bid for coverage. CTV is doing a horrible job at it and I would have much rather seen CBC take care of it.. They've always done such great job work with the games.

Re:5% pulled out somewhere were the sun doesn't ..

[freaker_TuC]

I guess you didn't bother reading the article. The EUCD is European. The site in question is in Prince Edward Island, Canada.. Neither the DMCA nor the EUCD have anything to do with it, for lack of jurisdiction. ... or you could look at the site itself, which quotes the appropriate section of the Canadian Copyright Act.

I meant more: What gets introduced in the US, we get handed over on a silver platter some period afterwards. The DMCA has been an example for the EUCD.

It's not affecting "just" 5%, but a lot more. Global trade agreements and such legalislation does affect the rest of the world as well.

I thought Canada had their own DMCA too, if I'm not wrong?

Re:IANAL, but...

[smellsofbikes]

I'm taking the bar tomorrow! Still, this is not legal advice, just what I remember studying about evidence law.

I'm sorry, but you don't get to say, "The course is fine," and then also get to change it immediately after a crash.

Actually, that's exactly what you get to say and do, at least when the wrongful death suit comes through. Subsequent cure is inadmissible as evidence of negligence. This is actually good public policy--you don't want a problem discovered that someone then decides to not fix because they don't want it to look like an admission...

I'm curious about this. While I agree that it's good public policy, I'm surprised to read that this is considered a legal principle because I've read claims by, for instance, aircraft companies that the reason they won't make changes to aircraft are because they're afraid that any change they make would constitute an admission that the previous design was bad and open them to lawsuits. It seems to me that if subsequent cure is inadmissable of evidence of negligence, they could get the suits dismissed, so their claims about liability aren't exactly true. Any thoughts?

Re:5% pulled out somewhere were the sun doesn't ..

[tomhudson]

I thought Canada had their own DMCA too, if I'm not wrong?

Not yet - the US is trying to force us to adopt one, but trying to do so could end up triggering an election here. Canada does not want to be like the US, which is quickly becoming so corporatist that it's sad. We really need to realize that people like Warren Buffet (largest shareholder of AIG and Moodys, and hence the largest welfare bum in history) are not people to look up to.

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[alexo]

Lugers can still die if they take a wall too high and capsize, smashing their heads into the solid ice track.

I think lugers would probably smash their legs more often than their heads. Skeletoners, on the other hand...

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

The IOC = Bunch of Cash Cow Cretins

[dogzdik]

Hmmmmmmm all the graft and corruption of this committee and the kickbacks and all just to host "The Olympics" in your city......

-

And the corporate cash grabs and the taking of bribes by the members of this committee with the consumerist angle of it all?

I remember how the chairman of the IOC kicked some kid out of lighting the torch in Greece, so his own kid could do it.

Sycophantic prick.

-

The IOC is looking more and more like christmas with a fat guy in a red suit standing on every street corner - telling us to buy, buy, buy - to "celebrate" the spirit of christmas.

With their copyright nazi-ism - Whats next?

Prohibiting groups of 5 people from hanging thir bare arses out of the bus windows, because it copyright infringes the IOC's 5 rings.

-

As far as that guy dying when he flipped out of the chute into the steel posts, I saw it, downloaded it and saved it. Sent it to some friends. Quite sad.

-

But I am a bit sick of the insanely sanitised news that is largely identical on all chanels in Australia; and most of it is "We are the 53rd state of the USA content, and it really matters if Obama makes a comment about the snow in Washington.

-

So it was HEALTHY to see "real news" and that the guy had a quick clean death - so.

-

In respect to the arseholes in the IOC bullying people:

Get Even.

Switch Off.

Don't Buy.

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[bytta]

It is wrong to have pillars that close to the track and Stephen Plate shows this to the rest of the world. ...

I think it is fine for pillars to be that close, on a track for a sport that is participated in voluntarily and with full knowledge that those pillars are there. All it would have taken is for the lugers to say "we aren't going down that course with those pillars there", if it were so clear that the pillars shouldn't have been there.

People train for years for the Olympics. I doubt that safety checks are on the top of their list when they finally get there. Does that mean they deserve to die?

Lugers can still die if they take a wall too high and capsize, smashing their heads into the solid ice track.

If you want to remove all means of death in the sport of luge, you might as well not luge at all. In fact, you won't be luging. You'll have to have a solid tube filled with soft water (instead of the open ice-caked half-tube). That's the "thrill ride" at a water park. How exciting. And someone could still drown if they aren't careful.

So we can't remove any risks (even obvious ones) because that leads to a slippery slope of killing the sport? Straw man, anyone?

How about solid concrete walls at most car race tracks?

They're in a goddamn car, designed so that the driver has a good chance of walking away from such a collision. The lugers are not. You're also forgetting that most of these walls have rows of tires in front to soften the blow (at least in the fastest races like Formula One).

Bugger off IOC and let the rest of the world see what is wrong so it can be prevented next time.

Next on NBC, the 2046 winter olympics. At 8PM, the US and Canada face off for the snowball fights, followed by the mackeral slapping contest between Great Britain and France. At 11PM, Greece and Latvia compete in 'walk around the block', and then Bolivia and Japan face off in a rematch of the famous 2042 "fill the slurpee cup as full as you can without spilling" contest. Stay tuned...

Great - another slippery slope straw man. Didn't you do that already?

Riiight ...

[RockDoctor]

The IOC asserts that it owns all the rights to all images taken at the games,

Yeah, sure.
So, if I went to the Olympics and took photos of my family there, the IOC would assert copyright over them.
Riiight.

Well one good thing can be said for this (alleged) policy : it hasn't changed one whit, jot, or iota the probability of me attending an Olympic event, or indeed of spending a penny on merchandise for the Olympics, or indeed of deliberately spending any money supporting sport at all. The probabilities have changed from zero to zero.

Roll on 2012 and the planned terrorist massacres in London. Let's hope some good urban regeneration can happen in the bomb-scoured wreckage.

Re:Its wrong to have pillars that close to the tra

[Obfuscant]

People train for years for the Olympics. I doubt that safety checks are on the top of their list when they finally get there.

That's just another way of saying what I did. We assume these people are rational, reasoning adults who can evaluate the level of risk and reward for themselves. At least, I make that assumption. If "safety checks" are not on the top of their list, then they've made the decision that other things than safety are more important. I allow them that right to decide for themselves. Why don't you?

The fact remains, not a single participant decided the risk was too great. Blaming the IOC for "obvious" risks and thus causing the death is simply ridiculous.

Does that mean they deserve to die?

Of course not, and I didn't say anything even remotely close to that. And you know it. What I DID say was they deserve the right to make their own choices and take risks that they choose to take.

So we can't remove any risks (even obvious ones) because that leads to a slippery slope of killing the sport?

Yet another thing I didn't say. I said, rather explicitely, "If you want to remove ALL means of death ..." (and I emphasized the word 'all' this time because you decided to ignore it the last).

You're also forgetting that most of these walls have rows of tires in front to soften the blow (at least in the fastest races like Formula One).

No, most of the race track walls do NOT have "rows of tires" in front of them. That would turn any scrape into a devastating accident. I wasn't talking about the races that take place on city streets, I said, pretty clearly, 'race track'. I suggest you step off the pedestal and watch a NASCAR race sometime and look for the tires.

wall height

[Anonymous Coward]

after seeing the video it looks like the wall size was a compromise between safety and ability to film, there's not much point in participating in an event if no one can record your glorious moment. there was a line painted on the turn part of the wall which i guess is what they though the maximum necessary safe height was and then they built it a bit higher, later in the track, i guess after the engineers thought the dangerous part was over the wall lowers so as not to interfere with the cameras. the steel beams are what the controversy is about and those that have not seen the footage should not comment that it shouldn't be shown. the verbal description of the accident given out at the press conference creates a completely different mental image of how the accident happened than the actual occurrence. the mental image would have them thrown way off the course at some angle when the reality had him going essentially parallel to the course and never more than 2 or 3 feet from it. also the mental image only mentions A column so one thinks it to be some freak thing whereas the video shows a row of columns near and parallel to the track and not serving an apparent purpose such as supporting the wall. personally i think the columns ended up granting him a mercifully swift death as opposed to (considering the speed he was going) tumbling in a fatal manner on the concrete. something else to keep in mind is accident videos help prevent future accidents and save lives, ex. people watching this vid would: design safer roads for icy conditions, drive safer in icy conditions, pay more attention to road barriers, take more precautions for amateur sking/sleding, design safer roller coasters, design safer trains and trollies, etc. every similar accident (and death) that could be prevented is the fault of those who would suppress the video.

IOC demands blogger retract video re luger death

[Anonymous Coward]

Although continuing to show the video is in bad taste, the IOC is also in bad taste. My response to them is F.Y.